Maxim IC frustration - hard to find components
techma...@yahoo.com
design with their components.
I am developing a new consumer electronics product. Unfortunately, I
planned to use 4 Maxim chips that are hard to find in small quantities
(1-40). Standard distributors like Arrow, Mouser and Digikey don't cary
them. These components are excellent matches for my design needs. Maxim
offers some of their ICs for purchasing on their website, but not the
ones listed below. Perhaps someone can recommend a broker or exchange
website where rare Maxim components can be purchased at reasonable
prices. I would love to find alternatives to these components if
someone can offer some advice. National, Linear and Analog devices
simply cant match the selection, sophistication and price of switching
regulators and battery charging ICs. Please feel free to recommend
other IC manuafacturers that specialize in these types of components.
DS2745 Low Cost I2C Battery Monitor
(chosen for its ability to cumulatively measure voltage & current to
estimate battery life, + its low cost, $1@1K)
http://www.maxim-ic.com/quick_view2.cfm/qv_pk/4994
MAX1555 Dual-Input, USB/AC Adapter, 1-Cell Li+ Battery Chargers
(chosen for its ability to intelligently charge a 1-cell lithium from
a wall adapter or USB port 5v rail, low cost .85@1K)
http://www.maxim-ic.com/quick_view2.cfm/qv_pk/4002
MAX1522 Simple SOT23 Boost Controllers
(chosen for its high frequency operation - small inductor, only a few
external components, low cost $1.07@1K)
MAX1724 1.5µA IQ, Step-Up DC-DC Converters in Thin SOT23-5
(chosen for its ultra low quiescent current, only needs a 10uh
inductor, has built in FET, very few external components, low cost
$1.45 @ 1K)
http://www.maxim-ic.com/quick_view2.cfm/qv_pk/3024
Brian
<techma...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1154911868.4...@p79g2000cwp.googlegroups.com...
I don't know why Maxim makes it so difficult for small companies to
design with their components.
I am developing a new consumer electronics product. Unfortunately, I
planned to use 4 Maxim chips that are hard to find in small quantities
(1-40). Standard distributors like Arrow, Mouser and Digikey don't cary
them. These components are excellent matches for my design needs. Maxim
offers some of their ICs for purchasing on their website, but not the
ones listed below. Perhaps someone can recommend a broker or exchange
website where rare Maxim components can be purchased at reasonable
prices. I would love to find alternatives to these components if
someone can offer some advice. National, Linear and Analog devices
simply cant match the selection, sophistication and price of switching
regulators and battery charging ICs. Please feel free to recommend
other IC manuafacturers that specialize in these types of components.
Maxim isn't aiming for your market. They design these chips and hope someone
orders a GAZILLION. The rest never go anywhere.
krw
>
> <techma...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:1154911868.4...@p79g2000cwp.googlegroups.com...
> I don't know why Maxim makes it so difficult for small companies to
> design with their components.
Don't worry. They make it equally impossible for large companies.
> I am developing a new consumer electronics product. Unfortunately, I
> planned to use 4 Maxim chips that are hard to find in small quantities
> (1-40). Standard distributors like Arrow, Mouser and Digikey don't cary
> them. These components are excellent matches for my design needs. Maxim
> offers some of their ICs for purchasing on their website, but not the
> ones listed below. Perhaps someone can recommend a broker or exchange
> website where rare Maxim components can be purchased at reasonable
> prices. I would love to find alternatives to these components if
> someone can offer some advice. National, Linear and Analog devices
> simply cant match the selection, sophistication and price of switching
> regulators and battery charging ICs. Please feel free to recommend
> other IC manuafacturers that specialize in these types of components.
They don't carry them because Maxim doesn't make (perhaps design)
them unless there is a huge demand.
> Maxim isn't aiming for your market. They design these chips and hope someone
> orders a GAZILLION. The rest never go anywhere.
Exactly. Go elsewhere.
--
Keith
budgie
>I don't know why Maxim makes it so difficult for small companies to
>design with their components.
>I am developing a new consumer electronics product. Unfortunately, I
>planned to use 4 Maxim chips that are hard to find in small quantities
>(1-40). Standard distributors like Arrow, Mouser and Digikey don't cary
>them. These components are excellent matches for my design needs.
I have been the same route with a Li-Ion charger design about three years back.
Having done the rounds of chip types we - like you - settled quite quickly on
the Maxim product for its functionality. Unfortunately Maxim want to remain
strictly a manufacturer, and the distribution chain which hangs off their
coat-tails isn't the most small-customer--focussed system you'll find. Here in
Australia the "official" distributor (Arrow) won't even break the factory MOQ.
We were fortunate that we located one offshore (NZ actually) Maxim reseller who
did carry the required IC and who actually broke the FMOQ down to something
sensible - ten off. Otherwise we would have had to compromise our design
objective by choosing another chip/supplier combination - and Arrow also
represent LT here :-(
>Maxim
>offers some of their ICs for purchasing on their website, but not the
>ones listed below. Perhaps someone can recommend a broker or exchange
>website where rare Maxim components can be purchased at reasonable
>prices. I would love to find alternatives to these components if
>someone can offer some advice. National, Linear and Analog devices
>simply cant match the selection, sophistication and price of switching
>regulators and battery charging ICs. Please feel free to recommend
>other IC manuafacturers that specialize in these types of components.
(snip chip description)
We checked several offshore suppliers. Maxim in Singapore looked promising but
the unzudders were a tad more responsive and I found their "quaint" version of
the English language easier to deal with that the Asian version.
Back to the web, check out their food chain ALL the way down, and you may just
strike it lucky.
CC
That's why I just don't even bother to consider that Maxim exists
anymore when looking for chips.
--
_____________________
Christopher R. Carlen
cr...@bogus-remove-me.sbcglobal.net
SuSE 9.1 Linux 2.6.5
JeffM
>for small companies to design with their components.
>
You must be new here.
http://groups.google.com/groups/search?q=author:Robert-Baer+Maxim
>National, Linear and Analog devices simply cant match
>the selection, sophistication and price of switching regulators
>and battery charging ICs.
>
Old joke:
"How much are you asking for tomatoes."
"50 cents a pound."
"50 cents a pound?!--the guy down the road said his were only 35."
"Why didn't you buy them there?"
"He was out of tomatoes."
"Ah, that's different. When I'm out, mine are only 25 cents a pound."
.
.
Interesting how you put sci.electronics.design twice in the To: line.
Winfield Hill
>
> I don't know why Maxim makes it so difficult for small companies to
> design with their components.
> I am developing a new consumer electronics product. Unfortunately,
> I planned to use 4 Maxim chips that are hard to find in small
> DS2745 Low Cost I2C Battery Monitor
What a great testimonial for cool parts. What a great warning
to stay the hell away!!! The bean counters (always a very bad
sign) at Maxim simply chose to ignore the massive collection of
products that start small, and then build big. Sadly, it's at
their peril, because even big boys recognize a failed approach
and steer clear, for fear they'll choose a part and after a year
or two find it discontinued by the same bean-counter mentality.
Either you orient yourself towards your customer, or you don't.
--
Thanks,
- Win
Tim Wescott
Maxim never obsoletes a design.
As far as I can tell this is true -- the just don't make a run until
they have orders for 50000 pieces.
There are a few Maxim parts that just cannot be lived without; for those
you need to order a years supply a year in advance. Then just wait --
when the other 49800 get ordered they'll start building your parts.
--
Tim Wescott
Wescott Design Services
http://www.wescottdesign.com
Posting from Google? See http://cfaj.freeshell.org/google/
"Applied Control Theory for Embedded Systems" came out in April.
See details at http://www.wescottdesign.com/actfes/actfes.html
Robert Baer
of static.
Mike Harrison
Unless it's a 1-off you can build with a sample...!
PeteS
I had a long conversation with the reps for Maxim whilst at my last
job, perhaps 4 years ago, and specifically asked them about the :
'We don't care about you unless you order a million and accept 16 week
lead times' attitude.
They assured me that they really had reformed, but the reality of the
situation is they have not.
My supply chain here has specifically asked I not use Maxim devices as
they find it nigh on impossible to get the parts. I find this sad and
amusing as Maxim sends me their 'engineering journal' touting their
great parts, but they just don't seem to want to sell them.
As for samples, you can get them, but you'll get the third degree over
it (don't want to give anything away too easily, do we).
As Win noted, it's silly to ignore the small customer that could become
a large customer. That's *precisely* how TI has now re-oriented itself,
and they are now posting record profits.
TI competes directly with Maxim (and has second sourced a lot of their
parts), and I find the support superb. Even though dev kits are
nominally $49 - $99 for most stuff, my FAEs get them to me for nothing,
because they *want me to design their parts in* and they know I won't
if I have a supply problem.
Contrasts in suppliers, indeed.
Cheers
PeteS
Mike Harrison
..and precisely how Microchip have always been, and are now the biggest 8-bit micro vendor - ISTR
reading somwehere that no one customer makes up more than 3% of their sales.
Fred Bloggs
Robert Baer wrote:
> Hmmm....I have said the same thing a number of times - and got a lot
> of static.
Yeah- but you're that Clarence nutcase troll...how's the speech
impediment coming along.
Fred Bloggs
> sophistication and price of switching regulators and battery charging
> ICs.
That's a bunch of bull, you're not paying attention.
Maxim is not making them because the market is using a superior
alternative, get a clue.
John Woodgate
Bloggs <nos...@nospam.com> writes
--
OOO - Own Opinions Only. Try www.jmwa.demon.co.uk and www.isce.org.uk
2006 is YMMVI- Your mileage may vary immensely.
John Woodgate, J M Woodgate and Associates, Rayleigh, Essex UK
Joerg
>>
>> Either you orient yourself towards your customer, or you don't.
>>
Or, to put it succinctly: If you don't orient yourself towards the
customer, somebody else will. However, it usually requires an upper
management change to truly understand that and most of all, live it.
>
> My supply chain here has specifically asked I not use Maxim devices as
> they find it nigh on impossible to get the parts. I find this sad and
> amusing as Maxim sends me their 'engineering journal' touting their
> great parts, but they just don't seem to want to sell them.
>
> As for samples, you can get them, but you'll get the third degree over
> it (don't want to give anything away too easily, do we).
>
Samples usually aren't the problem. The problems I found were when my
clients wanted to order the first reels and all they heard at the other
end of the phone line was some hard swallowing.
So far I have only designed out Maxim parts, mostly because of serious
logistics problems. I then always try my best to find a jelly bean
solution where every part in it is cheap and has half a dozen sources.
Advice to the OP: Learn how to do things without panacea chips, learn
discrete designs. It's amazing what you can do these days. Discrete
solutions are often significantly lower in cost than that nice cool chip
and also not larger in real estate. The only downside is you'd have to
deal with 0402 parts or smaller and eyes don't get better with age.
> As Win noted, it's silly to ignore the small customer that could become
> a large customer. ...
That's what many EU manufacturers do not understand. It is also the
reason why I typically don't use their parts anymore in designs and why
I wouldn't buy their stock.
--
Regards, Joerg
PeteS
I agree with everything you say here, with an addition. There is _very_
little, if anything, that Maxim makes that can not be done [at least as
well] with devices from another manufacturer. Those other manufacturers
are reaping the benefit of Maxim's short sightedness, imo. That goes
for just about all manufacturers, obviously.
Power, thermal management, serial drivers, hotswap - you name it, there
are at least 3 competitors in the majority of what they make, although
not always fit/form/function compatible. That makes little difference
at original design though.
I must sadly agree abut EU manufacturers too - I would use them, but I
just can't get them to understand that I am not going to buy 10k of
something for a prototype. So they lose the design. I don't know if
that's your experience with them; it certainly is mine, in general.
Cheers
PeteS
Tim
Not my (limited) experience - I've used Maxim Direct in the UK and it has
always worked well.
Frank Bemelman
news:44D74FBC...@nospam.com...
There's a bit of a teaser ;)
--
Thanks, Frank.
(remove 'q' and '.invalid' when replying by email)
PeteS
National, Linear and Analog devices
simply cant match the selection, sophistication and price of switching
regulators and battery charging ICs. Please feel free to recommend
other IC manuafacturers that specialize in these types of components.
>>
Power
TI, Linear, National, Analog devices, to name a few. All these have
products equal or superior to Maxim.
Battery charging. See the list above.
I use a BQ24103 [TI] in a couple of products, and it works exactly as
advertised.
There are, of course, many other manufacturers - these are just the
really big outfits.
As an example on price, I am using the TPS65020 as the regulator for a
PXA based design. 3 switchers, 2 LDOs, multiple pin-assignable default
settings, I2C controllable Vout. Budgetary $3.75 / 1k qtys. That's
pretty competitive as far as I can find.
Want a highend controller that will handle 10A load steps without even
a hiccup? Try the LTC1735. Not the cheapest, but a damn good piece of
work.
No - there is nothing that Maxim makes that others can't do just as
well (perhaps with the addition of a few external components on
occasion, but that goes both ways).
Cheers
PeteS
JeffM
>I don't know why Maxim makes it so difficult
>for small companies to design with their components.
...A prime example of why multi-posting is a bad idea.
Read more here:
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.basics/browse_frm/thread/7b7c0624331012bb/3958f18673b5f374?q=EVERY-group-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-appear+*-proper-answer-*-*-*-given+much-easier-*-*-*-*-what's-going-on+*-frowned-on+*-correcting+*-polite-*-mention-*-*-*-*-*-*-*+*-*-_perfect_-*-*-*-*+*-Followup-To-*+*-*-*-too-lazy-*-*-*-*-*-appropriate-*+Just-because-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-does-not-mean-*-*-*-*-*-*+*-*-*-*-two-groups-*-*-aren't-*-different
If we can't convince you not to pay any attention to this
pseudo-manufacturer,
a vendor (Patrick Cheung, Hong Kong)
did respond in your parallel (multi-posted) thread:
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.components/browse_frm/thread/f782366b25d7df45/9739eca2d667e901?q=We-do-have-the-following-stock
news:44d70...@rain.i-cable.com
Joerg
>
> I agree with everything you say here, with an addition. There is _very_
> little, if anything, that Maxim makes that can not be done [at least as
> well] with devices from another manufacturer. Those other manufacturers
> are reaping the benefit of Maxim's short sightedness, imo. That goes
> for just about all manufacturers, obviously.
>
In my cases the usual scenario is that none of the single-source parts
makes it, no matter from whom. Whenever possible I try to use standard
logic chips, FETs, BJT and passives to do just about anything. There are
designs still in production where close to 100 parts could have been
replaced with a few chips and only a dozen passives. But I didn't and
the clients are happy about it. Typically I never hear any mention of
logistics problems again after such re-designs.
> I must sadly agree abut EU manufacturers too - I would use them, but I
> just can't get them to understand that I am not going to buy 10k of
> something for a prototype. So they lose the design. I don't know if
> that's your experience with them; it certainly is mine, in general.
>
It's worse. For example, when I tried to obtain a partial reel of the
Infineon FET BSP297 they really blew it. Didn't call back, promised to
send samples but failed to do so, etc. It's not that I wanted freebies.
I told them I would pay whatever it takes to get them to the US. Well,
they lost that design-in and I haven't considered their other offerings
since.
The sad thing is that some of them are real technological leaders.
Infineon, for example, offers a great selection of hotrod RF
transistors, diodes and other useful parts. Truly mouth-watering stuff.
But what good does it do if you can't buy them at Digikey and they don't
understand how marketing to design engineers works?
Then there is the poor performance of many of their web sites but that's
a whole 'nother matter.
Joerg
>
> There are a few Maxim parts that just cannot be lived without; ...
Which ones would that be? I've not had that happen in the last 20-some
years :-)
PeteS
I would love to use just standard parts all the time, but in what I do
now space is a real issue, so I am pushed towards low count solutions.
In those cases, I will only use mfrs I can trust (obviously, MAX isn't
one of them). I detest single source solutions as much as anyone -
there are just some times I can't evade it.
Infineon is a particularly bad outfit - they only really sell into the
Tier 1 market (or so they like to think - who knows - one day you might
do a design for a Tier 1 outfit and NOT use their parts).
As to websites - I hear ya. I have a list that rates them as 'good' to
'should be taken out and shot' - might be amusing to start a thread on
that.
Cheers
PeteS
Joerg
>
> I would love to use just standard parts all the time, but in what I do
> now space is a real issue, so I am pushed towards low count solutions.
> In those cases, I will only use mfrs I can trust (obviously, MAX isn't
> one of them). I detest single source solutions as much as anyone -
> there are just some times I can't evade it.
>
Just ran the BOM again on one of my tinier designs. 64 parts on about
1.5 square inches. It can be done if you use 0402 or smaller. The SOT23
parts on there were comparably huge.
> Infineon is a particularly bad outfit - they only really sell into the
> Tier 1 market (or so they like to think - who knows - one day you might
> do a design for a Tier 1 outfit and NOT use their parts).
>
That's just the thing. They believe they can forecast what will be
Tier-1 in the distant future. They can't. Sometimes we design stuff that
looks like medium volumes. Then sales take off and it remains in
production until the cows come home. Getting onto the BOM at that stage
is next to impossible for any manufacturer unless they agree to very
painful rebates. I've even had them offer fancy dinners and all that
(but politely declined).
Tier-1 preference carries substantial risks. It only takes one large
client to drop the ball and there goes the whole apple cart. Then there
are layoffs because they failed to groom Tier-2.
John Woodgate
7 Aug 2006, Joerg <notthis...@removethispacbell.net> writes
>I've even had them offer fancy dinners and all that (but politely
>declined).
I'll take that onerous duty off your hands at any time. (;-)
Someone once asked me what influence entertainment had (in the days when
it was more routine). I said that it didn't have any influence on
anything that the Purchasing Department would notice and complain about.
The only influence was that if there was a problem, I'd be inclined to
call the supplier (even at a home number if I had one), rather than
leave it to the Quality Department to get out the long knives.
Tim Wescott
> Hello Tim,
>
>>
>> There are a few Maxim parts that just cannot be lived without; ...
>
>
>
> Which ones would that be? I've not had that happen in the last 20-some
> years :-)
>
specifications -- but then, when we turned that product we revisited the
system design so that we could use ADCs that were really only good to 14
bits, and design the Maxim part out.
I wonder what they're going to do after they tank? Get bought by Atmel?
http://www.eet.com/news/latest/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=191800862
PeteS
In a fairly recent thread on comp.arch.embedded I stated to the effect
of 'my only problem with Maxim is it's Maxim'
;)
Cheers
PeteS
Joerg
>
> Someone once asked me what influence entertainment had (in the days when
> it was more routine). I said that it didn't have any influence on
> anything that the Purchasing Department would notice and complain about.
>
However, in Europe I did like the candy boxes they brought the
purchasing guys during Christmas season. Purchasing was nice in that
they always informed the engineers to swing by and share.
Chris Jones
It seems that their external foundry does the obsoleting for them (e.g.
MAX038)
Chris
Joerg
>>>
>>> There are a few Maxim parts that just cannot be lived without; ...
>>
>> Which ones would that be? I've not had that happen in the last 20-some
>> years :-)
>>
> They make a serial-out ADC, the '185 I think, that actually meets its
> specifications -- but then, when we turned that product we revisited the
> system design so that we could use ADCs that were really only good to 14
> bits, and design the Maxim part out.
>
TI makes nice serial-out ADCs. ADS1252 and stuff like that if you need
24 bits and the BOM budget allows.
> I wonder what they're going to do after they tank? Get bought by Atmel?
>
> http://www.eet.com/news/latest/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=191800862
>
That story sounds like the Wild West. Hopefully nobody will bring a
Glock to the next meeting...
John Larkin
>I don't know why Maxim makes it so difficult for small companies to
>design with their components.
They've just nailed us again. After quoting us 2-month delivery, and
the parts finally due soon, they've again slipped the ship date on
some 16-bit serial DACs we really, really need. If they run true to
form, near the next ship date they'll slip it again. Once they slipped
the ship date on a part four times, then discontinued it; that was the
MAX9690 comparator. They replaced it with the 9691, the only
comparator in the galaxy that has back-to-back diodes across its
inputs!
It also looks like an increasing number of Maxim parts are only
available direct from Maxim, and are never stocked by distributors. So
a potential buffer stock doesn't exist.
John
PeteS
You have my sympathy. I got caught in the Maxim Fast-EOL cycle about a
year ago (a very nice Dallas part) and what little of me was still
attached to Maxim got detached at that time.
I did a respin of the board using other techniques and I now won't
design in a Maxim part - period. There is nothing they do I can't
replicate in other ways, although as mentioned I may need to use a few
external parts.That's something I can live with - at least I can always
get 0402 precision parts ;)
Cheers
PeteS
dou...@gmail.com
Remind me of the auto manufacturers who design pretty but un repairable
vehicles. The ignorant user buys and regrets after.
We need a user comparison mechanism with feedback
Personally if it has to be an analog IC Linear, Texas I find helpful
and reliable.
Tim Wescott
(top posting fixed)
So far.
> Remind me of the auto manufacturers who design pretty but un
> repairable vehicles. The ignorant user buys and regrets after.
Yup. After decades of treating customers like fools Ford and GM are on
the skids, and Chrysler is now a division of Daimler. Drive down the
freeway and count the Fords and Chevys, and compare them to the
population of Mazdas, Hondas, German cars and Toyotas.
Then deduct the number of Fords that are really Mazdas, and Chevys that
are really Toyotas.
--
Tim Wescott (who drives a Ford)
Joerg
>>
> > Maxim are successful despite their tactics.
>
> So far.
>
The question remains: How much more successful could they be if they got
their logistics problems licked?
lang...@ieee.org
John Woodgate wrote:
> In message <44D74FBC...@nospam.com>, dated Mon, 7 Aug 2006, Fred
> Bloggs <nos...@nospam.com> writes
> >> National, Linear and Analog devices simply cant match the selection,
> >> sophistication and price of switching regulators and battery charging
> >> ICs.
> >
> >That's a bunch of bull, you're not paying attention.
> >
> >Maxim is not making them because the market is using a superior
> >alternative, get a clue.
> >
> Well, that's true. Maxim doesn't seem to be making them at all.
> --
I wonder if they have a bunch of design teams doing what ever chips
they think could be interesting on pizza masks to get samples, and
then only if they actually get someone big enough to bite they start
a real production
-Lasse
techma...@yahoo.com
their childhood issues
by screaming and yelling when someone multiposts. I am sure you aren't
one of them.
I accidentally had sci.electronics.design twice in my group selection
(the other should have been sci.electronics.components),
so I had to create another post for sci.electronics.components.
Anyone can google my profile and see that I rarely if ever did this
before in my many years of USENET posting.
Thank you
budgie
>I wonder if they have a bunch of design teams doing what ever chips
>they think could be interesting on pizza masks to get samples, and
>then only if they actually get someone big enough to bite they start
>a real production
I suspect that is the closest yet to their business model.
Robert Baer
>
>
> Robert Baer wrote:
>
>> Hmmm....I have said the same thing a number of times - and got a
>> lot of static.
>
>
> Yeah- but you're that Clarence nutcase troll...how's the speech
> impediment coming along.
>
This cartoon talking cow cannot udder anything properly...
John Devereux
> Hello Tim,
>
>>
>> There are a few Maxim parts that just cannot be lived without; ...
>
>
> Which ones would that be? I've not had that happen in the last 20-some
> years :-)
I have been using the MAX7219 for ~15 years, (serial input,
multiplexed led driver). Can't seem to get rid of it.
--
John Devereux
qrk
wrote:
>CC wrote:
>> Brian wrote:
>>
>>> <techma...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>> news:1154911868.4...@p79g2000cwp.googlegroups.com...
>>> I don't know why Maxim makes it so difficult for small companies to
>>> design with their components.
>>> I am developing a new consumer electronics product. Unfortunately, I
>>> planned to use 4 Maxim chips that are hard to find in small quantities
>>> (1-40). Standard distributors like Arrow, Mouser and Digikey don't cary
>>> them. These components are excellent matches for my design needs. Maxim
>>> offers some of their ICs for purchasing on their website, but not the
>>> ones listed below. Perhaps someone can recommend a broker or exchange
>>> website where rare Maxim components can be purchased at reasonable
>>> prices. I would love to find alternatives to these components if
>>> someone can offer some advice. National, Linear and Analog devices
>>> simply cant match the selection, sophistication and price of switching
>>> regulators and battery charging ICs. Please feel free to recommend
>>> other IC manuafacturers that specialize in these types of components.
>>>
>>> Maxim isn't aiming for your market. They design these chips and hope
>>> someone orders a GAZILLION. The rest never go anywhere.
>>
Go to Linear Tech, Nat Semi, or Analog Devices if you want readily
available parts. The regional support staff have been really helpful.
I've stopped using Maxim due to a fiasco I had with them 5 years ago
and due to availability issues of other parts. Great parts if you can
get your hands on them!
>>
>> That's why I just don't even bother to consider that Maxim exists
>> anymore when looking for chips.
>>
>Yet I have had Maxim sales guys tell me -- with straight faces -- that
>Maxim never obsoletes a design.
Ask them about the MAX439 and variants. It was a very unique op-amp at
the time. Come to think of it, it's still a unique op-amp. Linear
Technology was glad to pick up another $50k in sales from us when
Maxim stopped producing the MAX439 due to a process line change. They
couldn't figure out how the designer, who was on a very long vacation
in Nepal, ever got that part to work.
>
>As far as I can tell this is true -- the just don't make a run until
>they have orders for 50000 pieces.
>
>There are a few Maxim parts that just cannot be lived without; for those
>you need to order a years supply a year in advance. Then just wait --
>when the other 49800 get ordered they'll start building your parts.
---
Mark
Joerg
>>
>>>There are a few Maxim parts that just cannot be lived without; ...
>>
>>Which ones would that be? I've not had that happen in the last 20-some
>>years :-)
>
> I have been using the MAX7219 for ~15 years, (serial input,
> multiplexed led driver). Can't seem to get rid of it.
>
There are lots of display drivers, for example in the Philips PCF series
although much of it is now going towards the more popular LCD technology.
mi...@sushi.com
As a former Maxim employee, I did my best to stay out of this thread.
However, the MAX7219 was one of the more "entertaining" parts I
designed. [As an analog IC designer, doing digital is nice for a
change.] I had to fight the powers that be to design it using VLSI's
process, rather than our fab. The chip would have been huge in 3um. Not
only did the smaller channel length fets help, but the double metal
sealed the deal. I designed the power fets in both processes and it
just wasn't a contest. [If you look at the die, the power fets are
build around the bonding pad for the best resistance to
electromigration problems.] The issue was given the usual 3 passes it
task to get a chip into production, that would cost a fortune at VLSI.
Still, I won on the merits of doing it in the finer geometry process.
The chip went through what was nearly a full circuit spice simulation
on IIRC a 90Mhz PC. We had a room in what was the old Tech Fed Credit
Union building that had a few PCs in it for either long runs or just to
be in a place not to be disturbed. The serial I/O plus dual port ram
was one simulation, then the rest of the chip was the other simulation.
I took at least two weeks of simulation.
The chip worked on the first pass, including passing burn-in, latch-up
and ESD. When Maxim got its one 1um process (1.2um I think), I tweaked
the chip for that process. It was run along with test patterns to get
the bugs out of the process. There is nothing like having a real chip
to play with when a process is being developed.
There are a few issues with the part. One is the burn-in test mode.
[The part is burned in with all digit drivers being exercise, i.e.
dynamic burn-in.] It is mentioned twice in the datasheet, but many
people don't read the datasheet carefully. Once you are in burn-in
mode, all the leds stay on no matter what you do. I ended up talking to
a customer from Australia that spent weeks with apps trying to figure
out what was going on with this part as he would get in that mode.
Finally the call got bumped up to me, to which I replied "No big deal,
you got the part in the burn-in test mode, as shown on page blah blah
blah." He was a bit irate as nobody in apps pointed that out. When the
datasheet was being written, I tried to get a special section in it
warning about the test mode, but that was deemed to be too alarming.
You don't want to scare off the customers. The other argument I lost
was the designation of "serially interfaced" rather than "serial
interface.' Which do you want, good gramar or common engineering speak?
There is also something funky in the serial interface. I don't remember
the problem exactly, but it has to do with the chip select not gating
the load pulse or something like that. I don't have the datasheet in
front of me so I can't recall the exact problem. I noticed the chip is
being sold in surface mount, so it was tweaked by someone after I left.
Maybe that problem is fixed.
Almost everything I wanted to put in the chip got approved. The
exception was the ability to set the intensity of every digit
individually. I wanted to use it so that a cursor (blinking digit or
different brightness) could be implemented. I did an app note later on
how to add a cursor with external parts.
One nice thing about the part is the use of current mirrors to set the
peak current via the external resistor. Current feeding the LEDs makes
the displays have uniform intensity even if the LEDs don't match well.
The analog control was also used in some military apps where NV goggles
were used. [The military apps did a combination of PWM and analog to
set the intensity.]
Joerg
I guess you like Japanese food. I do, too :-)
>
> As a former Maxim employee, I did my best to stay out of this thread.
> However, the MAX7219 was one of the more "entertaining" parts I
> designed. [As an analog IC designer, doing digital is nice for a
> change.] ...
[ ... story how MAX7219 was born ...]
Thanks for sharing this story. It is nice to have direct feedback here
from companies, even if it's former employees. I don't know why you left
but Maxim could be a great company if they got their hands around some
serious logistics problems I (and others) had to face. Maybe they should
design less chips or use 3rd party fabs more. The chips I saw were
mostly video and PWM related. I really admired their design and the
nifty functions they offered. But they were all single-sourced and
because my clients could not take delivery of any substantial quantity
in time I ended up having to design them all out. The only Maxim part I
ever left in a design was a Dallas digital potmeter. Because, to my
surprise, it was available.
mi...@sushi.com
Jack Gifford doesn't like three things: Phd, MBA, and product
engineers. The lack of product engineering is the reason for poor
delivery. When I was there, we orphaned only one chip. It was an
offline switcher of sorts that was capacitor coupled. Not only did it
have problems, but it was deemed kind of dangerous.
Johnny
Just thought I'd add a little vitriol (looks like we have a good amount
going already!).
In article <7uLBg.5837$FN2...@newssvr14.news.prodigy.com>,
> Then there is the poor performance of many of their web sites but that's
> a whole 'nother matter.
I nominate ST, Philips.
A few years ago I was thinking about using a Philips uC and checked out
their site. They had some crap "parametric" search that failed to work.
After hours, I finally found the part I wanted. I figured I should pass
some feedback to Philips and I wrote them (nicely) saying how much
difficulty I had finding the part I wanted. I got a very rude response
from Philips (a female if it makes a difference) tell me "I had no
issues finding this part". Yeah, if you know what part you want...
On the US front I say National and Intersil have crap websites.
Intersil blows for needing so much Flash...WTH? Are they pandering to
low attention span 5-year olds?
John.
Joerg
>
> Jack Gifford doesn't like three things: Phd, MBA, and product
> engineers. The lack of product engineering is the reason for poor
> delivery. When I was there, we orphaned only one chip. It was an
> offline switcher of sorts that was capacitor coupled. Not only did it
> have problems, but it was deemed kind of dangerous.
>
Just curious: What does he like? If you can't generate enough product to
fill orders a company isn't going to thrive. When I ran the division of
a company my first priority at all times was to make sure that
production was humming.
Spehro Pefhany
I sprung for a radio to keep them happy.
Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany
--
"it's the network..." "The Journey is the reward"
sp...@interlog.com Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
Embedded software/hardware/analog Info for designers: http://www.speff.com
Joerg
>>
>>Just curious: What does he like? If you can't generate enough product to
>>fill orders a company isn't going to thrive. When I ran the division of
>>a company my first priority at all times was to make sure that
>>production was humming.
>
> I sprung for a radio to keep them happy.
>
One of our guys said "If I go in there and hear Mr.Bojangles one more
time I am going to scream". But that's nothing compared to the schmaltzy
stuff they listened to in a German production facility. It could make
your toe nails curl.
PeteS
I think we all (well, most) agree Maxim has some great parts, and I
enjoyed the story above, but great parts is not the issue, as the
thread has noted heavily ;)
Cheers
PeteS
Joel Kolstad
news:ZgrCg.5357$9T3...@newssvr25.news.prodigy.net...
> But that's nothing compared to the schmaltzy stuff they listened to in a
> German production facility. It could make your toe nails curl.
The machine shop I occasionally worked at in college had a bunch of old(er)
machinists who preferred to listen to country music and Paul Harvey... really
drove some of the highly-liberal college students nuts. :-)
Joerg
>
>>But that's nothing compared to the schmaltzy stuff they listened to in a
>>German production facility. It could make your toe nails curl.
>
> The machine shop I occasionally worked at in college had a bunch of old(er)
> machinists who preferred to listen to country music and Paul Harvey... really
> drove some of the highly-liberal college students nuts. :-)
>
Ah, my kind of tunes. I like Country. Not the modern stuff but old
Americana. And Blues.
PeteS
Eeeeewwwww
That's almost as bad as Barry Manilow greatest hits for 'animated
production'
Cheers
PeteS
PeteS
I remember listening to Paul Harvey - I was always amused that his tone
and pitch did _not_ change during his commercials ;)
Cheers
PeteS
dalai lamah
> I don't know why Maxim makes it so difficult for small companies to
> design with their components. [...]
The business strategy of Maxim becomes obvious if you read the list of its
distributors:
http://www.maxim-ic.com/company/contact/sales_offices.cfm/filter/idistributors
Most of them are on the east and south-east of Asia. It seems to me that
Maxim is becoming a big consulting company that works for some big asian
cellphone/pda/whatever manufacturers, and sometimes incidentally sells
parts also to "normal" people.
--
asd
Rebecca of Maxim Dallas
My name is Rebecca and I supervise Maxim Dallas Direct, a sales channel
from which customers are able to order Maxim & Dallas parts directly.
One of the main reasons Maxim Dallas Direct was created was to allow
customers to receive pricing and availability from a Maxim Dallas
specialist with a vested interest in getting the customer what they
want, when they want it. I'm sorry you were led to believe these
parts had long lead times, but here is what we currently have
available. All units are in stock in the Philippines, 4 days transit
directly to you.
DS2745U+ 40 units $1.65 each
MAX1724EZK27+ 40 units $2.11 each
MAX1522EUT+ 40 units $1.61 each (quote#A1381106)
MAX1555EZK+ 40 units $1.34 each
We are moving towards lead free (noted by the + at the end of the part
number) so that I what I am quoting (if you have any questions
regarding lead free there is a notification on our website at
http://www.maxim-ic.com/emmi/lead_free_notice.cfm). If any of these are
not the exact package type you need or if you would like to order free
samples please let me know. For future reference please feel free to
call us directly at 888.629.4642 and any sales person can assist you.
If you would like to place an order please email ord...@maximhq.com or
fax to 800.992.1884. Thank you and I apologize for your frustration.
Sincerely,
Rebecca Graves
techma...@yahoo.com wrote:
> I don't know why Maxim makes it so difficult for small companies to
> design with their components.
> I am developing a new consumer electronics product. Unfortunately, I
> planned to use 4 Maxim chips that are hard to find in small quantities
> (1-40). Standard distributors like Arrow, Mouser and Digikey don't cary
> them. These components are excellent matches for my design needs. Maxim
> offers some of their ICs for purchasing on their website, but not the
> ones listed below. Perhaps someone can recommend a broker or exchange
> website where rare Maxim components can be purchased at reasonable
> prices. I would love to find alternatives to these components if
> someone can offer some advice. National, Linear and Analog devices
> simply cant match the selection, sophistication and price of switching
> regulators and battery charging ICs. Please feel free to recommend
> other IC manuafacturers that specialize in these types of components.
>
> DS2745 Low Cost I2C Battery Monitor
> (chosen for its ability to cumulatively measure voltage & current to
> estimate battery life, + its low cost, $1@1K)
> http://www.maxim-ic.com/quick_view2.cfm/qv_pk/4994
>
> MAX1555 Dual-Input, USB/AC Adapter, 1-Cell Li+ Battery Chargers
> (chosen for its ability to intelligently charge a 1-cell lithium from
> a wall adapter or USB port 5v rail, low cost .85@1K)
> http://www.maxim-ic.com/quick_view2.cfm/qv_pk/4002
>
> MAX1522 Simple SOT23 Boost Controllers
> (chosen for its high frequency operation - small inductor, only a few
> external components, low cost $1.07@1K)
>
> MAX1724 1.5µA IQ, Step-Up DC-DC Converters in Thin SOT23-5
> (chosen for its ultra low quiescent current, only needs a 10uh
> inductor, has built in FET, very few external components, low cost
> $1.45 @ 1K)
> http://www.maxim-ic.com/quick_view2.cfm/qv_pk/3024
Joerg
> My name is Rebecca and I supervise Maxim Dallas Direct, a sales channel
> from which customers are able to order Maxim & Dallas parts directly.
> One of the main reasons Maxim Dallas Direct was created was to allow
> customers to receive pricing and availability from a Maxim Dallas
> specialist with a vested interest in getting the customer what they
> want, when they want it.
Thanks for posting here in the group. Does that direct channel also work
for customer with large quantity needs? That's where my clients had the
most problems. They could buy a few dozen but when they wanted some
reels they pulled a blank (and I had to design the Maxim parts out).
Mostly these were PWM and video chips.
A suggestion to upper management at Maxim: Keep track of all inquiries,
especially those where customers could not be satisfied with the desired
quantities and have walked away.
krw
notthis...@removethispacbell.net says...
> Hello Joel,
>
> >
> >>But that's nothing compared to the schmaltzy stuff they listened to in a
> >>German production facility. It could make your toe nails curl.
> >
> > The machine shop I occasionally worked at in college had a bunch of old(er)
> > machinists who preferred to listen to country music and Paul Harvey... really
> > drove some of the highly-liberal college students nuts. :-)
> >
>
> Ah, my kind of tunes. I like Country. Not the modern stuff but old
> Americana. And Blues.
Ah, you like both kinds of music; Country _and_ Western.
--
Keith
krw
PeterSm...@googlemail.com says...
I still listen to him on occasion. His "The Rest of the Story", is
often interesting. the commercials start with even numbered pages.
;-)
--
KEith
John Larkin
<rebecca...@maximhq.com> wrote:
Hi, Rebecca,
It's getting to be conventional wisdom among EEs that one should avoid
designing Maxim parts into products. It doesn't help that pinouts are
deliberately made non-standard.
I've been personally burned four or five times. At this instant, we
can't ship over a million dollars worth of product because Maxim has
slipped their promised delivery date on MAX5205's. Do you know where I
can score a couple of hundred?
I've been having friends and family request samples, which are
available. Every 8 dacs we can scrounge, we can ship a $54,000 laser
modulator.
John
mi...@sushi.com
I'm curious which parts you think have deliberate non-standard pinouts.
I can tell you in the decade I worked there, this was never an issue.
Pinouts are carefully chosen to minimize noise, ease PCB layout, etc.
To keep costs down, Maxim doesn't make a die per each package type (in
general), so pinouts are designed to work across many package types.
[Back lap specs change from package to package, so often wafers get
allocated to one particular package at the expense of another, which in
turn causes shortages in a particular package type.]
At no company did I ever deliberately make pinouts to be
non-standard. If anything, if a part exists already with defined
pinouts, you make it a point to use THOSE pinouts in order to steal the
sockets with your hopefully superior product.
For one chip I did at a company I better not mention, a customer leaked
us a datasheet of a competitors part. We actually changed our part to
match their pinouts since our part was still in design. They had an
interesting feature that I added as well. As luck would have it, our
part came out before their part, but with the competitors pinouts and
features. While we were doing high fives, I suspect somebody at the
competition was pounding their fist on the conference table.
Michael A. Terrell
WSM AM Radio 650 KHZ in Nashville has several slots during the week
were they only play early country and western music. You can listen
online at http://www.wsmonline.com You can also hear the "Grand Ole
Opry" live and in stereo on Friday and Saturday evenings. I have it on
almost around the clock. You can listen for four hours before you are
dropped, but all you have to do is click on the "Click here to keep
listening to WSM" button to start the stream again.
--
Service to my country? Been there, Done that, and I've got my DD214 to
prove it.
Member of DAV #85.
Michael A. Terrell
Central Florida
mrda...@gmail.com
I believe she mentioned the Philippines; it may be worth it to make a
trip out there. *Must* you use Maxim's MAX5205?
> I've been having friends and family request samples, which are
> available. Every 8 dacs we can scrounge, we can ship a $54,000 laser
> modulator.
>
> John
This is very interesting:
http://finance.yahoo.com/q/bc?s=MXIM
Short, anyone?
Michael
xray
wrote:
>I remember listening to Paul Harvey - I was always amused that his tone
>and pitch did _not_ change during his commercials ;)
>
I was a horrible disc jockey on a campus station for a few weeks during
my college days. Did you ever think about the challenge of ending your
show at the appropriate time?
After that experience I always though that his closing:
"This is Paul Harvey ................................................
.......................................... Good Day!"
was an amateur technique that evolved into a style.
Michael A. Terrell
Try keeping a TV station on schedule from sign on to sign off,
including a live newscast where the "Talent" didn't wand to shut up at
the end of their 30 minutes.
krw
notr...@hotmail.invalid says...
> On 9 Aug 2006 14:50:51 -0700, "PeteS" <PeterSm...@googlemail.com>
> wrote:
>
>
> >I remember listening to Paul Harvey - I was always amused that his tone
> >and pitch did _not_ change during his commercials ;)
> >
>
> I was a horrible disc jockey on a campus station for a few weeks during
> my college days. Did you ever think about the challenge of ending your
> show at the appropriate time?
I DJ'd for our college station (the only student station network
affiliated, at the time) for a summer in the early '70s. I didn't
have so much trouble ending on time for the network news, and such.
My problem was getting all the work done, when it needed doing;
logs, transmitter readings, station breaks...
> After that experience I always though that his closing:
>
> "This is Paul Harvey ................................................
> .......................................... Good Day!"
>
> was an amateur technique that evolved into a style.
Never thought of it that way.
--
Keith
John Larkin
I base that statement on the parts I see, and an interview with
Maxim's CEO, where he said that nonstandard pinout was a specific
company strategy.
Got any 5205's you can spare?
John
John Larkin
Technically, it was a perfect fit. Bummer.
>
>> I've been having friends and family request samples, which are
>> available. Every 8 dacs we can scrounge, we can ship a $54,000 laser
>> modulator.
>>
>> John
>
>
>This is very interesting:
>http://finance.yahoo.com/q/bc?s=MXIM
>
>Short, anyone?
>
>Michael
Just goes to show you that engineers' opinions do matter. As word gets
around about these sorts of problems, we design around somebody else's
parts.
John
Spehro Pefhany
Look at the 5-year chart and compare with LLTC and ATML.
Rebecca of Maxim Dallas
Yes, Maxim Dallas Direct (MDD) is definitely also for large volume
production needs. Of course there will be times when our standard lead
time is too long for customer requirements, and when that happens, let
us know. Our people are trained to do everything possible to always
meet customers' lead time requirements. Too often the customer just
hears the lead time, says thank you, and hangs up. If we know you need
parts sooner we will look at upgrades, alternatives, world wide
inventory, etc. What I find most useful is when customers are able to
provide their drop dead quantity and their run rate. If a customer
calls in for 10k, the lead time may be 8 weeks, but if they are only
using 1k/week, we can often find ways to split their order into 1k
shipments and keep their production line running. In addition,
customers are able to schedule orders out as far as a year. This
allows them to take advantage of volume prices and helps eliminate
delivery issues.
Thank you for your suggestion regarding tracking lost business due to
lead time.
Sincerely,
Rebecca
Uwe Bonnes
> Joerg,
> Yes, Maxim Dallas Direct (MDD) is definitely also for large volume
> production needs. Of course there will be times when our standard lead
> time is too long for customer requirements, and when that happens, let
> us know. Our people are trained to do everything possible to always
> meet customers' lead time requirements. Too often the customer just
> hears the lead time, says thank you, and hangs up. If we know you need
> parts sooner we will look at upgrades, alternatives, world wide
> inventory, etc. What I find most useful is when customers are able to
> provide their drop dead quantity and their run rate. If a customer
> calls in for 10k, the lead time may be 8 weeks, but if they are only
> using 1k/week, we can often find ways to split their order into 1k
> shipments and keep their production line running. In addition,
> customers are able to schedule orders out as far as a year. This
> allows them to take advantage of volume prices and helps eliminate
> delivery issues.
> Thank you for your suggestion regarding tracking lost business due to
> lead time.
Rebecca,
another issues:
-- Why is it so difficult to get from a part to the online shop?
For example, I have followed
http://www.maxim-ic.com/ -> Video -> Video On-Screen Display -> Max4455
This is straightforward and gives a nice overview of the part.
Now lets assume I want to check price and availability:
Buy-> By Web: BUY ON-LINE ->Price and Availability ->
Now I have to type in the part by hand...
This isn't straightforward
--
Uwe Bonnes b...@elektron.ikp.physik.tu-darmstadt.de
Institut fuer Kernphysik Schlossgartenstrasse 9 64289 Darmstadt
--------- Tel. 06151 162516 -------- Fax. 06151 164321 ----------
Rebecca of Maxim Dallas
We definitely appreciate any and all feedback about the ecommerce
website. It is our sincere goal to make the website as user friendly
as possible. I am involved in the constant updating of our ecommerce
website and will include your below feedback in our upcoming
improvements to the site. Please feel free to contact me if you have
any other suggestions.
Thank you,
Rebecca
mi...@sushi.com
Do you have a reference when Jack Gifford said this? Hopefully on-line.
PeteS
Call me cynical (it would be much nicer than some things I've been
called), but I see Rebecca as 'damage control'.
As I noted much earlier in this thread, I have had assurances in the
past that all was changed and Maxim really really _really_wanted to
cater to the little project as well as the big one, but then when push
came to shove, failed utterly and reverted to type.
Once they were designed in and a board fabricated, I encountered an
attitude that can only be characterised as arrogant; viz - 'there is no
direct substitute for that part and now you'll just have to either
order a huge quantity or wait until we happen to get such an order for
it'.
The last time that happened I made a board with the same footprint as
the part with a competitor's part on it.
The exhortations I hear are rather like the boy who cried Wolf, but
I've now heard it too many times to believe it.
I'll believe the reform when I _see_ it. Until then, Maxim is a
proscribed vendor for my products. That's a shame as they make some
really good stuff.
Cheers
PeteS
SioL
news:1155229763.2...@m79g2000cwm.googlegroups.com...
> Uwe,
>
> We definitely appreciate any and all feedback about the ecommerce
> website. It is our sincere goal to make the website as user friendly
> as possible. I am involved in the constant updating of our ecommerce
> website and will include your below feedback in our upcoming
> improvements to the site. Please feel free to contact me if you have
> any other suggestions.
>
> Thank you,
>
> Rebecca
This might be appropriate:
http://www.dilbert.com/comics/dilbert/archive/dilbert-20060809.html
SioL
Joerg
>
> WSM AM Radio 650 KHZ in Nashville has several slots during the week
> were they only play early country and western music. You can listen
> online at http://www.wsmonline.com You can also hear the "Grand Ole
> Opry" live and in stereo on Friday and Saturday evenings. I have it on
> almost around the clock. You can listen for four hours before you are
> dropped, but all you have to do is click on the "Click here to keep
> listening to WSM" button to start the stream again.
>
Thanks. Just tried it but all it does is say "connecting to wsmcruise"
and then nothing happens. I'll try again later.
Sjouke Burry
Nice music ;) :)
John Larkin
No, it was an interview in some magazine. I was surprised that he just
said it out loud.
No 5205's, huh?
John
John Larkin
<spef...@interlogDOTyou.knowwhat> wrote:
>On Thu, 10 Aug 2006 08:24:24 -0700, the renowned John Larkin
><jjla...@highNOTlandTHIStechnologyPART.com> wrote:
>
>>On 10 Aug 2006 00:29:21 -0700, mrda...@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>>
>>>This is very interesting:
>>>http://finance.yahoo.com/q/bc?s=MXIM
>>>
>>>Short, anyone?
>>>
>>>Michael
>>
>>Just goes to show you that engineers' opinions do matter. As word gets
>>around about these sorts of problems, we design around somebody else's
>>parts.
>>
>>John
>
>Look at the 5-year chart and compare with LLTC and ATML.
>
>
>Best regards,
>Spehro Pefhany
That big dip in late '02 was when I quit buying their comparators.
John
mi...@sushi.com
Some magazine... At this point, I'm inclined to think he said he
prefers sole sourced products since they have a higher ASP. I know how
he thinks.
>
> No 5205's, huh?
Nope.
>
> John
Paul Burke
> as possible.
I bet the 'user friendliness' only stretches as far as telling you '26
weeks delivery' or 'minimum order 2500'.
Paul Burke
Winfield Hill
>
> I've been personally burned four or five times. At this instant, we
> can't ship over a million dollars worth of product because Maxim has
> slipped their promised delivery date on MAX5205's. Do you know where
> I can score a couple of hundred?
Can you use MAX5201 parts?
--
Thanks,
- Win
Joerg
>>
>>>>>>It's getting to be conventional wisdom among EEs that one should avoid
>>>>>>designing Maxim parts into products. It doesn't help that pinouts are
>>>>>>deliberately made non-standard.
>>>>>
>>>>>I'm curious which parts you think have deliberate non-standard pinouts.
>>>>>I can tell you in the decade I worked there, this was never an issue.
>>>>
It was an issue.
>>>>I base that statement on the parts I see, and an interview with
>>>>Maxim's CEO, where he said that nonstandard pinout was a specific
>>>>company strategy.
>>>
>>>Do you have a reference when Jack Gifford said this? Hopefully on-line.
>>
>>No, it was an interview in some magazine. I was surprised that he just
>>said it out loud.
>
> Some magazine... At this point, I'm inclined to think he said he
> prefers sole sourced products since they have a higher ASP. I know how
> he thinks.
>
Then the problem seems to be that design engineers do not think the same
way he does. Usually that isn't a good thing. Most of us never design in
a sole-sourced part unless there is no other alternative. Usually there is.
mrda...@gmail.com
ASP... "Asking Sales Price"?
Michael
Spehro Pefhany
>
>> Some magazine... At this point, I'm inclined to think he said he
>> prefers sole sourced products since they have a higher ASP. I know how
>> he thinks.
>
>
>ASP... "Asking Sales Price"?
>
>Michael
Average Selling Price.
Joerg
>>
>>ASP... "Asking Sales Price"?
>
> Average Selling Price.
>
Which somehow pre-supposes that there is enough stuff to sell...
--
SCNR, Joerg
John Woodgate
11 Aug 2006, Joerg <notthis...@removethispacbell.net> writes
>Hello Spehro,
>
>>>
>>>ASP... "Asking Sales Price"?
>> Average Selling Price.
>
>Which somehow pre-supposes that there is enough stuff to sell...
>
Exactly; this is a symptom of unenlightened marketing. These days,
uniqueness is NOT a positive USP (Unique Selling Point; this is more
general than the other 'U' things, because it covers not only the
product specification but the terms on which it is offered). The classic
case is perhaps a lower-noise version of a jelly-bean op-amp at the
normal going price. Most specifiers will opt for that as their first
choice, since it 'costs nothing'. But it doesn't *earn nothing* as a
result.
--
OOO - Own Opinions Only. Try www.jmwa.demon.co.uk and www.isce.org.uk
2006 is YMMVI- Your mileage may vary immensely.
John Woodgate, J M Woodgate and Associates, Rayleigh, Essex UK
PeteS
So they want a high ASP on large orders only (and 26 week lead times so
they are guaranteed to have sold it before they make it) - max ASP,
large volumes only (so they minimise production cost per unit and don't
have it sitting waiting for the guy with a 200 - 1000 order
requirement).
All mfrs run large volumes, of course, to minimise the cost per unit at
production, but they don't wait until they have an order for it, at
least for the area Maxim is in.
No wonder the stock is 'not doing really well' - other mfrs are willing
to keep that stock around for the '200-1000' (or the 500 next month,
10k 2 months later) order, and for that reason are popular amongst
designers.
Standard Maxim technique (in my experience) from the last at least 15
years. I personally wonder how much longer they can survive with this
attitude.
Cheers
PeteS
John Larkin
wrote:
They also seem to keep some of their parts out of distribution
entirely. So they make more money at the expense of the reliability of
supply to their customers.
John
John Larkin
<Winfiel...@newsguy.com> wrote:
No, I use the external Vref, at a goofy voltage, and it doesn't look
like I can overpower the internal ref. But I could use the 5204, which
just has different reset behavior from the 5205. I guess I'll ask for
some samples of them, too.
If anybody can score some 5204's or 5205's for me, I'll pay for them.
John
Rebecca of Maxim Dallas
I would be happy to personally handle any requirements you have for
Maxim or Dallas parts. Biased as I may be, we do care very much about
our customers and their needs. Please give me a chance to prove you
wrong.
Sincerely,
Rebecca
Joerg
>
> I would be happy to personally handle any requirements you have for
> Maxim or Dallas parts. Biased as I may be, we do care very much about
> our customers and their needs. Please give me a chance to prove you
> wrong.
>
Well, here would be your perfect chance: How about getting John Larkin
(here in this thread) some MAX5205?
mrda...@gmail.com
martin griffith
<notthis...@removethispacbell.net> wrote:
>Hello Rebecca,
>
>>
>> I would be happy to personally handle any requirements you have for
>> Maxim or Dallas parts. Biased as I may be, we do care very much about
>> our customers and their needs. Please give me a chance to prove you
>> wrong.
>>
>
>Well, here would be your perfect chance: How about getting John Larkin
>(here in this thread) some MAX5205?
I'm a bottom of the food chain dude here, no way as qualified as joerg
/john/etc. I doubt if I would use maxim, unless its for a max232,
either, just had too many problems on small quantity.
single source ...furgeddit
martin
John Larkin
Well, 65% of it.
John
lang...@ieee.org
John Larkin wrote:
> On 11 Aug 2006 04:50:51 -0700, Winfield Hill
> <Winfiel...@newsguy.com> wrote:
>
> >John Larkin wrote...
> >>
> >> I've been personally burned four or five times. At this instant, we
> >> can't ship over a million dollars worth of product because Maxim has
> >> slipped their promised delivery date on MAX5205's. Do you know where
> >> I can score a couple of hundred?
> >
> > Can you use MAX5201 parts?
>
> No, I use the external Vref, at a goofy voltage, and it doesn't look
> like I can overpower the internal ref. But I could use the 5204, which
> just has different reset behavior from the 5205. I guess I'll ask for
> some samples of them, too.
>
afaict from the datasheets 5205 has an ref voltage of 4 to 5V and 1x
gain, 5201
has fixed internal reference of 2.5V but has a 2x gain, so output is 0
to 5V, so
the output range can't be far that off?
What reference is your reference? can't you just hack the software to
compensate
for the different reference?
> If anybody can score some 5204's or 5205's for me, I'll pay for them.
>
> John
-Lasse
Scream...@yahoo.com
John,
As regards to the MAX5205 availability, I suppose you have
considered parts brokers, or do issues of provenance prohibit this?
A search at www.hkinventory.com showed many flavors/quantities
of the 5205 availiable for bid.
It's not pretty, but we've needed to aquire parts from the
brokers when the distributers were broken...
-Scott
John Larkin
If I got that desperate, I might. We'd have to hack the boards, too,
to disconnect the bussed Vref and maybe also bypass the internal refs.
My current full-scale is something like 3.6 volts. Looks like we can
just enlist an army of friends to get a few samples each; Maxim won't
ship us parts, but they always have lots of samples in stock. Strange
that they value potential customers more than real ones.
John
Clifford Heath
> I would be happy to personally handle any requirements you have for
> Maxim or Dallas parts. Biased as I may be, we do care very much about
> our customers and their needs. Please give me a chance to prove you
> wrong.
Then you should consider supporting normal US post for we international
customers. When I ordered the first bunch of IButtons and SMPS chips
so I could test my application (a scoring system for orienteering), the
order came to about $US200 IIRC. Then I had to pay $50 for you to pick
and pack them(!), $48 for DHL to deliver them, $AU46 for them to put
them through the non-required (but DHL's policy) customs check, and $10
for the privilege of DHL paying the customs check user-pays bill.
Your non-support of any method of international shipment other than DHL
*doubled* my cost, and I won't be coming back any time soon, unless I
can find the parts at Digikey (I couldn't on this occasion).
Clifford Heath.