> Kyle,

> That's a big help, the crowded-ness in that space right now is a big issue
> in the current managers even in English.

> Elin

> On Friday, April 27, 2012 12:14:49 PM UTC-4, Kyle Ledbetter wrote:

>> Hey JM just wanted to post this pic here in case you didn't see on
>> twitter, I'm moving the page title up to the header where there is more
>> room :)

>> <https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-EJ_8T0TictI/T5rF7AqZB6I/AAAAAAAAAB...>

>> More updates coming
>> -Kyle

>> On Sunday, April 22, 2012 12:57:27 AM UTC-5, infograf768 wrote:

>>>  Hello Kyle,

>>> I guess Elin has rightfully summarized the present situation.
>>> We have reached a step where trunk will become 3.0 pre-alpha at the end
>>> of May (after the 2.5.5 release).
>>> Until I posted on this list, I was only aware of some screenshots you
>>> posted in your forum.
>>> Getting a full branch to test made the difference.

>>> I have tested your branch with 2.5 admin templates and they are in many
>>> respects broken. i.e. the changes you brought to core make them
>>> incompatible.
>>> Therefore, as committing your proposal to Trunk implies a lot of code
>>> changes, we do need to test it now fully, for core and for 3pd, including
>>> legacy.

>>> This is a much heavier task than when it took weeks to re-implement an
>>> International Menu which had been "forgotten" when the joomla.orgfamily of sites design was revamped.

>>> My thoughts are evidently personal, based on the tests I did with your
>>> branch.
>>> You should not dismiss them though too fast.
>>> CMS maintainers and JBS have spent countless hours to make bluestork
>>> usable (and Andy to create accessible Hathor) and we now have some
>>> experience to share.

>>> Sorry, I don't tweet and I do not think that such an implementation can
>>> anyway be discussed or supported or not in a few words.

>>> I have added you to my skype contacts and I am ready to explain to you
>>> with screenshots where I think are the main culprits + suggesting some
>>> improvements.

>>> If this is not enough. I am willing to make a full pdf with details.

>>> Friendly

>>> JM

>>> Hi Kyle,

>>> Cool. Overall CMS related communication takes place on the CMS and JBS
>>> lists .   So I'm glad you've now made your first (I think ) foray into the
>>> world where your  work will be scrutinized, pushed in directions you never
>>> thought about, and in general given a workout like it never has had. It's
>>> really important that the people who will in the end have responsibility
>>> for long term maintenance get to know the code.   Probably you will want to
>>> listen for feed back on the general list too since the admin templates has
>>> big implications for the independent developer community and of course
>>> anything that touches core outputs.  Most important I think is to get
>>> something into the feature tracker with a link to your repo so people can
>>> try it out and start giving feedback and even patches. Make sure to
>>> subscribe to the issue report with the work since that way you will get
>>> email with each comment.

>>> There is a great community out there that will do testing in all kinds
>>> of settings including every language and every kind of assistive device you
>>> can think of.

>>> Of course there are months to go and no one expects that what you have
>>> now is ready for prime time, but early feed back is way better than later
>>> feed back so let's go for it.

>>> I think we are going to work insanely hard not to disrupt a single 2.5
>>> site that goes to 3.0 but to offer them great new features too. So the
>>> sooner we have things to  test the sooner we can start coding and testing
>>> out things like how do we offer an upgrading user the option to switch
>>> templates.

>>> Elin

>>> On Saturday, April 21, 2012 1:14:10 PM UTC-4, Kyle Ledbetter wrote:

>>> Hey JM, sorry for the delayed reply, I was just made aware of this post
>>> (how are you btw, been a while :)

>>> To your points, yes it's still very much under construction and lots
>>> left to do. So far it's been just me but I've made lots of progress in a
>>> short while. My plan is to do a 1st round of updates on everything to get
>>> the markup standardized and the new template built, then make rounds (and
>>> rounds) of UX improvements, test accessibility, add RTL, etc, etc.

>>> I've been trying to do lots of communication on twitter, skype and in
>>> the ux.joomla.org forum, and I've receive
>>> overwhelmingly positive feedback from all types of folks, component
>>> developers (who are all onboard to update their components and completely
>>> standardize them), template developers, and end users. To get a quick pulse
>>> check all this feedback https://twitter.com/#!/search/joomla%203.0 <
>>> I've never seen unified excitement like that in our community before.

>>> Some of your thoughts seem to be personal opinions about design. I can
>>> guarantee you that all aspects of usability and experience will be improved
>>> and that the most modern and effect UX design patterns and styles are being
>>> applied here.

>>> If you'd like to chat more about any aspect I'm always around and up for
>>> it in any of these channels:

>>> http://ux.joomla.org/forum

>>> https://twitter.com/#!/kyleledbetter

>>> skype: pixelpraise

>>> email: kyle.ledbetter <at> community.joomla.org

>>> Hope all is well on your end and looking forward to working together to
>>> deliver this exciting new experience

>>> -Kyle

>>> On Tuesday, April 17, 2012 11:55:04 AM UTC-5, infograf768 wrote:

>>> Folks,

>>> after this post

>>> http://community.joomla.org/blogs/community/1568-30-first-look.html

>>> I downloaded the project itself and installed it
>>> https://github.com/Joomla3-Admin-template/joomla-cms/zipball/template

>>> Obviously it is unfinished and my feedback will not concern the
>>> unfinished parts.

>>> (No descriptions displayed during installation, Options toolbar broken,
>>> Articles Titles and Category field missing, menu items associations, etc.)

>>> Nevertheless I am concerned about this design generally speaking.

>>> 1. This template's name should be called "Scroller" instead of
>>> "Strapped"  ( ;-)  ), for the need to scroll all over the UI is so
>>> important that we immediately feel the urge to recover our good old 1.5
>>> templates where the scrolls there were sometimes important but not
>>> systematic.

>>> 2. In the whole admin, the choice to display a menu on left with a fixed
>>> width is creating many issues.

>>> Even in English, and* at fortiori* in other languages, the labels
>>> occupy 2 or more lines for some.

>>> This can be seen in the left menu and also in the columns heads of the
>>> Managers.

>>> The Manager Titles are unreadable as they are cut, even in English.

>>> 3. No RTL consideration at all for now

>>> 4. I am not a fan either of the black and white icons. Colour is an
>>> important bonus for usability.

>>> 5. I welcome some of the Tabs but used systematically for everything ==
>>> lost of time

>>> I sincerely hope it will be possible to improve/change these issues.

>>> Feedback welcome.

>>> JM

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