Re: Am I Going to Hell?
Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD
>
> Am I Going to Hell?
>
> Gregory Koukl
>
> Do you think that people who commit moral crimes ought to be punished?
>
> I talked in the past about the difficulty in clarifying our communication of the
> need for salvation. Frankly, to a lot of people the message of Christianity is
> not going to be palatable, but at least we can make it clear. It will not be the
> kind of thing they will be happy with. Yet, at the same time, there are things
> we can do that make it clearer and not inappropriately put stumbling blocks
> in people's way.
>
> This is why I've often said that the Gospel is offensive enough all by itself.
> Don't add any more offense to it. But we should not take out the offense that
> is inherent to the Gospel, either. This is why we are not pluralists even though
> there is pressure to be pluralists or at least inclusivistic with the Gospel. At
> the same time, we don't want to communicate the exclusivity of Christ in such
> a way as to confound those people who are listening.
>
> Christians often say, "if you believe in Jesus you go to Heaven; if you don't
> believe in Jesus you go to Hell". Is that true? Well, it is true, but it doesn't
> communicate a sense of the true circumstance. It's not coherent to most
> people because it just seems bizarre why what one person thought about
> some guy who died 2000 years ago has anything to do with their eternal
> destiny. Whether they believe in him or not seems irrelevant to anything that
> might happen after we die. So we have often not been careful to
> communicate the sense of things.
>
> We need to be clear so that someone rejects the real message and not some
> incoherent mess that some Christian has handed him that they can't make
> sense of. So, I don't say, "if you believe in Jesus you go to Heaven, and if
> you don't believe you go to Hell," because this is misleading. I'd rather try to
> explain it more accurately.
>
> Many of you are familiar with the conversation I had with a fellow at Barnes
> and Noble in which he asked me a question. I was giving a talk there as part
> of the book on relativism that Dr. Frank Beckwith and I co-authored,
> Relativism: Feet Firmly Planted in Mid-Air. Since I was talking about it in the
> bookstore, he came up afterwards and started asking questions about Jesus.
> Instead of unloading this slogan on him, I asked him this question. Do you
> think that people who commit moral crimes ought to be punished? He said,
> "Yes." I said, "Good, so do I." Second question, "Have you ever committed
> any moral crimes?" Pause. Then he said, "Yes, I guess I have." You know
> what I said to him? "So have I."
>
> This just took 30 seconds, right? Then I reflected back to him, "Look where
> we've come so far. We both believe that people who commit moral crimes
> ought to be punished. And we both believe we've committed moral crimes.
> You know what I call that? Bad news." And it is bad news.
>
> Most people are concerned with doing what is right. That was one of the first
> things he told me. "I'm Jewish. I believe in morality. I believe in God. Why do
> I have to believe in your Jesus?" Here is a man who has some level of
> commitment to the moral life. The problem is, he knows that that commitment
> does not guarantee that he is going to live a fully moral life and he's aware of
> his own moral crimes. And so am I. Now what? That is the issue? We are
> guilty. That is the bad news.
>
> This is why it is so important to get the bad news before the good news. The
> bad news gives meaning to the good news. I was able to talk about the fact
> that now we both admit we have a problem, but that there is a solution that
> God has ordained. Since He is the one who is offended, He is the one who
> can call the shots on how to fix the problem. The answer is through His Son
> Jesus, who provides mercy because he took the rap for our crimes. We got
> off. He went to jail. A modern metaphor to put it in perspective.
>
> There at least is the sense of things about Jesus being the only way. I hear it
> even asked on TV. The question is often asked honestly, but I think most of
> the time it is asked for an inflammatory effect. The person who is asking the
> question is wording it very carefully because he knows precisely how the
> faithful evangelical Christian will respond. He is counting on it so that the
> Christian says something that sounds to the rest of the people to be bizarre.
> Therefore, they can discount what the Christian says.
>
> I don't want you to sound bizarre when you answer the question I am about
> to offer. I want you to sound sensible. Here is the question. Do you think I
> am going to Hell? Now the only person who asks that is a person who thinks
> you think they're going to Hell. Ninety per cent of the time they would ask it
> because they think you are nuts and they want other people to think you are
> nuts, too. They want to get you to say in public that people who disagree
> with you are going to Hell so that you will look silly and they will look good.
> How do you deal with that?
>
> The problem, of course, is, first of all, it's probably true they are going to
> Hell. Secondly, it doesn't communicate the sense of things and so it is
> misleading. The people who ask this are generally not criminals. It's going to
> be some nice guy who is basically good and sincere. You are in a tough spot.
> You are on the defensive already, you want to answer truthfully, but you
> know by giving a truthful answer you are going to play into his hands.
>
> Jesus faced this frequently. He always got out of it, and I'm going to give you
> a way to get out. Answer the question truthfully and don't sound like an idiot.
> It doesn't mean everyone is going to believe you, fall at your feet, and want to
> receive Christ, but at least you will be able to give a proper and appropriate
> answer to those who ask you to make a defense for the hope that is within
> you (2 Peter 3:15). The answer is simply this.
>
> When somebody says, "Do you think I am going to Hell?" and you think they
> are, you say something like, "Well, I believe in justice, do you?" "Yes." "What
> is justice but that people who are guilty get punished in an appropriate way to
> their guilt? I believe that people who are guilty pay for their crimes unless they
> have been pardoned."
>
> This is very straightforward language. It fits entirely with our culture. It is
> terminology that has meaning immediately. It is also terminology that the
> person you are talking with not only is familiar with but they agree with the
> concept. We both believe the same thing here: justice. If you have committed
> any moral crimes, if you have done anything wrong, I think you will be
> punished for them unless you receive pardon. The punishment for moral
> crimes is Hell.
>
> You are saying yes, I think you are going to Hell unless you receive Jesus.
> But you are putting it in terms that are making more sense to that individual.
> In fact, he has already affirmed the underlying concept, as well he should,
> because he believes in it.
>
> Most people believe in justice. It is built in. It is part of their moral intuition,
> the image of God in man that is being expressed. They clamor for justice.
> There is a place for mercy, and pardon. We both agree. From God's
> perspective, if you have committed any moral crimes, then you are going to
> be punished for them. You'll only receive God's punishment if you are guilty
> of something. Are you guilty of anything? What is so controversial about that?
> Don't want to be punished? God has a means for a pardon. That is the whole
> point of our conversation. I don't want to be punished either. I want to
> experience a pardon.
>
> See how that works? That's part of the tactical elements of communicating
> the knowledge truthfully.
The present world as we know it has become hell for many so that many
should see our LORD as Who HE is:
"I am the way, the truth, and the life..." -- LORD Jesus Christ
Amen ! Laus Deo ! ! ! Marana tha ! ! ! ! ! ! !
Yes, HE chose to come down from heaven to suffer terribly and die
horribly on the cross here in hell in order to save us from hell. HE
is the way out of this place where millions of children are slain
every year along with other unspeakable atrocities. Many thanks, much
praise, and all the glory to GOD for HIS rising up on that fantastic
third day so that HIS hand leads us out of hell:
http://HeartMDPhD.com/Christ.asp
May all those reading this wisely choose to reach for HIS hand which
HE has extended to rescue us from this accursed world which is hell:
http://HeartMDPhD.com/HolySpirit/TheWay
May GOD continue to heal our hearts with HIS living water curing our
diabetes, depression, anxiety, or panic so that we can love our
neighbors a little more and LORD Jesus Christ a whole lot more, dear
brother Noah whom I love unconditionally.
Prayerfully in Christ's amazing love,
Andrew <><
--
Andrew B. Chung
Cardiologist, Atlanta, Georgia, USA
http://HeartMDPhD.com/HolySpirit
As for knowing who are the very elect, these you will know by the
unconditional love they have for everyone including their enemies
(Matthew 5:44-45, 1 Corinthians 13:3, James 2:14-17).
http://HeartMDPhD.com/Love
Harry
Pastor Kutchie, ordained atheist minister
> brother noah wrote:
> > Am I Going to Hell?
No, Noah. It doesn't exist.
Earthquack is sometimes accidentally right. Truth can be simple
sometimes.
e
"Harry" <Ha...@Home.com> wrote in message news:45c5bfe3$1...@x-privat.org...
> No but Andrew B. Chung is.
>
--
There's no hurry?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zrmDWn6awMA
"The best way to drive out the devil, if he will not yield
to texts of Scripture, is to jeer and flout him, for he
cannot bear scorn."
Born once, die twice. Born twice, die once.
http://john-14-6.com/john-14-6.pdf
My Christian Bible Study Collection - http://Bibleweb.Info/
Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD
> convicted neighbor "Harry" <Ha...@Home.com> wrote:
> > Andrew, in the Holy Spirit, boldly wrote:
> >>
> >>http://groups.google.com/group/sci.med.cardiology/msg/1394dce2b1369080?
> >
> > No but Andrew B. Chung is.
> >
>
> There's no hurry?
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zrmDWn6awMA
>
> "The best way to drive out the devil, if he will not yield
> to texts of Scripture, is to jeer and flout him, for he
> cannot bear scorn."
>
> Born once, die twice. Born twice, die once.
> http://john-14-6.com/john-14-6.pdf
> My Christian Bible Study Collection - http://Bibleweb.Info/
Many thanks, much praise, and all the glory to GOD for all prayers on
my behalf made in Jesus' most precious and holy name.
Laus Deo !
Please continue to pray for our dear friends and neighbors who have
been convicted by the Holy Spirit:
http://HeartMDPhD.com/Convicts
May GOD continue to heal our hearts with HIS living water curing our
diabetes, depression, anxiety, or panic so that we can love our
neighbors a little more and LORD Jesus Christ tremendously more, dear
brother whom I love unconditionally.
e
news:1170588615.4...@j27g2000cwj.googlegroups.com...
> On Feb 4, 10:10 am, God's rabid retreat dog wrote:
>
>> brother noah wrote:
>> > Am I Going to Hell?
>
> Earthquack is sometimes accidentally right. Truth can be simple
> sometimes.
>
Don't you just love these atheists...! :-)))))
Hell Does Exist !!!!!!!
Hell is one of those subjects that makes people uncomfortable. We hear
stories of hell being a place of fire, demons, and endless torment.
Throughout history many authors have written about it, Dante's Inferno
for example. Western culture is very familiar with the concept. Even
Hollywood has made it the subject of many movies. Whatever the
context, whatever the belief, hell is definitely taught in the Bible. But even
the doctrine of hell is not without its controversy. Some say it is only the
grave with no consciousness. Others say it is a place of correction and
punishment that is not eternal. Others say it is an endless agonizing
punishment in fire. Whichever it is, hell is the total absence of the favor of
God. http://bibleweb.info/ftp/ftp-members-0001.html
The words associated with Hell
Gehenna
In the OT, the word for hell is 'ge-hinnom' meaning "Valley of Hinnom."
It was a place to the southwest of Jerusalem. This place was once "called
'Topheth' and derived from an Aramaic word meaning 'fireplace.' It was
here that some pagan kings practiced human sacrifice by fire (2 Chron.
28:3; 33:6; Jer. 7:31; 32:25)(1). This is probably why in the NT the
word came to be associated with destruction by fire. The word 'gehenna'
is found in the NT 12 times and every instance is spoken of by Jesus. In
the NT, "gehenna" is used of a condition and never of a place.
Hades
This word only occurs in the NT, ten times, and corresponds to the OT
word "sheol." Jesus uses the word four times: (Matthew 11:23);
(Matthew 16:18); (Luke 10:15); (Luke 16:23). The other six occur in
Acts 2:27,31; Rev. 1:18; 6:8; 20:13,14.
It was probably the "subterranean abode of all the dead until the
judgment. It was divided into two departments, paradise or Abraham's
bosom for the good, and Gehenna or hell for the bad."(2) In particular, in
the account of Lazarus and the Rich man of (Luke 16:19-31), it is the
place of the conscious dead who are wicked.
Sheol
"The Hebrew word Sheol is probably derived from a root "to make
hollow," and was seen as the common receptacle of the dead and in the
great many places the word appears in the OT, it is referring to the
grave.(3) It is a place and is mentioned in Gen. 37:35; Num. 16:30,33;
Psalm 16:10, etc. Sheol has many meanings in scripture: the grave, the
underworld, the state of the dead. It was supposed to be below the
surface of the earth (Ezek. 31:15,17; Psalm 86:13).
Is Hell Eternal Conscious Torment?
There are some Christian groups and many cults that deny the idea that
hell, in the general sense, means eternal, conscious punishment. Some
maintain that God's eternal punishment is annihilation, or non-existence.
Others say it is temporal and that eventually all will be saved out of hell.
Perhaps the most common objection is that a loving God would never
punish people in eternal torment. We agree that God is love (1 John 4:8),
but He is also just (Neh. 9:32-33; 2 Thess. 1:6), and eternal (Psalm 90:2;
1 Tim. 1:17 ). God punishes the evil doer (Isaiah 11:13) and this
punishment will be eternal. But the question remains. Is this eternal
punishment conscious or not?
There are verses that can be interpreted to support the idea that the dead
are not conscious after death: (Ecc. 9:5 - the dead know nothing(4) and
Psalm 146:4 - their thoughts perish, are good examples.) Other verses
compare the dead to sleep: Acts 13:36; 1 Cor. 15:1-6; 1 Thess. 4:13,
etc. But these latter verses are merely comparing the similarity between
the appearance of the dead and the appearance of someone sleeping.
The Dead are Conscious After Death
The wicked descend alive into Sheol,
Num. 16:30, "But if the Lord brings about an entirely new thing and the
ground opens its mouth and swallows them up with all that is theirs, and
they descend alive into Sheol, then you will understand that these men
have spurned the Lord . . . 33So they and all that belonged to them went
down alive to Sheol; and the earth closed over them, and they perished
from the midst of the assembly."
Cast to outer darkness with weeping and gnashing of teeth
Matt. 8:12, "but the sons of the kingdom shall be cast out into the outer
darkness; in that place there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth."
Those cast into the fire suffer consciously
Matt. 13:41-42, "The Son of Man will send forth His angels, and they
will gather out of His kingdom all stumbling blocks, and those who
commit lawlessness, 42and will cast them into the furnace of fire; in that
place there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth." See also Matt.
13:50.
Cast into a tormenting fire
Rev. 14:9-10, "And another angel, a third one, followed them, saying
with a loud voice, "If anyone worships the beast and his image, and
receives a mark on his forehead or upon his hand, 10he also will drink of
the wine of the wrath of God, which is mixed in full strength in the cup of
His anger; and he will be tormented with fire and brimstone in the
presence of the holy angels and in the presence of the Lamb." See also,
Rev. 21:8.
Hell is a place of eternal fire and punishment
Unquenchable Fire
Matt. 3:12 "And His winnowing fork is in His hand, and He will
thoroughly clear His threshing floor; and He will gather His wheat into the
barn, but He will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire."
Fiery Hell
Matt. 5:22, "whoever shall say, 'You fool,' shall be guilty enough to go
into the fiery hell." See also, Matt. 5:29,30.
Fiery Hell
Matt. 18:8-9, "And if your hand or your foot causes you to stumble, cut
it off and throw it from you; it is better for you to enter life crippled or
lame, than having two hands or two feet, to be cast into the eternal fire.
9"And if your eye causes you to stumble, pluck it out, and throw it from
you. It is better for you to enter life with one eye, than having two eyes,
to be cast into the fiery hell."
Eternal Fire
Matt. 25:41, "Then He will also say to those on His left, 'Depart from
Me, accursed ones, into the eternal fire which has been prepared for the
devil and his angels.
Eternal Punishment
Matt. 25:46, "And these will go away into eternal punishment, but the
righteous into eternal life."
The word 'eternal' in both places is "aionios" which means 1)without
beginning and end, that which always has been and always will be; 2)
without beginning; 3)without end, never to cease, everlasting. The word
'punishment' is the word kolasis and it means "to punish, with the
implication of resulting severe suffering - 'to punish, punishment.'"(5)
Eternal Fire
Jude 7, "Just as Sodom and Gomorrah and the cities around them, since
they in the same way as these indulged in gross immorality and went after
strange flesh, are exhibited as an example, in undergoing the punishment
of eternal fire."
Lake of Fire
Rev. 20:15, "And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of
life, he was thrown into the lake of fire."
Luke 16:19-31, Lazarus and the Rich Man
In Luke 16:19-31 is the story of Lazarus and the rich man. Basically,
Lazarus is a poor man who suffers during life. The rich man is, of course,
rich. They both die. The rich man goes to Hades. Lazarus goes to
Abraham's bosom, another term for paradise. In Hades, the rich man lifts
up his eyes and sees Lazarus far off. He cries out to Abraham and asks
for mercy because he is in agony in flame. Abraham says no. Then the
rich man asks if someone from the dead were to rise and go tell his
brothers not to come to this terrible place. Abraham teaches him that that
will not be done either.
Some say that this is a parable. However, if it is, it is unique because no
other parable actually names a person. It isn't a story. It is history. It
really happened. But many who believe in no consciousness after death
will say it is still a parable. The question then is, if it is? What is it
teaching? If hell fire is false and if self-awareness after death is also false,
then Jesus is using false doctrines to teach a truth. Parables illustrate truth.
If it is a parable what does the consciousness after death symbolize?
Also, what does the agony in flame symbolize? Are they not real? Of
course they are.
Conclusion
Hell is a real place. It is not mere unconsciousness. It is not temporal. It is
eternal torment. Perhaps that is why Jesus spoke more of hell than
heaven and spent so much time warning people not to go there. After all,
if people just stopped existing, why warn them? If it was temporal, they'd
get out in a while. But if it were eternal and conscious, then the warning is
strong.
Jesus said, "And if your right eye makes you stumble, tear it out, and throw it
from you; for it is better for you that one of the parts of your body perish,
than for your whole body to be thrown into hell. 30"And if your right hand
makes you stumble, cut it off, and throw it from you; for it is better for you
that one of the parts of your body perish, than for your whole body to go
into hell," (Matt. 5:29-30).
_________________
1. Achtemeier, Paul J., Th.D., Harper's Bible Dictionary, (San Francisco:
Harper and Row, Publishers, Inc.) 1985.
2. Unger, Merrill F., Unger's Bible Dictionary, (Chicago: Moody Press,
1966, p. 437.
3. Vine, W. E., Vine's Expository Dictionary of Old and New Testament
Words, (Grand Rapids, MI: Fleming H. Revell) 1981.
4. Ecclesiastes is a book that is addressed as things appear "under the sun"
(Ecc. 1:3,9,14, etc.). In fact, the phrase "under the sun" occurs 29 times in
Ecclesiastes, a book written from the human perspective and boldly states
that all is vanity.
5. Louw, Johannes P. and Nida, Eugene A., Greek-English Lexicon of the
New Testament based on Semantic Domains, (New York: United Bible
Societies) 1988, 1989.
--
Velvet Elvis
>Hell Does Exist !!!!!!!
Where is it, exactly?
--
Consider the ignorance of the average fundamentalist.
Then realize that by definition, fully half of them
must be even dumber than that.
e
"Velvet Elvis" <Velve...@BennyHinn.com> wrote in message news:jfubs2lr2297556ja...@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 4 Feb 2007 09:57:36 -0500, "e" <in...@bibleweb.info> wrote:
>
>>Hell Does Exist !!!!!!!
>
> Where is it, exactly?
Listen to or watch the material, for some speculation.
http://bibleweb.info/ftp/ftp-members-0001.html
Velvet Elvis
>
>"Velvet Elvis" <Velve...@BennyHinn.com> wrote in message news:jfubs2lr2297556ja...@4ax.com...
>> On Sun, 4 Feb 2007 09:57:36 -0500, "e" <in...@bibleweb.info> wrote:
>>
>>>Hell Does Exist !!!!!!!
>>
>> Where is it, exactly?
>
> Listen to or watch the material, for some speculation.
>
> http://bibleweb.info/ftp/ftp-members-0001.html
I don't want to read your voluminous bullshit. Have you never heard of
brevity? Just answer the question. 3 sentences should do it.
--
"Who will say with confidence that sexual abuse is more
permanently damaging to children than threatening them
with the eternal and unquenchable fires of hell?"
[Richard Dawkins]
Velvet Elvis
>
>"Velvet Elvis" <Velve...@BennyHinn.com> wrote in message news:jfubs2lr2297556ja...@4ax.com...
>> On Sun, 4 Feb 2007 09:57:36 -0500, "e" <in...@bibleweb.info> wrote:
>>
>>>Hell Does Exist !!!!!!!
>>
>> Where is it, exactly?
>
> Listen to or watch the material, for some speculation.
"Speculation"? Bwahahahaha <cough> ahahaha...
--
"You've got a Methodist Coloring Book
And you color really well
But don't color outside the lines
Or God will send you to hell"
[Dead Milkmen, "Methodist Coloring Book"]
e
"Velvet Elvis" <Velve...@BennyHinn.com> wrote in message news:411cs2digp7lvrqe5...@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 4 Feb 2007 10:31:22 -0500, "e" <in...@bibleweb.info> wrote:
>
>>
>>"Velvet Elvis" <Velve...@BennyHinn.com> wrote in message news:jfubs2lr2297556ja...@4ax.com...
>>> On Sun, 4 Feb 2007 09:57:36 -0500, "e" <in...@bibleweb.info> wrote:
>>>
>>>>Hell Does Exist !!!!!!!
>>>
>>> Where is it, exactly?
>>
>> Listen to or watch the material, for some speculation.
>
> "Speculation"? Bwahahahaha <cough> ahahaha...
>
--
The atheist bellow, like a frustrated goat: BAAWAAAAA, etc.
Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD
>brother "e" <in...@bibleweb.info> wrote:
> >neighbor "Velvet Elvis" <Velve...@BennyHinn.com> wrote:
> >> brother "e" <in...@bibleweb.info> wrote:
> >>
> >>>Hell Does Exist !!!!!!!
> >>
> >> Where is it, exactly?
> >
> > Listen to or watch the material, for some speculation.
> >
> > http://bibleweb.info/ftp/ftp-members-0001.html
>
> I don't want to read your voluminous bullshit. Have you never heard of
> brevity? Just answer the question. 3 sentences should do it.
It is here on earth in this accursed world today.
"And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him
was Death, and Hell followed with him." -- Apostle John describing his
vision of what was the future for him and the here and now for us.
(Revelation 6:8)
Here's the way to escape them:
http://HeartMDPhD.com/HolySpirit/TheWay
May GOD continue to heal our hearts with HIS living water curing our
diabetes, depression, anxiety, or panic so that we can love our
neighbors a little more and LORD Jesus Christ a whole lot more, dear
neighbor whom I love unconditionally.
e
"Velvet Elvis" <Velve...@BennyHinn.com> wrote in message news:rn0cs2dg94vln6dqj...@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 4 Feb 2007 10:31:22 -0500, "e" <in...@bibleweb.info> wrote:
>
>>
>>"Velvet Elvis" <Velve...@BennyHinn.com> wrote in message news:jfubs2lr2297556ja...@4ax.com...
>>> On Sun, 4 Feb 2007 09:57:36 -0500, "e" <in...@bibleweb.info> wrote:
>>>
>>>>Hell Does Exist !!!!!!!
>>>
>>> Where is it, exactly?
>>
>> Listen to or watch the material, for some speculation.
>>
>> http://bibleweb.info/ftp/ftp-members-0001.html
>
NO READING REQUIRED. 2 CHOICES. :-)
http://bibleweb.info/ftp/ftp-members-0001.html
1- watch a video [for the deaf]
2- listen to an audio [for the blind]
?Have you never heard of
> brevity? Just answer the question. 3 sentences should do it.
--
Velvet Elvis
>
>"Velvet Elvis" <Velve...@BennyHinn.com> wrote in message news:rn0cs2dg94vln6dqj...@4ax.com...
>> On Sun, 4 Feb 2007 10:31:22 -0500, "e" <in...@bibleweb.info> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>"Velvet Elvis" <Velve...@BennyHinn.com> wrote in message news:jfubs2lr2297556ja...@4ax.com...
>>>> On Sun, 4 Feb 2007 09:57:36 -0500, "e" <in...@bibleweb.info> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>Hell Does Exist !!!!!!!
>>>>
>>>> Where is it, exactly?
>>>
>>> Listen to or watch the material, for some speculation.
>>>
>>> http://bibleweb.info/ftp/ftp-members-0001.html
>>
>> I don't want to read your --.
>
> NO READING REQUIRED. 2 CHOICES. :-)
> http://bibleweb.info/ftp/ftp-members-0001.html
>
> 1- watch a video [for the deaf]
> 2- listen to an audio [for the blind]
Again, just answer the question. I have no interest in your ugly website.
Briefly, where is hell?
--
"Personal dishonesty seems to be a necessary basis for religion. That
is understandable. Children are indoctrinated with a code of behavior
that is instinctually impossible to follow. So they regularly violate
the code and to avoid punishment cover up the violations by lying.
For them, lying becomes part of their religion."
[C. W. Dalton, "The Right Brain and Religion"]
Whew_NotYuppie
"Velvet Elvis" <Velve...@BennyHinn.com> wrote in message
news:jfubs2lr2297556ja...@4ax.com...
>
>>Hell Does Exist !!!!!!!
>
> Where is it, exactly?
Can I get driving directions from Mapquest?
KG
"Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" <love13@
Yes chunkers, you are indeed going to hell.
You and all the others who violate yahweh's commandment not to worship false
gods like jebus and worship idols.
Pastor Kutchie
> "Velvet Elvis" <VelvetEl...@BennyHinn.com> wrote in message
>
> news:jfubs2lr2297556ja...@4ax.com...
>
> > On Sun, 4 Feb 2007 09:57:36 -0500, "e" <i...@bibleweb.info> wrote:
>
> >>Hell Does Exist !!!!!!!
>
> > Where is it, exactly?
>
> Can I get driving directions from Mapquest?
>
http://www.mapquest.com/maps/map.adp?country=Norway&city=Hell&state=Nord-Trondelag
Pastor Kutchie
> "Velvet Elvis" <VelvetEl...@BennyHinn.com> wrote in messagenews:411cs2digp7lvrqe5...@4ax.com...
> > On Sun, 4 Feb 2007 10:31:22 -0500, "e" <i...@bibleweb.info> wrote:
>
> >>"Velvet Elvis" <VelvetEl...@BennyHinn.com> wrote in messagenews:jfubs2lr2297556ja...@4ax.com...
> >>> On Sun, 4 Feb 2007 09:57:36 -0500, "e" <i...@bibleweb.info> wrote:
>
> >>>>Hell Does Exist !!!!!!!
>
> >>> Where is it, exactly?
>
> >> Listen to or watch the material, for some speculation.
>
> > "Speculation"? Bwahahahaha <cough> ahahaha...
>
> I'm sorry if you have a cold. :-) Keep slurping that chicken soup! :-)
>
If you don't have a clue, don't have an attitude.
e
"Velvet Elvis" <Velve...@BennyHinn.com> wrote in message news:u9bcs2defvsdjc60p...@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 4 Feb 2007 13:23:46 -0500, "e" <in...@bibleweb.info> wrote:
>
>>
>>"Velvet Elvis" <Velve...@BennyHinn.com> wrote in message news:rn0cs2dg94vln6dqj...@4ax.com...
>>> On Sun, 4 Feb 2007 10:31:22 -0500, "e" <in...@bibleweb.info> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>"Velvet Elvis" <Velve...@BennyHinn.com> wrote in message news:jfubs2lr2297556ja...@4ax.com...
>>>>> On Sun, 4 Feb 2007 09:57:36 -0500, "e" <in...@bibleweb.info> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>Hell Does Exist !!!!!!!
>>>>>
>>>>> Where is it, exactly?
>>>>
>>>> Listen to or watch the material, for some speculation.
>>>>
>>>> http://bibleweb.info/ftp/ftp-members-0001.html
>>>
>>> I don't want to read your --.
>>
>> NO READING REQUIRED. 2 CHOICES. :-)
>> http://bibleweb.info/ftp/ftp-members-0001.html
>>
>> 1- watch a video [for the deaf]
>> 2- listen to an audio [for the blind]
>
> Again, just answer the question. I have no interest in your ugly website.
> Briefly, where is hell?
>
I believe one of your fellow minions has put out an answer,
and as far as this conversation goes, I will give consensus
to it.
It is a placewhere there is no: Blessed Hope. :-))))
Dante passes through the Gate of Hell, on which is inscribed
the famous phrase, "Lasciate ogne speranza, voi ch'intrate"
or "Abandon all hope, you who enter here"[1]
a..
1.. ^ There are many English translations of this famous line. Some examples include
2.. All hope abandon, ye who enter here - Henry Francis Cary (1805-1844)
a.. All hope abandon, ye who enter in! - Henry Wadsworth Longfellow (1882)
b.. Leave all hope, ye that enter - Carlyle-Wicksteed (1932)
c.. Lay down all hope, you that go in by me. - Dorothy L. Sayers (1949)
d.. Abandon every hope, you who enter. - Charles S. Singleton (1970)
e.. Abandon all hope, ye who enter here - John Ciardi (1977)
f.. Abandon every hope, who enter here. - Allen Mandelbaum (1982)
g.. Abandon all hope, you who enter here - Robert Pinsky (1993)
h.. Abandon every hope, all you who enter - Mark Musa (1995)
i.. Abandon every hope, you who enter." - Robert M. Durling (1996)
j.. All hope abandon, you who enter here. - James Finn Cotter (2000) [1]
k.. Abandon all hope upon entering here! - Marcus Saunders (2004)
The Blessed Hope
(Titus 2:11-15 NASB)
11 For the grace of God has ?a?appeared, ?1??b?bringing salvation to all
men,
12 ?1?instructing us to deny ungodliness and ?a?worldly desires and ?b?to
live sensibly, righteously and godly ?c?in the present age,
13 looking for the blessed hope and the ?a?appearing of the glory of
?1??b?our great God and Savior, Christ Jesus,
14 who ?a?gave Himself for us ?b?to redeem us from every lawless deed,
and to ?c?purify for Himself a ?d?people for His own possession, ?e?zealous
for good deeds.
15 These things speak and ?a?exhort and ?a?reprove with all
?1?authority. ?b?Let no one disregard you.
[1]
2:11 The next four verses form a beautiful vignette of our salvation. But in
admiring this literary gem, we must not divorce it from its setting. Paul has been
urging consistent behavior on all members of the family of God. Now he shows
that one of the great purposes of our salvation is to produce lives of
unadulterated holiness.
For the grace of God ... has appeared. Here the grace of God is virtually
synonymous with the Son of God. God's grace appeared when the Lord Jesus
visited our planet and especially when He gave Himself for our sins. He
appeared for the salvation of all men. His substitutionary work is sufficient for the
redemption of all. A bona fide offer of pardon and forgiveness is made to all. But
only those who truly receive Him as Lord and Savior are saved. There is no
suggestion here or elsewhere in the Bible that everyone will be saved at last.
Universal salvation is a lie of the devil.
2:12 The same grace that saves us also trains us in the school of holiness. There
are "No-No's" in that school which we must learn to renounce. The first is
ungodliness, which means irreligion. The second is worldly lusts-not just sexual
sins, but also the lust for wealth, power, pleasure, fame, or anything else that is
essentially worldly.
On the positive side, grace teaches us to live soberly, righteously toward others,
and godly in the pure light of His presence. These are the virtues that should
characterize us in this world, where everything about us is going to be dissolved.
It is the place of our pilgrimage and not our final home.
2:13 While living as aliens in the world, we are inspired by a magnificent
hope-the appearing of the glory of our great God and Savior Jesus Christ. By
this are we to understand the Rapture, when Christ appears in glory to the
church and conveys it to heaven (1 Thess. 4:13-18)? Or does it refer to Christ's
coming to reign, when He appears in glory to the world, puts down His foes,
and sets up His kingdom (Rev. 19:11-16)? Basically we believe Paul is
speaking of the first-Christ's coming for His bride, the church. But whether it is
His coming as Bridegroom or as King, the believer should be prepared and
looking for His glorious arrival.
2:14 As we await His Return we never forget the purpose of His First Coming
and of His self-sacrifice. He gave Himself not only to save us from the guilt and
penalty of sin but to redeem us from every lawless deed. It would have been a
half-way salvation if the penalty of sin had been canceled but its dominion in our
lives was left unconquered.
He also gave Himself to purify for Himself His own special people. The 1611
King James quaintly? 4 says "a peculiar people." Too often we are a peculiar
people, but not in the way He intended! He didn't die to make us an odd or
strange people, but a people who belong to Him in a special way-not to the
world or to ourselves. And He gave Himself for us that we might be zealous for
good works. We should have enthusiasm to perform acts of kindness in His
name and for His glory. When we think of the zeal of men for sports, politics,
and business, we should be provoked to jealousy and inspired to good deeds.
2:15 These are things that Titus was commissioned to teach-every thing
discussed in the foregoing verses, and particularly the purposes of the Savior's
passion. He was to exhort or encourage the saints to lives of practical godliness
and to rebuke any who contradicted the apostolic teachings either by word or
by life. And he didn't have to be apologetic in carrying on a forceful ministry; let
him do it with all authority and boldness of the Holy Spirit. Let no one despise
you. Titus need have no qualms about his youth, his Gentile background, or any
natural disability. He was speaking the word of God, and this made all the
difference.
[2]
LOOKING FOR OUR LORD
A Topical Study of
Titus 2:11-13
Jesus spoke of the eye as being the light of the entire body (Matthew 6:22, 23).
And Paul tells us that we are to think on whatsoever things are true, honest, just,
pure, lovely, virtuous, praiseworthy, and of good report (Philippians 4:8). But
because our society no longer believes in the authority of the Bible, our culture
continues to crumble-which is exactly what Jesus said would happen.
And as it was in the days of Noah, so shall it be also in the days of the Son of
man. They did eat, they drank, they married wives, they were given in marriage,
until the day that Noah entered into the ark, and the flood came, and destroyed
them all. Likewise also as it was in the days of Lot; they did eat, they drank, they
bought, they sold, they planted, they builded; but the same day that Lot went out
of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.
Luke 17:26-29
Once we're saved, we need no one to tell us that, like Noah, we are to be those
who are different from the times in which we live, that we are to live soberly,
righteously, and godly. But here's the question for you and me: How? How can
we live soberly, righteously, and godly in a world full of iniquity? According to
our text, the answer is that we are to be looking for Jesus constantly.
You never drive so carefully as the day you discover your driver's license has
expired. So, too, we will live soberly, righteously, and godly when we
understand that because our culture is as it was in the days of Noah and as it
was in the days of Lot, time itself is nearly expired, and we must live very
carefully.
The apostle John knew this to be true..
Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall
be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall
see him as he is. And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even
as he is pure. 1 John 3:2, 3
Thinking the Lord could come back today will affect everything I do-how I
talk, what I watch, where I go. On the other hand, Jesus taught us that if you sit
here today, and even as I'm teaching, you're thinking, The Lord is not coming
back any time soon, that too will have a very real effect upon your life.
Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man
cometh. Who then is a faithful and wise servant, whom his lord hath made ruler
over his household, to give them meat in due season? Blessed is that servant,
whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing. Verily I say unto you, That he
shall make him ruler over all his goods. But and if that evil servant shall say in his
heart, My lord delayeth his coming; and shall begin to smite his fellowservants,
and to eat and drink with the drunken; the lord of that servant shall come in a
day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of, and shall
cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be
weeping and gnashing of teeth. Matthew 24:44-51
The Greek word translated "evil" is kakos and refers to that which was once
good but has gone bad-like a piece of fruit, or a musical instrument that was
once in tune but is now out of tune. Thus, Jesus is saying the once-good servant
became sour, slipped out of tune, because he said, "The Lord delays His
coming." And Jesus says the result of such a viewpoint is twofold.
Brutality
And he shall begin to smite his fellowservants.
He who doubts the nearness of the Lord's return will gossip about people, be
cynical toward people, and will be harsh with people. Whereas if he really
thought today could be the day the Lord comes back, he wouldn't scream at
people, find fault with people, or be bitter toward people. In short, he wouldn't
smite his fellow servants.
Carnality
.and to eat and drink with the drunken.
He who doubts the Lord's soon return will begin to eat and drink with the
drunkards. "It's party time," he'll say. "The Lord isn't coming back for a
while-probably not even in my lifetime-so let's party. I'll only go to church if
there's nothing else to do. I'll only study the Word if there's nothing on TV."
The servant who was once good and who has now gone bad is not one who
denies the coming of Christ. Rather, he's one who simply believes He's not
coming soon. In Exodus 32, we see an Old Testament parallel to the evil servant
parable..
And when the people saw that Moses delayed to come down out of the mount,
the people gathered themselves together unto Aaron, and said unto him, Up,
make us gods, which shall go before us; for as for this Moses, the man that
brought us up out of the land of Egypt, we wot not what is become of him.
Exodus 32:1
The people became kakos. They went bad. Why? Because they thought Moses,
their leader, delayed his coming. The result? Exactly what Jesus said it would be:
Carnality when they danced around a golden calf and brutality when three
thousand of them were killed (Exodus 32:28).
The way to live godly, soberly, and righteously is to look for the blessed hope of
the coming of Jesus Christ in any given day. But what if He doesn't come that
day? You had a great day! You walked righteously, soberly, and godly. Your
family was blessed. Your heart was full. God's blessings were celebrated and
enjoyed because you lived looking for the blessed hope of His return.
The majority of us fail to look for the Lord's coming today not because we deny
its reality nor because we think it will be delayed chronologically, but because
we are afraid emotionally. "I see things falling apart, and I know the only solution
is for the Lord to come back. Yet when He comes back, I don't know where I
will stand. I love Him. I believe in Him. But I haven't done as much as I wanted
to for Him," we say.
If this is how you feel, there is good news for you in Luke 12..
Blessed are those servants, whom the lord when he cometh shall find watching:
verily I say unto you, that he shall gird himself, and make them to sit down to
meat, and will come forth and serve them. Luke 12:37
Leaving the kids with a babysitter, my wife, Tammy, and I returned home a few
hours later.
"The kids did great," said the babysitter. "But the whole time you were gone,
Benjamin sat on the couch and looked out the window, just waiting for you guys
to come back."
Upon hearing this, I didn't say to three-year-old Benny, "What's the big idea
sitting on the couch looking for my coming?" Nor did I say, "Why weren't you in
the backyard raking the leaves and picking up after Sam?" Instead, I just took
him in my arms and gave him a great big hug because I knew how much he just
wanted to be with me.
The same is true of Jesus. To the one who says, "Life is good, but what I'm
really looking for and craving is You, Lord," He won't say, "Why didn't you do
more?" According to our text, He'll say, "Let's have lunch."
But I haven't been a very good person, you might be thinking. Join the club.
Like me, you may have done things you didn't want to do, said things you
shouldn't have said, gone where you shouldn't have gone. But the Lord still has
a place for you at His table. How do I know? Because of what I see in the life of
Joseph..
One of the clearest pictures of Jesus is seen in the person of Joseph-a man of
whom there is no recorded sin, a man who was betrayed by his brothers for
twenty pieces of silver, a man whose public "ministry" began at age thirty when
he became prime minister of Egypt, a man who took a Gentile bride. As his
brothers gathered before him, their hearts must have been filled with fear
concerning what they had done to him. Yet what does Joseph say?
But as for you, ye thought evil against me; but God meant it unto good, to bring
to pass, as it is this day, to save much people alive. Now therefore fear ye not: I
will nourish you, and your little ones. And he comforted them, and spake kindly
unto them. Genesis 50:20, 21
When Jesus comes, you will be as blown away and amazed as Joseph's
brothers were-amazed by how kind He is to you, by the comfort He shows to
you, by the meal He provides for you. But you can experience His love and
kindness, His grace and forgiveness even before then by simply watching for His
coming every day.
My desire and prayer is for us to be a people who look for the blessed
hope-the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. The lives of those who do will be
ordered and fruitful, righteous and godly. May we learn the lesson of Exodus
and listen to the parable of Jesus. May we live our lives looking for His coming,
knowing that in doing so, we will be blessed not only in that day, but in this day
as well.
[3]
2:11 "For" introduces Paul's full theological reason for requiring the conduct
above, why such conduct harmonizes with sound doctrine (v. 1).56 In short, it is
the proper response to God's grace. God has manifested His grace (unmerited
favor) in Christ and the gospel. This has resulted in two things: the possibility of
salvation for all and the actual salvation of all who believe in Christ (1 Tim. 2:4,
6; 4:10).
"In the Greek, 'has appeared' stand emphatically at the beginning, stressing the
manifestation of grace as a historical reality. The reference is to Christ's entire
earthly life-his birth, life, death, and resurrection. The verb epephane, from
which we derive our word 'epiphany,' means 'to become visible, make an
appearance,' and conveys the image of grace suddenly breaking in on our moral
darkness, like the rising sun. (It is used of the sun in Acts 27:20.) Men could
never have formed an adequate conception of that grace apart from its personal
manifestation in Christ, in his incarnation and atonement."57
2:12 When the Christian appreciates this grace it teaches him or her. It instructs
us negatively to deny ungodliness, the root problem, and worldly passions, the
manifestation of the root problem. These passions are the desires that
unbelievers find so appealing but which are not in harmony with God's character
and will, though they are typical of the world system. It instructs us positively to
live sensibly (Gr. sophronos; self-controlled inwardly, cf. vv. 2, 5, 6), righteously
(Gr. dikaios; morally upright outwardly), and godly (Gr. eusebos; reverently
upwardly) in this age.
2:13 The blessed hope of our great God and Savior Jesus Christ's appearing in
glory at the Rapture also motivates the sensitive Christian to honor God by his or
her behavior now.58 The Greek verb prosdechomenoi ("looking for") is in the
present tense indicating that this waiting should be our characteristic attitude,
always ready to welcome the returning Lord. We do not want to feel ashamed
when we meet Him face to face (1 John 2:28; 3:3). In the Greek text one article,
"the," introduces both "blessed hope" and "glorious appearing" suggesting that
Paul was viewing one event from two aspects. The blessed hope is the glorious
appearing of our Savior.
"In the New Testament hope does not indicate merely what is wished for but
what is assured."59
"In light of the concept of the imminent coming of Christ and the fact that the
New Testament does teach His imminent coming, we can conclude that the
Pretribulation Rapture view is the only view of the Rapture of the church that
comfortably fits the New Testament teaching of the imminent coming of Christ. It
is the only view that can honestly say that Christ could return at any moment,
because it alone teaches that Christ will come to rapture the church before the
70th week of Daniel 9 or the Tribulation period begins and that nothing else must
happen before His return."60
"Paul . . . does not ask us to look for the Tribulation, or the Antichrist, or for
persecution and martyrdom, or for death, but for the return of Christ. If any of
these events must precede the Rapture, then how can we help looking for them
rather than the Lord's coming? Such a view of the coming of the Lord can at
best only induce a very general interest in the 'blessed hope.'"61
"The unusual phrase 'the great God,' found only here in the New Testament, is
best accounted for as a Christological application of an Old Testament
description of God."62
In other words, Paul described the appearing and glory of one Person, our great
God and Savior Jesus Christ.63
2:14 Christ's intent in providing salvation for us was to buy our freedom from
slavery to sin and wickedness.
"First, the verb gave (and indeed the entire saying-who gave himself for us)
portrays Christ's death as a ritual offering made specifically to atone for sins
(Rom 4:25; 8:32; compare Gal 1:4). . . .
"Second, the note of willingness is emphasized, for it is said that he gave himself.
. . .
"Third, the phrase for us reveals that this offering was both representative and
substitutionary."64
Christ's purpose was also to purify a people for Himself who are eager to do
what is right and good.
"When a royal visit is expected, everything is cleansed and decorated, and made
fit for the royal eye to see."65
"The highest and purest motivation for Christian behavior is not based on what
we can do for God but rather upon what God has done for us and yet will
do."66
To summarize this section (vv. 11-14), the grace of God should result in our
present commitment to deny what He detests and to pursue what He values. We
see God's grace in His past provision of salvation in Christ and the prospect of
Christ's future return to take us to be with Himself forever. The fact that so few
Christians make this commitment is disappointing, but it is true to life, and Jesus
Christ anticipated it (Luke 17:11-19).
Concluding charge 2:15
This last verse concludes the section of instructions to various groups in the
church (ch. 2). Paul urged Titus to teach, exhort, and reprove, in accord with
what the apostle had just revealed, with full authority since it was divine
revelation. He should let no one intimidate him because the truth was at stake.
"The minister's authority rests in the nature of his message; he is not raised
above the truth but the truth above him."67
[4]
The Basis for the Instructions (2:11-15)
God's grace provides the basis for such instructions. It has saved, and it teaches
by both telling what to do and by enabling one to act accordingly. The result is
that Christians are able to say "no" (v. 12a) to sin whether it be rebellion against
God ("ungodliness") or pursuit of sinful desires ("worldly passions"). God's
grace enables us here and now ("in this present age") to "live self-controlled,
upright, and godly lives." God's grace provides a future perspective as well. So
Christians eagerly wait for "the blessed hope," "the glorious appearing of our
great God and Savior, Jesus Christ." He is designated both as "Savior" and "our
great God" (elsewhere in the New Testament Jesus is specifically designated as
God in John 1:1; 20:28; Rom. 9.5; Heb. 1:8; 2 Pet. 1:1).
The basis for God's grace instructing and enabling us (Titus 2:11) is that Jesus
Christ "gave himself for us" (v. 14) with the express purpose "to redeem us from
all wickedness and to purify for himself a people that are his very own, eager to
do what is good." Because of Jesus' death, believers have been and continue to
be delivered from all kinds of sins and have been and continue to be transformed
into the purity and likeness of Christ as a special people of the holy God. Such
radical transformation is done so that they will be zealous for good deeds. This
teaching is so important that Paul urges Timothy to communicate it ("teach"), to
urge it ("encourage"), to "rebuke" any who resist or oppose it, to do all this
authoritatively ("with all authority"), and finally to not allow any undermining of
his ministry at this point (v. 15).
[5]
JUST SAY NO
We can do nothing to earn our salvation through any service we give or even by
living morally upright. However, once we have accepted God's salvation, his
grace makes ethical demands of us both outwardly and inwardly. Grace teaches
and enables us to say no outwardly to non-Christian activities and inwardly to
non-Christian desires. Some people talk as if they were hypnotized and helpless
victims of their own desires. But Christians are expected and enabled to just say
no.
[6]
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
a 2 Tim 1:10; Titus 3:4
1 Or to all men, bringing
b 1 Tim 2:4
1 Or disciplining
a 1 Tim 6:9; Titus 3:3
b 2 Tim 3:12
c 1 Tim 6:17
a 2 Thess 2:8
1 Or the great God and our Savior
b 1 Tim 1:1; 2 Tim 1:2; Titus 1:4; 2 Pet 1:1
a 1 Tim 2:6
b Ps 130:8; 1 Pet 1:18f
c Ezek 37:23; Heb 1:3; 9:14; 1 John 1:7
d Ex 19:5; Deut 4:20; 7:6; 14:2; Eph 1:11; 1 Pet 2:9
e Eph 2:10; Titus 3:8; 1 Pet 3:13
a 1 Tim 4:13; 5:20; 2 Tim 4:2
1 Lit command
b 1 Tim 4:12
[1]New American Standard Bible : 1995 update. 1995 (Tit 2:11). LaHabra,
CA: The Lockman Foundation.
? 4 (2:14) It sounds quaint today because the meaning of "peculiar" has
changed. The KJV is a very accurate translation; most so-called "errors" are (as
here) due to nearly four centuries of changes in English.
[2]MacDonald, W., & Farstad, A. (1997, c1995). Believer's Bible
Commentary : Old and New Testaments (Tit 2:11). Nashville: Thomas Nelson.
[3]Courson, J. (2003). Jon Courson's Application Commentary (1420).
Nashville, TN: Thomas Nelson.
56 56. This (vv. 11-14) is another of the "liturgical passages" in the Pastorals
that summarize essential features of salvation (cf. 1 Tim. 1:15; 2:5-6; 3:16; 2
Tim. 1:9-10; 2:8-13; Titus 3:3-7). For a brief discussion of these passages, see
Mark L. Bailey, "A Biblical Theology of Paul's Pastoral Epistles," in A Biblical
Theology of the New Testament, pp. 349-54; or for a more detailed
explanation, see Philip H. Towner, The Goal of Our Instruction, pp. 75-119.
57 57. Hiebert, "Titus," p. 439.
58 58. See Gary L. Nebeker, "The Theme of Hope in Dispensationalism,"
Bibliotheca Sacra 158:629 (January-March 2001):30-20.
59 59. Donald Guthrie, The Pastoral Epistles, p. 199.
60 60. Renald E. Showers, Maranatha: Our Lord, Come! A Definitive Study of
the Rapture of the Church, p. 149. See also Gerald B. Stanton, Kept from the
Hour, ch. 6: "The Imminency of the Coming of Christ for the Church," pp.
108-37; and Wayne A. Brindle, "Biblical Evidence for the Imminence of the
Rapture," Bibliotheca Sacra 158:630 (April-June 2001):148-49.
61 61. Henry C. Thiessen, "Will the Church Pass through the Tribulation?"
Bibliotheca Sacra 92 (July-September 1935):307.
62 62. Griffin, p. 313.
63 63. This is one of the passages that clearly states that Jesus Christ is God (cf.
John 1:1, 18 [according to some manuscripts]; 20:28; Rom. 9:5; Heb. 1:8-13; 2
Pet. 1:1; and possibly 1 John 5:20).
64 64. Towner, 1-2 Timothy . . ., p. 248.
65 65. Barclay, p. 294.
66 66. Griffin, p. 316.
67 67. Hiebert, "Titus," p. 442.
[4]Tom Constable. (2003; 2003). Tom Constable's Expository Notes on the
Bible (Tit 2:11). Galaxie Software.
[5]Elwell, W. A. (1996, c1989). Vol. 3: Evangelical commentary on the Bible.
Baker reference library (Tit 2:11). Grand Rapids, Mich.: Baker Book House.
[6]Barton, B. B., Veerman, D., & Wilson, N. S. (1993). 1 Timothy, 2 Timothy,
Titus. Cover title: 1 & 2 Timothy & Titus. Life application Bible commentary
(277). Wheaton, Ill.: Tyndale House Publishers.
--
There's no hurry?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zrmDWn6awMA
"The best way to drive out the devil, if he will not yield
to texts of Scripture, is to jeer and flout him, for he
cannot bear scorn."
http://bibleweb.info/ftp/ftp-members-0001.html
Velvet Elvis
>
>"Velvet Elvis" <Velve...@BennyHinn.com> wrote in message news:u9bcs2defvsdjc60p...@4ax.com...
>> On Sun, 4 Feb 2007 13:23:46 -0500, "e" <in...@bibleweb.info> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>"Velvet Elvis" <Velve...@BennyHinn.com> wrote in message news:rn0cs2dg94vln6dqj...@4ax.com...
>>>> On Sun, 4 Feb 2007 10:31:22 -0500, "e" <in...@bibleweb.info> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>"Velvet Elvis" <Velve...@BennyHinn.com> wrote in message news:jfubs2lr2297556ja...@4ax.com...
>>>>>> On Sun, 4 Feb 2007 09:57:36 -0500, "e" <in...@bibleweb.info> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Hell Does Exist !!!!!!!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Where is it, exactly?
>>>>>
>>>>> Listen to or watch the material, for some speculation.
>>>>>
>>>>> http://bibleweb.info/ftp/ftp-members-0001.html
>>>>
>>>> I don't want to read your --.
>>>
>>> NO READING REQUIRED. 2 CHOICES. :-)
>>> http://bibleweb.info/ftp/ftp-members-0001.html
>>>
>>> 1- watch a video [for the deaf]
>>> 2- listen to an audio [for the blind]
>>
>> Again, just answer the question. I have no interest in your ugly website.
>> Briefly, where is hell?
>>
>
> I believe one of your fellow minions has put out an answer,
> and as far as this conversation goes, I will give consensus
> to it.
>
> It is a placewhere there is no: Blessed Hope. :-))))
<snip reams of nonsensical horseshit>
Fuck me dead, you're one stupid individual. You have no real answer, for the
simple reason it doesn't exist. Hell is a construct whose sole purpose is to
keep stupid people like you living in abject fear their entire lives. You're
a prime example.
--
"People are more likley(sic) to beleive(sic) a big lie than a small one -
Adolph Hitler." - Slide from convicted felon Kent Hovind's Creationist
Presentation
Velvet Elvis
wrote:
>
>"Velvet Elvis" <Velve...@BennyHinn.com> wrote in message
>news:jfubs2lr2297556ja...@4ax.com...
>> On Sun, 4 Feb 2007 09:57:36 -0500, "e" <in...@bibleweb.info> wrote:
>>
>>>Hell Does Exist !!!!!!!
>>
>> Where is it, exactly?
>
>Can I get driving directions from Mapquest?
Actually, you can. It's in Pennsylvania.
--
-------------------------------
Debating with fundamentalists is like playing bridge with monkeys.
They think they've won if they eat the cards.
JJFlash
"Harry" <Ha...@Home.com> wrote in message news:45c5bfe3$1...@x-privat.org...
Is he related to Johnny B. Goode?
e
"Velvet Elvis" <Velve...@BennyHinn.com> wrote in message news:5qhcs2hj7dt2l966a...@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 4 Feb 2007 14:58:40 -0500, "e" <in...@bibleweb.info> wrote:
>>>>>>>>Hell Does Exist !!!!!!!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Where is it, exactly?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Listen to or watch the material, for some speculation.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> http://bibleweb.info/ftp/ftp-members-0001.html
>>>>>
>>>>> I don't want to read your --.
>>>>
>>>> NO READING REQUIRED. 2 CHOICES. :-)
>>>> http://bibleweb.info/ftp/ftp-members-0001.html
>>>>
>>>> 1- watch a video [for the deaf]
>>>> 2- listen to an audio [for the blind]
>>>
>>> Again, just answer the question. I have no interest in your ugly website.
>>> Briefly, where is hell?
>>>
>>
>> I believe one of your fellow minions has put out an answer,
>> and as far as this conversation goes, I will give consensus
>> to it.
>>
>> It is a placewhere there is no: Blessed Hope. :-))))
>
> Fuck me dead, you're one stupid individual. You have no real answer, for the
> simple reason it doesn't exist. Hell is a construct whose sole purpose is to
> keep stupid people like you living in abject fear their entire lives. You're
> a prime example.
>
Nope. :-) You see, I'm one of those WHO Has The Blessed Hope.
Repeat for those who may have missed my previous answer:
(Look at those other references that understand what VE does not!)
It is a place where there is no: Blessed Hope. :-))))
e
"Velvet Elvis" <Velve...@BennyHinn.com> wrote in message news:peics2pn6bpmfukqc...@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 4 Feb 2007 11:06:26 -0800, "Whew_NotYuppie" <d.st...@ca.rr.com>
> wrote:
>
>>
>>"Velvet Elvis" <Velve...@BennyHinn.com> wrote in message
>>news:jfubs2lr2297556ja...@4ax.com...
>>> On Sun, 4 Feb 2007 09:57:36 -0500, "e" <in...@bibleweb.info> wrote:
>>>
>>>>Hell Does Exist !!!!!!!
>>>
>>> Where is it, exactly?
>>
>>Can I get driving directions from Mapquest?
>
>
Hell
JJFlash
"Velvet Elvis" <Velve...@BennyHinn.com> wrote in message
> Fuck me dead,
You're going to hell for that.
Velvet Elvis
That's OK. I probably couldn't get a blowjob in heaven for love nor money.
--
"I don't believe in an afterlife, so I don't have to spend my whole
life fearing hell, or fearing heaven even more. For whatever the
tortures of hell, I think the boredom of heaven would be even worse."
[Isaac Asimov]
Velvet Elvis
>
>"Velvet Elvis" <Velve...@BennyHinn.com> wrote in message news:peics2pn6bpmfukqc...@4ax.com...
>> On Sun, 4 Feb 2007 11:06:26 -0800, "Whew_NotYuppie" <d.st...@ca.rr.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>"Velvet Elvis" <Velve...@BennyHinn.com> wrote in message
>>>news:jfubs2lr2297556ja...@4ax.com...
>>>> On Sun, 4 Feb 2007 09:57:36 -0500, "e" <in...@bibleweb.info> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>Hell Does Exist !!!!!!!
>>>>
>>>> Where is it, exactly?
>>>
>>>Can I get driving directions from Mapquest?
>>
>> Actually, you can. It's in Pennsylvania. <== at Velvet Elvis' house. ::--)))
>>
>Hell
>
> Hell is one of those subjects
<snip>
Better, but no cigar. Although you managed it in one paragraph of someone
else's thoughts, you still didn't state where it is.
--
Explaining the unknown by means of the unobservable
is always a perilous business.
e
"Velvet Elvis" <Velve...@BennyHinn.com> wrote in message news:apmcs25tqnu3dnn23...@4ax.com...
Oh YES I DID! Look up, look down, look at my thumb, gee you're dumb! :-)))
If you look up at the previous post you will see: <== at Velvet Elvis' house. ::--)))
Phÿltêr
news:jfubs2lr2297556ja...@4ax.com:
> On Sun, 4 Feb 2007 09:57:36 -0500, "e" <in...@bibleweb.info> wrote:
>
>>Hell Does Exist !!!!!!!
>
> Where is it, exactly?
>
Anywhere where Melted Cheez Dick is...
--
Phÿltêr
Alt.Atheism #1938
Plonked by Fred Stone 03/17/2006
Denizen of Darkness #44
'72 Telecaster Thinline...
JJFlash
"Velvet Elvis" <Velve...@BennyHinn.com> wrote in message
> On Sun, 4 Feb 2007 16:51:41 -0500, "JJFlash" <JJF...@itsa.gas> wrote:
>
>>
>>"Velvet Elvis" <Velve...@BennyHinn.com> wrote in message
>>news:5qhcs2hj7dt2l966a...@4ax.com...
>>
>>> Fuck me dead,
>>
>>You're going to hell for that.
>
> That's OK. I probably couldn't get a blowjob in heaven for love nor
> money.
You probably can't get one here on earth either.
e
"JJFlash" <JJF...@itsa.gas> wrote in message news:45c67...@x-privat.org...
Oh don't u just love it!!!!!!!!!!!!
Mark K. Bilbo
>
> "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" <love13@
>
> Yes chunkers, you are indeed going to hell.
Too late, he's already there...
--
Mark K. Bilbo a.a. #1423
EAC Department of Linguistic Subversion
------------------------------------------------------------
"Fascism should more appropriately be called Corporatism,
because it is a merger of State and corporate power."
- Mussolini
Velvet Elvis
I had no idea my simple question would result in your transmogrifying
from a verbose pontificating no-nothing, to a monosyllabic Jerry Lewis
wannabee.
--
"Faith is to the human what sand is to the ostrich"
e
"Velvet Elvis" <Velve...@BennyHinn.com> wrote in message news:n90ds2p71vss73ftb...@4ax.com...
Pastor Kutchie
They cry in the dark so you can't see their tears,
They hide in the light so you can't see their fears,
Forgive and forget, all the while,
Love and pain,
Become one and the same in the eyes of a wounded child.
Because Hell, Hell is for children,
And you know that their little lives can become such a mess.
Hell, Hell is for children.
And you shouldn't have to pay for your love,
With your bones and your flesh.
It's all so confusing,
This brutal abusing,
They blacken your eyes and
Then 'pologize.
Be Daddy's good girl and
And don't tell Mommy a thing,
Be a good little boy and you'll get a new toy,
Tell Grandma you fell off the swing.
Because Hell, Hell is for children
And you know that their little lives can become such a mess.
Hell, Hell is for Children
And you shouldn't have to pay for your love,
With your bones and your flesh.
No, Hell is for children
Hell, Hell is for Hell
Hell is for Hell
Hell is for children.
The Mayor of Clueville
> "Harry" <H...@Home.com> wrote in messagenews:45c5bfe3$1...@x-privat.org...
> > No but Andrew B. Chung is.
>
> Is he related to Johnny B. Goode?
No, Earthquack B Badde.
Velvet Elvis
>
>"Velvet Elvis" <Velve...@BennyHinn.com> wrote in message
>news:vjmcs2huqokt8dhf4...@4ax.com...
>> On Sun, 4 Feb 2007 16:51:41 -0500, "JJFlash" <JJF...@itsa.gas> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>"Velvet Elvis" <Velve...@BennyHinn.com> wrote in message
>>>news:5qhcs2hj7dt2l966a...@4ax.com...
>>>
>>>> Fuck me dead,
>>>
>>>You're going to hell for that.
>>
>> That's OK. I probably couldn't get a blowjob in heaven for love nor
>> money.
>
>You probably can't get one here on earth either.
I'd have your sister say hi, but she's got her mouth full...
--
Xtian at crucifixion: "It's a shame he has to die"
Jesus (shouting from cross): "Well maybe I wouldn't have to
die if somebody would get a LADDER and a pair of PLIERS!!"
[2 Kinison, 4:56]
Anonymouse
<Velve...@BennyHinn.com> wrote:
>On Sun, 4 Feb 2007 19:07:21 -0500, "JJFlash" <JJF...@itsa.gas> wrote:
>
>>
>>"Velvet Elvis" <Velve...@BennyHinn.com> wrote in message
>>news:vjmcs2huqokt8dhf4...@4ax.com...
>>> On Sun, 4 Feb 2007 16:51:41 -0500, "JJFlash" <JJF...@itsa.gas> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>"Velvet Elvis" <Velve...@BennyHinn.com> wrote in message
>>>>news:5qhcs2hj7dt2l966a...@4ax.com...
>>>>
>>>>> Fuck me dead,
>>>>
>>>>You're going to hell for that.
>>>
>>> That's OK. I probably couldn't get a blowjob in heaven for love nor
>>> money.
>>
>>You probably can't get one here on earth either.
>
>I'd have your sister say hi, but she's got her mouth full...
Too bad it's not your load....once again you lose.
Snap Whipcrack..............
> brother noah wrote:
>> Am I Going to Hell?
>>
>
You are in hell now, how do you like it?
Rev. Dr. Dick Foot
$da1.496@trndny03:
I have checked our records and am pleased to tell you Brother Andrew has
fallen behind with his tithe payments, so he will be going to hell.
That's a relief. Heaven could hardly be heaven with him in it.
--
Rev. Dr. Richard Dick Foot, BSc., DD, FFD
Chief Executive Pastor
Broomleigh Group of True Christian® Baptist Churches
http://www.church.broomleigh.de/
Velvet Elvis
She already swallowed my load. She's working on your dad. Or your uncle. Oh
wait, they're one and the same.
--
If the meek inherit the earth,
who'll drive all the big trucks?
JJFlash
"e" <in...@bibleweb.info> wrote in message
news:lXvxh.37631$AK1....@newsfe11.phx...
You said "balls". You'll be on the convicted list for sure now.
Father Haskell
wrote:
>
> "And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him
> was Death, and Hell followed with him." -- Apostle John describing his
> vision of what was the future for him and the here and now for us.
> (Revelation 6:8)
>
> Here's the way to escape them:
Escape from what, bad, really bad, Charles Manson-style trips?
Eat a *quarter* of a mushroom before eating the whole bag so
you'll know how strong they are and you won't end up tripping
massive balls like John and writing seriously fucked up shit
like Revelations.
Father Haskell
wrote:
>
> Yes, HE chose to come down from heaven to suffer terribly and die
> horribly on the cross here in hell in order to save us from hell.
Who says?
> HE
> is the way out of this place where millions of children are slain
> every year along with other unspeakable atrocities. Many thanks, much
> praise, and all the glory to GOD for HIS rising up on that fantastic
> third day so that HIS hand leads us out of hell:
Fuck you, Chung, you would have been running the snack concession
and you know it.
Father Haskell
> Father Haskell barfed up this disgusting mess:
>
> > On Feb 4, 5:10 am, "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" <lov...@thetruth.com>
> > wrote:
>
> >> Yes, HE chose to come down from heaven to suffer terribly and die
> >> horribly on the cross here in hell in order to save us from hell.
>
> > Who says?
>
> jesuschristers can't answer:
>
> 1. Nobody is going to buy that eight or so hours crucifixion == eight
> billion eternities in hell. Nobody with an IQ above 70, anyway.
>
> 2. Eight hours isn't even long enough to die up there. The big pussy
> probably just passed out. That would explain why he was wandering about
> a couple days later.
"Wine and gall" = tincture of opium.
>
> >> HE
> >> is the way out of this place where millions of children are slain
> >> every year along with other unspeakable atrocities. Many thanks, much
> >> praise, and all the glory to GOD for HIS rising up on that fantastic
> >> third day so that HIS hand leads us out of hell:
>
> > Fuck you, Chung, you would have been running the snack concession
> > and you know it.
>
> Or cheerleading.
Or selling dead jebus bobbleheads.
null
"Father Haskell" <father...@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:1170738505.1...@v45g2000cwv.googlegroups.com...
FA - No j--------s ? How bout that wet spot?
I 1st thought u were PHAP on that #2 job.
Tat j---o will pop up like a pimple on prom night, huh.
--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
Father Haskell
> Father Haskell barfed up this disgusting mess:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Feb 5, 10:15 pm, malscribe <wri...@rotted.pencil> wrote:
> >> Father Haskell barfed up this disgusting mess:
>
> >> > On Feb 4, 5:10 am, "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" <lov...@thetruth.com>
> >> > wrote:
>
> >> >> Yes, HE chose to come down from heaven to suffer terribly and die
> >> >> horribly on the cross here in hell in order to save us from hell.
>
> >> > Who says?
>
> >> There are at least two big problems with the crucifixion that
> >> jesuschristers can't answer:
>
> >> 1. Nobody is going to buy that eight or so hours crucifixion == eight
> >> billion eternities in hell. Nobody with an IQ above 70, anyway.
>
> >> 2. Eight hours isn't even long enough to die up there. The big pussy
> >> probably just passed out. That would explain why he was wandering
> about
> >> a couple days later.
>
> > "Wine and gall" = tincture of opium.
>
>
>
>
> >> >> HE
> >> >> is the way out of this place where millions of children are slain
> >> >> every year along with other unspeakable atrocities. Many thanks,
> much
> >> >> praise, and all the glory to GOD for HIS rising up on that
> fantastic
> >> >> third day so that HIS hand leads us out of hell:
>
> >> > Fuck you, Chung, you would have been running the snack concession
> >> > and you know it.
>
> >> Or cheerleading.
>
> > Or selling dead jebus bobbleheads.
>
Or selling rotten tomatoes to throw and maybe win a stuffed animal.
Father Haskell
> Father Haskell barfed up this disgusting mess:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> >> >> >> >> is the way out of this place where millions of children are
> >> >> >> >> slain every year along with other unspeakable atrocities.
> Many
> >> >> >> >> thanks,
> >> >> much
> >> >> >> >> praise, and all the glory to GOD for HIS rising up on that
> >> >> fantastic
> >> >> >> >> third day so that HIS hand leads us out of hell:
>
> >> >> >> > Fuck you, Chung, you would have been running the snack
> >> >> >> > concession and you know it.
>
> >> >> >> Or cheerleading.
>
> >> >> > Or selling dead jebus bobbleheads.
>
> >> >> Or playing "charge" and clap-a-long ditties on an amplified organ.
>
> >> > Or selling rotten tomatoes to throw and maybe win a stuffed animal.
>
>
> > Or jerking off in time to the sledge hammer.
>
> Or "reselling" tickets to the best seats.
Or using the crucified savior as a
macabre ventriloquist dummy, at least
until someone saw his lips move.