Why is a picture ID opposed for voting?

[James]

eom

[Edward A. Falk]

Because not everybody can get them. In particular, it's harder for poor,
old, or black people to get them. Since these people are more likely
to vote Democrat, the Republicans are very keen to make it harder for
them to vote.

http://www.salon.com/2012/07/27/fla_republican_we_suppressed_black_votes/

http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2012/03/06/439324/86-year-old-ohio-veteran-cant-vote-after-government-issued-id-is-rejected-at-poll/

Republicans insist it's about stamping out voter fraud, but the number
of actual cases of voter fraud that a photo id would have prevented
is very small.

--
-Ed Falk, fa...@despams.r.us.com
http://thespamdiaries.blogspot.com/

[AM]

On 8/5/2012 1:17 PM, Edward A. Falk wrote:
> Because not everybody can get them. In particular, it's harder for poor,
> old, or black people to get them. Since these people are more likely
> to vote Democrat, the Republicans are very keen to make it harder for
> them to vote.
>
> http://www.salon.com/2012/07/27/fla_republican_we_suppressed_black_votes/
>
> http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2012/03/06/439324/86-year-old-ohio-veteran-cant-vote-after-government-issued-id-is-rejected-at-poll/
>
> Republicans insist it's about stamping out voter fraud, but the number
> of actual cases of voter fraud that a photo id would have prevented
> is very small.
>

Why is it OK for me to HAVE to show a photo ID at the bank which is not
a right, but not OK for someone to have to show a photo ID to vote ?
(which is a right)


???

[Orval Fairbairn]

In article <jvm9r4$ei4$1...@blue-new.rahul.net>,

fa...@rahul.net (Edward A. Falk) wrote:

> Because not everybody can get them. In particular, it's harder for poor,
> old, or black people to get them. Since these people are more likely
> to vote Democrat, the Republicans are very keen to make it harder for
> them to vote.
>
> http://www.salon.com/2012/07/27/fla_republican_we_suppressed_black_votes/
>
> http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2012/03/06/439324/86-year-old-ohio-veteran-ca
> nt-vote-after-government-issued-id-is-rejected-at-poll/
>
> Republicans insist it's about stamping out voter fraud, but the number
> of actual cases of voter fraud that a photo id would have prevented
> is very small.

Voter fraud is one of the most difficult acts to prove, since the perps
leave a cold trail.

When a Democrat operative goes down to Skid Row and hustles up a few
dozen bums to go and vote as some name, there is no way of tracking them
down. Voter ID throws some spikes into the road against such practices.

[columbiaaccidentinvestigation]

On Aug 5, 10:17 am, f...@rahul.net (Edward A. Falk) wrote:
> Because not everybody can get them.  In particular, it's harder for poor,
> old, or black people to get them.  Since these people are more likely
> to vote Democrat, the Republicans are very keen to make it harder for
> them to vote.
>

> http://www.salon.com/2012/07/27/fla_republican_we_suppressed_black_vo...
>
> http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2012/03/06/439324/86-year-old-ohio-v...

>
> Republicans insist it's about stamping out voter fraud, but the number
> of actual cases of voter fraud that a photo id would have prevented
> is very small.
>
> --

>         -Ed Falk, f...@despams.r.us.com
>        http://thespamdiaries.blogspot.com/

They also seem to miss the cases of people printing and posting
misleading voter information. Deceptive practices, such as posting
the wrong voting hours, or misleasding information about student
loans, parking tickets, and child support being tied to voting rights
would not be stopped by voter picture id.

[Ken Marino]

On Sun, 05 Aug 2012 17:17:24 +0000, Edward A. Falk wrote:

> Because not everybody can get them. In particular, it's harder for
> poor, old, or black people to get them. Since these people are more
> likely to vote Democrat, the Republicans are very keen to make it harder
> for them to vote.
>
> http://www.salon.com/2012/07/27/
fla_republican_we_suppressed_black_votes/
>
> http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2012/03/06/439324/86-year-old-ohio-
veteran-cant-vote-after-government-issued-id-is-rejected-at-poll/
>
> Republicans insist it's about stamping out voter fraud, but the number
> of actual cases of voter fraud that a photo id would have prevented is
> very small.

Most of the people you claim can't seem to find a way to identify
themselves to vote have no trouble identiying themselves to get free
gov't help. How do you explain that? They can get the needed ID, get to
the welfare office or anywhere else if it means free benefits, but can't
do the same to be able to vote?

[Desertphile]

Why the bloody fuck is this posted to alt.global-warming?

On Sun, 5 Aug 2012 12:46:40 -0700 (PDT),
columbiaaccidentinvestigation

<columbiaaccide...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> On Aug 5, 10:17 am, f...@rahul.net (Edward A. Falk) wrote:

> > Because not everybody can get them.  In particular, it's harder for poor,
> > old, or black people to get them.  Since these people are more likely
> > to vote Democrat, the Republicans are very keen to make it harder for
> > them to vote.
> >
> > http://www.salon.com/2012/07/27/fla_republican_we_suppressed_black_vo...
> >
> > http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2012/03/06/439324/86-year-old-ohio-v...
> >
> > Republicans insist it's about stamping out voter fraud, but the number
> > of actual cases of voter fraud that a photo id would have prevented
> > is very small.

In New Mexico and Arizona that are tens of thousands of American
citizens who do not have any kind of official / government
identification; they vote at many dozens of Chapter Houses, and
they and their families have been doing so since the late 1800s.
Expecting them to have photographic ID is just.... insane.

> They also seem to miss the cases of people printing and posting
> misleading voter information. Deceptive practices, such as posting
> the wrong voting hours, or misleasding information about student
> loans, parking tickets, and child support being tied to voting rights
> would not be stopped by voter picture id.

Nor would the photo ID prevent balloting machine fraud, like we
saw in New Mexico and Idaho--- where in dsome distrcts Bush2 was
*PREPUNCHED* on cards voters received. Nor would photo ID prevent
the GOP from placing three times as many balloting machines in
wealthy areas than in poor areas.


--
"I haven't seen any defensible explanation of any errors by Miskolczi." --- Bill Ward

[Desertphile]

On Sun, 5 Aug 2012 17:17:24 +0000 (UTC), fa...@rahul.net (Edward A.
Falk) wrote:

>
> Because not everybody can get them. In particular, it's harder for poor,
> old, or black people to get them. Since these people are more likely
> to vote Democrat, the Republicans are very keen to make it harder for
> them to vote.
>
> http://www.salon.com/2012/07/27/fla_republican_we_suppressed_black_votes/
>
> http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2012/03/06/439324/86-year-old-ohio-veteran-cant-vote-after-government-issued-id-is-rejected-at-poll/
>
> Republicans insist it's about stamping out voter fraud, but the number
> of actual cases of voter fraud that a photo id would have prevented
> is very small.

Why the bloody fuck is this posted to alt.global-warming?

In New Mexico and Arizona that are tens of thousands of American
citizens who do not have any kind of official / government
identification; they vote at many dozens of Chapter Houses, and
they and their families have been doing so since the late 1800s.
Expecting them to have photographic ID is just.... insane.

[James]

"Desertphile" <Deser...@spammegmail.com> wrote in message
news:g53u1858smlam2qrh...@4ax.com

> On Sun, 5 Aug 2012 17:17:24 +0000 (UTC), fa...@rahul.net (Edward A.
> Falk) wrote:
>
>>
>> Because not everybody can get them. In particular, it's harder for
>> poor, old, or black people to get them. Since these people are more
>> likely
>> to vote Democrat, the Republicans are very keen to make it harder for
>> them to vote.
>>
>> http://www.salon.com/2012/07/27/fla_republican_we_suppressed_black_votes/
>>
>> http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2012/03/06/439324/86-year-old-ohio-veteran-cant-vote-after-government-issued-id-is-rejected-at-poll/
>>
>> Republicans insist it's about stamping out voter fraud, but the
>> number of actual cases of voter fraud that a photo id would have
>> prevented
>> is very small.
>
> Why the bloody fuck is this posted to alt.global-warming?
>
> In New Mexico and Arizona that are tens of thousands of American
> citizens who do not have any kind of official / government
> identification; they vote at many dozens of Chapter Houses, and
> they and their families have been doing so since the late 1800s.
> Expecting them to have photographic ID is just.... insane.

Not insane at all.

>
> Nor would the photo ID prevent balloting machine fraud, like we
> saw in New Mexico and Idaho--- where in dsome distrcts Bush2 was
> *PREPUNCHED* on cards voters received. Nor would photo ID prevent
> the GOP from placing three times as many balloting machines in
> wealthy areas than in poor areas.

Idiot

[James]

"Edward A. Falk" <fa...@rahul.net> wrote in message
news:jvm9r4$ei4$1...@blue-new.rahul.net

> Because not everybody can get them. In particular, it's harder for
> poor, old, or black people to get them. Since these people are more
> likely
> to vote Democrat, the Republicans are very keen to make it harder for
> them to vote.

BS alert. They can get them easier than voting itself and nobody knows
who they will vote for.

>
> http://www.salon.com/2012/07/27/fla_republican_we_suppressed_black_votes/
>
> http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2012/03/06/439324/86-year-old-ohio-veteran-cant-vote-after-government-issued-id-is-rejected-at-poll/
>
> Republicans insist it's about stamping out voter fraud, but the number
> of actual cases of voter fraud that a photo id would have prevented
> is very small.

You don't know that.

[James]

"columbiaaccidentinvestigation"
<columbiaaccide...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:75a2eef3-4a91-4292...@d8g2000yqj.googlegroups.com

Everybody sees those things. So what's your point?

[erschro...@gmail.com]

On Aug 4, 5:26 pm, "James" <kingk...@iglou.com> wrote:
> eom

Lots of the elderly don't have photo ID. If they live in a rural
place, there may be no place close enough to get one. Many don't have
birth certificates -- 80-90 years ago, it was common in rural areas to
be born at home and the birth never officially registered. If there
is a birth certificate, it costs to get a certified copy of it.

And do you really think an 85-year old woman who's been living in the
same place all her life, who's been voting all her life (or maybe
since the 1965 Voting Rights Act) is an illegal alien?

[erschro...@gmail.com]

On Aug 5, 3:03 pm, AM <sctu...@comcast.net> wrote:
> On 8/5/2012 1:17 PM, Edward A. Falk wrote:
>
> > Because not everybody can get them.  In particular, it's harder for poor,
> > old, or black people to get them.  Since these people are more likely
> > to vote Democrat, the Republicans are very keen to make it harder for
> > them to vote.
>

> >http://www.salon.com/2012/07/27/fla_republican_we_suppressed_black_vo...
>
> >http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2012/03/06/439324/86-year-old-ohio-v...

>
> > Republicans insist it's about stamping out voter fraud, but the number
> > of actual cases of voter fraud that a photo id would have prevented
> > is very small.
>
> Why is it OK for me to HAVE to show a photo ID at the bank which is not
> a right, but not OK for someone to have to show a photo ID to vote ?
> (which is a right)
>
> ???

Banking isn't a constitutional right -- that's the whole point.
Denying someone the right to vote because they don't have a picture ID
is denying a constitutional right.

What if you needed a photo ID to attend church? Or to operate a
printing press? Or to assemble? Or to speak out publically?

[erschro...@gmail.com]

On Aug 5, 3:10 pm, Orval Fairbairn <orfairba...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> In article <jvm9r4$ei...@blue-new.rahul.net>,

>  f...@rahul.net (Edward A. Falk) wrote:
>
> > Because not everybody can get them.  In particular, it's harder for poor,
> > old, or black people to get them.  Since these people are more likely
> > to vote Democrat, the Republicans are very keen to make it harder for
> > them to vote.
>

> >http://www.salon.com/2012/07/27/fla_republican_we_suppressed_black_vo...
>
> >http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2012/03/06/439324/86-year-old-ohio-v...

> > nt-vote-after-government-issued-id-is-rejected-at-poll/
>
> > Republicans insist it's about stamping out voter fraud, but the number
> > of actual cases of voter fraud that a photo id would have prevented
> > is very small.
>
> Voter fraud is one of the most difficult acts to prove, since the perps
> leave a cold trail.
>
> When a Democrat operative goes down to Skid Row and hustles up a few
> dozen bums to go and vote as some name, there is no way of tracking them
> down. Voter ID throws some spikes into the road against such practices.

Why would that be illegal anyway, unless the people aren't citizens?
And you have to be registered to vote, so you can't just take people
there on election day?

[erschro...@gmail.com]

On Aug 5, 7:43 pm, Ken Marino <kpha...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> On Sun, 05 Aug 2012 17:17:24 +0000, Edward A. Falk wrote:
> > Because not everybody can get them.  In particular, it's harder for
> > poor, old, or black people to get them.  Since these people are more
> > likely to vote Democrat, the Republicans are very keen to make it harder
> > for them to vote.
>
> >http://www.salon.com/2012/07/27/
>
> fla_republican_we_suppressed_black_votes/
>
> >http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2012/03/06/439324/86-year-old-ohio-
>
> veteran-cant-vote-after-government-issued-id-is-rejected-at-poll/
>
>
>
> > Republicans insist it's about stamping out voter fraud, but the number
> > of actual cases of voter fraud that a photo id would have prevented is
> > very small.
>
> Most of the people you claim can't seem to find a way to identify
> themselves to vote have no trouble identiying themselves to get free
> gov't help. How do you explain that?

Your racism? You think all African-Americans are on welfare? What a
bigot.

>They can get the needed ID, get to
> the welfare office or anywhere else if it means free benefits,  but can't
> do the same to be able to vote?

Bigot.

[AM]

On 8/6/2012 1:45 PM, erschro...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Aug 5, 3:03 pm, AM <sctu...@comcast.net> wrote:
>> On 8/5/2012 1:17 PM, Edward A. Falk wrote:
>>
>>> Because not everybody can get them. In particular, it's harder for poor,
>>> old, or black people to get them. Since these people are more likely
>>> to vote Democrat, the Republicans are very keen to make it harder for
>>> them to vote.
>>
>>> http://www.salon.com/2012/07/27/fla_republican_we_suppressed_black_vo...
>>
>>> http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2012/03/06/439324/86-year-old-ohio-v...
>>
>>> Republicans insist it's about stamping out voter fraud, but the number
>>> of actual cases of voter fraud that a photo id would have prevented
>>> is very small.
>>
>> Why is it OK for me to HAVE to show a photo ID at the bank which is not
>> a right, but not OK for someone to have to show a photo ID to vote ?
>> (which is a right)
>>
>> ???
>
> Banking isn't a constitutional right -- that's the whole point.
> Denying someone the right to vote because they don't have a picture ID
> is denying a constitutional right.
>

With no photo ID, how does anyone know if the person voting is (besides
being a legal citizen) the person in question for that district, and if
they have not voted already ? Or if that person is even alive and
eligible to vote ?

If you don't have to have an ID to vote, whats to keep you from voting
repeatedly under different names ?

> What if you needed a photo ID to attend church? Or to operate a
> printing press? Or to assemble? Or to speak out publically?
>

Think about all the other things that one needs a photo ID to do.

Yet voting, one of the most important rights we have you don't want any
proof that the person is who they say they are ?



What are you so afraid of ?

[AM]

What's so bigoted in asking someone to show proof of who they are to
exercise one of the most important rights we have ?

[Edward A. Falk]

In article <98udnbD1gdtmWYPN...@giganews.com>,

AM <sct...@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>Why is it OK for me to HAVE to show a photo ID at the bank which is not
>a right, but not OK for someone to have to show a photo ID to vote ?
>(which is a right)

Whether the bank requires an ID or not is between you and the bank,
and it's for your protection. Requiring an ID to vote is only
intended to keep you from voting.

More examples:

http://www.aclupa.org/legal/legaldocket/applewhiteetalvcommonwealt/voteridclients.htm

Viviette Applewhite, 93. Born 1919 in Philadelphia, voted in every
election since 1960. Unable to obtain photo id and can no longer vote.

Wilola Lee, 59, born in Georgia. Former school principal, currently
a government state worker. Has been voting regularly for 30 years.
Unable to get a birth certificate; can no longer vote.

Grover Freeland, 72, born in Buffalo, NY. U.S. Army Veteran, honorably
discharged. Has not driven since 1980. His veteran's card, a photo
ID issued by the U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs is not accepted
at the polls.

Gloria Cuttino, 61, born in South Carolina. South Carolina has lost
her birth certificate and she cannot get a photo ID. She will have
to spend serious money and petition the court in SC for a replacement,
which won't happen in time for her to vote this year.

Nadine Marsh, 84, born in Pittsburgh. Never had a driver's
license. Pittsburgh has lost her birth certificate.

Dorothy Barksdale, 86. Born at home via midwife in Virginia. Previously
worked as a poll official. No driver's license, no birth certificate.

Joyce Block, 89. Born in Brooklyn, NY. Voted in nearly every election
since 1944. Never had a driver's license. She cannot get a photo
ID because her birth certificate and social security card are under
her maiden name. Her marriage certificate was written in Hebrew,
and officials would not accept it as evidence of name change.


http://www.post-gazette.com/stories/local/state/air-force-veteran-testifies-voter-id-law-could-prevent-him-from-casting-ballot-646865/

Danny Rosa, 63, Air Force veteran. No driver's license. State
won't issue a photo ID because his name was changed when his
mother married his stepfather, and now his birth certificate
does not match his verteran's ID card or discharge papers.

http://articles.latimes.com/2008/may/07/nation/na-voterid7

Angela Hiss, 19. Registered to vote in Indiana but still has Illinois
driver's license.

Nuns at a retirement home at Saint Mary's Convent not allowed to
vote for lack of photo id.

http://www.866ourvote.org/pages/think-getting-free-id-is-easy-think-again

Another couple dozen examples; read it yourself.


Or just use Google.

[columbiaaccidentinvestigation]

On Aug 6, 12:10 pm, AM <sctu...@comcast.net> wrote:

So you are now saying that the poll workers are now privelaged to ask
“Show me your papers!", just like in the old soviet days.

[Ken Marino]

No , not only do I not think so, I know so. There are a good many African
Americans I call friend. You probably even know one, by name at least.
Frank, THE BIG HURT, Thomas, who had an outstanding career with the White
Sox. It just happens that a higher % of the people on welfare/ food
stamps etc are blacks. On the same note, those who you claim would have
trouble obtaining proper ID are low income, causing that perceived
hardship. Those of low income, once again, come up with sufficient ID to
get there handouts. You only need to do that one time, unless you move.
And those of low income are less likely to move.

[Ken Marino]

As many others have said, try your arguement with a bank, police officer,
signing a contract,etc etc etc.

[columbiaaccidentinvestigation]

Not the same, as the companies/authorities are obligated to protect
your information on the other hand you are creating a defacto
authority out of a poll volunteer. GIven todays risks of identity
theft, revealing a picture id to a volunteer is voluntarily giving up
protection.

[Desertphile]

On Sun, 5 Aug 2012 22:11:24 -0400, "James" <king...@iglou.com>
wrote:

> On Sun, 05 Aug 2012 18:16:17 -0600, Desertphile <Deser...@spammegmail.com> wrote:
>
> > On Sun, 5 Aug 2012 17:17:24 +0000 (UTC), fa...@rahul.net (Edward A.
> > Falk) wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > Because not everybody can get them. In particular, it's harder for poor,
> > > old, or black people to get them. Since these people are more likely
> > > to vote Democrat, the Republicans are very keen to make it harder for
> > > them to vote.
> > >
> > > http://www.salon.com/2012/07/27/fla_republican_we_suppressed_black_votes/
> > >
> > > http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2012/03/06/439324/86-year-old-ohio-veteran-cant-vote-after-government-issued-id-is-rejected-at-poll/
> > >
> > > Republicans insist it's about stamping out voter fraud, but the number
> > > of actual cases of voter fraud that a photo id would have prevented
> > > is very small.

> > Why the bloody fuck is this posted to alt.global-warming?
> >
> > In New Mexico and Arizona that are tens of thousands of American
> > citizens who do not have any kind of official / government
> > identification; they vote at many dozens of Chapter Houses, and
> > they and their families have been doing so since the late 1800s.
> > Expecting them to have photographic ID is just.... insane.
> >

> > Nor would the photo ID prevent balloting machine fraud, like we
> > saw in New Mexico and Idaho--- where in dsome distrcts Bush2 was
> > *PREPUNCHED* on cards voters received. Nor would photo ID prevent
> > the GOP from placing three times as many balloting machines in
> > wealthy areas than in poor areas.

> Not insane at all. Idiot

Demanding that people who lack photographic ID produce
photographic ID is an insane, irrational demand.

Many tens of thousands of Americans live on American Indian
reservations and they have no official identification at all: the
demand that they not be allowed to vote because they have no
official ID is an evil, despotic, criminal demand.

Every tax-paying American Indian male was given the right to vote
more than 150 years ago. Denying them the right to vote is an
abomination, and a step backwards towards savagery.

Be ashamed.

[AM]

>>> �Show me your papers!", just like in the old soviet days.

>>
>> As many others have said, try your arguement with a bank, police officer,
>> signing a contract,etc etc etc.
>
> Not the same, as the companies/authorities are obligated to protect
> your information on the other hand you are creating a defacto
> authority out of a poll volunteer. GIven todays risks of identity
> theft, revealing a picture id to a volunteer is voluntarily giving up
> protection.
>

Then don't vote. Good grief, if one can't show proof of who they are so
they can exercise one of the most important rights we have, then how do
you know they even know who and what they are voting for ?

Showing ID is not a burden it's a guarantee that the person voting is
eligible to vote in the first place. Don't you want only eligible people
to vote ?


Try shoing up at the place where I vote without ID, and you will not get
to vote. Period. And that's the way it should be !

[AM]

Yeah it's funny. They can come up with an ID to get taxpayer benefits
such as welfare and food stamps, but somehow can't find their ID when
they want to vote ? No way, say it ain't so.......

[Desertphile]

The American Indian reservations all across the USA are crammed
full of voters of Democrat candidates who do not have any kind of
official identification at all, let alone photographic ID. The
entire point of demanding such ID is to prevent these American
citizens voting for President Obama--- this is obvious to even the
anti-science pseudo-conservatve denialists in this newsgroup
(surely they cannot be stupid enough to not understand this,
yes?).

New Mexico and Arizona are two fine examples of citizens who tend
to vote for Democrat Party candidates, and who do not have
photographic identification. Their parents never had such ID;
their grandparents did not either; in many cases their children do
not have any ID either.

[Desertphile]

Exactly so. I live and work on an American Indian reservation; a
bloody hell of a lot of my neighbors go to Chapter Houses to vote,
and damn few of them have any kind of official ID at all. They
tend to vote for their family members and their friends, most of
whom are members of the Deocrat Party or other non-Republican
party (there are more than 40 political parties in the USA).

The only thing the new "must have picture ID to vote" laws are
intended to do is to suppress voters who vote for Democrat Party
candidates.

[James]

"Desertphile" <Deser...@spammegmail.com> wrote in message

news:8up028t9p57at23fq...@4ax.com

Oh pleeeze

>
> Every tax-paying American Indian male was given the right to vote
> more than 150 years ago. Denying them the right to vote is an
> abomination, and a step backwards towards savagery.

Idiot.

>
> Be ashamed.

Cut the bs.

[James]

<erschro...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:b1332f10-adde-4dd8...@p8g2000yqa.googlegroups.com

> On Aug 5, 3:03 pm, AM <sctu...@comcast.net> wrote:
>> On 8/5/2012 1:17 PM, Edward A. Falk wrote:
>>
>>> Because not everybody can get them. In particular, it's harder for
>>> poor, old, or black people to get them. Since these people are more
>>> likely
>>> to vote Democrat, the Republicans are very keen to make it harder
>>> for them to vote.
>>
>>> http://www.salon.com/2012/07/27/fla_republican_we_suppressed_black_vo...
>>
>>> http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2012/03/06/439324/86-year-old-ohio-v...
>>
>>> Republicans insist it's about stamping out voter fraud, but the
>>> number of actual cases of voter fraud that a photo id would have
>>> prevented
>>> is very small.
>>
>> Why is it OK for me to HAVE to show a photo ID at the bank which is
>> not a right, but not OK for someone to have to show a photo ID to
>> vote ? (which is a right)
>>
>> ???
>
> Banking isn't a constitutional right -- that's the whole point.
> Denying someone the right to vote because they don't have a picture ID
> is denying a constitutional right.

No it doesn't. It's confirming his right.

[James]

<erschro...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:42bec991-5fb8-473b...@r7g2000yqr.googlegroups.com

Picture ID confirms who they are

> And you have to be registered to vote, so you can't just take people
> there on election day?

Yes you can. All you need is a name that is registered.

[James]

<erschro...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:128dc97e-4686-4aa7...@r9g2000yqr.googlegroups.com

> On Aug 5, 7:43 pm, Ken Marino <kpha...@earthlink.net> wrote:
>> On Sun, 05 Aug 2012 17:17:24 +0000, Edward A. Falk wrote:
>>> Because not everybody can get them. In particular, it's harder for
>>> poor, old, or black people to get them. Since these people are more
>>> likely to vote Democrat, the Republicans are very keen to make it
>>> harder for them to vote.
>>
>>> http://www.salon.com/2012/07/27/
>>
>> fla_republican_we_suppressed_black_votes/
>>
>>> http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2012/03/06/439324/86-year-old-ohio-
>>
>> veteran-cant-vote-after-government-issued-id-is-rejected-at-poll/
>>
>>
>>
>>> Republicans insist it's about stamping out voter fraud, but the
>>> number of actual cases of voter fraud that a photo id would have
>>> prevented is very small.
>>
>> Most of the people you claim can't seem to find a way to identify
>> themselves to vote have no trouble identiying themselves to get free
>> gov't help. How do you explain that?
>
> Your racism? You think all African-Americans are on welfare? What a
> bigot.

This is not about race and you know it. Why inject it?

[James]

"columbiaaccidentinvestigation"
<columbiaaccide...@yahoo.com> wrote in message

news:267f33f4-23b6-4cb1...@gr5g2000pbc.googlegroups.com

>>> ask �Show me your papers!", just like in the old soviet days.

>>
>> As many others have said, try your arguement with a bank, police
>> officer, signing a contract,etc etc etc.
>
> Not the same, as the companies/authorities are obligated to protect
> your information on the other hand you are creating a defacto
> authority out of a poll volunteer. GIven todays risks of identity
> theft, revealing a picture id to a volunteer is voluntarily giving up
> protection.

rotflmao Now shoo.

[James]

<erschro...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:5a738231-eb68-4379...@d8g2000yqj.googlegroups.com

> On Aug 4, 5:26 pm, "James" <kingk...@iglou.com> wrote:
>> eom
>
> Lots of the elderly don't have photo ID. If they live in a rural
> place, there may be no place close enough to get one. Many don't have
> birth certificates -- 80-90 years ago, it was common in rural areas to
> be born at home and the birth never officially registered. If there
> is a birth certificate, it costs to get a certified copy of it.

There are tons of people out there that didn't get their births
registered. When they needed one, the birth registration has a procedure
to issue one.

>
> And do you really think an 85-year old woman who's been living in the
> same place all her life, who's been voting all her life (or maybe
> since the 1965 Voting Rights Act) is an illegal alien?

No, but she needs an ID to prove it.

[James]

"James" <king...@iglou.com> wrote in message
news:501d945a$0$19783$d94e...@news.iglou.com
> eom

This question is very illuminating when libs start making up examples,
whether true or fabricated, of how it's a conspiracy to keep certain
people from voting.

[columbiaaccidentinvestigation]

> >>> “Show me your papers!", just like in the old soviet days.

> >> As many others have said, try your arguement with a bank, police officer,
> >> signing a contract,etc etc etc.
> > Not the same, as the companies/authorities are obligated to protect
> > your information on the other hand you are creating a defacto
> > authority out of a poll volunteer.  GIven todays risks of identity
> > theft, revealing a picture id to a volunteer is voluntarily giving up
> > protection.
> Then don't vote. Good grief, if one can't show proof of who they are so
> they can exercise one of the most important rights we have, then how do
> you know they even know who and what they are voting for ?
> Showing ID is not a burden it's a guarantee that the person voting is
> eligible to vote in the first place. Don't you want only eligible people
> to vote ?
> Try shoing up at the place where I vote without ID, and you will not get
> to vote. Period. And that's the way it should be !

Let us set the record straight, first personal information found on
drivers does assist in the malicious act of identity theft that is a
fact. Second State authorities recommend that a consumer use a
banking services additional protection against identity theft. So the
state the very entity which conducts the elections recommends using an
additional service not just the standard protection but extra
protection against id theft for a cost, and yet you would provide NONE
in a process were people could easily gather such a persons personal
information at one location. You are advocating for local community
volunteers should be trusted with additional personal information, any
one of which could use the additional information found on a drivers
license to conduct identity theft. The polling place is not like a
business where I can choose to use another service; you are mandating
I place myself at a higher risk for identity theft, in a process where
the constitution states there should be no impedance to my
participation. Your recommendation is that I do not vote, and my
recommendation is that if you are going to change the system you must
put in place the protection otherwise you will be impeding on my
constitutional rights.

[columbiaaccidentinvestigation]

On Aug 6, 7:34 pm, "James" <kingk...@iglou.com> wrote:
> "columbiaaccidentinvestigation"<columbiaaccidentinvestigat...@yahoo.com> wrote in message

> >>> ask “Show me your papers!", just like in the old soviet days.

>
> >> As many others have said, try your arguement with a bank, police
> >> officer, signing a contract,etc etc etc.
>
> > Not the same, as the companies/authorities are obligated to protect
> > your information on the other hand you are creating a defacto
> > authority out of a poll volunteer.  GIven todays risks of identity
> > theft, revealing a picture id to a volunteer is voluntarily giving up
> > protection.
>
> rotflmao  Now shoo.

Get yourself up off the floor and offer a real argument, and quit
hiding behind the proverbial glass jaw, otherwise you will get red
carded for taking a dive.

[columbiaaccidentinvestigation]

On Aug 6, 12:24 pm, f...@rahul.net (Edward A. Falk) wrote:
> In article <98udnbD1gdtmWYPNnZ2dnUVZ_hEAA...@giganews.com>,

>
> AM  <sctu...@comcast.net> wrote:
>
> >Why is it OK for me to HAVE to show a photo ID at the bank which is not
> >a right, but not OK for someone to have to show a photo ID to vote ?
> >(which is a right)
>
> Whether the bank requires an ID or not is between you and the bank,
> and it's for your protection.  Requiring an ID to vote is only
> intended to keep you from voting.
>
> More examples:
>

> http://www.aclupa.org/legal/legaldocket/applewhiteetalvcommonwealt/vo...

>
>   Viviette Applewhite, 93. Born 1919 in Philadelphia, voted in every
>   election since 1960.  Unable to obtain photo id and can no longer vote.
>
>   Wilola Lee, 59, born in Georgia. Former school principal, currently
>   a government state worker.  Has been voting regularly for 30 years.
>   Unable to get a birth certificate; can no longer vote.
>
>   Grover Freeland, 72, born in Buffalo, NY. U.S. Army Veteran, honorably
>   discharged.  Has not driven since 1980. His veteran's card, a photo
>   ID issued by the U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs is not accepted
>   at the polls.
>
>   Gloria Cuttino, 61, born in South Carolina.  South Carolina has lost
>   her birth certificate and she cannot get a photo ID.  She will have
>   to spend serious money and petition the court in SC for a replacement,
>   which won't happen in time for her to vote this year.
>
>   Nadine Marsh, 84, born in Pittsburgh.  Never had a driver's
>   license. Pittsburgh has lost her birth certificate.
>
>   Dorothy Barksdale, 86. Born at home via midwife in Virginia.  Previously
>   worked as a poll official.  No driver's license, no birth certificate.
>
>   Joyce Block, 89. Born in Brooklyn, NY.  Voted in nearly every election
>   since 1944.  Never had a driver's license. She cannot get a photo
>   ID because her birth certificate and social security card are under
>   her maiden name. Her marriage certificate was written in Hebrew,
>   and officials would not accept it as evidence of name change.
>

> http://www.post-gazette.com/stories/local/state/air-force-veteran-tes...

>
>   Danny Rosa, 63, Air Force veteran.  No driver's license.  State
>   won't issue a photo ID because his name was changed when his
>   mother married his stepfather, and now his birth certificate
>   does not match his verteran's ID card or discharge papers.
>
> http://articles.latimes.com/2008/may/07/nation/na-voterid7
>
>   Angela Hiss, 19. Registered to vote in Indiana but still has Illinois
>   driver's license.
>
>   Nuns at a retirement home at Saint Mary's Convent not allowed to
>   vote for lack of photo id.
>

> http://www.866ourvote.org/pages/think-getting-free-id-is-easy-think-a...

>
>   Another couple dozen examples; read it yourself.
>
> Or just use Google.
>
> --

>         -Ed Falk, f...@despams.r.us.com
>        http://thespamdiaries.blogspot.com/

thanks for the info

[AM]

Yeah right. That all sounds good, any proof of what you write happening
because of polling place volunteers ?


And.... All one has to do is get a voter ID card. Which we have here in
VA so one does NOT have to show their drivers license at the polling
place, only show it at the DMV to get their voter ID card. Which has NO
personal info except your name and address.

So NOW whats the problem ??

[columbiaaccidentinvestigation]

On Aug 7, 5:04 am, AM <sctu...@comcast.net> wrote:
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.global-warming/msg/d8cf281c49576a0c?hl=en-gb

Nope, a fake dismissal on your part does not validate your idiocy. So
are you really claiming identity theft is not a problem, as that
would be wrong on your part. Date of birth is found on the drivers
liscence, and thats a common photo id. Having a persons date of birth
assists in the malicous act of identity theft. The advice from the
authorities as to how to protect myself from identitiy theft is to
limit the number of people who would be viewing my drivers liscence.
But you want to increase that number which inherently increases risk
of my personal loss. Im told to shred my personal papers in order to
protect myself from identity theft, but you would have no additional
protections. Thats where the comparison of starting a bank account
fails, because as a consumer i can pick and choose what kind of
protection, but you would mandate i have none when voting. At the
heart of your argument is that the additional requirement will not be
an undue burden, but it will cause an undue burden by increasing risk
to identity theft. The problem is people like you who dont think, they
just follow blindly expecting others to not question your stupidity.

[AM]

>>>>>>> �Show me your papers!", just like in the old soviet days.

I just wrote and you did not reply to, that all one has to do is get a
VOTER ID CARD. No problem and no personal information is revealed except
your name and address.

You have a problem with a voter ID card ?

[columbiaaccidentinvestigation]

On Aug 7, 6:24 am, AM <sctu...@comcast.net> wrote:
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.global-warming/msg/2b1063a4848dcaaf?hl=en-gb

> On 8/7/2012 9:22 AM, columbiaaccidentinvestigation wrote:
> > On Aug 7, 5:04 am, AM <sctu...@comcast.net> wrote:

> >http://groups.google.com/group/alt.global-warming/msg/d8cf281c49576a0...

> >>>>>>> “Show me your papers!", just like in the old soviet days.

Now if you allege possible malice by voters, but you dodge the
potential malice by poll workers in an effort to prop up your lame
idea, it would seem you are acting in a hypocritical manner. How many
people only have one form of photo id their driver’s license? You are
creating a focal point where a potential criminal could have access to
information, I understand that if you assume no malice at all by poll
workers you can insulate you argument, but that would be wrong on your
part. You want to prevent a potential crime, but in doing so, you
would also create more opportunities for criminals. So how much money
is lost every year due to ID theft?

[columbiaaccidentinvestigation]

On Aug 5, 12:03 pm, AM <sctu...@comcast.net> wrote:

> On 8/5/2012 1:17 PM, Edward A. Falk wrote:
>
> > Because not everybody can get them.  In particular, it's harder for poor,
> > old, or black people to get them.  Since these people are more likely
> > to vote Democrat, the Republicans are very keen to make it harder for
> > them to vote.
>

> >http://www.salon.com/2012/07/27/fla_republican_we_suppressed_black_vo...
>
> >http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2012/03/06/439324/86-year-old-ohio-v...

>
> > Republicans insist it's about stamping out voter fraud, but the number
> > of actual cases of voter fraud that a photo id would have prevented
> > is very small.
>

> Why is it OK for me to HAVE to show a photo ID at the bank which is not
> a right, but not OK for someone to have to show a photo ID to vote ?
> (which is a right)
>

> ???

At this point, you must admit your idea has flaws, and should be
scrapped.

[columbiaaccidentinvestigation]

On Aug 7, 9:34 am, columbiaaccidentinvestigation

http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/brochures/fast_facts/ffdl24.htm
Identity Theft Have You Been A Victim of Identity Theft

[Orval Fairbairn]

In article
<42bec991-5fb8-473b...@r7g2000yqr.googlegroups.com>,

"erschro...@gmail.com" <erschro...@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Aug 5, 3:10�pm, Orval Fairbairn <orfairba...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> > In article <jvm9r4$ei...@blue-new.rahul.net>,

> > �f...@rahul.net (Edward A. Falk) wrote:
> >
> > > Because not everybody can get them. �In particular, it's harder for poor,
> > > old, or black people to get them. �Since these people are more likely
> > > to vote Democrat, the Republicans are very keen to make it harder for
> > > them to vote.
> >
> > >http://www.salon.com/2012/07/27/fla_republican_we_suppressed_black_vo...
> >
> > >http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2012/03/06/439324/86-year-old-ohio-v...

> > > nt-vote-after-government-issued-id-is-rejected-at-poll/

> >
> > > Republicans insist it's about stamping out voter fraud, but the number
> > > of actual cases of voter fraud that a photo id would have prevented
> > > is very small.
> >

> > Voter fraud is one of the most difficult acts to prove, since the perps
> > leave a cold trail.
> >
> > When a Democrat operative goes down to Skid Row and hustles up a few
> > dozen bums to go and vote as some name, there is no way of tracking them
> > down. Voter ID throws some spikes into the road against such practices.
>
> Why would that be illegal anyway, unless the people aren't citizens?

> And you have to be registered to vote, so you can't just take people
> there on election day?

You can with "same day" registration.

[Orval Fairbairn]

In article <50208258$0$13241$d94e...@news.iglou.com>,

What it means is that photo ID is one of the most important means of
assuring clean elections.

No longer (assuming that poll workers follow the law) can community
organizers sign up bums off the street (sometimes under multiple names)
and bus them from precinct to precinct to stuff the ballot boxes.

It also means that those self-same organizers are now hampered from
scouring the cemeteries for voter name to give to their bums.

"Methinks they protest too much."

[columbiaaccidentinvestigation]

On Aug 5, 12:03 pm, AM <sctu...@comcast.net> wrote:" Why is it OK for

me to HAVE to show a photo ID at the bank which is not a right, but
not OK for someone to have to show a photo ID to vote ? (which is a
right) ???"

On Aug 7, 6:24 am, AM <sctu...@comcast.net> wrote:" I just wrote and

you did not reply to, that all one has to do is get a VOTER ID CARD.
No problem and no personal information is revealed except your name
and address.

On Aug 6, 6:07 pm, AM <sctu...@comcast.net> wrote:" Try shoing up at

the place where I vote without ID, and you will not get to vote.
Period. And that's the way it should be !"

On Aug 7, 5:04 am, AM <sctu...@comcast.net> wrote:" And.... All one

has to do is get a voter ID card. Which we have here in VA so one does
NOT have to show their drivers license at the polling place, only show
it at the DMV to get their voter ID card. Which has NO personal info
except your name and address."

On Aug 4, 2:26 pm, "James" <kingk...@iglou.com> wrote:"Why is a
picture ID opposed for voting?

So the topic starts with the concept of a photo ID requirement for
voting, and you argued against those who don’t want such a policy
change. You then shifted from “photo ID”, to a “voter id card”, that
would be a concession on your part. At this point, its rather
obvious people like you don’t have a clue as to the impact of such a
policy, even though you rail against the unintended consequences of
policy and legislation. Requiring a photo id to vote, places the
voter at a risk for identity theft. Here in California we have a
rather large ballot, creating a good amount of work if the voter wants
to be well informed when casting his or her vote. My voting
experience should not be burdened with additional financial risk, and
your photo id requirement would increase the risk of a voter being the
victim of identity theft. Its that simple your idea has unintended
consequences which is increased risk to identity theft.

http://www.privacy.ca.gov/consumers/identity_theft.shtml
"Identity Theft
Identity Theft First Aid
Identity theft is taking someone else's personal information and using
it for an unlawful purpose (California Penal Code Section 530.5). It
is a serious crime with serious consequences.
There were 11.6 million U.S. adults who were victims of identity theft
in 2011. That represents 4.9% of adults, including over a million
Californians. The total cost of identity theft in 2011 was $18
billion. The average victim spent $354 and 12 hours to resolve the
problem and clear up records."

[AM]

'


What flaws ?


What is wrong about showing an ID to vote ?

It's easy to get a voter ID card, and it reveals no personal info except
for name and address. To get one, you do have to prove you are a legal
citizen, and not a felon, but they are free, no cost required.



So what you are saying is that I don't need an ID to vote.

Which means I can just find names in my district and vote as many times
as I like. With no proof needed, whats to stop me if I don't have to
prove who I am ?

You have an answer for this ?

[AM]

Voter ID cards have no info anyone can use to commit identity theft. No
more info than say every time you use a credit card, which most people
do all the time.

Your argument is bogus. Even more funny, the link you provided proves
there are soo many other ways to commit identity theft, they don't even
mention it in the context of voting.

Thanx for proving my point !

[AM]

On 8/7/2012 1:24 PM, columbiaaccidentinvestigation wrote:
> So the topic starts with the concept of a photo ID requirement for

> voting, and you argued against those who don�t want such a policy
> change. You then shifted from �photo ID�, to a �voter id card�, that

> would be a concession on your part.

No concession at all. You need a photo ID at the DMV to get a voter ID
card. (which is free) Here in Virginia either one will get you into a
voting place. If you have neither you don't get to vote period.

> At this point, its rather

> obvious people like you don�t have a clue as to the impact of such a
> policy,



What ? A policy that insures that the person voting is really who they
say they are, whats wrong with that ?

> even though you rail against the unintended consequences of
> policy and legislation.

What unintended consequences ? Of yeah, that identity theft mumbo jumbo
again...

> Requiring a photo id to vote, places the
> voter at a risk for identity theft.

With a FREE voter ID card no photo ID required at the voting place.

> Here in California we have a
> rather large ballot, creating a good amount of work if the voter wants
> to be well informed when casting his or her vote. My voting
> experience should not be burdened with additional financial risk, and
> your photo id requirement would increase the risk of a voter being the
> victim of identity theft. Its that simple your idea has unintended
> consequences which is increased risk to identity theft.

If identity theft is the best argument you have that is lame.

Since you are on the unintended consequences line. how about the
unintended consequence of people voting as many times as they like if
no ID is required, whats to stop it from happening ?


IS it too much to ask that someone show proof of who they are and that
they are not a felon before they vote ?

[columbiaaccidentinvestigation]

cost, either the state or the person pays, and if the person pays for
the additional id it is in fact a poll tax.

[columbiaaccidentinvestigation]

On Aug 7, 11:39 am, AM <sctu...@comcast.net> wrote:" With a FREE voter

ID card no photo ID required at the voting place."

Are you calling use of taxpayers money "free"?

[Orval Fairbairn]

In article
<9bb4f886-05b9-492a...@td3g2000pbc.googlegroups.com>,
columbiaaccidentinvestigation

It's an even bigger cost when the criminals corrupt the voting process
and elect their fellow criminals to loot the treasury.

[BeamMeUpScotty]

------------------------------------------------------

DIFFERENT POST IGNORE ATTRIBUTES

>>
>> That would be why you need a PHOTO ID to buy a gun....
>>
>> To get rid of the elderly buyers and lower 2nd amendment
>> participation
>> and to prevent folks from owning and using their firearms.
>>
>> But isn't Eric Holder suing TEXAS on the ground that it's
>> discrimination
>> for requiring a Photo ID to vote. And doesn't that mean that if Eric
>> Holder wins that SCOTUS will also be saying that requiring a photo ID
>> for exercising your gun rights is discrimination?
>>
>> *Rumination*
>>
>> #40 - The truth is always the truth, it doesn't matter if it's
>> discovered by accident or by genius, it's always the truth.
>
> are you saying that the tea party has the right to shoot up polling
> places without the fear of showing a ID to buy a gun. but the voter
> must show ID to vote, correct?



I thought I said that if one is discrimination then surely the other is
discrimination and that both RIGHTS will either be subject to a PHOTO ID
or neither will be subject to a PHOTO ID, depending on whether Eric
Holder wins his LAW SUIT AGAINST TEXAS.

[columbiaaccidentinvestigation]

On Aug 7, 11:30 am, AM <sctu...@comcast.net> wrote:" Voter ID cards

have no info anyone can use to commit identity theft. "

http://groups.google.com/group/alt.global-warming/msg/7be1175d6cfb335d?hl=en-gb

You are wrong, and your denial is a joke! See the image of the georgia
voter id card it has date of birth and address of the voter. Two
pieces of information that assist in the malicous act of identity
theft. Viginia's ID card has a date of birth, please explain why you
think different, as the picture confims the fact you are wrong.

http://www.policeandsheriffspress.com/vic/
"Welcome
Welcome to the Georgia Voter ID System website! This site has been
created for you the Georgia Voter Registrar. As you can see from the
menu there are copies of the Quick Reference Guide, Training Manual,
Frequently Asked Questions section, and Contact Information. We hope
that you enjoy using this site and find it to be helpful."

[BeamMeUpScotty]

That would be why you need a PHOTO ID to buy a gun....

To get rid of the elderly buyers and lower 2nd amendment
participation and to prevent folks from owning and using their firearms.

But isn't Eric Holder suing TEXAS on the ground that it's
discrimination for requiring a Photo ID to vote. And doesn't that mean
that if Eric
Holder wins that SCOTUS will also be saying that requiring a photo ID
for exercising your gun rights is discrimination?

The truth is always the truth, it doesn't matter if it's
discovered by accident or by genius, it's always the truth.

[columbiaaccidentinvestigation]

On Aug 7, 12:29 pm, Orval Fairbairn <orfairba...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> In article

> <9bb4f886-05b9-492a-9dba-b4003a1e7...@td3g2000pbc.googlegroups.com>,
>  columbiaaccidentinvestigation

that would be another bs illogical assertion on your part attempting
to validate ignorance of the unintended consequences of a proposed
change to our laws.

[columbiaaccidentinvestigation]

On Aug 7, 12:42 pm, BeamMeUpScotty
<ThenDestroyEveryth...@blackhole.nebulax.com> wrote:
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.global-warming/msg/651ba5ca7439a18d?hl=en-gb

are you claiming a poll tax is constitutional?

[erschro...@gmail.com]

On Aug 6, 10:31 pm, "James" <kingk...@iglou.com> wrote:
> <erschroedin...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:128dc97e-4686-4aa7...@r9g2000yqr.googlegroups.com

>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Aug 5, 7:43 pm, Ken Marino <kpha...@earthlink.net> wrote:

> >> On Sun, 05 Aug 2012 17:17:24 +0000, Edward A. Falk wrote:
> >>> Because not everybody can get them. In particular, it's harder for
> >>> poor, old, or black people to get them. Since these people are more
> >>> likely to vote Democrat, the Republicans are very keen to make it
> >>> harder for them to vote.
>

> >>>http://www.salon.com/2012/07/27/
>
> >> fla_republican_we_suppressed_black_votes/
>
> >>>http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2012/03/06/439324/86-year-old-ohio-
>
> >> veteran-cant-vote-after-government-issued-id-is-rejected-at-poll/
>

> >>> Republicans insist it's about stamping out voter fraud, but the
> >>> number of actual cases of voter fraud that a photo id would have
> >>> prevented is very small.
>

> >> Most of the people you claim can't seem to find a way to identify
> >> themselves to vote have no trouble identiying themselves to get free
> >> gov't help. How do you explain that?
>
> > Your racism?  You think all African-Americans are on welfare?  What a
> > bigot.
>

> This is not about race and you know it. Why inject it?

>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> >> They can get the needed ID, get to
> >> the welfare office or anywhere else if it means free benefits, but
> >> can't do the same to be able to vote?
>
> > Bigot.

Because this all started when a black man became president. Because
the majority leader of the PA house said the voter ID law would
"deliver Pennsylvania to Romney."

[erschro...@gmail.com]

On Aug 6, 10:46 pm, "James" <kingk...@iglou.com> wrote:
> "James" <kingk...@iglou.com> wrote in message

Well, you make up examples of voter fraud, as in most states, there's
not a single shred of evidence one has ever occurred.

[erschro...@gmail.com]

On Aug 6, 10:43 pm, "James" <kingk...@iglou.com> wrote:
> <erschroedin...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>

> news:5a738231-eb68-4379...@d8g2000yqj.googlegroups.com
>
> > On Aug 4, 5:26 pm, "James" <kingk...@iglou.com> wrote:
> >> eom
>
> > Lots of the elderly don't have photo ID.  If they live in a rural
> > place, there may be no place close enough to get one.  Many don't have
> > birth certificates -- 80-90 years ago, it was common in rural areas to
> > be born at home and the birth never officially registered.  If there
> > is a birth certificate, it costs to get a certified copy of it.
>
> There are tons of people out there that didn't get their births
> registered. When they needed one, the birth registration has a procedure
> to issue one.

And you're expecting an 85-year old woman who lives a long way from
any DMV office to work through all that? In GA, for example, even to
get a birth certificate copy, you have to download a form, fill it in,
get a money order or certified check for $25, and mail it in. Then
there's not even a guarantee the state will find your birth
certificate on file.

Oh, the DMV web site says to "inquire" if you never had a birth
certificate. When you do, you find you need someone who witnessed the
birth. Good luck with that.

>
>
>
> > And do you really think an 85-year old woman who's been living in the
> > same place all her life, who's been voting all her life (or maybe
> > since the 1965 Voting Rights Act) is an illegal alien?
>
> No, but she needs an ID to prove it.

Why?

[erschro...@gmail.com]

You need a birth certificate to get one (and if you don't have a copy,
you have to pay for one). You need to go in person to a DMV office
and pay to get one.

What other constitutional right do you have to pay to exercise?

And if you don't have a birth certificate on file, what do you do?

[erschro...@gmail.com]

On Aug 7, 2:26 pm, AM <sctu...@comcast.net> wrote:
> On 8/7/2012 12:34 PM, columbiaaccidentinvestigation wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Aug 5, 12:03 pm, AM <sctu...@comcast.net> wrote:
> >> On 8/5/2012 1:17 PM, Edward A. Falk wrote:
>
> >>> Because not everybody can get them.  In particular, it's harder for poor,
> >>> old, or black people to get them.  Since these people are more likely
> >>> to vote Democrat, the Republicans are very keen to make it harder for
> >>> them to vote.
>
> >>>http://www.salon.com/2012/07/27/fla_republican_we_suppressed_black_vo...
>
> >>>http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2012/03/06/439324/86-year-old-ohio-v...
>
> >>> Republicans insist it's about stamping out voter fraud, but the number
> >>> of actual cases of voter fraud that a photo id would have prevented
> >>> is very small.
>
> >> Why is it OK for me to HAVE to show a photo ID at the bank which is not
> >> a right, but not OK for someone to have to show a photo ID to vote ?
> >> (which is a right)
>
> >> ???
>
> > At this point, you must admit your idea has flaws, and should be
> > scrapped.
>
> '
>
> What flaws ?
>
> What is wrong about showing an ID to vote ?

Not everybody has one or can get one.

>
> It's easy to get a voter ID card, and it reveals no personal info except
> for name and address. To get one, you do have to prove you are a legal
> citizen, and not a felon, but they are free, no cost required.

Really? They're not in GA, and you have to have a certified copy of a
birth certificate (which costs $25) to get one.

>
> So what you are saying is that I don't need an ID to vote.
>
> Which means I can just find names in my district and vote as many times
> as I like. With no proof needed, whats to stop me if I don't have to
> prove who I am ?

What would stop you from getting multiple ID cards?

[erschro...@gmail.com]

On Aug 7, 3:29 pm, Orval Fairbairn <orfairba...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> In article
> <9bb4f886-05b9-492a-9dba-b4003a1e7...@td3g2000pbc.googlegroups.com>,
>  columbiaaccidentinvestigation
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

Cite proof this has happened.

[erschro...@gmail.com]

On Aug 7, 3:42 pm, BeamMeUpScotty

Not a constitutional right.

>
>  To get rid of the elderly buyers and lower 2nd amendment
>  participation and to prevent folks from owning and using their firearms.
>
>  But isn't Eric Holder suing TEXAS on the ground that it's
>  discrimination for requiring a Photo ID to vote.  And doesn't that mean
> that if Eric
>  Holder wins that SCOTUS will also be saying that requiring a photo ID
>  for exercising your gun rights is discrimination?

No. SCOTUS has held you can restrict certain people from buying guns;
you can't restrict people from voting.

>
>  The truth is always the truth, it doesn't matter if it's
>  discovered by accident or by genius, it's always the truth.
>
> I said that if one is discrimination then surely the other is
> discrimination and that both RIGHTS will either be subject to a PHOTO ID
> or neither will be subject to a PHOTO ID, depending on whether Eric
> Holder wins his LAW SUIT AGAINST TEXAS.

You're as much a constitutional scholar as you are a scientist.

[erschro...@gmail.com]

On Aug 7, 1:15 pm, Orval Fairbairn <orfairba...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> In article <50208258$0$13241$d94e5...@news.iglou.com>,
>
>  "James" <kingk...@iglou.com> wrote:
> > "James" <kingk...@iglou.com> wrote in message

> >news:501d945a$0$19783$d94e...@news.iglou.com
> > > eom
>
> > This question is very illuminating when libs start making up examples,
> > whether true or fabricated, of how it's a conspiracy to keep certain
> > people from voting.
>
> What it means is that photo ID is one of the most important means of
> assuring clean elections.

Considering the cases of documented voter fraud can be counted on 2
hands, this is just not a problem.

>
> No longer (assuming that poll workers follow the law) can community
> organizers sign up bums off the street (sometimes under multiple names)
> and bus them from precinct to precinct to stuff the ballot boxes.

Cite proof this has happened.


>

> It also means that those self-same organizers are now hampered from
> scouring the cemeteries for voter name to give to their bums.

Again, cite proof this has happened.

[Ken Marino]

On Mon, 06 Aug 2012 19:23:01 -0600, Desertphile wrote:

> On Mon, 6 Aug 2012 10:43:38 -0700 (PDT), "erschro...@gmail.com"
> <erschro...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> On Aug 4, 5:26 pm, "James" <kingk...@iglou.com> wrote:
>
>> > eom
>
>> Lots of the elderly don't have photo ID. If they live in a rural
>> place, there may be no place close enough to get one. Many don't have
>> birth certificates -- 80-90 years ago, it was common in rural areas to
>> be born at home and the birth never officially registered. If there is
>> a birth certificate, it costs to get a certified copy of it.
>>

>> And do you really think an 85-year old woman who's been living in the
>> same place all her life, who's been voting all her life (or maybe since
>> the 1965 Voting Rights Act) is an illegal alien?
>

> The American Indian reservations all across the USA are crammed full of
> voters of Democrat candidates who do not have any kind of official
> identification at all, let alone photographic ID. The entire point of
> demanding such ID is to prevent these American citizens voting for
> President Obama--- this is obvious to even the anti-science
> pseudo-conservatve denialists in this newsgroup (surely they cannot be
> stupid enough to not understand this, yes?).
>
> New Mexico and Arizona are two fine examples of citizens who tend to
> vote for Democrat Party candidates, and who do not have photographic
> identification. Their parents never had such ID; their grandparents did
> not either; in many cases their children do not have any ID either.

Their parents probably didn't have computers. Their grandparents probably
didn't have TV's. Guess we'll say they can't have those either if they
can't get an ID.

[Ken Marino]

On Tue, 07 Aug 2012 13:25:14 -0700, erschro...@gmail.com wrote:

Somehow that fictitious 85 year old proved who she was to get SS
benefits, I'll bet.

[Ken Marino]

Try this link about no voter fraud:


It seems in '08, 1099 convicted felons voted when they had no right to do
so. No big deal, right? In the sceme of things it's a pitance. Except for
one little detail. It was the election Al Frankin one in a disputed
election by just 312 votes. I'm ready libs. Spin this one. These votes
were never thrown out. How could they be. No way to insure they all vote
democratic, but we all know they did.

http://washingtonexaminer.com/york-when-1099-felons-vote-in-race-won-
by-312-ballots/article/2504163

[AM]

The individual does not pay. And since you are all for govt spending
that shouldn't be an issue right ?

[AM]

google it for yourself. Felons voting happens all the time.....

[columbiaaccidentinvestigation]

On Aug 7, 1:52 pm, AM <sctu...@comcast.net> wrote:
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.global-warming/msg/da5cdf5534cb7d97

Contrary to your belief, taxpayer money is not free, but since you
support raising taxes it should not be an issue right? (just ask
grover norquist)

[Edward A. Falk]

In article <E9adnYFU5Mc4HLzN...@giganews.com>,

Sometimes the individual pays. Sometimes the individual has to
get a lawyer.

If you could absolutely guarantee that every eligible voter could
get a photo id, that it wouldn't cost them a dime, and that no
undue burden would be placed on them to get it, then I would be
ok with it.

However, that is simply not the case. See the references I posted
above.

--
-Ed Falk, fa...@despams.r.us.com
http://thespamdiaries.blogspot.com/

[AM]

On 8/7/2012 8:54 PM, Edward A. Falk wrote:
> In article <E9adnYFU5Mc4HLzN...@giganews.com>,
> AM <sct...@comcast.net> wrote:
>> On 8/7/2012 3:16 PM, columbiaaccidentinvestigation wrote:
>>
>> The individual does not pay. And since you are all for govt spending
>> that shouldn't be an issue right ?
>
> Sometimes the individual pays. Sometimes the individual has to
> get a lawyer.
>
> If you could absolutely guarantee that every eligible voter could
> get a photo id, that it wouldn't cost them a dime, and that no
> undue burden would be placed on them to get it, then I would be
> ok with it.
>
> However, that is simply not the case. See the references I posted
> above.
>

Then under your plan of no ID needed you have no problem with me voting
hundreds and hundreds of times in an election ?


Well ?

[James]

<erschro...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:a29e9080-8812-4192...@d8g2000yqj.googlegroups.com

Every election

[Ken Marino]

On Mon, 06 Aug 2012 10:45:05 -0700, erschro...@gmail.com wrote:

> On Aug 5, 3:03 pm, AM <sctu...@comcast.net> wrote:
>> On 8/5/2012 1:17 PM, Edward A. Falk wrote:
>>
>> > Because not everybody can get them.  In particular, it's harder for
>> > poor, old, or black people to get them.  Since these people are more
>> > likely to vote Democrat, the Republicans are very keen to make it
>> > harder for them to vote.
>>
>> >http://www.salon.com/2012/07/27/
fla_republican_we_suppressed_black_vo...
>>
>> >http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2012/03/06/439324/86-year-old-ohio-
v...
>>
>> > Republicans insist it's about stamping out voter fraud, but the
>> > number of actual cases of voter fraud that a photo id would have
>> > prevented is very small.
>>
>> Why is it OK for me to HAVE to show a photo ID at the bank which is not
>> a right, but not OK for someone to have to show a photo ID to vote ?
>> (which is a right)
>>
>> ???
>

> Banking isn't a constitutional right -- that's the whole point. Denying
> someone the right to vote because they don't have a picture ID is
> denying a constitutional right.
>
> What if you needed a photo ID to attend church? Or to operate a
> printing press? Or to assemble? Or to speak out publically?

Or to go to an Obama or any other democratic meeting/fund raiser/
convention.

[Ken Marino]

We also have a constitutional right to bear arms so you will have no
problem if repubs pass a law that gun sales will no longer require any
kind of ID? Unless you agree with that you are one HUGE hypocrit.

[Ken Marino]

On Mon, 06 Aug 2012 10:45:05 -0700, erschro...@gmail.com wrote:

> On Aug 5, 3:03 pm, AM <sctu...@comcast.net> wrote:
>> On 8/5/2012 1:17 PM, Edward A. Falk wrote:
>>
>> > Because not everybody can get them.  In particular, it's harder for
>> > poor, old, or black people to get them.  Since these people are more
>> > likely to vote Democrat, the Republicans are very keen to make it
>> > harder for them to vote.
>>
>> >http://www.salon.com/2012/07/27/
fla_republican_we_suppressed_black_vo...
>>
>> >http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2012/03/06/439324/86-year-old-ohio-
v...
>>
>> > Republicans insist it's about stamping out voter fraud, but the
>> > number of actual cases of voter fraud that a photo id would have
>> > prevented is very small.
>>
>> Why is it OK for me to HAVE to show a photo ID at the bank which is not
>> a right, but not OK for someone to have to show a photo ID to vote ?
>> (which is a right)
>>
>> ???
>
> Banking isn't a constitutional right -- that's the whole point. Denying
> someone the right to vote because they don't have a picture ID is
> denying a constitutional right.
>
> What if you needed a photo ID to attend church? Or to operate a
> printing press? Or to assemble? Or to speak out publically?

aND JUST LIKE ANY MORON CAN VOTE, THERE WILL BE NO QUESTIONING A PERSON'S
SANITY BEFORE GIVING HIM THE GUNS HE WANTS.

[Ken Marino]

On Mon, 06 Aug 2012 19:24:44 +0000, Edward A. Falk wrote:

> In article <98udnbD1gdtmWYPN...@giganews.com>, AM

> <sct...@comcast.net> wrote:
>>
>>Why is it OK for me to HAVE to show a photo ID at the bank which is not
>>a right, but not OK for someone to have to show a photo ID to vote ?
>>(which is a right)
>

> Whether the bank requires an ID or not is between you and the bank, and
> it's for your protection. Requiring an ID to vote is only intended to
> keep you from voting.
>
> More examples:
>
> http://www.aclupa.org/legal/legaldocket/applewhiteetalvcommonwealt/
voteridclients.htm
>
> Viviette Applewhite, 93. Born 1919 in Philadelphia, voted in every
> election since 1960. Unable to obtain photo id and can no longer
> vote.
>
> Wilola Lee, 59, born in Georgia. Former school principal, currently a
> government state worker. Has been voting regularly for 30 years.
> Unable to get a birth certificate; can no longer vote.
>
> Grover Freeland, 72, born in Buffalo, NY. U.S. Army Veteran, honorably
> discharged. Has not driven since 1980. His veteran's card, a photo ID
> issued by the U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs is not accepted at
> the polls.
>
> Gloria Cuttino, 61, born in South Carolina. South Carolina has lost
> her birth certificate and she cannot get a photo ID. She will have to
> spend serious money and petition the court in SC for a replacement,
> which won't happen in time for her to vote this year.
>
> Nadine Marsh, 84, born in Pittsburgh. Never had a driver's license.
> Pittsburgh has lost her birth certificate.
>
> Dorothy Barksdale, 86. Born at home via midwife in Virginia.
> Previously worked as a poll official. No driver's license, no birth
> certificate.
>
> Joyce Block, 89. Born in Brooklyn, NY. Voted in nearly every election
> since 1944. Never had a driver's license. She cannot get a photo ID
> because her birth certificate and social security card are under her
> maiden name. Her marriage certificate was written in Hebrew, and
> officials would not accept it as evidence of name change.
>
>
> http://www.post-gazette.com/stories/local/state/air-force-veteran-
testifies-voter-id-law-could-prevent-him-from-casting-ballot-646865/
>
> Danny Rosa, 63, Air Force veteran. No driver's license. State won't
> issue a photo ID because his name was changed when his mother married
> his stepfather, and now his birth certificate does not match his
> verteran's ID card or discharge papers.
>
> http://articles.latimes.com/2008/may/07/nation/na-voterid7
>
> Angela Hiss, 19. Registered to vote in Indiana but still has Illinois
> driver's license.
>
> Nuns at a retirement home at Saint Mary's Convent not allowed to vote
> for lack of photo id.
>
> http://www.866ourvote.org/pages/think-getting-free-id-is-easy-think-
again
>
> Another couple dozen examples; read it yourself.
>
>
> Or just use Google.

Those are sad and also rare occurances. Then again, when it comes to
illegally voting, WI had 1099 convicted felons vote illegally in the last
election.

[columbiaaccidentinvestigation]

On Aug 7, 7:11 pm, AM <sctu...@comcast.net> wrote:
> On 8/7/2012 8:54 PM, Edward A. Falk wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

> > In article <E9adnYFU5Mc4HLzNnZ2dnUVZ_umdn...@giganews.com>,

> > AM  <sctu...@comcast.net> wrote:
> >> On 8/7/2012 3:16 PM, columbiaaccidentinvestigation wrote:
>
> >> The individual does not pay. And since you are all for govt spending
> >> that shouldn't be an issue right ?
>
> > Sometimes the individual pays.  Sometimes the individual has to
> > get a lawyer.
>
> > If you could absolutely guarantee that every eligible voter could
> > get a photo id, that it wouldn't cost them a dime, and that no
> > undue burden would be placed on them to get it, then I would be
> > ok with it.
>
> > However, that is simply not the case.  See the references I posted
> > above.
>
> Then under your plan of no ID needed you have no problem with me voting
> hundreds and hundreds of times in an election ?
>
> Well ?

http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/brochures/fast_facts/ffdl24.htm
"Identity Theft Have You Been A Victim of Identity Theft
Is Your Identity Secure? Let’s Make Sure!

Identity theft and identity fraud are two of the fastest growing
crimes in the United States.

Because the driver license (DL) and identification (ID) card are the
primary identification documents in California, they are targets for
identity fraud. The Department of Motor Vehicles (DMV) is doing
everything possible to protect your identity."

[Orval Fairbairn]

In article
<8cdff13f-51fe-47d3...@d8g2000yqj.googlegroups.com>,

Voter fraud is difficult to prove, since the perps can easily disappear.

The fact that the DemocRATS are making such a fuss about voter ID says
that they are running scared that a major source of their "votes" is
being shut off.

[Orval Fairbairn]

In article
<802170bd-b3da-46f3...@t6g2000pbp.googlegroups.com>,
columbiaaccidentinvestigation
<columbiaaccide...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> On Aug 7, 11:30 am, AM <sctu...@comcast.net> wrote:" Voter ID cards
> have no info anyone can use to commit identity theft. "
> http://groups.google.com/group/alt.global-warming/msg/7be1175d6cfb335d?hl=en-g
> b
>
> You are wrong, and your denial is a joke! See the image of the georgia
> voter id card it has date of birth and address of the voter. Two
> pieces of information that assist in the malicous act of identity
> theft. Viginia's ID card has a date of birth, please explain why you
> think different, as the picture confims the fact you are wrong.
>
> http://www.policeandsheriffspress.com/vic/
> "Welcome
> Welcome to the Georgia Voter ID System website! This site has been
> created for you the Georgia Voter Registrar. As you can see from the
> menu there are copies of the Quick Reference Guide, Training Manual,
> Frequently Asked Questions section, and Contact Information. We hope
> that you enjoy using this site and find it to be helpful."

Drivers' licenses also contain DOB. Are they being used for ID theft? NO.

[columbiaaccidentinvestigation]

On Aug 7, 9:12 pm, Orval Fairbairn <orfairba...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> In article

> <802170bd-b3da-46f3-9702-7d1912ec2...@t6g2000pbp.googlegroups.com>,
>  columbiaaccidentinvestigation

>  <columbiaaccidentinvestigat...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > On Aug 7, 11:30 am, AM <sctu...@comcast.net> wrote:" Voter ID cards
> > have no info anyone can use to commit identity theft. "

> >http://groups.google.com/group/alt.global-warming/msg/7be1175d6cfb335...

> > b
> > You are wrong, and your denial is a joke! See the image of the georgia
> > voter id card it has date of birth and address of the voter.  Two
> > pieces of information that assist in the malicous act of identity
> > theft.  Viginia's ID card has a date of birth, please explain why you
> > think different, as the picture confims the fact you are wrong.
> >http://www.policeandsheriffspress.com/vic/
> > "Welcome
> > Welcome to the Georgia Voter ID System website!  This site has been
> > created for you the Georgia Voter Registrar.  As you can see from the
> > menu there are copies of the Quick Reference Guide, Training Manual,
> > Frequently Asked Questions section, and Contact Information.  We hope
> > that you enjoy using this site and find it to be helpful."
> Drivers' licenses also contain DOB. Are they being used for ID theft? NO.

Wrong, the answer is yes, a drivers license can aid in the theft of
ones identity, it contains a persons date of birth, and so does the
virgina photo ID.

http://its.virginia.edu/security/idtheft/

[AM]

On 8/7/2012 11:16 PM, columbiaaccidentinvestigation wrote:
> On Aug 7, 7:11 pm, AM <sctu...@comcast.net> wrote:
>> On 8/7/2012 8:54 PM, Edward A. Falk wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>> In article <E9adnYFU5Mc4HLzNnZ2dnUVZ_umdn...@giganews.com>,
>>> AM <sctu...@comcast.net> wrote:
>>>> On 8/7/2012 3:16 PM, columbiaaccidentinvestigation wrote:
>>
>>>> The individual does not pay. And since you are all for govt spending
>>>> that shouldn't be an issue right ?
>>
>>> Sometimes the individual pays. Sometimes the individual has to
>>> get a lawyer.
>>
>>> If you could absolutely guarantee that every eligible voter could
>>> get a photo id, that it wouldn't cost them a dime, and that no
>>> undue burden would be placed on them to get it, then I would be
>>> ok with it.
>>
>>> However, that is simply not the case. See the references I posted
>>> above.
>>
>> Then under your plan of no ID needed you have no problem with me voting
>> hundreds and hundreds of times in an election ?
>>
>> Well ?
>
> http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/brochures/fast_facts/ffdl24.htm
> "Identity Theft Have You Been A Victim of Identity Theft

> Is Your Identity Secure? Let�s Make Sure!

>
> Identity theft and identity fraud are two of the fastest growing
> crimes in the United States.
>
> Because the driver license (DL) and identification (ID) card are the
> primary identification documents in California, they are targets for
> identity fraud. The Department of Motor Vehicles (DMV) is doing
> everything possible to protect your identity."
>

Ok, so you will not mind me voting hundreds and hundreds of times in an
election ?

You will also not mind that I feel that I shouldnt have to show an ID to
buy a gun Right ?

[columbiaaccidentinvestigation]

On Aug 8, 5:02 am, AM <sctu...@comcast.net> wrote:
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.global-warming/msg/7b30a8f354e52b51?hl=en-gb

> On 8/7/2012 11:16 PM, columbiaaccidentinvestigation wrote:
> > On Aug 7, 7:11 pm, AM <sctu...@comcast.net> wrote:
> >> On 8/7/2012 8:54 PM, Edward A. Falk wrote:
> >>> In article <E9adnYFU5Mc4HLzNnZ2dnUVZ_umdn...@giganews.com>,
> >>> AM  <sctu...@comcast.net> wrote:
> >>>> On 8/7/2012 3:16 PM, columbiaaccidentinvestigation wrote:
> >>>> The individual does not pay. And since you are all for govt spending
> >>>> that shouldn't be an issue right ?
> >>> Sometimes the individual pays.  Sometimes the individual has to
> >>> get a lawyer.
> >>> If you could absolutely guarantee that every eligible voter could
> >>> get a photo id, that it wouldn't cost them a dime, and that no
> >>> undue burden would be placed on them to get it, then I would be
> >>> ok with it.
> >>> However, that is simply not the case.  See the references I posted
> >>> above.
> >> Then under your plan of no ID needed you have no problem with me voting
> >> hundreds and hundreds of times in an election ?
> >> Well ?
> >http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/brochures/fast_facts/ffdl24.htm
> > "Identity Theft Have You Been A Victim of Identity Theft

> > Is Your Identity Secure? Let s Make Sure!

> > Identity theft and identity fraud are two of the fastest growing
> > crimes in the United States.
> > Because the driver license (DL) and identification (ID) card are the
> > primary identification documents in California, they are targets for
> > identity fraud. The Department of Motor Vehicles (DMV) is doing
> > everything possible to protect your identity."
> Ok, so you will not mind me voting hundreds and hundreds of times in an
> election ?
> You will also not mind that I feel that I shouldnt have to show an ID to
> buy a gun Right ?

Thats a bs false assertion, which can be countered by asking you why
"you dont mind aiding in the theft of others indentities", as you are
creating a focal point for personal information.

You still have yet to correct your incorrect statements as to what
information is found on the virgina ID.

Moving the goal posts from "photo ID" to "voter ID", does not validate
your point, in fact it shows you know you have a very weak argument.
And next time, why not get your friends together, as individuals you
have a very hard time constructing a valid well reasoned logical reply.

[columbiaaccidentinvestigation]

On Aug 7, 5:04 am, AM <sctu...@comcast.net> wrote:"Which has NO

personal info except your name and address."

wrong, but if you think you are correct, prove it.

[Orval Fairbairn]

In article
<51e4dda1-2d5e-4f4f...@l5g2000yql.googlegroups.com>,
columbiaaccidentinvestigation

You Proggies are really grasping at straws in your opposition to voter
ID. Is it because you RELY on it to corrupt the electoral process?

[columbiaaccidentinvestigation]

On Aug 8, 10:02 am, Orval Fairbairn <orfairba...@earthlink.net> wrote:
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.global-warming/msg/24fb46cd80ded082

> In article
> <51e4dda1-2d5e-4f4f-ac34-25edb6149...@l5g2000yql.googlegroups.com>,

Reactionaries like yourself are no longer representing the middle
right, instead your views are a demonstration of the extreme. Calling
ID theft "grasping at straws", its rather funny how people like you
are now arguing that local volunteers should be privy to one personal
information upon request, "show me your papers" soviet style.

[James]

"columbiaaccidentinvestigation"
<columbiaaccide...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:5b59aabb-bec6-463f...@b10g2000vbj.googlegroups.com

You're the most illogical entity I know of. lol

[alanm...@yahoo.com]

On Aug 5, 10:17 am, f...@rahul.net (Edward A. Falk) wrote:
> Because not everybody can get them.  In particular, it's harder for poor,
> old, or black people to get them.  Since these people are more likely
> to vote Democrat, the Republicans are very keen to make it harder for
> them to vote.
>
> http://www.salon.com/2012/07/27/fla_republican_we_suppressed_black_vo...
>
> http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2012/03/06/439324/86-year-old-ohio-v...
>
> Republicans insist it's about stamping out voter fraud, but the number
> of actual cases of voter fraud that a photo id would have prevented
> is very small.
>

> --
>         -Ed Falk, f...@despams.r.us.com
>        http://thespamdiaries.blogspot.com/

Even SSI claimants have to present a photo I.D. at the start of
an interview. The photo I.D. only discriminates against
dead people and incarcerated people- a significant Democrat
constituency
- A. McIntire

[Orval Fairbairn]

In article
<de0f87cf-7bb5-47f5...@i10g2000pbh.googlegroups.com>,
columbiaaccidentinvestigation

The REAL ID theft is by Democrats scouring the cemeteries for names and
birth dates.

Another fraud is checking the voter lists for people who didn't vote and
then getting substitutes to vote in their names.

Voter ID puts a crimp in those Chicago-type practices.

[columbiaaccidentinvestigation]

On Aug 8, 7:03 pm, Orval Fairbairn <orfairba...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> In article

> <de0f87cf-7bb5-47f5-917b-3aa52cc80...@i10g2000pbh.googlegroups.com>,

Placing personal information found on a drivers license or a voter id
in the hands of poll volunteers increases risk of the voters identity
being stolen, which is an undue burden

[Orval Fairbairn]

In article
<f77876b6-42f4-4554...@i10g2000pbh.googlegroups.com>,
columbiaaccidentinvestigation

No more so than handing a credit card to a waiter in a restaurant. In
fact, the poll workers are there with the consent of the Registrar of
Voters, so they should be a cut above the run-of-the-mill populace.

ID theft is just another straw man put out by those who wish to continue
corrupting the vote.

[columbiaaccidentinvestigation]

On Aug 8, 9:11 pm, Orval Fairbairn <orfairba...@earthlink.net> wrote:
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.global-warming/msg/8f0e665e4e78e381

> In article
> <f77876b6-42f4-4554-acd7-a1e231f4e...@i10g2000pbh.googlegroups.com>,

Your example fails, based on the following example: When going to a
business a patron can favor a restaurant if it uses wireless card
terminals that can be used at the table; such terminals reduce the
chances of ID theft making the dining experience less of a risk. As
opposed to the fact i have no choice to substitute my polling place if
I’m not satisfied with its identity protection standards, based on
your "show me your papers" concept, i have to show my personal
information with no assurance that my information is protected. You
are mandating that i place myself at a higher risk to having my
identity stolen in order to vote, that is an undue burden.

[Orval Fairbairn]

In article
<63f88351-b392-44a5...@t6g2000pbp.googlegroups.com>,
columbiaaccidentinvestigation

Specious arguments and disingenuousness noted.

[columbiaaccidentinvestigation]

On Aug 9, 9:26 am, Orval Fairbairn <orfairba...@earthlink.net> wrote:
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.global-warming/msg/e8377760bef8b904

> In article
> <63f88351-b392-44a5-bd22-217ecfbb7...@t6g2000pbp.googlegroups.com>,

Your ignorance of the unintended consequences for no id protection
noted, your incorrect opinions of irrelevance are therefore dismissed,
and my argument of undue burden being factually correct would stump
scalia, thomas, alito's decision in CRAWFORD et al. v. MARION COUNTY
ELECTION BOARD .

[Orval Fairbairn]

In article
<fbf52c6b-579c-4db3...@nc9g2000pbc.googlegroups.com>,
columbiaaccidentinvestigation

<columbiaaccide...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> On Aug 9, 9:26�am, Orval Fairbairn <orfairba...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> http://groups.google.com/group/alt.global-warming/msg/e8377760bef8b904
>
> > In article
> > <63f88351-b392-44a5-bd22-217ecfbb7...@t6g2000pbp.googlegroups.com>,
> > �columbiaaccidentinvestigation
> > �<columbiaaccidentinvestigat...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > > On Aug 8, 9:11�pm, Orval Fairbairn <orfairba...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> > >http://groups.google.com/group/alt.global-warming/msg/8f0e665e4e78e381
> > > > In article
> > > > <f77876b6-42f4-4554-acd7-a1e231f4e...@i10g2000pbh.googlegroups.com>,
> > > > �columbiaaccidentinvestigation
> > > > �<columbiaaccidentinvestigat...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > > > > On Aug 8, 7:03�pm, Orval Fairbairn <orfairba...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> > > > > > In article
> > > > > > <de0f87cf-7bb5-47f5-917b-3aa52cc80...@i10g2000pbh.googlegroups.com>,
> > > > > > �columbiaaccidentinvestigation
> > > > > > �<columbiaaccidentinvestigat...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > > > > > > On Aug 8, 10:02�am, Orval Fairbairn <orfairba...@earthlink.net>
> > > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > >http://groups.google.com/group/alt.global-warming/msg/24fb46cd80ded
> > > > > > >082
> > > > > > > > In article
> > > > > > > > <51e4dda1-2d5e-4f4f-ac34-25edb6149...@l5g2000yql.googlegroups.co

We can write off the whole anti-voter ID argument as DNC talking points,
since the DNC strategy depends on voter fraud to win elections.

[columbiaaccidentinvestigation]

On Aug 9, 5:52 pm, Orval Fairbairn <orfairba...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> In article

> <fbf52c6b-579c-4db3-8af2-4549cd734...@nc9g2000pbc.googlegroups.com>,

or maybe you can write it off because its a mandate for me to increase
my exposure to identity theft, which is an undue burden.

[Orval Fairbairn]

In article
<2388a9e6-a9a9-46f5...@r2g2000pbn.googlegroups.com>,
columbiaaccidentinvestigation

Who in hell would WANT to steal YOUR identity? Only a bozo would want to
do that!

[columbiaaccidentinvestigation]

On Aug 9, 8:22 pm, Orval Fairbairn <orfairba...@earthlink.net> wrote:
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.global-warming/msg/354389910e3575ff?hl=en-gb

> In article
> <2388a9e6-a9a9-46f5-958f-dc1ff4cf1...@r2g2000pbn.googlegroups.com>,

total popular vote for president in 2008 was just under 130 million,
are you claiming im the only voter who will be facing increased risk
of having their identiy stolen with a requirement that all voters show
personal information to poll volunteers, or is the number closer to
130 million? Wow your argument has gotten more and more desperate/
idiotic

[Orval Fairbairn]

In article
<51383bcf-30d5-496b...@vg10g2000pbc.googlegroups.com>,
columbiaaccidentinvestigation

> > > > > > > > om>,
> > > > > > > >  columbiaaccidentinvestigation
> > > > > > > >  <columbiaaccidentinvestigat...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > On Aug 8, 7:03 pm, Orval Fairbairn
> > > > > > > > > <orfairba...@earthlink.net>
> > > > > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > In article
> > > > > > > > > > <de0f87cf-7bb5-47f5-917b-3aa52cc80...@i10g2000pbh.googlegrou
> > > > > > > > > > ps.c
> > > > > > > > > > om>,
> > > > > > > > > >  columbiaaccidentinvestigation
> > > > > > > > > >  <columbiaaccidentinvestigat...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > On Aug 8, 10:02 am, Orval Fairbairn
> > > > > > > > > > > <orfairba...@earthlink.net>
> > > > > > > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > >http://groups.google.com/group/alt.global-warming/msg/24fb4
> > > > > > > > > > >6cd8
> > > > > > > > > > >0ded
> > > > > > > > > > >082
> > > > > > > > > > > > In article
> > > > > > > > > > > > <51e4dda1-2d5e-4f4f-ac34-25edb6149...@l5g2000yql.googleg

In your (deluded) mind!