Rather poor TV manual!
Ashley
Andy Wade
> Well I've heard of Japlish but this is not that language. Is it an
> example of the rare dialect Chinglish?
No, I suspect it's an unedited computer translation.
--
Andy
Brian Gaff
80s Toshiba thought of a great way to make a manual that did not use
language at all.
It was a VCR. The basic idea seemed to be to show pictures of the display
and control setting steps with smiley faces for correct, and frowning ones
with glum looks for wrong.
It was fine for simple stuff, but was somewhat bemusing for anything that
had several steps that relied on the previous steps.
Very weird though.
Brian
--
Brian Gaff - bri...@blueyonder.co.uk
Note:- In order to reduce spam, any email without 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name may be lost.
Blind user, so no pictures please!
"Ashley" <a...@snglinksRemoveThisBit.com> wrote in message
news:fYidnXtChvMe4fPT...@bt.com...
> http://www.raspberrycrafts.co.uk/worldsworst/index.htm
>
> --
>
Brian Gaff
this manual used pictures as all the links on that sight though talking
about translation is in fact just pictures of the text. Very very
helpful.... not.
Pity nobody could be bothered to OCR it then.
Andy Burns
> Pity nobody could be bothered to OCR it then.
not have any OCR capability? Though to be fair, any OCR program would be
quite likely to burst into flames if asked to transcribe the manual!
e.g.
Usage Elucidation
Usage Manual
Patronage LCD color tlevisions of many thanks, only watch gratitude, for
can the sharing use the characteristics of this machine with insure to
without cause use, please over a long period of time careful read this
manual, and combine obey among them row items.
A, Announcements
1. this television be tried absolutely not to by the electronics dollar
of a lot of nicety the piece consitute of, the tear openning to unload o
refit make its damage or break, to by oneself maintain, if the emergence
break down and please turn off the television immediately, and contact
our company or dealer.
Grimly Curmudgeon
<a...@snglinksRemoveThisBit.com> wrote:
>http://www.raspberrycrafts.co.uk/worldsworst/index.htm
It all seems quite clear.
Graham.
"Andy Wade" <spamb...@maxwell.myzen.co.uk> wrote in message news:9d8f54...@mid.individual.net...
but (page 3) "invite the consult cowgirl operating instructions" ???
--
Graham.
%Profound_observation%
J G Miller
Grimly Curmudgeon explained:
> It all seems quite clear.
QUOTE
Raspberry Crafts
We apologise for any inconvenience caused but due to major
ill health no products or services can be provided by the
company until further notice
UNQUOTE
Graham.
"J G Miller" <mil...@yoyo.ORG> wrote in message news:j4npsb$kv9$1...@dont-email.me...
--
Graham.
%Profound_observation%
John Rumm
> Brian Gaff wrote:
>
>> Pity nobody could be bothered to OCR it then.
>
> Well, I for one don't posess any OCR software, does your screen reader
> not have any OCR capability? Though to be fair, any OCR program would be
> quite likely to burst into flames if asked to transcribe the manual!
Well I let my screen shot reader have a bash... here is the unedited result:
3-1. Need machine key( control from a distance the key)
1. Function: machine or from machine appearance turn the work appearance
appearance
2. Elucidation:
• While turn power onning. TV placed into machine appearance bottom.
• Each according to a time( machine) key. machine with of normal
appearance conversion.
• Machine appearance.besides machine key outside, rest key all have no
effect.
• Open to machine hour contain factory the manifestation that scribe.
3-2. TV/ AV( control from a distance, this machine key)
1. I:unction:Cut over the TV mode with the AV mode
2. Elucidation:
• Have two road AV importation.
• Each according to a time this key between TV and AV conversion.
• In the AV appearance, if press arithmetic figure key 0-9.-. CH+, CH-
with RECALL key. would still rise the function. TV channel return the
cowgirl bottom.
3-3. 0~9:-( control from a distance the key)
1. Funetion:The item's fast choice of press program debug
2. Elucidation
• 0-9 number program, press direct choice. 10-255 number program
choice.Need to choose to press key to choose an or three appearances.
thcn{0-9) the key one by one in order input 100s
• If the program number pressed beyond the reach of 255 program number,
then the key have no effect.
• Change the set to complete the empress, current program number and
last time the program number produce the cowgirl changes, and the result
automatically write in the EE PROM inside.
■ If choose with the number of same alike number of current program. CPU
afresh read from the EEPROM the relevant save information of the current
program number.
• When the proceeding program exchange, can 1156(0-9) the direct choice
of key to proceed the program number that exchange.
3-4. CH+;CH-/ program+;Program-( control from a distance, this machine key)
1. Function:The program number increases reduce:The menu win elections
item's choice: Debug choice;Calendar function
2. Elucidation
• Use the CH- CH-change program number, would automatically jump the
"SKIP ON" program number.
• If have the program number to all place to jump up to open appearance,
press CH+/ CH-key can fix to choose 0 number program.If appearance for
there is a programing for jump upping openning. press CI I - CH- key fix
to choose this top program.
• If press CH the - the key arrive already save biggest program of set
number, again press CM* key and then jump already save program of
minimum set number: If press CI I- key to arrive already save program of
minimum set number, again press CH- key and jump already save biggest
program of the set number.
• The information that conversion complete the empress, current program
number and last time program number will change, pan out to
automatically deposit the EEPROM inside.
• At all hold the menu inside. CH+ use with CH- key to options in the
menu of next choice. ( invite the consult cowgirl operating instructions)
• While be placed inning the calendar to look into the appearance, use
the CM- the CH- key use changes for year.
--
Cheers,
John.
/=================================================================\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\=================================================================/
Brian Gaff
comply with accessability, manuals should not be supplied in pdf which are
merely photos.
I think that there are far too many people out there who seem to think
that just scanning stuff in is all we need as if some magical process
takes place.
If you have Office pro xp then you have ocr software.
I cannot say for lter versions of office.
Unfortunately, as you also say, its not just a case of ocring it. when a
company produces manuals for the web for example the graphic and the text
need to be thought of seperately.
Brian
--
Brian Gaff....Note, this account does not accept Bcc: email.
graphics are great, but the blind can't hear them
Email: bri...@blueyonder.co.uk
______________________________________________________________________________________________________________
"Andy Burns" <usenet....@adslpipe.co.uk> wrote in message
news:IbidncmrE--aifLT...@brightview.co.uk...
Andy Burns
> No the only ocr in a screenreader is in Cobra, its generallyaccepted that to
> comply with accessability, manuals should not be supplied in pdf which are
> merely photos.
piss-take web site where someone had scanned it on to poke fun at it.
> If you have Office pro xp then you have ocr software.
Nope, the last microsoft office I paid for was 97.
> when a company produces manuals for the web for example the graphic
> and the text need to be thought of seperately.
their manuals exist in a "readable" format.
David Taylor
> On Wed, 14 Sep 2011 08:11:01 +0100, "Brian Gaff"
><Bri...@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:
>
>>No the only ocr in a screenreader is in Cobra, its generallyaccepted that to
>>comply with accessability, manuals should not be supplied in pdf which are
>>merely photos.
>
> them.
> Yes I know that it is possible to print other formats.
PDF is fine - PDF which is an image (rather than text) is not.
--
David Taylor
Java Jive
the sort of problems it creates:
http://groups.google.com/group/uk.tech.digital-tv/browse_frm/thread/ec767da098401739/4f78a750018fc63f?#doc_60f10b842e11e51d
On Wed, 14 Sep 2011 08:25:41 +0000 (UTC), David Taylor
<davidt...@yadt.co.uk> wrote:
>
> PDF is fine - PDF which is an image (rather than text) is not.
--
Please always reply to ng as the email in this post's
header does not exist. Or use a contact address at:
http://www.macfh.co.uk/JavaJive/JavaJive.html
http://www.macfh.co.uk/Macfarlane/Macfarlane.html
JohnT
"Java Jive" <ja...@evij.com.invalid> wrote in message
news:9v61771pj8bqb68ve...@4ax.com...
--
JohnT
Ian Jackson
<johns...@yahoo.com> writes
previous contributors to the thread have bottom posted, are not really
expecting anyone to reply to them.
--
Ian
Deri James
> PDF is NOT fine, read from my first post (#8) onwards for examples of
> the sort of problems it creates:
> http://groups.google.com/group/uk.tech.digital-
tv/browse_frm/thread/ec767da098401739/4f78a750018fc63f?#doc_60f10b842e11e51d
>
PDF is an open standard (ISO32000-1) if you read the specification you will see
that Section 14.9 covers the features specifically designed for accessibility:-
============================================================================
PDF includes several facilities in support of accessibility of documents to
users with disabilities. In particular, many visually computer users with visual
impairments use screen readers to read documents aloud. To enable
proper vocalization, either through a screen reader or by some more direct
invocation of a text-to-speech engine, PDF supports the following features:
? Specifying the natural language used for text in a PDF document?for example,
as English or Spanish, or used to hide or reveal optional content (see 14.9.2,
?Natural Language Specification?)
? Providing textual descriptions for images or other items that do not translate
naturally into text (14.9.3, ?Alternate Descriptions?), or replacement text for
content that does translate into text but is represented in a nonstandard way
(such as with a ligature or illuminated character; see 14.9.4, ?Replacement
Text?)
? Specifying the expansion of abbreviations or acronyms (Section 14.9.5,
?Expansion of Abbreviations and Acronyms?)
The core of this support lies in the ability to determine the logical order of
content in a PDF document, independently of the content?s appearance or layout,
through logical structure and Tagged PDF, as described under 14.8.2.3, ?Page
Content Order.? An accessibility application can extract the content of a
document for presentation to users with disabilities by traversing the structure
hierarchy and presenting the contents of each node. For this reason, conforming
writers ensure that all information in a document is reachable by means of the
structure hierarchy, and they should use the facilities described in this sub-
clause.
===========================================================================
So if a PDF file is accessibility unfriendly the problem is the software which
created the PDF rather than the PDF format itself.
Deri
Java Jive
<de...@chuzzlewit.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>
> The core of this support lies in the ability to determine the logical order of
> content in a PDF document, independently of the content?s appearance or layout,
However, as I explained in the earlier thread that I linked, the vast
majority of PDF documents that I've ever encountered have no concept
of logical structure, so that when you try to copy and paste data from
them or to save them as text, the result is an unstructured, useless,
jumbled mess.
> So if a PDF file is accessibility unfriendly the problem is the software which
> created the PDF rather than the PDF format itself.
Perhaps, but that's little consolation when the vast majority of PDF
documents are poorly structured and poorly accessible. A decent
format wouldn't allow the sort of problems that I've explained.
And here's another reason not to use PDF. Suppose you know that you
have a document somewhere on your hard drive, relating to a particular
problem which has just arisen, but you obtained it so long ago that
you can't remember where you saved or what type of document it is -
HTML, Word, Excel, PDF, etc. So you search your hard drive for all
the documents containing some keyword that you are sure was in this
document, but unfortunately, the document was PDF, so this search will
not find it, because the contents of PDFs encrypted, even when they
are not protected in any way. You can check this for yourself by
loading any PDF of your choice into a hex editor or even just Notepad.
The whole thing's a pile of sh*te. I would advise anyone considering
using PDF to try to find a less obscure and less intractable open
source format to use instead.
Richard Tobin
Deri James <de...@chuzzlewit.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>So if a PDF file is accessibility unfriendly the problem is the
>software which created the PDF rather than the PDF format itself.
That the software is so poor is not unconnected with the format.
For example, software that generates plain text files generally does
not have such problems.
Amusingly, in a typical PDF file everything is plain text except the
text itself.
-- Richard
Java Jive
For some reason or other, it's not coming up in Agent 4.2. I've
checked that it has actually been sent (post #18) ...
http://groups.google.com/group/uk.tech.digital-tv/browse_frm/thread/7df35a6083865831#
... and I've tried disabling all the usenet killfile filters, which is
the usual culprit in this situation, but the post still doesn't
appear.
My news server is news.btconnect.com. Can anyone else using that
server see the post?
On Wed, 14 Sep 2011 19:24:43 +0100, Deri James
<de...@chuzzlewit.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>
> PDF is an open standard (ISO32000-1) if you read the specification you will see
> that Section 14.9 covers the features specifically designed for accessibility:-
Peter Duncanson
wrote:
>Is anyone else unable to see my previous reply to this post?
>
>
>However, as I explained in the earlier thread that I linked, the vast
>majority of PDF documents that I've ever encountered have no concept
>of logical structure, so that when you try to copy and paste data from
>them or to save them as text, the result is an unstructured, useless,
>jumbled mess.
>
>For some reason or other, it's not coming up in Agent 4.2. I've
>checked that it has actually been sent (post #18) ...
>http://groups.google.com/group/uk.tech.digital-tv/browse_frm/thread/7df35a6083865831#
>... and I've tried disabling all the usenet killfile filters, which is
>the usual culprit in this situation, but the post still doesn't
>appear.
>
>My news server is news.btconnect.com. Can anyone else using that
>server see the post?
>
>On Wed, 14 Sep 2011 19:24:43 +0100, Deri James
><de...@chuzzlewit.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>> PDF is an open standard (ISO32000-1) if you read the specification you will see
>> that Section 14.9 covers the features specifically designed for accessibility:-
--
(in uk.tech.digital-tv)
Max Demian
Would XPS files be any better?
--
Max Demian
Deri James
> Amusingly, in a typical PDF file everything is plain text except the
> text itself.
>
> -- Richard
<http://www.chuzzlewit.demon.co.uk/PDFs/simple.pdf>
with Notepad or a hex editor. The only binary in it is the 2nd line, the
rest of it is plain text. You should see:-
A simple PDF
And here?s another reason to use PDF
Cheers
Deri
Deri James
> And here's another reason not to use PDF. Suppose you know that you
> have a document somewhere on your hard drive, relating to a particular
> problem which has just arisen, but you obtained it so long ago that
> you can't remember where you saved or what type of document it is -
> HTML, Word, Excel, PDF, etc. So you search your hard drive for all
> the documents containing some keyword that you are sure was in this
> document, but unfortunately, the document was PDF, so this search will
> not find it, because the contents of PDFs encrypted, even when they
> are not protected in any way. You can check this for yourself by
> loading any PDF of your choice into a hex editor or even just Notepad.
>
on my KDE desktop all my PDF files (and many other formats) are dynamically
indexed, so when I do a search by pressing Alt-F2 the results from all my
PDFs pops up in a few seconds (since it is querying a database rather than
the files themselves). So again it is poor search software you are using ,
which is blindly doing a text only search rather than using intelligent
search agents which understand the format of the files it is searching.
If you don't need a password to view the PDF then no encryption is used,
what you are seeing is LZW compression of the text (the same as the "flate"
compression used by winzip). So your complaint about not being able to text
search applies to any file you have in a zip archive, or any other binary
format.
The PDF compression is not in fact mandatory for the standard and you can
create files which are readable in a text editor.
Deri
Richard Tobin
Their text content is usually compressed. It may also be encrypted.
Even a file that displays in a PDF reader without requiring you to
type a password may be encrypted using the empty password; I'm not
sure what the point of that is.
-- Richard
Java Jive
<de...@chuzzlewit.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>
> I think you're possibly using windows, so what you say is probably true, but
> on my KDE desktop all my PDF files (and many other formats) are dynamically
> indexed, so when I do a search by pressing Alt-F2 the results from all my
> PDFs pops up in a few seconds (since it is querying a database rather than
> the files themselves). So again it is poor search software you are using ,
> which is blindly doing a text only search rather than using intelligent
> search agents which understand the format of the files it is searching.
inaccessible format, you wouldn't NEED any such special indexing
software!
Also, BTW, Windows too has an indexing service that will index the
contents of documents on the hard drive. However, despite much disk
thrashing, I've never been able to satisfy myself that as a result of
having the service running searches complete any quicker. So I always
disable it. Consequently, I'm not sure whether the service can index
PDFs or not.
> If you don't need a password to view the PDF then no encryption is used,
> what you are seeing is LZW compression of the text (the same as the "flate"
> compression used by winzip). So your complaint about not being able to text
> search applies to any file you have in a zip archive, or any other binary
> format.
> The PDF compression is not in fact mandatory for the standard and you can
> create files which are readable in a text editor.
compression is required, it would be better to use a normal document
and put it in a zip, or else enable compression of all traffic from
the server for those browsers that can handle it, which nowadays is
nearly all.
Tests that I have done suggests that compression is only worthwhile
for documents greater than about 64Kb(*), so enabling compression by
the server for any document - HTML, PDF or other - over that size
would be far more transparent and far more beneficial to a site's
users, than trying to compress each individual page or document. It
can be done, but requires access to the server's configuration that
unfortunately is not usually available to the customers of SOHO web
hosting packages ...
* ... Consequently, as the only way of implementing compression with
most common SOHO web hosting packages is to use rather clunky PHP
wrappers, which is something of an implementation and maintenance
nightmare, I've only enabled compression on my site for three complex
pages, the two TV calculators and a mapping page containing a feature
editor.
Java Jive
but my original missing reply is still missing. I think BT must have
had a problem with its server or something like that. But, if that;s
really the explanaition, it's rather odd that I was even able to post
it.
On Wed, 14 Sep 2011 23:14:55 +0100, Java Jive <ja...@evij.com.invalid>
wrote:
Richard Tobin
>> Amusingly, in a typical PDF file everything is plain text except the
>> text itself.
-- Richard
Albert Ross
text.
J G Miller
> You seem determines to miss the point. If it wasn't for the
> inaccessible format, you wouldn't NEED any such special indexing
> software!
desktop indexing program, such as beagle, which is no doubt what
the poster is using on his KDE desktop.
<http://en.wikipedia.ORG/wiki/Beagle_%28software%29>
As he said, the indexing is of all files under his home directory,
including PDF and other formats.
Bill Wright
> No the only ocr in a screenreader is in Cobra, its generallyaccepted that to
> comply with accessability, manuals should not be supplied in pdf which are
> merely photos.
> I think that there are far too many people out there who seem to think
> that just scanning stuff in is all we need as if some magical process
> takes place.
> If you have Office pro xp then you have ocr software.
> I cannot say for lter versions of office.
> Unfortunately, as you also say, its not just a case of ocring it. when a
> company produces manuals for the web for example the graphic and the text
> need to be thought of seperately.
>
> Brian
>
Why don't you start a campaign asking that all manuals that are
distributed as pdfs are accompanied by a txt file?
Bill
Peter Duncanson
>On Sun, 18 Sep 2011 02:10:20 +0100, Bill Wright <bi...@invalid.com>
>wrote:
>or use Calibre to make his own.
Problem: Calibre has a visual interface - Brian is blind.
Also pdf is a pig of a format to convert to plain text.
See these snippets from the Calibre website at:
http://manual.calibre-ebook.com/conversion.html#pdfconversion
<quote>
PDF documents are one of the worst formats to convert from.
Some limitations of PDF input are:
Complex, multi-column, and image based documents are not supported.
To re-iterate PDF is a really, really bad format to use as input. If you
absolutely must use PDF, then be prepared for an output ranging anywhere
from decent to unusable, depending on the input PDF.
<endquote>
The type of document that Brian is interested in, and has commented on,
typically presents information in a tabular and/or multi-column style.
That is fine for a sighted person, but the text when copied and pasted
is an absolute disorderly mess.
Terry Casey
Sep 2011 19:29:46 +0100
Graham. <m...@privacy.com> wrote:
>
> "J G Miller" <mil...@yoyo.ORG> wrote in message news:j4npsb$kv9$1...@dont-email.me...
> > On Tuesday, September 13th, 2011 at 13:44:47h +0100,
> > Grimly Curmudgeon explained:
> >
> >> It all seems quite clear.
> >
> > Indeed it does.
> >
> > QUOTE
> >
> > Raspberry Crafts
> >
> > We apologise for any inconvenience caused but due to major
> > ill health no products or services can be provided by the
> > company until further notice
> >
> > UNQUOTE
> >
> Apart from the lack of punctuation what's so wrong with that? It sounds like a recent "The Archers" storyline.
There is something that Mr Miller has left out of that post, as I have since
discovered ...
I posted the link to the manual in a local forum and was greeted by this follow
up from the site moderator/owner:
"Hmmmm. Here is the entry page of the site (Terry) links to.
http://www.raspberrycrafts.co.uk/
I had to look up BDSM to find out what it meant
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BDSM
…"
I am now wondering exactly how I am going to compose my response ...!
--
Terry