coi is there any talk of making a lojbanic/lojban beginners ipod app? apps like flashcardlet are good for studying words, but i was thinking maybe a more lojban specific app would help for people who are already wanting to learn, getting to look at it on the go, or maybe to hear spoken lojban, or maybe just to make it more accessible to a wider variety of people. Just a thought. co'o
[repost, original seems to have been lost to the aether]
I've got an Apple iOS Developer account and would be happy to have a hand in writing a Lojban app for iOS (and Android if I can get the damn SDK and toolset stable), it's just I haven't thought of an app idea that has anything better to it than those that already exist.
My dev language of choice would probably be the JavaScript variant from Appcelerator, not that it's anything amazing, but it can compile to multiple platforms and takes away some of the suckage of Objective C.
One idea I had was perhaps a meet-up app for conlangers in general, whereby you tick the list of languages you speak or are learning to speak and perhaps your level of proficiency, and let it run in the background occasionally checking your location in to a central server. When someone else with a matching conlang interest is nearby the phone can alert you so you can meet up and say coi. Might be good for finding people to practice with?
> coi > is there any talk of making a lojbanic/lojban beginners ipod app? apps like flashcardlet are good for studying words, but i was thinking maybe a more lojban specific app would help for people who are already wanting to learn, getting to look at it on the go, or maybe to hear spoken lojban, or maybe just to make it more accessible to a wider variety of people. Just a thought. > co'o
> -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. > To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msg/lojban-beginners/-/x4FPR7wgSmEJ. > To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
I have written a Lojban Dictionary in pure Objective C, I am currently waiting for approval. I finished it a week or so ago but posted it today. But some other applications would be interesting.
On Thu, Jan 19, 2012 at 9:58 AM, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk>wrote:
> [repost, original seems to have been lost to the aether]
> I've got an Apple iOS Developer account and would be happy to have a hand > in writing a Lojban app for iOS (and Android if I can get the damn SDK and > toolset stable), it's just I haven't thought of an app idea that has > anything better to it than those that already exist.
> My dev language of choice would probably be the JavaScript variant from > Appcelerator, not that it's anything amazing, but it can compile to > multiple platforms and takes away some of the suckage of Objective C.
> One idea I had was perhaps a meet-up app for conlangers in general, > whereby you tick the list of languages you speak or are learning to speak > and perhaps your level of proficiency, and let it run in the background > occasionally checking your location in to a central server. When someone > else with a matching conlang interest is nearby the phone can alert you so > you can meet up and say coi. Might be good for finding people to practice > with?
> kozmikreis
> On 12 Jan 2012, at 06:27, kalsa wrote:
> coi > is there any talk of making a lojbanic/lojban beginners ipod app? apps > like flashcardlet are good for studying words, but i was thinking maybe a > more lojban specific app would help for people who are already wanting to > learn, getting to look at it on the go, or maybe to hear spoken lojban, or > maybe just to make it more accessible to a wider variety of people. Just a > thought. > co'o
> -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Lojban Beginners" group. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msg/lojban-beginners/-/x4FPR7wgSmEJ. > To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
> -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Lojban Beginners" group. > To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
I look forward to trying that out, please let us know when it's available. It'll be good when there's finally a Lojban-specific app in the iTunes Store :-)
Regarding my conlanger meet-up app idea, I retain no rights to the idea should you or anyone else wants to implement it either solo or as a collaboration.
On a slightly related note, there's now a free iBooks Author app in the Mac App Store for authoring rich content books for iPad consumption. It looks ideal for creating and sharing educational textbooks. The CLL as an iBook would be a good place to start, once the latest changes to it have been completed - thoughts anyone?
> I have written a Lojban Dictionary in pure Objective C, I am currently waiting for approval. I finished it a week or so ago but posted it today. But some other applications would be interesting.
> On Thu, Jan 19, 2012 at 9:58 AM, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk> wrote: > [repost, original seems to have been lost to the aether]
> I've got an Apple iOS Developer account and would be happy to have a hand in writing a Lojban app for iOS (and Android if I can get the damn SDK and toolset stable), it's just I haven't thought of an app idea that has anything better to it than those that already exist.
> My dev language of choice would probably be the JavaScript variant from Appcelerator, not that it's anything amazing, but it can compile to multiple platforms and takes away some of the suckage of Objective C.
> One idea I had was perhaps a meet-up app for conlangers in general, whereby you tick the list of languages you speak or are learning to speak and perhaps your level of proficiency, and let it run in the background occasionally checking your location in to a central server. When someone else with a matching conlang interest is nearby the phone can alert you so you can meet up and say coi. Might be good for finding people to practice with?
> kozmikreis
> On 12 Jan 2012, at 06:27, kalsa wrote:
>> coi >> is there any talk of making a lojbanic/lojban beginners ipod app? apps like flashcardlet are good for studying words, but i was thinking maybe a more lojban specific app would help for people who are already wanting to learn, getting to look at it on the go, or maybe to hear spoken lojban, or maybe just to make it more accessible to a wider variety of people. Just a thought. >> co'o
I was just looking into the idea of creating a CLL iBook as well! The problem that I see is that iBooks Author doesn't appear to play very nicely with the idea of streaming data in from other files. Which means that it's not really possible to script "convert the source files into an iBook", but rather each change made to the source files would have to be manually made to the iBook as well. Which is going to rapidly become painful. Further looking into is required however, as it would be a truly incredible platform to use.
---- Josh _____________________ Instead of our drab slogging forth and back to the fishing boats, there's a reason to life! We can lift ourselves out of ignorance, we can find ourselves as creatures of excellence and intelligence and skill. We can be free! We can learn to fly!
— Richard Bach, 'Jonathan Livingston Seagull,' 1970.
On Mon, Jan 23, 2012 at 11:11, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk> wrote: > I look forward to trying that out, please let us know when it's available. > It'll be good when there's finally a Lojban-specific app in the iTunes > Store :-)
> Regarding my conlanger meet-up app idea, I retain no rights to the idea > should you or anyone else wants to implement it either solo or as a > collaboration.
> On a slightly related note, there's now a free iBooks Author app in the > Mac App Store for authoring rich content books for iPad consumption. It > looks ideal for creating and sharing educational textbooks. The CLL as an > iBook would be a good place to start, once the latest changes to it have > been completed - thoughts anyone?
> kozmikreis
> On 22 Jan 2012, at 09:13, aryrain laubels wrote:
> I have written a Lojban Dictionary in pure Objective C, I am currently > waiting for approval. I finished it a week or so ago but posted it today. > But some other applications would be interesting.
> On Thu, Jan 19, 2012 at 9:58 AM, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk>wrote:
>> [repost, original seems to have been lost to the aether]
>> I've got an Apple iOS Developer account and would be happy to have a hand >> in writing a Lojban app for iOS (and Android if I can get the damn SDK and >> toolset stable), it's just I haven't thought of an app idea that has >> anything better to it than those that already exist.
>> My dev language of choice would probably be the JavaScript variant from >> Appcelerator, not that it's anything amazing, but it can compile to >> multiple platforms and takes away some of the suckage of Objective C.
>> One idea I had was perhaps a meet-up app for conlangers in general, >> whereby you tick the list of languages you speak or are learning to speak >> and perhaps your level of proficiency, and let it run in the background >> occasionally checking your location in to a central server. When someone >> else with a matching conlang interest is nearby the phone can alert you so >> you can meet up and say coi. Might be good for finding people to practice >> with?
>> kozmikreis
>> On 12 Jan 2012, at 06:27, kalsa wrote:
>> coi >> is there any talk of making a lojbanic/lojban beginners ipod app? apps >> like flashcardlet are good for studying words, but i was thinking maybe a >> more lojban specific app would help for people who are already wanting to >> learn, getting to look at it on the go, or maybe to hear spoken lojban, or >> maybe just to make it more accessible to a wider variety of people. Just a >> thought. >> co'o
> -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Lojban Beginners" group. > To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
Those were very much my thoughts too - that porting a regularly updated open source formatted book into a proprietary format was going to be awfully tough to keep up with. However, unlike apps, I think iBooks are static once published. Authors don't push out a v1.x update after the fact. With this in mind it's probably still worth forking the next stable CLL major version and porting it, perhaps even embedding an errata section by use of a web view that points back to the github repo in case of any major boo-boos.
> I was just looking into the idea of creating a CLL iBook as well! > The problem that I see is that iBooks Author doesn't appear to play very nicely with the idea of streaming data in from other files. Which means that it's not really possible to script "convert the source files into an iBook", but rather each change made to the source files would have to be manually made to the iBook as well. Which is going to rapidly become painful. Further looking into is required however, as it would be a truly incredible platform to use.
> ---- > Josh > _____________________ > Instead of our drab slogging forth and back to the fishing boats, there's a reason to life! We can lift ourselves out of ignorance, we can find ourselves as creatures of excellence and intelligence and skill. We can be free! We can learn to fly!
> — Richard Bach, 'Jonathan Livingston Seagull,' 1970.
> On Mon, Jan 23, 2012 at 11:11, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk> wrote: > I look forward to trying that out, please let us know when it's available. It'll be good when there's finally a Lojban-specific app in the iTunes Store :-)
> Regarding my conlanger meet-up app idea, I retain no rights to the idea should you or anyone else wants to implement it either solo or as a collaboration.
> On a slightly related note, there's now a free iBooks Author app in the Mac App Store for authoring rich content books for iPad consumption. It looks ideal for creating and sharing educational textbooks. The CLL as an iBook would be a good place to start, once the latest changes to it have been completed - thoughts anyone?
> kozmikreis
> On 22 Jan 2012, at 09:13, aryrain laubels wrote:
>> I have written a Lojban Dictionary in pure Objective C, I am currently waiting for approval. I finished it a week or so ago but posted it today. But some other applications would be interesting.
>> On Thu, Jan 19, 2012 at 9:58 AM, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk> wrote: >> [repost, original seems to have been lost to the aether]
>> I've got an Apple iOS Developer account and would be happy to have a hand in writing a Lojban app for iOS (and Android if I can get the damn SDK and toolset stable), it's just I haven't thought of an app idea that has anything better to it than those that already exist.
>> My dev language of choice would probably be the JavaScript variant from Appcelerator, not that it's anything amazing, but it can compile to multiple platforms and takes away some of the suckage of Objective C.
>> One idea I had was perhaps a meet-up app for conlangers in general, whereby you tick the list of languages you speak or are learning to speak and perhaps your level of proficiency, and let it run in the background occasionally checking your location in to a central server. When someone else with a matching conlang interest is nearby the phone can alert you so you can meet up and say coi. Might be good for finding people to practice with?
>> kozmikreis
>> On 12 Jan 2012, at 06:27, kalsa wrote:
>>> coi >>> is there any talk of making a lojbanic/lojban beginners ipod app? apps like flashcardlet are good for studying words, but i was thinking maybe a more lojban specific app would help for people who are already wanting to learn, getting to look at it on the go, or maybe to hear spoken lojban, or maybe just to make it more accessible to a wider variety of people. Just a thought. >>> co'o
> -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. > To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
> -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. > To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
> Those were very much my thoughts too - that porting a regularly updated > open source formatted book into a proprietary format was going to be > awfully tough to keep up with. However, unlike apps, I think iBooks are > static once published. Authors don't push out a v1.x update after the > fact. With this in mind it's probably still worth forking the next stable > CLL major version and porting it, perhaps even embedding an errata section > by use of a web view that points back to the github repo in case of any > major boo-boos.
> kozmikreis
> On 24 Jan 2012, at 02:44, Joshua Proehl wrote:
> I was just looking into the idea of creating a CLL iBook as well! > The problem that I see is that iBooks Author doesn't appear to play very > nicely with the idea of streaming data in from other files. Which means > that it's not really possible to script "convert the source files into an > iBook", but rather each change made to the source files would have to be > manually made to the iBook as well. Which is going to rapidly become > painful. Further looking into is required however, as it would be a truly > incredible platform to use.
> ---- > Josh > _____________________ > Instead of our drab slogging forth and back to the fishing boats, there's > a reason to life! We can lift ourselves out of ignorance, we can find > ourselves as creatures of excellence and intelligence and skill. We can be > free! We can learn to fly!
> — Richard Bach, 'Jonathan Livingston Seagull,' 1970.
> On Mon, Jan 23, 2012 at 11:11, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk>wrote:
>> I look forward to trying that out, please let us know when it's >> available. It'll be good when there's finally a Lojban-specific app in the >> iTunes Store :-)
>> Regarding my conlanger meet-up app idea, I retain no rights to the idea >> should you or anyone else wants to implement it either solo or as a >> collaboration.
>> On a slightly related note, there's now a free iBooks Author app in the >> Mac App Store for authoring rich content books for iPad consumption. It >> looks ideal for creating and sharing educational textbooks. The CLL as an >> iBook would be a good place to start, once the latest changes to it have >> been completed - thoughts anyone?
>> kozmikreis
>> On 22 Jan 2012, at 09:13, aryrain laubels wrote:
>> I have written a Lojban Dictionary in pure Objective C, I am currently >> waiting for approval. I finished it a week or so ago but posted it today. >> But some other applications would be interesting.
>> On Thu, Jan 19, 2012 at 9:58 AM, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk>wrote:
>>> [repost, original seems to have been lost to the aether]
>>> I've got an Apple iOS Developer account and would be happy to have a >>> hand in writing a Lojban app for iOS (and Android if I can get the damn SDK >>> and toolset stable), it's just I haven't thought of an app idea that has >>> anything better to it than those that already exist.
>>> My dev language of choice would probably be the JavaScript variant from >>> Appcelerator, not that it's anything amazing, but it can compile to >>> multiple platforms and takes away some of the suckage of Objective C.
>>> One idea I had was perhaps a meet-up app for conlangers in general, >>> whereby you tick the list of languages you speak or are learning to speak >>> and perhaps your level of proficiency, and let it run in the background >>> occasionally checking your location in to a central server. When someone >>> else with a matching conlang interest is nearby the phone can alert you so >>> you can meet up and say coi. Might be good for finding people to practice >>> with?
>>> kozmikreis
>>> On 12 Jan 2012, at 06:27, kalsa wrote:
>>> coi >>> is there any talk of making a lojbanic/lojban beginners ipod app? apps >>> like flashcardlet are good for studying words, but i was thinking maybe a >>> more lojban specific app would help for people who are already wanting to >>> learn, getting to look at it on the go, or maybe to hear spoken lojban, or >>> maybe just to make it more accessible to a wider variety of people. Just a >>> thought. >>> co'o
>> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Lojban Beginners" group. >> To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
> -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Lojban Beginners" group. > To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
> -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Lojban Beginners" group. > To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
That is true, but is missing the point of the additional richness the proprietary iBook format allows for such as interactive multiple-choice questions, audio clips, video clips, and other learning aids that might be attractive in an enhanced version of the CLL :-)
> Or, if there's an html version in existence, it could just be ported to .epub with Calibre...
> Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S II X.
> On Jan 27, 2012 6:50 AM, "CosmicRay" <c...@cosmicray.co.uk> wrote: > Those were very much my thoughts too - that porting a regularly updated open source formatted book into a proprietary format was going to be awfully tough to keep up with. However, unlike apps, I think iBooks are static once published. Authors don't push out a v1.x update after the fact. With this in mind it's probably still worth forking the next stable CLL major version and porting it, perhaps even embedding an errata section by use of a web view that points back to the github repo in case of any major boo-boos.
> kozmikreis
> On 24 Jan 2012, at 02:44, Joshua Proehl wrote:
>> I was just looking into the idea of creating a CLL iBook as well! >> The problem that I see is that iBooks Author doesn't appear to play very nicely with the idea of streaming data in from other files. Which means that it's not really possible to script "convert the source files into an iBook", but rather each change made to the source files would have to be manually made to the iBook as well. Which is going to rapidly become painful. Further looking into is required however, as it would be a truly incredible platform to use.
>> ---- >> Josh >> _____________________ >> Instead of our drab slogging forth and back to the fishing boats, there's a reason to life! We can lift ourselves out of ignorance, we can find ourselves as creatures of excellence and intelligence and skill. We can be free! We can learn to fly!
>> — Richard Bach, 'Jonathan Livingston Seagull,' 1970.
>> On Mon, Jan 23, 2012 at 11:11, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk> wrote: >> I look forward to trying that out, please let us know when it's available. It'll be good when there's finally a Lojban-specific app in the iTunes Store :-)
>> Regarding my conlanger meet-up app idea, I retain no rights to the idea should you or anyone else wants to implement it either solo or as a collaboration.
>> On a slightly related note, there's now a free iBooks Author app in the Mac App Store for authoring rich content books for iPad consumption. It looks ideal for creating and sharing educational textbooks. The CLL as an iBook would be a good place to start, once the latest changes to it have been completed - thoughts anyone?
>> kozmikreis
>> On 22 Jan 2012, at 09:13, aryrain laubels wrote:
>>> I have written a Lojban Dictionary in pure Objective C, I am currently waiting for approval. I finished it a week or so ago but posted it today. But some other applications would be interesting.
>>> On Thu, Jan 19, 2012 at 9:58 AM, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk> wrote: >>> [repost, original seems to have been lost to the aether]
>>> I've got an Apple iOS Developer account and would be happy to have a hand in writing a Lojban app for iOS (and Android if I can get the damn SDK and toolset stable), it's just I haven't thought of an app idea that has anything better to it than those that already exist.
>>> My dev language of choice would probably be the JavaScript variant from Appcelerator, not that it's anything amazing, but it can compile to multiple platforms and takes away some of the suckage of Objective C.
>>> One idea I had was perhaps a meet-up app for conlangers in general, whereby you tick the list of languages you speak or are learning to speak and perhaps your level of proficiency, and let it run in the background occasionally checking your location in to a central server. When someone else with a matching conlang interest is nearby the phone can alert you so you can meet up and say coi. Might be good for finding people to practice with?
>>> kozmikreis
>>> On 12 Jan 2012, at 06:27, kalsa wrote:
>>>> coi >>>> is there any talk of making a lojbanic/lojban beginners ipod app? apps like flashcardlet are good for studying words, but i was thinking maybe a more lojban specific app would help for people who are already wanting to learn, getting to look at it on the go, or maybe to hear spoken lojban, or maybe just to make it more accessible to a wider variety of people. Just a thought. >>>> co'o
>> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. >> To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
>> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. >> To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
> -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. > To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
> -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. > To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
> That is true, but is missing the point of the additional richness the > proprietary iBook format allows for such as interactive multiple-choice > questions, audio clips, video clips, and other learning aids that might be > attractive in an enhanced version of the CLL :-)
> kozmikreis
> On 27 Jan 2012, at 21:32, Aaron Hawryluk wrote:
> Or, if there's an html version in existence, it could just be ported to > .epub with Calibre...
> Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S II X. > On Jan 27, 2012 6:50 AM, "CosmicRay" <c...@cosmicray.co.uk> wrote:
>> Those were very much my thoughts too - that porting a regularly updated >> open source formatted book into a proprietary format was going to be >> awfully tough to keep up with. However, unlike apps, I think iBooks are >> static once published. Authors don't push out a v1.x update after the >> fact. With this in mind it's probably still worth forking the next stable >> CLL major version and porting it, perhaps even embedding an errata section >> by use of a web view that points back to the github repo in case of any >> major boo-boos.
>> kozmikreis
>> On 24 Jan 2012, at 02:44, Joshua Proehl wrote:
>> I was just looking into the idea of creating a CLL iBook as well! >> The problem that I see is that iBooks Author doesn't appear to play very >> nicely with the idea of streaming data in from other files. Which means >> that it's not really possible to script "convert the source files into an >> iBook", but rather each change made to the source files would have to be >> manually made to the iBook as well. Which is going to rapidly become >> painful. Further looking into is required however, as it would be a truly >> incredible platform to use.
>> ---- >> Josh >> _____________________ >> Instead of our drab slogging forth and back to the fishing boats, there's >> a reason to life! We can lift ourselves out of ignorance, we can find >> ourselves as creatures of excellence and intelligence and skill. We can be >> free! We can learn to fly!
>> — Richard Bach, 'Jonathan Livingston Seagull,' 1970.
>> On Mon, Jan 23, 2012 at 11:11, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk>wrote:
>>> I look forward to trying that out, please let us know when it's >>> available. It'll be good when there's finally a Lojban-specific app in the >>> iTunes Store :-)
>>> Regarding my conlanger meet-up app idea, I retain no rights to the idea >>> should you or anyone else wants to implement it either solo or as a >>> collaboration.
>>> On a slightly related note, there's now a free iBooks Author app in the >>> Mac App Store for authoring rich content books for iPad consumption. It >>> looks ideal for creating and sharing educational textbooks. The CLL as an >>> iBook would be a good place to start, once the latest changes to it have >>> been completed - thoughts anyone?
>>> kozmikreis
>>> On 22 Jan 2012, at 09:13, aryrain laubels wrote:
>>> I have written a Lojban Dictionary in pure Objective C, I am currently >>> waiting for approval. I finished it a week or so ago but posted it today. >>> But some other applications would be interesting.
>>> On Thu, Jan 19, 2012 at 9:58 AM, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk>wrote:
>>>> [repost, original seems to have been lost to the aether]
>>>> I've got an Apple iOS Developer account and would be happy to have a >>>> hand in writing a Lojban app for iOS (and Android if I can get the damn SDK >>>> and toolset stable), it's just I haven't thought of an app idea that has >>>> anything better to it than those that already exist.
>>>> My dev language of choice would probably be the JavaScript variant from >>>> Appcelerator, not that it's anything amazing, but it can compile to >>>> multiple platforms and takes away some of the suckage of Objective C.
>>>> One idea I had was perhaps a meet-up app for conlangers in general, >>>> whereby you tick the list of languages you speak or are learning to speak >>>> and perhaps your level of proficiency, and let it run in the background >>>> occasionally checking your location in to a central server. When someone >>>> else with a matching conlang interest is nearby the phone can alert you so >>>> you can meet up and say coi. Might be good for finding people to practice >>>> with?
>>>> kozmikreis
>>>> On 12 Jan 2012, at 06:27, kalsa wrote:
>>>> coi >>>> is there any talk of making a lojbanic/lojban beginners ipod app? apps >>>> like flashcardlet are good for studying words, but i was thinking maybe a >>>> more lojban specific app would help for people who are already wanting to >>>> learn, getting to look at it on the go, or maybe to hear spoken lojban, or >>>> maybe just to make it more accessible to a wider variety of people. Just a >>>> thought. >>>> co'o
>>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
>> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Lojban Beginners" group. >> To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
>> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Lojban Beginners" group. >> To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
> -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Lojban Beginners" group. > To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
> -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Lojban Beginners" group. > To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
-- mu'o mi'e .aionys.
.i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D )
Extending your line of reasoning, should we immediately cease distributing hard copies of the CLL because the format isn't compatible with e-readers? :-p
Yes the iBook format is only compatible with a limited selection of devices, does that somehow invalidate taking advantage of the format in addition to the plethora of open formats the new CLL can be transformed into?
> Not to mention the proprietary nature of the format that automatically excludes anyone without an iPad, iPod Touch, or iPhone.
> On Fri, Jan 27, 2012 at 3:26 PM, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk> wrote: > That is true, but is missing the point of the additional richness the proprietary iBook format allows for such as interactive multiple-choice questions, audio clips, video clips, and other learning aids that might be attractive in an enhanced version of the CLL :-)
> kozmikreis
> On 27 Jan 2012, at 21:32, Aaron Hawryluk wrote:
>> Or, if there's an html version in existence, it could just be ported to .epub with Calibre...
>> Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S II X.
>> On Jan 27, 2012 6:50 AM, "CosmicRay" <c...@cosmicray.co.uk> wrote: >> Those were very much my thoughts too - that porting a regularly updated open source formatted book into a proprietary format was going to be awfully tough to keep up with. However, unlike apps, I think iBooks are static once published. Authors don't push out a v1.x update after the fact. With this in mind it's probably still worth forking the next stable CLL major version and porting it, perhaps even embedding an errata section by use of a web view that points back to the github repo in case of any major boo-boos.
>> kozmikreis
>> On 24 Jan 2012, at 02:44, Joshua Proehl wrote:
>>> I was just looking into the idea of creating a CLL iBook as well! >>> The problem that I see is that iBooks Author doesn't appear to play very nicely with the idea of streaming data in from other files. Which means that it's not really possible to script "convert the source files into an iBook", but rather each change made to the source files would have to be manually made to the iBook as well. Which is going to rapidly become painful. Further looking into is required however, as it would be a truly incredible platform to use.
>>> ---- >>> Josh >>> _____________________ >>> Instead of our drab slogging forth and back to the fishing boats, there's a reason to life! We can lift ourselves out of ignorance, we can find ourselves as creatures of excellence and intelligence and skill. We can be free! We can learn to fly!
>>> — Richard Bach, 'Jonathan Livingston Seagull,' 1970.
>>> On Mon, Jan 23, 2012 at 11:11, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk> wrote: >>> I look forward to trying that out, please let us know when it's available. It'll be good when there's finally a Lojban-specific app in the iTunes Store :-)
>>> Regarding my conlanger meet-up app idea, I retain no rights to the idea should you or anyone else wants to implement it either solo or as a collaboration.
>>> On a slightly related note, there's now a free iBooks Author app in the Mac App Store for authoring rich content books for iPad consumption. It looks ideal for creating and sharing educational textbooks. The CLL as an iBook would be a good place to start, once the latest changes to it have been completed - thoughts anyone?
>>> kozmikreis
>>> On 22 Jan 2012, at 09:13, aryrain laubels wrote:
>>>> I have written a Lojban Dictionary in pure Objective C, I am currently waiting for approval. I finished it a week or so ago but posted it today. But some other applications would be interesting.
>>>> On Thu, Jan 19, 2012 at 9:58 AM, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk> wrote: >>>> [repost, original seems to have been lost to the aether]
>>>> I've got an Apple iOS Developer account and would be happy to have a hand in writing a Lojban app for iOS (and Android if I can get the damn SDK and toolset stable), it's just I haven't thought of an app idea that has anything better to it than those that already exist.
>>>> My dev language of choice would probably be the JavaScript variant from Appcelerator, not that it's anything amazing, but it can compile to multiple platforms and takes away some of the suckage of Objective C.
>>>> One idea I had was perhaps a meet-up app for conlangers in general, whereby you tick the list of languages you speak or are learning to speak and perhaps your level of proficiency, and let it run in the background occasionally checking your location in to a central server. When someone else with a matching conlang interest is nearby the phone can alert you so you can meet up and say coi. Might be good for finding people to practice with?
>>>> kozmikreis
>>>> On 12 Jan 2012, at 06:27, kalsa wrote:
>>>>> coi >>>>> is there any talk of making a lojbanic/lojban beginners ipod app? apps like flashcardlet are good for studying words, but i was thinking maybe a more lojban specific app would help for people who are already wanting to learn, getting to look at it on the go, or maybe to hear spoken lojban, or maybe just to make it more accessible to a wider variety of people. Just a thought. >>>>> co'o
>>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
>>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
>> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. >> To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
>> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. >> To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
> -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. > To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
> -- > mu'o mi'e .aionys.
> .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o > (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D )
> -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. > To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
On 28 jan 2012, at 09:43, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk> wrote:
Extending your line of reasoning, should we immediately cease distributing hard copies of the CLL because the format isn't compatible with e-readers? :-p
Yes the iBook format is only compatible with a limited selection of devices, does that somehow invalidate taking advantage of the format in addition to the plethora of open formats the new CLL can be transformed into?
kozmikreis
On 28 Jan 2012, at 00:10, Jonathan Jones wrote:
Not to mention the proprietary nature of the format that automatically excludes anyone without an iPad, iPod Touch, or iPhone.
On Fri, Jan 27, 2012 at 3:26 PM, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk>wrote:
> That is true, but is missing the point of the additional richness the > proprietary iBook format allows for such as interactive multiple-choice > questions, audio clips, video clips, and other learning aids that might be > attractive in an enhanced version of the CLL :-)
> kozmikreis
> On 27 Jan 2012, at 21:32, Aaron Hawryluk wrote:
> Or, if there's an html version in existence, it could just be ported to > .epub with Calibre...
> Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S II X. > On Jan 27, 2012 6:50 AM, "CosmicRay" <c...@cosmicray.co.uk> wrote:
>> Those were very much my thoughts too - that porting a regularly updated >> open source formatted book into a proprietary format was going to be >> awfully tough to keep up with. However, unlike apps, I think iBooks are >> static once published. Authors don't push out a v1.x update after the >> fact. With this in mind it's probably still worth forking the next stable >> CLL major version and porting it, perhaps even embedding an errata section >> by use of a web view that points back to the github repo in case of any >> major boo-boos.
>> kozmikreis
>> On 24 Jan 2012, at 02:44, Joshua Proehl wrote:
>> I was just looking into the idea of creating a CLL iBook as well! >> The problem that I see is that iBooks Author doesn't appear to play very >> nicely with the idea of streaming data in from other files. Which means >> that it's not really possible to script "convert the source files into an >> iBook", but rather each change made to the source files would have to be >> manually made to the iBook as well. Which is going to rapidly become >> painful. Further looking into is required however, as it would be a truly >> incredible platform to use.
>> ---- >> Josh >> _____________________ >> Instead of our drab slogging forth and back to the fishing boats, there's >> a reason to life! We can lift ourselves out of ignorance, we can find >> ourselves as creatures of excellence and intelligence and skill. We can be >> free! We can learn to fly!
>> — Richard Bach, 'Jonathan Livingston Seagull,' 1970.
>> On Mon, Jan 23, 2012 at 11:11, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk>wrote:
>>> I look forward to trying that out, please let us know when it's >>> available. It'll be good when there's finally a Lojban-specific app in the >>> iTunes Store :-)
>>> Regarding my conlanger meet-up app idea, I retain no rights to the idea >>> should you or anyone else wants to implement it either solo or as a >>> collaboration.
>>> On a slightly related note, there's now a free iBooks Author app in the >>> Mac App Store for authoring rich content books for iPad consumption. It >>> looks ideal for creating and sharing educational textbooks. The CLL as an >>> iBook would be a good place to start, once the latest changes to it have >>> been completed - thoughts anyone?
>>> kozmikreis
>>> On 22 Jan 2012, at 09:13, aryrain laubels wrote:
>>> I have written a Lojban Dictionary in pure Objective C, I am currently >>> waiting for approval. I finished it a week or so ago but posted it today. >>> But some other applications would be interesting.
>>> On Thu, Jan 19, 2012 at 9:58 AM, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk>wrote:
>>>> [repost, original seems to have been lost to the aether]
>>>> I've got an Apple iOS Developer account and would be happy to have a >>>> hand in writing a Lojban app for iOS (and Android if I can get the damn SDK >>>> and toolset stable), it's just I haven't thought of an app idea that has >>>> anything better to it than those that already exist.
>>>> My dev language of choice would probably be the JavaScript variant from >>>> Appcelerator, not that it's anything amazing, but it can compile to >>>> multiple platforms and takes away some of the suckage of Objective C.
>>>> One idea I had was perhaps a meet-up app for conlangers in general, >>>> whereby you tick the list of languages you speak or are learning to speak >>>> and perhaps your level of proficiency, and let it run in the background >>>> occasionally checking your location in to a central server. When someone >>>> else with a matching conlang interest is nearby the phone can alert you so >>>> you can meet up and say coi. Might be good for finding people to practice >>>> with?
>>>> kozmikreis
>>>> On 12 Jan 2012, at 06:27, kalsa wrote:
>>>> coi >>>> is there any talk of making a lojbanic/lojban beginners ipod app? apps >>>> like flashcardlet are good for studying words, but i was thinking maybe a >>>> more lojban specific app would help for people who are already wanting to >>>> learn, getting to look at it on the go, or maybe to hear spoken lojban, or >>>> maybe just to make it more accessible to a wider variety of people. Just a >>>> thought. >>>> co'o
>>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
>> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Lojban Beginners" group. >> To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
>> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Lojban Beginners" group. >> To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
> -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Lojban Beginners" group. > To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
> -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Lojban Beginners" group. > To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
-- mu'o mi'e .aionys.
.i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D )
-- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
-- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
That analogy doesn't work. Hard-copy isn't a format, is a presentation medium.
.epub is a format, as is .pdf. .html, .doc, .odf, etc. An e-reader is a presentation medium, as is a desktop, laptop, netbook, tablet, etc.
And even if we were to allow that a traditional book is both a format /and/ a presentation medium (which I don't), scanners have existed for years, and are perfectly capable of being used to transfer a book's contents to any kind of other medium's format, usually with no loss of information during the process.
Is there /any/ other format to which iBooks are capable of being transferred to? Can you name one format that is not only available to Apple devices to which an iBook can be converted?
I'm against proprietary formats in general. I honestly don't care what "wonderful" features the format may provide. There's is no way I'm buying a $800 device just to be able to access, literally, /one/ thing I couldn't otherwise. Especially since I already have a tablet, a smartphone, a laptop, and a desktop.
The point is, limiting distribution to noly those who have "X", means that any one who doesn't is automatically excluded. Especially for a language, /any/ kind of exclusion of people is BAD. I'm not saying I wouldn't enjoy having such features- they may be valuable, they may not, I have no opinion. What I'm saying is that whether or not such a thing exists, I /won't/ have it, because of the proprietary nature of the item. I happen to be dead set against participating in the money-vacuum that is Apple Inc. (my Android tablet has equivalent specs to the iPad 2 and is $500(!) cheaper), but my stance is the same regardless of the company behind it.
On Sat, Jan 28, 2012 at 1:43 AM, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk>wrote:
> Extending your line of reasoning, should we immediately cease distributing > hard copies of the CLL because the format isn't compatible with e-readers? > :-p
> Yes the iBook format is only compatible with a limited selection of > devices, does that somehow invalidate taking advantage of the format in > addition to the plethora of open formats the new CLL can be transformed > into?
> kozmikreis
> On 28 Jan 2012, at 00:10, Jonathan Jones wrote:
> Not to mention the proprietary nature of the format that automatically > excludes anyone without an iPad, iPod Touch, or iPhone.
> On Fri, Jan 27, 2012 at 3:26 PM, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk>wrote:
>> That is true, but is missing the point of the additional richness the >> proprietary iBook format allows for such as interactive multiple-choice >> questions, audio clips, video clips, and other learning aids that might be >> attractive in an enhanced version of the CLL :-)
>> kozmikreis
>> On 27 Jan 2012, at 21:32, Aaron Hawryluk wrote:
>> Or, if there's an html version in existence, it could just be ported to >> .epub with Calibre...
>> Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S II X. >> On Jan 27, 2012 6:50 AM, "CosmicRay" <c...@cosmicray.co.uk> wrote:
>>> Those were very much my thoughts too - that porting a regularly updated >>> open source formatted book into a proprietary format was going to be >>> awfully tough to keep up with. However, unlike apps, I think iBooks are >>> static once published. Authors don't push out a v1.x update after the >>> fact. With this in mind it's probably still worth forking the next stable >>> CLL major version and porting it, perhaps even embedding an errata section >>> by use of a web view that points back to the github repo in case of any >>> major boo-boos.
>>> kozmikreis
>>> On 24 Jan 2012, at 02:44, Joshua Proehl wrote:
>>> I was just looking into the idea of creating a CLL iBook as well! >>> The problem that I see is that iBooks Author doesn't appear to play very >>> nicely with the idea of streaming data in from other files. Which means >>> that it's not really possible to script "convert the source files into an >>> iBook", but rather each change made to the source files would have to be >>> manually made to the iBook as well. Which is going to rapidly become >>> painful. Further looking into is required however, as it would be a truly >>> incredible platform to use.
>>> ---- >>> Josh >>> _____________________ >>> Instead of our drab slogging forth and back to the fishing boats, >>> there's a reason to life! We can lift ourselves out of ignorance, we can >>> find ourselves as creatures of excellence and intelligence and skill. We >>> can be free! We can learn to fly!
>>> — Richard Bach, 'Jonathan Livingston Seagull,' 1970.
>>> On Mon, Jan 23, 2012 at 11:11, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk>wrote:
>>>> I look forward to trying that out, please let us know when it's >>>> available. It'll be good when there's finally a Lojban-specific app in the >>>> iTunes Store :-)
>>>> Regarding my conlanger meet-up app idea, I retain no rights to the idea >>>> should you or anyone else wants to implement it either solo or as a >>>> collaboration.
>>>> On a slightly related note, there's now a free iBooks Author app in the >>>> Mac App Store for authoring rich content books for iPad consumption. It >>>> looks ideal for creating and sharing educational textbooks. The CLL as an >>>> iBook would be a good place to start, once the latest changes to it have >>>> been completed - thoughts anyone?
>>>> kozmikreis
>>>> On 22 Jan 2012, at 09:13, aryrain laubels wrote:
>>>> I have written a Lojban Dictionary in pure Objective C, I am currently >>>> waiting for approval. I finished it a week or so ago but posted it today. >>>> But some other applications would be interesting.
>>>> On Thu, Jan 19, 2012 at 9:58 AM, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk>wrote:
>>>>> [repost, original seems to have been lost to the aether]
>>>>> I've got an Apple iOS Developer account and would be happy to have a >>>>> hand in writing a Lojban app for iOS (and Android if I can get the damn SDK >>>>> and toolset stable), it's just I haven't thought of an app idea that has >>>>> anything better to it than those that already exist.
>>>>> My dev language of choice would probably be the JavaScript variant >>>>> from Appcelerator, not that it's anything amazing, but it can compile to >>>>> multiple platforms and takes away some of the suckage of Objective C.
>>>>> One idea I had was perhaps a meet-up app for conlangers in general, >>>>> whereby you tick the list of languages you speak or are learning to speak >>>>> and perhaps your level of proficiency, and let it run in the background >>>>> occasionally checking your location in to a central server. When someone >>>>> else with a matching conlang interest is nearby the phone can alert you so >>>>> you can meet up and say coi. Might be good for finding people to practice >>>>> with?
>>>>> kozmikreis
>>>>> On 12 Jan 2012, at 06:27, kalsa wrote:
>>>>> coi >>>>> is there any talk of making a lojbanic/lojban beginners ipod app? apps >>>>> like flashcardlet are good for studying words, but i was thinking maybe a >>>>> more lojban specific app would help for people who are already wanting to >>>>> learn, getting to look at it on the go, or maybe to hear spoken lojban, or >>>>> maybe just to make it more accessible to a wider variety of people. Just a >>>>> thought. >>>>> co'o
>>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. >>>> To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>>> lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >>>> For more options, visit this group at >>>> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
>>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
>>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
>> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Lojban Beginners" group. >> To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
>> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Lojban Beginners" group. >> To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
> -- > mu'o mi'e .aionys.
> .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o > (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D )
> -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Lojban Beginners" group. > To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
On Saturday, January 28, 2012 at 10:44 AM, Jonathan Jones wrote: > That analogy doesn't work. Hard-copy isn't a format, is a presentation medium.
> .epub is a format, as is .pdf. .html, .doc, .odf, etc. An e-reader is a presentation medium, as is a desktop, laptop, netbook, tablet, etc.
> And even if we were to allow that a traditional book is both a format /and/ a presentation medium (which I don't), scanners have existed for years, and are perfectly capable of being used to transfer a book's contents to any kind of other medium's format, usually with no loss of information during the process.
> Is there /any/ other format to which iBooks are capable of being transferred to? Can you name one format that is not only available to Apple devices to which an iBook can be converted?
> I'm against proprietary formats in general. I honestly don't care what "wonderful" features the format may provide. There's is no way I'm buying a $800 device just to be able to access, literally, /one/ thing I couldn't otherwise. Especially since I already have a tablet, a smartphone, a laptop, and a desktop.
> The point is, limiting distribution to noly those who have "X", means that any one who doesn't is automatically excluded. Especially for a language, /any/ kind of exclusion of people is BAD. I'm not saying I wouldn't enjoy having such features- they may be valuable, they may not, I have no opinion. What I'm saying is that whether or not such a thing exists, I /won't/ have it, because of the proprietary nature of the item. I happen to be dead set against participating in the money-vacuum that is Apple Inc. (my Android tablet has equivalent specs to the iPad 2 and is $500(!) cheaper), but my stance is the same regardless of the company behind it.
> On Sat, Jan 28, 2012 at 1:43 AM, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk (mailto:kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk)> wrote: > > Extending your line of reasoning, should we immediately cease distributing hard copies of the CLL because the format isn't compatible with e-readers? :-p
> > Yes the iBook format is only compatible with a limited selection of devices, does that somehow invalidate taking advantage of the format in addition to the plethora of open formats the new CLL can be transformed into?
> > kozmikreis
> > On 28 Jan 2012, at 00:10, Jonathan Jones wrote: > > > Not to mention the proprietary nature of the format that automatically excludes anyone without an iPad, iPod Touch, or iPhone.
> > > On Fri, Jan 27, 2012 at 3:26 PM, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk (mailto:kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk)> wrote: > > > > That is true, but is missing the point of the additional richness the proprietary iBook format allows for such as interactive multiple-choice questions, audio clips, video clips, and other learning aids that might be attractive in an enhanced version of the CLL :-)
> > > > kozmikreis
> > > > On 27 Jan 2012, at 21:32, Aaron Hawryluk wrote: > > > > > Or, if there's an html version in existence, it could just be ported to .epub with Calibre... > > > > > Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S II X. > > > > > On Jan 27, 2012 6:50 AM, "CosmicRay" <c...@cosmicray.co.uk (mailto:c...@cosmicray.co.uk)> wrote: > > > > > > Those were very much my thoughts too - that porting a regularly updated open source formatted book into a proprietary format was going to be awfully tough to keep up with. However, unlike apps, I think iBooks are static once published. Authors don't push out a v1.x update after the fact. With this in mind it's probably still worth forking the next stable CLL major version and porting it, perhaps even embedding an errata section by use of a web view that points back to the github repo in case of any major boo-boos.
> > > > > > kozmikreis
> > > > > > On 24 Jan 2012, at 02:44, Joshua Proehl wrote: > > > > > > > I was just looking into the idea of creating a CLL iBook as well! > > > > > > > The problem that I see is that iBooks Author doesn't appear to play very nicely with the idea of streaming data in from other files. Which means that it's not really possible to script "convert the source files into an iBook", but rather each change made to the source files would have to be manually made to the iBook as well. Which is going to rapidly become painful. Further looking into is required however, as it would be a truly incredible platform to use.
> > > > > > > ---- > > > > > > > Josh > > > > > > > _____________________ > > > > > > > Instead of our drab slogging forth and back to the fishing boats, there's a reason to life! We can lift ourselves out of ignorance, we can find ourselves as creatures of excellence and intelligence and skill. We can be free! We can learn to fly!
> > > > > > > On Mon, Jan 23, 2012 at 11:11, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk (mailto:kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk)> wrote: > > > > > > > > I look forward to trying that out, please let us know when it's available. It'll be good when there's finally a Lojban-specific app in the iTunes Store :-)
> > > > > > > > Regarding my conlanger meet-up app idea, I retain no rights to the idea should you or anyone else wants to implement it either solo or as a collaboration.
> > > > > > > > On a slightly related note, there's now a free iBooks Author app in the Mac App Store for authoring rich content books for iPad consumption. It looks ideal for creating and sharing educational textbooks. The CLL as an iBook would be a good place to start, once the latest changes to it have been completed - thoughts anyone?
> > > > > > > > kozmikreis
> > > > > > > > On 22 Jan 2012, at 09:13, aryrain laubels wrote: > > > > > > > > > I have written a Lojban Dictionary in pure Objective C, I am currently waiting for approval. I finished it a week or so ago but posted it today. But some other applications would be interesting.
> > > > > > > > > On Thu, Jan 19, 2012 at 9:58 AM, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk (mailto:kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk)> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > [repost, original seems to have been lost to the aether]
> > > > > > > > > > I've got an Apple iOS Developer account and would be happy to have a hand in writing a Lojban app for iOS (and Android if I can get the damn SDK and toolset stable), it's just I haven't thought of an app idea that has anything better to it than those that already exist.
> > > > > > > > > > My dev language of choice would probably be the JavaScript variant from Appcelerator, not that it's anything amazing, but it can compile to multiple platforms and takes away some of the suckage of Objective C.
> > > > > > > > > > One idea I had was perhaps a meet-up app for conlangers in general, whereby you tick the list of languages you speak or are learning to speak and perhaps your level of proficiency, and let it run in the background occasionally checking your location in to a central server. When someone else with a matching conlang interest is nearby the phone can alert you so you can meet up and say coi. Might be good for finding people to practice with?
> > > > > > > > > > kozmikreis
> > > > > > > > > > On 12 Jan 2012, at 06:27, kalsa wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > coi > > > > > > > > > > > is there any talk of making a lojbanic/lojban beginners ipod app? apps like flashcardlet are good for studying words, but i was thinking maybe a more lojban specific app would help for people who are already wanting to learn, getting to look at it on the go, or maybe to hear spoken lojban, or maybe just to make it more accessible to a wider variety of people. Just a thought. > > > > > > > > > > > co'o
> > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. > > > > > > > > To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com (mailto:lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com). > > > > > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com (mailto:lojban-beginners%2Bunsubscribe@googlegroups.com). > > > > > > > > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
> > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. > > > > > > > To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com (mailto:lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com). > > > > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com (mailto:lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com). > > > > > > > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
> > > > > > -- > > > > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. > > > > > > To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com (mailto:lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com). > > > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com (mailto:lojban-beginners%2Bunsubscribe@googlegroups.com). > > > > > > For more options, visit this group at
also I’m not really following the discussion, so what I just said may have been stupid and irrelevant. Sorry, I’ll try to refrain from commenting without reading in the future.
On Saturday, January 28, 2012 at 10:46 AM, Daniel Brockman wrote: > dude, who’s saying you would be forbidden from converting it into another format?
> On Saturday, January 28, 2012 at 10:44 AM, Jonathan Jones wrote:
> > That analogy doesn't work. Hard-copy isn't a format, is a presentation medium.
> > .epub is a format, as is .pdf. .html, .doc, .odf, etc. An e-reader is a presentation medium, as is a desktop, laptop, netbook, tablet, etc.
> > And even if we were to allow that a traditional book is both a format /and/ a presentation medium (which I don't), scanners have existed for years, and are perfectly capable of being used to transfer a book's contents to any kind of other medium's format, usually with no loss of information during the process.
> > Is there /any/ other format to which iBooks are capable of being transferred to? Can you name one format that is not only available to Apple devices to which an iBook can be converted?
> > I'm against proprietary formats in general. I honestly don't care what "wonderful" features the format may provide. There's is no way I'm buying a $800 device just to be able to access, literally, /one/ thing I couldn't otherwise. Especially since I already have a tablet, a smartphone, a laptop, and a desktop.
> > The point is, limiting distribution to noly those who have "X", means that any one who doesn't is automatically excluded. Especially for a language, /any/ kind of exclusion of people is BAD. I'm not saying I wouldn't enjoy having such features- they may be valuable, they may not, I have no opinion. What I'm saying is that whether or not such a thing exists, I /won't/ have it, because of the proprietary nature of the item. I happen to be dead set against participating in the money-vacuum that is Apple Inc. (my Android tablet has equivalent specs to the iPad 2 and is $500(!) cheaper), but my stance is the same regardless of the company behind it.
> > On Sat, Jan 28, 2012 at 1:43 AM, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk (mailto:kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk)> wrote: > > > Extending your line of reasoning, should we immediately cease distributing hard copies of the CLL because the format isn't compatible with e-readers? :-p
> > > Yes the iBook format is only compatible with a limited selection of devices, does that somehow invalidate taking advantage of the format in addition to the plethora of open formats the new CLL can be transformed into?
> > > kozmikreis
> > > On 28 Jan 2012, at 00:10, Jonathan Jones wrote: > > > > Not to mention the proprietary nature of the format that automatically excludes anyone without an iPad, iPod Touch, or iPhone.
> > > > On Fri, Jan 27, 2012 at 3:26 PM, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk (mailto:kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk)> wrote: > > > > > That is true, but is missing the point of the additional richness the proprietary iBook format allows for such as interactive multiple-choice questions, audio clips, video clips, and other learning aids that might be attractive in an enhanced version of the CLL :-)
> > > > > kozmikreis
> > > > > On 27 Jan 2012, at 21:32, Aaron Hawryluk wrote: > > > > > > Or, if there's an html version in existence, it could just be ported to .epub with Calibre... > > > > > > Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S II X. > > > > > > On Jan 27, 2012 6:50 AM, "CosmicRay" <c...@cosmicray.co.uk (mailto:c...@cosmicray.co.uk)> wrote: > > > > > > > Those were very much my thoughts too - that porting a regularly updated open source formatted book into a proprietary format was going to be awfully tough to keep up with. However, unlike apps, I think iBooks are static once published. Authors don't push out a v1.x update after the fact. With this in mind it's probably still worth forking the next stable CLL major version and porting it, perhaps even embedding an errata section by use of a web view that points back to the github repo in case of any major boo-boos.
> > > > > > > kozmikreis
> > > > > > > On 24 Jan 2012, at 02:44, Joshua Proehl wrote: > > > > > > > > I was just looking into the idea of creating a CLL iBook as well! > > > > > > > > The problem that I see is that iBooks Author doesn't appear to play very nicely with the idea of streaming data in from other files. Which means that it's not really possible to script "convert the source files into an iBook", but rather each change made to the source files would have to be manually made to the iBook as well. Which is going to rapidly become painful. Further looking into is required however, as it would be a truly incredible platform to use.
> > > > > > > > ---- > > > > > > > > Josh > > > > > > > > _____________________ > > > > > > > > Instead of our drab slogging forth and back to the fishing boats, there's a reason to life! We can lift ourselves out of ignorance, we can find ourselves as creatures of excellence and intelligence and skill. We can be free! We can learn to fly!
> > > > > > > > On Mon, Jan 23, 2012 at 11:11, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk (mailto:kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk)> wrote: > > > > > > > > > I look forward to trying that out, please let us know when it's available. It'll be good when there's finally a Lojban-specific app in the iTunes Store :-)
> > > > > > > > > Regarding my conlanger meet-up app idea, I retain no rights to the idea should you or anyone else wants to implement it either solo or as a collaboration.
> > > > > > > > > On a slightly related note, there's now a free iBooks Author app in the Mac App Store for authoring rich content books for iPad consumption. It looks ideal for creating and sharing educational textbooks. The CLL as an iBook would be a good place to start, once the latest changes to it have been completed - thoughts anyone?
> > > > > > > > > kozmikreis
> > > > > > > > > On 22 Jan 2012, at 09:13, aryrain laubels wrote: > > > > > > > > > > I have written a Lojban Dictionary in pure Objective C, I am currently waiting for approval. I finished it a week or so ago but posted it today. But some other applications would be interesting.
> > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Jan 19, 2012 at 9:58 AM, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk (mailto:kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk)> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > [repost, original seems to have been lost to the aether]
> > > > > > > > > > > I've got an Apple iOS Developer account and would be happy to have a hand in writing a Lojban app for iOS (and Android if I can get the damn SDK and toolset stable), it's just I haven't thought of an app idea that has anything better to it than those that already exist.
> > > > > > > > > > > My dev language of choice would probably be the JavaScript variant from Appcelerator, not that it's anything amazing, but it can compile to multiple platforms and takes away some of the suckage of Objective C.
> > > > > > > > > > > One idea I had was perhaps a meet-up app for conlangers in general, whereby you tick the list of languages you speak or are learning to speak and perhaps your level of proficiency, and let it run in the background occasionally checking your location in to a central server. When someone else with a matching conlang interest is nearby the phone can alert you so you can meet up and say coi. Might be good for finding people to practice with?
> > > > > > > > > > > kozmikreis
> > > > > > > > > > > On 12 Jan 2012, at 06:27, kalsa wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > coi > > > > > > > > > > > > is there any talk of making a lojbanic/lojban beginners ipod app? apps like flashcardlet are good for studying words, but i was thinking maybe a more lojban specific app would help for people who are already wanting to learn, getting to look at it on the go, or maybe to hear spoken lojban, or maybe just to make it more accessible to a wider variety of people. Just a thought. > > > > > > > > > > > > co'o
> > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. > > > > > > > > > To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com (mailto:lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com). > > > > > > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com (mailto:lojban-beginners%2Bunsubscribe@googlegroups.com (mailto:2Bunsubscribe@googlegroups.com)). > > > > > > > > > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
> > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. > > > > > > > > To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com (mailto:lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com). > > > > > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com (mailto:lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com). > > > > > > > > For more
> dude, who’s saying you would be forbidden from converting it into another > format?
> On Saturday, January 28, 2012 at 10:44 AM, Jonathan Jones wrote:
> > That analogy doesn't work. Hard-copy isn't a format, is a presentation > medium.
> > .epub is a format, as is .pdf. .html, .doc, .odf, etc. An e-reader is a > presentation medium, as is a desktop, laptop, netbook, tablet, etc.
> > And even if we were to allow that a traditional book is both a format > /and/ a presentation medium (which I don't), scanners have existed for > years, and are perfectly capable of being used to transfer a book's > contents to any kind of other medium's format, usually with no loss of > information during the process.
> > Is there /any/ other format to which iBooks are capable of being > transferred to? Can you name one format that is not only available to Apple > devices to which an iBook can be converted?
> > I'm against proprietary formats in general. I honestly don't care what > "wonderful" features the format may provide. There's is no way I'm buying a > $800 device just to be able to access, literally, /one/ thing I couldn't > otherwise. Especially since I already have a tablet, a smartphone, a > laptop, and a desktop.
> > The point is, limiting distribution to noly those who have "X", means > that any one who doesn't is automatically excluded. Especially for a > language, /any/ kind of exclusion of people is BAD. I'm not saying I > wouldn't enjoy having such features- they may be valuable, they may not, I > have no opinion. What I'm saying is that whether or not such a thing > exists, I /won't/ have it, because of the proprietary nature of the item. I > happen to be dead set against participating in the money-vacuum that is > Apple Inc. (my Android tablet has equivalent specs to the iPad 2 and is > $500(!) cheaper), but my stance is the same regardless of the company > behind it.
> > On Sat, Jan 28, 2012 at 1:43 AM, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk(mailto: > kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk)> wrote: > > > Extending your line of reasoning, should we immediately cease > distributing hard copies of the CLL because the format isn't compatible > with e-readers? :-p
> > > Yes the iBook format is only compatible with a limited selection of > devices, does that somehow invalidate taking advantage of the format in > addition to the plethora of open formats the new CLL can be transformed > into?
> > > kozmikreis
> > > On 28 Jan 2012, at 00:10, Jonathan Jones wrote: > > > > Not to mention the proprietary nature of the format that > automatically excludes anyone without an iPad, iPod Touch, or iPhone.
> > > > On Fri, Jan 27, 2012 at 3:26 PM, kozmikreis < > kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk (mailto:kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk)> wrote: > > > > > That is true, but is missing the point of the additional richness > the proprietary iBook format allows for such as interactive multiple-choice > questions, audio clips, video clips, and other learning aids that might be > attractive in an enhanced version of the CLL :-)
> > > > > kozmikreis
> > > > > On 27 Jan 2012, at 21:32, Aaron Hawryluk wrote: > > > > > > Or, if there's an html version in existence, it could just be > ported to .epub with Calibre... > > > > > > Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S II X. > > > > > > On Jan 27, 2012 6:50 AM, "CosmicRay" <c...@cosmicray.co.uk(mailto: > c...@cosmicray.co.uk)> wrote: > > > > > > > Those were very much my thoughts too - that porting a > regularly updated open source formatted book into a proprietary format was > going to be awfully tough to keep up with. However, unlike apps, I think > iBooks are static once published. Authors don't push out a v1.x update > after the fact. With this in mind it's probably still worth forking the > next stable CLL major version and porting it, perhaps even embedding an > errata section by use of a web view that points back to the github repo in > case of any major boo-boos.
> > > > > > > kozmikreis
> > > > > > > On 24 Jan 2012, at 02:44, Joshua Proehl wrote: > > > > > > > > I was just looking into the idea of creating a CLL iBook as > well! > > > > > > > > The problem that I see is that iBooks Author doesn't appear > to play very nicely with the idea of streaming data in from other files. > Which means that it's not really possible to script "convert the source > files into an iBook", but rather each change made to the source files would > have to be manually made to the iBook as well. Which is going to rapidly > become painful. Further looking into is required however, as it would be a > truly incredible platform to use.
> > > > > > > > ---- > > > > > > > > Josh > > > > > > > > _____________________ > > > > > > > > Instead of our drab slogging forth and back to the fishing > boats, there's a reason to life! We can lift ourselves out of ignorance, we > can find ourselves as creatures of excellence and intelligence and skill. > We can be free! We can learn to fly!
> > > > > > > > On Mon, Jan 23, 2012 at 11:11, kozmikreis < > kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk (mailto:kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk)> wrote: > > > > > > > > > I look forward to trying that out, please let us know when > it's available. It'll be good when there's finally a Lojban-specific app in > the iTunes Store :-)
> > > > > > > > > Regarding my conlanger meet-up app idea, I retain no > rights to the idea should you or anyone else wants to implement it either > solo or as a collaboration.
> > > > > > > > > On a slightly related note, there's now a free iBooks > Author app in the Mac App Store for authoring rich content books for iPad > consumption. It looks ideal for creating and sharing educational textbooks. > The CLL as an iBook would be a good place to start, once the latest changes > to it have been completed - thoughts anyone?
> > > > > > > > > kozmikreis
> > > > > > > > > On 22 Jan 2012, at 09:13, aryrain laubels wrote: > > > > > > > > > > I have written a Lojban Dictionary in pure Objective C, > I am currently waiting for approval. I finished it a week or so ago but > posted it today. But some other applications would be interesting.
> > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Jan 19, 2012 at 9:58 AM, kozmikreis < > kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk (mailto:kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk)> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > [repost, original seems to have been lost to the > aether]
> > > > > > > > > > > I've got an Apple iOS Developer account and would be > happy to have a hand in writing a Lojban app for iOS (and Android if I can > get the damn SDK and toolset stable), it's just I haven't thought of an app > idea that has anything better to it than those that already exist.
> > > > > > > > > > > My dev language of choice would probably be the > JavaScript variant from Appcelerator, not that it's anything amazing, but > it can compile to multiple platforms and takes away some of the suckage of > Objective C.
> > > > > > > > > > > One idea I had was perhaps a meet-up app for > conlangers in general, whereby you tick the list of languages you speak or > are learning to speak and perhaps your level of proficiency, and let it run > in the background occasionally checking your location in to a central > server. When someone else with a matching conlang interest is nearby the > phone can alert you so you can meet up and say coi. Might be good for > finding people to practice with?
> > > > > > > > > > > kozmikreis
> > > > > > > > > > > On 12 Jan 2012, at 06:27, kalsa wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > coi > > > > > > > > > > > > is there any talk of making a lojbanic/lojban > beginners ipod app? apps like flashcardlet are good for studying words, but > i was thinking maybe a more lojban specific app would help for people who > are already wanting to learn, getting to look at it on the go, or maybe to > hear spoken lojban, or maybe just to make it more accessible to a wider > variety of people. Just a thought. > > > > > > > > > > > > co'o
> > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to > the Google Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. > > > > > > > > > To post to this group, send email to > lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com (mailto: > lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com). > > > > > > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com (mailto: > lojban-beginners%2Bunsubscribe@googlegroups.com). > > > > > > > > > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
> > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the > Google Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. > > > > > > > > To post to this group, send email to > lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com (mailto: > lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com). > > > > > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com (mailto: > lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com). > > > > > > > > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
Well, personally I think the hard part would be actually creating the content. Or whatever we are talking about. Converting between formats is usually the easy part of a creative endeavor. Is all I’m saying. *quaffs another AAPL Kool-Aid*
On Saturday, January 28, 2012 at 10:49 AM, Jonathan Jones wrote: > It's not a question of "allowed". It's a question of "can".
> On Sat, Jan 28, 2012 at 2:46 AM, Daniel Brockman <dbrock...@gmail.com (mailto:dbrock...@gmail.com)> wrote: > > dude, who’s saying you would be forbidden from converting it into another format?
> > On Saturday, January 28, 2012 at 10:44 AM, Jonathan Jones wrote:
> > > That analogy doesn't work. Hard-copy isn't a format, is a presentation medium.
> > > .epub is a format, as is .pdf. .html, .doc, .odf, etc. An e-reader is a presentation medium, as is a desktop, laptop, netbook, tablet, etc.
> > > And even if we were to allow that a traditional book is both a format /and/ a presentation medium (which I don't), scanners have existed for years, and are perfectly capable of being used to transfer a book's contents to any kind of other medium's format, usually with no loss of information during the process.
> > > Is there /any/ other format to which iBooks are capable of being transferred to? Can you name one format that is not only available to Apple devices to which an iBook can be converted?
> > > I'm against proprietary formats in general. I honestly don't care what "wonderful" features the format may provide. There's is no way I'm buying a $800 device just to be able to access, literally, /one/ thing I couldn't otherwise. Especially since I already have a tablet, a smartphone, a laptop, and a desktop.
> > > The point is, limiting distribution to noly those who have "X", means that any one who doesn't is automatically excluded. Especially for a language, /any/ kind of exclusion of people is BAD. I'm not saying I wouldn't enjoy having such features- they may be valuable, they may not, I have no opinion. What I'm saying is that whether or not such a thing exists, I /won't/ have it, because of the proprietary nature of the item. I happen to be dead set against participating in the money-vacuum that is Apple Inc. (my Android tablet has equivalent specs to the iPad 2 and is $500(!) cheaper), but my stance is the same regardless of the company behind it.
> > > On Sat, Jan 28, 2012 at 1:43 AM, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk (mailto:kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk) (mailto:kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk)> wrote: > > > > Extending your line of reasoning, should we immediately cease distributing hard copies of the CLL because the format isn't compatible with e-readers? :-p
> > > > Yes the iBook format is only compatible with a limited selection of devices, does that somehow invalidate taking advantage of the format in addition to the plethora of open formats the new CLL can be transformed into?
> > > > kozmikreis
> > > > On 28 Jan 2012, at 00:10, Jonathan Jones wrote: > > > > > Not to mention the proprietary nature of the format that automatically excludes anyone without an iPad, iPod Touch, or iPhone.
> > > > > On Fri, Jan 27, 2012 at 3:26 PM, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk (mailto:kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk) (mailto:kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk)> wrote: > > > > > > That is true, but is missing the point of the additional richness the proprietary iBook format allows for such as interactive multiple-choice questions, audio clips, video clips, and other learning aids that might be attractive in an enhanced version of the CLL :-)
> > > > > > kozmikreis
> > > > > > On 27 Jan 2012, at 21:32, Aaron Hawryluk wrote: > > > > > > > Or, if there's an html version in existence, it could just be ported to .epub with Calibre... > > > > > > > Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S II X. > > > > > > > On Jan 27, 2012 6:50 AM, "CosmicRay" <c...@cosmicray.co.uk (mailto:c...@cosmicray.co.uk) (mailto:c...@cosmicray.co.uk)> wrote: > > > > > > > > Those were very much my thoughts too - that porting a regularly updated open source formatted book into a proprietary format was going to be awfully tough to keep up with. However, unlike apps, I think iBooks are static once published. Authors don't push out a v1.x update after the fact. With this in mind it's probably still worth forking the next stable CLL major version and porting it, perhaps even embedding an errata section by use of a web view that points back to the github repo in case of any major boo-boos.
> > > > > > > > kozmikreis
> > > > > > > > On 24 Jan 2012, at 02:44, Joshua Proehl wrote: > > > > > > > > > I was just looking into the idea of creating a CLL iBook as well! > > > > > > > > > The problem that I see is that iBooks Author doesn't appear to play very nicely with the idea of streaming data in from other files. Which means that it's not really possible to script "convert the source files into an iBook", but rather each change made to the source files would have to be manually made to the iBook as well. Which is going to rapidly become painful. Further looking into is required however, as it would be a truly incredible platform to use.
> > > > > > > > > ---- > > > > > > > > > Josh > > > > > > > > > _____________________ > > > > > > > > > Instead of our drab slogging forth and back to the fishing boats, there's a reason to life! We can lift ourselves out of ignorance, we can find ourselves as creatures of excellence and intelligence and skill. We can be free! We can learn to fly!
> > > > > > > > > On Mon, Jan 23, 2012 at 11:11, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk (mailto:kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk) (mailto:kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk)> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > I look forward to trying that out, please let us know when it's available. It'll be good when there's finally a Lojban-specific app in the iTunes Store :-)
> > > > > > > > > > Regarding my conlanger meet-up app idea, I retain no rights to the idea should you or anyone else wants to implement it either solo or as a collaboration.
> > > > > > > > > > On a slightly related note, there's now a free iBooks Author app in the Mac App Store for authoring rich content books for iPad consumption. It looks ideal for creating and sharing educational textbooks. The CLL as an iBook would be a good place to start, once the latest changes to it have been completed - thoughts anyone?
> > > > > > > > > > kozmikreis
> > > > > > > > > > On 22 Jan 2012, at 09:13, aryrain laubels wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > I have written a Lojban Dictionary in pure Objective C, I am currently waiting for approval. I finished it a week or so ago but posted it today. But some other applications would be interesting.
> > > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Jan 19, 2012 at 9:58 AM, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk (mailto:kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk) (mailto:kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk)> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > [repost, original seems to have been lost to the aether]
> > > > > > > > > > > > I've got an Apple iOS Developer account and would be happy to have a hand in writing a Lojban app for iOS (and Android if I can get the damn SDK and toolset stable), it's just I haven't thought of an app idea that has anything better to it than those that already exist.
> > > > > > > > > > > > My dev language of choice would probably be the JavaScript variant from Appcelerator, not that it's anything amazing, but it can compile to multiple platforms and takes away some of the suckage of Objective C.
> > > > > > > > > > > > One idea I had was perhaps a meet-up app for conlangers in general, whereby you tick the list of languages you speak or are learning to speak and perhaps your level of proficiency, and let it run in the background occasionally checking your location in to a central server. When someone else with a matching conlang interest is nearby the phone can alert you so you can meet up and say coi. Might be good for finding people to practice with?
> > > > > > > > > > > > kozmikreis
> > > > > > > > > > > > On 12 Jan 2012, at 06:27, kalsa wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > coi > > > > > > > > > > > > > is there any talk of making a lojbanic/lojban beginners ipod app? apps like flashcardlet are good for studying words, but i was thinking maybe a more lojban specific app would help for people who are already wanting to learn, getting to look at it on the go, or maybe to hear spoken lojban, or maybe just to make it more accessible to a wider variety of people. Just a thought. > > > > > > > > > > > > > co'o
> > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. > > > > > > > > > > To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com (mailto:lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com) (mailto:lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com). > > > > > > > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com (mailto:lojban-beginners%2Bunsubscribe@googlegroups.com) (mailto:lojban-beginners%2Bunsubscribe@googlegroups.com
This is the point I'm trying to get across, politics and pro- vs anti-proprietary arguments (however valid) aside - the suggestion to use a closed format _in_addition_ to the open formats is not an exercise in exclusivity. Far from it. I believe it's in the common interest to have the CLL available to as wide an audience as possible, and should conversion to proprietary formats _in_addition_ to the open formats be non-detrimental to the CLL's availability which clearly in this case it wouldn't be, then why not?
You make a case for not purchasing a closed-format consumption device based on its feature set. Good for you, I applaud your stance even though personally I'm (currently) an Apple fan. To answer your question, no I cannot name another format an iBook can be transferred to whether it is an Apple-exclusive format or not. As far as I know it is completely closed. I don't see the relevance of this point though. The CLL source files are, and would remain, open.
> dude, who’s saying you would be forbidden from converting it into another format?
> On Saturday, January 28, 2012 at 10:44 AM, Jonathan Jones wrote:
>> That analogy doesn't work. Hard-copy isn't a format, is a presentation medium.
>> .epub is a format, as is .pdf. .html, .doc, .odf, etc. An e-reader is a presentation medium, as is a desktop, laptop, netbook, tablet, etc.
>> And even if we were to allow that a traditional book is both a format /and/ a presentation medium (which I don't), scanners have existed for years, and are perfectly capable of being used to transfer a book's contents to any kind of other medium's format, usually with no loss of information during the process.
>> Is there /any/ other format to which iBooks are capable of being transferred to? Can you name one format that is not only available to Apple devices to which an iBook can be converted?
>> I'm against proprietary formats in general. I honestly don't care what "wonderful" features the format may provide. There's is no way I'm buying a $800 device just to be able to access, literally, /one/ thing I couldn't otherwise. Especially since I already have a tablet, a smartphone, a laptop, and a desktop.
>> The point is, limiting distribution to noly those who have "X", means that any one who doesn't is automatically excluded. Especially for a language, /any/ kind of exclusion of people is BAD. I'm not saying I wouldn't enjoy having such features- they may be valuable, they may not, I have no opinion. What I'm saying is that whether or not such a thing exists, I /won't/ have it, because of the proprietary nature of the item. I happen to be dead set against participating in the money-vacuum that is Apple Inc. (my Android tablet has equivalent specs to the iPad 2 and is $500(!) cheaper), but my stance is the same regardless of the company behind it.
>> On Sat, Jan 28, 2012 at 1:43 AM, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk (mailto:kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk)> wrote: >>> Extending your line of reasoning, should we immediately cease distributing hard copies of the CLL because the format isn't compatible with e-readers? :-p
>>> Yes the iBook format is only compatible with a limited selection of devices, does that somehow invalidate taking advantage of the format in addition to the plethora of open formats the new CLL can be transformed into?
>>> kozmikreis
>>> On 28 Jan 2012, at 00:10, Jonathan Jones wrote: >>>> Not to mention the proprietary nature of the format that automatically excludes anyone without an iPad, iPod Touch, or iPhone.
>>>> On Fri, Jan 27, 2012 at 3:26 PM, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk (mailto:kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk)> wrote: >>>>> That is true, but is missing the point of the additional richness the proprietary iBook format allows for such as interactive multiple-choice questions, audio clips, video clips, and other learning aids that might be attractive in an enhanced version of the CLL :-)
>>>>> kozmikreis
>>>>> On 27 Jan 2012, at 21:32, Aaron Hawryluk wrote: >>>>>> Or, if there's an html version in existence, it could just be ported to .epub with Calibre... >>>>>> Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S II X. >>>>>> On Jan 27, 2012 6:50 AM, "CosmicRay" <c...@cosmicray.co.uk (mailto:c...@cosmicray.co.uk)> wrote: >>>>>>> Those were very much my thoughts too - that porting a regularly updated open source formatted book into a proprietary format was going to be awfully tough to keep up with. However, unlike apps, I think iBooks are static once published. Authors don't push out a v1.x update after the fact. With this in mind it's probably still worth forking the next stable CLL major version and porting it, perhaps even embedding an errata section by use of a web view that points back to the github repo in case of any major boo-boos.
>>>>>>> kozmikreis
>>>>>>> On 24 Jan 2012, at 02:44, Joshua Proehl wrote: >>>>>>>> I was just looking into the idea of creating a CLL iBook as well! >>>>>>>> The problem that I see is that iBooks Author doesn't appear to play very nicely with the idea of streaming data in from other files. Which means that it's not really possible to script "convert the source files into an iBook", but rather each change made to the source files would have to be manually made to the iBook as well. Which is going to rapidly become painful. Further looking into is required however, as it would be a truly incredible platform to use.
>>>>>>>> ---- >>>>>>>> Josh >>>>>>>> _____________________ >>>>>>>> Instead of our drab slogging forth and back to the fishing boats, there's a reason to life! We can lift ourselves out of ignorance, we can find ourselves as creatures of excellence and intelligence and skill. We can be free! We can learn to fly!
>>>>>>>> — Richard Bach, 'Jonathan Livingston Seagull,' 1970.
>>>>>>>> On Mon, Jan 23, 2012 at 11:11, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk (mailto:kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk)> wrote: >>>>>>>>> I look forward to trying that out, please let us know when it's available. It'll be good when there's finally a Lojban-specific app in the iTunes Store :-)
>>>>>>>>> Regarding my conlanger meet-up app idea, I retain no rights to the idea should you or anyone else wants to implement it either solo or as a collaboration.
>>>>>>>>> On a slightly related note, there's now a free iBooks Author app in the Mac App Store for authoring rich content books for iPad consumption. It looks ideal for creating and sharing educational textbooks. The CLL as an iBook would be a good place to start, once the latest changes to it have been completed - thoughts anyone?
>>>>>>>>> kozmikreis
>>>>>>>>> On 22 Jan 2012, at 09:13, aryrain laubels wrote: >>>>>>>>>> I have written a Lojban Dictionary in pure Objective C, I am currently waiting for approval. I finished it a week or so ago but posted it today. But some other applications would be interesting.
>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Jan 19, 2012 at 9:58 AM, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk (mailto:kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk)> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> [repost, original seems to have been lost to the aether]
>>>>>>>>>>> I've got an Apple iOS Developer account and would be happy to have a hand in writing a Lojban app for iOS (and Android if I can get the damn SDK and toolset stable), it's just I haven't thought of an app idea that has anything better to it than those that already exist.
>>>>>>>>>>> My dev language of choice would probably be the JavaScript variant from Appcelerator, not that it's anything amazing, but it can compile to multiple platforms and takes away some of the suckage of Objective C.
>>>>>>>>>>> One idea I had was perhaps a meet-up app for conlangers in general, whereby you tick the list of languages you speak or are learning to speak and perhaps your level of proficiency, and let it run in the background occasionally checking your location in to a central server. When someone else with a matching conlang interest is nearby the phone can alert you so you can meet up and say coi. Might be good for finding people to practice with?
>>>>>>>>>>> kozmikreis
>>>>>>>>>>> On 12 Jan 2012, at 06:27, kalsa wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>> coi >>>>>>>>>>>> is there any talk of making a lojbanic/lojban beginners ipod app? apps like flashcardlet are good for studying words, but i was thinking maybe a more lojban specific app would help for people who are already wanting to learn, getting to look at it on the go, or maybe to hear spoken lojban, or maybe just to make it more accessible to a wider variety of people. Just a thought. >>>>>>>>>>>> co'o
>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. >>>>>>>>> To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com (mailto:lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com). >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com (mailto:lojban-beginners%2Bunsubscribe@googlegroups.com). >>>>>>>>> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. >>>>>>>> To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com (mailto:lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com). >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com (mailto:lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com). >>>>>>>> For more options, visit this group at
On Saturday, January 28, 2012 at 11:04 AM, kozmikreis wrote: > This is the point I'm trying to get across, politics and pro- vs anti-proprietary arguments (however valid) aside - the suggestion to use a closed format _in_addition_ to the open formats is not an exercise in exclusivity. Far from it. I believe it's in the common interest to have the CLL available to as wide an audience as possible, and should conversion to proprietary formats _in_addition_ to the open formats be non-detrimental to the CLL's availability which clearly in this case it wouldn't be, then why not?
> You make a case for not purchasing a closed-format consumption device based on its feature set. Good for you, I applaud your stance even though personally I'm (currently) an Apple fan. To answer your question, no I cannot name another format an iBook can be transferred to whether it is an Apple-exclusive format or not. As far as I know it is completely closed. I don't see the relevance of this point though. The CLL source files are, and would remain, open.
> kozmikreis
> On 28 Jan 2012, at 09:46, Daniel Brockman wrote:
> > dude, who’s saying you would be forbidden from converting it into another format?
> > On Saturday, January 28, 2012 at 10:44 AM, Jonathan Jones wrote:
> > > That analogy doesn't work. Hard-copy isn't a format, is a presentation medium.
> > > .epub is a format, as is .pdf. .html, .doc, .odf, etc. An e-reader is a presentation medium, as is a desktop, laptop, netbook, tablet, etc.
> > > And even if we were to allow that a traditional book is both a format /and/ a presentation medium (which I don't), scanners have existed for years, and are perfectly capable of being used to transfer a book's contents to any kind of other medium's format, usually with no loss of information during the process.
> > > Is there /any/ other format to which iBooks are capable of being transferred to? Can you name one format that is not only available to Apple devices to which an iBook can be converted?
> > > I'm against proprietary formats in general. I honestly don't care what "wonderful" features the format may provide. There's is no way I'm buying a $800 device just to be able to access, literally, /one/ thing I couldn't otherwise. Especially since I already have a tablet, a smartphone, a laptop, and a desktop.
> > > The point is, limiting distribution to noly those who have "X", means that any one who doesn't is automatically excluded. Especially for a language, /any/ kind of exclusion of people is BAD. I'm not saying I wouldn't enjoy having such features- they may be valuable, they may not, I have no opinion. What I'm saying is that whether or not such a thing exists, I /won't/ have it, because of the proprietary nature of the item. I happen to be dead set against participating in the money-vacuum that is Apple Inc. (my Android tablet has equivalent specs to the iPad 2 and is $500(!) cheaper), but my stance is the same regardless of the company behind it.
> > > On Sat, Jan 28, 2012 at 1:43 AM, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk (mailto:kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk)> wrote: > > > > Extending your line of reasoning, should we immediately cease distributing hard copies of the CLL because the format isn't compatible with e-readers? :-p
> > > > Yes the iBook format is only compatible with a limited selection of devices, does that somehow invalidate taking advantage of the format in addition to the plethora of open formats the new CLL can be transformed into?
> > > > kozmikreis
> > > > On 28 Jan 2012, at 00:10, Jonathan Jones wrote: > > > > > Not to mention the proprietary nature of the format that automatically excludes anyone without an iPad, iPod Touch, or iPhone.
> > > > > On Fri, Jan 27, 2012 at 3:26 PM, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk (mailto:kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk)> wrote: > > > > > > That is true, but is missing the point of the additional richness the proprietary iBook format allows for such as interactive multiple-choice questions, audio clips, video clips, and other learning aids that might be attractive in an enhanced version of the CLL :-)
> > > > > > kozmikreis
> > > > > > On 27 Jan 2012, at 21:32, Aaron Hawryluk wrote: > > > > > > > Or, if there's an html version in existence, it could just be ported to .epub with Calibre... > > > > > > > Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S II X. > > > > > > > On Jan 27, 2012 6:50 AM, "CosmicRay" <c...@cosmicray.co.uk (mailto:c...@cosmicray.co.uk)> wrote: > > > > > > > > Those were very much my thoughts too - that porting a regularly updated open source formatted book into a proprietary format was going to be awfully tough to keep up with. However, unlike apps, I think iBooks are static once published. Authors don't push out a v1.x update after the fact. With this in mind it's probably still worth forking the next stable CLL major version and porting it, perhaps even embedding an errata section by use of a web view that points back to the github repo in case of any major boo-boos.
> > > > > > > > kozmikreis
> > > > > > > > On 24 Jan 2012, at 02:44, Joshua Proehl wrote: > > > > > > > > > I was just looking into the idea of creating a CLL iBook as well! > > > > > > > > > The problem that I see is that iBooks Author doesn't appear to play very nicely with the idea of streaming data in from other files. Which means that it's not really possible to script "convert the source files into an iBook", but rather each change made to the source files would have to be manually made to the iBook as well. Which is going to rapidly become painful. Further looking into is required however, as it would be a truly incredible platform to use.
> > > > > > > > > ---- > > > > > > > > > Josh > > > > > > > > > _____________________ > > > > > > > > > Instead of our drab slogging forth and back to the fishing boats, there's a reason to life! We can lift ourselves out of ignorance, we can find ourselves as creatures of excellence and intelligence and skill. We can be free! We can learn to fly!
> > > > > > > > > On Mon, Jan 23, 2012 at 11:11, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk (mailto:kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk)> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > I look forward to trying that out, please let us know when it's available. It'll be good when there's finally a Lojban-specific app in the iTunes Store :-)
> > > > > > > > > > Regarding my conlanger meet-up app idea, I retain no rights to the idea should you or anyone else wants to implement it either solo or as a collaboration.
> > > > > > > > > > On a slightly related note, there's now a free iBooks Author app in the Mac App Store for authoring rich content books for iPad consumption. It looks ideal for creating and sharing educational textbooks. The CLL as an iBook would be a good place to start, once the latest changes to it have been completed - thoughts anyone?
> > > > > > > > > > kozmikreis
> > > > > > > > > > On 22 Jan 2012, at 09:13, aryrain laubels wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > I have written a Lojban Dictionary in pure Objective C, I am currently waiting for approval. I finished it a week or so ago but posted it today. But some other applications would be interesting.
> > > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Jan 19, 2012 at 9:58 AM, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk (mailto:kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk)> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > [repost, original seems to have been lost to the aether]
> > > > > > > > > > > > I've got an Apple iOS Developer account and would be happy to have a hand in writing a Lojban app for iOS (and Android if I can get the damn SDK and toolset stable), it's just I haven't thought of an app idea that has anything better to it than those that already exist.
> > > > > > > > > > > > My dev language of choice would probably be the JavaScript variant from Appcelerator, not that it's anything amazing, but it can compile to multiple platforms and takes away some of the suckage of Objective C.
> > > > > > > > > > > > One idea I had was perhaps a meet-up app for conlangers in general, whereby you tick the list of languages you speak or are learning to speak and perhaps your level of proficiency, and let it run in the background occasionally checking your location in to a central server. When someone else with a matching conlang interest is nearby the phone can alert you so you can meet up and say coi. Might be good for finding people to practice with?
> > > > > > > > > > > > kozmikreis
> > > > > > > > > > > > On 12 Jan 2012, at 06:27, kalsa wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > coi > > > > > > > > > > > > > is there any talk of making a lojbanic/lojban beginners ipod app? apps like flashcardlet are good for studying words, but i was thinking maybe a more lojban specific app would help for people who are already wanting to learn, getting to look at it on the go, or maybe to hear spoken lojban, or maybe just to make it more accessible to a wider variety of people. Just a thought. > > > > > > > > > > > > > co'o
I'd be in favour of a conversion with some additions like pretty colour pictures, audio samples and multiple-choice questions. Ideally these would be added into the open version of the CLL first as static features (perhaps the audio samples could be in the form of absolute URLs to files on lojban.org) and then enlivened in the iBlah version by use of the appropriate widgets.
> Oh, it’s not even that you’re going to create anything on the iBlah. You’re just converting the CLL into it? Haha, then that’s a no-brainer, I think.
I was addressing specifically the things you were talking about /adding to/ the proposed iBook (the "interactive multiple-choice questions, audio clips, video clips, and other learning aids") that would /not/ be available in any other format.
iPads can read pdfs. The CLL can be exported to pdf (IIRC). If you're not wanting to use the "special" featuresof iBooks, there's no need to make an iBook CLL. If you are, then you're making something that will /not/ be available by any other means.
On Sat, Jan 28, 2012 at 3:04 AM, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk>wrote:
> This is the point I'm trying to get across, politics and pro- vs > anti-proprietary arguments (however valid) aside - the suggestion to use a > closed format _in_addition_ to the open formats is not an exercise in > exclusivity. Far from it. I believe it's in the common interest to have > the CLL available to as wide an audience as possible, and should conversion > to proprietary formats _in_addition_ to the open formats be non-detrimental > to the CLL's availability which clearly in this case it wouldn't be, then > why not?
> You make a case for not purchasing a closed-format consumption device > based on its feature set. Good for you, I applaud your stance even though > personally I'm (currently) an Apple fan. To answer your question, no I > cannot name another format an iBook can be transferred to whether it is an > Apple-exclusive format or not. As far as I know it is completely closed. > I don't see the relevance of this point though. The CLL source files are, > and would remain, open.
> kozmikreis
> On 28 Jan 2012, at 09:46, Daniel Brockman wrote:
> > dude, who’s saying you would be forbidden from converting it into > another format?
> > On Saturday, January 28, 2012 at 10:44 AM, Jonathan Jones wrote:
> >> That analogy doesn't work. Hard-copy isn't a format, is a presentation > medium.
> >> .epub is a format, as is .pdf. .html, .doc, .odf, etc. An e-reader is a > presentation medium, as is a desktop, laptop, netbook, tablet, etc.
> >> And even if we were to allow that a traditional book is both a format > /and/ a presentation medium (which I don't), scanners have existed for > years, and are perfectly capable of being used to transfer a book's > contents to any kind of other medium's format, usually with no loss of > information during the process.
> >> Is there /any/ other format to which iBooks are capable of being > transferred to? Can you name one format that is not only available to Apple > devices to which an iBook can be converted?
> >> I'm against proprietary formats in general. I honestly don't care what > "wonderful" features the format may provide. There's is no way I'm buying a > $800 device just to be able to access, literally, /one/ thing I couldn't > otherwise. Especially since I already have a tablet, a smartphone, a > laptop, and a desktop.
> >> The point is, limiting distribution to noly those who have "X", means > that any one who doesn't is automatically excluded. Especially for a > language, /any/ kind of exclusion of people is BAD. I'm not saying I > wouldn't enjoy having such features- they may be valuable, they may not, I > have no opinion. What I'm saying is that whether or not such a thing > exists, I /won't/ have it, because of the proprietary nature of the item. I > happen to be dead set against participating in the money-vacuum that is > Apple Inc. (my Android tablet has equivalent specs to the iPad 2 and is > $500(!) cheaper), but my stance is the same regardless of the company > behind it.
> >> On Sat, Jan 28, 2012 at 1:43 AM, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk(mailto: > kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk)> wrote: > >>> Extending your line of reasoning, should we immediately cease > distributing hard copies of the CLL because the format isn't compatible > with e-readers? :-p
> >>> Yes the iBook format is only compatible with a limited selection of > devices, does that somehow invalidate taking advantage of the format in > addition to the plethora of open formats the new CLL can be transformed > into?
> >>> kozmikreis
> >>> On 28 Jan 2012, at 00:10, Jonathan Jones wrote: > >>>> Not to mention the proprietary nature of the format that > automatically excludes anyone without an iPad, iPod Touch, or iPhone.
> >>>> On Fri, Jan 27, 2012 at 3:26 PM, kozmikreis <kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk(mailto: > kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk)> wrote: > >>>>> That is true, but is missing the point of the additional richness > the proprietary iBook format allows for such as interactive multiple-choice > questions, audio clips, video clips, and other learning aids that might be > attractive in an enhanced version of the CLL :-)
> >>>>> kozmikreis
> >>>>> On 27 Jan 2012, at 21:32, Aaron Hawryluk wrote: > >>>>>> Or, if there's an html version in existence, it could just be > ported to .epub with Calibre... > >>>>>> Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S II X. > >>>>>> On Jan 27, 2012 6:50 AM, "CosmicRay" <c...@cosmicray.co.uk (mailto: > c...@cosmicray.co.uk)> wrote: > >>>>>>> Those were very much my thoughts too - that porting a regularly > updated open source formatted book into a proprietary format was going to > be awfully tough to keep up with. However, unlike apps, I think iBooks are > static once published. Authors don't push out a v1.x update after the fact. > With this in mind it's probably still worth forking the next stable CLL > major version and porting it, perhaps even embedding an errata section by > use of a web view that points back to the github repo in case of any major > boo-boos.
> >>>>>>> kozmikreis
> >>>>>>> On 24 Jan 2012, at 02:44, Joshua Proehl wrote: > >>>>>>>> I was just looking into the idea of creating a CLL iBook as well! > >>>>>>>> The problem that I see is that iBooks Author doesn't appear to > play very nicely with the idea of streaming data in from other files. Which > means that it's not really possible to script "convert the source files > into an iBook", but rather each change made to the source files would have > to be manually made to the iBook as well. Which is going to rapidly become > painful. Further looking into is required however, as it would be a truly > incredible platform to use.
> >>>>>>>> ---- > >>>>>>>> Josh > >>>>>>>> _____________________ > >>>>>>>> Instead of our drab slogging forth and back to the fishing boats, > there's a reason to life! We can lift ourselves out of ignorance, we can > find ourselves as creatures of excellence and intelligence and skill. We > can be free! We can learn to fly!
> >>>>>>>> — Richard Bach, 'Jonathan Livingston Seagull,' 1970.
> >>>>>>>> On Mon, Jan 23, 2012 at 11:11, kozmikreis < > kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk (mailto:kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk)> wrote: > >>>>>>>>> I look forward to trying that out, please let us know when it's > available. It'll be good when there's finally a Lojban-specific app in the > iTunes Store :-)
> >>>>>>>>> Regarding my conlanger meet-up app idea, I retain no rights to > the idea should you or anyone else wants to implement it either solo or as > a collaboration.
> >>>>>>>>> On a slightly related note, there's now a free iBooks Author app > in the Mac App Store for authoring rich content books for iPad consumption. > It looks ideal for creating and sharing educational textbooks. The CLL as > an iBook would be a good place to start, once the latest changes to it have > been completed - thoughts anyone?
> >>>>>>>>> kozmikreis
> >>>>>>>>> On 22 Jan 2012, at 09:13, aryrain laubels wrote: > >>>>>>>>>> I have written a Lojban Dictionary in pure Objective C, I am > currently waiting for approval. I finished it a week or so ago but posted > it today. But some other applications would be interesting.
> >>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Jan 19, 2012 at 9:58 AM, kozmikreis < > kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk (mailto:kozmikr...@lojban.org.uk)> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>> [repost, original seems to have been lost to the aether]
> >>>>>>>>>>> I've got an Apple iOS Developer account and would be happy to > have a hand in writing a Lojban app for iOS (and Android if I can get the > damn SDK and toolset stable), it's just I haven't thought of an app idea > that has anything better to it than those that already exist.
> >>>>>>>>>>> My dev language of choice would probably be the JavaScript > variant from Appcelerator, not that it's anything amazing, but it can > compile to multiple platforms and takes away some of the suckage of > Objective C.
> >>>>>>>>>>> One idea I had was perhaps a meet-up app for conlangers in > general, whereby you tick the list of languages you speak or are learning > to speak and perhaps your level of proficiency, and let it run in the > background occasionally checking your location in to a central server. When > someone else with a matching conlang interest is nearby the phone can alert > you so you can meet up and say coi. Might be good for finding people to > practice with?
> >>>>>>>>>>> kozmikreis
> >>>>>>>>>>> On 12 Jan 2012, at 06:27, kalsa wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>>> coi > >>>>>>>>>>>> is there any talk of making a lojbanic/lojban beginners ipod > app? apps like flashcardlet are good for studying words, but i was thinking > maybe a more lojban specific app would help for people who are already > wanting to learn, getting to look at it on the go, or maybe to hear spoken > lojban, or maybe just to make it more accessible to a wider variety of > people. Just a thought. > >>>>>>>>>>>> co'o
> >>>>>>>>> -- > >>>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the
I'd like to see an enhanced version (see my message of a few minutes ago), but preferably not at the cost of other formats losing out, we'd want to retain maximum compatibility and accessibility across all formats.
You are correct the CLL can be exported to PDF which can be read by iPads etc. The best case I can see for using the iBooks format is not so much the special features but being able to publish it to and therefore the visibility and searchability of the CLL within the iTunes and iBooks stores. This allows for the less technically adept to find and download the content as well as share bookmarks across devices and whatever else that a PDF alone doesn't.
The same should be done for other open and closed book stores in my opinion :-)
> I was addressing specifically the things you were talking about /adding to/ the proposed iBook (the "interactive multiple-choice questions, audio clips, video clips, and other learning aids") that would /not/ be available in any other format.
> iPads can read pdfs. The CLL can be exported to pdf (IIRC). If you're not wanting to use the "special" featuresof iBooks, there's no need to make an iBook CLL. If you are, then you're making something that will /not/ be available by any other means.
Having read the rest of the discussion, oops.. A bit late. Btw, isn't the real problem with the iBook app the contract that you have to "accept" to post books to the app. Particularly if the LLG decides to sell the book?
> On Sat, Jan 28, 2012 at 10:54 PM, CosmicRay <c...@cosmicray.co.uk> wrote:
>> I'd like to see an enhanced version (see my message of a few minutes >> ago), but preferably not at the cost of other formats losing out, we'd want >> to retain maximum compatibility and accessibility across all formats.
>> You are correct the CLL can be exported to PDF which can be read by iPads >> etc. The best case I can see for using the iBooks format is not so much >> the special features but being able to publish it to and therefore the >> visibility and searchability of the CLL within the iTunes and iBooks >> stores. This allows for the less technically adept to find and download >> the content as well as share bookmarks across devices and whatever else >> that a PDF alone doesn't.
>> The same should be done for other open and closed book stores in my >> opinion :-)
>> kozmikreis
>> On 28 Jan 2012, at 11:34, Jonathan Jones wrote:
>> > I was addressing specifically the things you were talking about /adding >> to/ the proposed iBook (the "interactive multiple-choice questions, audio >> clips, video clips, and other learning aids") that would /not/ be available >> in any other format.
>> > iPads can read pdfs. The CLL can be exported to pdf (IIRC). If you're >> not wanting to use the "special" featuresof iBooks, there's no need to make >> an iBook CLL. If you are, then you're making something that will /not/ be >> available by any other means.
>> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Lojban Beginners" group. >> To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
On Sat, Jan 28, 2012 at 10:54 PM, CosmicRay <c...@cosmicray.co.uk> wrote: > I'd like to see an enhanced version (see my message of a few minutes ago), > but preferably not at the cost of other formats losing out, we'd want to > retain maximum compatibility and accessibility across all formats.
> You are correct the CLL can be exported to PDF which can be read by iPads > etc. The best case I can see for using the iBooks format is not so much > the special features but being able to publish it to and therefore the > visibility and searchability of the CLL within the iTunes and iBooks > stores. This allows for the less technically adept to find and download > the content as well as share bookmarks across devices and whatever else > that a PDF alone doesn't.
> The same should be done for other open and closed book stores in my > opinion :-)
> kozmikreis
> On 28 Jan 2012, at 11:34, Jonathan Jones wrote:
> > I was addressing specifically the things you were talking about /adding > to/ the proposed iBook (the "interactive multiple-choice questions, audio > clips, video clips, and other learning aids") that would /not/ be available > in any other format.
> > iPads can read pdfs. The CLL can be exported to pdf (IIRC). If you're > not wanting to use the "special" featuresof iBooks, there's no need to make > an iBook CLL. If you are, then you're making something that will /not/ be > available by any other means.
> -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Lojban Beginners" group. > To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
Wahoo! Just installed it on iOS 5.0.1 (9A405) on an iPhone 4.
The "Lookup" and "Keyword" searches are OK (no indication what the difference is) but the "Text search" feature doesn't seem to work, and the search button being a little arrow in the main screen's title is unintuitive, other than that it's a great start and I like it, thanks :-)
kozmikreis
-- Sent from my iPhone
On 30 Jan 2012, at 22:00, aryrain laubels <aryr...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Sat, Jan 28, 2012 at 10:54 PM, CosmicRay <c...@cosmicray.co.uk> wrote: > I'd like to see an enhanced version (see my message of a few minutes ago), but preferably not at the cost of other formats losing out, we'd want to retain maximum compatibility and accessibility across all formats.
> You are correct the CLL can be exported to PDF which can be read by iPads etc. The best case I can see for using the iBooks format is not so much the special features but being able to publish it to and therefore the visibility and searchability of the CLL within the iTunes and iBooks stores. This allows for the less technically adept to find and download the content as well as share bookmarks across devices and whatever else that a PDF alone doesn't.
> The same should be done for other open and closed book stores in my opinion :-)
> kozmikreis
> On 28 Jan 2012, at 11:34, Jonathan Jones wrote:
> > I was addressing specifically the things you were talking about /adding to/ the proposed iBook (the "interactive multiple-choice questions, audio clips, video clips, and other learning aids") that would /not/ be available in any other format.
> > iPads can read pdfs. The CLL can be exported to pdf (IIRC). If you're not wanting to use the "special" featuresof iBooks, there's no need to make an iBook CLL. If you are, then you're making something that will /not/ be available by any other means.
> -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. > To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
> -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. > To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
Lookup just looks for the English word or Lojban word, there is also meant to be a lujvo parser there but I don't think it's "ready" for use. (Anyone care to help me with Ragel?) While keyword search does a search on most of the contents, it's basically an index search, it only supports and (implicitly) at the moment. Text search is basically a simple grep on the rasfi and gismu text files, I included it as people like to search for exact phrases ect, however as I don't have an iPhone I couldn't test if there were any bundling* problems. I wouldn't mind adding a jbovlaste and jbofi'e option to it, but those would be a simple web lookup.
I am a little worried about speed, I made the application using the "coredata" system, which is a wrapper around Sqlite, with a bit of extras which I think apple added for speed. However I think it just bloats the sql file and
I am thinking of adding a Selma'o explorer and some other things like that but I would really like a list of descriptions for the selma'o before I do that. Also, I have said this before on g+, but the TXT format is getting really tiresome. :P I say XML with compilers to make it human readable. :P Which will allow us to put more "value add" features like examples and more gloss words.
Do you have a suggestion as to what I should use for the search button? I thought that as well but was sort of at a loss on what I could do.
* Seems it's apples name for something like the Slackware model package.
On Wed, Feb 1, 2012 at 12:11 AM, Paul <mrp...@gmail.com> wrote: > Wahoo! Just installed it on iOS 5.0.1 (9A405) on an iPhone 4.
> The "Lookup" and "Keyword" searches are OK (no indication what the > difference is) but the "Text search" feature doesn't seem to work, and the > search button being a little arrow in the main screen's title is > unintuitive, other than that it's a great start and I like it, thanks :-)
> kozmikreis
> -- > Sent from my iPhone
> On 30 Jan 2012, at 22:00, aryrain laubels <aryr...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Sat, Jan 28, 2012 at 10:54 PM, CosmicRay <c...@cosmicray.co.uk> wrote:
>> I'd like to see an enhanced version (see my message of a few minutes >> ago), but preferably not at the cost of other formats losing out, we'd want >> to retain maximum compatibility and accessibility across all formats.
>> You are correct the CLL can be exported to PDF which can be read by iPads >> etc. The best case I can see for using the iBooks format is not so much >> the special features but being able to publish it to and therefore the >> visibility and searchability of the CLL within the iTunes and iBooks >> stores. This allows for the less technically adept to find and download >> the content as well as share bookmarks across devices and whatever else >> that a PDF alone doesn't.
>> The same should be done for other open and closed book stores in my >> opinion :-)
>> kozmikreis
>> On 28 Jan 2012, at 11:34, Jonathan Jones wrote:
>> > I was addressing specifically the things you were talking about /adding >> to/ the proposed iBook (the "interactive multiple-choice questions, audio >> clips, video clips, and other learning aids") that would /not/ be available >> in any other format.
>> > iPads can read pdfs. The CLL can be exported to pdf (IIRC). If you're >> not wanting to use the "special" featuresof iBooks, there's no need to make >> an iBook CLL. If you are, then you're making something that will /not/ be >> available by any other means.
>> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Lojban Beginners" group. >> To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
> -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Lojban Beginners" group. > To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
> -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Lojban Beginners" group. > To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
