SC-21 class?
Bill Jones
design, but I have no clue what it is. Is it any relation to the FF-21
export project being talked about a year or so ago? Thanks for the info.
--
Bill Jones "I curse the new astrologer who wants to
wcj...@princeton.edu prove that the earth moves and goes around,
Wilson College the fool wants to turn the whole art of
Princeton University astronomy upside down."
-Martin Luther on Copernicus
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Neacha neamhbeo agus nithe nach bhfuil ann...
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ch...@motown.ge.com
:I've seen the SC-21 class mentioned in several postings as a new frigate
:design, but I have no clue what it is. Is it any relation to the FF-21
;export project being talked about a year or so ago? Thanks for the info.
SC-21 comes from Ship Class - Twenty-first Centure. The Navy has
basically set a fundamental design proposal in place that will be a moving
target for contractors up until the time the first one is built. As
budgets and the world situation changes so will the design. Then after the
first one is built the design will be changed to incorporate lessons
learned when building the first one. You can speculate all you want but
the current proposed design criteria will resemble the final ship in the
color grey only. And they wonder why mil spec hammers cost $600.00. ;-)
ch...@motown.ge.com
:the Surface Combatant-21 (SC-21), has
Thats what I meant Surface Combatant-21....boy what a brain fart...the 21
being twenty first century....
ch...@motown.ge.com
:According to the 28 Aug 3-Sept. 1995 issue of DEFENSE
:NEWS, one of the early front runner design concepts comes
:from a study "Joint Multilevel Analytical Game: SC-21
:Analysis Executive Report" by Global Associates Ltd, a
:Arlington Va based Consulting firm (one of a series of such
:often referred to as "beltway bandits" by government
:insiders and the media).
It is politically incorrect to refer to the Navy's consultants as "beltway
bandits. We use the term "Los Banditos De La Carrente Grande:
(Theives of the big road).
The definition of a consultant? A guy who knows 250 sexual positions
but doesn't have anyone to have sex with...
Andrew Toppan
: SC-21 comes from Ship Class - Twenty-first Centure. The Navy has
^^^^^^^^^^^
Surface Combatant For the 21st Century.
--
Andrew Toppan --- el...@wpi.edu --- http://www.wpi.edu/~elmer/
Railroads, Ships and Aircraft Homepage, Tom Clancy FAQ Archive
"I am Pentium of Borg. Arithmetic is irrelevant. Prepare to be approximated."
Bill Jones
Inter) wrote:
> For more info on the FF 21 just yell..
Aaaaaaaaarrrghhhhh. Ahm. It's a small modular design, sort of like the
German MEKO's, isn't it? 12 or 24 cell VLS, small gun, etc.? What about
performance? What about sales prospects? What about ASW capability?
Seems like that's what most small navies need.
Matt Clonfero
> It is politically incorrect to refer to the Navy's consultants as "beltway
> bandits. We use the term "Los Banditos De La Carrente Grande:
> (Theives of the big road).
>
> The definition of a consultant? A guy who knows 250 sexual positions
> but doesn't have anyone to have sex with...
Over here, its: `Someone who will tell you the time using your own watch,
then keep the watch as payment.'
Aetherem Vincere
Matt.
--
===============================================================================
Matt Clonfero (ma...@aetherem.demon.co.uk) | To err is human,
My employer & I have a deal - they don't | To forgive is not Air Force Policy.
speak for me, and I don't speak for them. | -- Anon, ETPS
AMI Inter
consultant jokes personally.
(let me know if you want to buy a watch, I've got hundreds)
And after my wife and I had our second child I foiund it healthier to
swear myself to celibacy (sp?) (o was it my wife that did it and I just
had to follow????)
Regards, Guy
Paul Jonathan Adam
> >In message <NEWTNews.25583....@pc007026.motown.ge.com> you wrote:
> > The definition of a consultant? A guy who knows 250 sexual positions
> > but doesn't have anyone to have sex with...
>
> Over here, its: `Someone who will tell you the time using your own watch,
> then keep the watch as payment.'
Ah, the voice of the Ministry of Defence. Who don't know what they want,
don't know what they need it to do, don't know when they need it, and
don't know where they are going to use it or who they intend to use it on.
What they *do* know is that yesterday's fixed price and agreed specification
are now incorrect: however, nobody at the Ministry has this morning's firm and
final figures, because the Permanent Secretary has not yet sacrificed the
sacred chickens and examined their entrails.
Also, the project must be ready six weeks ago, so an order can be placed next
century. The resulting delay in the in-service date is of course entirely due
to the contractor, not to any lag in placing orders. Any cost overruns caused
by repeated movement of the goalposts are naturally the fault of the greedy
contractor, who failed to observe the terms in the Invitaion to Tender
regarding their use of clairvoyance, prescience and telepathy to predict
Ministry intentions.
But like the Murphy's... we're not bitter :)
--
"When you have shot and killed a man, you have defined your attitude towards
him. You have offered a definite answer to a definite problem. For better
or for worse, you have acted decisively.
In fact, the next move is up to him." <R.A. Lafferty>
Paul J. Adam pa...@jrwlynch.demon.co.uk
Matt Clonfero
> Ah, the voice of the Ministry of Defence. Who don't know what they want,
> don't know what they need it to do, don't know when they need it, and
> don't know where they are going to use it or who they intend to use it on.
>
> What they *do* know is that yesterday's fixed price and agreed specification
> are now incorrect: however, nobody at the Ministry has this morning's firm and
> final figures, because the Permanent Secretary has not yet sacrificed the
> sacred chickens and examined their entrails.
>
> Also, the project must be ready six weeks ago, so an order can be placed next
> century. The resulting delay in the in-service date is of course entirely due
> to the contractor, not to any lag in placing orders. Any cost overruns caused
> by repeated movement of the goalposts are naturally the fault of the greedy
> contractor, who failed to observe the terms in the Invitaion to Tender
> regarding their use of clairvoyance, prescience and telepathy to predict
> Ministry intentions.
>
> But like the Murphy's... we're not bitter :)
Aha, the voice of GEC-Marconi, purveyors of mangy radar and duff torpedoes
to the extremely gullable MoD(PE). Who know exactly what they want (the
government's money for nothing); what they need to do for it (lie blatently
in technical documents); and how to cover it up afterwards (blame the
government).
What they *don't* know is that we're on to them: However, since they are
running around like entrail-less chickens (since the MD is on vacation in
Bermuda on expenses under the auspices of observing underwater tests) they
aren't able to pull their fingers out and come up with some quality products.
Also, the project should have been ready six weeks ago, so that the Goverment
could award the contract to Shorts/Raython/Lockheed-Martin in the year 2001,
as planned. The resulting delay *is* entirely due to the contractors. Cost
overruns are also the fault of the contractor, whose repeated exaggeration
of schedules and capabilities require the MoD to make the goal wider. And
one minor nit: consultants are not telepathic, they're telepathetic.
Mine's a pint then ;->
Matt Clonfero
> Hey CHYDE and Matt Clonfero, I'm a consultant and I really take those
> consultant jokes personally.
Unlucky. In my experience, consultants are the biggest waste of money
in the MoD. We could buy enough fuel to run the RAF on the amount we
shell out on consultants whose idea of hard work is 30 mins programming
in between games of solitare(tm) by Microsoft(tm).
Matt Clonfero
> And since we're on the subject, I speak only for myself on this matter...
Ditto.
> How naive of us to believe "firm and fixed" meant "will still be the same
> in three weeks' time"... ;) And when we say "We can do X for Y amount of
> money in Z time", naturally it follows that we really only need half that
> much money, can stretch it over at least twice the time, and still
> meet the (changing) specifications.
Gee. The crew over in MoD(PE) must have been slipping. The idea behind the
Civil Service is to say things in a way that cannot possibly be held against
you at a later time ;-)
> Well, *you're* not getting a Christmas card this year!
There's rules against giving prezzies to us... well, there's rules against
us accepting them anyway.
> So yah-boo-sucks to you, Mr Clonfero! :) Mine's a Murphy's by the way...
You can get it when you collect my Strongbow (ok, I spent too much time down
in Bristol). There's no rule against us accepting lunch.
Scott Norton
> In message <NEWTNews.25583....@pc007026.motown.ge.com> you wrote:
>
> > bandits. We use the term "Los Banditos De La Carrente Grande:
> > (Theives of the big road).
> >
> > but doesn't have anyone to have sex with...
>
> Over here, its: `Someone who will tell you the time using your own watch,
> then keep the watch as payment.'
Well, its not as if the government has any choice. There is a law,
call the "Freedom from Competition Act" that prevents the US
Government from doing anything itself that it can contract out.
And we prefer the term "Highway Helpers" over "Beltway Bandits"
--
Scott Norton
Nor...@ACM.org
Defense Technology, Inc.
2361 Jefferson Davis Hwy, Suite 500
Arlington VA 22202-3876
(703) 415-0200, fax: (703) 415-0206