OS X copy/paste bugs and issues
notl...@usual.places
http://user.services.openoffice.org/en/forum/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=30813
Keynote and Illustrator have copy/paste problems in OS X
http://www.oasq.com/clipboard-problems-with-Preview-thread-173298-1-1.html
OS X upgrade breaks Synergy copy/paste
http://code.google.com/p/synergy-plus/issues/detail?id=67
OS X upgrade breaks Illustrator to photoshop copy/paste
http://forums.creativecow.net/thread/71/856135
OS X Snow Leopard drops accents during copy/paste
http://www.betalogue.com/2010/03/23/clipboard-viewer/
OS X copy/paste operation freezes VNC sessions on Mac side
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/vinagre/+bug/535046
Can't select text for copy/paste in OS X Finder app
http://npacemo.com/wordpress/2008/05/11/copying-a-file-name-to-the-
clipboard-on-mac-os-x/
Inkscape copy/paste doesn't work as expected in OS X
http://www.inkscapeforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=5372
----------------------------------------------------------
Get the idea, Snit?
Snit
VoudnQF8obD25ujQ...@supernews.com on 3/7/11 5:42 PM:
I understand why you are interested in trying to make the OS X environment
seem as bad a what I have shown Ubuntu to be, but remember, I made it very
clear I was looking at just apps that shipped with the OS (though I would
include very common apps on OS X given it does not ship with as many apps -
in other words, things such as Flash and the like - those are used on many
if not most OS X installations. With that said, let's look at what you can
find!
> Open Office has copy/paste problems in OS X
> http://user.services.openoffice.org/en/forum/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=30813
Yup: noted as a bug... and at least one comment says it is based on an OS X
bug. If so, then I would even be willing to go against me "comes with the
OS or is real common" and say it is a weakness of the platform - though a
very minor one given that OpenOffice is not really common on OS X. If this
was with MS Office or iWork, the more common office products, it would be
more of an issue.
> Keynote and Illustrator have copy/paste problems in OS X
> http://www.oasq.com/clipboard-problems-with-Preview-thread-173298-1-1.html
And here you have an Apple product and a common product... however, I just
tested this with Keynote and copy/paste works just fine. Even did a lasso
selection - no problem. Same with Illustrator - works fine.
Heck, I tried pasting it to a Windows program (Paint) via Parallels, and
that worked fine. If this ever was an issue, it is not with current
versions. This is to be predicted - OS X users are used to excellence and
would not tolerate that without raising a stink. And Apple works with major
developers to get these things fixed.
> OS X upgrade breaks Synergy copy/paste
> http://code.google.com/p/synergy-plus/issues/detail?id=67
Uncommon product - and the developers quickly admit this seems to be a big
bug. Good... as it should be.
> OS X upgrade breaks Illustrator to photoshop copy/paste
> http://forums.creativecow.net/thread/71/856135
If if it ever was true, not true in current products. Again: good... OS X
users do not tolerate such poor behavior.
> OS X Snow Leopard drops accents during copy/paste
> http://www.betalogue.com/2010/03/23/clipboard-viewer/
Did not test, but if this is real, then of course it is a bug with OS X.
How could it not be?
> OS X copy/paste operation freezes VNC sessions on Mac side
> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/vinagre/+bug/535046
Not sure if it is a bug with OS X or with the VNC software - but, again,
uncommon. Still, it should be fixed. Of course.
> Can't select text for copy/paste in OS X Finder app
> http://npacemo.com/wordpress/2008/05/11/copying-a-file-name-to-the-
> clipboard-on-mac-os-x/
Well, this is a "bug" with not being able to select text in a dialog... not
a copy / paste bug. And, assuming it ever existed, it does not any more.
Works fine.
> Inkscape copy/paste doesn't work as expected in OS X
> http://www.inkscapeforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=5372
Just skimmed it - but if it is true there are problems with copy and paste
between the general OS X programs and X11 programs then this is a pretty big
issue that should be resolved. Likely already was...
> ----------------------------------------------------------
>
> Get the idea, Snit?
Sure: I noted a problem with Ubuntu and you took it personally, even though
I made it clear it was not a "show stopper". You then tried to make it
appear that OS X is as bad, but most of your examples completely failed -
either they are with rare software (and thus completely different than the
examples I gave) or have been resolved (if they were even general bugs to
start off with - some like were, but we do not know).
Do you feel better having done this?
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
notl...@usual.places
No, you noted what you and somebody who reported it saw as a problem, and
when people kept explaining that it was designed behavior, you kept
moving the goalposts until you finally ended up with, "Copy/paste
behavior is not the same across all applications." That statement is
true. It's also true for OS X and Windows.
> You then tried to
> make it appear that OS X is as bad,
Actually, the examples I gave were actual, real bugs in OS X related to
copy/paste operations. The example you gave was expected behavior. You
just *called* it a bug because you didn't know any better, then circled
around until you started calling it something else.
I'm not trying to say OS X is worse, just because it has a history of
copy/paste bugs dating back for many years (I only posted the more recent
ones). But I damn sure wouldn't call it better. You might feel Apple's
design is better, and I wouldn't have an issue with that. That's
opinion. Mine might differ (although it doesn't).
> but most of your examples completely
> failed - either they are with rare software (and thus completely
> different than the examples I gave) or have been resolved (if they were
> even general bugs to start off with - some like were, but we do not
> know).
The "rare" program you used in your Ubuntu video was Open Office. I
showed that it also had an issue with Mac OS X, but you dismiss it as
very minor since OO is rare on Macs.
You demonstrate a dialog in an Ubuntu program (a help dialog, I think)
that could not be copied from and lambasted it as outrageous. I
demonstrate the exact same thing in what is apparently an actual OS X
component (not a 3rd part program), and you dismiss it because you don't
believe it exists any more. In other words, you say, "Works fine for
me." Isn't that what you accuse Linux users of doing? Yeah, I think you
and your buds make that accusation all the time.
By the way, I can't replicate the gedit copy/paste thing on my copy of
Ubuntu. Know why? Cause it works fine for me. I guess something got
fixed, huh?
The OO behavior is still as advertised, though. I just tried it. My
copied selection disappeared upon exit.
You know, there is an actual reason for this kind of behavior. If you
weren't simply trolling, you could have googled it.
> Do you feel better having done this?
I feel kind of dirty, actually. I actually like Apple. But I see you as
an asshole who spends an embarassing percentage of your life posting
derogatory comments about a computer operating system you obviously
detest, and insulting those who defend it in a newsgroup dedicated its
advocacy. That's almost the definition of being an asshole, and you have
half a dozen buddies who do the same thing. You excuse what you do by
pretending that you're merely pointing out problems in the hope that the
system will be improved, but that's an obvious lie whether it's you
saying it or one of your buds. You do it because you enjoy the feeling
it gives you, whatever that is.
So yeah, I feel kind of filthy rolling around in the muck with you. I'll
be all right, though, because I can clean up and I'll leave soon. I
never stick around very long here. It's always the same -- slimy and
disgusting. You, flatfish, DFS, amicus curious, and Hadron make sure of
it.
Snit
VoudnQB8obDWAujQ...@supernews.com on 3/7/11 8:15 PM:
...
>> Sure: I noted a problem with Ubuntu and you took it personally, even
>> though I made it clear it was not a "show stopper".
>
> No, you noted what you and somebody who reported it saw as a problem, and
> when people kept explaining that it was designed behavior, you kept
> moving the goalposts until you finally ended up with, "Copy/paste
> behavior is not the same across all applications." That statement is
> true. It's also true for OS X and Windows.
You are simply incorrect. I noted that the behavior of Ubuntu was
inconsistent. Several people told me it worked the way it does by design.
I proved this to be incorrect (nobody "designs" anything to be so
inconsistent).
The the conversation move to X and the way it loses clipboard data on
application close. This, I noted, would at least be consistent (I even note
this in my video): <http://tmp.gallopinginsanity.com/UbuntuCP.mov>.
But the topic has moved to how *Ubuntu* should behave and, to some extent
(because of its relation) how X should behave. And I have noted that the
losing-data method is rather silly... it is not what users want, it is not
what users expect and it is not what serves users best.
And I have backed up those claims.
You reacted by trying to pretend OS X is as bad as Ubuntu is (or X). This
is *clearly* not the case. Here:
<http://www.mail-archive.com/regi...@lists.launchpad.net/msg15175.html>
-----
And it has links to many duplicate bugs of people wanting it
fixed. Now I know this is mainly a design flaw and not a bug in
code per say, but it's been 16 years now. It's time has come to
be redesigned the way windows and mac os x do their clipboard.
-----
This person knows different. And so do many, many other... just a quick
search:
<http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/idea/27331/>
-----
Idea #27331: clipboard design extremely frustrating
Since we're moving to wayland I think we should fix a long time
issue that linux has. It is the clipboard. Currently it saves
nothing but a reference to the data copied to it. Say I go in copy
some text from firefox, close firefox, that text is now gone. I
can't paste it else where.
However in windows and mac os x I can do this since they have
properly implemented clipboards.
-----
<https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/11334>
-----
when they develop versions of their software on windows or mac os
x, they don't need to jump through these extra hoops to get it
working with the clipboard
-----
<https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/glipper/+bug/506980>
-----
But if this is "for human beings" and aimed as new comers to linux
world (coming from windows or mac os x in 99% cases), the only
logical conclusion is that this behavior is unexpected.
-----
<http://www.mail-archive.com/ubunt...@lists.ubuntu.com/msg2349481.html>
-----
MASTER Copy-Paste doesn't work if the source is closed before
the paste
Welcome Sarah. If you read the comments here, I don't think
people want it fixed on a per application basis. Linux developers
coming from windows and mac os x, don't want to have to put in
extra work on linux just to get the clipboard working with their
app. They want it taken care of for them.
-----
<http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/idea/27331/>
-----
Solution #1: implement clipboard in wayland the way it is in
windows/mac os x
-----
<http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/idea/3118/>
-----
To put it bluntly, it's about programmers who want to maintain the
terminal emulator first over an actual clipboard that works like
it does on windows and OS X.
-----
<https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=25220>
-----
This bug has been bugging me since the first week I started using
Linux (in 2007). It's now 2010 and the bug still annoys me
everytime I'm using Linux. I even switched from Linux to Mac OS X
as my primary operating system, only because of the bugs in X.
Since 2007 I used Linux as my primary operating system, but a few
months ago I was so frustrated about the bugs in X that I went out
and bought a MacBook. From now on Mac OS X is my primary operating
system, untill the 16 year old bugs in X finally get fixed.
-----
So your idea that OS X is somehow has messed up in this area as is Ubuntu is
just flat out wrong.
>> You then tried to make it appear that OS X is as bad,
>
> Actually, the examples I gave were actual, real bugs in OS X related to
> copy/paste operations. The example you gave was expected behavior.
Incorrect. The example I gave was inconsistency:
<http://tmp.gallopinginsanity.com/UbuntuCP.mov>
TomB claimed that X behavior, which is generally not liked, is also expected
on Ubuntu - and I proved that wrong. It is not what is expected nor what
serves people best. And it is not what people want.
> You just *called* it a bug because you didn't know any better, then circled
> around until you started calling it something else.
Again: my video proves that wrong. I did not call the loss of clipboard
data a bug - it is the inconsistency that is a bug.
Please: if you wish to disagree with me I welcome it - but try to understand
the position you are disagreeing with and do not just make things up.
> I'm not trying to say OS X is worse, just because it has a history of
> copy/paste bugs dating back for many years (I only posted the more recent
> ones). But I damn sure wouldn't call it better. You might feel Apple's
> design is better, and I wouldn't have an issue with that. That's
> opinion. Mine might differ (although it doesn't).
You might be some rare individual who does not see the OS X clipboard design
as being better - but can you back up any reasons why you would not?
Remember, I have posted support and many quotes as to why the X way (even
when handled consistently) is not preferred - and certainly why the
inconsistent reality of Ubuntu is clearly not done well.
>> but most of your examples completely failed - either they are with rare
>> software (and thus completely different than the examples I gave) or have
>> been resolved (if they were even general bugs to start off with - some like
>> were, but we do not know).
>
> The "rare" program you used in your Ubuntu video was Open Office. I
> showed that it also had an issue with Mac OS X, but you dismiss it as
> very minor since OO is rare on Macs.
OpenOffice is the norm on Ubuntu. It is not on OS X. Now you know.
> You demonstrate a dialog in an Ubuntu program (a help dialog, I think)
> that could not be copied from and lambasted it as outrageous.
It is quite silly.
> I demonstrate the exact same thing in what is apparently an actual OS X
> component (not a 3rd part program), and you dismiss it because you don't
> believe it exists any more.
Non-existent bugs are not an issue. On any OS.
> In other words, you say, "Works fine for me." Isn't that what you accuse
> Linux users of doing? Yeah, I think you and your buds make that accusation
> all the time.
Nope: if a bug does not exist on Linux I do not say Linux is weak for having
that bug. Heck, even when the bug is fairly common, such as the mouse bugs
on VMs, I give Ubuntu a bit of a pass based on people saying it works fine
on "real" machines.
Again: if you wish to disagree with me I am all for it - but do not make up
positions and claim they are mine.
> By the way, I can't replicate the gedit copy/paste thing on my copy of
> Ubuntu. Know why? Cause it works fine for me. I guess something got
> fixed, huh?
Given the number of reports of it, there are two possibilities:
1) It has been fixed: in this case it is no longer an issue (just as fixed
bugs on OS X are no longer an issue... see the pattern!)
2) User error.
I can test to see which it is if you like... though I suppose it also might
work inconsistently from machine to machine - that seems unlikely.
> The OO behavior is still as advertised, though. I just tried it. My
> copied selection disappeared upon exit.
>
> You know, there is an actual reason for this kind of behavior. If you
> weren't simply trolling, you could have googled it.
You act like I am looking for reasons as to why the bugs exist that I
note... but I have given no indication I am. The reasons why do not change
the fact they do exist.
But you call that trolling. See your bias.
>> Do you feel better having done this?
>
> I feel kind of dirty, actually.
Perhaps you should.
> I actually like Apple. But I see you as an asshole who spends an embarassing
> percentage of your life posting derogatory comments about a computer operating
> system you obviously detest, and insulting those who defend it in a newsgroup
> dedicated its advocacy.
See: you just make things up. If I "detest" Linux then why would I be using
it? Why would I suggest it to others - read my recent discussion where I am
suggesting it to a friend and even installing it for him. Your view of me
(and of my views) is clearly not correct. You are looking at things though
your own clearly inaccurate lenses.
Remember: I am also the one who repeatedly said the whole clipboard issue,
even the inconsistencies I proved existed, were not "show stoppers" and were
not that big of an issue. The fact you take my noting such a bug as being
so "derogatory" you feel the need to call me names does not speak well of
you.
> That's almost the definition of being an asshole, and you have half a dozen
> buddies who do the same thing.
Buddies? Doing the same thing - suggesting people use Linux? Using it
themselves? Or do you mean doing as you *think* people do as opposed to
what they are *really* doing?
> You excuse what you do by pretending that you're merely pointing out problems
> in the hope that the system will be improved, but that's an obvious lie
> whether it's you saying it or one of your buds. You do it because you enjoy
> the feeling it gives you, whatever that is.
And here you are accusing me - with *no* support - of dishonesty. Again,
this speaks poorly of you.
> So yeah, I feel kind of filthy rolling around in the muck with you. I'll be
> all right, though, because I can clean up and I'll leave soon. I never stick
> around very long here. It's always the same -- slimy and disgusting. You,
> flatfish, DFS, amicus curious, and Hadron make sure of it.
I will not speak for them, but if my comments about a true issue with
Ubuntu, one I note is not that big of a deal, is offensive enough to you to
make you want to leave, you clearly allow your view of an OS to hold too
much sway over you. A little sick, really.
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
Chris Ahlstrom
> So yeah, I feel kind of filthy rolling around in the muck with you. I'll
> be all right, though, because I can clean up and I'll leave soon. I
> never stick around very long here. It's always the same -- slimy and
> disgusting. You, flatfish, DFS, amicus curious, and Hadron make sure of
> it.
Yup. Sigh. Nasty little children they are.
Not an ounce of integrity between 'em.
--
Unless Liarnut is on his knees taking care of "pee-pees" that is....
"I am not worthy to wipe your pee-pee <grin>"
-- Liarnut in comp.os.linux.advocacy
-- "Hadron"'s pee-pee obsession, <gi10im$fcd$1...@reader.motzarella.org>
turd's just a vicious child who uses Windows to make a living, and
defrauds his employer by posting on company time - just like his
sycophant Linosuck.
-- DFS, http://groups.google.com/group/comp.os.linux.advocacy/browse_thread/thread/5d618b167a2b40fb/60e10ff555604a39
3. Chris Ahlstrom. A pathetic little suck up. He pretends to be open
minded and reasonable but tends to snip and run when he gets on the
losing side of a debate, which is 99 percent of the time. He is a Linux
zealot by night and a Windows programmer by day.
-- flatfish, <1f3pmi0uarito.c...@40tude.net>
Lusotec
> notl...@usual.places wrote:
> I understand why you are interested in trying to make the OS X environment
> seem as bad a what I have shown Ubuntu to be,
You have shown copy & paste bugs in a few applications. That is it!
Now, here it is a bug that actually creates some *internal*
*inconsistencies* in how copy & paste works in MacOS X.
>> OS X copy/paste operation freezes VNC sessions on Mac side
>> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/vinagre/+bug/535046
>
> Not sure if it is a bug with OS X or with the VNC software - but, again,
> uncommon. Still, it should be fixed. Of course.
It is a bug in the VNC software that comes with MacOS X.
>> Can't select text for copy/paste in OS X Finder app
>> http://npacemo.com/wordpress/2008/05/11/copying-a-file-name-to-the-
>> clipboard-on-mac-os-x/
>
> Well, this is a "bug" with not being able to select text in a dialog...
> not a copy / paste bug. And, assuming it ever existed, it does not any
> more. Works fine.
>
>> Inkscape copy/paste doesn't work as expected in OS X
>> http://www.inkscapeforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=5372
>
> Just skimmed it - but if it is true there are problems with copy and paste
> between the general OS X programs and X11 programs then this is a pretty
> big issue that should be resolved. Likely already was...
>
>> ----------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> Get the idea, Snit?
>
> Sure: I noted a problem with Ubuntu
You noted a problem with *some* applications. Why do you insist that this is
a problem with Ubuntu? Also, noted the double standards in your responses to
the above copy & paste problem in applications running on MacOS X or in
MacOS X itself.
> and you took it personally, even though I made it clear it was not a "show
> stopper".
You have started threads on this subject many times, and many times it has
been explained to you how X copy & paste should work and how bugs in a
application are not bugs in the system, but still you return to this subject
and post the same false statements.
> You then tried to make it appear that OS X is as bad,
Apparently, MacOS X is worse. One of those bug is in the copy & paste system
of MacOS X, and not in a application.
> but most of your examples completely failed -
Just like your examples of bugs in application that you try to pass as bugs
or inconsistencies in the Ubuntu's copy & paste system.
> either they are with rare software (and thus completely different than the
> examples I gave) or have been resolved (if they were even general bugs to
> start off with - some like were, but we do not know).
So you decided to ignore the bug in the actual copy & paste system of MacOS
X!
> Do you feel better having done this?
:D
Regards.
Snit
9:54 AM:
> Snit wrote:
>> notl...@usual.places wrote:
>> I understand why you are interested in trying to make the OS X environment
>> seem as bad a what I have shown Ubuntu to be,
>
> You have shown copy & paste bugs in a few applications. That is it!
Not just a few programs - a few key programs that are a part of the distro
and are often used. It is not like it is with some rare software or
uncommon situation.
But, as I have said, it is not like it is a show stopper. Still, the number
of quirks is rather amazing:
<http://tmp.gallopinginsanity.com/UbuntuCP.mov>
To be fair, some of those have been fixed.
...
>>> OS X Snow Leopard drops accents during copy/paste
>>> http://www.betalogue.com/2010/03/23/clipboard-viewer/
>>
>> Did not test, but if this is real, then of course it is a bug with OS X.
>> How could it not be?
>
> Now, here it is a bug that actually creates some *internal*
> *inconsistencies* in how copy & paste works in MacOS X.
Yes. And I just tested it and it is real. Copy from a PDF in preview and
the accent gets dropped if it is the final character. Odd... and clearly a
bug.
>>> OS X copy/paste operation freezes VNC sessions on Mac side
>>> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/vinagre/+bug/535046
>>
>> Not sure if it is a bug with OS X or with the VNC software - but, again,
>> uncommon. Still, it should be fixed. Of course.
>
> It is a bug in the VNC software that comes with MacOS X.
If it is real - I have not tested it. But, sure, if it is a bug it should
be fixed. As I said.
...
>>> Get the idea, Snit?
>>
>> Sure: I noted a problem with Ubuntu
>
> You noted a problem with *some* applications. Why do you insist that this is
> a problem with Ubuntu?
Because I am honest.
> Also, noted the double standards in your responses to the above copy & paste
> problem in applications running on MacOS X or in MacOS X itself.
What double standard? When the problems were with OS X or its common apps,
I used also listed them the same way. Completely consistent.
Of course: one difference is I reported bugs I easily found by stumbling
into - very common ones based on the results of later searches. You hunted
and eventually found bugs that affect uncommon situations.
>
>> and you took it personally, even though I made it clear it was not a "show
>> stopper".
>
> You have started threads on this subject many times, and many times it has
> been explained to you how X copy & paste should work and how bugs in a
> application are not bugs in the system, but still you return to this subject
> and post the same false statements.
If you think it has been explained many times, then why do so many in COLA
get it wrong? I mean, really, it is not that complex - but RonB and others
still are completely clueless as to the problem I am talking about. They
are a bit slow, eh?
>> You then tried to make it appear that OS X is as bad,
>
> Apparently, MacOS X is worse. One of those bug is in the copy & paste system
> of MacOS X, and not in a application.
How do you figure OS X is worse? You had to hunt a lot more and found bugs
that were a lot less common. Clearly that is not as bad.
>> but most of your examples completely failed -
>
> Just like your examples of bugs in application that you try to pass as bugs
> or inconsistencies in the Ubuntu's copy & paste system.
How so? You keep repeating things but fail to explain.
>> either they are with rare software (and thus completely different than the
>> examples I gave) or have been resolved (if they were even general bugs to
>> start off with - some like were, but we do not know).
>
> So you decided to ignore the bug in the actual copy & paste system of MacOS
> X!
Nope. Nice story though. I guess.
>> Do you feel better having done this?
>
> :D
>
> Regards.
>
>
>
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
Lusotec
> Lusotec wrote:
>> Snit wrote:
>>> notl...@usual.places wrote:
>>> I understand why you are interested in trying to make the OS X
>>> environment seem as bad a what I have shown Ubuntu to be,
>>
>> You have shown copy & paste bugs in a few applications. That is it!
>
> Not just a few programs - a few key programs that are a part of the distro
> and are often used.
Thousands of programs "are a part of the distro", and "often used" actually
depends on user's usage and you are making an assumption there.
> It is not like it is with some rare software or uncommon situation.
Oh please, copy & paste in MacOS X has a bug that affects *all*
applications.
> But, as I have said, it is not like it is a show stopper. Still, the
> number of quirks is rather amazing:
>
> <http://tmp.gallopinginsanity.com/UbuntuCP.mov>
>
> To be fair, some of those have been fixed.
> ...
>>>> OS X Snow Leopard drops accents during copy/paste
>>>> http://www.betalogue.com/2010/03/23/clipboard-viewer/
>>>
>>> Did not test, but if this is real, then of course it is a bug with OS X.
>>> How could it not be?
>>
>> Now, here it is a bug that actually creates some *internal*
>> *inconsistencies* in how copy & paste works in MacOS X.
>
> Yes. And I just tested it and it is real. Copy from a PDF in preview and
> the accent gets dropped if it is the final character. Odd... and clearly
> a bug.
Seems to be a UTF8 handling issue in the copy & paste core.
>>>> OS X copy/paste operation freezes VNC sessions on Mac side
>>>> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/vinagre/+bug/535046
>>>
>>> Not sure if it is a bug with OS X or with the VNC software - but, again,
>>> uncommon. Still, it should be fixed. Of course.
>>
>> It is a bug in the VNC software that comes with MacOS X.
>
> If it is real - I have not tested it. But, sure, if it is a bug it should
> be fixed. As I said.
>
> ...
>>>> Get the idea, Snit?
>>>
>>> Sure: I noted a problem with Ubuntu
>>
>> You noted a problem with *some* applications. Why do you insist that this
>> is a problem with Ubuntu?
>
> Because I am honest.
>> Also, noted the double standards in your responses to the above copy &
>> paste problem in applications running on MacOS X or in MacOS X itself.
>
> What double standard? When the problems were with OS X or its common
> apps, I used also listed them the same way. Completely consistent.
How many threads have you started on comp.os.linux.advocacy (or similar
group) about the Ubuntu/X/GNU/Linux copy & paste issues?
How many threads have you started on comp.sys.mac.advocacy (or similar
group) about the MacOS X copy & paste issues?
Buggy application in Ubuntu is a Ubuntu/system problem.
Buggy application in MacOS X is a application problem.
> Of course: one difference is I reported bugs I easily found by stumbling
> into - very common ones based on the results of later searches. You
> hunted and eventually found bugs that affect uncommon situations.
I have not hunted any bugs, someone else did. And for you copying text with
accents (or other UTF8 multibyte chars) may be "uncommon", but for people
using other languages it is a very common situation.
>>> and you took it personally, even though I made it clear it was not a
>>> "show stopper".
>>
>> You have started threads on this subject many times, and many times it
>> has been explained to you how X copy & paste should work and how bugs in
>> a application are not bugs in the system, but still you return to this
>> subject and post the same false statements.
>
> If you think it has been explained many times, then why do so many in COLA
> get it wrong? I mean, really, it is not that complex - but RonB and
> others still are completely clueless as to the problem I am talking about.
> They are a bit slow, eh?
You certainly are, or pretend to be!
>>> You then tried to make it appear that OS X is as bad,
>>
>> Apparently, MacOS X is worse. One of those bug is in the copy & paste
>> system of MacOS X, and not in a application.
>
> How do you figure OS X is worse?
Bugs in the core system that affect *all* applications are worse than bugs
that affects single applications.
> You had to hunt a lot more and found bugs that were a lot less common.
> Clearly that is not as bad.
Like I wrote above, it was not me who posted the bugs.
>>> but most of your examples completely failed -
>>
>> Just like your examples of bugs in application that you try to pass as
>> bugs or inconsistencies in the Ubuntu's copy & paste system.
>
> How so? You keep repeating things but fail to explain.
A bug in a application is not a bug in the system. I don't know how else to
explain it. I don't know how that can be difficult to understand, either.
>>> either they are with rare software (and thus completely different than
>>> the examples I gave) or have been resolved (if they were even general
>>> bugs to start off with - some like were, but we do not know).
>>
>> So you decided to ignore the bug in the actual copy & paste system of
>> MacOS X!
>
> Nope. Nice story though. I guess.
Snit: "either they are with rare software (and thus completely different
than the examples I gave) or have been resolved (if they were even general
bugs to start off with - some like were, but we do not know)."
You downplay the list of copy & past bug in Mac OS X application and make no
mention of the copy & paste system bug, thus I wrote "So you decided to
ignore the bug in the actual copy & paste system of MacOS X!"
Regards.
Snit
3:28 PM:
> Snit wrote:
>> Lusotec wrote:
>>> Snit wrote:
>>>> notl...@usual.places wrote:
>>>> I understand why you are interested in trying to make the OS X
>>>> environment seem as bad a what I have shown Ubuntu to be,
>>>
>>> You have shown copy & paste bugs in a few applications. That is it!
>>
>> Not just a few programs - a few key programs that are a part of the distro
>> and are often used.
>
> Thousands of programs "are a part of the distro", and "often used" actually
> depends on user's usage and you are making an assumption there.
Well, thousands is an exaggeration, unless you are including the repository
- which I was not. And I think it is safe to say the web browser is a
pretty common tool on any desktop OS.
>> It is not like it is with some rare software or uncommon situation.
>
> Oh please, copy & paste in MacOS X has a bug that affects *all*
> applications.
And that bug is...???
>> But, as I have said, it is not like it is a show stopper. Still, the
>> number of quirks is rather amazing:
>>
>> <http://tmp.gallopinginsanity.com/UbuntuCP.mov>
>>
>> To be fair, some of those have been fixed.
>> ...
>>>>> OS X Snow Leopard drops accents during copy/paste
>>>>> http://www.betalogue.com/2010/03/23/clipboard-viewer/
>>>>
>>>> Did not test, but if this is real, then of course it is a bug with OS X.
>>>> How could it not be?
>>>
>>> Now, here it is a bug that actually creates some *internal*
>>> *inconsistencies* in how copy & paste works in MacOS X.
>>
>> Yes. And I just tested it and it is real. Copy from a PDF in preview and
>> the accent gets dropped if it is the final character. Odd... and clearly
>> a bug.
>
> Seems to be a UTF8 handling issue in the copy & paste core.
But it only seems to affect Preview... which is odd. But, sure, it is a bug
and it should be fixed. It is not like I am excusing it.
...
>>> Also, noted the double standards in your responses to the above copy &
>>> paste problem in applications running on MacOS X or in MacOS X itself.
>>
>> What double standard? When the problems were with OS X or its common
>> apps, I used also listed them the same way. Completely consistent.
>
> How many threads have you started on comp.os.linux.advocacy (or similar
> group) about the Ubuntu/X/GNU/Linux copy & paste issues?
Far, far fewer than the number of times people have lied about my views on
it. Heck, fewer than the number of times RonB has lied about my views.
> How many threads have you started on comp.sys.mac.advocacy (or similar
> group) about the MacOS X copy & paste issues?
Being that there is no issue of the same magnitude, why would I? Remember:
I have never run into any such bug on OS X, except when specifically looking
for them. And there are few reports of bugs. With Ubuntu I noted the bugs
I, personally, ran into - and then found there are many, many others finding
similar bugs.
Not the same situation at all. Remember: many of the reports on Ubunut
included people saying they wish the clipboard worked as it does on OS X or
Windows. I posted one report where the person said this bug was bad enough
they were going to switch to OS X. Why are you trying to make OS X look as
buggy as is Ubuntu?
> Buggy application in Ubuntu is a Ubuntu/system problem.
>
> Buggy application in MacOS X is a application problem.
You are tying to make OS X look as buggy as Ubuntu is - when that is
*clearly* not the case. Not by a long shot. This is somewhat dishonest of
you (or perhaps just ignorant - maybe you do not have experience with OS X
or Windows and their clipboard use and just cannot imagine any OS not being
as buggy as desktop Linux distros).
>> Of course: one difference is I reported bugs I easily found by stumbling
>> into - very common ones based on the results of later searches. You
>> hunted and eventually found bugs that affect uncommon situations.
>
> I have not hunted any bugs, someone else did.
Um, OK. Still, someone in COLA had to hunt. But my apology for the
mistake.
> And for you copying text with accents (or other UTF8 multibyte chars) may be
> "uncommon", but for people using other languages it is a very common
> situation.
From one program only... and only the final character. And, yes, it is a
bug with the OS X environment that should be fixed. Hasn't this been
established enough? You complain about me repeatedly pointing things out
that others lie about, but you keep repeating things that nobody is lying
about. Why? It is not like you are doing as I am and setting the record
straight.
>>>> and you took it personally, even though I made it clear it was not a
>>>> "show stopper".
>>>
>>> You have started threads on this subject many times, and many times it
>>> has been explained to you how X copy & paste should work and how bugs in
>>> a application are not bugs in the system, but still you return to this
>>> subject and post the same false statements.
>>
>> If you think it has been explained many times, then why do so many in COLA
>> get it wrong? I mean, really, it is not that complex - but RonB and
>> others still are completely clueless as to the problem I am talking about.
>> They are a bit slow, eh?
>
> You certainly are, or pretend to be!
You dodged the question. It is simply a fact RonB lies about my view on
this over and over and over. Why do you think he does this? Do you really
think he is so daft as to not be able to understand it? He is not the only
one - Peter K. and others also often lie about me and my views on this. Are
they all so daft as to be excused as being simply wrong?
>>>> You then tried to make it appear that OS X is as bad,
>>>
>>> Apparently, MacOS X is worse. One of those bug is in the copy & paste
>>> system of MacOS X, and not in a application.
>>
>> How do you figure OS X is worse?
>
> Bugs in the core system that affect *all* applications are worse than bugs
> that affects single applications.
How do you figure OS X is worse, then, when, as explained, there is no known
bug in OS X that is affecting all apps - and *all* apps in Ubuntu suffer
from the heavy amount of inconsistency.
>> You had to hunt a lot more and found bugs that were a lot less common.
>> Clearly that is not as bad.
>
> Like I wrote above, it was not me who posted the bugs.
Noted and apologized for. Does not change the main point though.
>>>> but most of your examples completely failed -
>>>
>>> Just like your examples of bugs in application that you try to pass as
>>> bugs or inconsistencies in the Ubuntu's copy & paste system.
>>
>> How so? You keep repeating things but fail to explain.
>
> A bug in a application is not a bug in the system. I don't know how else to
> explain it. I don't know how that can be difficult to understand, either.
I have been clear I am talking about the environment and not just the OS.
Not sure what you are confused about with that.
>>>> either they are with rare software (and thus completely different than
>>>> the examples I gave) or have been resolved (if they were even general
>>>> bugs to start off with - some like were, but we do not know).
>>>
>>> So you decided to ignore the bug in the actual copy & paste system of
>>> MacOS X!
>>
>> Nope. Nice story though. I guess.
>
> Snit: "either they are with rare software (and thus completely different
> than the examples I gave) or have been resolved (if they were even general
> bugs to start off with - some like were, but we do not know)."
>
> You downplay the list of copy & past bug in Mac OS X application and make no
> mention of the copy & paste system bug, thus I wrote "So you decided to
> ignore the bug in the actual copy & paste system of MacOS X!"
What copy and paste system bug? And what am I downplaying? Please do try
to make your case - and not just by repeating empty accusations. If you can
show where I have done what you say I would be happy to admit to it - but so
far you have not. No reason to think I have done so, and, as I have
explained, plenty of reason to think I have not. No double standard as you
keep implying. Well, not from me anyway.
In both cases: if there are bugs that affect the OS and / or common apps,
esp. if those bugs affect things in common (relevant) situations, then it is
a weakness of the environment. The weaknesses of OS X that have been shown
are few and far between and were only found by someone in COLA researching
them - not running into them himself. And those that were shown to be bugs
I acknowledged... and they should be fixed. With Ubuntu, the bugs are so
prevalent that I ran into many in a short time - as have others. Bug
reports and comments from dissatisfied users are quite common, and the bug
not only loses an accent from a character but loses *all* data. And in
recording that one bug I ran into a number of others.
You keep tying to pretend OS X is as buggy as Ubuntu - but the evidence
directly contradicts that view. Why would you want to push a clearly
incorrect view?
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]