google-busting, UIP
Luke
- google groups won't show?
- can't be replied to by google groupers?
Thanks
Troy Piggins
> Are there any ways to make a post that
>
> - google groups won't show?
>
> - can't be replied to by google groupers?
You mean you don't want /your/ posts to show up in GG? And you
don't want GG users to reply to /your/ posts?
No. If you post to USENET, it's there for all to see. GG or
not.
Unless you ask all GG users to killfile you specifically...
--
Troy Piggins | http://piggo.com/~troy/slrn ___ | __ __
|___ | |/ |/ |
___| | | | |
VanguardLH
<news:9503f2a19502e1fa...@pseudo.borked.net>:
Why does someone hiding behind a remailer to post to Usenet care about
who sees or replies to their posts?
Mike Easter
Subject: google-busting, UIP
Mail-To-News-Contact: ab...@dizum.com
What does google-busting mean in this context? There's something to be
said for dizum-busting.
What does UIP mean in this context? Here are the 18 meanings in acronyms
and abbreviations
http://www.acronymfinder.com/af-query.asp?Acronym=uip&Find=find&string=exa
ct None of those are useful in this context.
What does your being an anonymous mail2news poster mean in this GGer
context? I would sooner filter dizum than GGers.
> Are there any ways to make a post that
>
> - google groups won't show?
>
> - can't be replied to by google groupers?
You could configure your own newsserver and post to it all by yourself.
You could post to a group on a newsserver which doesn't propagate to GG.
You could post to a usenet group which is carried by usenet newsservers
which isn't carried by GG, example alt.os.linux.ubuntu, or a group which
is carried on a newsserver which is carried by GG but only in part, ie
some newsgroups but not others, example spamcop, gmane.
--
Mike Easter
XS11E
> You could post to a usenet group which is carried by usenet
> newsservers which isn't carried by GG, example
> alt.os.linux.ubuntu, or a group which is carried on a newsserver
> which is carried by GG but only in part, ie some newsgroups but
> not others, example spamcop, gmane.
However, the OP should realize that every group is archived somewhere,
most in multiple places. If a group is not archived on Google that
only means it's less accessable to the public.
If the OP doesn't want his posts archived he'll have to turn off his
computer, there's no other way.
--
XS11E, Killing all posts from Google Groups
The Usenet Improvement Project:
http://improve-usenet.org
Blinky the Shark
> Luke wrote:
> Subject: google-busting, UIP
> Mail-To-News-Contact: ab...@dizum.com
>
> What does google-busting mean in this context? There's something to be
> said for dizum-busting.
>
> What does UIP mean in this context?
Wake up Mike. This is news.software.readers. I'd be willing to bet that
there's only one UIP sense that's used in here.
--
Blinky
Killing all posts from Google Groups
The Usenet Improvement Project --> http://improve-usenet.org
Found 5/08: a free GG-blocking news *feed* --> http://usenet4all.se
Bill
@piggo.com says...
> * Luke wrote :
> > Are there any ways to make a post that
> >
> > - google groups won't show?
> >
> > - can't be replied to by google groupers?
>
> You mean you don't want /your/ posts to show up in GG? And you
> don't want GG users to reply to /your/ posts?
>
> No. If you post to USENET, it's there for all to see. GG or
> not.
>
> Unless you ask all GG users to killfile you specifically...
>
>
Not true. One need merely post in a newsgroup that Google doesn't
carry. Then the googlegoobers can't read your post.
Bill
us...@invalid.invalid
Pre load your path to include googlegroups.
--
User...
VanguardLH
<news:pan.2008.06.06....@thurston.blinkynet.net>:
> Mike Easter wrote:
>
>> Luke wrote:
>> Subject: google-busting, UIP
>> Mail-To-News-Contact: ab...@dizum.com
>>
>> What does google-busting mean in this context? There's something to be
>> said for dizum-busting.
>>
>> What does UIP mean in this context?
>
> Wake up Mike. This is news.software.readers. I'd be willing to bet that
> there's only one UIP sense that's used in here.
As in a dizum user Urinating In Public?
Peter J Ross
us...@invalid.invalid <us...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
This is a bad idea for at least two reasons:
1. Some news providers consider Path: forgery to be a reason for
closing your account.
2. Some anti-GG posters filter on the Path:.
--
PJR :-)
Updated documentation for slrn version pre0.9.9:
<http://pjr.lasnobberia.net/slrn-doc/>
Adam Funk
A while back, somebody suggested these headers
X-No-Html: yes
Distribution: usenet
but I don't think they work.
--
The generation of random numbers is too important to be left to
chance. [Robert R. Coveyou]
Adam Funk
>> Pre load your path to include googlegroups.
>
> This is a bad idea for at least two reasons:
>
> 1. Some news providers consider Path: forgery to be a reason for
> closing your account.
Don't the ones who care just just overwrite it?
Leafnode puts a Path: in my messages without asking, which
individual.net renames to X-Orig-Path: and replaces with its own.
Apparently my X-Orig-Path header looked like "bullschitt".
http://groups.google.com/group/news.software.readers/msg/3f54ced01b355875
--
Classical Greek lent itself to the promulgation of a rich culture,
indeed, to Western civilization. Computer languages bring us
doorbells that chime with thirty-two tunes, alt.sex.bestiality, and
Tetris clones. (Stoll 1995)
Peter J Ross
<a24...@ducksburg.com> wrote:
> On 2008-06-06, Peter J Ross wrote:
>
>>> Pre load your path to include googlegroups.
>>
>> This is a bad idea for at least two reasons:
>>
>> 1. Some news providers consider Path: forgery to be a reason for
>> closing your account.
>
> Don't the ones who care just just overwrite it?
Not necessarily. Altopia, for instance, doesn't overwrite it but
considers forged Paths (i.e. the use of domains that the user
isn't entitled to use) to be abuse of their ToS/AUP. (At least it used
to; I haven't used Altopia for a while.)
> Leafnode puts a Path: in my messages without asking,
That's correct behaviour for a server, which leafnode is.
> which individual.net renames to X-Orig-Path: and replaces with its
> own.
That's legitimate behaviour, unless the leafnode installation has its
own abuse admin (which may or may not be possible to arrange with
NIN).
> Apparently my X-Orig-Path header looked like "bullschitt".
>
> http://groups.google.com/group/news.software.readers/msg/3f54ced01b355875
You own ducksburg.com, so you're entitled to use
<anything>.ducksburg.com as the name of your news server.
Adam Funk
>>> 1. Some news providers consider Path: forgery to be a reason for
>>> closing your account.
>>
>> Don't the ones who care just just overwrite it?
>
> Not necessarily. Altopia, for instance, doesn't overwrite it but
> considers forged Paths (i.e. the use of domains that the user
> isn't entitled to use) to be abuse of their ToS/AUP. (At least it used
> to; I haven't used Altopia for a while.)
I see: "preloading" isn't necessarily "forging".
Did they automatically detect forged paths, or just act if someone
complained about them? (I'd be surprised if more than a handful of
news.software.* readers look at Path headers.)
>> Apparently my X-Orig-Path header looked like "bullschitt".
>>
>> http://groups.google.com/group/news.software.readers/msg/3f54ced01b355875
>
> You own ducksburg.com, so you're entitled to use
><anything>.ducksburg.com as the name of your news server.
Even our old friend agreed to that.
--
| _
| ( ) ASCII Ribbon Campaign
| X Against HTML email & news
| / \ www.asciiribbon.org
Frank Slootweg
> In news.software.readers on Fri, 06 Jun 2008 14:40:55 +0800,
> us...@invalid.invalid <us...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>
> > On Thu, 5 Jun 2008 17:47:35 -0600 (MDT), Luke <m...@privacy.net> wrote:
> >
> >>Are there any ways to make a post that
> >>
> >>- google groups won't show?
> >>
> >>- can't be replied to by google groupers?
> >>
> >>Thanks
> >
> > Pre load your path to include googlegroups.
>
> This is a bad idea for at least two reasons:
>
> 1. Some news providers consider Path: forgery to be a reason for
> closing your account.
>
> 2. Some anti-GG posters filter on the Path:.
In the context of the OP's OP, where is the "bad" part? :-)
Blinky the Shark
They probably do. But I filter them.
Blinky the Shark
> In news.software.readers on Fri, 06 Jun 2008 14:40:55 +0800,
> us...@invalid.invalid <us...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>
>> On Thu, 5 Jun 2008 17:47:35 -0600 (MDT), Luke <m...@privacy.net> wrote:
>>
>>>Are there any ways to make a post that
>>>
>>>- google groups won't show?
>>>
>>>- can't be replied to by google groupers?
>>>
>>>Thanks
>>
>> Pre load your path to include googlegroups.
>
> This is a bad idea for at least two reasons:
>
> 1. Some news providers consider Path: forgery to be a reason for closing
> your account.
>
> 2. Some anti-GG posters filter on the Path:.
That seems kind of stupid.
Mike Easter
> Mike Easter wrote:
>> What does UIP mean in this context?
>
> Wake up Mike. This is news.software.readers. I'd be willing to bet
> that there's only one UIP sense that's used in here.
My cite also included its absence in Acronym Finders.
By way of 'restitution' I submitted it to the acronymfinder dudes, so
maybe next time it will show up there.
--
Mike Easter
Peter J Ross
<a24...@ducksburg.com> wrote:
> On 2008-06-06, Peter J Ross wrote:
>
>>>> 1. Some news providers consider Path: forgery to be a reason for
>>>> closing your account.
>>>
>>> Don't the ones who care just just overwrite it?
>>
>> Not necessarily. Altopia, for instance, doesn't overwrite it but
>> considers forged Paths (i.e. the use of domains that the user
>> isn't entitled to use) to be abuse of their ToS/AUP. (At least it used
>> to; I haven't used Altopia for a while.)
>
> I see: "preloading" isn't necessarily "forging".
>
> Did they automatically detect forged paths, or just act if someone
> complained about them? (I'd be surprised if more than a handful of
> news.software.* readers look at Path headers.)
The current policy makes no sense to me:
===[begin_quoted_text]================================================
Q: What is your policy on Path: pre-loading?
A: If a customer of Altopia performs Path: pre-loading on their Path:
lines with valid (or valid looking) site names before "news.alt.net"
they should end their path-preloading with "news.alt.net", so that it
appears twice and it is obvious the post originated at Altopia. An
exception to this is made for customers who pre-load a site name that
they own or have permission to use. For example:
Path: ...!news.alt.net!valid_looking_site_name!news.alt.net
===[end_quoted_text]==================================================
Quoted from <https://www.altopia.com/polfaq.html>
This seems to me to dodge the forgery issue.
>>> Apparently my X-Orig-Path header looked like "bullschitt".
>>>
>>> http://groups.google.com/group/news.software.readers/msg/3f54ced01b355875
>>
>> You own ducksburg.com, so you're entitled to use
>><anything>.ducksburg.com as the name of your news server.
>
> Even our old friend agreed to that.
Friend??? AC has friends??? ;-)
Blinky the Shark
> Blinky the Shark wrote:
>> Mike Easter wrote:
>
>>> What does UIP mean in this context?
>>
>> Wake up Mike. This is news.software.readers. I'd be willing to bet
>> that there's only one UIP sense that's used in here.
>
> My cite also included its absence in Acronym Finders.
That's surprising? :)
> By way of 'restitution' I submitted it to the acronymfinder dudes, so
> maybe next time it will show up there.
Heh. Thanks. :) acronymfinder.com?
Blinky the Shark
Thanks, Mike. I never even noticed that there was a submission process.
I have no idea how I thought they came up with their list. :)
»Q«
Peter J Ross <p...@example.invalid> wrote:
> Friend??? AC has friends??? ;-)
Sure. Bigfoot.
Adam Funk
>> Pre load your path to include googlegroups.
>
> This is a bad idea for at least two reasons:
...
> 2. Some anti-GG posters filter on the Path:.
Why would they do that? Scoring on the Message-ID is much cheaper
since it comes with the XOVER, and just as effective, isn't it?
--
It is probable that television drama of high caliber and produced by
first-rate artists will materially raise the level of dramatic taste
of the nation. (David Sarnoff, CEO of RCA, 1939; in Stoll 1995)
Blinky the Shark
> On 2008-06-06, Peter J Ross wrote:
>
>>> Pre load your path to include googlegroups.
>>
>> This is a bad idea for at least two reasons:
> ...
>> 2. Some anti-GG posters filter on the Path:.
>
> Why would they do that? Scoring on the Message-ID is much cheaper since
They don't understand filtering.
> it comes with the XOVER, and just as effective, isn't it?
--
Peter J Ross
<a24...@ducksburg.com> wrote:
> On 2008-06-06, Peter J Ross wrote:
>
>>> Pre load your path to include googlegroups.
>>
>> This is a bad idea for at least two reasons:
> ...
>> 2. Some anti-GG posters filter on the Path:.
>
> Why would they do that? Scoring on the Message-ID is much cheaper
> since it comes with the XOVER, and just as effective, isn't it?
If other filters use Path: of necessity, using Path: for Google as
well shouldn't make any difference, since the header is already being
retrieved. But, as Blinky points out, the main reason for using Path:
is that the user hasn't worked out a more efficient method.
Adam Funk
>>> 2. Some anti-GG posters filter on the Path:.
>>
>> Why would they do that? Scoring on the Message-ID is much cheaper
>> since it comes with the XOVER, and just as effective, isn't it?
>
> If other filters use Path: of necessity, using Path: for Google as
> well shouldn't make any difference, since the header is already being
> retrieved. But, as Blinky points out, the main reason for using Path:
> is that the user hasn't worked out a more efficient method.
That's what I thought --- by mistake. (I hadn't considered that you
might already need to score on Path.)
--
"Why do the most demanding of books have words like _basic_,
_introductory_, and _elementary_ in their titles? Why not have a
title like _Exceedingly Difficult Ways to Forecast Weather Using
Giant, Complicated, and Stunningly Expensive Machines?" (McMullen 2001)
spooge
news:slrng4jnk...@pjr.motzarella.org:
Reads to me like Chris is trying to avoid having other servers "blamed" for
posts made by his clients and vice-versa. That would explain wanting
'news.alt.net' at the beginning of the path. I'd guess that was/is in
reaction to some net fuckery back in the day which either caused Altopia to
be blamed for the actions of others, or caused Chris to be the target of
some peer pressure due to other services being blamed for shit originating
from Altopia, but made to appear to originiate elsewhere.
Of course, present Altopia users are all kind, polite and law abiding
netizens who would never cause trouble for anyone.
Really.
--
When I'm God
Everyone dies
Luke
> >
> >- google groups won't show?
> >
> >- can't be replied to by google groupers?
> >
> >Thanks
>
> Pre load your path to include googlegroups.
Thanks.
Adam Funk
> The current policy makes no sense to me:
>
>===[begin_quoted_text]================================================
> Q: What is your policy on Path: pre-loading?
> A: If a customer of Altopia performs Path: pre-loading on their Path:
> lines with valid (or valid looking) site names before "news.alt.net"
> they should end their path-preloading with "news.alt.net", so that it
> appears twice and it is obvious the post originated at Altopia. An
> exception to this is made for customers who pre-load a site name that
> they own or have permission to use. For example:
> Path: ...!news.alt.net!valid_looking_site_name!news.alt.net
>===[end_quoted_text]==================================================
>
> Quoted from <https://www.altopia.com/polfaq.html>
>
> This seems to me to dodge the forgery issue.
It's pretty convoluted, but I *think* it means:
1. You can preload any domains you own or anything that looks invalid.
2. You can preload anything you want as long as you preload
"news.alt.net" first (right-most) because this is our standard hint
that you know it's bogus.
With leafnode and my custom host-name (in a domain I own), that would
be OK. But if I wanted to use something fake but valid-looking, or
preload google in, I don't think I could configure leafnode to stick
the extra one on the right. (But I'm not bothered, personally.)
--
Is one language more powerful than another? Compare, for example,
English with Yiddish. Sure, it's hard to describe a carburetor in
Yiddish, but try describing a schlemiel in English. (Stoll 1995)