Debating The John F. Kennedy Assassination (Part 32)
David Von Pein
-----------------------------------------------------------------
SUBJECT -- The JFK Assassination: The Ongoing "Lone Assassin vs.
Conspiracy" Debate.
FEATURED TEXT -- Archived JFK Forum Messages From February 2005 and
February 2007.
-----------------------------------------------------------------
CTer (A CONSPIRACY THEORIST) -- NO ONE ever put Lee Harvey Oswald on
the 6th floor at the time of the shooting. It's a lie to assert
otherwise.
DVP (DAVID VON PEIN) -- Howard Brennan's existence makes the above
statement a complete falsehood.
But the CT-Kook who wrote that nonsense doesn't WANT Brennan to be
right....so we'll continue to have to contend with such stupid
statements as the one quoted above.
But as hard as the CTers try to discredit Brennan's testimony....they
can never do it. Because...based on the totality of the evidence in
this case, the odds that Howard L. Brennan saw anyone other than Lee
Harvey Oswald shooting from that 6th Floor are almost totally
nil. .....
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/a83751f6ce319004
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/d26167f23399f7d6
-------------------------------------------
CTer -- No LNT'er was willing to answer any of the posts in this
series. It's funny to see dead silence from the LNT'er crowd.
DVP -- That CTer seems to actually think that if LNers don't crawl out
of the woodwork to attempt to "debunk" each and every one of his pro-
CT assertions and allegations....that must mean that a conspiracy is
still alive and well.
The plain truth of the matter is that ANY kook can easily pick apart
the Warren Report (they've had ample time, and desire, to do this of
course) and then isolate some things that (on the surface) appear to
lead down Conspiracy Avenue.
But what these CTers fail to EVER do is place those isolated items
back into a COHESIVE WHOLE that adds up to a logical and reasonable
and workable and DOABLE "Assassination Conspiracy Plot To Kill JFK".
Have we EVER seen such a COHESIVE WHOLE from the CTers? Ever? I sure
haven't. Their theories are scattershot and piecemeal (at best); and
utterly laughable (at worst).
A good case in point is a certain CTer's constant harping on Officer
James Chaney of the DPD. That CTer's exact question for LNers (via his
"21 Questions" series) was this:
"Why was the closest police eyewitness to the murder, who just
coincidently would have testified in contradiction to the SBT, was
never questioned by the FBI or WC prior to the release of the WCR?"
Per that conspiracist, Chaney ALONE could easily have debunked the SBT
with his testimony...testimony that was never elicited by the WC, of
course....so how that CTer KNOWS what Chaney would have said to the WC
is anyone's guess.
But, in all his kooky grandeur, that CTer announces to the world that
the "SBT is dead via Chaney alone!" (paraphrasing the kook there).
Of course, only a true kook of the First Order would make such a
stupid and incorrect declaration to the masses; because Chaney's (non)-
testimony does not debunk the SBT in any way, shape, or form.
(That is to say that what Chaney told non-WC people in interviews
after the assassination does not indicate in any way that the SBT has
had its legs knocked out from under it. To think that Chaney HAS, by
himself, accomplished that task re. the SBT is just silly to begin
with.)
But that's a perfect example of how these CT-Kooks will "handle" the
evidence (or even the NON-evidence in Chaney's instance, since he
never was called to testify). The CTers will manipulate things to the
maximum degree of distortion, in order to promote their non-existent
conspiracy.
We've learned to expect this type of CT deception and the oddball CTer
skewing of CS&L by now, of course....because we're dealing with people
who probably could not continue to exist without a conspiracy of some
kind to latch onto daily.
And, of course, I myself have already dealt with a lengthy series of
CT questions from that list-loving conspiracy theorist. .....
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/6db9ac1c27e26e32
-------------------------------------------
CTer -- How many shots do you "hear" {during} a 21-gun salute?
DVP -- So, you actually want to think that 13(!) shots (per the God-
awful "JFK II" documentary which that CTer is referring to when he
asked the above question) were melded into the THREE that all the
initial broadcasts reported...and the THREE that perfectly match the
number of spent bullet shells found on the 6th Floor of the Book
Depository?
Good luck with the jury on that "13 Sounded Like Only 3" theory (if
there had actually been a jury to appeal to, of course, sans the
shooting of Lee Oswald).
Unless you've got the O.J. jury on hand there....you'll need some
major help on passing that one off as anything close to reasonable (or
believable).
Not to mention the fact that it'd be just flat-out goofy to shoot at
the President THIRTEEN times within a ONE-patsy frame-up plot. That
gets the biggest "LOL" of all.
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/d5a5eeae1e135fd1
-------------------------------------------
CTer -- {James} Powell was there to capture a picture of "Oswald"
firing his rifle from that window during the shooting.
DVP -- LOL. More "Magical" powers being exhibited by a rabid CTer I
see -- a CTer who seems to know things that no JFK assassination
investigator has EVER learned.
Go figure.
-------------------------------------------
CTer -- He {Powell} snapped his picture just a couple of minutes
BEFORE the motorcade arrived when "Oswald" stuck his rifle out of that
window.
DVP -- Okay, kook. Where's the rifle?
The Powell photo:
http://216.122.129.112/dc/user_files/4392.jpg
http://216.122.129.112/dc/user_files/4241.jpg
-------------------------------------------
CTer -- I think those particular witnesses felt that two shots came
from the area of the picket fence. So when they mention shots as
plural, I don't think they are saying that "all the shots" fired that
day came from the fence.
DVP -- That might very well be what Simmons and Price meant, indeed.
But that is NOT what was implied by Mark Lane in his film {"Rush To
Judgment"}.
When asked "Where did you think the shots came from?", there was
nothing to prohibit either Simmons or Price from declaring that they
thought at least ONE shot (or more) had come from the Depository area.
But neither man ever said this in Lane's filmed interviews with them.
-------------------------------------------
CTer -- {Quoting Bill Newman}: "I thought the shot had come from the
garden directly behind me, that it was on an elevation from where I
was, as I was right on the curb. I do not recall looking toward the
Depository. I looked back in the vicinity of the garden."
DVP -- This is very similar to the Price/Simmons "all from one
direction" point I was making earlier.
Newman says "shot" (singular) above -- but what about the OTHER shots
that WE KNOW FOR A FACT came from behind Kennedy? (We KNOW this,
obviously, due to the entry wounds in the backs of both victims, JBC
and JFK.)
Newman, via his WFAA-TV comments on 11/22/63 re. shots coming from
"the garden on the mound of ground there on the Knoll", seems to be
implying (just like Price and Simmons in Mark Lane's movie) that shots
came from just ONE PLACE (to the front of the limo).
Why? And how? When we know a majority of the shots came from the rear
(or at the least, even from a CT POV, an EQUAL number of shots came
from the rear and not the front).
NOT hearing REAR shots (or shots that would be discernible from
MULTIPLE directions), along with the frontal shots they've spoken
about, tells me that it's very likely that Newman, Price, and Simmons
(et al) were mistaken as to the origin of ALL the shots they heard.
For, HOW could ALL of these people have ONLY heard the frontal shots,
and NOT any multiple rear shots? I would say that this is highly
unlikely in a small bowl-like "Plaza" like DP. Especially from MANY
different witnesses. The Plaza is just simply not very big.
To say that all rear shots (and we KNOW there were some) would have
been completely inaudible (somehow) to many witnesses on the West End
of Dealey Plaza is just not a highly-logical conclusion, IMO.
A rifle blast is easily going to travel the short 100-yard (or so)
distance from Oswald's Sniper's Perch to Newman's eardrums, and Jean
Hill's, and James Simmons', and Richard Dodd's, et al.*
* = Unless silencers were utilized for ONLY the REAR shots -- which is
highly unlikely, since that's exactly where the "Patsy" resides (per
the common CT POV), and any TSBD shots would be the LAST shots any
"plotters" would want "silenced".
-------------------------------------------
CTer -- How hard is it to understand that the shooter closest to you
will drown out other shooters further away who may be firing at the
same time.
DVP -- Yes, true. But, the proverbial CT problem is -- there is NO
such provable evidence in the record (or otherwise) to suggest that
shots were fired "at the same time".
If there were shots being fired from the front AND rear at identical
times, then ALL of the frontal shots MISSED COMPLETELY, without
question. And how likely is that (via a "professional killers"
scenario)?
You're inventing that tidbit of data regarding shots fired "at the
same time" to suit your needs, and for no other reason, IMO.
And if the shots were SEPARATED by several seconds (which Oswald's
were from the TSBD), logic dictates to me that the people less than
100 yards west are going to certainly hear those blasts.
I have heard of the "tests" done in DP, where some people heard this
or that (depending on positioning in the Plaza). But it's still hard
for me to accept as fact the idea that Newman, or Jean Hill, or
whoever to the west of Oswald's position, would somehow NOT hear any
shots from the LHO location, and ONLY hear what sounded like shots
from the Knoll (which even CTers will probably admit were smaller in
numbers than any REAR shots).
-------------------------------------------
CTer -- David, that was not speculation; that reply was based on my
experience as a hunter.
DVP -- It WAS "speculation" with regard to the JFK case though.
Because you don't KNOW any shots were fired "at the same time".
Your past hunting experience is nice to hear about, but as far as what
happened in Dealey Plaza, your post about shots being fired "at the
same time" IS pure speculation.
-------------------------------------------
CTer -- This means that if the kill shot came from the front, then the
{front-seat} fragments were from a missile hitting the chrome strip
without wounding anyone in the car.
DVP -- I'm very dubious about this possibility, for the reason that if
the chrome was damaged by a MISSED shot, that hit nothing else en
route to its chrome "meeting", why didn't the ricochet (that sent the
large fragments down into the limo) cause more damage to the front
seats or floorboards of the vehicle?
As far as I am aware, the two large bullet fragments were NOT
accompanied by ADDITIONAL FLOOR/SEAT DAMAGE; they were just lying
there, and never penetrated the floor or seats.
I'd therefore ask: How could this occur, when the bullet (if it was a
"miss") obviously would have been travelling at full velocity when it
struck the chrome and certainly ricocheted at (probably) a pretty good
speed?
Even if you don't accept the idea that such a full-velocity missile
could have PENETRATED whatever material was underneath the chrome
strip, the bullet certainly went SOMEPLACE after striking the chrome.
And if it was a missed shot, I think much more damage to the limo's
interior would have resulted from this missile.
However, in a "head-shot ricochet" scenario, this bullet is ALREADY
pretty much "spent" by the time it has reached the chrome. Therefore,
it's perfectly logical to assume that additional seat/floorboard
damage would not necessarily have resulted.
Plus, I'll also throw in the fact that, of course, the two front-seat
fragments were scientifically linked to Oswald's rifle (a rifle which
just happened to be found on the 6th Floor of the Depository 52
minutes after the shooting, along with the three spent Mannlicher-
Carcano shells).
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/9f9db2052413d59d
brightwinger
You've convinced me that the sounds of the shots aren't the way to
solve the crime. (Of course I already knew that.)
At the same time, it's perplexing that you're devoting time to this
when you've left those TWO severed carotid artery problems untouched.
JFK's audible, agonal breathing at Parkland tells us that he was alive
when he arrived there. With that fact firmly established, it is also a
fact hat his carotids weren't severed at that point.
But they, along with 15 other brain attachments, were detached prior
to the autopsy, which is why Hume did not have to perform any surgery
to remove JFK's brain.
Humes also testified to the HAC that the brain was torn below the
midbrain and at the pons. Yet, JFK was alive at Parkland.
Those are but two examples from the forensic evidence that shout out
the word "TAMPERED!"
So stop wasting your time with the # of bullets that were fired. It's
past time for you to surrender your LN stance.
Ben Holmes
It's interesting to note that the very *title* is a lie - since LNT'ers simply
aren't capable of doing "32" posts *and responding to the replies*.
In article <1171676585.1...@q2g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>, brightwinger
says...
>
>On Feb 16, 7:28 pm, "David Von Pein" <davevonp...@aol.com> wrote:
>> DEBATING THE JFK CASE (PART 32):
>>
>> -----------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> SUBJECT -- The JFK Assassination: The Ongoing "Lone Assassin vs.
>> Conspiracy" Debate.
>>
>> FEATURED TEXT -- Archived JFK Forum Messages From February 2005 and
>> February 2007.
>>
>> -----------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> CTer (A CONSPIRACY THEORIST) -- NO ONE ever put Lee Harvey Oswald on
>> the 6th floor at the time of the shooting. It's a lie to assert
>> otherwise.
>>
>> DVP (DAVID VON PEIN) -- Howard Brennan's existence makes the above
>> statement a complete falsehood.
Untrue. Why lie about it?
>> But the CT-Kook who wrote that nonsense doesn't WANT Brennan to be
>> right....so we'll continue to have to contend with such stupid
>> statements as the one quoted above.
Go ahead and *QUOTE* Brennan's words... *ALL* of them.
But you can't - since it contradicts your theory...
>> But as hard as the CTers try to discredit Brennan's testimony....they
>> can never do it.
Untrue... we simply let Brennan discredit himself.
>> Because...based on the totality of the evidence in
>> this case, the odds that Howard L. Brennan saw anyone other than Lee
>> Harvey Oswald shooting from that 6th Floor are almost totally
>> nil. .....
Ah! So DVP is now a statistician on top of all the other fields he's mastered!
>> http://groups.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/a83751f6ce319004
>>
>> http://groups.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/d26167f23399f7d6
Meaningless cites, since DVP is unwilling or incapable of answering *rebuttals*
to his nonsense.
>> -------------------------------------------
>>
>> CTer -- No LNT'er was willing to answer any of the posts in this
>> series. It's funny to see dead silence from the LNT'er crowd.
>>
>> DVP -- That CTer seems to actually think that if LNers don't crawl out
>> of the woodwork to attempt to "debunk" each and every one of his pro-
>> CT assertions and allegations....that must mean that a conspiracy is
>> still alive and well.
No, it merely means that no LNT'er was willing to answer any of the posts in
that particular series.
LNT'ers frequently run in the opposite direction when the evidence is cited and
discussed.
>> The plain truth of the matter is that ANY kook can easily pick apart
>> the Warren Report (they've had ample time, and desire, to do this of
>> course) and then isolate some things that (on the surface) appear to
>> lead down Conspiracy Avenue.
LNT'ers have had the same amount of time to support the WCR... yet can't seem to
be able to do so on the basis of the evidence.
>> But what these CTers fail to EVER do is place those isolated items
>> back into a COHESIVE WHOLE that adds up to a logical and reasonable
>> and workable and DOABLE "Assassination Conspiracy Plot To Kill JFK".
Of course we can. Done so many times that it's amazing that LNT'ers never seem
to understand this: THERE WAS MORE THAN ONE SHOOTER!
Actually, we can expand this into *two* conspiracies which may or may not have
been related... the conspiracy to "muder" the President (to quote a famously
"literate" LNT'er), and the conspiracy to cover up the facts in this case.
The second conspiracy is provable beyond *any* reasonable doubt (parts of it
have even been admitted), the second - beyond the reasonable doubt of the
majority of Americans.
>> Have we EVER seen such a COHESIVE WHOLE from the CTers? Ever? I sure
>> haven't. Their theories are scattershot and piecemeal (at best); and
>> utterly laughable (at worst).
When you have to lie to make a point, the only point you've made is that you're
a liar. Right?
>> A good case in point is a certain CTer's constant harping on Officer
>> James Chaney of the DPD. That CTer's exact question for LNers (via his
>> "21 Questions" series) was this:
The "constant harping" never seems to produce any explanation that seems
reasonable to anyone other than the nuts.
>> "Why was the closest police eyewitness to the murder, who just
>> coincidently would have testified in contradiction to the SBT, was
>> never questioned by the FBI or WC prior to the release of the WCR?"
>>
>> Per that conspiracist, Chaney ALONE could easily have debunked the SBT
>> with his testimony...
Yep... his known statements were in direct *contradiction* to the basic tenet of
the SBC. He was there, he was close, and we *KNOW* that he was looking right at
JFK during the shooting.
>> testimony that was never elicited by the WC, of
>> course....so how that CTer KNOWS what Chaney would have said to the WC
>> is anyone's guess.
Simply untrue. We *do* know much of what he would have said. Even the WC knew
much of it.
So why bother to lie?
>> But, in all his kooky grandeur, that CTer announces to the world that
>> the "SBT is dead via Chaney alone!" (paraphrasing the kook there).
Note, of course, that this nut *STILL* hasn't answered the basic question - how
could an investigation of this size and length avoid asking the closest non-limo
eyewitness, who happened to be a COP(!!?), a *single* question about what he
saw?
Most reasonable people will instantly realize just what an impossibility any
answer is going to be that doesn't posit a conspiracy to hide the facts of JFK's
murder. And they'd be right.
That's why no LNT'er will ever *answer* this question... thus the "constant
harping"... as if an unanswered question *should* go away...
>> Of course, only a true kook of the First Order would make such a
>> stupid and incorrect declaration to the masses; because Chaney's (non)-
>> testimony does not debunk the SBT in any way, shape, or form.
Of course it does. He *specifically* states that the bullet that hit JFK was
*DIFFERENT* from the one that struck Connally.
That's all that's needed. Of course, we *also* have the medical testimony, and
the ballistics testimony. But that would be piling insult upon injury...
>> (That is to say that what Chaney told non-WC people in interviews
>> after the assassination does not indicate in any way that the SBT has
>> had its legs knocked out from under it.
Simply untrue. When you have to lie to make a point...
>> to think that Chaney HAS, by
>> himself, accomplished that task re. the SBT is just silly to begin
>> with.)
A nut *would* think that...
>> But that's a perfect example of how these CT-Kooks will "handle" the
>> evidence (or even the NON-evidence in Chaney's instance, since he
>> never was called to testify).
That *is* the question that this nut keeps avoiding, isn't it?
>> The CTers will manipulate things to the
>> maximum degree of distortion, in order to promote their non-existent
>> conspiracy.
No distortion needed at all. In fact, let's try judging this... present all
quotes known to have come from Chaney (1st or 2nd hand) that would bear on the
issue of the SBT.
Let's *examine* those statements...
(But, of course, nuts like this would *never* do such a thing... it simply can't
help their case to go to the evidence in detail)
>> We've learned to expect this type of CT deception and the oddball CTer
>> skewing of CS&L by now, of course....because we're dealing with people
>> who probably could not continue to exist without a conspiracy of some
>> kind to latch onto daily.
>>
>> And, of course, I myself have already dealt with a lengthy series of
>> CT questions from that list-loving conspiracy theorist. .....
>>
>> http://groups.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/6db9ac1c27e26e32
No, you haven't. For example, my "35 Questions" post was directed at you, and
you ran for months... never *did* answer any of them to my knowledge.
>> -------------------------------------------
>>
>> CTer -- How many shots do you "hear" {during} a 21-gun salute?
>>
>> DVP -- So, you actually want to think that 13(!) shots (per the God-
>> awful "JFK II" documentary which that CTer is referring to when he
>> asked the above question) were melded into the THREE that all the
>> initial broadcasts reported...and the THREE that perfectly match the
>> number of spent bullet shells found on the 6th Floor of the Book
>> Depository?
Actually, the evidence shows that *two* spent shells were initially found.
>> Good luck with the jury on that "13 Sounded Like Only 3" theory (if
>> there had actually been a jury to appeal to, of course, sans the
>> shooting of Lee Oswald).
>>
>> Unless you've got the O.J. jury on hand there....you'll need some
>> major help on passing that one off as anything close to reasonable (or
>> believable).
>>
>> Not to mention the fact that it'd be just flat-out goofy to shoot at
>> the President THIRTEEN times within a ONE-patsy frame-up plot. That
>> gets the biggest "LOL" of all.
>>
>> http://groups.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/d5a5eeae1e135fd1
>>
>> -------------------------------------------
>>
>> CTer -- {James} Powell was there to capture a picture of "Oswald"
>> firing his rifle from that window during the shooting.
>>
>> DVP -- LOL. More "Magical" powers being exhibited by a rabid CTer I
>> see -- a CTer who seems to know things that no JFK assassination
>> investigator has EVER learned.
>>
>> Go figure.
Some CT'ers feel the need to delve into speculation as deeply as LNT'ers
frequently do. But it's unnecessary to prove a conspiracy.
We *also* know for a fact that shots came from the front... the entry wound in
JFK's neck, the hole in the limo's windshield.
>> Newman, via his WFAA-TV comments on 11/22/63 re. shots coming from
>> "the garden on the mound of ground there on the Knoll", seems to be
>> implying (just like Price and Simmons in Mark Lane's movie) that shots
>> came from just ONE PLACE (to the front of the limo).
>>
>> Why? And how? When we know a majority of the shots came from the rear
>> (or at the least, even from a CT POV, an EQUAL number of shots came
>> from the rear and not the front).
How do YOU know that a "majority" of the shots came from the rear? You can't
even admit to more than 3 shots...
Who was it, Powers(?), who said that they felt they were riding *INTO* an ambush
- from the front...
>> NOT hearing REAR shots (or shots that would be discernible from
>> MULTIPLE directions), along with the frontal shots they've spoken
>> about, tells me that it's very likely that Newman, Price, and Simmons
>> (et al) were mistaken as to the origin of ALL the shots they heard.
Of course... the 'ole "All Eyewitnesses were Mistaken" theory...
>> For, HOW could ALL of these people have ONLY heard the frontal shots,
>> and NOT any multiple rear shots?
Because they were closer to the frontal shooters?
Just as many near the TSBD argued for the rear shooters?
But don't let the facts confuse you...
>> I would say that this is highly
>> unlikely in a small bowl-like "Plaza" like DP. Especially from MANY
>> different witnesses. The Plaza is just simply not very big.
What you're arguing, of course, is that anyone who said anything inconvenient to
your theory must be wrong.
>> To say that all rear shots (and we KNOW there were some) would have
>> been completely inaudible (somehow) to many witnesses on the West End
>> of Dealey Plaza is just not a highly-logical conclusion, IMO.
Of *course* it is. Just as some earwitnesses didn't hear frontal shooters.
>> A rifle blast is easily going to travel the short 100-yard (or so)
>> distance from Oswald's Sniper's Perch to Newman's eardrums, and Jean
>> Hill's, and James Simmons', and Richard Dodd's, et al.*
>>
>> * = Unless silencers were utilized for ONLY the REAR shots -- which is
>> highly unlikely,
Actually, the evidence that day *does* lead to the certainty that one of the
shooters was firing either a silenced weapon, or a different one.
>> since that's exactly where the "Patsy" resides (per
>> the common CT POV), and any TSBD shots would be the LAST shots any
>> "plotters" would want "silenced".
Arguing by speculation rather than evidence is a silly way to do things...
>> -------------------------------------------
>>
>> CTer -- How hard is it to understand that the shooter closest to you
>> will drown out other shooters further away who may be firing at the
>> same time.
>>
>> DVP -- Yes, true.
Bingo... you just contradicted your own argument. :)
>> But, the proverbial CT problem is -- there is NO
>> such provable evidence in the record (or otherwise) to suggest that
>> shots were fired "at the same time".
>>
>> If there were shots being fired from the front AND rear at identical
>> times, then ALL of the frontal shots MISSED COMPLETELY, without
>> question.
Not according to the best medical evidence.
>> And how likely is that (via a "professional killers"
>> scenario)?
>>
>> You're inventing that tidbit of data regarding shots fired "at the
>> same time" to suit your needs, and for no other reason, IMO.
>>
>> And if the shots were SEPARATED by several seconds (which Oswald's
>> were from the TSBD), logic dictates to me that the people less than
>> 100 yards west are going to certainly hear those blasts.
Never been around rifles firing, have you?
>> I have heard of the "tests" done in DP, where some people heard this
>> or that (depending on positioning in the Plaza). But it's still hard
>> for me to accept as fact the idea that Newman, or Jean Hill, or
>> whoever to the west of Oswald's position, would somehow NOT hear any
>> shots from the LHO location, and ONLY hear what sounded like shots
>> from the Knoll (which even CTers will probably admit were smaller in
>> numbers than any REAR shots).
You simply wish to discount anything that is inconvenient for your theory.
Perfectly understandable... and perfectly dishonest.
>> -------------------------------------------
>>
>> CTer -- David, that was not speculation; that reply was based on my
>> experience as a hunter.
>>
>> DVP -- It WAS "speculation" with regard to the JFK case though.
>> Because you don't KNOW any shots were fired "at the same time".
>>
>> Your past hunting experience is nice to hear about, but as far as what
>> happened in Dealey Plaza, your post about shots being fired "at the
>> same time" IS pure speculation.
>>
>> -------------------------------------------
>>
>> CTer -- This means that if the kill shot came from the front, then the
>> {front-seat} fragments were from a missile hitting the chrome strip
>> without wounding anyone in the car.
>>
>> DVP -- I'm very dubious about this possibility, for the reason that if
>> the chrome was damaged by a MISSED shot, that hit nothing else en
>> route to its chrome "meeting", why didn't the ricochet (that sent the
>> large fragments down into the limo) cause more damage to the front
>> seats or floorboards of the vehicle?
Demonstrate - with photographs, that it didn't.
Nuts will never do that.
David Von Pein
JFK's body could not POSSIBLY have been "tampered with" prior to the
Bethesda autopsy. Too many witnesses to confirm that the casket was
NEVER left unattended.
"The coffin was never unattended. Lifton's story is the biggest pack
of malarkey I ever heard in my life. I never had my hands or eyes off
of it during the period he says it was unattended, and when Jackie got
up to go to her stateroom where Lyndon Johnson was, Kenny O'Donnell
went with her, but we stayed right there with the coffin and never let
go of it. In fact, several of us were with it through the whole trip,
all the way to Bethesda Naval Hospital. It couldn't have happened the
way that fellow said. Not even thirty seconds. I never left it." --
David Powers; 1987
Dave Powers is a "plotter" too, I suppose. Right?
Therefore....you are wrong. Simple as that, Mr. "Carotid Artery".
And you're kooky at the same time, for even BEGINNING to believe in
the Lifton-esque crap you're advocating.
So, to keep things short and kinda sweet -- BLOW ME!
David Von Pein
(at great length) to his now-"killfiled" LNers...who aren't worthy of
his precious time, because "life's too short" (per his previous
hypocritical comments).
Gotta love them kooks.
BTW, Ben...what about J.W. Hodges' new CT book?? Any word? I need a
copy. Should I ask 68 more times before you dare answer me?