Uddanda Sastri - 2

[P.K.Ramakrishnan]

Uddanda Sastri had a very low opinion about the Poets of Malayalam language.

Here is what he says.

भाषाकविनिवहोयं

दोषाकरवत् विभाति गगनतले  /

प्रायेण वृत्तहीनः

सूर्यालोके विनष्टगोप्रसर:     //

 

This multitude of Malayalam Poets

shine like the moon in the sky.

Mostly not round (not composing in proper meters)

losing brightness (losing their verbal display)

at the approach of the sun (in front of learned people).

 

-----------------------------------
P.K.Ramakrishnan
http://peekayar.blogspot.com

[P.K.Ramakrishnan]

Dear Brahmasri Narayanaswamy Subramanian,

I would request you to read  again the shloka attributed to Uddanda Sastri.

He has said Bhaashaakavi-nivahoyam. Here Bhasha means Malayalam. It does not refer to Sanskrit. Though  Brahmasri Narayana Bhattathiri and Sankaracharya are Kerala Brahmins, their compositions are in Sanskrit and are in proper vrittams or meters having specific framing rules and names.

I would request you to come back to  this forum after reading again and understanding Uddanda Sastri's comments on Bhaashaakavi.

With best regards,

----------------------------------

P.K.Ramakrishnan
http://peekayar.blogspot.com

---

From: Narayanaswamy Subramanian <s_naray...@yahoo.com>
To: iye...@yahoogroups.com; 4bra...@yahoogroups.com
Cc: peek...@yahoo.com; samskri...@googlegroups.com
Sent: Thu, 10 February, 2011 1:17:07 PM
Subject: Re: [4brahmins] Uddanda Sastri - 2

Dear fellow-Iyers and fellow-Brahmanas
 
If what Sri P K Ramakrishnan reports is correct  --  that Uddanda Sastri said publicly that Malayaalam poets, as a genre, are incapable of composing in "proper meters" (whatever that means), and "lose their display" in front of learned persons (like his own self?) -- then, the irresistible conclusion must be that Uddanda is talking total nonsense (or, not talking through his mouth).
 
Uddanda might well be full of his own self-importance and pomposity.  Plus, have an exaggerated opinion about his superiority as a self-styled "learned person".  In this, he is not alone, as our website testifies.  In any event, it does not excuse his sneering.
 
Such drivel must be stopped.  Else, it only lowers him in the estimation of other aspiring "learned persons".  Perhaps he (and his modern-day admirers?) should be reminded of the legend of Daedalus -- you fly near the Sun, thinking you are supreme, then your wings get burnt and you topple down dead, back to the Earth.
 
Uddanda obviously either has not read, or does not have the faculty to understand, much less appreciate, works like the NAARAAYANEEYAM of Brahmashri Naarayana Bhattathiri of Kerala.  Other supreme texts can be added to this list, not least the wondrous works of Bhagavaan Sri Aadi Shankaraachaaryar Bhagavathpaada, also of Kerala.  And the lofty compositions of his sishyaas.
 
S Narayanaswamy Iyer
 
--- On Wed, 2/9/11, P.K.Ramakrishnan <peek...@yahoo.com> wrote:

From: P.K.Ramakrishnan <peek...@yahoo.com>
Subject: [4brahmins] Uddanda Sastri - 2
To: "4bra...@yahoogroups.com" <4bra...@yahoogroups.com>, "Iyer123group" <iyer12...@yahoo.com>, "samskrita" <sams...@googlegroups.com>
Date: Wednesday, February 9, 2011, 7:39 PM

Uddanda Sastri had a very low opinion about the Poets of Malayalam language.

Here is what he says.

भाषाकविनिवहोयं
दोषाकरवत् विभाति गगनतले  /
प्रायेण वृत्तहीनः
सूर्यालोके विनष्टगोप्रसर: //

This multitude of Malayalam Poets
shine like the moon in the sky.
Mostly not round (not composing in proper meters)
losing brightness (losing their verbal display)
at the approach of the sun (in front of learned people). 

P.K.Ramakrishnan
http://peekayar.blogspot.com

[Vimala Sarma]

Ramkrishnan Mahodaya

I wonder what are the dates for Uddanda Sastri? 

Vimala

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[P.K.Ramakrishnan]

One has to find the meaning  of the word bhaashaa with reference to the circumstances in which it is 

written.  During Uddanda Sastris time, he would have been acquainted with only Tamil, Malayalam and

Sanskrit.  Can you quote some  Malayalam poetry and name its vrittam. There are some Malayalam 

compositions using Sanskrit vrittams. When Uddanda Sastri says "praayena vrittahiinah) he excludes 

Malayalam written in Sanskrit vrittams.

Now we cannot reach Uddanda Sastri for getting his clarification. I can only quote a saying -

kavih karoti kaavyaani,

rasam jaananti panditaah //

कवि: करोति काव्यानि

रसं जानन्ति पण्डिता: /

If you insist on your interpretation,  you may do so. I do not agree. 

-----------------------------------
P.K.Ramakrishnan
http://peekayar.blogspot.com

---

From: Narayanaswamy Subramanian <s_naray...@yahoo.com>

To: iye...@yahoogroups.com; 4Bra...@yahoogroups.com; P.K.Ramakrishnan <peek...@yahoo.com>
Cc: sams...@googlegroups.com
Sent: Thu, 10 February, 2011 10:01:02 PM

Subject: Re: [4brahmins] Uddanda Sastri - 2

Dear Sri P K Ramakrishnan
 
Thanks for your attempt to defend your interpretation.
 
I am not unaware that "bhaashaa" means "language", "tongue", "speech" or "talk".  It can include spoken Samskrutham or any Prakrita dialect. 

Your arrowing all Malayaalam poets for demeaning treatment, and still maintaining that all poetry written in the Malayalam language is not only far inferior (to Uddanda's?), but just vapourise at the rising of the sun  --  is a misinterpretation, and uncalled for.
 
In any event, what motivates you to single out Malayaalam for this apparently unprovoked attack?  Why not Hindi, Gujarathi, Bengali, Singhalese, Kannadam, Telegu, Tamil?  Has Uddanda composed impeccable poetry in all these languages, plus Malayaalam?  Can you quote examples?
 
Thanks.
 
S Narayanaswamy Iyer

--- On Thu, 2/10/11, P.K.Ramakrishnan <peek...@yahoo.com> wrote:

From: P.K.Ramakrishnan <peek...@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [4brahmins] Uddanda Sastri - 2
To: "Narayanaswamy Subramanian" <s_naray...@yahoo.com>
Cc: "4bra...@yahoogroups.com" <4bra...@yahoogroups.com>, "iyer123" <iye...@yahoogroups.com>, "samskrita" <sams...@googlegroups.com>
Date: Thursday, February 10, 2011, 2:29 AM

Dear Brahmasri Narayanaswamy Subramanian,
 
I would request you to read  again the shloka attributed to Uddanda Sastri.
 
He has said Bhaashaakavi-nivahoyam. Here Bhasha means Malayalam. It does not refer to Sanskrit. Though  Brahmasri Narayana Bhattathiri and Sankaracharya are Kerala Brahmins, their compositions are in Sanskrit and are in proper vrittams or meters having specific framing rules and names

I would request you to come back to  this forum after reading again and understanding Uddanda Sastri's comments on Bhaashaakavi.
 
With best regards,
 

P.K.Ramakrishnan
http://peekayar.blogspot.com

[hnbhat B.R.]

Promptly replied to Brahmasri Narayanasvamin. 

I have posted my reply in another thread started by Ramakrishnan to supplement his argument in which I have posted a link to a web page containing the background of the contemporary circle of court poets of Uddanda Kavi.

But I fail to understand such a cry against this post by our learned Brahmasri and his motive behind the flaming words of complaining.

Anyway, it is the popular verse handed over through legends and no question arises about their authenticity or source. But they represent only the attitude behind them.

Anyway, I don't get the idea behind addressing a community in than this forum in this context. Brahmasri Narayanaswamy is once again reminded that this popular verse denotes his condemn towards the vernacular poets bhashaakavi-s as it explicit in the shloka itself. Better to re-read and come again with a better interpretation for the verse, which had been handed over through the legends related to the great scholar/poet Uddanda-kavi as he is represented in Kerala. And his contempt about N;ambudri brahmins too may be taken from this verse. "praayeNa vruttavihInaaH" by interpreting not having "aacaara" as Uddanda Pandita has learnt them (in Tamilnadu from Tamil Brahmins). The practices of Nambudri community is entirely different from those in Tamilnadu, Andhra and Karnataka. (which had been ridiculed even in modern times, leave alone UddaNDa who was 16th century Brahmin of Tamil origin).

Hope you will enjoy the verse in its spirit and better understand its purpose.

-- 

Dr. Hari Narayana Bhat B.R.
EFEO,
PONDICHERRY

[hnbhat B.R.]

This information I got about the prominent assembly of scholars which Uddanda Pandita/kavi was proud of winning every year in his contemporary times and just for information fo our Narayana swamin,  the Bhattasthana was denied for Narayana Bhatta, the author of Prakriyasarvasva and Narayaneeya 6 times:

http://www.museumstuff.com/learn/topics/Revathi_Pattathanam

This for information of the reference to Narayana Bhatta, in an earlier post. The archives of earlier form of this forum attest to the knowledge of Sri P Ramakrishnan:

http://www.mail-archive.com/sans...@cs.utah.edu/msg00802.html