ulticritic
tki...@gmail.com
post much, but like to read it to hear about what's being talked
about, the hype, etc.
I've always just glossed over the posts from ulticritic and Frank,
since they are long, usually say the same things over and over, and
are often semi-offensive or typed so quickly that they lose meaning
("You're still of playing Ultimate Frisbay is boring.")
However, recently I just decided to look into who this ulticritic guy
is, and how he can post so much every day that i wonder if he has a
job or just has deep pockets so that he can just chill and get his rsd
on.
I was surprised to find out his long list of accomplishments (no
joke!), including starting numerous leagues, captaining team to
nationals, TD'ing multiple tourneys including those with innovative
and fresh ideas, and other noteworthy tasks.
Then I realized how sad it is that we've not only lost a guy who
obviously cares deeply about the sport, but also could have a huge
positive impact on it, and lastly, is basically chopping away at his
basis of credibility by throwing out "faggot"s all over the place and
coming across as a pedophile.
It's really, honestly, too bad, and I for one would like to urge Todd
to get back to what I would like to believe he really loves doing, and
that is being a strong promoter for new ways to play the game.
I'd love to attend a tourney with refs to see how it's done, and would
gladly pay a sizable tourney fee so that some good refs can be
compensated.
I'd love to play in a tourney with different, innovative rules to see
how the game is affected.
I'd love to read about these types of tourneys across the nation.
The fact is, I think a lot of people feel this way, and I think that
even with the PR hole he's dug himself with some of the ulti
community, I'd still be down to attend a tourney he ran, and I imagine
that others would too.
It's a single choice between positively shaping our game with new
ideas or tearing down the current game with criticisms. I'd like to
think Todd chose the former one day, but along the way fell victim to
naysayers and critics, and the fight simply became too much, leading
him to join them rather than keep fighting what is admittedly an
uphill battle at times.
It is a simple choice, but one with great implications. Come on Todd.
The game would be way better if you could put back on your promoter
hat and be a catalyst again.
Tyler
Rhett
He insists on a complete overhaul and basically an uprising against
the UPA, who he sees as evil.
I would agree that many people would be open to the idea of running
trials of refs (personally I'm happy with Observers getting a bit more
active but it amounts to a similar end).
knowing how much of a douche-bag he is, I don't think I'd attend a
Todd tournament.
Frank Huguenard
Ultimate promotes ignorance
The UPA promotes Ultimate.
The UPA is evil.
"Rhett" <rhe...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:2a39b50a-5755-44d1...@s8g2000prg.googlegroups.com...
ulticritic
> So, I enjoy reading rsd, check it about every other day or so. Don't
> post much, but like to read it to hear about what's being talked
> about, the hype, etc.
well theres your first mistake and a big part of the problem. You
people with ideas and opinions keep you lip buttoned and come across
as apathetic. speak up and be herd.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> I've always just glossed over the posts from ulticritic and Frank,
> since they are long, usually say the same things over and over, and
> are often semi-offensive or typed so quickly that they lose meaning
> ("You're still of playing Ultimate Frisbay is boring.")
hey, we got our own style..... and just cause you cant relate dosent
mean we have to
------------------------------------------------------------
>
> However, recently I just decided to look into who this ulticritic guy
> is, and how he can post so much every day that i wonder if he has a
> job or just has deep pockets so that he can just chill and get his rsd
> on.
i'm in between jobs.....and its either this or cleaning the
garage.....obviously my garage is a mess.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> I was surprised to find out his long list of accomplishments (no
> joke!), including starting numerous leagues, captaining team to
> nationals, TD'ing multiple tourneys including those with innovative
> and fresh ideas, and other noteworthy tasks.
fuckin a right....now reasearch this throw chump and see what ya find
-------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Then I realized how sad it is that we've not only lost a guy who
> obviously cares deeply about the sport, but also could have a huge
> positive impact on it, and lastly, is basically chopping away at his
> basis of credibility by throwing out "faggot"s all over the place and
> coming across as a pedophile.
maybe the sad part is that we;ve yet to FIND the likes of people like
you. I'm only one man, dont put all the burden on me here. Take some
initiative for yourself how about. Why do you think you need someone
like me to hold your hand thru this whole process.
As for the faggot shit.....c'mon, i cant be the only one here that
thinks this punto prick is a root shootcher.
And pedophile??? isnt that wanting to have sex with young children?
are you saying those college bitches are children?
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> It's really, honestly, too bad, and I for one would like to urge Todd
> to get back to what I would like to believe he really loves doing, and
> that is being a strong promoter for new ways to play the game.
Hey, thats on the players. Again, dont try and shift the burden on to
me. This type of attitude comes accross as a little needy and
apathetic to me.
------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> I'd love to attend a tourney with refs to see how it's done, and would
> gladly pay a sizable tourney fee so that some good refs can be
> compensated.
well fuckin put one on.....or hound your precious, can do no wrong UPA
about it. They are the ones you pay your money to not me. And ya
know what i would love......for people like you who have interest in
reffed ulti to get off your lazy asses and go ref your next pickup
game. You dont need anyones approval and it aint rocket science.
Anyone with half a brain and a spine should be able to do it......so
what your fuckin excuse?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> I'd love to play in a tourney with different, innovative rules to see
> how the game is affected.
and i'm the only person out of 27,000 members that can facilitate
that???? Cant you see my frustration and disgust with these types of
apathetic, head up your ass attitudes.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> I'd love to read about these types of tourneys across the nation.
fuck readin about it.....live it.
----------------------------------------------------------
>
> The fact is, I think a lot of people feel this way, and I think that
> even with the PR hole he's dug himself with some of the ulti
> community, I'd still be down to attend a tourney he ran, and I imagine
> that others would too.
well dont hold your breath if you are waitin on me. get off your ass
and do somthing for yourself. And you might want to start with the
leaders and organizers that are SUPPOSED to be facilitating such
options and experiments........thats right, the upa......NOT ME!!!
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> It's a single choice between positively shaping our game with new
> ideas or tearing down the current game with criticisms.
so seein how i call my self "ulticritic", take a wild guess which
choice i've made.
------------------------------------------------------------------
I'd like to
> think Todd chose the former one day, but along the way fell victim to
> naysayers and critics, and the fight simply became too much, leading
> him to join them rather than keep fighting what is admittedly an
> uphill battle at times.
yet i still seem to make an impact......do you?
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> It is a simple choice, but one with great implications. Come on Todd.
> The game would be way better if you could put back on your promoter
> hat and be a catalyst again.
your barkin up the wrong tree here son. but dont let my synicism
prevent you from blazin your own trail. The writing is on the wall.
weather or not you choose to read it and apply it is up to you. Good
luck though and if ya do choose to one day get off your ass and
initiate change rather than just hope someone else will come along and
do it far ya be forwarned......i'll be watchin ya, and critiquin ya.
SO DO THAT SHIT RIGHT!
Frank Huguenard
If you knew anything about me, you'd realize that I've devoted a lifetime to
this game. Todd has also, given your resume of him.
So the question is, why is it that two guys who were passionate about the
sport so hell bent at some sort of reform?
We're not just a couple of schmucks, ex-soccer players goofing on something
that we know very little about.
In our own ways (and I might add in dramatically different ways), we're both
very knowledgeable and accomplished in the game.
You think Todd has dug himself a hole? You just don't get it. Ultimate is
the one in the hole here.
ps--I spend less than ten minutes on rsd every day. The joke is on you.
jacob...@gmail.com
If only there were some way to coax you until telling us all what the
"obvious" thing is ..... dare we hold out hope?
Frank H: "If you knew anything about me, you'd realize that I've
devoted a lifetime to this game."
How are you measuring "lifetime" here? Human? Dog? Fruitfly? While
we're at it, how are you measuring "devotion?"
Frank H: "So the question is, why is it that two guys who were
passionate about the sport so hell bent at some sort of reform?"
That's your question. Tkin, the original poster, actually had a
different question; namely, will Toad stop calling people faggot and
get back to actually helping ultimate? Not really a question for you
or I to answer.
Frank H: "We're not just a couple of schmucks"
Does this mean that neither of you are schmucks, or that only one of
you is a schmuck?
Frank H: "ex-soccer players goofing on something that we know very
little about."
Y'know, I'll bet the ultimate hall of fame has a few ex-soccer
players. Oh, but that's right .... we shouldn't have any respect for
hall of famers, since ultimate is so dumb.
Frank H: "In our own ways (and I might add in dramatically different
ways), we're both very knowledgeable and accomplished in the game."
Oh? Do, tell, Frank. Please sacrifice brevity for the sake of detail.
No need to list Toad's accomplishments.
Frank H: "You think Todd has dug himself a hole? You just don't get
it. Ultimate is the one in the hole here."
Can't they both be in a hole? And can't Toad's hole (insert gay joke
here) be related to ultimate's hole?
Frank H: "ps--I spend less than ten minutes on rsd every day."
Is it OK if we go ahead and start dreaming of the day you spend 15
minutes a day on rsd?
richarda...@gmail.com
Yes, you two are knowledgeable experienced players with reform on the
mind, but that doesn't prove anything when you consider the several
hundred knowledgeable experienced players who don't think ultimate
should be dismantled.
ulticritic
>
> Can't they both be in a hole? And can't Toad's hole (insert gay joke
> here) be related to ultimate's hole?
good one jacob.....but i dont really consider myself to be in a hole.
I'm just a critic thats emotionally detatched and on the outside. I
no longer have a stake in ultimates success or failure......like i
said, its either this or go clean the garage.
jacob...@gmail.com
I wasn't claiming you were in a hole, for the record, just trying to
paraphrase the original poster.
mike....@ncmail.net
back, to sit back and read posts
regarding our sport, where we're at, and who's moving it forward, or
attempting to. I see a lot of thoughts and ideas tossed out that
often get slammed just for the sake of humor and back and forth
banter, which is all good, hell it sure makes RSD entertaining.
But after a while you gotta stop and think, when folks like Toad throw
out ideas, put forth the effort and talk about organizing a
tournament, having refs, having an elite division and showcasing
games under the lights, and offering CASH prizes for tournament
Champions. Man, wouldn't that be a step in the right direction? We
all know how awesome this sport is, wouldn't it be killer to take it
to the next level?
Folks like Frank and Toad and even Mike G post a lot and put a great
deal of energy into ultimate, shame it has to be
sitting in front of a computer. They should be encouraged to take our
sport, which IS fun to watch, out to the world. Market it, advertise
it, see who wants to sponsor some air time. They have cheerleading
and poker on 24 hours a day for God's sake!
Right now we just have ideas batted around and shot down, one after
the other. It might take some new, even crazy ideas to shake things
up. Like Tyler said in the original post, I too would like to see
what new and innovative ideas could do for the sport. I guess time
will tell.
MT
benlw...@gmail.com
> Folks like Frank and Toad and even Mike G post a lot and put a great
> deal of energy into ultimate, shame it has to be
> sitting in front of a computer.
Let's not confuse the three:
(unauthorized biographical sketches below...)
Mike Gerics: one of the top players in the game in his prime, former
National champ, actively runs quality coaching camps for teams on the
eastern seaboard, used to coach UNCW in their 'bracket-busting' days,
used to run College Easterns (and other tournaments). Helped develop
modern observer system and served as an observer for many tournaments,
including College and Club Nationals. Suspended for 1 UPA year for an
incident at UPA Club Nationals.
Toad: a very strong player in his prime, formerly very active in
promoting Ultimate, including many tournaments and ground-breaking
refereed Ultimate. Instrumental in developing the modern observer
system. Currently limits himself to RSD only (which is a shame, but
also his perogative, obviously). Smart guy who thinks inventively and
long-term about Ultimate, but somewhat bound by fascination with the
Sportscenter-model and his own predisposition towards unnecessary
obscenity.
Frank: By his own admission, crazy. This the sport of Ultimate is
'dumb' and that we are all 'stupid' and 'ignorant' for playing this
sport, or caring about it. Developed Dischoops. To my knowledge, has
never contributed to the development of Ultimate in any way beyond
rants on RSD. Regularly has good ideas but they are often lost among a
tide of invective or poor reasoning. Has played a lot of low-level
Ultimate.
About the only things that I think they all have in common is a love
for disc sports and high RSD posting numbers.
(Mike Tur...I am not trying to jump all over you...i feel like I get
this question via email from someone about once a day regarding one of
these three...'who is this guy?'. well, now you know what i know.)
blw
(i'm not smart, i've just been paying attention here for about 10
years. I probably screwed something up, and hopefully someone will
fill in my errors)
a.tia...@gmail.com
<fhuguenard(no_spam)@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
> Ignorance is evil.
>
> Ultimate promotes ignorance
>
> The UPA promotes Ultimate.
>
> The UPA is evil.
>
i think you're missing some premises.
throw
No Toad bio is complete without mentioning his hairdo from days gone
by.
Hank & Co.
www.thisisultimate.com
ulticritic
>
> Toad: a very strong player in his prime, formerly very active in
> promoting Ultimate, including many tournaments
Founder of College Easterns
and ground-breaking
> refereed Ultimate. Instrumental in developing the modern observer
> system. Currently limits himself to RSD only (which is a shame, but
> also his perogative, obviously)
and why is that ben? i didnt quit mlu, it quit me. I still dont know
what the hell happened to you guys. So if its my potential thats
shamlessly being wasted ALL of you mlu players need to take a good
look in the mirror and acept the potential that you shamlessly wasted
by not seeing this project thru as well. Dont be casting me as the
only villian thats wasting his or, more importantly, THE SPORTS
potential. At the very least i am still making somewhat of an impact
as a critic.
. Smart guy who thinks inventively and
> long-term about Ultimate, but somewhat bound by fascination with the
> Sportscenter-model
Bound?????? the sportscenter espn model IS the pinnacle of sports
entertainment......the world wide leader in sports, if you will. To
be bound is to be limited......the only thing around here thats
limited IS ultimate in its present state. I am trying to free it, to
liberate it, to unshackle it so that it can reach the its full
potential. What higher asperation could one have for any sport than
the "Sportscenter-model"?
and his own predisposition towards unnecessary
> obscenity.
well a big part of that is just for effect......the other part of it
is simply to compensate for the overyly pc front that ultimate puts
on. Of course i am from the lenny bruce camp in that i feel swearing
and obscenities are a necessary part speech in conveying ones true
feelings. And of course, on top of that i dont take a whole lot of
shit but love to dish it out. And that prick punto and his prickish,
arrogant, intellectual-wanna-be, jonny come latley trip just brings
out the best of me.....or the worst, however you want to look at it.
so thank him for much of that over the top shit.
as for frank, i think he would be better off focusing on dischoops but
he sure did hit the nail on the head with his new games report. I
dont really agree with all his catagorizations of what it means to be
a "true gamer" but there seems to be a definite split in old school,
traditionalist, spirit zealot philosophies and those of the
philosophies that the modern sports industry (the sportscenter model)
advocates prescribe to. And he is definitely on the right side of
that debate.
as for mike, to me, he's a walking contradiction. A referee that
dosent support the facilitation of refs in ulti......a promoter that
settles for a mediocre presentation and delivery model for the
sport.......a one time hardcore referee proponent, known bad boy and
accused cheater turned anti ref born again. But I nor anyone else can
deny his fasination or commitment with the sport and as much as we but
heads on these issues he'll always be a brother and a fellow seaman.
Now, as for you ben.......whats your trip. Are you gonna step up and
realize your full potential of what you can do for this sport. Or are
you gonna settle. Are you gonna recognize and embrace the realities
of what it takes for ultimate to become a legit player in the industry
or are you gonna get sucked into the new games hybrid version that
makes ultimate out to be the half-steppin sport that some project it
to be. You have a calling of your own and will likley have a bigger
impact on this sport than all of us combined. question is are you
gonna step up and face the challenge and when you do are you gonna
take it to the limits or be bound yourself by some stigmatized hybrid
versions of whatever model it is that others deem fit for this sport
we call ultimate.
MrP...@gmail.com
> the "Sportscenter-model"?
The Olympic model?
A model that focuses on the enjoyment that players get from playing?
~p
ulticritic
like i said, what higher asperation could one have for any sport than
the sportscenter model?
Baer
discussions with Toad and we have exchanged ideas on Ultimate. He
cares much about the sport, has great ideas and a vision for the
potential of the sport, and I consider it a privilege to be able to
talk to him about it. While some people may want to warn me not to get
involved with Toad, I understand that any work done with him in
Ultimate will carry his personality as baggage, but I also understand
that Ultimate is bigger than any one person, and good ideas must also
be explored.
I'm sure Toad knows as well as anyone how his personality on RSD
effects people and makes him look, and he and I have even had smaller
public arguments on RSD about being PC, being too forgiving, etc.
While he is harsh, no doubt, I have gotten along with him by treating
him with respect due to his contributions to the game, and he has
returned the same respect to me.
Toad clearly has fun cursing out some people on RSD, and while it may
pollute the whole forum, it is what it is. The attacks and flames
against him are often as bad and as annoying as his own posts. I could
also recommend that Toad lightens up a little bit in the content of
his posts, and he may or may not give a shit about my recommendation,
but I'm sure we can continue to work together and discuss good ideas
for Ultimate. Anyone who does not like him does not need to keep
responding to him, but that is kind of a sport in itself as well, I
guess (for several posters here).
Toad's personal history in relation to Ultimate, up to and including
his becoming "Ulticritic" is an interesting story, and it's good that
some of us know his overall contributions to the game. Maybe if the
rest of us work to advance the sport and help Ultimate realize its
potential, the anger of Ulticritic will eventually fade?
jacob...@gmail.com
realize its potential, the anger of Ulticritic will eventually fade?"
Ahhh, he's not even really angry, just disappointed. Right, Toad?
ulticritic
sometimes angry.....with the idiocy of the spirit zealots attitudes
and their lack of understanding how the sports industry works
sometimes disappointed......with the apathetic nature of ultimate
players in general, especially the ones that fight me then say, "hey i
wouldnt mind seein how refs would work too" as well as those that
straight up agree but then dont act or speak up
totally pissed...................at the upa admin and their fuckin
arrogance, ineptness and pretensiousness
deeply saddened.............for the tough road that the sport has had
to endure for the sake of the egos of it participants(not all of em
but most of em).
but those that know me well will tell you i AM a trouble maker and an
agitator with a popeye philosphy.
i dont see what the big fuckin deal is though........i feel i'm the
normal one here and all (most) of you people are in some fantasy
world. Take a step outside of the ultimate world and theres a fuck of
alot more people just like me out there that you. Foul mouthed,
brash, dont sugar coat shit. So maybe i'm just tryin to prepare you
all for reality. Either way, i anit gonna stop bein me.
Oh yea, and i CANT STAND arrogant little intellectual pricks like this
punto chump that thinks he knows the whole god damned score. The ass
wipe has probably been playin 3 years tops, has no cred and he shoots
his mouth off like he's a seasoned vet.......and comes accross like a
gay ass terd burglar. kyle christoph and throwup can suck a root
too........although buck will say some funny shit every so often.
so basically, i'm here to represent the sport and i could give a shit
about everything else.
lumberjack
<richardaustinw...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Yes, you two are knowledgeable experienced players with reform on the
> mind, but that doesn't prove anything when you consider the several
> hundred knowledgeable experienced players who don't think ultimate
> should be dismantled.
Hi, Dick! Are you going to StL Classic? I promise to not take
pictures of you streaking like someone else did last year.
jacob...@gmail.com
you. Foul mouthed, brash, dont sugar coat shit."
Are you using "shit" as a synonym for "anything," as in: "I don't
sugar coat anything"? The alternative meaning would be that while you
may be open to sugar coating things besides shit, you literally refuse
to sugar coat shit. When considering this possibility, I cannot help
but picture you breaking into a UPA board meeting uninvited with a
plate full of turds which you proceed to offer the board members. When
they request that you please sugar coat the turds in the name of
spirit of the game, you refuse.
Please clarify.
Mike Gerics
> deal of energy into ultimate, shame it has to be
> sitting in front of a computer. They should be encouraged to take our
> sport, which IS fun to watch, out to the world
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
---i think i've been trying pretty well to help a lot of folks improve their
ultimate play...providing camps and playing opportunities for a long long
time.....
and...i don't think that there's any shame in what i do in front of the
computer....again....organizing tournaments...i've run plenty of leagues
from here....and currently Tabulating the NUMP Rankings...(due out today)
Mike Gerics
National champ, actively runs quality coaching camps for teams on the
eastern seaboard, used to coach UNCW in their 'bracket-busting' days,
used to run College Easterns (and other tournaments). Helped develop
modern observer system and served as an observer for many tournaments,
including College and Club Nationals. Suspended for 1 UPA year for an
incident at UPA Club Nationals.
Toad: a very strong player in his prime, formerly very active in
promoting Ultimate, including many tournaments and ground-breaking
refereed Ultimate. Instrumental in developing the modern observer
system. Currently limits himself to RSD only (which is a shame, but
also his perogative, obviously). Smart guy who thinks inventively and
long-term about Ultimate, but somewhat bound by fascination with the
Sportscenter-model and his own predisposition towards unnecessary
obscenity.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~`
--thanks Ben
Mike Gerics
Mike Gerics: one of the top players in the game in his prime,
---one of?
~~~~~~~~~~
former
National champ,
--former 3x college champ....former college champ head coach...
~~~~~~~~~~~~~
actively runs quality coaching camps for teams on the
eastern seaboard,
---WUFF CAMP!
~~~~~~~~~~~~
used to coach UNCW in their 'bracket-busting' days,
---99, 00, 01, 02....
the two biggest upsets in college nationals history...
UNCW over Carleton in 01 and Colorado in 02.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~
used to run College Easterns (and other tournaments).
---Easterns, WUFF War, WUFF Coed Nationals, Fall Collegiates, Spring
Collegiates, summer league/and/tournament,
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Helped develop
modern observer system
--not the mos...the TOS. the Two Observer System....
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
and served as an observer for many tournaments,
including College and Club Nationals.
---3x College Nationals Finals observer...Masters Finals observer
once....plenty of other tournaments too, yes.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Suspended for 1 UPA year for an
incident at UPA Club Nationals.
--yes.
lieber...@gmail.com
Like seriously. We have different priorities here. Maybe it's a divide
due to active/former player status. From what I see 99% of the cursing
and flaming and bickering on this forum comes from the refusal of
everyone to realize that ulti and frank have investments into the
entertainment and fan aspect of the game and the unnamed masses have
priorities on the SotG/actual playing of the game.
Ringer
Ignorance is evil.
Ultimate promotes ignorance
The UPA promotes Ultimate.
The UPA is evil.
Frank: nice attempt, but I think your little argument is invalid.
Assuming your premises are true, I think the actual consequence is:
"the UPA promotes evil." You can add the premise "something that
promotes evil is evil." I think that fixes it. You might also need a
transitivity assumption...something along the lines: "If X promotes Y,
and Y promotes Z, then X promotes Z." Transitivity along these lines
cannot be assumed.
You also have some soundness problems. Your major premise "Ultimate
promotes ignorance" is the controversial one, which is why I'm not
suprised that its you who is suggesting it. But the premise that
actually does the work in this argument is "Ignorance is evil." This
should be controversial for anyone, even you. Sure ignorance is bad.
But its hard to say its evil. Small children are ignorant, but they
aren't evil. I just think you need to weaken this premise..to
something like "Ignorance is unfortunate." But then when you are left
with a plausibly sound and valid argument (even with your crazy
Ultimate promotes ignorance), you get "the UPA is unfortunate."
Noticably weaker.
When you post in the "premise, premise, premise, conclusion" logical
form, you are open to such criticism.
faddy
ozzy like, that would be.
not sure i've ever known leber to sugar coat anything, shit or
otherwise.
lieber...@gmail.com
> Ultimate promotes ignorance
someone elaborate. this seems downright silly to me...or maybe i'm
just ignorant
jeffy...@yahoo.com
Maybe you're just evil?
richarda...@gmail.com
You see, what Frank would like Ultimate to do is quietly dismantle
itself because it's the brainchild of an international conspiracy of
New Games-brainwashed non-athletes. All newly disenfranchised players
should champion Dischoops as the only true disc sport, or true sport
at all for that matter. Since ultimate isn't even trying to do any of
this, it is promoting ignorance of its need to. I hope this clarifies
his logic.
swill...@yahoo.com
(Disclaimer: This is only a Frank translation. Get it? =)
Ignorance = reasons and arguments (whether due to choice or lack of
said options) that discourage change or advancement
Evil = limiting; unnecessary limitations (thus suggesting the
limitation is solely for preference)
Ultimate = how ultimate is played, officiated, and taught
UPA = the powers that be, for better or for worse, write the rules for
the sport we love (how it's played, officiated, and taught)
Okay, I think that should work...proceed.
"Ignorance is evil.
Ultimate promotes ignorance
The UPA promotes Ultimate.
The UPA is evil. "
(or in my speak...)
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.sport.disc/browse_thread/thread/71cf1bb5623b56b3/11ee5b3d58217b02?lnk=raot#11ee5b3d58217b02