Daily Spirit-guided thought for 05/25/08
Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD
May dear neighbors, friends, and brethren have a blessedly wonderful
2008th year since the birth of our LORD Jesus Christ as the Son of
Man ...
... by being hungrier:
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.med.cardiology/msg/f891e617d10bd689?
Hunger is wonderful ! ! !
It's how we know what GOD desires, which is what is good.
Yes, hunger is our knowledge of good versus evil that Adam and Eve
paid for with their and our immortal lives.
"Blessed are you who hunger NOW...
... for you will be satisfied." -- LORD Jesus Christ (Luke 6:21)
Amen.
Here is a Spirit-guided exegesis of Luke 6:21 given in hopes of
promoting much greater understanding:
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.med.cardiology/msg/cc2aa8f8a4d41360?
Be hungry... be healthy... be hungrier... be healthier...
Marana tha
Prayerfully in the awesome name of LORD Jesus Christ,
Andrew <><
--
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.med.cardiology/msg/076ebd277bbfd158?
J A
various Mediterranean religious cults. Similarly, virgin birth was an
unoriginal invention. As one example: Romulus and Remus, the founders
of Rome, were supposedly virgin births with the god Mars being the
father.
If jesus had actually been capable of miracle healings, and raising
the dead, it would have been well known to the Jewish and Roman
authorities of the time. Both entities had very good intelligence on
what was going on with the populace. The authorities of the time had trusted
informants who told them what
was going on in the populace.
Those informants were capable of witnessing miracle cures and the
rasing of people from the dead, and then reporting those things back.
The Romans, in particluar, were very superstitious and willing to
respect and take in other peoples' "gods".
Everyone would have had an interest in keeping him alive. Nearly
everyone had relatives and friends who could have used a dose of
miracle healing. And, of course, people lived in fear of disease and
injury for themselves.
But there were also always people wandering around claiming to be able
to do miracles then, as there are now. Benny Hinn? Jesus was a faker.
If jesus were capable of performing miracles, nothing stopped him from
doing so in front of the Jewish authorities, or the the Roman
authorities, and immediately acquiring stature and authority.
The Roman governor probably would have sought to gain favor in Rome by
shipping him back to the Emperor, if jesus were for real. If Jesus
actually could perform miracles cures and raising from the dead, the
LAST thing anyone would have done was kill him. He would have been too
useful.
Additionally, if jesus actually had shown the power of doing miracle
cures and raising the dead, who would want to insult and provoke such
a power, or the power behind him?
The Gospel of Thomas has numerous anecdotes about the child Jesus
abusing his magical powers: transforming his playmates into goats, or
turning mud into sparrows; or giving his father assistance by
lengthening a piece of wood.
Bottm line - it's all made up for fools, and there's never been any
shortage of them, and you're just another example.
Chuck Stamford
"J A" <a...@re.com> wrote in message
news:8o6dnQ0LyMXI6qTV...@earthlink.com...
> The rising from the dead myth had been around long before jesus in
> various Mediterranean religious cults.
Need to source this, and give examples of the others gods said to rise from
the dead, to include not only any similarities, but also any difference, and
some reasonable analysis of those similarities and differences.
For example, skeptics, especially ignorant ones, often cite Isis here, when
the truth is the differences in the myth of Isis' "rising from the dead" and
the historical account of our Lord's resurrection in a glorious immortal
body and later ascension into Heave to forever sit at the right hand of the
Father, FAR out weigh the paltry, and in some cases, inescapable
similarities. For instance, the similarity of a dead person rising from the
dead between the two stories can hardly be avoided if one wishes to testify
to Jesus actually rising from the dead! And this is the ONY major
similarity between the two stories!!
> Similarly, virgin birth was an
> unoriginal invention.
Same here; need a source, and some analysis of that source.
> As one example: Romulus and Remus, the founders
> of Rome, were supposedly virgin births with the god Mars being the
> father.
What? The story is of Mars having SEX with the priestess Rhea Silvia
(according to Wiki). Thus the story is the same as that of Hercules,
Achilles, and many other Greek heros, where a Greek god impregnates a mortal
woman, or is impregnated by a mortal man. Are they all examples of "virgin
births"? Don't be absurd!
If the story includes the sex act as part of the "fathering" of the child,
then whether the father be a god or a man, the resultant birth is NOT a
"virgin birth" within the story. Greek mythology is FILLED with the lusty
exploits of Zesus having sex with mortal women and fathering children.
> If jesus had actually been capable of miracle healings, and raising
> the dead, it would have been well known to the Jewish and Roman
> authorities of the time. Both entities had very good intelligence on
> what was going on with the populace. The authorities of the time had
> trusted informants who told them what
> was going on in the populace.
This is a nonsense argument from silence, as are most arguments from
silence. It seeks to make significant what DOESN'T exist...always a
mistake!
Besides, it's a stupid argument that assumes it's principle premise when
much of ancient history shows it to be false. Even on the OT we find
numerous examples of miracles being done that are not widely known in the
land, nor are the miracle workers through whom God acted.
>
> Those informants were capable of witnessing miracle cures and the
> rasing of people from the dead, and then reporting those things back.
>
> The Romans, in particluar, were very superstitious and willing to
> respect and take in other peoples' "gods".
What you're describing is Roman apathy toward deities, not superstition,
which they were no more susceptible to than any other people of their time.
That apathy goes a long way toward undercutting the premise above you were
trying to foist on us. We have to ask ourselves, why would the Romans
concern themselves with reports of miracles that reached their ears enough
to take the time to investigate their veracity? Why wouldn't they instead,
do what you do, and simply act on the assumption they weren't true?
You're arguing in such a circle here I'm surprised you don't get dizzy!
>
> Everyone would have had an interest in keeping him alive. Nearly
> everyone had relatives and friends who could have used a dose of
> miracle healing. And, of course, people lived in fear of disease and
> injury for themselves.
First off, this just isn't true. There were very few disciples of Jesus
when He was killed by the Romans. Obviously, no Roman had any interest in
keeping Him alive, nor did any of the Jewish leaders, or any of the many
Jews who stood with them and cried "Crucify Him" as Pilate tried to release
Him. Of the disciples Jesus still had, all but one scattered and hid.
Yet from this low point in Jesus' ministry there is a RADICAL upswing only
weeks later! We see in the record that the number of disciples goes from
about 100 to over 3000 in one day! And of those 100, they transform from
cowering in upper rooms, to openly proclaiming the resurrection from the
dead and ascension into heaven of Jesus.
There has to be a REASON for the complete and sudden transformation these
cowering nobodies underwent. If not the fact they actually did witness
Jesus rise from the dead in a glorious immortal body, and ascend into
heaven, as they say, and if not that they were filled with God's Holy Spirit
who emboldened them to then go out and do what we all know they then did,
then what, genius?
What is your alternative explanation for this transformation? And remember,
this wasn't just some sudden impluse in them that came and went. It changed
them for THE REST OF THEIR LIVES. There isn't a one of them about whom we
know the circumstances of their subsequent deaths that didn't die witnessing
to the Resurrection to their last breath.
Explain that, if you can.
>
> But there were also always people wandering around claiming to be able
> to do miracles then, as there are now. Benny Hinn? Jesus was a faker.
>
> If jesus were capable of performing miracles, nothing stopped him from
> doing so in front of the Jewish authorities, or the the Roman
> authorities, and immediately acquiring stature and authority.
Read the NT. Jesus did many of His miracles before members of the
Sanhedrin, and before members of the sect of the Pharisees, the then
(religiously) predominant sect in Judaism. However, He did not do any
miracles that would have caused both the Jews and Romans to make Him king,
because that was not the reason He came in the flesh. How many times did He
proclaim, in various ways, what He said to Pilate? "My kingdom is not of
this world". Why then would any reasonable, intelligent person seek to make
an objection against Jesus' miracles on the basis of Him not doing them so
as to be make a king by those who say them?
It's a stupid argument, and you look stupid trying to make it.
>
> The Roman governor probably would have sought to gain favor in Rome by
> shipping him back to the Emperor, if jesus were for real. If Jesus
> actually could perform miracles cures and raising from the dead, the
> LAST thing anyone would have done was kill him. He would have been too
> useful.
You're arguing as if Jesus were some "miracle vending machine" or a pet
monkey! Here, Tiberius, a gift for you from Pilate. Just give him an olive
and watch what he does!
You are an idiot, and apparently one that doesn't know the difference
between the Infancy Gospel of Thomas (see note below), and the Gospel of
Thomas (not all that much better!). So much for any rational argument ever
coming out of you. Go learn something first; then come back and speak.
Note: The Infancy Gospel is currently attested by a WHOPPING 3 [count them:
one, two, three] manuscripts; one Greek and one Latin, both dating to around
the 13th century, the Syraic version dating to about the 6th century! Wow,
what strong evidence that what we have of it is authentic! Besides, it's
earliest dating for the original [that we don't have] is 150 ad., LONG after
the supposed author died; making it a FOR SURE piece of pseudoepigraphy
written by someone we have no compelling reason to suspect ever even knew
Jesus, or anyone who did!! Anyone who knows anything about the formation of
the NT, knows that nothing was accepted as Scripture by the very early
Church until it was accepted as having been written BY AN APOSTLE or one of
their personally authorized secretaries or disciples, and this FACT
disqualifies IGT as a valid source of information concerning Jesus. No one
died claiming IGT was historically accurate. Hundreds and thousands died
proclaiming the four Evangelistic Gospels were essentially, historically
accurate BEFORE THIS FANTASY WAS EVER PENNED! About 100 years before!!
Addendum to note, because it needs to be said: You know what amazes us
thoughtful Christians? The inconsistency you moronic atheists and skeptics
display in tripe like this. You will let slide the most egregiously flawed
data if you think you can use it to bash Christianity as an irrational, made
up faith, but you will throw out instantaneously and without any critical
analysis whatsoever much more compelling evidence supporting the claims of
the NT and the history of the very early Church, claiming since it's still
possible the inference taken from them may be wrong, it can't be used at
all. Talk about your special pleading fallacies!!!
Chuck Stamford
Pastor Dave
<shell__...@cox.net> spake thusly:
>"J A" <a...@re.com> wrote in message
>news:8o6dnQ0LyMXI6qTV...@earthlink.com...
>> The rising from the dead myth had been around long before jesus in
>> various Mediterranean religious cults.
>
>Need to source this, and give examples of the others gods said to rise from
>the dead, to include not only any similarities, but also any difference, and
>some reasonable analysis of those similarities and differences.
>
>For example, skeptics, especially ignorant ones, often cite Isis here, when
>the truth is the differences in the myth of Isis' "rising from the dead" and
>the historical account of our Lord's resurrection in a glorious immortal
>body and later ascension into Heave to forever sit at the right hand of the
>Father,
Another Futurist self-contradiction! Yet they say
they don't make them!
Jesus cannot sit at the right hand of the Father
forever in Heaven, if as you believe, both He
and the Father are going to leave Heaven,
to come and live on some new planet Earth!
And as for what else you said to this guy,
there's more to it than just similarities!
There is when they developed, in what
area and with whom!
--
What part of 'THOU SHALT NOT' don't you understand?
J A
"Chuck Stamford" <shell__...@cox.net> wrote in message
news:q7j_j.24648$ap3....@newsfe14.phx...
>
> "J A" <a...@re.com> wrote in message
> news:8o6dnQ0LyMXI6qTV...@earthlink.com...
>> The rising from the dead myth had been around long before jesus in
>> various Mediterranean religious cults.
>
> Need to source this, and give examples of the others gods said to rise
> from the dead, to include not only any similarities,
No you don't.
All that has to be done is to show the same basic myth story exists in
mythologies other than xianity, and predates xianity.
It's simply a borrowed myth, as is virgin birth. Do you think all these
yarns are going to be exactly the same?
The thing about lies, is that they change with the telling...
from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Life-death-rebirth_deity
"" The category life-death-rebirth deity also known as a "dying-and-rising"
or "Resurrection" deity is a convenient means of classifying the many
divinities in world mythology or religion who are born, suffer death, an
eclipse, or other death-like experience, pass a phase in the underworld
among the dead, and are subsequently reborn, in either a literal or symbolic
sense.
Male deities among such figures might include Osiris, Adonis, Tammuz,
Zalmoxis, phoenix, Jesus, Baldr, and Odin.
Female deities who passed into the kingdom of death and returned include
Inanna (also known as Ishtar) whose cult dates to 4000 BC and Persephone,
the central figure of the Eleusinian Mysteries, whose cult may date to 1700
BC as the unnamed goddess worshiped in Crete.
Historically, this category has been most strongly associated with two
different approaches to the study of religion. The first, which might be
labelled the "naturalist" approach, seeks to explain such myths in terms of
parallels with natural processes. The second, which might be labelled the
"internal" approach, seeks to explain such myths in terms of individual
spiritual transformation or timeless, archetypal truth. """
<snip>
Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD
> convicted friend "Chuck Stamford" <shell__...@cox.net> wrote:
> > satan via a sockpuppet (corporeal demon) despairingly posted:
>
> >> The rising from the dead myth had been around long before jesus in
> >> various Mediterranean religious cults.
> >
> > Need to source this, and give examples of the others gods said to rise
> > from the dead, to include not only any similarities,
>
> No you don't.
>
> All that has to be done is to show the same basic myth story exists in
> mythologies other than xianity, and predates xianity.
>
> It's simply a borrowed myth, as is virgin birth. Do you think all these
> yarns are going to be exactly the same?
>
> The thing about lies, is that they change with the telling...
... and you are the source of all lies as described in the Bible per
an earlier exposition here on usenet:
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.med.cardiology/msg/cbaf8b927dc443f4?
Many thanks, much praise, and all the glory to GOD for HIS compelling
you to unwittingly post faith-affirming materal for Christians.
Laus Deo ! ! !
May we, who are Jesus' disciples, continue to rebuke you at each GOD-
given opportunity as GOD desires:
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.med.cardiology/msg/31c3b88286afc5bd?
Thom Madura
If you read Joseph Campbells books on religious mythology - you will
find that virtually all of the so called Christian claims came from
other religions. Some came directly from the Jewish - and are documented
right in the bible.
THe "Love your enemies" came from Buddha
Revere your enemies as you revere your parents.
--The Perfect Enlightenment Sutra
The Koran itself disputes both that the christ was the son of god and
that he rose from the dead.
The jewish religion - for whom the savior was supposedly sent - doesn't
recognize the christ as a savior - or a god - or the son of god - etc.
Noting that the Christ died a Jew (INRI KING OF THE JEWS) - this is
telling evidence against the christ.
It would be hard to call the Jews and Muslims atheists - since they are
not. In fact- both the Muslims and Christians recognize the god of
abraham - ie - the jewish god - as the one true god.
Birth fathered by a god and by a human woman exist - Perseus being the
most obvious - mothered by a virign locked away - Danae.
It is unusual for a religion to claim the resurrection of their god -
since most god are expected to be eternal - ie - always have and always
will exist - so their god is not capable of death. It is interesting
that all christian religions describe their god that way - most in their
masses - "As he was in the beginning, is now - and ever shall be" and
do not see the obvious contradiction that causes. However, in the
ancient Babylonian religion - far predating christianity - their god
Tammuz - the god of vegetation did it.
Still - the resurrection of the soul - or living again in some way - is
a major part of most early religions as well. Symbolic resurrection, or
rebirth of the spirit, occurred in the Hellenistic mystery religions,
such as the religion of the goddess Isis of Egypt. Zoroastrianism holds
a belief in a final overthrow of Evil, a general resurrection, a Last
Judgment, and the restoration of a cleansed world to the righteous -
some 500 to 600 years before the christ. Of course - the jewish religion
also predates the Christ for that.
What little the christian religions did not directly take with them from
their jewish origins is mostly rehash of religious myths that predate
them. The December 25th date of the birth of the christ - was to replace
the Roman Festiival of the sun on that day - and likely has little to do
with the actual day the christ supposedly was born . Noting that
December is winter in that area - and freezing weather and snow are
unlikely but possible - it is more likely that the actual birthday of
the christ was after harvest and before winter - warm enough to sleep in
a stable.
EVEN you would understand that if the christ died on a cross - that DATE
would be on a different DAY each year following through history - and
not on a Sunday every year.
As far as the bible - a bible is a compiled reference book - and its
authenticity is dependent not on the book itself - but on the source
material it "REFERS" to. By the time it was written - there was NO
documentation for the Old Testament. One does have to question including
the Old Testament - now claimed to be archaic by many religious
organization - but since it was included 300 years after the death of
christ - there is no basis for that.
With the exception of a few supposedly authentic Apostolic letters -
there is no original documentation for the bible. Those letter can be
dated - but cannot be authenticated as to author. In fact - it is this
problem with the bible that causes the most problems - authorship is
absent in most cases. Even in cases where people's names are used - they
are normally written in third person - so a statement by the christ -
for instance - was not transcribed by the christ. We can assume that the
stories were embellished - or highly edited - to make their religions
points - but we have no basis for believing we have any actual words of
the christ in the bible.
Bible scholars even question some of the texts supposedly written by
JOHN as unlikely to be written by him. The story of the stoning of the
prostitue (He who has not sinned cast the first stone) was not in early
versions of the bible at all - and is one of the passages considered
most likely to have been manufactured. There is no evidence that the
bible waited to be constructed for proof of its passages. The bible was
constructed at the order of the Roman Emperor Constantine the first - to
come up with a uniform doctrine of the religion - at the council of
nicea in 325 AD. Before that - there was no recognized uniform doctrine
- and bibles were custom made and varied widely.
First - one should not believe that all those who do not believe in the
christ or bible are atheists. The great majority of the people of the
world do not believe in the bible or the christ = and believe in other
religious deities - of which there are thousands- none of which are
proven wrong in the bible.
However -it would seem that you would be able to use "google" to find
out this information for yourself and therefore not make a fool of
yourself making up stories that are not factually accurate.
monkfish
> If you read Joseph Campbells books on religious mythology - you will
> find that virtually all of the so called Christian claims came from
> other religions. Some came directly from the Jewish - and are documented
> right in the bible.
>
> THe "Love your enemies" came from Buddha
>
> Revere your enemies as you revere your parents.
> --The Perfect Enlightenment Sutra
This kind of misrepresentation is not acceptable.
BTW the Buddha is not a myth but a real person.
One more post like this, you will be ignored.
--
monkfish
* The followup-to header is set to alt.christnet.theology.
** alt.atheism is removed from the groups header.
Chuck Stamford
>
> "Chuck Stamford" <shell__...@cox.net> wrote in message
> news:q7j_j.24648$ap3....@newsfe14.phx...
>>
>> "J A" <a...@re.com> wrote in message
>> news:8o6dnQ0LyMXI6qTV...@earthlink.com...
>>> The rising from the dead myth had been around long before jesus in
>>> various Mediterranean religious cults.
>>
>> Need to source this, and give examples of the others gods said to rise
>> from the dead, to include not only any similarities,
>
> No you don't.
Of course YOU don't. You're nothing but an anti-Christian ideologue who
would use anything, regardless of it's validity, to sling at the Christian
faith. It couldn't be more obvious that you don't care about facts, or
truth, or valid argumentation; that all you care about is castigating
Christians and their beliefs.
Chuck Stamford
Chuck Stamford
"Thom Madura" <Tomm...@optonline.net> wrote in message
news:4839f62d$0$11644$607e...@cv.net...
Now tell me why I should be impressed by Joseph Campbell, and ignore the
hundreds of other mythologists who say the Resurrection can't possibly be
myth, the oral traditions having been reduced to writing within the living
memory of people who were witnesses to the life of Jesus...not to mention
all the other historians who note so many remarkable differences, and in
most cases a complete lack of any vector for these "dying and rising gods"
myths and the record of Jesus Christ's resurrection, as to conclude they
couldn't be connected in anyway whatsoever?
All you do is make my last point to JA for me. Another case of special
pleading as a poor substitute for real, critical analysis. You guys always
start from your conclusions and work backwards.
J A
You're a liar.
I pointed out that many other, older mythologies had stories about raising
the dead and virgin birth, and you pretend that the details of the stories
would somehow make the conclusion that xinainty borrowed the stories,
unsupportable.
How? What details might exist that would do that?
Don't you think that ideas of someone returning from the dead, or being born
from a virgin, are bizarre and unique enough by themselves, to make it
evident that they were borrowed?
Do you think all the supernatural beings and all the raising the dead and
virgin birth stories in all the myths are actually true and real?
If not, then why do you think the jesus stories are real?
Explain why someone with common sense *wouldn't* assume the pre-existance of
raising the dead and virgin birth stories in other myth systems, isn't an
indication that xianity borrowed those stories.
If jesus still exists, 2000 years after crucifiion, then produce him, let us
see him.
>
> Chuck Stamford
>
Steve
> satan via a sockpuppet (corporeal demon) despairingly posted:
>> convicted friend "Chuck Stamford" <shell__...@cox.net> wrote:
>>> satan via a sockpuppet (corporeal demon) despairingly posted:
>>>> The rising from the dead myth had been around long before jesus in
>>>> various Mediterranean religious cults.
>>> Need to source this, and give examples of the others gods said to rise
>>> from the dead, to include not only any similarities,
>> No you don't.
>>
>> All that has to be done is to show the same basic myth story exists in
>> mythologies other than xianity, and predates xianity.
>>
>> It's simply a borrowed myth, as is virgin birth. Do you think all these
>> yarns are going to be exactly the same?
>>
>> The thing about lies, is that they change with the telling...
>
> ... and you are the source of all lies as described in the Bible per
> an earlier exposition here on usenet:
Actually Mr. Chung what he has said is the absolute truth and has
been verified thru much painstaking research. And as a witness to such,
I verify that you've inadvertently made a liar of thyself, and thusly also
falsely accused a man speaking the truth. I do believe this makes two
witnesses, not just one, thusly making your testimony a lie.
Steve..
--
A soft breeze on my brow, the wind in my hair,
and the energy of life all around me....
Thom Madura
quote please
the oral traditions having been reduced to writing within the living
> memory of people who were witnesses to the life of Jesus.
proof please
..not to mention
> all the other historians who note so many remarkable differences, and in
> most cases a complete lack of any vector for these "dying and rising gods"
> myths and the record of Jesus Christ's resurrection, as to conclude they
> couldn't be connected in anyway whatsoever?
>
> All you do is make my last point to JA for me. Another case of special
> pleading as a poor substitute for real, critical analysis. You guys always
> start from your conclusions and work backwards.
>
>
Mr. Campbell documents his statements very well.
There remains no source documentation for the Old Testament at all.
With the exception of a few datable Apostolic letters that otherwise
cannot be authenticated - there is no other first person source
documentation for the bible.
There is no documentation that is claimed to be second person that is
verifiable for the bible. Otherwise - quote it. There are NO instances
of verifyable oral statements having been reduced to writing.
I take note you asked for specific examples of so called christian
principles that existed in other religions before christianity - I gave
you quite a number of examples that you snipped off - because obviously
you cannot dispute those.
You asked the question
I provided the information
THat is not working backwards.
There are no Mythologists that say that the so called resurrection of
the christ absolutely cannot be a myth. Even a christian mythologist
would not go that far - although I would not take their opinion
seriously anyway.
Chuck Stamford
If that's true, you sure butchered them here.
Look, you're working off a false assumption here, which is that I think the
way I do because I'm just not properly informed on my subject. You seem to
think that if I would just read Campbell, I could no longer reasonably hold
the position I do, and that's absurd. There is no monolithic academic
opinion that echoes Campbell's.
Chuck Stamford
activ
I think someone as smart, intelligent, learned and wise as you must
get frustrated with the some of the mere peons who do not get it no
matter how hard you try to educate them even on the basic elements.
I think as the guru, the teacher you should show a little more
patience and understanding of the masses who obviously do not get
things as innately or quickly or sith such insight as you with your
sharp mind.
I am sure most everyone looks up to you as a paragon, an ideal a goal,
the apex of wisdom and so please continue to read from those misguided
individuals as they can learn.
Keep up the good fight for the Truth.
Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD
> Andrew, in the Holy Spirit, boldly wrote:
> > satan via a sockpuppet (corporeal demon) despairingly posted:
> >> convicted friend "Chuck Stamford" <shell__...@cox.net> wrote:
> >>> satan via a sockpuppet (corporeal demon) despairingly posted:
>
> >>>> The rising from the dead myth had been around long before jesus in
> >>>> various Mediterranean religious cults.
>
> >>> Need to source this, and give examples of the others gods said to rise
> >>> from the dead, to include not only any similarities,
>
> >> No you don't.
> >>
> >> All that has to be done is to show the same basic myth story exists in
> >> mythologies other than xianity, and predates xianity.
> >>
> >> It's simply a borrowed myth, as is virgin birth. Do you think all these
> >> yarns are going to be exactly the same?
> >>
> >> The thing about lies, is that they change with the telling...
> >
> > ... and you are the source of all lies as described in the Bible per
> > an earlier exposition here on usenet:
>
>
> Actually Mr. Chung what he has said is the absolute truth...
Nothing is being said here.
Bottom line:
You remain the liar who is the source of all lies as described in the
Bible.
May we, who are Jesus' disciples, continue to rebuke you at each GOD-
given opportunity as GOD desires:
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.med.cardiology/msg/31c3b88286afc5bd?
<><
May dear neighbors, friends, and brethren have a blessedly wonderful
2008th year since the birth of our LORD Jesus Christ as the Son of
Man ...
... by being hungrier:
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.med.cardiology/msg/f891e617d10bd689?
Hunger is wonderful ! ! !
It's how we know what GOD desires, which is what is good.
Yes, hunger is our knowledge of good versus evil that Adam and Eve
paid for with their and our immortal lives.
"Blessed are you who hunger NOW...
... for you will be satisfied." -- LORD Jesus Christ (Luke 6:21)
Amen.
Here is a Spirit-guided exegesis of Luke 6:21 given in hopes of
promoting much greater understanding:
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.med.cardiology/msg/cc2aa8f8a4d41360?
Be hungry... be healthy... be hungrier... be healthier...
Marana tha
Prayerfully in the awesome name of LORD Jesus Christ,
Andrew <><
--
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.med.cardiology/msg/3558812d72ab4e17?
Steve
So it's true....you disrespect your own god enough to lie and conceal
the truth when backed into a corner with the truth. Life must be a real
bitch for you....
Steve
J A
"Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" <lov...@thetruth.com> wrote in message
news:418f5065-46e1-4fb4...@m36g2000hse.googlegroups.com...
> satan via a sockpuppet (corporeal demon) despairingly posted:
>> convicted friend "Chuck Stamford" <shell__...@cox.net> wrote:
>> > satan via a sockpuppet (corporeal demon) despairingly posted:
>>
>> >> The rising from the dead myth had been around long before jesus in
>> >> various Mediterranean religious cults.
>> >
>> > Need to source this, and give examples of the others gods said to rise
>> > from the dead, to include not only any similarities,
>>
>> No you don't.
>>
>> All that has to be done is to show the same basic myth story exists in
>> mythologies other than xianity, and predates xianity.
>>
>> It's simply a borrowed myth, as is virgin birth. Do you think all these
>> yarns are going to be exactly the same?
>>
>> The thing about lies, is that they change with the telling...
>
> ... and you are the source of all lies as described in the Bible per
> an earlier exposition here on usenet:
...and yet it is YOU who gets revealed as lying, and YOU who can't answer
questions about your ridiculous unoriginal myths.
A couple years ago chung claimed to be near the end of a 40 day fast.
He was asked to post a photo of himself in running shorts, to see if his
appearance was compatible with having done this fast.
He wouldn;t do it, and started disembling about how people were telling him
how good he looked, after 40 days with no food,
Liar? We know who the liar is.
Why don't you have your "holy spirit" appear and talk to other people?
Why don;t you have him tell you how to cure some widespread disease?
Why - becasue it's all a pile of bullshit.
Zen Cohen
> A couple years ago chung claimed to be near the end of a 40 day fast.
>
> He was asked to post a photo of himself in running shorts, to see if his
> appearance was compatible with having done this fast.
>
> He wouldn;t do it, and started disembling about how people were telling
> him how good he looked, after 40 days with no food,
Chung also talks about regularly doing 200 pushups. Given that he's probably
very light bc of his eating disorder it's not out of the realm of
possibililty but I doubt it in light of his poor record of telling the truth
in the past. Maybe he can post a youtube video of himself doing those 200
pushups. How about it, Andy?
Here Too
> Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > satan via a sockpuppet (corporeal demon) despairingly posted:
> >>> satan via a sockpuppet (corporeal demon) despairingly posted:
> >>>> The rising from the dead myth had been around long before jesus in
> >>>> various Mediterranean religious cults.
> >>> Need to source this, and give examples of the others gods said to rise
> >>> from the dead, to include not only any similarities,
> >> No you don't.
>
> >> All that has to be done is to show the same basic myth story exists in
> >> mythologies other than xianity, and predates xianity.
>
> >> It's simply a borrowed myth, as is virgin birth. Do you think all these
> >> yarns are going to be exactly the same?
>
> >> The thing about lies, is that they change with the telling...
>
> > ... and you are the source of all lies as described in the Bible per
> > an earlier exposition here on usenet:
>
> Actually Mr. Chung what he has said is the absolute truth and has
> been verified thru much painstaking research. And as a witness to such,
> I verify that you've inadvertently made a liar of thyself, and thusly also
> falsely accused a man speaking the truth. I do believe this makes two
> witnesses, not just one, thusly making your testimony a lie.
No, just yours, "Steve" - since you're really Rodney Eastman now using
yet another sock-puppet. So, please tell us - *who's* the liar?
Roger Pearse
> If you read Joseph Campbells books on religious mythology - you will
I'm afraid that few of us believe stuff just because someone says
it.
> The Koran itself disputes both that the christ was the son of god and
> that he rose from the dead.
Must be right, then.
> The December 25th date of the birth of the christ - was to replace
> the Roman Festiival of the sun on that day ....
Perhaps. What evidence from ancient sources indicates this
replacement?
> With the exception of a few supposedly authentic Apostolic letters -
> there is no original documentation for the bible. Those letter can be
> dated - but cannot be authenticated as to author. In fact - it is this
> problem with the bible that causes the most problems - authorship is
> absent in most cases. Even in cases where people's names are used - they
> are normally written in third person - so a statement by the christ -
> for instance - was not transcribed by the christ. We can assume that the
> stories were embellished - or highly edited - to make their religions
> points - but we have no basis for believing we have any actual words of
> the christ in the bible.
This is nonsense.
> The bible was constructed at the order of the Roman Emperor Constantine
> the first - to come up with a uniform doctrine of the religion - at the council
> of nicea in 325 AD. Before that - there was no recognized uniform doctrine
> - and bibles were custom made and varied widely.
Also nonsense. Didn't you check any of this? Any fool knows that the
story about Nicaea is a lie:
http://www.tertullian.org/rpearse/nicaea.html
> First - one should not believe that all those who do not believe in the
> christ or bible are atheists.
No-one does. But most of those cursing both are.
> However -it would seem that you would be able to use "google" to find
> out this information for yourself and therefore not make a fool of
> yourself making up stories that are not factually accurate.
Indeed. So why didn't you?
Roger Pearse
Steve
From what I've observed of your nym shifting habits, you're talking
about yourself, troll.
I really don't care who you are or what you're going to say, there is
only one correct way to deal with your kind...
It's called P-L-O-N-K....B-Y-E......T-R-O-L-L.......
Here Too
Sure, Rodney - sure you're going to plonk me. If you plonked me, you
might miss something said about you...
You are really laughable, do you know that? You create all of these
sock-puppets by finding and then using abandoned or extremely generic
Usenet email accounts, put a new nym on it and voila! Rodney believes
he has cleverly created a new persona. The problem is, doofus, you
still have *very* revealing characteristics in your posts that make it
more than obvious that it's you, not some new poster. Hey, I'm not
the only one who has caught you at this little game you play - so why
do you do it and then deny it?
Hmmm...maybe you *want* to get caught...I guess it wouldn't be much
fun for you to be a sock-puppet in a group anonymously and not have
some of your favorite antagonists chime in, huh?
And you call *me* a loon?
GET. HELP. NOW.
Pastor Dave
<Tomm...@optonline.net> spake thusly:
>If you read Joseph Campbells books on religious mythology - you will
>find that virtually all of the so called Christian claims came from
>other religions.
He may say it, but it wouldn't be true. He is ignorant
on the subject and leaves out what doesn't suit him.
>Some came directly from the Jewish
What's your point? Now you show your ignorance!
Jesus was a Jew. Jesus came to the Jews.
Christianity is the fulfillment of the Jewish
prophecies found in the Old Testament.
The first Christians were Jews.
Again, what's your point? You're ignorant about this
and you're reading the work of a man who is ignorant
about this.
<snip>
The examples you gave are ridiculous, in that none
were borrowed from them. But you're not smart
enough to find out why. You want to read only what
says what you already want it to say and any information
that I give you, will be hand waved away!
But if you really are interested in the truth and finding
out what it is you are missing, then get the book:
The Gospel and the Greeks, by Ronald H. Nash
...and you'll find out why Campbells is an idiot
and how he has made an idiot of you.
And that's all I'm going to say about this.
You now have what you need. Goodbye.
--
God sends us meat, the Devil sends us cooks.
monkfish
You first.
Are you good at anything?
activ
> Zen Cohen wrote:
>
> > "J A" <a...@re.com> wrote in message
> > ....
> >> A couple years ago chung claimed to be near the end of a 40 day fast.
>
> >> He was asked to post a photo of himself in running shorts, to see if his
> >> appearance was compatible with having done this fast.
>
> >> He wouldn;t do it, and started disembling about how people were telling
>
> > Chung also talks about regularly doing 200 pushups. Given that he's
> > probably very light bc of his eating disorder it's not out of the realm of
> > possibililty but I doubt it in light of his poor record of telling the
> > truth in the past. Maybe he can post a youtube video of himself doing
> > those 200 pushups. How about it, Andy?
>
> Youfirst.
> Areyougoodatanything?
>
> --
> monkfish
Your babble has a fishy ring to it so you are the Internet tele-
phony. I see you are also a control freak in trying to control this
thread as to where it goes.
Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD
http://HeartMDPhD.com/Convicts/Rebukesatan
<><
Zen Cohen
"activ" <ACTay...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:884efe49-e9e8-41e4...@z24g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
> On May 26, 11:26 am, monkfish <monkfish@nowhere> wrote:
>> Zen Cohen wrote:
>>
>> > "J A" <a...@re.com> wrote in message
>> > ....
>> >> A couple years ago chung claimed to be near the end of a 40 day fast.
>>
>> >> He was asked to post a photo of himself in running shorts, to see if
>> >> his
>> >> appearance was compatible with having done this fast.
>>
>> >> He wouldn;t do it, and started disembling about how people were
>> >> telling
>> >> him howgoodhe looked, after 40 days with no food,
>>
>> > Chung also talks about regularly doing 200 pushups. Given that he's
>> > probably very light bc of his eating disorder it's not out of the realm
>> > of
>> > possibililty but I doubt it in light of his poor record of telling the
>> > truth in the past. Maybe he can post a youtube video of himself doing
>> > those 200 pushups. How about it, Andy?
>>
>> Youfirst.
>> Areyougoodatanything?
>>
MF, fyi, you're in my kf so I can only see yer posts when someone replies to
them. Nothing personal. You're just too big a bore.
>> --
>> monkfish
>
> Your babble has a fishy ring to it so you are the Internet tele-
> phony. I see you are also a control freak in trying to control this
> thread as to where it goes.
that's why I kf'd him.
Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD
monkfish
Or because you are too afraid to read me.
You two are not even using your real names
and calling the one that does dishonest.
Incredible people.
BTW try not to edit the quoted text.
It is dishonest to do so.
activ
> Zen Cohen wrote:
>
> >news:884efe49-e9e8-41e4...@z24g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
> >> On May 26, 11:26 am, monkfish <monkfish@nowhere> wrote:
> >>> Zen Cohen wrote:
> Or because you are too afraid to read me.
>
> You two are not even using your real names
> and calling the one that does dishonest.
To paraphrase an old saying, I can read you like a Mickey Mouse comic
book
You are showing your stupidity Monk Fish - just look at my e-mail
address on all my posting for my name.
You really do continue to put your foot in your mouth and make a
bigger and bigger fool with passing time.
I hope you are just a small child trying to play with the grownups and
not adult.
J666
>
> You are showing your stupidity Monk Fish
It is the one thing Master Fish does well.
I wonder if Monk is short for Monkey
activ
I try to every now and then to respond to Monkey Fish as it is really
pathetic. Master Fish tries so hard to be Chung-like and has failed
miserably and his posts are so foolish. On ACT practically no one
responds to him and most that do are to insult him,
I guess, some, like Monkey, are just losers
Zen Cohen
> On May 26, 4:23 pm, monkfish <monkfish@nowhere> wrote:
>> Zen Cohen wrote:
>>
>> > "activ" <ACTaylo...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>> >news:884efe49-e9e8-41e4...@z24g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
>> >> On May 26, 11:26 am, monkfish <monkfish@nowhere> wrote:
>> >>> Zen Cohen wrote:
>
>> Or because you are too afraid to read me.
>>
No more afraid than I am to read the scribblings of my three-yr-old
daughter. Except she's a bit more intellectually advanced than you are.
J A
He was asked to post a photo of himself in running shorts, to see if his
appearance was compatible with having done this fast.
He wouldn;t do it, and started disembling about how people were telling him
how good he looked, after 40 days with no food,
Liar? We know who the liar is.
J A
He was asked to post a photo of himself in running shorts, to see if his
appearance was compatible with having done this fast.
He wouldn;t do it, and started disembling about how people were telling him
how good he looked, after 40 days with no food,
Liar? We know who the liar is.
J A
Which is as it should be... ;-))
J666
(in article <483b34e5$0$4084$4c36...@roadrunner.com>):
Have we determined Monkey Fish's physical age, we know his mental age seems
to be about two on a good day.
J666
(in article <ZbednbkR0sF1qqbV...@earthlink.com>):
Monkey Fish is so obvious, it would be hard to take him serious.
I wonder if monkeys look at Monkey Fish and ask if they are descended from
him.
Well, Monkey should enjoy all this negative attention - because for a loser,
bad attention where others at least acknowledge your existence is better than
no one even knowing you exist.
We've all done our good deed for the day.
J A
"J666" <j6...@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:0001HW.C460A4F7...@news.supernews.com...
I'm not sure MonkTurd even knows whether or not he exists.
I'm remember him questioning whether or not he does, and as a public
service, I advised him to test the situation by walking out in front of a
truck.
Apparently, he doesn't question existence enough to do the experiment.
J666
(in article <OOWdndm5-Z3coabV...@earthlink.com>):
> and as a public
> service, I advised him to test the situation by walking out in front of a
> truck.
It is a shame, because that is likely the only good thing Monkey could do.
OTOH, maybe his mommy does not let him play in the streets.
monkfish
Do you really believe that
you appear as honest as Dr. Chung here?
Do you have a job?
monkfish
Big mistake.
Now you have to post your address as well.
Are you as honest as Dr. Chung?
If so, do you have a job?
Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD
J666
(in article <Yv6dndRfjveno6bV...@ptd.net>):
>>
>> It is the one thing Master Fish does well.
>>
>> I wonder if Monk is short for Monkey
>
>
> Do you really believe that
How could anyone not believe that.
We must be making your day - glad to be of help
monkfish
I must have pushed your honesty button.
You came into being specifically to troll me.
I do appreciate your service.
Without you, I would have been talking to myself.
Now we have several posters at ACT.
Thanks again.
monkfish
Am I pushing your anger button?
Would you like to know how to love your enemies?
monkfish
That's nice.
Let it all hang out!
Would you like to know how to love your enemies?
monkfish
You are what you do here and now.
Aren't you ashamed of yourself yet?
J A
"Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" <ach...@emory.edu> wrote in message
news:1211841...@alibistextweb.com...
> http://HeartMDPhD.com/Ignorantsatan
>
> <><
>
> http://HeartMDPhD.com/HolySpirit/Counsels
monkfish
It's not nice to talk about people that way.
Would you like to know how to love your enemies?
monkfish
You really should try to love even your enemies.
monkfish
Would you like to learn how to love yourself?
monkfish
I do appreciate another chance
to be gracious and magnanimous.
But I also worry about your quality of life.
If all you can do to enjoy life is
to sneer at people, I can help you.
[quote]
Biblical Sneers
There are five sneers recorded in the Bible:
* The wicked sneer at God (Isaiah 57:4)
* The arrogant man sneers at his enemies (Psalm 10:6)
* The Pharisees sneered at Jesus (Luke 16:14)
* The people and rulers sneered at Jesus on the cross (Luke 23:35)
* The men of Athens sneered at Paul (Acts 17:32)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sneer
[/quote]
Is it nice to sneer at people?
activ
>
> > and as a public
> > service, I advised him to test the situation by walking out in front of a
> > truck.
>
> It is a shame, because that is likely the only good thing Monkey could do.
>
> OTOH, maybe his mommy does not let him play in the streets.
What is as funny as a "barrel of monkeys" is that Monkey Fish thinks
he is so clever and wise rather than the fool he is.
He is so full of himself that his head must be where the moon don't
shine.
Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD
> satan via another sockpuppet (corporeal demon) despairingly posted:
> > satan via asockpuppet (corporeal demon) despairingly posted:
> >
> >> and as a public
> >> service, I advised him to test the situation by walking out in front of a
> >> truck.
> >
> > It is a shame, because that is likely the only good thing Monkey could do.
> >
> > OTOH, maybe his mommy does not let him play in the streets.
>
>
> It's not nice to talk about people that way.
>
> Would you like to know how to love your enemies?
Neither satan nor his sockpuppets (corporeal demons) are capable of
love.
Therefore, it remains wiser to simply rebuke him and move on to
addressing others who are able to love.
Prayerfully in the awesome name of LORD Jesus Christ,
Andrew <><
--
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.med.cardiology/msg/9adc500316e28fce?
monkfish
If you really think so,
you would not be talking about me so much.
It's always better to talk
about wise people than about fools.
Phobos
(in message
<21b29248-3f0c-4d40...@s33g2000pri.googlegroups.com>):
> What is as funny as a "barrel of monkeys" is that Monkey Fish thinks
> he is so clever and wise rather than the fool he is.
>
> He is so full of himself that his head must be where the moon don't
> shine.
Yes he is and yes his head probably is there.
It can be fun to watch him try so hard, but unlike the little engine in his
favorite book him mother reads to him, no he cannot.
Perhaps time to let him play by himself in his playpen
monkfish
God is love.
You will find Him
when you get sick and tired of your hateful life.
Steve
> satan via another sockpuppet (corporeal demon) despairingly posted:
>>> satan via a sockpuppet (corporeal demon) despairingly posted:
>>>> convicted friend "Chuck Stamford" <shell__...@cox.net> wrote:
>>>>> satan via a sockpuppet (corporeal demon) despairingly posted:
>>>>>> The rising from the dead myth had been around long before jesus in
>>>>>> various Mediterranean religious cults.
>>>>> Need to source this, and give examples of the others gods said to rise
>>>>> from the dead, to include not only any similarities,
>>>> No you don't.
>>>>
>>>> All that has to be done is to show the same basic myth story exists in
>>>> mythologies other than xianity, and predates xianity.
>>>>
>>>> It's simply a borrowed myth, as is virgin birth. Do you think all these
>>>> yarns are going to be exactly the same?
>>>>
>>>> The thing about lies, is that they change with the telling...
>>> ... and you are the source of all lies as described in the Bible per
>>> an earlier exposition here on usenet:
>>> http://groups.google.com/group/sci.med.cardiology/msg/8258297443e8aa3b?
>> Actually Mr. Chung what he has said is the absolute truth...
>
> Nothing is being said here.
Why are you lying, Chung ? Your religion is as much a sham as you are.
>
> Bottom line:
No, the bottom line is that you've told another lie, in an attempt
to keep from having top admit to the truth, and yet you claim to
be a supporter of truth.
And it was such a simple truth at that !
The bottom line IS that you're a cultist headcase and a liar, or
was it the holy spirit that told you to deny the truth ?
Steve