Re: REBUTTING JAMES DiEUGENIO (YET AGAIN)
David Von Pein
http://Box.net/shared/orxsobj3l0
I discovered today that James "OSWALD SHOT NOBODY" DiEugenio wasn't
satisfied with embarrassing himself in print form only, via his
hilarious CTKA.net article [http://ctka.net/2010/dvp.html], which is
Jim's so-called "overview of the Internet career of the man many call
Disinformation Dave" (that would be me).
No, Jim decided to embarrass himself (and his riotous "Oswald Was
Innocent Of Killing Both Kennedy AND Tippit" theories) even further by
traipsing out his CTKA.net article about me on "Black Op Radio" on
April 15, 2010 (linked above), two days after the article appeared in
print form on his website.
Now, I must admit, I actually did fully expect DiEugenio to talk about
that DVP article on Len Osanic's weekly retard-fest (aka "Black Op
Radio") when I first saw he had put it up on his website. He had even
informed the three Black Op listeners on April 8th that the article
was coming soon to his conspiracy-oriented site at CTKA.net.
But when I heard James D. starting to read verbatim passages of the
written article during the April 15th radio program (which he also
does, btw, with all of the parts of his never-ending book review for
Vincent Bugliosi's "Reclaiming History" as well--i.e., he usually
reads text, word-for-word, from his written articles on the air), I
could hardly believe my ears. It was very difficult to keep seated in
my chair, I was laughing so hard.
Why was I laughing?
Well, it's pretty simple actually, and if you saw my written rebuttal
to DiEugenio's smear piece, which is linked below, I think you'll
easily be able to understand why my weak urinary bladder was given a
hearty workout when listening to J.D. on the radio on April 15:
MY REBUTTAL ARTICLE ("WHO'S REALLY THE COMEDIAN HERE?"):
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/a3ac48b4703ba1b1
I'm beginning to seriously wonder if it is truly humanly POSSIBLE for
a person like Jim DiEugenio to NOT realize he's making a total fool
out of himself when he says things like the following (these are all
direct quotes from James "OSWALD SHOT NOBODY ON NOVEMBER 22"
DiEugenio):
"To understand Von Pein, one has to go back to his online, forum
appearance on the JFK Lancer site back in 2003. .... In July of that
year, he proclaimed Oswald guilty through what he termed a "mountain
of evidence." He then asked, how much of this overwhelming tidal wave
of proof would it take to convince a person out of the notion of
conspiracy? Quite a thunderous build up eh?
"But...Von Pein's "mountain of evidence" consisted of the
mildewed litany of discredited Warren Commission data. Which, of
course, is not a mountain. It's more like the San Andreas Fault. He
began with the...specious notion that Oswald owned the rifle; and he
ended with the equally specious notion that Oswald could have run down
from the sixth floor to the second in time to be seen by Marrion Baker
and Roy Truly right after the assassination.
"Some of the gems in between were that Oswald definitely killed
Officer Tippit and that he also attempted to kill General Edwin
Walker. My favorite point was this: "the Single Bullet Theory has
still not been proven to be an impossibility." I guess he thinks that
if it's not impossible, that means it happened. ....
"Von Pein even wrote that at Z frame 224, both Kennedy and John
Connally were reacting to the same bullet. .... In reality Kennedy is
reacting and Connally is not. With a straight face, at the end of this
"mountainous" listing, Von Pein wrote, "For aren't hard facts and
evidence always more believable than wild speculation and
conjecture?""
[End DiEugenio Hilarity, for the moment.]
We should pause about three minutes here for the laughs to die down.
The laughs began when DiEugenio suggested, in essence, that all
reasonable people should just COMPLETELY IGNORE all of the evidence in
the John F. Kennedy and J.D. Tippit murder cases. That's essentially
what he just said in those quoted excerpts above.
In other words, per Jim, ALL of the evidence is fake and/or not to be
trusted in some manner. Every last piece of it is worthless to Jim D.,
including all of the following items:
1.) The guns that were used to kill JFK and Tippit (both of which were
Lee Harvey Oswald's guns, of course).
2.) The bullet fragments that were found right in the Presidential
limousine itself, which are fragments that were linked conclusively to
OSWALD'S rifle, of course. And virtually no conspiracy theorist that
I've ever heard of has ever suggested that these bullet fragments from
Rifle C2766 were planted or tainted in some way.
(Note -- I won't talk about Stretcher Bullet CE399 here, although I
certainly could include it in this list of evidence that hangs
DiEugenio's prized patsy, because there hasn't been a conspiracy
theorist yet who has come up with a single bit of PROOF to show that
CE399 was a "planted" bullet. But as this extensive list shows, even
WITHOUT Bullet CE399, there is still more than enough evidence that
proves Oswald's guilt beyond all reasonable doubt.)
3.) The bullet shells FROM OSWALD'S GUNS that littered the scenes of
BOTH murders (JFK's and Tippit's).
4.) The palmprint and fingerprints found on the C2766 Carcano rifle,
which were proven to be OSWALD'S prints [CE637; WC testimony of Lt.
J.C. Day; WC testimony of Sebastian Latona; and Vincent Scalice's 1993
analysis of the fingerprints found on the trigger housing of Carcano
rifle #C2766.]
5.) The fingerprints of OSWALD'S which were found all over the
Sniper's Nest on the sixth floor of the Texas School Book Depository
(which is the place where JFK's killer was firing a rifle from).
6.) The paper bag found in the Sniper's Nest (with OSWALD'S prints on
it in two places).
7.) The fiber evidence on the C2766 rifle and inside the brown paper
bag (which were fibers consistent with OSWALD'S guilt, of course).
8.) And OSWALD'S own LIES that he told practically non-stop from the
moment he was arrested.
Plus:
9.) I guess we're even supposed to IGNORE the fact that Oswald, a
person whom DiEugenio says didn't shoot ANYBODY on November 22 and
therefore would likely have had no reason to START killing cops just
35 minutes after Officer Tippit was shot and only 80 minutes after JFK
was assassinated, fought like mad and pulled a loaded revolver out of
his pants in the Texas Theater, while at the same time shouting "This
is it" and/or "It's all over now".
I wonder how Jim DiEugenio explains Oswald's odd behavior in the
theater at 1:50 PM CST on November 22nd, which is behavior that has an
ARMED Lee Harvey Oswald fighting the police like a wild man while
making statements like "It's all over now"?
Is that the behavior of an innocent "patsy" who didn't fire a single
shot at President Kennedy OR Officer Tippit? Jim DiEugenio apparently
thinks so.
And Oswald isn't armed with just any old revolver when he was fighting
with the police on November 22 in the Texas Theater. No, he had in his
hands the EXACT SAME GUN that was proven to be the gun that murdered
Officer J.D. Tippit just THIRTY-FIVE MINUTES before Oswald pulled that
Smith & Wesson revolver out of his pants.
And yet DiEugenio still thinks Oswald was innocent of shooting Tippit.
Pathetic, isn't it? Yes, it is.
DiEugenio, in both his written article and his April 15 Black Op
appearance, also spends considerable time trying to cast mysterious
shadows over Stretcher Bullet CE399, which Jim is convinced was
actually NOT the bullet that was found on a stretcher at Parkland
Hospital.
Apparently, then, in DiEugenio's mixed-up world of kooky (and really,
really bumbling) conspirators, a NON-CE399 bullet was evidently
planted by the "Let's Frame Oswald" crew of idiots on the WRONG
STRETCHER.
And, as if that act of stupidity wasn't enough, apparently those same
goofball plotters planted a pointy-tipped bullet that looked NOTHING
like a bullet from Oswald's rifle -- hence, these plotters evidently
wanted to plant a NON-CARCANO bullet (on the wrong stretcher!), even
though the whole point of "planting" any evidence in the first place
is supposedly to frame the man named Oswald, who owned a Mannlicher-
Carcano rifle.
DiEugenio, of course, fails to point out these absurdities and logic
gaps in the "patsy" plot when he rambles on and on about how terrible
and stupid Vincent Bugliosi and David Von Pein are (my name is
pronounced "VON PINE", btw, not "VON PEEN").
But, evidently, these huge holes in the "logic" department regarding
the so-called "planting" of Stretcher Bullet CE399 are supposed to be
overlooked completely by the "lone nutters" of the world, while being
embraced as some sort of "Aha! I told you that bullet was fake!" proof
for the conspiracy kooks of the world.
Go figure that. I sure can't.
As a side note to all of this bullet talk -- DiEugenio never seems to
want to come out and explain what he actually believes happened with
respect to this "stretcher bullet" topic.
He loves to dangle the suspicions in front of people, but I've never
heard him try to come up with a coherent theory about WHY a bullet was
found on the stretcher of Ronald Fuller, instead of being found on
John Connally's stretcher.
Maybe in the past he has trotted out some kind of feeble explanation
to tie all of these seemingly-incoherent and goofy things together,
but I've never heard him talk about it.
Let me also add this -- Bullet CE399 was deemed to be the "SBT" bullet
by BOTH the Warren Commission in 1964 and the House Select Committee
on Assassinations in 1978.
In other words, that exact CE399 bullet, the same bullet that Mr.
DiEugenio thinks struck NO VICTIMS in Dealey Plaza at all, was said to
be the exact bullet that struck both President Kennedy AND Governor
Connally on 11/22/63.
I'm quite sure, however, that the facts that reside within my last two
paragraphs don't carry a whole lot of weight with the likes of Jim
DiEugenio.
Jim undoubtedly thinks that BOTH the Warren Commission AND the HSCA
were filled with either total boobs who couldn't tell one end of a
rifle bullet from the other, or Jim thinks that BOTH the WC and the
HSCA were replete with a bunch of Government shills who wanted nothing
more than to frame the VERY SAME PATSY THAT CLAY SHAW, DAVID FERRIE,
AND THE RAGTAG GROUP OF CONSPIRATORS DOWN IN NEW ORLEANS WERE
SUPPOSEDLY TRYING TO FRAME FOR KENNEDY'S MURDER! (Amazing co-inky
there, isn't it Jim?)
For more "LN" type logic concerning Warren Commission Exhibit No.
Three-Niner-Niner (i.e., for some stuff that makes much more sense
than ANYTHING James DiEugenio believes), go to the links below:
WAS BULLET CE399 "PLANTED" IN PARKLAND HOSPITAL?:
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/afb30246ab698396
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/84689b600ce41d68
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/bceb46435b39817f
MORE BUGLIOSI BASHING FROM DiEUGENIO:
Yes, indeed, ol' Jim couldn't help himself. He had to take a few more
pathetic swings at author Vincent Bugliosi and Vince's 2007 book,
"Reclaiming History", during the 4/15/10 Black Op show. (What a
surprise, huh?)
Near the end of the program, DiEugenio said this about Bugliosi's
book:
"The only person who believed it ["Reclaiming History"] was Tom
Hanks." -- Jim DiEugenio; 4/15/10
Well, Jim, let's just take a minute or two and examine the review
statistics currently at Amazon.com for Mr. Bugliosi's "Reclaiming
History":
As of this moment on April 16, 2010, the book has received 187
customer reviews -- including my own (which, naturally, included a
deserved 5-Star rating, and can be seen at the link below):
http://Amazon.com/review/RZD82270D69E8
And out of those 187 reviews, 99 of them are 5-Star (maximum) reviews,
while another 18 people gave the book a 4-Star rating, and another 16
people have given it a 3-Star ranking:
So, when doing the math, this means (based on Amazon's current crop of
reviews) that 133 out of 187 people have given "Reclaiming History" a
BETTER-THAN-AVERAGE rating (3 stars or higher). That figures to 71.1%
of the reviews.
So, almost 3 out of every 4 reviewers are essentially saying "Thumbs
Up" to Vincent Bugliosi's JFK book. Only 28.9% of the reviewers have
given the book a poor rating of 2 stars or 1 star. And 52.9% of the
reviewers think the book deserves a PERFECT 5-Star rating (99 of 187).
Now, considering all of the built-in things that Vince's book had
going against it from the get-go in 2007 -- such as the fact it's
absolutely enormous (2800+ pages, including the CD-ROM disc), and the
fact it has a high retail price ($49.95), and the sad-but-true fact
that 75% of the American public (per the 2003 Gallup Poll) believe in
a conspiracy in the JFK case -- I'd say that those stats for
Bugliosi's book at Amazon are remarkably good.
So, Mr. DiEugenio, what was that you were saying about only Tom Hanks
believing the things written in "Reclaiming History"?
McADAMS TALK:
When thinking about the absurd over-the-top insults that DiEugenio
heaped upon John McAdams in Jim's article about me, two familiar words
came to mind immediately -- "Pot" and "Kettle". Let's take another
look at what DiEugenio said about Professor McAdams:
"John McAdams...historically speaking...was the first person on
the Internet to exhibit critical thinking skills so stilted,
comprehension skills so unbalanced, cognitive skills so impaired, all
combined with a basic dishonesty about these failings, to the degree
that he almost seemed the victim of a neurological disease. Any strong
indication of conspiracy in the JFK case, no matter how compelling,
could not permeate his brain waves." -- James DiEugenio
Now, when mulling over the proven-to-be-false things that Jim
DiEugenio believes with regard to the JFK assassination --- e.g.,
Oswald was innocent of shooting BOTH President Kennedy and Officer
Tippit; Oswald couldn't possibly have gone from the sixth floor to the
second floor of the TSBD in less than 90 seconds; Oswald couldn't
possibly have ordered the #C2766 Mannlicher-Carcano rifle that Klein's
shipped to Oswald's alias in March 1963; Oswald couldn't possibly have
taken a pot-shot at General Edwin Walker in April of '63; Oswald
didn't carry ANY large paper bag into his workplace on the morning of
11/22/63; and both Linnie Mae Randle and Buell Wesley Frazier were
lying when they said they each saw Lee Oswald with a large bag in his
hands on November 22nd --- it's kind of difficult to read the above
paragraph which has DiEugenio raking Mr. McAdams over super-hot coals
(and then spitting on those coals with a smile on his face) without
bursting into fits of laughter. Isn't it? Well, it sure is for me
anyway.
The more I listen to this conspiracy-thirsty kook named Jim DiEugenio
ramble on and on about how *I* am a person who misrepresents and
distorts and omits all kinds of evidence in the JFK case, and about
how John McAdams is an "idiot" (which is something Jim called McAdams
on an earlier Black Op show in 2010), and about how McAdams is the
"victim of a neurological disease" because of his "impaired cognitive
skills" (etc.), and about how Jim Garrison was right all along (i.e.,
Dave Ferrie and Clay Shaw WERE plotting to kill JFK in 1963 after all,
even though Garrison's nonexistent court case against Mr. Shaw
collapsed like a weakened bridge when the New Orleans jury acquitted
Shaw in less than an hour in 1969), and about how "Krazy Kid Oswald"
was actually completely innocent of shooting anyone in Dallas on
November 22, 1963, the more I have a desire to vomit uncontrollably
(in-between the laughing sessions, that is).
And when I'm not hurling or rolling on the floor, I'm merely shaking
my head from side to side the whole time I'm listening to Jimbo talk.
Because I simply have a difficult time believing that anyone could
have THAT strong of a desire to want to throw all of the physical
evidence into the trash can connected with the JFK and Tippit murder
cases, which is evidence that easily and irrevocably is telling any
reasonable and rational human being that Lee Harvey Oswald
(DiEugenio's favorite patsy) killed two men in Dallas on 11/22/63.
AND MORE STUFF (~sigh~):
I took note of DiEugenio and Black Op host Len Osanic repeating the
same outright lie about me on 4/15/10 that they started several weeks
ago on another Black Op show, which concerns the "DVP review" that
never existed in the first place. DiEugenio and Osanic are somehow
convinced that I wrote a negative review at Amazon.com for Rodger
Remington's latest book, "Biting The Elephant".
The only problem for the Black Op kook twins (DiEugenio & Osanic) is
this: I never wrote any such review. It doesn't exist on the
Amazon.com website now, and it never did exist at any time in the
past.
Osanic, who hosts his Retard Radio program ("Black Op Radio") each
Thursday night from Vancouver, Canada, naturally laps up every single
word Jim D. says on virtually every Black Op show DiEugenio appears
on--which must number pretty close to triple-digits by now, dating
back to his first appearance on that show on February 27, 2003
(according to the stats presented on this webpage: http://BlackOpRadio.com/schedule.html),
with nearly all of those guest appearances coming since November 2007.
Footnote -- Wouldn't it also be nice if DiEugenio could just ONCE have
the decency to pronounce Vincent Bugliosi's last name correctly? I
know darn well he knows how to pronounce it the right way (with the
"G" silent), but he apparently has a willful desire to mangle Vince's
name many times on every "Black Op Radio" broadcast. It becomes quite
aggravating after hearing him botch it for the 40th time in a row.
At least he manages to pronounce my name correctly about 20% of the
time. So, he's only wrong 80% of the time there. That's not too bad
for Jim.
Well, such is the way with JFK conspiracy theorists, I guess -- they
rarely get ANYTHING right. :)
David Von Pein
April 16, 2010
=================================
EQUAL TIME:
http://DavidVonPein.blogspot.com
=================================
lazu...@webtv.net
upcoming book will have an interview with a woman who worked at the
TSBD, and was talking with Oswald while the shots were being fired.
Recently, a relative of Seymour Sy Weitzman has confirmed that Weitzman
found a mauser, & a guy that knew Eugene Boone has also said the same,
so Roger Craig was right all along they pulled the old switcheroo
somehow on the 6th floor...also, interesting to note that Weitzman and
Craig were very good officers that only started having a lot of trouble
leadng to mental problems because of the Assassination.
Sam McClung
news:6478-4BC8...@storefull-3251.bay.webtv.net...
> More and more evidence keeps surfacing LHO didn't do it-Robert Groden's
> upcoming book will have an interview with a woman who worked at the
> TSBD, and was talking with Oswald while the shots were being fired.
>
> Recently, a relative of Seymour Sy Weitzman has confirmed that Weitzman
> found a mauser, & a guy that knew Eugene Boone has also said the same,
> so Roger Craig was right all along they pulled the old switcheroo
> somehow on the 6th floor...
enter the mauser at 1:06 p.m. on the 6th floor (per craig)
exit the mauser by 1:22 p.m. and
enter the carcano at 1:22 p.m. per weitzman
if unsigned wc testimony is accurate and weitzman's guess at the time was
accurate, though he apparently indicates he wasn't sure it was 1:22 p.m.;
noting ellsworth enters the carcano after 1:30 p.m. on the 5th
floor
craig left the tsbd at 1:06 p.m. and didn't come back that day so couldn't
be in any of the alyea film frames that the carcano are in
the alyea film footage showing the carcano and craig are from the two
different rifle discoveries in the tsbd 11-22-63, the mauser at 1:06 p.m.
then the carcano at 1:22 p.m., all of which was on the 1st reel of film,
which left the tsbd at 2:10 p.m.
the changing of the frame rifle from the mauser to the carcano resulted in
the frame bullet going from pointed to rounded while in custody
if the carcano was intentionally left on the 5th floor to frame oswald
there:
- the frame was moved to the 6th floor because jarman, norman, and
williams were on the 5th floor
- may also explain the elevators stuck on the 5th floor
David Von Pein
Subject: My Reply To Jim DiEugenio's Article
Date: 4/13/2010 3:24:42 PM Eastern Daylight Time
From: David Von Pein
To: Rosemary Newton (Vincent Bugliosi's secretary)
-------------------------
Hi Rosemary,
Yes, it's that pest from Indiana bothering you again! :)
The conspiracy nut named James DiEugenio posted an article on his
website this morning that was all about lil' ol' me (for some reason),
so naturally I had to reply in kind. And I just finished my response,
which I think is pretty doggone good, if I do say so myself.
And since DiEugenio decided to attack Mr. Bugliosi--yet again--in his
article about me, I thought I'd send this link along, just in case
Vince or you might want to have a look at how far gone DiEugenio is
regarding the JFK case.
Here's the link to my rebuttal post:
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/a3ac48b4703ba1b1
DiEugenio's article is here:
http://www.ctka.net/2010/dvp.html
Thanks, as always, for allowing me to bug you incessantly.
My best,
David Von Pein
================================================================
Subject: Re: My Reply To Jim DiEugenio's Article
Date: 4/17/2010 1:42:04 PM Eastern Daylight Time
From: Rosemary Newton
To: David Von Pein
-------------------------
Hi Dave,
Don't worry about bothering me incessantly. I enjoy your e-mails. What
can I say? Again, as the old saying goes, "Don't confuse me with the
facts; my mind is made up." Again, I'll reiterate, mysteries,
conspiracies, who dunnits, are one hell of a lot more interesting than
actual facts sometimes.
Rosemary
================================================================
Subject: Re: My Reply To Jim DiEugenio's Article
Date: 4/18/2010 12:44:55 AM Eastern Daylight Time
From: David Von Pein
To: Rosemary Newton
-------------------------
Hi again Rosemary (and thank you).
I wasn't going to "bother" you with the following article (which is a
follow-up rebuttal to DiEugenio's never-ending tomfoolery), but since
you say you enjoy these conspiracy-bashing e-mails, I think I'll send
it to you now anyway.
Fasten your seat beat, Rosemary, because some of this stuff coming
from Jim D. is enough to make you drop right out of your chair (from
the laughter, that is):
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/78e762a534fa835a
Thanks.
David V.P.
================================================================
http://DVP-Potpourri.blogspot.com/2009/12/dvp-vs-dieugenio.html
http://groups.google.com/group/Reclaiming-History/browse_thread/thread/863ee417ecb1633f
================================================================
David Von Pein
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/a3ac48b4703ba1b1
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/78e762a534fa835a
REBUTTAL ADDENDUM:
In my two April 2010 articles (linked above) in which I thoroughly
debunk and refute a whole bunch of junk coming from the mouth of
conspiracy theorist James DiEugenio, I forgot to include an important
point which I overlooked previously. DiEugenio said this in his
http://ctka.net/2010/dvp.html article of 4/13/10:
"In his reply [to DVP's August 2009 questions concerning CE399],
Bugliosi also referred to pages 814-815 of 'Reclaiming History' as
proof that CE 399 was not fired elsewhere and then planted at
Parkland. If you look up those pages you will see why Von Pein is Von
Pein. For on those pages, Bugliosi is referring to the Neutron
Activation Analysis test." -- Jim DiEugenio
In response to the above quote from DiEugenio -- yes, Vince Bugliosi
did refer to those two pages of his 2007 book "Reclaiming History".
Here is exactly what Vince wrote to me:
"To the argument that yes, CE 399 was fired from Oswald's
Carcano, but at another time and place, and was planted at Parkland,
see pages 814-815 of "Reclaiming History"." -- Vincent Bugliosi;
Letter to DVP dated August 22, 2009
http://groups.google.com/group/Reclaiming-History/browse_thread/thread/0cb3e452a9b80933
Now, I probably should have done a re-check of those two pages of
Vincent's book FOR MYSELF, instead of assuming a conspiracy theorist
like Mr. DiEugenio would actually get something completely right for a
change (which, after all, doesn't happen very often), but I did not
take another detailed look at "RH" pages 814 and 815 until this
morning.
And what did I find when I looked at those two pages? --- I found that
DiEugenio, as per the norm, was not telling the entire story when he
said that Bugliosi's arguments regarding the so-called "planting" of
Stretcher Bullet CE399 were "referring to the Neutron Activation
Analysis test".
Yes, Vince refers to the NAA tests on the first half of page 814, but
then he starts talking about a lot of OTHER STUFF besides Neutron
Activation Analysis on the rest of page 814 and ALL OF PAGE 815!
In fact, Vince doesn't talk about NAA anywhere at all on page 815 (and
there are a LOT of words on EACH page of "Reclaiming History", as
everyone who has read that book is fully aware of).
Bugliosi's NAA discussion actually begins on page 811 of "RH" (in the
chapter entitled "Identification Of The Murder Weapon") and concludes
on the first one-half of page 814.
So, it appears to me that what Jim DiEugenio has probably done is to
glance at the first half of page 814, where he saw the letters "NAA"
several times, and Jim just assumed that "NAA" was the ONLY thing that
Mr. Bugliosi had to say to buttress his argument about CE399 not being
planted at Parkland Hospital by evil conspirators.
But that is not entirely correct, Jim. And you would have realized it
is not entirely correct if you had CONTINUED READING page 814 and then
all of page 815 (which, to emphasize again, doesn't contain a single
reference to "Neutron Activation Analysis", because Bugliosi had
already finished talking about NAA in that particular chapter on page
814).
Now, yes, Bugliosi does say this on page 814 (which probably was the
only part of the page that DiEugenio read; he saw these words and then
essentially was prepared to declare Bugliosi crazy on the whole
"bullet-planting" discussion):
"His [Dr. Vincent Guinn's] most important conclusion by far,
however, scientifically defeating the notion that the bullet found on
Connally's stretcher had been planted, was that the elemental
composition and concentration of trace elements of the three bullet
fragments removed from Governor Connally's wrist matched those of a
second bullet, the stretcher bullet. The stretcher bullet, then, had
to be the one that struck Connally, which all of the other evidence
had already shown." -- V. Bugliosi
But, in DiEugenio's zeal to discredit the science of NAA and Vincent
Bugliosi's book as a whole, Jim must have missed all of the following
non-NAA excerpts that also appear on pages 814 and 815 of "Reclaiming
History". Let's now take a gander at those excerpts:
"Even without NAA, the idea that conspirators planted a bullet
on the stretcher to frame Oswald makes no sense at all. .... Note that
at the time the conspirators supposedly planted the stretcher bullet
(which, if we're to follow the logic of the conspiracy theorists, must
have been fired from Oswald's rifle at some earlier time in order to
frame him with it), they'd have to assume that at least one of the
real bullets fired at Kennedy would be recovered, either from
Kennedy's body or inside the presidential limousine or elsewhere.
"And since they would know that firearm tests would reveal the
bullet (or bullets) was not fired from Oswald's Mannlicher-Carcano,
this would automatically exonerate Oswald as the assassin, when the
whole purpose of the alleged planting was to frame Oswald.
"Moreover, the conspirators would have to know that if the real
bullet (or bullets) was recovered and determined not to have been
fired from Oswald's Carcano, the presence of a planted bullet on
Connally's stretcher that had been fired from Oswald's rifle would
immediately signal to the authorities that a second gun (and hence, a
conspiracy) was involved in the assassination.
"Since we can assume that the conspirators would not want the
existence of a conspiracy to be known, why would they do something
that could only advertise their existence?
"For their plan to plant the stretcher bullet to work, the
conspirators would have to feel extremely confident, at the time they
planted it, that they would be able to retrieve and destroy all of the
real bullets that were fired, even those that, for all they knew,
might still be lodged in Kennedy's body.
"But how could they possibly believe they could do this? Or are
we perhaps to believe that the conspirators' hit man did not fire from
a different rifle, but with the Carcano itself, which was then left
behind on the sixth floor, knowing it would be found and Oswald would
be implicated in the murder?
"But if the hit man for the conspirators fired three shots from
Oswald's rifle and left it on the sixth floor, why would the
conspirators have felt the need to plant a fourth bullet on the
stretcher at Parkland to frame him? Wouldn't the authorities finding
the murder weapon (Oswald's Carcano), as well as three shells from
that weapon, on the sixth floor be enough to frame Oswald? What more
could they possibly hope to achieve by gilding the lily and taking the
additional risk of being caught by planting the fourth bullet at
Parkland?
"And if we follow the illogic of this scenario, how in the world
did the conspirators come into possession of Oswald's Carcano in the
first place? Did they break into Ruth Paine's garage sometime before
the assassination, steal the Carcano, take it out and fire a bullet
into some object from which they could recover it, then fire the
Carcano from the sixth-floor window and leave it behind, then plant
the earlier, recovered bullet on a stretcher at Parkland?
"Under that scenario, I guess the conspiracy theorists would
want us to believe that Oswald was really having lunch on the first
floor of the Book Depository Building at the time of the assassination
while some stranger who had stolen his rifle was firing it on the
sixth floor. Nurse, call the doctor. Our fine-feathered conspiracy
friends seem to be hallucinating.
"I hate to reduce myself to talking about such silliness, but if
Oswald wasn't the one who fired his Carcano that day, then after his
arrest when the authorities asked him questions about the Carcano and
showed him a picture of himself holding the murder weapon—the main
piece of evidence, he knew, that connected him to the assassination—
why did he deny holding the rifle, or even owning a rifle, two blatant
lies that showed an unmistakable consciousness of guilt?
"If it wasn't he who fired his Mannlicher-Carcano at the
president, wouldn't the automatic and natural thing for him to say be,
"Yes, that's of course my rifle, but some SOB stole it from me about a
week or so ago. You find the person who stole it from me and you'll
find the person who killed the president."
"Instead, Oswald told one lie after another about his own rifle
because he knew, of course, that it was the murder weapon."
-- Vincent T. Bugliosi; Pages 814-815 of "RECLAIMING HISTORY:
THE ASSASSINATION OF PRESIDENT JOHN F. KENNEDY" (c.2007)
-------------------
So, as we can see, Bugliosi is not ONLY referring to NAA when he talks
about the ludicrous notion put forth by conspiracy promoters regarding
Bullet CE399 being planted into the official record of the JFK murder
case.
And I can add a little more basic common sense and logic to the things
Vince said, too. Right here:
WAS CE399 PLANTED IN PARKLAND HOSPITAL?:
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/afb30246ab698396
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/84689b600ce41d68
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/bceb46435b39817f
THE JOURNEY OF BULLET CE399:
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/c565d3b4c930a683
TOO MANY CE399 FRAGMENTS IN JOHN CONNALLY? HARDLY:
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/7bf79593cce78406
IF CE399 DIDN'T HIT JOHN CONNALLY, WHAT BULLET DID?:
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/f90802d6225a380e
David Von Pein
http://Amazon.com/David-Von-Pein-Gets-His/forum/Fx2TVHW5I0UEY9A/TxZ10IO0WTRNKX/1/ref=cm_cd_fp_ef_tft_tp?_encoding=UTF8&asin=0393045250
EDDIE KASICA SAID (AT AMAZON.COM):
David Von Pein Gets His. :-) .... Von Punk gets punked: ....
http://ctka.net/2010/dvp.html .... You've made it, David!
EDDIE KASICA ALSO SAID THIS AT AMAZON:
Go here: http://ctka.net/2008/bugliosi_review.html .... The great Jim
DiEugenio has just completed Part 9 in his masterful destruction of
"Defaming History" and all of its Von Poon fanny-boys.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
Keep in mind that James DiEugenio is a person who believes that Oswald
is innocent of killing BOTH Kennedy AND Tippit. And that's just plain
nuts right there.
Anyway, here's my rebuttal [in three parts]:
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/a3ac48b4703ba1b1
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/78e762a534fa835a
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/ba615dc23ce85e44
EDDIE KASICA THEN SAID (MUCH TO MY SURPRISE):
BTW, David, I think DiEugenio really missed the target. (But he may
try again! Tune in to this week's Black Op Radio.*) :-)
[* = http://Box.net/shared/orxsobj3l0]
Also btw, thanks for your magnificent YouTube archive:
http://www.youtube.com/user/DavidVonPein1
BTW3 -- sorry for the goofy namecalling. I know you're a serious
reseacher about a very serious subject. (But you're wrong!) :-)
KEN MURRAY (A CONSPIRACY KOOK WHO HANGS OUT AT WIM DANKBAAR'S FORUM)
THEN SAID:
Hey Von Pein, who gives a flying crap about your "paper debates"[?]
Debate DiEugenio so the world can hear your voice. What [are] you
afraid of? Don't give us that stage fright excuse again. I know why
you won't.
Hey David, how's your brother Tim doing? Or is that you that does all
that traveling[?] How's the KFC chicken business going? I understand
now why you won't debate DiEugenio, chicken. ....
If Jimbo [DiEugenio] makes it so easy, why don't you debate him,
coward? Afraid of getting torn to shreds, coward? Come on coward, your
adoring public wants to hear your voice, coward.
DVP SAID:
Zooooommmmm!!
My last post [linked below] sailed right past Mr. Murray.
Murray will continue to pretend I didn't thoroughly refute DiEugenio.
Because unless I do so ON THE RADIO, it somehow doesn't count.
It must be the built-in laziness on the part of conspiracy theorists.
They don't want to READ it, they need to HEAR the exact same thing
instead.
KEN MURRAY SAID:
ZOOOOOOM!! Col. Sanders still hiding behind his computer. What a
surprise. Hey, we can't wait until you do a review of McAdams' new
book. You going to do a review of that book too before it hits the
bookstores? LOL.
You are a piece of work, I give you that much. You can't refute
nobody, coward. NOBODY takes you seriously with your "paper debates",
except a select few of your adoring fans which I can count on one
hand.
DVP SAID:
Typical kook reply. Ignore my rebuttal. Ignore the evidence. Ignore
Oswald's guilt.
Here's a stroke of genius -- it's time to ignore Ken Murray.
BTW, why the "DVP" fixation, Murray? I've been wondering that for
quite some time now. Why the fixation for someone whom you think knows
absolutely nothing about the JFK topic?
KEN MURRAY BELLOWED:
Here's a stroke of genius, coward. The ONLY fixation around here is
you with yourself. Your [sic] a legend...in your own mind. You are
truly an every day laugh for me, magic bullet kook.
DVP SAID:
Gee, what an original retort. Complete with the usual misspelling of
"you're" by Mr. Conspiracy Kook.
You're a cliche, Kenny. A stereotype of the JFK conspiracy theorists.
~yawn~
KEN MURRAY THEN EJACULATED:
Chicken Von Pein, who goes around 24/7 promoting his master Vinnie the
Bugman's book [THE KOOK NAMED MURRAY IS REFERRING HERE, OF COURSE, TO
VINCENT BUGLIOSI'S 2007 MASTERPIECE, "RECLAIMING HISTORY" --
http://ReclaimingHistory.blogspot.com].
I have never seen so much a$$ kissing by anybody in comparison to you,
Von Pein. If the Bugman told you that Oswald and Manson were brothers,
you would believe him. Such true devotion on your part. Bow down and
kiss your master's feet. If you do so, Vinnie will give you another
autographed copy of his book. Yawn. Sigh. ZZZZZZZZZ
DVP SAID:
Bzzzzz! Wrong again, Kenny. I've talked about multiple errors that
Vincent Bugliosi has made in his JFK book. Here are a few samples
(among others):
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/947d25e8fac5b996
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/7fa797ffc5bc2b26
Here's an excerpt from the second article linked above:
"Another "Not Always Right" example would be Vincent Bugliosi.
I've discovered multiple errors in Vince's JFK book (factual errors
too, not just minor typos).
"But, oddly enough, when those factual errors that I've noticed
in Bugliosi's book are corrected, it actually bolsters VB's lone-
assassin conclusions, instead of weakening his LN case.
"I found that to be quite interesting. This is especially true
regarding a portion of VB's book when he's discussing the amount of
metal (bullet) fragments that were left inside Governor John
Connally's body after he was operated on.
"Mr. Bugliosi, in what could be considered a fairly-large
mistake, leaves the readers of his book with the incorrect impression
that Governor Connally went to his grave in 1993 with up to "seven or
eight" bullet fragments from Bullet CE399 inside his right wrist.
"But, in fact, the "seven or eight" fragments that Vince thinks
are BULLET fragments in Connally's wrist were not BULLET fragments at
all -- they were BONE fragments. And this fact can easily be
discovered by reading Dr. Charles Gregory's testimony in the Warren
Commission volumes.
"Gregory was positively talking about BONE fragments when he
said that as many as "seven or eight" fragments (or possibly more)
were seen inside Connally's wrist via X-ray. Vince Bugliosi, however,
thinks that Gregory was talking about METAL fragments in that
testimony.
"So, when VB's "fragments" mistake is corrected, a strong
argument can really be made for as few as just ONE tiny bullet
fragment (per the totality of Dr. Gregory's testimony) being left in
John Connally's right wrist (plus the one very small bullet fragment
that was left in JBC's thigh wound) after he was operated on at
Parkland Hospital in November of 1963.
"The official record, however, as Mr. Bugliosi rightly points
out in his book, is somewhat muddled and unclear as to the exact
number of small metallic (bullet) fragments that Connally took with
him to his grave.
"But from the sources I can find (and by looking at Connally's
post-operative X-rays), it becomes pretty clear that only a very, very
small amount of metal was left inside Governor Connally's entire body
after he was operated on at Parkland. And it certainly was not an
amount of metal that would come even close to exceeding the
approximately 2.2 to 2.4 grains of lead that are missing from Bullet
CE399.
David Von Pein
May 21, 2009"
[And Vince B. is also dead-wrong about his "Z210" timing for the SBT;
and he's also wrong about his "bouncing bullet" theory relating to
Oswald's first (missed) gunshot.]
==============================================
MORE FUN WITH CONSPIRACY KOOKS AT AMAZON.COM:
==============================================
robcap...@netscape.com
> http://Box.net/shared/orxsobj3l0
>
> I discovered today that James "OSWALD SHOT NOBODY" DiEugenio wasn't
> satisfied with embarrassing himself in print form only, via his
> hilarious CTKA.net article [http://ctka.net/2010/dvp.html], which is
> Jim's so-called "overview of the Internet career of the man many call
> Disinformation Dave" (that would be me).
I have a feeling the "only one about to be embarrassed" is DVP!
> No, Jim decided to embarrass himself (and his riotous "Oswald Was
> Innocent Of Killing Both Kennedy AND Tippit" theories) even further by
> traipsing out his CTKA.net article about me on "Black Op Radio" on
> April 15, 2010 (linked above), two days after the article appeared in
> print form on his website.
Where is YOUR evidence showing LHO shot anyone again?
Snip all Jim DiEugenio stuff! Let's look at the more entertaining
stuff about Dave Von Con instead!
> "To understand Von Pein, one has to go back to his online, forum
> appearance on the JFK Lancer site back in 2003. .... In July of that
> year, he proclaimed Oswald guilty through what he termed a "mountain
> of evidence." He then asked, how much of this overwhelming tidal wave
> of proof would it take to convince a person out of the notion of
> conspiracy? Quite a thunderous build up eh?
LOL!! That is a NICE way to put it Jim!
> "But...Von Pein's "mountain of evidence" consisted of the
> mildewed litany of discredited Warren Commission data. Which, of
> course, is not a mountain. It's more like the San Andreas Fault. He
> began with the...specious notion that Oswald owned the rifle;
LOL!! Ben, are you listening???
> and he
> ended with the equally specious notion that Oswald could have run down
> from the sixth floor to the second in time to be seen by Marrion Baker
> and Roy Truly right after the assassination.
All NON-thinking LNers believe this one!
> "Some of the gems in between were that Oswald definitely killed
> Officer Tippit and that he also attempted to kill General Edwin
> Walker. My favorite point was this: "the Single Bullet Theory has
> still not been proven to be an impossibility." I guess he thinks that
> if it's not impossible, that means it happened. ....
LOL!! That sums up the bent thinking of ALL LNers to a "t!"
> "Von Pein even wrote that at Z frame 224, both Kennedy and John
> Connally were reacting to the same bullet. .... In reality Kennedy is
> reacting and Connally is not. With a straight face, at the end of this
> "mountainous" listing, Von Pein wrote, "For aren't hard facts and
> evidence always more believable than wild speculation and
> conjecture?""
LOL!!! Indeed! They always list NOTHING but wild speculation and
conjecture and then all it FACTS!
> [End DiEugenio Hilarity, for the moment.]
>
> We should pause about three minutes here for the laughs to die down.
For once you are right DVP as everyone is LAUGHING AT YOU!
> The laughs began when DiEugenio suggested, in essence, that all
> reasonable people should just COMPLETELY IGNORE all of the evidence in
> the John F. Kennedy and J.D. Tippit murder cases. That's essentially
> what he just said in those quoted excerpts above.
NO he did NOT liar, he said the evidence you call VALID is worthless
in the sense it does NOT show the scenario you propose (LHO did it all
by himself) to be accurate. YOU need to learn to cite evidence that
actually supports your claims!
> In other words, per Jim, ALL of the evidence is fake and/or not to be
> trusted in some manner. Every last piece of it is worthless to Jim D.,
> including all of the following items:
Putting words into other people's mouths won't help your cause Dave.
The point he made, and anyone with an ounce of reasoning ability and
an understanding of our legal system will know this, is that the
evidence the WC presented can be TRUSTED to show us that a CONSPIRACY
occured!
> 1.) The guns that were used to kill JFK and Tippit (both of which were
> Lee Harvey Oswald's guns, of course).
They were?? Then why can't ANYONE, including YOUR alter-ego Ben, show
us the evidence that makes it CLEAR he owned them then?
> 2.) The bullet fragments that were found right in the Presidential
> limousine itself,
When were they found Dave?
> which are fragments that were linked conclusively to
> OSWALD'S rifle, of course.
YOU have NOT shown there was an "Oswald's rifle" with valid evidence,
so you can't just make this proclamation! Perhaps "Ben" will help
you, huh?
> And virtually no conspiracy theorist that
> I've ever heard of has ever suggested that these bullet fragments from
> Rifle C2766 were planted or tainted in some way.
YOU are NOT reading the right ones then Dave Von Con as the fragments
were "found" 12 hours later in a crime scene that should not have been
taken from the jurisdiction with the authority!
> (Note -- I won't talk about Stretcher Bullet CE399 here, although I
> certainly could include it in this list of evidence that hangs
> DiEugenio's prized patsy, because there hasn't been a conspiracy
> theorist yet who has come up with a single bit of PROOF to show that
> CE399 was a "planted" bullet.
We don't have to Dave, that is the WHOLE POINT as the bullet is
worthless to your side since it has NO FORENSIC link to either victim!
> But as this extensive list shows, even
> WITHOUT Bullet CE399, there is still more than enough evidence that
> proves Oswald's guilt beyond all reasonable doubt.)
LOL!! I love how they use the word "prove" all the time but when I
used to call them on it I get reprimanded by "Ben" for using it since
it never went to court! He is always looking out for those LNers,
huh?
> 3.) The bullet shells FROM OSWALD'S GUNS that littered the scenes of
> BOTH murders (JFK's and Tippit's).
Two or three?? IF you have NOT proven LHO owned the alleged murder
weapon, and YOUR side has NOT, so what?? As for the Tippit murder,
you have all kinds of problems there as the casings did NOT match up
with the BULLETS FOUND INSIDE JDT!
> 4.) The palmprint and fingerprints found on the C2766 Carcano rifle,
What fingerprints?? The few "faint ridges" were UNIDENTIFIABLE LIAR!
> which were proven to be OSWALD'S prints [CE637; WC testimony of Lt.
> J.C. Day; WC testimony of Sebastian Latona; and Vincent Scalice's 1993
> analysis of the fingerprints found on the trigger housing of Carcano
> rifle #C2766.]
ONLY the palmprint was accused of being LHO's, but YOU can't show it
was EVER ON THE RIFLE in the first place since Lt. Day's testimony is
a bunch of contridictions to the official story and that of Latona's!
Why would he sign an affadavit outlining what he did? Why did he
IGNORE all crime scene prodcedures that day?? Who was the source
telling him NOT to fully examine the Carcano?
> 5.) The fingerprints of OSWALD'S which were found all over the
> Sniper's Nest on the sixth floor of the Texas School Book Depository
> (which is the place where JFK's killer was firing a rifle from).
LOL!! It was found allegedly on TWO cartons when he was suppposed to
have moved 20-25 boxes!! Besides, he worked there, so this proves
nothing.
> 6.) The paper bag found in the Sniper's Nest (with OSWALD'S prints on
> it in two places).
What paper bag?? Why do we see NO picture of it in situ?? Why did he
allegedly ONLY leave TWO prints when he was supposedly setting it down
and picking it up (as well as carrying it in different ways according
to different witnesses) a good bit?
> 7.) The fiber evidence on the C2766 rifle and inside the brown paper
> bag (which were fibers consistent with OSWALD'S guilt, of course).
Explain how the fibers MATCHED THE SHIRT HE CHANGED INTO when he
allegedly LEFT THE RIFLE back at the TSBD again for us!
How and when did he make this bag?? The WC NEVER proved he did. The
bag presented as the "bag" also lacked any markings consistent with
the Carcano.
> 8.) And OSWALD'S own LIES that he told practically non-stop from the
> moment he was arrested.
Slander is NOT evidence DVP, no wonder everyone laughs at you!
> Plus:
>
> 9.) I guess we're even supposed to IGNORE the fact that Oswald, a
> person whom DiEugenio says didn't shoot ANYBODY on November 22 and
> therefore would likely have had no reason to START killing cops just
> 35 minutes after Officer Tippit was shot and only 80 minutes after JFK
> was assassinated, fought like mad and pulled a loaded revolver out of
> his pants in the Texas Theater, while at the same time shouting "This
> is it" and/or "It's all over now".
The natural inclination to defend oneself has NOTHING to do with beng
guilty DVP.
> I wonder how Jim DiEugenio explains Oswald's odd behavior in the
> theater at 1:50 PM CST on November 22nd,
Of course DVP NEVER questions his ODD behavior of taking in a movie
after killing two people allegedly INSTEAD OF heading for the Mexican
border!
> which is behavior that has an
> ARMED Lee Harvey Oswald fighting the police like a wild man while
> making statements like "It's all over now"?
That could mean anything and does NOT mean he was guilty. Silly stuff
like this is NOT evidence. YOU can't even give us a motive for
goodness sake!
> Is that the behavior of an innocent "patsy" who didn't fire a single
> shot at President Kennedy OR Officer Tippit? Jim DiEugenio apparently
> thinks so.
YOU can't make judgements off of how folks behave in a tense situation
Dave. Even if someone flees it does NOT mean they are guilty! What
kind of place do you lieve in? The FOURTH REICH?
> And Oswald isn't armed with just any old revolver when he was fighting
> with the police on November 22 in the Texas Theater. No, he had in his
> hands the EXACT SAME GUN that was proven to be the gun that murdered
> Officer J.D. Tippit just THIRTY-FIVE MINUTES before Oswald pulled that
> Smith & Wesson revolver out of his pants.
It was?? How come NONE of the shots the FBI fired could be MATCHED to
the revolver during their tests, but supposedly ONE of the bullets in
JDT did?
Why did ONLY one supposedly matched when LHO supposedly fired all
four?
Why did LHO use a MIX MATCH of bullets allegedly?
Why is there NO evidence showing where LHO got his ammo from?
Why can't your side answer these basic questions?
> And yet DiEugenio still thinks Oswald was innocent of shooting Tippit.
> Pathetic, isn't it? Yes, it is.
I would think it is more frustrating to a lying LNer like, but hey,
the TRUTH always frustrates liars like Dave.
> DiEugenio, in both his written article and his April 15 Black Op
> appearance, also spends considerable time trying to cast mysterious
> shadows over Stretcher Bullet CE399, which Jim is convinced was
> actually NOT the bullet that was found on a stretcher at Parkland
> Hospital.
IF you took the time to actually read the testimony of those who found
it, saw it, and touched it, you would come to the SAME conclusion!
But, like all folks who dismiss "conspiracy theories", YOU are
ignorant of the actual evidence!
> Apparently, then, in DiEugenio's mixed-up world of kooky (and really,
> really bumbling) conspirators, a NON-CE399 bullet was evidently
> planted by the "Let's Frame Oswald" crew of idiots on the WRONG
> STRETCHER.
Why did it happen this way liar? The bullet could have been easily
swapped out once it was entered into "evidence" with the DPD.
I mean, we had the FBI ILLEGALLY taking the evidence on 11/22 anyway,
right?
> And, as if that act of stupidity wasn't enough, apparently those same
> goofball plotters planted a pointy-tipped bullet that looked NOTHING
> like a bullet from Oswald's rifle -- hence, these plotters evidently
> wanted to plant a NON-CARCANO bullet (on the wrong stretcher!), even
> though the whole point of "planting" any evidence in the first place
> is supposedly to frame the man named Oswald, who owned a Mannlicher-
> Carcano rifle.
The bullet they found could have come out of JFK's back wound, that is
what Dr. Humes thought!
> DiEugenio, of course, fails to point out these absurdities and logic
> gaps in the "patsy" plot when he rambles on and on about how terrible
> and stupid Vincent Bugliosi and David Von Pein are (my name is
> pronounced "VON PINE", btw, not "VON PEEN").
Who cares?? YOUR real name is DAVE REITZES and you use a litany of
monikers here including "Ben Holmes!"
> But, evidently, these huge holes in the "logic" department regarding
> the so-called "planting" of Stretcher Bullet CE399 are supposed to be
> overlooked completely by the "lone nutters" of the world, while being
> embraced as some sort of "Aha! I told you that bullet was fake!" proof
> for the conspiracy kooks of the world.
DVP always rambles on this silly point when the truth is this simple
-- THE BULLET IN EVIDENCE IS NOT THE BULLET ANYONE SAW AT PH ON
11/22/63!
Ditto the bullet tied to the Gen. Walker shooting.
> Go figure that. I sure can't.
OF course NOT, YOUR mind won't accept logic and the truth.
YOU are conditioned to lie for money like a perverted "Pavlov dog!"
> As a side note to all of this bullet talk -- DiEugenio never seems to
> want to come out and explain what he actually believes happened with
> respect to this "stretcher bullet" topic.
He doesn't have to DVP, YOU are on the side with the BURDEN OF PROOF.
> He loves to dangle the suspicions in front of people, but I've never
> heard him try to come up with a coherent theory about WHY a bullet was
> found on the stretcher of Ronald Fuller, instead of being found on
> John Connally's stretcher.
The man who took down JBC's stretcher was clear in his description of
what his looked like and what JFK's looked like. Get up to speed
liar.
> Maybe in the past he has trotted out some kind of feeble explanation
> to tie all of these seemingly-incoherent and goofy things together,
> but I've never heard him talk about it.
>
> Let me also add this -- Bullet CE399 was deemed to be the "SBT" bullet
> by BOTH the Warren Commission in 1964 and the House Select Committee
> on Assassinations in 1978.
>
> In other words, that exact CE399 bullet, the same bullet that Mr.
> DiEugenio thinks struck NO VICTIMS in Dealey Plaza at all, was said to
> be the exact bullet that struck both President Kennedy AND Governor
> Connally on 11/22/63.
Yet YOUR side can't produce any evidence showing it was ever INSIDE
EITHER VICTIM! How come liar?
Snip repitive junk!
Snip all worthless McAdam's rhetoric.
David Von Pein
I skipped all of Robcap's usual "OSWALD WAS A SAINT & NEVER HARMED A
FLY" crackpottery, and focused instead on this little gem from
Caprio's keyboard of nuttiness, proving (yet again) that Caprio
couldn't get anything right if his life depended on it:
"YOUR real name is DAVE REITZES and you use a litany of monikers
here including "Ben Holmes!""
That could conceivably be a new high point in hilarity for Robby The
Retard.
Dave Reitzes, have you got room in your body for somebody calling
himself "DVP"? Caprio thinks you do.
robcap...@netscape.com
IOW, the liar skipped ALL OF HIS LIES regarding the evidence! How
typical of Dave Von Con, huh?
David Von Pein
http://ctka.net/2010/dvp.html
ANOTHER REBUTTAL ADDENDUM:
I just noticed another thing that James DiEugenio got wrong in the
article linked above, and that is when Jim said this:
"But the rule that Von Pein violated [at the JFK Lancer forum]
with reckless abandon was the one about doing mass posts and therefore
flooding the board. As Gene Stump pointed out, Von Pein did 263 posts
in his first 12 days! (Post of 7/28/05)"
The problem with the above quote about "flooding the board" at Debra
Conway's conspiracy-oriented JFK Lancer forum is this -- Gene Stump
wasn't talking about me when he said "263 posts in his first 12 days".
Stump was referring, instead, to another LNer by the name of Nick
Kendrick, who joined the JFK Lancer forum on July 17, 2005, and was
kicked off the forum the very same day I was (July 28, 2005).
And when we add up Kendrick's active days on the forum, what does it
come to? Twelve days exactly (inclusively) -- July 17 through July 28.
Here is a link to the 7/28/05 post by Gene Stump that DiEugenio
incorrectly thinks applies to me (and the various quotes that are
cited by Stump here are all things that were posted during those 12
days by Kendrick, not by me):
I don't know why I didn't notice that error of DiEugenio's earlier.
Maybe it's because my capacity for detecting the large number of
mistakes and silly things uttered by James DiEugenio had already
reached its maximum level when I first looked through Jim's article.
Hence, a second (and third) reading was required to pick up any
additional pieces of misinformation spouted by Jim D.
When thinking about the above "flooding the board" error made by
DiEugenio, in conjunction with the following "egg" comment also made
by Jim D. in the same article, I get a sense of pot-and-kettle irony:
"He [DVP] has been trying to sell 'Reclaiming History' as the
Holy Grail to the JFK case for about five years. To put it mildly, it
hasn't panned out as he claimed. He can't admit that. Since because of
his unwise advertising campaign, he now has egg all over his face. So
he sends out an SOS to Bugliosi. And what does he get? More egg. Maybe
he'll get an omelet next time." -- Jim DiEugenio
Are you sure it is DVP who has a face full of omelet, Jim? Look in the
mirror. Maybe it's you who needs a towel to wipe off some egg of your
own.
===============================================
RELATED REBUTTALS:
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/a3ac48b4703ba1b1
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/78e762a534fa835a
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy.jfk/msg/ba615dc23ce85e44
===============================================
Gil Jesus
> http://ctka.net/2010/dvp.html
>
> ANOTHER REBUTTAL ADDENDUM:
>
> I just noticed another thing that James DiEugenio got wrong in the
> article linked above, and that is when Jim said this:
>
> � � � "But the rule that Von Pein violated [at the JFK Lancer forum]
> with reckless abandon was the one about doing mass posts and therefore
> flooding the board. As Gene Stump pointed out, Von Pein did 263 posts
> in his first 12 days! (Post of 7/28/05)"
>
> The problem with the above quote about "flooding the board" at Debra
> Conway's conspiracy-oriented JFK Lancer forum is this -- Gene Stump
> wasn't talking about me when he said "263 posts in his first 12 days".
> Stump was referring, instead, to another LNer by the name of Nick
> Kendrick, who joined the JFK Lancer forum on July 17, 2005, and was
> kicked off the forum the very same day I was (July 28, 2005).
>
> And when we add up Kendrick's active days on the forum, what does it
> come to? Twelve days exactly (inclusively) -- July 17 through July 28.
>
> Here is a link to the 7/28/05 post by Gene Stump that DiEugenio
> incorrectly thinks applies to me (and the various quotes that are
> cited by Stump here are all things that were posted during those 12
> days by Kendrick, not by me):
>
>
> I don't know why I didn't notice that error of DiEugenio's earlier.
Maybe because you and Kendrick were the same poster and that's why you
were booted off Lancer on the same day.
David Von Pein
>>> "Maybe because you and Kendrick were the same poster and that's why you were booted off Lancer on the same day." <<<
Just like a CT-Kook -- you never get anything right.
David Von Pein
I've certainly hit a nerve in James DiEugenio.
The delusional DiEugenio has decided to embarrass himself even more in
his latest effort to discredit me, linked below, which is an article
that debuted at the CTKA.net website on May 17, 2010:
http://CTKA.net/2010/dvp2.html
DiEugenio, in effect, admits he lied about me in the past regarding
certain things I brought up in one of my rebuttal articles that I
wrote to straighten out some of his falsehoods. (Take note of item
numbers 3, 5, 10, and 15 in the above article to see what I mean.)
And item #6 on Jim's list of craziness is enough to make any sensible
person pee their pants immediately. Let's take a gander at it now:
"6. The next point indicates the time warp that Von Pein is in.
He actually scores me for not accepting all the old discredited Warren
Commission evidence against Oswald. You know, like the palm print that
did not arrive in Washington until a week later; the unbelievable CE
399; the dented shell that could not have been dented that day; the
Walker bullet that somehow altered its caliber and color while in
transit from the rifle; the shells from the bullets fired at Tippit
that are missing the officer's initials etc etc. These deceptions were
all exposed decades ago by Harold Weisberg, Sylvia Meagher, Mark Lane,
Josiah Thompson and others. Yet, with Von Pein, it's like those books
do not exist. Which shows his denial problem. Because they are the
main reason that the public lost faith in the Warren Commission." --
Jim DiEugenio; May 2010
Keep posting the articles, Jim. I'm enjoying the laughs they
inevitably provide.
lazu...@webtv.net
seasoned wants to hear from lone nutters period anymore, but if you can
get the old curmudgeon who wrote the POS Reclaiming History, to actually
defend it in a public venue bring it on...Laz
David Von Pein
>>> "But if you can get the old curmudgeon who wrote...Reclaiming History to actually defend it in a public venue[,] bring it on." <<<
Vince has already done that--dozens of times. Perhaps ol' Laz was
asleep at the time: