World of Commodore Notes
Chuck Beck
The World Of Commodore Amiga in Toronto last week-
I wont go into all that was said as I was not taking notes- but...
He said that the new Amiga's with AGA and Beyond were based on
all surface mount technology not entirely because of cost savings
in manufacturing, but also because of the need to keep siginal
characteristics in line with the designs' needs as many of the
new designs run at very high clock speeds. At the speeds that these
siginals run, you can have lots of troubles adding extra connections
in the circuit (IC Sockets).
Because of this it will be very hard to add the AGA chip set in
any of the older machines (500, 2000, 3000, 600, etc) as they
need to run at such speeds, and be closely coupled together.
He said a lot more, and talked about 2 entirely new chipsets
coming out in the future... One low end 'single chip' Amiga, that
blows the doors off of anything we have seen (even 4000), and one
really neat 4 chip set for high end applications.
Does anyone have a transcript of this talk that they could post
to the net? I saw a few people videotaping it, and suspect some
may have recorded the audio too. If someone has it- PLEASE POST IT!
These thoughts are only my own. CHB...@anl.gov
Hamish Macdonald
>>>>> In message <chbeck-08...@chbmac01.el.anl.gov>,
>>>>> chb...@anl.gov (Chuck Beck) wrote:
Chuck> The VP of New Product Development put on a great talk at The
Chuck> World Of Commodore Amiga in Toronto last week-
One thing he mentioned was the the reason the HD floppy wasn't put in
the 1200 is that it doesn't *fit*.
Regular floppies are 25mm high. The HD floppies are 32mm high (room
for two motors for the 2 different rotation speeds).
The 1200 only has room for a 25mm high drive.
So they didn't leave it out just to piss people off.
He also mentioned that they are working on getting the drives to be
less high.
Adam Benjamin
>
>One thing he mentioned was the the reason the HD floppy wasn't put in
>the 1200 is that it doesn't *fit*.
>
Or didn't any 4000 owners notice that the manual says you will have to
replace your existing floppy in order to add another?
Has anyone crammed a second floppy into thier 4000 yet? Is the manual
correct?
>Regular floppies are 25mm high. The HD floppies are 32mm high (room
>for two motors for the 2 different rotation speeds).
>
I never took a close look, is there indeed two drive motors?? this sounds
ludicrous, why not a dual speed single motor?
>So they didn't leave it out just to piss people off.
No they continued to use a "hack" design to piss us off (slightly)
/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\
// benj...@zds-oem.zds.com OR AF...@yfn.ysu.edu
\X/ Adam Benjamin Insert snappy humor here
\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/
Skip Sauls
>In article <1992Dec09.0...@bmerh85.bnr.ca> Hamish.M...@x400gate.bnr.ca (Hamish Macdonald) writes:
>>
>>One thing he mentioned was the the reason the HD floppy wasn't put in
>>the 1200 is that it doesn't *fit*.
>>
>And I am VERY suprized an uproar has not risen regarding this in the 4000
>Or didn't any 4000 owners notice that the manual says you will have to
>replace your existing floppy in order to add another?
>Has anyone crammed a second floppy into thier 4000 yet? Is the manual
>correct?
Perhaps the lack of an uproar is that most A4000 owners probably see
little need for a second floppy. I do not use a floppy on a regular
basis except when installing new software and backing up the hard drive.
I guess if there were any games that ran on the A4000 then you might
have heard a few more complaints... :-)
>>Regular floppies are 25mm high. The HD floppies are 32mm high (room
>>for two motors for the 2 different rotation speeds).
>>
>I never took a close look, is there indeed two drive motors?? this sounds
>ludicrous, why not a dual speed single motor?
I have no idea, but I did notice that there is plenty of height for a
second drive, but the faceplate is too small.
>>So they didn't leave it out just to piss people off.
>
>No they continued to use a "hack" design to piss us off (slightly)
After using it, I have to agree that it is indeed a hack and a very
poor one at that. The speed under AmigaDOS seems okay because we
have always had rather slow floppies, but under MS-DOS it is very
noticeable, especially when once is accustomed to fast Clones. I
guess that the designers put the floppy in a position where it would
be blocked by the keyboard to hide the fact that it sucks. :-)
Before anyone jumps to the conclusion that I don't like the A4000,
think again. But it is just like anything else and has both its
good points and its bad points. The fact that the floppy drive is
a slow hack and that the machine looks like a Tandy reject are far
outweighed by the A4000's merits.
>/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\
> // benj...@zds-oem.zds.com OR AF...@yfn.ysu.edu
> \X/ Adam Benjamin Insert snappy humor here
>\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/
Skip Sauls, Amiga Advocate who likes the A4000 despite its ugliness
sk...@tacky.cs.olemiss.edu
Rostyk Lewyckyj
> >>>>> chb...@anl.gov (Chuck Beck) wrote:
>
> Chuck> The VP of New Product Development put on a great talk at The
> Chuck> World Of Commodore Amiga in Toronto last week-
>
> One thing he mentioned was the the reason the HD floppy wasn't put in
> the 1200 is that it doesn't *fit*.
>
> Regular floppies are 25mm high. The HD floppies are 32mm high (room
> for two motors for the 2 different rotation speeds).
>
> The 1200 only has room for a 25mm high drive.
>
> So they didn't leave it out just to piss people off.
>
> He also mentioned that they are working on getting the drives to be
> less high.
Funny thing about these decisions. They decide to put in an
incompatible drive and spend even more money to slim it down for
a future version of AMIGA rather than
Initially design a proper sized case that the drives would have
fit into. DOn't they talk to each other?
Initially decide to put in a commonly available disk drive (and
of course the electronics to support it). I am talking about
IBM compatible 720/1440 K drives. They sure didn't hesitate on
putting IDE harddrives into the A4000. I kno the 880 would hafta
go.
Jeff Easton
>In article <1992Dec09.1...@zds-oem.zds.com> benj...@zds-oem.zds.com (Adam Benjamin) writes:
>>Has anyone crammed a second floppy into thier 4000 yet? Is the manual
>>correct?
>
>Perhaps the lack of an uproar is that most A4000 owners probably see
>little need for a second floppy. I do not use a floppy on a regular
>basis except when installing new software and backing up the hard drive.
You back up that 105 Mb drive to _floppies_?
>>I never took a close look, is there indeed two drive motors?? this sounds
>>ludicrous, why not a dual speed single motor?
>
>I have no idea, but I did notice that there is plenty of height for a
>second drive, but the faceplate is too small.
>
>After using it, I have to agree that it is indeed a hack and a very
>poor one at that. The speed under AmigaDOS seems okay because we
>have always had rather slow floppies, but under MS-DOS it is very
>noticeable, especially when once is accustomed to fast Clones. I
>guess that the designers put the floppy in a position where it would
>be blocked by the keyboard to hide the fact that it sucks. :-)
No! no! we just got done arguing about the suck vs. blow theory. :-)
>Before anyone jumps to the conclusion that I don't like the A4000,
>think again. But it is just like anything else and has both its
>good points and its bad points. The fact that the floppy drive is
>a slow hack and that the machine looks like a Tandy reject are far
>outweighed by the A4000's merits.
You obviously havent seen the ZDS Z300/400 series. I hate to
admit it, but the C= mechanical engineers copied it verbatim.
Okay, they took out a slot and put a keylock on the front, big deal...
:-)
>> // benj...@zds-oem.zds.com OR AF...@yfn.ysu.edu
>sk...@tacky.cs.olemiss.edu
--
___ ___ Jeff Easton eas...@zds-oem.zds.com
(__ (__ Zenith Data Systems j.ea...@mi04.zds.com
___) ___) Saint Joseph, Mich. eas...@andrews.edu
Monte Carlo Z-LS/20 - Choice of a quiet generation
Tom R Krotchko
>have heard a few more complaints... :-)
Actually, most of my favorites run. Most of the arcade stuff breaks.
Fortunately the following runs with no problem:
Railroad Tychoon
Civilization
Simearth
Simant
Leisure Suit Larry V
Space Quest IV
Chessmaster 2000
Jack Nicholas Golf
Lemming Christmas Demo (you have to boot from the disk)
Clown-o-Manis
Mean 18
Simcity
Marble Madness almost works; except the ball appears on the screen
four times.
What breaks:
Monkey Island II
Search For The King
Links
Castles
<many more that I won't depress anyone with>
The only bad part about the stuff that breaks is for the most
part, the companies have no plans to fix it.
>have always had rather slow floppies, but under MS-DOS it is very
>noticeable,
Fortunately, we don't use MS-DOS. Seriously, its a little slower,
but how much MS-DOS floppy processing do you do?
>good points and its bad points. The fact that the floppy drive is
>a slow hack and that the machine looks like a Tandy reject are far
>outweighed by the A4000's merits.
The ugly duckling has beautiful insides. Pop off the color, and
tell me the inside of the 4000 is thought out better and uses better
materials than any clone.
>Skip Sauls, Amiga Advocate who likes the A4000 despite its ugliness
>sk...@tacky.cs.olemiss.edu
To...@cup.portal.com who thinks IBM makes even uglier computers
Tom Krotchko
Skip Sauls
>In article <1992Dec9.2...@ra.msstate.edu> sk...@tacky.cs.olemiss.edu (Skip Sauls) writes:
>>In article <1992Dec09.1...@zds-oem.zds.com> benj...@zds-oem.zds.com (Adam Benjamin) writes:
>
>>>Has anyone crammed a second floppy into thier 4000 yet? Is the manual
>>>correct?
>>
>>Perhaps the lack of an uproar is that most A4000 owners probably see
>>little need for a second floppy. I do not use a floppy on a regular
>>basis except when installing new software and backing up the hard drive.
>
> You back up that 105 Mb drive to _floppies_?
Not often... :-)
I've used rcp and ftp to back up my A3000's hd to Suns and other UNIX
boxes, but that is such a pain that I haven't tried it with the A4000.
A friend of mine just got an A3070 and I could borrow it to do a backup,
but the A4000 has not SCSI port yet. While I could buy one of the
existing Zorro II SCSI cards, I've heard that the performance of these
beasts really sucks in the A4000. Luckily, Commodore has announced a
Zorro III SCSI-II card and I'll be purchasing one as soon as they are
available.
>>>I never took a close look, is there indeed two drive motors?? this sounds
>>>ludicrous, why not a dual speed single motor?
>>
>>I have no idea, but I did notice that there is plenty of height for a
>>second drive, but the faceplate is too small.
>>
>>After using it, I have to agree that it is indeed a hack and a very
>>poor one at that. The speed under AmigaDOS seems okay because we
>>have always had rather slow floppies, but under MS-DOS it is very
>>noticeable, especially when once is accustomed to fast Clones. I
>>guess that the designers put the floppy in a position where it would
>>be blocked by the keyboard to hide the fact that it sucks. :-)
>
> No! no! we just got done arguing about the suck vs. blow theory. :-)
Well, my fan now blows, but it did suck. :-) In my statement above,
I was referring to the fact that the HD floppy hack sucks. In the
standard mode the drive is as fast or faster than the A3000, which is
itself faster than the A1000, A2000, and A500. But compared to the
486 I use at work, the A4000's HD floppy hack is a bit slower in the
normal mode and much slower in the HD mode. That sucks. :-)
>>Before anyone jumps to the conclusion that I don't like the A4000,
>>think again. But it is just like anything else and has both its
>>good points and its bad points. The fact that the floppy drive is
>>a slow hack and that the machine looks like a Tandy reject are far
>>outweighed by the A4000's merits.
>
> You obviously havent seen the ZDS Z300/400 series. I hate to
>admit it, but the C= mechanical engineers copied it verbatim.
>Okay, they took out a slot and put a keylock on the front, big deal...
>:-)
You're right. I just dug up a couple of Byte mags and found a few ads
with pictures of those machines. They appear to be a bit taller and
don't have the silly sloped front that they A4000 has, but otherwise
they are very similar.
Has anyone noticed that most of the recent case designs are all ugly?
The A4000 is bad, but next to a Performa 600 or one of those new IBM
ValuePoint machines, it looks pretty good. And the new ZEOS machines
have cases which look like something an art school dropout might design.
What is wrong with the case designers these days?
> ___ ___ Jeff Easton eas...@zds-oem.zds.com
> (__ (__ Zenith Data Systems j.ea...@mi04.zds.com
> ___) ___) Saint Joseph, Mich. eas...@andrews.edu
>Monte Carlo Z-LS/20 - Choice of a quiet generation
Skip Sauls, Amiga Advocate and owner of a nice but ugly A4000
sk...@tacky.cs.olemiss.edu
Skip Sauls
>>I guess if there were any games that ran on the A4000 then you might
>>have heard a few more complaints... :-)
>
>Actually, most of my favorites run. Most of the arcade stuff breaks.
>Fortunately the following runs with no problem:
Perhaps I should have qualified my statement a bit. I have owned an A1000
(still do in fact) and an A3000 (just sold) before my A4000. I have nearly
fifty games which I purchased when I was using the A1000, but none of them
work on the A4000. Of course, I might be able to play a few if I used the
boot menus and had a multisync, but the former is too much trouble as I
rarely if ever turn my machine off or reboot and the latter will soon be
remedied but I hate using the non-31kHz modes.
I purchased a few games for my A3000, but many of them do not work on the
A4000 for the reasons mentionned above. I'd have bought more games, but
many of them did not run on the A3000 and I pretty much gave up playing
games on the Amiga for this fact. While I will probably buy games for the
A4000 in the future, I refuse to do so if the damn things must be run from
a floppy and are not OS friendly. There is simply no reason for programmers
to continue to develop that sort of trash.
>Railroad Tychoon
>Civilization
A friend of mine has these for the PC and I've played it on occasion, but
the graphics don't do much for me. I've seen the Amiga versions and they
seem to suffer from the same poorly drawn lo-res EGA colored graphics.
>Simearth
>Simant
These I will probably buy. I've played SimCity for hundreds of hours and
have wanted to play SimEarth ever since seeing it on a Mac. But I'll
probably need the multisync first...
>Leisure Suit Larry V
>Space Quest IV
I'll pass on these.
>Chessmaster 2000
Has this been updated? I never bought it for the Amiga, but I saw it in
stores and played the IIGS version at the store where I worked. Neat, but
on the IIGS it was very slow.
>Jack Nicholas Golf
I hate golf and I hate golf games even more. :-)
>Lemming Christmas Demo (you have to boot from the disk)
I tried it, but it opens a 15kHz screen and is unplayable on my A4000.
>Clown-o-Manis
What is this? I don't even recall hearing of it.
>Mean 18
See above about golf games. :-)
>Simcity
I must have an old version or something. It starts to run, but it does not
even open a screen and appears to allocate and then free some memory. The
machine is then very unstable and will crash soon. I need to call them and
see if there is an upgrade to the new version.
>Marble Madness almost works; except the ball appears on the screen
>four times.
I've seen this on an Amiga and was amazed at how close it was to the arcade
version.
>What breaks:
>
>Monkey Island II
>Search For The King
>Links
>Castles
><many more that I won't depress anyone with>
I guess I could try out all the games that I have, but I don't exactly
enjoy popping in floppies and rebooting just to have the things not work.
I am sick and tired of games that do not multitask and are not hard drive
installable. There is no reason for Amiga owners to have to put up with
this sort of thing. Clone and Mac owners certainly wouldn't.
>The only bad part about the stuff that breaks is for the most
>part, the companies have no plans to fix it.
I know it sounds odd, but I'm glad. I'd much rather them use their
resources developing new software for modern systems instead of trying
to fix their old poorly written code.
>>have always had rather slow floppies, but under MS-DOS it is very
>>noticeable,
>
>Fortunately, we don't use MS-DOS. Seriously, its a little slower,
>but how much MS-DOS floppy processing do you do?
Thankfully not much. My A4000 has Ethernet, as do all the other Amigas,
Clones, and workstations in the department. But I do have students who
come by to get files for class and all of them use MS-DOS HD floppies.
It is quicker to walk around the corner and use a 486 to copy the files
than it is to wait for the A4000 to do so...
>>good points and its bad points. The fact that the floppy drive is
>>a slow hack and that the machine looks like a Tandy reject are far
>>outweighed by the A4000's merits.
>
>The ugly duckling has beautiful insides. Pop off the color, and
>tell me the inside of the 4000 is thought out better and uses better
>materials than any clone.
I agree, in fact, my cover is off right now. :-) Compared to the A3000,
the A4000 is a much better design, it just suffers from an ugly front
panel. Luckily, the cover does come off and hopefully someone will design
a replacement one to end our suffering. :-)
>>Skip Sauls, Amiga Advocate who likes the A4000 despite its ugliness
>>sk...@tacky.cs.olemiss.edu
>
>To...@cup.portal.com who thinks IBM makes even uglier computers
>Tom Krotchko
Skip Sauls, Amiga Advocate who agrees, and feels the Performas are also uglier
sk...@tacky.cs.olemiss.edu
Tom R Krotchko
>have heard a few more complaints... :-)
Actually, most of my favorites run. Most of the arcade stuff breaks.
Fortunately the following runs with no problem:
Railroad Tychoon
Civilization
Simearth
Simant
Leisure Suit Larry V
Space Quest IV
Chessmaster 2000
Jack Nicholas Golf
Lemming Christmas Demo (you have to boot from the disk)
Clown-o-Manis
Mean 18
Simcity
Marble Madness almost works; except the ball appears on the screen
four times.
What breaks:
Monkey Island II
Search For The King
Links
Castles
<many more that I won't depress anyone with>
The only bad part about the stuff that breaks is for the most
part, the companies have no plans to fix it.
>have always had rather slow floppies, but under MS-DOS it is very
>noticeable,
Fortunately, we don't use MS-DOS. Seriously, its a little slower,
but how much MS-DOS floppy processing do you do?
>good points and its bad points. The fact that the floppy drive is
>a slow hack and that the machine looks like a Tandy reject are far
>outweighed by the A4000's merits.
The ugly duckling has beautiful insides. Pop off the color, and
tell me the inside of the 4000 is thought out better and uses better
materials than any clone.
>Skip Sauls, Amiga Advocate who likes the A4000 despite its ugliness
>sk...@tacky.cs.olemiss.edu
To...@cup.portal.com who thinks IBM makes even uglier computers
Tom Krotchko
Steven Mathers
|> >I guess if there were any games that ran on the A4000 then you might
|> >have heard a few more complaints... :-)
|>
|> four times.
|>
|> What breaks:
|>
|> Monkey Island II
|> Search For The King
|> Links
|> Castles
|> <many more that I won't depress anyone with>
|>
|> The only bad part about the stuff that breaks is for the most
|> part, the companies have no plans to fix it.
Have you tried this stuff with the ECS mode enabled by doing the
mouse-button push down thingy when the computer boots up?
Rostyk Lewyckyj
> In article <1992Dec10....@zds-oem.zds.com> eas...@zds-oem.zds.com (Jeff Easton) writes:
> >In article <1992Dec9.2...@ra.msstate.edu> sk...@tacky.cs.olemiss.edu (Skip Sauls) writes:
> >>In article <1992Dec09.1...@zds-oem.zds.com> benj...@zds-oem.zds.com (Adam Benjamin) writes:
> >
> >>>Has anyone crammed a second floppy into thier 4000 yet? Is the manual
> >>>correct?
> Luckily, Commodore has announced a
> Zorro III SCSI-II card and I'll be purchasing one as soon as they are
> available.
a concious design decision. Not even an oversight.
> >>>I never took a close look, is there indeed two drive motors?? this sounds
> >>>ludicrous, why not a dual speed single motor?
> >>
> >>I have no idea, but I did notice that there is plenty of height for a
> >>second drive, but the faceplate is too small.
> >>After using it, I have to agree that it is indeed a hack and a very
> >>poor one at that. The speed under AmigaDOS seems okay because we
> >>have always had rather slow floppies, but under MS-DOS it is very
> >>noticeable, especially when once is accustomed to fast Clones. I
> >>guess that the designers put the floppy in a position where it would
> >>be blocked by the keyboard to hide the fact that it sucks. :-)
>
> standard mode the drive is as fast or faster than the A3000, which is
> itself faster than the A1000, A2000, and A500. But compared to the
> 486 I use at work, the A4000's HD floppy hack is a bit slower in the
> normal mode and much slower in the HD mode. That sucks. :-)
>
>
> Has anyone noticed that most of the recent case designs are all ugly?
> The A4000 is bad, but next to a Performa 600 or one of those new IBM
> ValuePoint machines, it looks pretty good. And the new ZEOS machines
> have cases which look like something an art school dropout might design.
> What is wrong with the case designers these days?
>
such as wrong shape and not enough space for upgrades are more important.
As another example of this is the lack of room in the A1200 case for
a C= HD diskette drive. Of course the warped decision to develop a
special dual speed diskette drive, rather tha n spending the money to
put in support for the commonly available 720/1440 k diskette drives
as AMIGA file system diskettes is subject for a seperate discussion.
--Rostyk
-----------------------------------------------
Reply-To: Rostyslaw Jarema Lewyckyj
urj...@unc.oit.unc.edu (ARPA,SURA,NSF etc. internet)
or urj...@unc.bitnet
or urj...@ecsvax.UUCP
tel. (919)-962-6501
Jeff Easton
>
>Has anyone noticed that most of the recent case designs are all ugly?
>The A4000 is bad, but next to a Performa 600 or one of those new IBM
>ValuePoint machines, it looks pretty good. And the new ZEOS machines
>have cases which look like something an art school dropout might design.
>What is wrong with the case designers these days?
Because they never question the Industrial Designers? :-) I remember
arguing with a guy over a rendering of a new front bezel. It went
something like this;
him: Here's a drawing showing how we are going to style your front
bezel.
me: If you put the power switch way down there, how am I going to
turn the computer on and off when the keyboard covers it up?
him: Thats a problem? Besides, it looks better down there.
I finally convinced him that it would be in the users best interests
if it was in the upper corner instead of the lower corner. He still
felt that it "interrupted the flow of the speed lines", or some such
nonsense.
>Skip Sauls, Amiga Advocate and owner of a nice but ugly A4000
--
Denny Lee Atkin
>What breaks:
>
>Monkey Island II
>Search For The King
>Links
>Castles
><many more that I won't depress anyone with>
Tom,
Every game I've tried that doesn't break under 2.04 or a >68000
processor on ANY machine you run it on, will run fine on the 4000 if
you boot in ECS mode with the caches disabled. I've run Links with no
problem at all, for instance.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Denny Atkin | den...@cup.portal.com | "No matter where
Editor | Portal, GEnie, and BIX: dennya | you go, there you
COMPUTE's Amiga Resource | CIS: 75500,3602 | are." - B.Banzai
---------------=====<<<<< YES! COMPUTE _DOES_ COVER THE AMIGA! >>>>>=====------
George Hepker VI
someone written a program to make the '040 and '030 simulate a 68000.
Forgive but I don't know how plausible these things are. It would be nice
to make the new machines fully backwards compatable
George Hepker
Barry McConnell
>>Perhaps the lack of an uproar is that most A4000 owners probably see
>>little need for a second floppy. I do not use a floppy on a regular
>>basis except when installing new software and backing up the hard drive.
> You back up that 105 Mb drive to _floppies_?
Well, I have a 120MB HD, and I back it up to floppies too... QB 5.02 works
quite well for this, and with two drives you never have to waste time with
a "please insert disk" requestor. I always use max compression so I can use
less floppies (although I wish there was a way not to bother compressing
certain files that I know won't compress, like archives...).
Okay, so a tape streamer or Syquest would be a lot faster, more convenient, and
more reliable, but as a student, I simply could not justify the cost! A few
hours on a Saturday evening is not *that* bad, and besides, I can just leave it
backing-up while I work on something else in the foreground...
Barry.
K30...@alijku11.bitnet
>>have heard a few more complaints... :-)
>Actually, most of my favorites run. Most of the arcade stuff breaks.
>Fortunately the following runs with no problem:
-"-
>Marble Madness almost works; except the ball appears on the screen
>four times.
Great| Marble Madness is still now one of the best coded & perfectly
playable game ever made on Amiga (and all this system-friendly|||)
Tell me more about the 4-times-ball please. Is it still playable?
-"-
Regards, Werner.
A.J.Amsel
To keep a 399 pound price tag it was a choice between that or 2 megs chip
memory. The software writers were given the choice and decided on memory
with the HD drives to be added at a later date along with possibly
internal hard drives for some A1200
I can`t guarantee all this is exactly correct, but it is what I have heard.
------------------------------------------------------------
| This is sent to your courtesy of Alex Amsel incorporated |
------------------------------------------------------------
| Probably the best opinion in the world | NOT |
------------------------------------------------------------