Baptist School of Theology
pasto...@my-deja.com
Here's a new one! No tuition, you're just obligated to pay a large
enrollment fee, plus buy all your books through their affiliate link
with Amazon.com
Barry
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
Steve Levicoff
> Hey,
> Here's a new one! No tuition, you're just obligated to pay a large
> enrollment fee, plus buy all your books through their affiliate link
> with Amazon.com
>
> http://www.baptist.edu/
Yes, campers, it's a degree mill. But here's some interesting trivia .
. .
The Baptist School of Theology web site lists its address as 334 E.
Kearney Street, #202, Springfield, MO 65803. I am not aware of whether
this is an office building, apartment house, or mailbox service. But
here's the interesting part . . .
A few blocks away, at 628 E. Kearney Street, Springfield, MO 65803 -
same street and same zip code - is Baptist Bible College, a legitimate
school. Accredited by AABC (the Accrediting Association of Bible
Colleges, the DoEd-approved accreditor for undergraduate programs in
Bible) but not regionally accredited, BBC is the alma mater of Jerry
Falwell (who earned his 3-year Th.G. diploma there) and is affiliated
with the Baptist Bible Fellowship. Their URL is http://www.bbcnet.edu.
BBC in Springfield offers distance ed programs, including a degree
completion program for people who hold its 3-year Th.G. diploma, but
they do not currently offer a full distance degree program from scratch.
(There is also a Baptist Bible College & Seminary in Clarks Summit,
Pennsylvania, which is regionally accredited, but they have no
relationship to the BBC in Springfield. The Pennsylvania school is the
one with the URL http://www.bbc.edu.)
The bottom line: What we have in the Baptist School of Theology is a
degree mill that has not only chosen a name similar to a legitimate,
traditional college, but one that has located its mailing address (at
the least) on the same street, in the same town, and with the same zip
code. And managed to cop the baptist.edu URL. They may be small-time
players, but they obviously know how to be sleazy with style.
--
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( ) 0
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/ \-'~; /~~~(O)
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=( _____| (_________|
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Steve Levicoff
levi...@ix.netcom.com
http://levicoff.tripod.com
------------------------------
Bill Gossett
>The Baptist School of Theology web site lists its address as 334
>E. Kearney Street, #202, Springfield, MO 65803. I am not aware
>of whether
>this is an office building, apartment house, or mailbox service.
>
Steve, the domain registrant is:
Mt. Calvary Baptist Bible College using the same address.
Bill Gossett
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Kevin Stewart
Steve Levicoff wrote in message <398CC107...@ix.netcom.com>...
>pasto...@my-deja.com wrote:
[...] BBC is the alma mater of Jerry
>Falwell (who earned his 3-year Th.G. diploma there) and is affiliated
>with the Baptist Bible Fellowship.
Ummm, in keeping with a truly informative post, would you care to explain
"Th.G."? I'm guessing it's a typo, but. . . . And "diploma"? That sounds
like a liability and a trinket for 3 yrs. work. (I speak as one who has a 2
yr version.)
Thanks.
Kevin, (tongue in cheek, but sincere.)
Steve Levicoff
> Uhhh, Dr. Steve, sir?
Yes, my son?
> [Sorry I don't wear hats or I'd be holding one.] . . .
And, out of the goodness of my heart, I'm sure I would be dropping a few
coins in it.
> [...] BBC is the alma mater of Jerry
> >Falwell (who earned his 3-year Th.G. diploma there) and is affiliated
> >with the Baptist Bible Fellowship.
>
> Ummm, in keeping with a truly informative post, would you care to explain
> "Th.G."? I'm guessing it's a typo, but. . . . And "diploma"? That sounds
> like a liability and a trinket for 3 yrs. work. (I speak as one who has a 2
> yr version.)
Very good, Kevin . . . You get the gold star for today!
"Th.G. diploma" is quite accurate. The "Th.G." part means Graduate of
Theology, and was the traditional three-year curriculum of many Bible
colleges that did not grant a four-year degree at the time. Almost all
of the historic Bible colleges *started* out as three-year programs.
Most of them expanded their offerings to a four-year bachelor's degree,
often the B.B.S. (Bachelor of Biblical Studies). A few still offer the
three-year Th.G., which is technically a diploma rather than a degree
(although a few called their three-year credential a degree). Needless
to say, this all happened before the advent of the two-year associate's
degree offered by junior and community colleges. Many Th.G.-granting
Bible colleges were, in fact, accredited by what is now the Accrediting
Association of Bible Colleges (the DoEd-approved accreditor for
undergraduate Bible programs).
Hence, the reference to BBC's distance program, which offers a
bachelor's degree to persons already holding a three-year Th.G. Point
of trivia: As I mentioned, Jerry Falwell earned the Th.G. from BBC in
Springfield, a "King James only" school. Thus, "Dr. Falwell" (as he is
called), the founder and chancellor of the regionally and
TRACS-accredited Liberty University, not only does not hold an earned
doctorate, he does not even have an earned bachelor's degree.
The Th.G. has pretty much gone the way of the academic D.D. (as opposed
to today's honorary D.D.). One of the last schools to offer the Th.G.
was the Practical Bible Training School in New York, which has been
around since 1900 and was accredited by AABC in 1985. They were finally
issued degree-granting approval by the New York Board of Regents in
1993, changed their name to Practical Bible College, and now follow the
usual two and four-year models, granting the A.A.S. and B.R.E. degrees.
> Thanks.
>
> Kevin, (tongue in cheek, but sincere.)
I'm sure (ditto).
Kevin Stewart
Steve Levicoff wrote in message,
<398D5BAC...@ix.netcom.com>...
>Kevin Stewart wrote:
>
>> Uhhh, Dr. Steve, sir?
>
>Yes, my son?
>
>> [Sorry I don't wear hats or I'd be holding one.] . . .
>
>And, out of the goodness of my heart, I'm sure I would be dropping a few
>coins in it.
The reference was to "hat in hand". I don't take donations. But thanks for
the thought!
>> Ummm, in keeping with a truly informative post, would you care to explain
>> "Th.G."?
>Very good, Kevin . . . You get the gold star for today!
gushgollyneato [blushes]
>"Th.G. diploma" is quite accurate. The "Th.G." part means Graduate of
>Theology, and was the traditional three-year curriculum of many Bible
>colleges that did not grant a four-year degree at the time.
snipped
Point
>of trivia: As I mentioned, Jerry Falwell earned the Th.G. from BBC in
>Springfield, a "King James only" school. Thus, "Dr. Falwell" (as he is
>called), the founder and chancellor of the regionally and
>TRACS-accredited Liberty University, not only does not hold an earned
>doctorate, he does not even have an earned bachelor's degree.
Wildly insane guess: The "Dr." was 'awarded' by his own school. The old boy
sounds like Herman Hoeh at Ambassador college, (Armstrongs' "Liberty U"),
who would go to Registration and "sign up" for Masters/Doctorate-level,
(non-existent classes, since AC was a 4-yr school), classes in Ancient
History and Theology. Thus didst he become 'Dr Hoeh, Professor' -- and he
did it while 'teaching'.
In any case, how does Farwell's honorific differ from mine aside from my
spending $20? Does popularity posit propriety? Or is there a double standard
here?
And did Liberty start out with a similarly "qualified" staff? (IOW, was it a
mill with(?) an exemption for religious schools or just an unaccredited
school that was considered too good for mill status?). Could Liberty be a
successful, (ergo, prototype for) 'LaSalle'?
It's getting interesting!
Kevin
Steve Levicoff
> In any case, how does Farwell's honorific differ from mine aside from my
> spending $20? Does popularity posit propriety? Or is there a double standard
> here?
In my opinion, Falwell's honorary doctorate and your $20 ULC doctorate
do not differ at all. There is no double standard; honorary degrees are
bullshit, period.
> And did Liberty start out with a similarly "qualified" staff? (IOW, was it a
> mill with(?) an exemption for religious schools or just an unaccredited
> school that was considered too good for mill status?). Could Liberty be a
> successful, (ergo, prototype for) 'LaSalle'?
Neither. Interestingly enough, Falwell made a few of "the right moves"
when he started Liberty. First, he did not name the school after
himself. (Look at what happened to Jimmy Swaggart Bible College.)
Second, remember that Liberty was started with megabucks earned through
Falwell's broadcast ministry and through his own congregation, the
Thomas Road Baptist Church. (In fact, Liberty has always been
considered a ministry of TRBC.) Therefore, when it came to faculty and
staff, Falwell again made the right move - the university simply stole
their faculty from *other* established colleges, an academic equivalent
of corporate head hunting. Thus, they ended up with one of the best
faculties around in terms of their constituency, not to mention
achieving regional accreditation (from SACS) in near record time.
Kevin Stewart
Steve Levicoff wrote in message <398D9720...@ix.netcom.com>...
snipped
>In my opinion, Falwell's honorary doctorate and your $20 ULC doctorate
>do not differ at all. There is no double standard; honorary degrees are
>bullshit, period.
Wow. Consistency. Good trait.
Did you make a note of it, airborne? Taylor?
Kevin
snipped
nort...@my-deja.com
levi...@ix.netcom.com wrote:
snipped
> Hence, the reference to BBC's distance program, which offers a
> bachelor's degree to persons already holding a three-year Th.G. Point
> of trivia: As I mentioned, Jerry Falwell earned the Th.G. from BBC in
> Springfield, a "King James only" school. Thus, "Dr. Falwell" (as he is
> called), the founder and chancellor of the regionally and
> TRACS-accredited Liberty University, not only does not hold an earned
> doctorate, he does not even have an earned bachelor's degree.
Which is what annoyed me when reading over one of the very liberal
Bishop Shelby Spong's books in which he brags about debating Jerry
Falwell on a national television morning program. The host was so
intrigued by the debate that he cancelled the next guest. Spong was so
excited that he wanted to continue the debate across the country.
Apparently, if I remember correctly, Spong said Falwell declined.
Spong then made some statement that he did not feel Falwell was up to
the task any way. This rather pompous remark came from someone who had
a far better liberal arts & theological education (good Episcopal
colleges). I would have been far more impressed had he asked to debate
Dr. D. James Kennedy (PhD). Spong might not have fared so well in the
exchange.
North
> --
> ,-~~-.___.
> / | ' \
> ( ) 0
> \_/-, ,----'
> ==== //
> / \-'~; /~~~(O)
> / __/~| / |
> =( _____| (_________|
> ------------------------------
> Steve Levicoff
> levi...@ix.netcom.com
> http://levicoff.tripod.com
> ------------------------------
>
Steve Levicoff
> levi...@ix.netcom.com wrote:
>
> > Hence, the reference to BBC's distance program, which offers a
> > bachelor's degree to persons already holding a three-year Th.G. Point
> > of trivia: As I mentioned, Jerry Falwell earned the Th.G. from BBC in
> > Springfield, a "King James only" school. Thus, "Dr. Falwell" (as he is
> > called), the founder and chancellor of the regionally and
> > TRACS-accredited Liberty University, not only does not hold an earned
> > doctorate, he does not even have an earned bachelor's degree.
>
> Which is what annoyed me when reading over one of the very liberal
> Bishop Shelby Spong's books in which he brags about debating Jerry
> Falwell on a national television morning program. The host was so
> intrigued by the debate that he cancelled the next guest. Spong was so
> excited that he wanted to continue the debate across the country.
> Apparently, if I remember correctly, Spong said Falwell declined.
> Spong then made some statement that he did not feel Falwell was up to
> the task any way. This rather pompous remark came from someone who had
> a far better liberal arts & theological education (good Episcopal
> colleges). I would have been far more impressed had he asked to debate
> Dr. D. James Kennedy (PhD). Spong might not have fared so well in the
> exchange.
>
> North
This should not be taken as a defense of degree mills by any means, but
one's education is not necessarily an indicator of how good a debater he
or she will become. If anything, Falwell's weakness as a debater comes
from his lack of theological eduication per se rather than the nature of
his credential. In fact, one of the most effective debaters in the
evangelical community was Walter Martin , the late countercult apologist
who allegedly received his doctorate from what is now California Coast
University (a degree mill). (I discuss Martin's credentials in chapter
5 of my book "Name It & Frame It," full-text surfable through my home
page.)
Falwell's weakness against Spong is simple: Spong *is* a theologian
(whacked out as he may be), while Falwell's strong points are in
political and social issues (whacked out as he may be). Falwell is a
good ol' Baptist boy who has been quite effective in other situations
(such as his debates with Larry Flynt); when it came to Spong, he was
simpkly out of his league in the context of the issues they addressed.
Ai similar mismatch occurred several years ago when Troy Perry (founder
of the Metropolitan Community Church, a predominantly gay denomination)
debated Carl McIntyre (one of the classical conservative, right-wing,
anti-communist preachers prominent in the 1960's). Perry had been
trained in Pentecostal churches, while McIntyre was trained in
unaccredited Fundamentalist schools. In their debate, Perry trounced
McIntyre, in part because the focus issue was the one that Perry
specialized in every day.
As for Spong, a debate with D. James Kennedy would be a hoot. But for
those with a background in apologetics, one that would be even funnier
(and which would trounce Spong) would be a debate with John Warwick
Montgomery (who, having offended most accredited schools here in the
States, is now the European dean for Trinity Bible College & Seminary, a
degree mill).