Re: Dylan in Nuremberg

[Will Dockery]

"President_dudley" wrote in message
news:2793a7bd-248e-4722...@googlegroups.com...
> On Sunday, November 4, 2018 at 5:31:41 PM UTC-5, jimha...@gmail.com wrote:
>
> On Thursday, October 9, 1997 at 3:00:00 AM UTC-4, Brad Chapman wrote:
> > Hello! My friend is spending this semester over in Germany,and she is
> > going to be visiting Nuremberg, a site of a Nazi concentration camp.
> > Well, while she was listeing to some lecture about Nuremberg, she heard
> > the prof mention something about a Bob Dylan performance at Nuremberg
> > where, in the direct wording of my friend: "Bob Dylan sang there once
> > and he did something (i didntcatch what) taht showed that he realized
> > what had happened there and he was protesting that or something." (They
> > do speak German over there and all!). Anyways, does anyone know about a
> > Bob Dylan concert at Nuremberg, and have any kind of info--dates, set
> > lists, etc.. Thanks a lot for you time!
> >
> > Brad Chapman
> > chap...@pilot.msu.edu
>
> I Was @ the Concert. Eric Clapton, Bob Dillon, Muddy Waters and a German
> Band Called "Chicken Shack" recorded a live Album which Myself and all my
> Army Buddies wound up on the back of the album cover !We were about 30
> feet from the stage. It rained but otherwise was an AWESOME Concert !!

hey jimha,

thanks for taking the time to post this, and i hope this finds you well.

i love it when i go to these elderly sites and someone dredges up a dead
post that is more alive than some of the people i know.

just a cursory seek yields this:

https://www.setlist.fm/festival/1978/open-air-festival78-bob-dylan-nurnberg-1978-4bd657d2.html

https://www.setlist.fm/setlist/bob-dylan/1978/zeppelinfeld-nuremberg-germany-53d7c3d9.html

this purports to be the entirety of the concert:

Bob Dylan Nuremberg 1978 (Nurnberg)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UeRM7Cwz-lE

}

Hubert Bruns
1 year ago (edited)
Please note the announcement of MASTERS OF WAR (at about 1:40:50): "Great
pleasure to sing this in this place!". The location was the Zeppelinfeld aka
Reichsparteitagsgelände where the nazi party celebrated itself in the
1930s. Incredible moment! I'm sorry for my bad English but I hope everybody
will understand the meaning of my comment!
{

Nice remembrance in today's political climate, nicht wahr?

That said, i really prefer 58:06

take care,
rdd

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Classic show from one of the greatest eras of Dylan performance poetry.... I
saw him, of course, a few months later up in Atlanta at the grand old Omni,
long ago demolished.

[General Zod]

Out damn standing...…………..

[Will Dockery]

The 1978 Street Legal tour, the last of what is now called the "Silver Age" of Dylan.

[Good Time Charley]

A fine time to be alive...………………..

[General Zod]

On Wednesday, November 7, 2018 at 11:45:49 AM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:

Same time as The Stones had Miss You blasting onm the radio........

[ehor...@gmail.com]

Nice show.

[Will Dockery]

On Friday, November 9, 2018 at 3:05:31 AM UTC-5, ehor...@gmail.com wrote:
>
> Nice show.

Here is the newest Bob Dylan song:

https://twitter.com/mleonardtyson/status/1060529493167800320?s=17

Bob Dylan covers James Brown
"It's a Man's Man's Man's World"
Bell Auditorium
Augusta, Georgia

[Michael Pendragon]

On Friday, November 9, 2018 at 2:24:13 PM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> On Friday, November 9, 2018 at 3:05:31 AM UTC-5, ehor...@gmail.com wrote:
> >
> > Nice show.
>
> Here is the newest Bob Dylan song:

< spamsnip >

Go play it in the Dylan group ... unless that's where you copied the link from.

[Will Dockery]

I might crosspost it on the Dylan group, but this is my main group so it goes here first.

😊

[Coco DeSockmonkey]

On Friday, November 9, 2018 at 2:47:31 PM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> I might crosspost it on the Dylan group, but this is my main group so it goes here first.
>

This is a poetry group, you DAMF, so it doesn't belong here at all.

[Will Dockery]

A winner of the Nobel Prize in Literature who writes poetry definitely fits in this group, Pendragon.

Try to keep up... Bob Dylan won this award a couple of years ago.

😊

[Coco DeSockmonkey]

On Friday, November 9, 2018 at 3:00:56 PM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> A winner of the Nobel Prize in Literature who writes poetry definitely fits in this group, Pendragon.
>
> Try to keep up... Bob Dylan won this award a couple of years ago.

So post a link to some of his so-called "poetry" -- not to his latest music video. This is AAPC, not MTV.

[Will Dockery]

Sure, Pendragon, we can post Bob Dylan poetry here.

Do you really want that?

😊

[Coco DeSockmonkey]

On Friday, November 9, 2018 at 3:17:46 PM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> Sure, Pendragon, we can post Bob Dylan poetry here.
>
> Do you really want that?

Of course not. But under the guidelines, I'd have to accept it ... much as I put up with your "poetry."

You've been cross-posting a lot of music-related stuff lately. I really think you'd be much happier in the Dylan and/or 1960s group/s.

[Will Dockery]

No thanks, Pendragon, I like it here just fine.

😊

[Michael Pendragon]

On Friday, November 9, 2018 at 4:41:28 PM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> No thanks, Pendragon, I like it here just fine.
>

I don't think you do, Will.

The bulk of your posts consist of:

1) Videos of you singing on open mic night.
2) Videos of your fellow open mic singers.
3) Videos of your favorite musicians
4) Copied/pasted Wiki articles on assorted 1960s folk singers.
5) Assorted gushes over Bob Fucking Dylan.

Face it. You aren't a poet. You don't read any poetry (unless it's been quoted in a comic book). You don't write any poetry. You are incapable of critiquing poetry. And your main artistic interest is centered around music.

You'd be much more at home in a music group.

[Will Dockery]

Pendragon, I've written and published poetry for over forty years, you know
that.

My poetry has won local awards, you also know that.

We can go over all this again for a week or two if you really want to, I
don't mind, I reckon.

[General Zod]

Great as always from the mighty Dylan...............

[Will Dockery]

Of course most of Bob Dylan's best poems are set to music.

😊

[Michael Pendragon]

You've written gibberish. You're lucky if you've got one complete sentence in any five of your so-called "poems."

You've never been published. You wrote a column in the local "Fish Wrap Quarterly" and stuck your own poems in it.

Your poetry won a "Perky." The "Perky" was an "award" the local paper gave out to ... everyone. There was a "Perky" for Best Barber Shop, a "Perky" for Cleanest Restrooms, a "Perky" for Most Congenial Dog, etc. Based on the number of "Perkys" awarded each year, they probably awarded a "Perky" to each of their paper's subscribers.

You're not even a professional singer. Back when you had a band, you played on the street corner for handouts. These days you're just one of a dozen or so amateurs who "perform" on open mic night in a local bar.

As an artist, you've never had a gallery exhibition, or sold a painting.

You're a total washout.

I'm sorry to be so blunt about it (truth hurts), and this is cruel even for me. However, you've been yakking it up about Bob again, so consider it another of life's "Karma Bombs."

[Will Dockery]

No, you have a right to your honest opinion, Pendragon.

As long as you don't try to pass your opinion off as fact, all is cool with me.

:)

[ehor...@gmail.com]

Great show.

[Conley Brothers]

Thanks for these indisputable facts. They deserve their own thread thread for Will to answer each point, since he has claimed it is only opinion. We in Columbus know better.

[Will Dockery]

Sure, fake Conley, we can cover it point by point, although we already have several times already.

😊

[Will Dockery]

Gibberish... you prove my point for me, Pendragon... you simply do not understand modern poetry.

:)

[General Zod]

On Friday, November 9, 2018 at 3:00:56 PM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> A winner of the Nobel Prize in Literature who writes poetry definitely fits in this group, Pendragon.
>
> Try to keep up... Bob Dylan won this award a couple of years ago.
>
> 😊

Yes any fool should know this...…..

[George J. Dance]

On Saturday, November 10, 2018 at 3:10:44 AM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> Gibberish... you prove my point for me, Pendragon... you simply do not understand modern poetry.
>

Certainly his idea that "gibbberish" means "not written in complete sentences" is a non-starter when it comes to poetry, period. The grammatical units of poetry are lines and stanzas, not (as in prose) sentences and paragraphs.

[Will Dockery]

As noted before, he simply lacks the imagination to see beyond his rigid and outdated rules.

[Michael Pendragon]

On Saturday, November 10, 2018 at 3:10:44 AM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:

> Gibberish... you prove my point for me, Pendragon... you simply do not understand modern poetry.
>

Merriam-Webster defines "gibberish" as:

"unintelligible or meaningless language."

When you fail to compose complete sentences, your use of language becomes unintelligible and, ultimately, meaningless.

[Michael Pendragon]

As per the above example.

[Michael Pendragon]

Do you even believe the b.s. you spew out, Dunce?

Grammatical units are parts of ... (wait for it) ... sentences.

This is as true for poetry as it is for prose.

Homer, Dante, Shakespeare, Pope, Blake, Byron, Shelley, Keats, Poe, Tennyson, Eliot, WCW, Ginsberg (albeit run-on) and even Bukowski wrote complete sentences, Dunce.

cummings occasionally gibbered ... but Will isn't conducting word experiments.

[George J. Dance]

On Saturday, November 10, 2018 at 12:20:00 PM UTC-5, Michael Pendragon wrote:
> On Saturday, November 10, 2018 at 10:39:43 AM UTC-5, George J. Dance wrote:
> > On Saturday, November 10, 2018 at 3:10:44 AM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> > > Gibberish... you prove my point for me, Pendragon... you simply do not understand modern poetry.
> > >
> >
> > Certainly his idea that "gibbberish" means "not written in complete sentences" is a non-starter when it comes to poetry, period. The grammatical units of poetry are lines and stanzas, not (as in prose) sentences and paragraphs.
>
> Do you even believe the b.s. you spew out, Dunce?

Ho, hum; let's see if the Pedo can back up his insult.

> Grammatical units are parts of ... (wait for it) ... sentences.

So you're saying that paragraphs and sentences (which are not "parts of ... (wait for it) ... sentences") are not grammatical units.

>
> This is as true for poetry as it is for prose.
>

> Homer, Dante, Shakespeare, Pope, Blake, Byron, Shelley, Keats, Poe, Tennyson, Eliot, WCW, Ginsberg (albeit run-on) and even Bukowski wrote complete sentences, Dunce.

Do you have a point, Pedodragon?

> cummings occasionally gibbered

Whatever that's supposed to mean. If you're back to your "gibberish means 'not written in a complete sentence' chant, well, that's just something you've made up.

... but Will isn't conducting word experiments.

What do "word experiments" have to do the the use of "complete sentences"? One can write a complete sentence full of word experiments; as an example, here's a famous example of a complete sentence that's full of them:

’Twas brillig, and the slithy toves
Did gyre and gimble in the wabe:
All mimsy were the borogoves,
And the mome raths outgrabe.
- from "Jabberwocky," Lewis Carroll

[George J. Dance]

In case the irony (as well as Pedodragon's hypocrisy) is lost on some of the more challenged readers, I'll point out that he reoutinely posts links to his videos and calls that posting poetry.

[Will Dockery]

Routinely second hands the music of Cyndi Lauper and others as part of these "poetry videos" as well.

[Michael Pendragon]

On Saturday, November 10, 2018 at 1:37:35 PM UTC-5, George J. Dance wrote:
> On Saturday, November 10, 2018 at 12:20:00 PM UTC-5, Michael Pendragon wrote:
> > On Saturday, November 10, 2018 at 10:39:43 AM UTC-5, George J. Dance wrote:
> > > On Saturday, November 10, 2018 at 3:10:44 AM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> > > > Gibberish... you prove my point for me, Pendragon... you simply do not understand modern poetry.
> > > >
> > >
> > > Certainly his idea that "gibbberish" means "not written in complete sentences" is a non-starter when it comes to poetry, period. The grammatical units of poetry are lines and stanzas, not (as in prose) sentences and paragraphs.
> >
> > Do you even believe the b.s. you spew out, Dunce?
>
> Ho, hum; let's see if the Pedo can back up his insult.

There was no insult, NAMBLA Dunce. I'd merely asked you a question (which, btw, you haven't answered).

> > Grammatical units are parts of ... (wait for it) ... sentences.
>
> So you're saying that paragraphs and sentences (which are not "parts of ... (wait for it) ... sentences") are not grammatical units.
>

No, NAMBLA Dunce.

But we are discussing incomplete sentences. Do try to focus.

> > This is as true for poetry as it is for prose.
> >
>
> > Homer, Dante, Shakespeare, Pope, Blake, Byron, Shelley, Keats, Poe, Tennyson, Eliot, WCW, Ginsberg (albeit run-on) and even Bukowski wrote complete sentences, Dunce.
>
> Do you have a point, Pedodragon?

Yes, and I'm sure that even a dunce like yourself can figure it out.

> > cummings occasionally gibbered
>
> Whatever that's supposed to mean. If you're back to your "gibberish means 'not written in a complete sentence' chant, well, that's just something you've made up.
>

I've already supplied you with the Merriam-Webster definition of "gibberish," NAMBLA Dunce. "Gibbered" (obviously) would be its past-tense verb form.

> ... but Will isn't conducting word experiments.
>
> What do "word experiments" have to do the the use of "complete sentences"? One can write a complete sentence full of word experiments;
>

Certainly, one *can* ... be, again, we are discussing incomplete sentences. cummings' word experiments included his abandoning the sentence form.

> as an example, here's a famous example of a complete sentence that's full of them:
>
> ’Twas brillig, and the slithy toves
> Did gyre and gimble in the wabe:
> All mimsy were the borogoves,
> And the mome raths outgrabe.
> - from "Jabberwocky," Lewis Carroll

It's also a complete sentence, NAMBLA Dunce, and therefore unrelated to the discussion at hand.

[George J. Dance]

On Saturday, November 10, 2018 at 12:02:14 PM UTC-5, Michael Pendragon wrote:
> On Saturday, November 10, 2018 at 3:10:44 AM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> > Gibberish... you prove my point for me, Pendragon... you simply do not understand modern poetry.
> >
>
> Merriam-Webster defines "gibberish" as:
>
> "unintelligible or meaningless language."

- which has nothing to do with whether it's in a complete sentence or not. Here's another example of a complete sentence composed of pure gibberish:

"What have we heard, what?" quoth whatever porpoise-
inspected pool drowned Madam Prevaricose
up to her leopard.
- from "A Dubliner of Cathay," PJ Ross

> When you fail to compose complete sentences, your use of language becomes unintelligible and, ultimately, meaningless.

Not true. Let's take this poem, that's been quoted here many a time

Silence
and a deeper silence
when the crickets
hesitate
- "Summer Haiku," Leonard Cohen

That's not written in complete sentences, but it's neither unintelligible nor meaningless.

[Will Dockery]

Excellent example, George.

[Michael Pendragon]

On Saturday, November 10, 2018 at 2:10:27 PM UTC-5, George J. Dance wrote:
> On Saturday, November 10, 2018 at 12:02:14 PM UTC-5, Michael Pendragon wrote:
> > On Saturday, November 10, 2018 at 3:10:44 AM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> > > Gibberish... you prove my point for me, Pendragon... you simply do not understand modern poetry.
> > >
> >
> > Merriam-Webster defines "gibberish" as:
> >
> > "unintelligible or meaningless language."
>
> - which has nothing to do with whether it's in a complete sentence or not.

It most certainly does, NAMBLA Dunce.

Consider the following gibberish:

"Black hieroglyphic signs
Chattahoochee Sunset going to bed.
Red clover runes as she shakes her head.
Chattahoochee Sunset going down.
Going down."

>
Here's another example of a complete sentence composed of pure gibberish:
>
> "What have we heard, what?" quoth whatever porpoise-
> inspected pool drowned Madam Prevaricose
> up to her leopard.
> - from "A Dubliner of Cathay," PJ Ross

There are various forms of gibberish, Dunce.

We are discussing the gibberish that results from incomplete sentences.

Do try to focus.

> > When you fail to compose complete sentences, your use of language becomes unintelligible and, ultimately, meaningless.
>
> Not true. Let's take this poem, that's been quoted here many a time
>
> Silence
> and a deeper silence
> when the crickets
> hesitate
> - "Summer Haiku," Leonard Cohen
>
> That's not written in complete sentences, but it's neither unintelligible nor meaningless.
>

It is quite meaningless, NAMBLA Dunce.

It is merely a description -- not a complete thought.

Consider the following:

"Chair."

I'm sure you know what a chair is, and can even envision a chair in your mind upon reading the word. But a verbal designation is not a complete thought.

"Chair
dog
cozy
hearth fire"

is gibberish -- although one can easily connect the dots to *create* a coherent sentence out of it.

[George J. Dance]

On Saturday, November 10, 2018 at 2:10:07 PM UTC-5, Michael Pendragon wrote:
> On Saturday, November 10, 2018 at 1:37:35 PM UTC-5, George J. Dance wrote:
> > On Saturday, November 10, 2018 at 12:20:00 PM UTC-5, Michael Pendragon wrote:
> > > On Saturday, November 10, 2018 at 10:39:43 AM UTC-5, George J. Dance wrote:
> > > > On Saturday, November 10, 2018 at 3:10:44 AM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> > > > > Gibberish... you prove my point for me, Pendragon... you simply do not understand modern poetry.
> > > >
> > > > Certainly his idea that "gibbberish" means "not written in complete sentences" is a non-starter when it comes to poetry, period. The grammatical units of poetry are lines and stanzas, not (as in prose) sentences and paragraphs.
> > >
> > > Do you even believe the b.s. you spew out, Dunce?
> >
> > Ho, hum; let's see if the Pedo can back up his insult.
>
> There was no insult, NAMBLA Dunce.

One expects you to fail to understand what others write, Pedodragon; but are you really incapble of understanding what you write?

> I'd merely asked you a question (which, btw, you haven't answered).

> > > Grammatical units are parts of ... (wait for it) ... sentences.
> >
> > So you're saying that paragraphs and sentences (which are not "parts of ... (wait for it) ... sentences") are not grammatical units.
> >
>
> No, NAMBLA Dunce.

But you just claimed that "grammatical units" were all "parts of ... (wait for it) ... sentences" - so that's what your sentence means, Pedodragon.

> But we are discussing incomplete sentences.

Well, right now, we're discussing my claim that the grammatical units are lines and stanzas; which you tried to disprove by claiming (somewhat stupidly) that grammatical units are all parts of sentences. I refuted your claim by giving you two counter-examples.

> Do try to focus.

Indeed.

> > > This is as true for poetry as it is for prose.
> > >
> >
> > > Homer, Dante, Shakespeare, Pope, Blake, Byron, Shelley, Keats, Poe, Tennyson, Eliot, WCW, Ginsberg (albeit run-on) and even Bukowski wrote complete sentences, Dunce.
> >
> > Do you have a point, Pedodragon?
>
> Yes, and I'm sure that even a dunce like yourself can figure it out.

Well, Pedo, since you can't explain what it is, I'll have to try. You've noticed that a lot of poets have written poems using complete sentences; which is where you got the idea that poetry has to be written in complete sentences.

> > > cummings occasionally gibbered
> >
> > Whatever that's supposed to mean. If you're back to your "gibberish means 'not written in a complete sentence' chant, well, that's just something you've made up.
>
> I've already supplied you with the Merriam-Webster definition of "gibberish,"

Not to me you haven't; but since Merriam-Webster has supplied it online, let me "supply" it here:

"Definition of gibberish
: unintelligible or meaningless language:
a : a technical or esoteric (see ESOTERIC sense 1) language
(The doctors spoke to one another in their medical gibberish that I was unable to follow.)
b : pretentious or needlessly obscure language

Nothing to do with the use of complete or incomplete sentences there.

Notice, BTW, that Merriam Webster's definitions are not complete sentences; which does not make them either unintelligible or meaningless.

> NAMBLA Dunce. "Gibbered" (obviously) would be its past-tense verb form.

Yes, Pedodragon. I think everyone understood you were claiming that Cummings occasionally wrote gibberish (whatever that's supposed to mean).

> > ... but Will isn't conducting word experiments.
> >
> > What do "word experiments" have to do the the use of "complete sentences"? One can write a complete sentence full of word experiments;
>
> Certainly, one *can* ... be, again, we are discussing incomplete sentences.

> cummings' word experiments included his abandoning the sentence form.

If that's what you meant, then that's what you should have said.

Did you really think you'd win your point simply be calling Cummings's poems that don't use complete sentences "gibberish"?

> > as an example, here's a famous example of a complete sentence that's full of them:
> >
> > ’Twas brillig, and the slithy toves
> > Did gyre and gimble in the wabe:
> > All mimsy were the borogoves,
> > And the mome raths outgrabe.
> > - from "Jabberwocky," Lewis Carroll
>
> It's also a complete sentence

As I just told you: it's a complete sentence full of gibberish; enough to show that "gibberish" has nothing to do with writing in complete sentences.

> , NAMBLA Dunce, and therefore unrelated to the discussion at hand.

It shows that "gibberish" and "not written in complete sentences" do not have the same, or even a similar, meaning.

[Peter J Ross]

In alt.arts.poetry.comments on Sat, 10 Nov 2018 12:02:36 -0800 (PST),
George J. Dance wrote:

> Pedo

> Pedo

> Pedo

> Pedo

The Duncewit doth protest too much, methinks.



--
PJR :-)

τὸν οἰόμενον νόον ἔχειν ὁ νουθετέων ματαιοπονεῖ.
- Democritus

[George J. Dance]

On Saturday, November 10, 2018 at 2:34:47 PM UTC-5, Michael Pendragon wrote:
> On Saturday, November 10, 2018 at 2:10:27 PM UTC-5, George J. Dance wrote:
> > On Saturday, November 10, 2018 at 12:02:14 PM UTC-5, Michael Pendragon wrote:
> > > On Saturday, November 10, 2018 at 3:10:44 AM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> > > > Gibberish... you prove my point for me, Pendragon... you simply do not understand modern poetry.
> > >
> > > Merriam-Webster defines "gibberish" as:
> > >
> > > "unintelligible or meaningless language."
> >
> > - which has nothing to do with whether it's in a complete sentence or not.
>
> It most certainly does, NAMBLA Dunce.

It most certainly does not, Pedodragon. As we've seen, "unintelligible or meaningless language" can be written in complete sentences.

> Consider the following gibberish:
>
> "Black hieroglyphic signs
> Chattahoochee Sunset going to bed.
> Red clover runes as she shakes her head.
> Chattahoochee Sunset going down.
> Going down."

Well, let's assume, for the sake of the argument, that the above is meaningless or unintelligible; and see if the "incomplete sentences" have anything to do with that, by turning them into complete sentences:

> There are black hieroglyphic signs
> of Chattahoochee Sunset going to bed.
> I see red clover runes as she shakes her head.
> Chattahoochee Sunset is going down.
> It's going down."

I can't see that that affects the meaning or the intelligility in the slightest.

> Here's another example of a complete sentence composed of pure gibberish:
> >
> > "What have we heard, what?" quoth whatever porpoise-
> > inspected pool drowned Madam Prevaricose
> > up to her leopard.
> > - from "A Dubliner of Cathay," PJ Ross
>
> There are various forms of gibberish, Dunce.
>
> We are discussing the gibberish that results from incomplete sentences.
>
> Do try to focus.
>
>
> > > When you fail to compose complete sentences, your use of language becomes unintelligible and, ultimately, meaningless.
> >
> > Not true. Let's take this poem, that's been quoted here many a time
> >
> > Silence
> > and a deeper silence
> > when the crickets
> > hesitate
> > - "Summer Haiku," Leonard Cohen
> >
> > That's not written in complete sentences, but it's neither unintelligible nor meaningless.
>
> It is quite meaningless, NAMBLA Dunce.

It is, Pedodragon? You really think it's a meaningless string of words?

> It is merely a description

snip [Sorry - I have to go out for a while]

[Peter J Ross]

In alt.arts.poetry.comments on Sat, 10 Nov 2018 12:26:52 -0800 (PST),

George J. Dance wrote:

> snip [Sorry - I have to go out for a while]

That's a SPANK awarded to Creepy Mike.

[General Zod]

On Saturday, November 10, 2018 at 11:18:22 AM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> As noted before, he simply lacks the imagination to see beyond his rigid and outdated rules.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YMf2QUKg3aM

Bob Dylan - Stuck Inside Of Mobile With The Memphis Blues Again

[Michael Pendragon]

On Saturday, November 10, 2018 at 3:26:53 PM UTC-5, George J. Dance wrote:
> On Saturday, November 10, 2018 at 2:34:47 PM UTC-5, Michael Pendragon wrote:
> > On Saturday, November 10, 2018 at 2:10:27 PM UTC-5, George J. Dance wrote:
> > > On Saturday, November 10, 2018 at 12:02:14 PM UTC-5, Michael Pendragon wrote:
> > > > On Saturday, November 10, 2018 at 3:10:44 AM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> > > > > Gibberish... you prove my point for me, Pendragon... you simply do not understand modern poetry.
> > > >
> > > > Merriam-Webster defines "gibberish" as:
> > > >
> > > > "unintelligible or meaningless language."
> > >
> > > - which has nothing to do with whether it's in a complete sentence or not.
> >
> > It most certainly does, NAMBLA Dunce.
>
> It most certainly does not, Pedodragon. As we've seen, "unintelligible or meaningless language" can be written in complete sentences.
>

We are discussing Will's poetry, NAMBLA Dunce.

Will's poetry is unintelligible because they comprise a list of thought fragments clustered around a loosely-delineated theme.

Were Will to think his thought fragments out, and express them in complete sentences, his poetry *might* approach the "semi-intelligible" mark.

> > Consider the following gibberish:
> >
> > "Black hieroglyphic signs
> > Chattahoochee Sunset going to bed.
> > Red clover runes as she shakes her head.
> > Chattahoochee Sunset going down.
> > Going down."
>
> Well, let's assume, for the sake of the argument, that the above is meaningless or unintelligible; and see if the "incomplete sentences" have anything to do with that, by turning them into complete sentences:
>
> > There are black hieroglyphic signs
> > of Chattahoochee Sunset going to bed.
> > I see red clover runes as she shakes her head.
> > Chattahoochee Sunset is going down.
> > It's going down."
>
> I can't see that that affects the meaning or the intelligility in the slightest.
>

Some gibberish is unsalvageable.

> > Here's another example of a complete sentence composed of pure gibberish:
> > >
> > > "What have we heard, what?" quoth whatever porpoise-
> > > inspected pool drowned Madam Prevaricose
> > > up to her leopard.
> > > - from "A Dubliner of Cathay," PJ Ross
> >
> > There are various forms of gibberish, Dunce.
> >
> > We are discussing the gibberish that results from incomplete sentences.
> >
> > Do try to focus.
> >
> >
> > > > When you fail to compose complete sentences, your use of language becomes unintelligible and, ultimately, meaningless.
> > >
> > > Not true. Let's take this poem, that's been quoted here many a time
> > >
> > > Silence
> > > and a deeper silence
> > > when the crickets
> > > hesitate
> > > - "Summer Haiku," Leonard Cohen
> > >
> > > That's not written in complete sentences, but it's neither unintelligible nor meaningless.
> >
> > It is quite meaningless, NAMBLA Dunce.
>
> It is, Pedodragon? You really think it's a meaningless string of words?

Were it turned into a sentence, it would describe absolute silence vs the ambient silence that makes up the soundscapes of our world.

As written, it's Yoda-speak.

[Will Dockery]

Thanks for reading and commenting, Dance and Pendragon... I will respond in detail later, I'm on the mobile gizmo right now.

😊

[Will Dockery]

This was actually imported from the Bob Dylan group, where I have quite a few friends.

[mydemon...@gmail.com]

On Tuesday, November 13, 2018 at 12:25:17 AM UTC-5, Ellsworth M. Toohey wrote:
> This was actually imported from the Bob Dylan group, where I have quite a few friends.
>

You should have left it there.

No one wants to read cross-posts from other groups.

Anyone who is interested in Dylan is already a member of the Dylan group.

If the rest of us ever develop any interest in Dylan, we will join the Dylan group.

This is a POETRY group, and we would all appreciate it if you would stop your annoying OFF-TOPIC cross-posts.

[Will Dockery]

On Tuesday, November 13, 2018 at 8:49:52 AM UTC-5, mydemon...@gmail.com wrote:
>
> This is a POETRY group

And Bob Dylan is well established worldwide as a great poet.

But you already know that by now, Pen.

[Will Dockery]

"General Zod" wrote in message
news:5d82899e-e8e5-4f3e...@googlegroups.com...

On Wednesday, November 7, 2018 at 11:45:49 AM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> "President_dudley" wrote in message
> news:2793a7bd-248e-4722...@googlegroups.com...
> > On Sunday, November 4, 2018 at 5:31:41 PM UTC-5, jimha...@gmail.com
> > wrote:
> >
> > On Thursday, October 9, 1997 at 3:00:00 AM UTC-4, Brad Chapman wrote:
> > > Hello! My friend is spending this semester over in Germany,and she is
> > > going to be visiting Nuremberg, a site of a Nazi concentration camp.
> > > Well, while she was listeing to some lecture about Nuremberg, she
> > > heard
> > > the prof mention something about a Bob Dylan performance at Nuremberg
> > > where, in the direct wording of my friend: "Bob Dylan sang there once
> > > and he did something (i didntcatch what) taht showed that he realized
> > > what had happened there and he was protesting that or something."
> > > (They
> > > do speak German over there and all!). Anyways, does anyone know about
> > > a
> > > Bob Dylan concert at Nuremberg, and have any kind of info--dates, set
> > > lists, etc.. Thanks a lot for you time!
> > >
> > > Brad Chapman
> > > chap...@pilot.msu.edu
> >
> > I Was @ the Concert. Eric Clapton, Bob Dillon, Muddy Waters and a German
> > Band Called "Chicken Shack" recorded a live Album which Myself and all
> > my
> > Army Buddies wound up on the back of the album cover !We were about 30
> > feet from the stage. It rained but otherwise was an AWESOME Concert !!
>
> hey jimha,
>
> thanks for taking the time to post this, and i hope this finds you well.
>
> i love it when i go to these elderly sites and someone dredges up a dead
> post that is more alive than some of the people i know.
>
> just a cursory seek yields this:
>
> https://www.setlist.fm/festival/1978/open-air-festival78-bob-dylan-nurnberg-1978-4bd657d2.html
>
> https://www.setlist.fm/setlist/bob-dylan/1978/zeppelinfeld-nuremberg-germany-53d7c3d9.html
>
> this purports to be the entirety of the concert:
>
> Bob Dylan Nuremberg 1978 (Nurnberg)
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UeRM7Cwz-lE
>
> }
>
> Hubert Bruns
> 1 year ago (edited)
> Please note the announcement of MASTERS OF WAR (at about 1:40:50): "Great
> pleasure to sing this in this place!". The location was the Zeppelinfeld
> aka
> Reichsparteitagsgelände where the nazi party celebrated itself in the
> 1930s. Incredible moment! I'm sorry for my bad English but I hope
> everybody
> will understand the meaning of my comment!
> {
>
> Nice remembrance in today's political climate, nicht wahr?
>
> That said, i really prefer 58:06
>
> take care,
> rdd
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Classic show from one of the greatest eras of Dylan performance poetry....
> I
> saw him, of course, a few months later up in Atlanta at the grand old
> Omni,
> long ago demolished.

> Out damn standing...…………..

Indeed, indeed...

[cobbjaq...@gmail.com]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QfiK17FhP4g

My favorite Dylan tune.

[Good Time Charley]

Great perforemance…………….

[Ellen Horny]

Jaquavious Cobb, how many of these links did Will tell you to post? If he promised you more than a dollar a dozen, I'm pissed.

[Will Dockery]

Bob Dylan is a Nobel Prize winning poet, so of course discussion of his life and work is on topic here.

[Michael Pendragon]

On Wednesday, November 14, 2018 at 12:50:29 PM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> Bob Dylan is a Nobel Prize winning poet, so of course discussion of his life and work is on topic here.
>

How many times do I need to explain this to you, Will?

He is not a Nobel Prize winning poet because he did not win a Nobel Prize for poetry.

He is a Nobel Prize winning writer because he won the Nobel Prize for literature.

[Will Dockery]

Dylan is a poet, thus is on topic in a poetry group.

[Michael Pendragon]

On Wednesday, November 14, 2018 at 1:10:29 PM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> Dylan is a poet, thus is on topic in a poetry group.

I'm a poet.

I can also play a variety of musical instruments.

A video of my playing the piano would be OFF-TOPIC here.

Sometimes I write reviews of old movies on Amazon or in rec.arts.movies.past-films, etc.

Posting one of my movie reviews here would be OFF-TOPIC.

I am guilty of having posted a handful of my short stories here. However, I've only posted a half dozen or so over the past 5 years. If you, Pick, and Rachel only made a half-dozen Dylan posts over a 5 year period I'd have no cause to complain.

[Will Dockery]

If that is how you feel about your own posts, fine, Pendragon

Your rules do not apply to the other poets here, though.

[Michael Pendragon]

On Wednesday, November 14, 2018 at 2:38:32 PM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> If that is how you feel about your own posts, fine, Pendragon
>
> Your rules do not apply to the other poets here, though.

It's a general Usenet rule, Will.

Posts are supposed to be ON-TOPIC.

That's why they made different groups for different topics.

[Will Dockery]

"Good Time Charley" wrote in message
news:f962231b-33b6-4126...@googlegroups.com...

> > Out damn standing...…………..
>
> The 1978 Street Legal tour, the last of what is now called the "Silver
> Age" of Dylan.

> A fine time to be alive...………………..

Indeed it was...

[jaquaviousc...@gmail.com]

He gave me bunch of links to click on and told me what to say. He gave me urls to post in them. Is this some illegal shit he wants me to do? He said he would make me a star.

[Good Time Charley]

Dylan poetry........................

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q0OdNY8Aybw

[General Zod]

Fabulous...………...

[General Zod]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_VtOrYBU-pw

Bob Dylan On German TV (1978)

[General Zod]

Rockonand…………………...bless....my.....soul...………………………….

[Will Dockery]

"General Zod" wrote in message
news:5d82899e-e8e5-4f3e...@googlegroups.com...

> Out damn standing...…………..

Agreed.

[General Zod]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YwSZvHqf9qM

In 1975, Bob Dylan released his fifteenth studio album, Blood on the Tracks. Taken from the cult classic Renaldo and Clara, you can watch Dylan's riveting live performance of Tangled Up in Blue now.

[Will Dockery]

Good video, Zod.

[Good Time Charley]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oj2CPqX-tLc

From the movie "No Direction Home - Bob Dylan Part 2". Bob reads some interesting offers of a shop and mocks them Dylan-style.

[Michael Pendragon]

On Monday, November 26, 2018 at 7:40:39 PM UTC-5, Good Time Charley wrote:
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oj2CPqX-tLc
>
> From the movie "No Direction Home - Bob Dylan Part 2". Bob reads some interesting offers of a shop and mocks them Dylan-style.
>

Do you ever get a chance to bathe, Did?

Has your skin gotten all dry and scaly?

Does your toe-jam outweigh your toes?

Does the feral scent of Monkey Cage envelope you wherever you go?

How does cooked rat meat taste?

[Will Dockery]

Zod actually has it pretty good, from my observation, yesterday.

Columbus Georgia treats the homeless quite kindly, it seems.

[Michael Pendragon]

On Monday, November 26, 2018 at 8:50:36 PM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> Zod actually has it pretty good, from my observation, yesterday.
>
> Columbus Georgia treats the homeless quite kindly, it seems.

[Will considers selling the shed back to Brother Dave and hitting the open road with good ol' "Mad Dog" Did.]

[Conley Brothers]

On Sunday, November 25, 2018 at 10:36:33 PM UTC, General Zod wrote:
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YwSZvHqf9qM
>
> In 1975, Bob Dylan released his fifteenth studio album, Blood on the Tracks. Taken from the cult classic Renaldo and Clara, you can watch Dylan's riveting live performance of Tangled Up in Blue now.

Nice cut/paste of the video comments. It's too bad you can't come up with your own coherent thoughts on it other than some idiocy like:
"Dat good"

[Will Dockery]

On Monday, November 26, 2018 at 9:26:35 PM UTC-5, Michael Pendragon wrote:
> On Monday, November 26, 2018 at 8:50:36 PM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
>
> > Zod actually has it pretty good, from my observation, yesterday.

Here it is:

https://scontent-atl3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/46705470_10157109414189363_3284620434829475840_n.jpg?_nc_cat=101&_nc_ht=scontent-atl3-1.xx&oh=556d544fcf335e4383e465378ab95fa7&oe=5CAB9679

alt.arts.poetry.comments, Facebook Edition!
Admin · November 24 ·

General Zod aka George Sulzbach 2018. — at Shadowville.

> > Columbus Georgia treats the homeless quite kindly, it seems.
>
> [Will considers selling the shed

Not likely.

:)

[Will Dockery]

So, fake CB, what original comments and opinions do you have on the Bob Dylan poetry posted here?

😀

[General Zod]

On Tuesday, November 27, 2018 at 4:23:11 PM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
> So, fake CB, what original comments and opinions do you have on the Bob Dylan poetry posted here?
>
> 😀

Hilarious...………...….

[Will Dockery]

"Michael Pendragon" wrote in message
news:de41dae8-987d-4e27...@googlegroups.com...
>
> Go play it in the Dylan group

Bob Dylan is one of the greatest of American poets so this is on-topic here.

:)

[Michael Pendragon]

You should be horsewhipped for making such a dumbassed statement... except for the fact that your really are that big a dumbass.

[Will Dockery™]

Your jealosy of Bob Dylan is unbecoming, Pendragon.

:)

[General Zod]

Pen dragon Dylan is s real poet
.....

You just play at it....

[Will Dockery]

"Michael Pendragon" wrote in message
news:de41dae8-987d-4e27...@googlegroups.com...
>

> Go play it in the Dylan group ...

No, I think I'll stay here.

:)

[Rex Hester Jr.]

On Wednesday, November 7, 2018 at 11:45:49 AM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:

Outstanding.....

[Will Dockery]

Jim Harp wrote in message
news:db7b7db8-6b38-402a...@googlegroups.com...

> On Thursday, October 9, 1997 at 3:00:00 AM UTC-4, Brad Chapman wrote:
>
> Hello! My friend is spending this semester over in Germany,and she is
> going to be visiting Nuremberg, a site of a Nazi concentration camp.
> Well, while she was listeing to some lecture about Nuremberg, she heard
> the prof mention something about a Bob Dylan performance at Nuremberg
> where, in the direct wording of my friend: "Bob Dylan sang there once
> and he did something (i didntcatch what) taht showed that he realized
> what had happened there and he was protesting that or something." (They
> do speak German over there and all!). Anyways, does anyone know about a
> Bob Dylan concert at Nuremberg, and have any kind of info--dates, set
> lists, etc.. Thanks a lot for you time!
>
> Brad Chapman
> chap...@pilot.msu.edu

I Was @ the Concert. Eric Clapton, Bob Dillon, Muddy Waters and a German
Band Called "Chicken Shack" recorded a live Album which Myself and all my
Army Buddies wound up on the back of the album cover !We were about 30 feet
from the stage. It rained but otherwise was an AWESOME Concert !!

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Sounds like a Hell of a show...

[High Number]

Indeed...……...

[Zod-The...@none.i2p]

Jim Harp wrote in message [/color

> > news:db7b7db8-6b38-402a...@googlegroups.com...
> >> On Thursday, October 9, 1997 at 3:00:00 AM UTC-4, Brad Chapman wrote:
> >>
> >> Hello! My friend is spending this semester over in Germany,and she is
> >> going to be visiting Nuremberg, a site of a Nazi concentration camp.
> >> Well, while she was listeing to some lecture about Nuremberg, she heard
> >> the prof mention something about a Bob Dylan performance at Nuremberg
> >> where, in the direct wording of my friend: "Bob Dylan sang there once
> >> and he did something (i didntcatch what) taht showed that he realized
> >> what had happened there and he was protesting that or something." (They
> >> do speak German over there and all!). Anyways, does anyone know about a
> >> Bob Dylan concert at Nuremberg, and have any kind of info--dates, set
> >> lists, etc.. Thanks a lot for you time!
> >>
> >> Brad Chapman
> >> chap...@pilot.msu.edu
> >
> > I Was @ the Concert. Eric Clapton, Bob Dillon, Muddy Waters and a German
> > Band Called "Chicken Shack" recorded a live Album which Myself and all my
> > Army Buddies wound up on the back of the album cover !We were about 30 feet
> > from the stage. It rained but otherwise was an AWESOME Concert !!
> >

Recent clips suggest Bob Dylan is back and better than ever in some ways............

[Will-D...@none.i2p]

General Zod wrote on Thu, 03 October 2019 10:37

> Indeed............

Yes it does...

[Will Dockery]

On Saturday, November 10, 2018 at 3:26:53 PM UTC-5, George J. Dance wrote:
> On Saturday, November 10, 2018 at 2:34:47 PM UTC-5, Michael Pendragon wrote:
> > On Saturday, November 10, 2018 at 2:10:27 PM UTC-5, Will Dockery wrote:
>
> > > > > Gibberish... you prove my point for me, Pendragon... you simply do not understand modern poetry.
> > > >
> > > > Merriam-Webster defines "gibberish" as:
> > > >
> > > > "unintelligible or meaningless language."
> > >
> > > - which has nothing to do with whether it's in a complete sentence or not.
> >
> > It most certainly does, NAMBLA Dunce.
>
> It most certainly does not, Pedodragon. As we've seen, "unintelligible or meaningless language" can be written in complete sentences.
>
> > Consider the following gibberish:
> >
> > "Black hieroglyphic signs
> > Chattahoochee Sunset going to bed.
> > Red clover runes as she shakes her head.
> > Chattahoochee Sunset going down.
> > Going down."
>
> Well, let's assume, for the sake of the argument, that the above is meaningless or unintelligible; and see if the "incomplete sentences" have anything to do with that, by turning them into complete sentences:
>
> > There are black hieroglyphic signs
> > of Chattahoochee Sunset going to bed.
> > I see red clover runes as she shakes her head.
> > Chattahoochee Sunset is going down.
> > It's going down."
>
> I can't see that that affects the meaning or the intelligility in the slightest.
>
> > Here's another example of a complete sentence composed of pure gibberish:
> > >
> > > "What have we heard, what?" quoth whatever porpoise-
> > > inspected pool drowned Madam Prevaricose
> > > up to her leopard.
> > > - from "A Dubliner of Cathay," PJ Ross
> >
> > There are various forms of gibberish, Dunce.
> >
> > We are discussing the gibberish that results from incomplete sentences.
> >
> > Do try to focus.
> >
> >
> > > > When you fail to compose complete sentences, your use of language becomes unintelligible and, ultimately, meaningless.
> > >
> > > Not true. Let's take this poem, that's been quoted here many a time
> > >
> > > Silence
> > > and a deeper silence
> > > when the crickets
> > > hesitate
> > > - "Summer Haiku," Leonard Cohen
> > >
> > > That's not written in complete sentences, but it's neither unintelligible nor meaningless.
> >
> > It is quite meaningless, NAMBLA Dunce.
>
> It is, Pedodragon? You really think it's a meaningless string of words?

I missed most of this discussion the first the around, interesting how the same points were being made even then.

[Michael Pendragon]

What points, Will?

That your poetry is meaningless gibberish?

That your poetry remains meaningless gibberish even after George puts it into an approximation of sentence form?

That your poetry is a tenth-rate imitation of a folk song?

[ME]

Amen Michael.
Or, should I say ‘seconded’?!!

[Will Dockery]

On Saturday, July 11, 2020 at 4:39:18 PM UTC-4, Michael Pendragon wrote:
>

> That your poetry is meaningless gibberish?

That you were wrong about that before and are again.

You even called Leonard Cohen and e.e. cummings' poetry "meaningless gibberish".

;)

[ME]

Shut the fuck up will.
He’s not talking about Cohen or Cummings poetry. He’s talking about the regurgitated bullshit that you claim is your poetry.
Stop deflecting from the topic at hand.

[Will Dockery]

On Saturday, July 11, 2020 at 5:22:14 PM UTC-4, ME wrote:
> On Saturday, July 11, 2020 at 5:17:08 PM UTC-4, Will Dockery wrote:
>
> > That you were wrong about that before and are again.
> >
> > You even called Leonard Cohen and e.e. cummings' poetry "meaningless gibberish".
>

> He’s not talking about Cohen or Cummings poetry

Yes he was. Here is part of the discussion of Leonard Cohen:

-----------------------------------------------

> > > When you fail to compose complete sentences, your use of language becomes unintelligible and, ultimately, meaningless.
> >
> > Not true. Let's take this poem, that's been quoted here many a time
> >
> > Silence
> > and a deeper silence
> > when the crickets
> > hesitate
> > - "Summer Haiku," Leonard Cohen
> >
> > That's not written in complete sentences, but it's neither unintelligible nor meaningless.
>
> It is quite meaningless, NAMBLA Dunce.

It is, Pedodragon? You really think it's a meaningless string of words?

--------------------------------------------

On e.e. cummings:

--------------------------------------------
> cummings occasionally gibbered

Whatever that's supposed to mean. If you're back to your "gibberish means 'not written in a complete sentence' chant, well, that's just something you've made up.
--------------------------------------------

[Michael Pendragon]

Your poetry is not Cohen's or cummings'.

Nor is it on a par with theirs.

[Michael Pendragon]

Cohen and cummings occasionally gibbered. However, they gibbered at a far more advanced level than you could ever dream of approximating.

[Will Dockery]

I never claimed it was, and, of course, your poetry is inferior to Cohen and cummings, since you bring it up.

;)

[Will Dockery]

"Certainly his idea that "gibbberish" means "not written in complete sentences" is a non-starter when it comes to poetry, period. The grammatical units of poetry are lines and stanzas, not (as in prose) sentences and paragraphs..." -George J. Dance

https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.arts.poetry.comments/mXC-5dB8YuI/rOjBFX1XAgAJ

:)

[Rocky]

Good read...