De Rosa and Velo News
Jim Flom
jdandrews wrote in message <366C793D...@home.com>...
>The latest Velo News lists DeRosa as the bike to have if money were no
>object. According to the readers' poll.
>
>Why do the responses say this?
>
>What's so special about DeRosa?
"The 'master builder,' Ugo De Rosa's frames have defined the
state-of-the-art in great road frames for thirty years. The number one
choice of professional riders worldwide."
JF
jdandrews
object. According to the readers' poll.
Why do the responses say this?
What's so special about DeRosa?
Looking for opinions.
Robert Torre
Frames are frames, but there is always something that makes each one
different. I think the quickest, hotest frames are Ciocc. They were the
first to use track geometry on a street bike, others have followed. The
DeRosa frames are nice frames, but a Ciocc to a DeRosa is like a Ferrari
to an Alfa, both are nice but if you could, you'd go for the Ferarri! I
think what has happened with the readers pole is the fact that Ciocc's
are hard to find, DeRosa's are more popular.
KenwoodCyc
>to an Alfa, both are nice but if you could, you'd go for the Ferarri!
I would rather have the alfa!
Pechs1
says Derosa-it was made by Ugo, Christiano, Doriano or Daniello-I have three
and love them-old world charm and excellence-
peter
Auggie3
I ordered one (a Neo Primato - top of the line!) and it came from the factory
with an absolute gorgeous paint job, and brazing that looked like shit. I sent
it back. Boy was I disappointed in their QC! It looked like it came out of
their reject bin.
I'd still like to own one, but I won't accept garbage.
Matt Locker
newage
made by the guy whose name is on the frame? No. Otherwise people would
lust for Mondonico's and Tommasini's.
Is it because of their extensive racing pedigree and association with
great champions like Merckx? No, otherwise people would lust for
Colnagos and Masis.
Let's presuppose that all bikes of this category are of similer quality
and that there isn't just one guy who has figured out how to make a bike
ride significantly better than all others (sorry Chooch guy-BTW do you
know what Ciocc means? Did you know that the name was sold and the
current bikes have no assocition with the original builder? Anyway, I
love your Alfa/Ferrari analogy but I'd have to call a Chooch a Pantera).
1. DeRosas have a great distributor who has established the brand as a
premium mark that is not discounted.
2. DeRosa picked a great logo. Along with the Colnago clover leaf the
DeRosa heart is instantly recognizable-quick, what's on the headtube of
a Torelli?
3. And the real reason-DeRosa, more than any Italian builder has
managed to create an aura of mystery about their frames. They put the
special in the sauce and the secret in the 16 herbs and spices. I
actually had a guy once tell me that DeRosa's have a "mystery angle"
that other builders can't replicate. This guy is a well-respected
member of the cycling industy so I won't reveal his name here. The
press often simply regurgitates what it hears and the public quite
literally buys it. DeRosa's response? When in doubt charge more. You
can't blame them. They make a good product (but can anybody explain to
me why their ti frameset costs almost twice as much as a Merlin or 7?
Every maker has it's spiel, it's story, but what makes me wary is when
they decide to hedge their bets and change that story. For years DeRosa
only built bikes with flat fork crowns, for example. How many builders
poo-pooed tig welding and now do it? Do you really believe all these
Italian builders who bad-mouthed aluminum are suddenly embracing it
because it has suddenly, due to a quantum advance in technology, met
their lofty standards? Personally, I doubt it. But they sure put a
romantic spin on it, and that's what sells; the sizzle, not the steak.
Otherwise, people would be lusting after Ron Coopers. He's got over 40
years experience, builds every single bike himself, each is made to
measure and fully custom, and he charges less than an off the rack frame
from so many makers. But quick-what's on his headtubes?
George Mount
near the factory the week each bike was built,( It's under Ugos house after all)
saying they build them is like saying Colnago or Guerciotti builds their bikes.
Don't get me wrong, they are nice bikes, but they are built in a small factory with
numerous workers, not hand built, and certainly not custom unless you are a top
pro.
If you want a custom frame, built to fit you, find a local builder who's done it
for a few decades, and you may even pay less than a stock Euro-frame for a better
bike.
George Mount
"Been there, rode one"
RDF1249
out there so a lot of positive responses. Dig? There are a lot of fine bikes
out there, though. Check out www.davidsonbicycles.com. In business for 25
years making great truly custom bikes in the US of A.
Bob Freeman
Davidson Bicycles
Mike Pomrink
1. DeRosas have a great distributor who has established the brand as a
> premium mark that is not discounted.
> 2. DeRosa picked a great logo. Along with the Colnago clover leaf the
> DeRosa heart is instantly recognizable-quick, what's on the headtube of
> a Torelli?
> 3. And the real reason-DeRosa, more than any Italian builder has
> managed to create an aura of mystery about their frames.
-Snip-
Well said. I have ridden a De Rosa for many years (mine was built in 1976
from reyndols 531), and it is one of my favorite bikes. But I have also
had the opportunity to ride many other Italian bikes and the truth is, they
all ride pretty good. I doubt if I (or anyone else) could tell one from
the other if they were all painted a solid color with no decals.
BTW, I'm looking to buy a new bike soon and I am considering small American
builders.
Mike Pomrink
1976 De Rosa
1980 Picchio
1985 Rossin
1990 Basso
(and all of the above ride just fine and feel about the same)
PPWrench
in or
near the factory the week each bike was built,( It's under Ugos house after
all)"
Nice e-mail address BTW-
Go visit the factory-believe what you want but Ugo or one of his three
sons-Doriano, Christiano or Daniello, makes ALL of the DeRosa built-
Even Antonio Mondonico has his low end frameset built by Guerciotti
Peter
ht...@tesser.com
George Mount <no...@NOSPAM.com> wrote:
> Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha! While I am sure someone named DeRosa might have been in
or
> near the factory the week each bike was built,( It's under Ugos house after
all)
bikes.
Thst's twice that smiling George has emerged to dis big name Euro
framebuilders. I find this significant because this is someone who used and
wore out (no engineering rebuttals please) a lot of equipment, especially
back in the days when all these names were all much smaller operations.
Presumably he was getting the best they had to offer. Undoubtably his
achievements added value to their brand names. This begs the question, (pay
attention collectors) Was it possible to buy a shitty big name road frame
from anybody before 1980?
The poster acknowledges that Jobst trashed a few Cinellis way before this
date.
> "Been there, rode one"
A bit of an understatement.
Dan Schoenherr
ht...@tesser.com
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George Mount
builders, just the myths about the frames.
European frames are great, especially the Italian ones. They ride great and all
that, but you often pay a lot for those names and are not buying what is marketed
to you. Fine with me, I used to get lot's of bikes for free, and they were all
great, and those ploys paid for me to get free stuff. BUT, there are so many good
local framebuilders in the US now that sell bikes at reasonable prices it's crazy
to pay for those imports unless you get a great blow-out price. By the way, my
latest favorite bike is a local frame builder and I paid for it even though I have
some other bikes hanging around.
Also, I rode a stock 54x54 frame, there was only one type of tubing back then (in
Italy), and everyone built them pretty much the same, so off the shelf was OK by
me. I didn't need any special geometry to race. Some bikes I had rode OK, some
crappy, some exceptionally, all splitting hairs by the way, most people would never
notice the difference. It's all very personal, what one person likes and another
hates.
But the mythology of who touches or welds frames, where factories are, etc., is
astounding. It's as bad as the myths Jobst tries to debunk. I've been to a lot of
these factories and offices. For example, I've been to DeRosas factory on a ride in
my Italian teams clothing, speaking Italian, with team mates, (they built a team
mates, some guy named Moreno Argentin, frames since he didn't like Marnatis frames
or Marnati) no one the wiser, and listened to the workers laughing about sending
the not quite so straight frames to the crazy Americans since they would never
notice. And this was a factory, not a show-room in Milano where they tell everyone
some old guys cobble the frames together by hand. I also know Paolo Guerciotti
never built a bike in his life. Paolo is a great guy. Bikes with his name on them
are great. I rode on at least half a dozen of them in hundreds of races, but don't
buy into the myths propogated by vendors of products. I've seen Ernesto Colnagos
factory, ridden his bikes, some great, some OK. I can probably only think of a few
so-called famous framebuilders who actually build their own in Italy like Irio
Tommasinni, and I am not sure how much work he actually does these days.
Colnago, DeRosa, etc., a lot of these guys did build bikes at one time, but taint
so no mo. Hasn't been for decades.
By the way, there are some astoundingly great small framebuilders in Italy. Marnati
built our Benottos I rode on for 3 years, small shop, great bikes, but why buy
there when you can get a custom frame from the dozens of great builders here. You
get a better product, better fit, better relationship for future bikes, newer
technology, a better bike all the way around.
If I had to get a on-the-cheap frame to race on, I'd probably look for blow-outs on
last season color euro-frames, where there are often deals to be had, but other
than that, you usually pay for nothing special.
Anyway, that's what I think and I saw.
Steel is Real
I've tried the rest, now ride the best, buy local!
George Mount
Jim Ingram
the DeRosa cause it ride correctly in whatever conditions I put it. It is the
right geometry and weight and balance etc.
Jimbo
Sergio SERVADIO
safe with my Tecnociclo post and routinely renovate its 7mm bolt.
So far, I have not been able to find the spares.
Suggestions?
Thanks
Sergio
Pisa
Tecnociclo
Um, are you sure it's not a Selcof post ? Tecnociclo don't make seatposts...
Marco.
Sergio SERVADIO
It is Italmanubri.
With this correction, let me reiterate the query.
Thanks
Sergio
On 11 Dec 1998, Tecnociclo wrote:
> >After realizing many seat posts have an 8mm bolt, I decided to play
> >safe with my Tecnociclo post and routinely renovate its 7mm bolt.
> >So far, I have not been able to find the spares.
> >Suggestions?
Patrick Fanelli
Thanks for the facts and the history! I really enjoyed it. I'm interested
in your opinion of some of the local builders you reference. Who do you
like....and why? Don't mean to put you on the spot....but...inquiring
minds..... :)
Patrick
George Mount wrote in message <36705F99...@NOSPAM.com>...
George Mount
I live in the San Francisco Bay Area. There are so many good frame builders,
and for me, having someone who knows my style of riding is important, but in
reality probably doesn't mean a lot. I like Albert Eisentrauts bikes the best.
He's been doing it longer than anyone and his stuff is intensely good. I also
like the fact that I just tell him I want a bike and leave the rest up to him,
including paint and everything. You just have to let him do what he thinks is
best. He's been building bikes longer than I've ridden them, and a lot of really
top riders have used his bikes. I asked him what he built my bike of once and
the reply was "Metal." Well, like I've said, they build them, I ride them.
There are a number of other good frame builders who do really custom work in the
area. Brent Steelman in Redwood City does nice work. In Santa Cruz you've got
Rock Lobster frames. Bernie Mikkelsen and Ed Litton in Oakland are others. Bruce
Gordon in Petaluma. There are more. We're really in a great part of the world
for frame builders. They all have their quirks and what they are good at.
George Mount
TomBBB
>>object. According to the readers' poll.
>>
>>Why do the responses say this?
>>
>>What's so special about DeRosa?
>
>
>state-of-the-art in great road frames for thirty years. The number one
>choice of professional riders worldwide."
>
>JF
As if Ugo still builds all the frames himself...
DeRosa is a good frame, but so are a lot of others (like Grandis, for example)
that don't happen to have the sponsorship exposure.