Why X3d?
Roger
X3d...Why?
thanks
R
Rev. Bob 'Bob' Crispen
27 Nov 2002:
> hy...I'm new VRML world and I've just heard that it will be
> replace by X3d...Why?
Y'know, that's a darn good question. The syntax (at least the XML
syntax, which is all I've seen, and pretty much all most people are
working on) is much wordier and requires some gymnastics that look
kinda awkward to me for some kinds of nodes and fields.
However, while VRML either runs in a browser plugin or in a stand-alone
application, X3D escapes from that box. You'll eventually be able to
see all kinds of web page and application integration -- Clippy
bouncing around your web page in 3D? More seriously, recall that
OpenOffice uses XML as its native file format, and Microsoft Office
will be doing the same, to name just one mouth-watering possibility.
And because X3D has profiles, you'll be able to see not only "VRML
Lite" but profiles that take advantage of some of the rendering
capabilities of the newer graphics cards or profiles that are specially
tweaked for different kinds of applications -- 3D on your toaster?
And, a personal favorite, GeoVRML has been added, which makes it
possible to use X3D as a native format for geodata. There's also some
work going on to adapt X3D for use as a CAD interchange format, and the
X3D syntax may make MPEG-4 media (which already uses VRML) better able
to be used outside its own little box.
For now, I'd write VRML code. Browser support is excellent, and there
will always be a VRML 97 profile for X3D and converters to turn VRML 97
syntax into X3D.
--
Rev. Bob "Bob" Crispen
vrmlworks at crispen dot org
chmod a+x /bin/laden
jake reid
Yep like the sound of X3D pity vrml tag was way before it`s time
maybe this is the new hip word that starts to turn the heads. X3D
vrml whatever it is ace!!
Justin Couch
> <rev...@crispen.org> wrote:
>
>
>>The kindly Rev. overheard "Roger" <seamu...@yahoo.it> saying on
>>27 Nov 2002:
[snip]
>>For now, I'd write VRML code. Browser support is excellent, and there
>>will always be a VRML 97 profile for X3D and converters to turn VRML 97
>>syntax into X3D.
Not correct. X3D does not have a VRML97 profile. The closest that you
will get is the Immersive profile, which has most of VRML97 plus a
collection of extra bits. There will be a small period of a spec called
X3D Transitional that will allow browsers to support the X3D file
encodings but with VRML97 scripting APIs, but that is temporary and not
part of the specification. It is expected that when you move to X3D,
that you will change all your scripting content over to the new APIs.
Note that the two sets of code (Xj3D and Anima) that do support X3D
currently mainly support the VRML encoding, and not the XML encoding, so
you'll be able to keep the curly brackets for a long time yet. Xj3D
supports the XML encoding out of the box, along with any content
pipeline for any XML + XSLT setup (we've got CML going already and a
collection of custom XML formats working this way), but the encoding is
still undergoing some last minute shuffling at the spec level. If you
would like to try this out, Xj3D had another dev release last night
which fully supports everything (ignores IMPORT/EXPORT requests currently).
--
Justin Couch http://www.vlc.com.au/~justin/
Java Architect & Bit Twiddler http://www.yumetech.com/
Author, Java 3D FAQ Maintainer http://www.j3d.org/
-------------------------------------------------------------------
"Look through the lens, and the light breaks down into many lights.
Turn it or move it, and a new set of arrangements appears... is it
a single light or many lights, lights that one must know how to
distinguish, recognise and appreciate? Is it one light with many
frames or one frame for many lights?" -Subcomandante Marcos
-------------------------------------------------------------------
P. Flavin
with Java, intgrated with the modern object-oriented
web friendly ( networking ), safe, secure computing
reading, rendering, writing files when appropriate
( and not otherwise ).
Rev. Bob 'Bob' Crispen wrote:
>
> The kindly Rev. overheard "Roger" saying on 27 Nov 2002:
>
>
>> hey... I'm new VRML world and I've just heard that
>> it will be replaced by X3d... Why?
>
> ... while VRML either runs in a browser plugin
> or in a stand-alone application, X3D escapes
> from that box.
>
> You'll eventually be able to see all kinds of web page
> and application integration --
>
http://groups.google.com/groups?dq=&hl=en&oe=UTF-8&selm=Xns92D367164E3D9revbob%40127.0.0.1
It's been done with Java3d, including animating
Web3d's H-Anim Avatars with Gesture animations
triggered by mouse clicks by the user, with Sound ...
with the Sun VRML Loaders ( not the 'new' Yumetech ones ).
VRML Animation with Java3d without the plug-ins using Java3d
------------------------------------------------------------
http://www.frontiernet.net/~imaging/java3d_and_vrml.html
>
> And, a personal favorite, GeoVRML has been added,
> which makes it possible to use X3D as a native
> format for geodata. ...
Lot's of terrain rendering is done with the DEM format,
I'm kind of neutral on formats as long as their open,
DEM is fairly popular and get the job done:
Terrain Rendering with DEM, Nasa's Web Renderings with Java3d
-------------------------------------------------------------
http://www.frontiernet.net/~imaging/terrain_rendering.html
> and the X3D syntax may make MPEG-4 media
>(which already uses VRML) better able
> to be used outside its own little box.
>
Right, Web3d.org has a MPEG list too, and it's
been discussed there:
| H-Anim and MPEG-4 are dependendent on
| implementing technologies, of which Java3d
| is one of the best available to us and both
| H-Anim and MPEG-4 have been held back
| by misperceptions, false statements, and
| unethical conduct.
|
| The VRML Loaders from Sun provided
|
| the highest level of functionality for
| loading VRML files into Java3d ...
|
| -- and still do --
|
| ~~ please ~~ correct me ... if any other
| VRML loader is more capable for loading
| VRML into Java3d and rendering it with
| animation.
|
http://www.web3d.org/WorkingGroups/web3d-mpeg/hypermail/2001/0159.html
VRML can be effiecently animated with modern methods
though lots of the people working with federal
funds ( NSF, NIST, NIH, NPS ) use older methods
then ones kids are learning and using high school today:
| Computer Integrated Manufacturing increases
| manufacturing productivity, research on
| human modeling in the workplace is funded by
| our tax dollars and done by the
|
| NIST's Visualization and Virtual Reality for Manufacturing
|
| division.
|
| The NIST's VRML model ( with animation ) can be animated
| with Java3d using Web3d's VRML Loaders from Sun
| ( as shown above, on Linux ) or with the older,
| more restrictive method the government's researchers use.
|
| The more modern, efficient, and portable technology of
| using portable Java with Web3d's H-Anim Avatars
| is not used by the NIST.
|
| The interactive Chess Player (above) can
| reach for, lift, and move the chess pieces for you,
| interactively on the web.
|
http://www.frontiernet.net/~imaging/games_with_java3d.html
http://www.frontiernet.net/~imaging/sc_manufacturing_simulation.jpg
Lies, fraud and unethical conduct of people
paid through tax funds has hurt an important
part of technology sector, a sector that is
important to our economy and national security.
We can already animate the VRML including
H-Anim Avatars with Java3d.
VRML Loaders working now with NIST & NPS data sets:
---------------------------------------------------------
http://www.frontiernet.net/~imaging/vrml_loaders_working.html
Some people believe that the Sun VRML Loaders can't
be used to animate Web3d.org's H-Anim Avatars with
Sounds & TouchSensors Triggering Gesture Animations
without expensive certificates based on false and
misleading statements from Aaron Walsh, Justin Couch,
Alan Hudson, and the grossly inaccurate and uninformative
"Core Web3d" from Prenitice Hall.
But it can be done: just because the brilliant
Australian Programmer tried and failed, it doesn't
mean that others can't -- and haven't --
succeeded where the Yumetech Gang Tried & Failed.
Neither the new the older loaders are fully
spec compliant, but there's lots & lots of
great fun stuff you can do with the old Sun Loaders
and VRML, or with VRML & and Java 1.1.
-- Paul, Java Developer & Web Animator.
--------------------------------------
"Imaging the Imagined: Modeling with Math & a Keyboard"
jake reid
Somebody Frame Flavfuddrick and try and focus the light for the
learner. I am not interested in who is best or who is the great
Technotwaddler! All I want is vrml content in reams of webpages.
High end waffle puts a lot of people off an otherwise most excellent
vrml. Or is that the aim of sad individuals who missed their big
chance. Me I just love vrml and it`s brilliant potential for many
opportunities.
Jake
On Wed, 27 Nov 2002 11:55:33 -0800, Justin Couch <jus...@vlc.com.au>
wrote:
Braden McDaniel
> The kindly Rev. overheard "Roger" <seamu...@yahoo.it> saying on
> 27 Nov 2002:
>
> > hy...I'm new VRML world and I've just heard that it will be
> > replace by X3d...Why?
>
> Y'know, that's a darn good question. The syntax (at least the XML
> syntax, which is all I've seen, and pretty much all most people are
> working on) is much wordier and requires some gymnastics that look
> kinda awkward to me for some kinds of nodes and fields.
>
> However, while VRML either runs in a browser plugin or in a stand-alone
> application, X3D escapes from that box. You'll eventually be able to
> see all kinds of web page and application integration -- Clippy
> bouncing around your web page in 3D? More seriously, recall that
> OpenOffice uses XML as its native file format, and Microsoft Office
> will be doing the same, to name just one mouth-watering possibility.
[snip]
XML is not a file format; it is a framework for file formats. That
office applications are using XML does have advantages; but those
advantages don't do much to get us closer to the scenario you
describe.
The problem of transmogrifying XML namespaces into software components
in any kind of general fashion still has a big question mark hovering
over it. Web browser developers haven't really begun to touch this
one--the problem simply isn't sufficiently well-defined yet.
Merging presentation of conceptually disparate media types is a
problem on its own; and it is unrelated to the storage format of the
media types. Solving that one is conceptually simple--just make the
windowing system's drawing subsystem fundamenally aware of 3
dimensions--but the solution faces sufficient inertia that it will not
see broad adoption for a few years yet.
Braden