Recovery During 1200Ks Re: [Randon] Digest for randon@googlegroups.com - 17 Messages in 4 Topics

[John Hughes]

Dave,

Excellent question on recovery during a staged 1200K.  Here's what I learned on RAAM and multiple 1200Ks.

• You should consume a bolus of about 1000 calories before your sleep break.  It's the only recovery time that you have to digest it.  Emphasize carbohydrate. So-called recovery drinks are no better than real food. 
• Try to sleep for a multiple of full sleep cycles.  The normal sleep cycle is 90 minutes, but they vary be individual.  If you try to wake up before the end of a sleep cycle you will be extremely fuzzy and have a hard time getting going.  You can estimate the length of your sleep cycle on a normal night by noting when you fall asleep, when you wake up (perhaps to urinate) and then dividing.  For example, if you sleep for 5 hours, divide by 3, your sleep cycle is around 100 minutes.
• If you have time without compromising your sleep break, stretch or give yourself a massage.
• Eat breakfast as you leave the sleep stop.  Don't spend time sitting around eating but grab food (solid or liquid) that you can eat rolling out.

Here are several helpful articles:

Over the 24-hours of a 1200K calories consumed should equal calories expended:  http://www.coach-hughes.com/resources/calories.html

Multiple recovery strategies can help including elevating the legs, stretching, icing and sel-massage:   http://www.coach-hughes.com/resources/recovery.html

Cheers,
John
www.coach-hughes-com

On Wed, Jun 13, 2012 at 12:34 PM, <ran...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

  Today's Topic Summary

Group: http://groups.google.com/group/randon/topics

• Recovery and training two weeks between 600K and 1200K [7 Updates]
• Recovery during 1200ks [4 Updates]
• Training talk at Denver REI [1 Update]
• Breathing Problems [5 Updates]

 Recovery and training two weeks between 600K and 1200K

Christian <christian....@gmail.com> Jun 12 05:06PM -0700  

Hi everyone
 
I rode my club's 600k this weekend; in less than two weeks I will be riding
(and hopefully even finishing) the Cascade 1200. I've done the full series
this spring, a fleche, and an extra 300k in addition to my routine riding.
I won't be able to do any more long rides before the 1200, nor do I really
want to, to tell the truth.
 
So, I am looking for advice/suggestions/what have you on how to combine a
training with recovery and rest b/w now and June 23. I do know that what
works for some won't work for others but I am ready to listen to any and
all advice and then perhaps the thread will be of value to others as well.
 
Thanks in advance.
 
Christian


 

Jan Heine <hei...@earthlink.net> Jun 12 09:32PM -0700  

My answer is simple: Don't train. You are done with training. Rest
and get excited about riding your bike again.
 
If you feel the need, go for a few short spins with friends. If you
feel even more need, do a few short (30 second max) sprints.
 
The best thing you can do now is be well rested and excited about
riding your bike when you line up at the start. See you there.
 
Jan Heine
Editor
Bicycle Quarterly
http://www.bikequarterly.com
 
Follow our blog at http://janheine.wordpress.com/
 
At 5:06 PM -0700 6/12/12, Christian wrote:


 

Jim Logan <jimlo...@gmail.com> Jun 13 09:10AM -0400  

Ditto what Jan said. But if you stiffen up as you recover from the 600, do stretches or recovery yoga to regain flexibility. For me, that would happen perhaps twice in the 2 weeks. Otherwise taper and recover.
 
Jim Logan
 


 

Taylor <tpk...@gmail.com> Jun 13 07:40AM -0700  

As others have stated, you shouldn't do any real training. This is your
taper period, and you'll do much better with fresh legs at the 1200k start.
 
Before a 1200k I always do a few things:
 
1. Bank up on sleep. Get an hour or two more sleep per night whenever
possible, and force yourself to sleep in a few days before the event. This
will pay off during the event or in helping cope with the travel and stress
of prep for the ride.
 
2. Take it easy on the coffee. I normally drink coffee all day at work, but
this means that when I need caffeine at 2am during an event it has barely
any effect on me. Getting some of that tolerance out of your system will
help it work when it counts.
 
3. Stretch often. Should always stretch, but I frequently get lazy and
don't, I make sure to start again for a bit before every long event.
 
4. Eat ALOT for the week or so before. People carbo load for 2 hour events.
Imagine how much you'll be buying through in your 70-90 hour effort.
 
5. Get all your stuff together now. Realizing you forgot something two days
before the event sucks.
 
Good luck!
 
 
On Tuesday, June 12, 2012 8:06:15 PM UTC-4, Christian wrote:


 

Christian <christian....@gmail.com> Jun 13 09:01AM -0700  

Thanks for the replies. This is all good to know. I will take it
easy--I'm pretty good at that--get lots of rest and do some yoga I am not
really inclined to ride much now so it'll be easy to stay away from the
bike. Good tip on the caffeine: before the 600K I dropped back to 1 cup a
day (from 2) and it was noticeable especially at the start of the second
day.
 
And Jan: I'll see you there if only at the beginning and end.
 
Best wishes,
 
Christian
 
On Tuesday, June 12, 2012 8:06:15 PM UTC-4, Christian wrote:


 

"russell...@yahoo.com" <russell...@yahoo.com> Jun 13 10:22AM -0700  



 

Jan Heine <hei...@earthlink.net> Jun 13 11:01AM -0700  

>stay on the bike. If you don't keep exercising, your muscles will
>deteriorate. Any conditioning you have from the 600k will be gone
>by the time the 1200k comes if you don't keep exercising.
 
 
It may be that different riders respond to rest differently, but for
me, staying mostly off the bike works best. I still do commute, and
I'll go for a pleasant ride with friends on the weekend.
 
I don't know how fast muscles "deteriorate," but the effect of rest
is two-fold:
 
1. your muscles rest, recover and build strength.
2. your motivation recovers. After not riding for 10 days, I usually
am eager to get on my bike. That is an important factor for a long
ride.
 
I don't find that 10 days off the bike make me lose my form. On the
contrary, I usually feel stronger and ride better.
 
Jan Heine
Editor
Bicycle Quarterly
http://www.bikequarterly.com
 
Follow our blog at http://janheine.wordpress.com/


 

 Recovery during 1200ks

David Cramer <dau...@gmail.com> Jun 13 11:08AM -0400  

I'm interested in people's strategies for recovery during 1200k rides. Most US events now use a staged approach, and so you may have four to eight hours between stages. Sleep is a priority, of course, but what else can help? Do people use a recovery drink before eating a meal? Self-massage? Any thoughts, or a description of what you do, would be appreciated.
 
Thanks,
 
Dave Cramer


 

Mark W <mdw...@yahoo.com> Jun 13 10:22AM -0500  

At a night stop I try to eat, get cleaned up if I have time and it's available, sleep, and then eat again before heading out.
 
Avoiding wasted time helps increase sleep time, so having a clear plan as you approach the stop really helps. A recovery drink as soon as you stop might help if available--I've done this sometimes. No large apparent effect but at worst it's a few more calories.
 
Mark W
 


 

Kole Kantner <kkan...@gmail.com> Jun 13 09:04AM -0700  

All you need is drink, food, and sleep and you will be fine.
 
Kole
 
On Jun 13, 2012 8:25 AM, "Mark W" <mdw...@yahoo.com> wrote:
 
At a night stop I try to eat, get cleaned up if I have time and it's
available, sleep, and then eat again before heading out.
 
Avoiding wasted time helps increase sleep time, so having a clear plan as
you approach the stop really helps. A recovery drink as soon as you stop
might help if available--I've done this sometimes. No large apparent
effect but at worst it's a few more calories.
 
Mark W
 
 


 

Jan Heine <hei...@earthlink.net> Jun 13 09:41AM -0700  

As others have pointed out, making sure you spend your off-the-bike
time well is important. Don't stand if you can sit, don't sit if you
can lie down, and don't have your eyes open when you can close them.
 
Apart from that, I find I don't recover during the ride at all. It
takes me days to recover, which is why I tend to ride non-stop when
possible. A few rest breaks are great, but taking breaks with more
than an hour off the bike doesn't provide much benefit for me. All
that happens is that my legs get stiff, and it is harder to get back
into a rhythm on the bike.
 
Having ridden four PBPs, the slowest was the hardest. Sure, it was my
first 1200, but I was in better shape back then, never pushed the
pace, and had ridden many 600s. Still, the last few hundred
kilometers were a slog, as I was deeply fatigued even though I had
been sleeping every night, and even took an afternoon nap. My
recovery after the ride also took longer than it did after my other
PBPs.
 
For me, the total event time appears to determine the fatigue. Riding
with fewer, shorter stops means that my "total event time" is
shorter. I find that my limit for "total event time" is somewhere
around 55 hours. Thereafter, it gets a lot harder. So ideally, the
finish line is in sight at that point.
 
The alternative is touring at a sustainable pace for no more than
10-12 hours a day. I really enjoy that, but you cannot ride brevets
that way. A brevet is not sustainable for most randonneurs, myself
included, which is why we all slow down on a 1200 compared to a 600.
There is a reason the rules allow for 10 more hours for the 1200 than
they do for two 600s.
 
Jan Heine
Editor
Bicycle Quarterly
http://www.bikequarterly.com
 
Follow our blog at http://janheine.wordpress.com/
 
 
At 11:08 AM -0400 6/13/12, David Cramer wrote:
 
--


 

 Training talk at Denver REI

John Hughes <coachjo...@gmail.com> Jun 13 08:48AM -0600  

I'm very pleased that the Denver Flagship REI is hosting my talk on
Preparing For & Riding a Century. Tuesday, June 19, 6:30 p.m. I'll cover
the six success factors:
* planning
* training
* nutrition
* equipment
* riding technique
* mental skills
Although I focus on a century these factors also apply to other types of
rides. There will be plenty of time for Q&A.
 
http://www.rei.com/event/37705/session/47639
--
Cheers,
John Hughes
www.coach-hughes.com
PO Box 18028
Boulder, CO 80308-1028


 

 Breathing Problems

PatCH <patc...@gmail.com> Jun 12 09:35AM -0700  

Hi all. I’ve been struggling quite a bit this year with breathing problems
on brevets, and I’m wondering if the rando folks here might have experience
with or thoughts on it. I haven’t quite figured out a pattern, but on the
longer (>300k) rides, it seems that my chest tightens up so I can breathe
only at, say, 50% capacity. By mile 200 on our local 600k this past
weekend, I was breathing at much less capacity than that, and my chest was
becoming so fatigued from just trying to force myself to breathe, I started
wondering if it might be heart issues. There’s no wheezing involved, my
legs still have plenty of power, I’m pretty mentally awake, and in the case
this past weekend, there weren’t any hills.
 

 
I tried using an albuterol inhaler several times on a few rides, but that
doesn’t seem to have any effect. And two days later, my breathing is still
not back to 100% capacity. Is this common among the rando folks? I don’t
remember having this last year in my bag of problems to be solved, but then
again, I was probably too much of a newbie last year to remember any
suffering. Randonnesia, perhaps?
 

 
Any thoughts and/or suggestions would be greatly welcomed!
 

 
--Patrick (RUSA #6365)


 

alex plumb <alex...@sbcglobal.net> Jun 12 09:59AM -0700  

Patrick,
 
I had a very similar problem last year. My shortness of breath was not a steady problem, sometimes it was very bad in the morning and other times it would hit hard later in the ride.  After extensive testing, my somewhat apathetic doctor said flat out "There is nothing wrong with you". I fired him on the spot.
 
My new doctor, who is also a cyclist, said on my first visit to her,"It's just a hunch, but try eliminating dairy from your diet". After three days of being dairy free I was fully recovered. 
 
I had absolutely no problem with dairy products my whole life until last year.  You should pursue all possible dietary causes, even if you have not had reactions in the past.
 
I miss my chocoloate milk on long rides, but I'll trade it for the ability to breathe when riding hard any day. 
 
Alex Plumb
 
--- On Tue, 6/12/12, PatCH <patc...@gmail.com> wrote:
 
 
From: PatCH <patc...@gmail.com>
Subject: [Randon] Breathing Problems
To: ran...@googlegroups.com
Date: Tuesday, June 12, 2012, 9:35 AM
 
 
 
Hi all. I’ve been struggling quite a bit this year with breathing problems on brevets, and I’m wondering if the rando folks here might have experience with or thoughts on it. I haven’t quite figured out a pattern, but on the longer (>300k) rides, it seems that my chest tightens up so I can breathe only at, say, 50% capacity. By mile 200 on our local 600k this past weekend, I was breathing at much less capacity than that, and my chest was becoming so fatigued from just trying to force myself to breathe, I started wondering if it might be heart issues. There’s no wheezing involved, my legs still have plenty of power, I’m pretty mentally awake, and in the case this past weekend, there weren’t any hills.
               
I tried using an albuterol inhaler several times on a few rides, but that doesn’t seem to have any effect. And two days later, my breathing is still not back to 100% capacity. Is this common among the rando folks? I don’t remember having this last year in my bag of problems to be solved, but then again, I was probably too much of a newbie last year to remember any suffering. Randonnesia, perhaps?
 
Any thoughts and/or suggestions would be greatly welcomed!
 
--Patrick (RUSA #6365)
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Bill Gobie <bi...@billandlorene.com> Jun 12 10:27AM -0700  

You could have something very serious going on. Your symptoms resemble
mine when I was walking around with pulmonary embolisms (PEs) -- no
symptoms until I reached a certain level of exertion. PEs are blood
clots lodged in the lungs. Mine originated from a blood clot that was
developing in my right leg with no symptoms.
 
You should read the link Iron Rider provided about atrial
fibrillation. I have copied his message here.
 
I hope you have nothing this serious. But you really need to get
checked out by a doctor ASAP! Go to an ER if you have to. PEs can kill
you in seconds, without warning. They can cause you to lose
consciousness, again without warning. Get someone to drive you to a
doctor, do not drive yourself.
 
Bill
 
On Jun 6, 2012, at 5:07 AM, Iron Rider wrote:
 
> .
> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/randon?hl=en
> .
 
On Jun 12, 2012, at 9:35 AM, PatCH wrote:
 


 

Lynne Fitz <fitz...@comcast.net> Jun 12 11:15AM -0700  

Do you have any swelling anywhere? Exercise-induced angioedema? Hard to breathe if your airway and/or chest is constricted by edema.


 

RayO <loch...@msn.com> Jun 12 07:20PM -0700  

Having no prior allergies, I have exercise induced alergy asthma
on rides longer than 200k.
 
I take non-drowsey OTC Claritin (sp?) after 200k and my bronchials
remain open.
 


 

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Cheers,
John Hughes
www.coach-hughes.com
PO Box 18028
Boulder, CO 80308-1028