UCL rd of 16 Day 2.1

[Binder Dundat]

I did not know that hockey was a North american colloquialism for
football? I always thought it was soccer?
Two return leg games today, with the home teams having slight
advantages. Though for the Man U vs real game, I am not sure how big
the home field advantage will be? I seem to recall Roy Keano calling
the man u fans a bunch of prawn eaters? In Dortmund it should be
loud, they get to drink beer with their prawn sandwiches, but Hummels
is still injured and Santana and Subotic looked shaky in the last
couple of games.


BVB vs Shaktar (2-2)
two away goals is a nice thing to have, but like I said, Dortmund will
miss Hummels, if for no other reason he is better then the other two
in the air. If they can come out and score quickly I like their
chances.
2-1

Man U vs R Madrid (1-1)
A couple of weeks ago, i would have picked Man u, but Real have that
confidence boost of beating Barca twice in that time. I can see this
going to extra time and penalties? Oh and of course 50 red cards
flying.
1-1 Man U win on penalties

[ixion martin - GdBx]

anders t a utilisé son clavier pour écrire :
> Another ref with a fatter bank account.

For once, it's not MU who has benefits from referee.

--
Ixion
Vu comment Lille galère pour sortir un club danois
et vu comme PSG et Montpellier assurent, ça sent
encore l'éclate totale en Ligue des Champions cette année

[ixion martin - GdBx]

anders t avait ￜnoncￜ :
> Quoting ixion martin - GdBx in rec.sport.soccer:
>> anders t a utilisￜ son clavier pour ￜcrire :

>>> Another ref with a fatter bank account.
>>
>> For once, it's not MU who has benefits from referee.
>

> This sentence comes every now and then. Go figure.

This sentence comes every now and then because it's the truth.
But I apologize for the moment I chosed to write it. You must
be disappointed and/or angry and I understand it.


--
Ixion
Vu comment Lille galï¿œre pour sortir un club danois
et vu comme PSG et Montpellier assurent, ï¿œa sent
encore l'ï¿œclate totale en Ligue des Champions cette annï¿œe

[ixion martin - GdBx]

anders t vient de nous annoncer :
> A red noone else but the ref saw

I saw such red for less than that.

--
Ixion

Vu comment Lille galère pour sortir un club danois
et vu comme PSG et Montpellier assurent, ça sent

encore l'éclate totale en Ligue des Champions cette année

[Sven Mischkies]

anders t <anthu_001@-nospam-hotmail.com> wrote:

> A red noone else but the ref saw and 2 PK:s denied. Real Cheaters go on.


The red one was clear, you can't kung fu kick your opponents. In all
likelyhood not malicious, but for sure reckless.

Regarding Real:

- Why was their first goal not given? It was scored from an offside
position, but I thought the ball came from a ManU player? Was it called
as a foul on him?

- Why was ManU's little right back not sent off after his deliberate
handball on the line?

ManU:

- The first pen you refer to was when Ramos pushed Welbeck (or some
other red shirt) out of the way? I thought that was borderline at best,
the red shirt didn't do much, and you shouldn't expect to get Ashley
Young penalties every game.

- The one in injury time - yes, that was as clear a pen as it can get.

Overall not a good refereeing performance, but both teams suffered from
it.


Ciao,
SM
--
Avoid Santander, the magic bank that makes money disappear.

[Clément]

"anders t" escreveu:

> A red noone else but the ref saw and 2 PK:s denied. Real Cheaters go on.

Mourinho: "Independent of the decision, the best team lost". Interesting.

Is this Real's 10th European Cup/UEFA Champions League title?

Abraço,

Luiz Mello

[RED DEVIL]

On Tue, 05 Mar 2013 22:11:00 +0100, anders t
<anthu_001@-nospam-hotmail.com> wrote:

>Another ref with a fatter bank account.

He was having a decent game up until he pulled out that ridiculous red

[RED DEVIL]

On Tue, 05 Mar 2013 22:35:53 +0100, anders t
<anthu_001@-nospam-hotmail.com> wrote:

>A red noone else but the ref saw and 2 PK:s denied. Real Cheaters go on.

I don't think it was Real's fault that the ref was incompetent They
may have won anyway but it would have been nice to have seen a fair
contest and not one ruined by that kind of decision.

[RED DEVIL]

On Tue, 05 Mar 2013 22:47:48 +0100, ixion martin - GdBx
<ix...@martin.invalid> wrote:

>anders t vient de nous annoncer :
>> A red noone else but the ref saw
>
>I saw such red for less than that.

Then they were also wrong

[RED DEVIL]

On Tue, 5 Mar 2013 21:48:34 +0000, hs...@der-ball-ist-rund.net (Sven
Mischkies) wrote:

>anders t <anthu_001@-nospam-hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>> A red noone else but the ref saw and 2 PK:s denied. Real Cheaters go on.
>
>
>The red one was clear, you can't kung fu kick your opponents. In all
>likelyhood not malicious, but for sure reckless.

That statement is so fucking idiotic!

Nani didn't even see the other player and was clattered into

[RED DEVIL]

>Abra�o,
>
>Luiz Mello

Kudo's to the special one

[ixion martin - GdBx]

RED DEVIL vient de nous annoncer :

And ?
That doens't exclude a red card.

[ixion martin - GdBx]

RED DEVIL a pensￜ trￜs fort :

90% are wrong then.

As Ibra's one vs Valence.
An Ibra took TWO games of suspension.

--
Ixion

Vu comment Lille galï¿œre pour sortir un club danois
et vu comme PSG et Montpellier assurent, ï¿œa sent

encore l'ï¿œclate totale en Ligue des Champions cette annï¿œe

[Google Beta User]

No press conference from Ferguson? Because he's "upset"?

[Sven Mischkies]

anders t <anthu_001@-nospam-hotmail.com> wrote:

> Retired referee Dermot Gallagher


No need to read further. We all remember the last time a British referee
was in charge of a WC final.


> "I can't reiterate enough that he [Nani] is watching the ball over his
> shoulder, there was no malice in him. At worst it was a yellow for
> dangerous play, but if I was refereeing that game I cannot se [Sic!] what
> stretch of the imagination where I would have sent him off for that."


Yes, he is British. :)

[MH]

On 13-03-05 2:11 PM, anders t wrote:
> Another ref with a fatter bank account.
>
>

Never attribute to malevolence anything that can be explained by
incompetence !

Bad decision. It was dangerous play. Indirect free kick, and in this
case possibly a yellow card.

[Sven Mischkies]

The moment contact is made dangerous play becomes a foul.

[Abubakr]

On Wed, 06 Mar 2013 09:11:37 +1100, anders t
<anthu_001@-nospam-hotmail.com> wrote:

> Retired referee Dermot Gallagher on BBC Radio 5 live: "[The decision was]
> harsh to say the least but in fairness the Real player did Nani no
> favours
> whatsoever. At worst Nani catches the underside of his arm, certainly not
> the ribs as the guy has gone down and shown.

>
> "I can't reiterate enough that he [Nani] is watching the ball over his
> shoulder, there was no malice in him. At worst it was a yellow for
> dangerous play, but if I was refereeing that game I cannot se [Sic!] what
> stretch of the imagination where I would have sent him off for that."

We hardly require a retired referee's verdict to know that was a bad
decision. However, it was somewhat evened out later on by not awarding a
penalty (and red card) for the blatant handball on the line by Rafael.

[Abubakr]

On Wed, 06 Mar 2013 08:55:38 +1100, anders t
<anthu_001@-nospam-hotmail.com> wrote:

> Jose Mourinho to ITV Sport: "Independent of the decision, the best team
> lost. We didn't deserve to win but football is like this.
>
> "I am not speaking about the decision as I am not sure about it.
> Independent of that, the best team lost."

I don't know about that but it did take Real Madrid going behind before
they actually settled down and played with more confidence and freedom,
ironically. Arbeloa was atrocious (slow as well as unskilled) at
right-back and most of Man U's thrusts on the break were directed at the
spaces he would leave behind him even when not providing anything in
attack himself.

[Abubakr]

On Wed, 06 Mar 2013 08:49:23 +1100, Clément <lcmello...@terra.com.br>
wrote:

He wouldn't have been so magnanimous in defeat, I can assure of that...

[Abubakr]

On Wed, 06 Mar 2013 09:23:15 +1100, ixion martin - GdBx
<ix...@martin.invalid> wrote:

> RED DEVIL a pensé très fort :

>> On Tue, 05 Mar 2013 22:47:48 +0100, ixion martin - GdBx
>> <ix...@martin.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>> anders t vient de nous annoncer :
>>>> A red noone else but the ref saw
>>> I saw such red for less than that.
>>
>> Then they were also wrong
>
> 90% are wrong then.
>
> As Ibra's one vs Valence.
> An Ibra took TWO games of suspension.

Ibra's was a clear red card for violent conduct. He deliberately went over
the ball in an intimidating fashion. In Nani's case, I think he was just
trying to control a high ball coming over his shoulder and didn't even
realise that there was Real player coming in from his blind side.
Dangerous play, at worst.

[Murat Ataman]

6 Mart 2013 Çarşamba 00:11:37 UTC+2 tarihinde anders t yazdı:

> Retired referee Dermot Gallagher on BBC Radio 5 live: "[The decision was]
>
> harsh to say the least but in fairness the Real player did Nani no favours
>
> whatsoever. At worst Nani catches the underside of his arm, certainly not
>
> the ribs as the guy has gone down and shown.
>
>
>
> "I can't reiterate enough that he [Nani] is watching the ball over his
>
> shoulder, there was no malice in him. At worst it was a yellow for
>
> dangerous play, but if I was refereeing that game I cannot se [Sic!] what
>
> stretch of the imagination where I would have sent him off for that."
>
>
>
>
>

> --
>
> Manchester United FC - CHAMPIONS
>
> Latest: England 2011 (19th), UEFA 2008, World 2009

i thought it was red.. and knowing the referee from his games in turkish league, i said "red" the moment i saw the instant replay.. i also thought he'd send off ferguson if he kept bothering the fourth official.. that guy (cuneyt cakir, the referee) is a mass murderer in big games, his reds are all over the pitch..

[ixion martin - GdBx]

MH a exposￜ le 05/03/2013 :

He put his foot on Arbeloa's body during an aerian play. Why
the hell the red card would be a bad decision, most of all
without replay and at real time ? Because he is a MU player ?

We, fans or little club (like me with Bordeaux), use to see
such decisions against our teams. Severe red cards, denied free
kicks ou penalties, and versus MU, I remember the dive of
Beckham to send off Laslandes in 1999 or the one-sided
refereing aginst Lille five years ago. But I can imagine MU
fans don't use to see their team refered hard...

[ixion martin - GdBx]

Abubakr a exprimé avec précision :

You are ridiculous. There's no violent conduct in Ibra's red,
but a valencian simulation. Nani's one is clearer than Ibra's
one.

Does Nani ignore than he is not alone in the pitch and Real has
some defenders who can come from behind ? When you put your leg
like this, you make a dangerous play.

And a dangerous play may be punished by a red (law XII, Serious
foul play).

--
Ixion

Vu comment Lille galère pour sortir un club danois
et vu comme PSG et Montpellier assurent, ça sent

encore l'éclate totale en Ligue des Champions cette année

[Abubakr]

On Wed, 06 Mar 2013 10:41:12 +1100, ixion martin - GdBx

<ix...@martin.invalid> wrote:

> Abubakr a exprimé avec précision :
>> On Wed, 06 Mar 2013 09:23:15 +1100, ixion martin - GdBx
>> <ix...@martin.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>> RED DEVIL a pensé très fort :
>>>> On Tue, 05 Mar 2013 22:47:48 +0100, ixion martin - GdBx
>>>> <ix...@martin.invalid> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> anders t vient de nous annoncer :
>>>>>> A red noone else but the ref saw
>>>>> I saw such red for less than that.
>>>>
>>>> Then they were also wrong
>>>
>>> 90% are wrong then.
>>>
>>> As Ibra's one vs Valence.
>>> An Ibra took TWO games of suspension.
>>
>> Ibra's was a clear red card for violent conduct. He deliberately went
>> over the ball in an intimidating fashion. In Nani's case, I think he
>> was just trying to control a high ball coming over his shoulder and
>> didn't even realise that there was Real player coming in from his blind
>> side. Dangerous play, at worst.
>
> You are ridiculous. There's no violent conduct in Ibra's red, but a
> valencian simulation. Nani's one is clearer than Ibra's one.

No you ridiculous. The simulation is irrelevant.

> Does Nani ignore than he is not alone in the pitch and Real has some
> defenders who can come from behind ? When you put your leg like this,
> you make a dangerous play.


> And a dangerous play may be punished by a red (law XII, Serious foul
> play).

The contact with the player was inadvertent and that being the case, it
was reckless play at worst, and yellow card would suffice.

In Ibra's case, he knew a player was there and he still stomped his foot
over the ball. That's serious foul play by definition. A clear red card
offence.

[The Scrutineer]

"RED DEVIL" wrote in message
news:erqcj85die338hbln...@4ax.com...

> A red noone else but the ref saw and 2 PK:s denied. Real Cheaters go on.
>
> I don't think it was Real's fault that the ref was incompetent They
> may have won anyway but it would have been nice to have seen a fair
> contest and not one ruined by that kind of decision.

Referee decisions knocking out teams? I never...

I'd urge United to move on, they have a big FA Cup match against Chelsea
next up!!!

[MH]

On 13-03-05 4:02 PM, Sven Mischkies wrote:
> MH <MHno...@ucalgary.ca> wrote:
>
>> On 13-03-05 2:11 PM, anders t wrote:
>>> Another ref with a fatter bank account.
>>>
>>>
>> Never attribute to malevolence anything that can be explained by
>> incompetence !
>>
>> Bad decision. It was dangerous play. Indirect free kick, and in this
>> case possibly a yellow card.
>
>
> The moment contact is made dangerous play becomes a foul.

err, dangerous play is by definition a foul.


>
>
> Ciao,
> SM
>

[Abubakr]

On Wed, 06 Mar 2013 10:59:41 +1100, The Scrutineer <vla...@bigpond.com>
wrote:

>
>
> "RED DEVIL" wrote in message
> news:erqcj85die338hbln...@4ax.com...
>
>> A red noone else but the ref saw and 2 PK:s denied. Real Cheaters go on.
>>
>> I don't think it was Real's fault that the ref was incompetent They
>> may have won anyway but it would have been nice to have seen a fair
>> contest and not one ruined by that kind of decision.
>
> Referee decisions knocking out teams? I never...

I don't think the refereeing decision knocked them out. They were still in
the lead but couldn't hold. It was not like Nani such an important clog in
their defensive shape. He could've easily been covered for. It did hamper
ManU of course, once they went behind.

[RED DEVIL]

On Tue, 05 Mar 2013 23:19:50 +0100, ixion martin - GdBx
<ix...@martin.invalid> wrote:

>RED DEVIL vient de nous annoncer :
>> On Tue, 5 Mar 2013 21:48:34 +0000,
>> hs...@der-ball-ist-rund.net (Sven Mischkies) wrote:
>>
>>> anders t <anthu_001@-nospam-hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> A red noone else but the ref saw and 2 PK:s denied. Real
>>>> Cheaters go on.
>>>
>>>
>>> The red one was clear, you can't kung fu kick your
>>> opponents. In all likelyhood not malicious, but for sure
>>> reckless.
>> That statement is so fucking idiotic!
>>
>> Nani didn't even see the other player and was clattered
>> into
>
>And ?
>That doens't exclude a red card.

Of course it does, there has to be some kind of intent otherwise it's
just a yellow.

[The Scrutineer]

"Abubakr " wrote in message news:op.wthzsqiep9blxg@adamkhalidi-hp...

>> A red noone else but the ref saw and 2 PK:s denied. Real Cheaters go on.
>>
>> I don't think it was Real's fault that the ref was incompetent They
>> may have won anyway but it would have been nice to have seen a fair
>> contest and not one ruined by that kind of decision.
>
> Referee decisions knocking out teams? I never...
>
> I don't think the refereeing decision knocked them out. They were still in
> the lead but couldn't hold. It was not like Nani such an important clog in
> their defensive shape. He could've easily been covered for. It did hamper
> ManU of course, once they went behind.

I can honestly say I didn't watch the match, just reading the worldwide
media reports, manager reactions and highlights... I couldn't care less who
won or lost, but really, these officials are quite a joke, I think it might
be time for UEFA to have specific officials who have no league commitments
for these matches... and are ONLY designated to UEFA competition!!!

It will only improve consistency IMO, this type of red is a one/two per
season, rubbish!!!

[RED DEVIL]

On Tue, 05 Mar 2013 23:23:15 +0100, ixion martin - GdBx
<ix...@martin.invalid> wrote:

>RED DEVIL a pensé très fort :

>> On Tue, 05 Mar 2013 22:47:48 +0100, ixion martin - GdBx
>> <ix...@martin.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>> anders t vient de nous annoncer :
>>>> A red noone else but the ref saw
>>>
>>> I saw such red for less than that.
>>
>> Then they were also wrong
>
>90% are wrong then.
>

Actually the refs get it right most of the time but the ref in this
game did not in this instant.

[RED DEVIL]

On Tue, 5 Mar 2013 14:28:38 -0800 (PST), Google Beta User
<wany...@gmail.com> wrote:

>No press conference from Ferguson? Because he's "upset"?

Can you blame him?

[RED DEVIL]

Spot on!

Unless intent could be judged it's either just a foul or at worst case
a yellow card. Ruined a very good match.

[RED DEVIL]

On Tue, 5 Mar 2013 23:02:01 +0000, hs...@der-ball-ist-rund.net (Sven
Mischkies) wrote:

>MH <MHno...@ucalgary.ca> wrote:
>
>> On 13-03-05 2:11 PM, anders t wrote:
>> > Another ref with a fatter bank account.
>> >
>> >
>> Never attribute to malevolence anything that can be explained by
>> incompetence !
>>
>> Bad decision. It was dangerous play. Indirect free kick, and in this
>> case possibly a yellow card.
>
>
>The moment contact is made dangerous play becomes a foul.
>
>
>Ciao,
> SM

And a yellow

[RED DEVIL]

On Wed, 06 Mar 2013 10:03:50 +1100, "Abubakr " <aa...@hotmail.com>
wrote:

Definite handball by Rafael but there was also two handballs in the
Madrid penalty area, one a 50/50 the other just as blatant as
Rafael's.

[RED DEVIL]

On Wed, 06 Mar 2013 10:13:38 +1100, "Abubakr " <aa...@hotmail.com>
wrote:

Madrid were a beaten team up to the red card

[RED DEVIL]

On Tue, 5 Mar 2013 15:36:24 -0800 (PST), Murat Ataman
<gerika...@gmail.com> wrote:

>6 Mart 2013 �ar?amba 00:11:37 UTC+2 tarihinde anders t yazd?:

Then he should be demoted from taking such high profile matches since
he's obviously not up to the task.

[RED DEVIL]

On Wed, 06 Mar 2013 00:36:53 +0100, ixion martin - GdBx
<ix...@martin.invalid> wrote:

>MH a expos� le 05/03/2013 :

>> On 13-03-05 2:11 PM, anders t wrote:
>>> Another ref with a fatter bank account.
>>>
>>>
>> Never attribute to malevolence anything that can be explained
>> by incompetence !
>>
>> Bad decision. It was dangerous play. Indirect free kick,
>> and in this case possibly a yellow card.
>
>He put his foot on Arbeloa's body during an aerian play. Why
>the hell the red card would be a bad decision, most of all
>without replay and at real time ? Because he is a MU player ?
>
>We, fans or little club (like me with Bordeaux), use to see
>such decisions against our teams. Severe red cards, denied free
>kicks ou penalties, and versus MU, I remember the dive of
>Beckham to send off Laslandes in 1999 or the one-sided
>refereing aginst Lille five years ago. But I can imagine MU
>fans don't use to see their team refered hard...

And you are not at all biased about Manchester United are you?

[RED DEVIL]

On Wed, 06 Mar 2013 00:41:12 +0100, ixion martin - GdBx

<ix...@martin.invalid> wrote:

>Abubakr a exprimé avec précision :
>> On Wed, 06 Mar 2013 09:23:15 +1100, ixion martin - GdBx
>> <ix...@martin.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>> RED DEVIL a pensé très fort :
>>>> On Tue, 05 Mar 2013 22:47:48 +0100, ixion martin - GdBx
>>>> <ix...@martin.invalid> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> anders t vient de nous annoncer :
>>>>>> A red noone else but the ref saw
>>>>> I saw such red for less than that.
>>>>
>>>> Then they were also wrong
>>>
>>> 90% are wrong then.
>>>
>>> As Ibra's one vs Valence.
>>> An Ibra took TWO games of suspension.
>>
>> Ibra's was a clear red card for violent conduct. He
>> deliberately went over the ball in an intimidating fashion.
>> In Nani's case, I think he was just trying to control a high
>> ball coming over his shoulder and didn't even realise that
>> there was Real player coming in from his blind side.
>> Dangerous play, at worst.
>
>You are ridiculous. There's no violent conduct in Ibra's red,
>but a valencian simulation. Nani's one is clearer than Ibra's
>one.
>

It's you that is being ridiculous and biased

[RED DEVIL]

We already have I'm sure.

That Ref should be moved on also (out of European matches)

[Abubakr]

On Wed, 06 Mar 2013 11:15:08 +1100, RED DEVIL <RED...@xxxxzcharter.net>

Which one?

[RED DEVIL]

Interesting idea but just like the players a Ref needs to "play"
consistently to at his/her best

[RED DEVIL]

On Wed, 06 Mar 2013 11:22:32 +1100, "Abubakr " <aa...@hotmail.com>

Can't pinpoint the actual occurrence for you this minute but I'll
watch it again and post.

There were actually three handballs, two by Real and one by United.
One of the Madrid handballs was definitely not a penalty since the
Madrid player had his hands behind his back and the ball hit his arm,
the other was blatant and should have been a penalty. It was fairly
late in the match.

These things happen, win some lose some.

I'm proud of the way United fought all the way and played pretty well
considering being down a man.

On to the Chelsea match!

[Abubakr]

On Wed, 06 Mar 2013 11:11:03 +1100, The Scrutineer <vla...@bigpond.com>
wrote:

>
>

This was a matter of interpretation, I don't know how you can get everyone
to interpret absolutely consistently. This Turkish ref saw, what I
consider, a reckless challenge without malice as serious foul play, and
that bald policeman (!! of all things!!) from England thinks deliberate
karate kicks to chests are perfectly fine and will waive play on.

[ixion martin - GdBx]

RED DEVIL a exposￜ le 06/03/2013 :

Hmmm.
I would like to see the law of the game which says that.

--
Ixion

Vu comment Lille galï¿œre pour sortir un club danois
et vu comme PSG et Montpellier assurent, ï¿œa sent

encore l'ï¿œclate totale en Ligue des Champions cette annï¿œe

[ixion martin - GdBx]

Abubakr a exprimé avec précision :

> The contact with the player was inadvertent and that being
> the case, it was reckless play at worst, and yellow card
> would suffice.

"would", yes. Not "must".

>
> In Ibra's case, he knew a player was there and he still
> stomped his foot over the ball. That's serious foul play by
> definition. A clear red card offence.

Ok, change your glasses.

[ixion martin - GdBx]

I'm biased by my feeling of MU, yes maybe.
But you are biased by your feeling of refereeing.

[Abubakr]

On Wed, 06 Mar 2013 11:31:18 +1100, RED DEVIL <RED...@xxxxzcharter.net>

Then don't call it a handball. "Handballs" are only the ones that are
infringements.

> the other was blatant and should have been a penalty. It was fairly
> late in the match.

I'll wait for you to post something more definite. Rafael's was a clear
case which should have been a penalty and red card.

[ixion martin - GdBx]

RED DEVIL vient de nous annoncer :

off course, it's against MU.

[Abubakr]

On Wed, 06 Mar 2013 11:34:36 +1100, ixion martin - GdBx
<ix...@martin.invalid> wrote:

> Abubakr a exprimé avec précision :
>
>> The contact with the player was inadvertent and that being the case, it
>> was reckless play at worst, and yellow card would suffice.
>
> "would", yes. Not "must".

It *should* suffice in that case.

>> In Ibra's case, he knew a player was there and he still stomped his
>> foot over the ball. That's serious foul play by definition. A clear red
>> card offence.
>
> Ok, change your glasses.

Whatever. Everyone knows Ibra is dirty and Nani is not, except you.

[ixion martin - GdBx]

RED DEVIL a exposé le 06/03/2013 :

You are so ridiculous and pathetic.
This referee dared to sent severely a MU player off so he must
be punished. What such a crime Lèse-United !

[ixion martin - GdBx]

Il se trouve que RED DEVIL a formulé :

Yes I can.
I remember Lille-Manchester when he was shocked by Lille upset

[ixion martin - GdBx]

Après mûre réflexion, RED DEVIL a écrit :

> On Wed, 06 Mar 2013 00:36:53 +0100, ixion martin - GdBx
> <ix...@martin.invalid> wrote:
>

>> MH a exposé le 05/03/2013 :

Yes, I am in my feeling and I recognize it. But it's a normal
thing when you see games with French club and Ferguson
arrogance.

This kind of red card always happens versus our teams. You have
to deal with it. OK, that happens rarely with MU so you don't
use to accept that.

[The Scrutineer]

"Abubakr " wrote in message news:op.wth05kwgp9blxg@adamkhalidi-hp...

> This was a matter of interpretation, I don't know how you can get everyone
> to interpret absolutely consistently. This Turkish ref saw, what I
> consider, a reckless challenge without malice as serious foul play, and
> that bald policeman (!! of all things!!) from England thinks deliberate
> karate kicks to chests are perfectly fine and will waive play on.

You wont get decisions influenced by domestic interpretation, if that's a
red card in the Turkish league and not in lets say 40 other leagues, then
why should it be red on the biggest stage?

The officials wont have domestic influence or committments to think about
when making these decisions, they will all be training together under the
UEFA banner and you wont have to worry about the nationality of the referee
in the pre match build up... you might not get absolute consistency, one per
cent better consistency would mean success, you will eradicate these one in
a million type decisions that are effectively bringing an end to teams
participation...

Or maybe it's a huge over reaction and all is fine with the referees...

[ixion martin - GdBx]

Dans son message prï¿œcï¿œdent, Abubakr a ï¿œcrit :

> On Wed, 06 Mar 2013 11:34:36 +1100, ixion martin - GdBx
> <ix...@martin.invalid> wrote:
>

>> Abubakr a exprimￜ avec prￜcision :

>>
>>> The contact with the player was inadvertent and that being
>>> the case, it was reckless play at worst, and yellow card
>>> would suffice.
>>
>> "would", yes. Not "must".
>
> It *should* suffice in that case.

No. It *could*.

>>> In Ibra's case, he knew a player was there and he still
>>> stomped his foot over the ball. That's serious foul play
>>> by definition. A clear red card offence.
>>
>> Ok, change your glasses.
>
> Whatever. Everyone knows Ibra is dirty and Nani is not,

Have you asked everyone ?

> except you.

Have you asked me ?


OK, so you admit that the decision was made because of the
player, not because of the action. Thanks to agree me.

Do you know Esseyric ? A nice guy. Never a red card, some
yellow... A very correct player. But bad mistake last saturday
:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JKz1S_tvW9E (caution : hard
foul)

So, if I think like you, he doesn't deserve his red card
because he is not a dirty player ?

--
Ixion

Vu comment Lille galï¿œre pour sortir un club danois
et vu comme PSG et Montpellier assurent, ï¿œa sent

encore l'ï¿œclate totale en Ligue des Champions cette annï¿œe

[ixion martin - GdBx]

The Scrutineer a pensé très fort :

> "Abubakr " wrote in message
> news:op.wth05kwgp9blxg@adamkhalidi-hp...
>
>> This was a matter of interpretation, I don't know how you
>> can get everyone to interpret absolutely consistently. This
>> Turkish ref saw, what I consider, a reckless challenge
>> without malice as serious foul play, and that bald
>> policeman (!! of all things!!) from England thinks
>> deliberate karate kicks to chests are perfectly fine and
>> will waive play on.
>
> You wont get decisions influenced by domestic interpretation,
> if that's a red card in the Turkish league and not in lets
> say 40 other leagues, then why should it be red on the
> biggest stage?

The problem is the opposite.
Often, a foul deserving a red in 40 leagues would not deserve a
yellow in England.

--
Ixion

Vu comment Lille galère pour sortir un club danois
et vu comme PSG et Montpellier assurent, ça sent

encore l'éclate totale en Ligue des Champions cette année

[Abubakr]

On Wed, 06 Mar 2013 11:48:34 +1100, ixion martin - GdBx
<ix...@martin.invalid> wrote:

> Dans son message précédent, Abubakr a écrit :

>> On Wed, 06 Mar 2013 11:34:36 +1100, ixion martin - GdBx
>> <ix...@martin.invalid> wrote:
>>

>>> Abubakr a exprimé avec précision :

>>>
>>>> The contact with the player was inadvertent and that being the case,
>>>> it was reckless play at worst, and yellow card would suffice.
>>>
>>> "would", yes. Not "must".
>>
>> It *should* suffice in that case.
>
> No. It *could*.

No, it *should*. That is is the punishment for reckless play.

>>>> In Ibra's case, he knew a player was there and he still stomped his
>>>> foot over the ball. That's serious foul play by definition. A clear
>>>> red card offence.
>>>
>>> Ok, change your glasses.
>>
>> Whatever. Everyone knows Ibra is dirty and Nani is not,
>
> Have you asked everyone ?
>
>> except you.
>
> Have you asked me ?
>
>
> OK, so you admit that the decision was made because of the player, not
> because of the action. Thanks to agree me.

No, I don't.

> Do you know Esseyric ? A nice guy. Never a red card, some yellow... A
> very correct player. But bad mistake last saturday :
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JKz1S_tvW9E (caution : hard foul)
>
> So, if I think like you, he doesn't deserve his red card because he is
> not a dirty player ?

Nani:

1) ball is coming over his shoulder
2) he is looking at the ball
3) the ball is high
4) he goes to trap it in mid air
5) there's a player coming in from his blind side
6) the high leg catches opponent
7) Nani isn't a dirty player

Ibra

1) hasn't done jack all game
2) loses the ball for umpteenth time
3) the ball is loose
4) another player is coming in to take it
5) Ibra sees the other player coming in to take it
6) he goes over the ball with his studs
7) Ibra is a dirty player, especially when he's frustrated

[The Scrutineer]

"ixion martin - GdBx" wrote in message
news:5136929c$0$1864$426a...@news.free.fr...

The Scrutineer a pensￜ trￜs fort :

> "Abubakr " wrote in message news:op.wth05kwgp9blxg@adamkhalidi-hp...
>
>> This was a matter of interpretation, I don't know how you can get
>> everyone to interpret absolutely consistently. This Turkish ref saw, what
>> I consider, a reckless challenge without malice as serious foul play, and
>> that bald policeman (!! of all things!!) from England thinks deliberate
>> karate kicks to chests are perfectly fine and will waive play on.
>
> You wont get decisions influenced by domestic interpretation, if that's a
> red card in the Turkish league and not in lets say 40 other leagues, then
> why should it be red on the biggest stage?
>
> The problem is the opposite.
> Often, a foul deserving a red in 40 leagues would not deserve a yellow in
> England.

That isn't opposite, it's exactly the issue... English referees ruin matches
as well you know!!!

[Sven Mischkies]

MH <MHno...@ucalgary.ca> wrote:

> On 13-03-05 4:02 PM, Sven Mischkies wrote:

> > MH <MHno...@ucalgary.ca> wrote:
> >
> >> On 13-03-05 2:11 PM, anders t wrote:
> >>> Another ref with a fatter bank account.
> >>>
> >>>
> >> Never attribute to malevolence anything that can be explained by
> >> incompetence !
> >>
> >> Bad decision. It was dangerous play. Indirect free kick, and in this
> >> case possibly a yellow card.
> >
> >

> > The moment contact is made dangerous play becomes a foul.
>

> err, dangerous play is by definition a foul.


With contact it changes from indirect to direct fk.


Ciao,
SM
--
Avoid Santander, the magic bank that makes money disappear.

[Sven Mischkies]

RED DEVIL <RED...@XXXXZCharter.net> wrote:

> On Tue, 05 Mar 2013 23:19:50 +0100, ixion martin - GdBx
> <ix...@martin.invalid> wrote:
>
> >RED DEVIL vient de nous annoncer :

> >> On Tue, 5 Mar 2013 21:48:34 +0000,
> >> hs...@der-ball-ist-rund.net (Sven Mischkies) wrote:
> >>
> >>> anders t <anthu_001@-nospam-hotmail.com> wrote:
> >>>

> >>>> A red noone else but the ref saw and 2 PK:s denied. Real
> >>>> Cheaters go on.
> >>>
> >>>

> >>> The red one was clear, you can't kung fu kick your
> >>> opponents. In all likelyhood not malicious, but for sure
> >>> reckless.
> >> That statement is so fucking idiotic!
> >>
> >> Nani didn't even see the other player and was clattered
> >> into
> >
> >And ?
> >That doens't exclude a red card.
>
> Of course it does, there has to be some kind of intent otherwise it's
> just a yellow.

No, you just need to be reckless.

[Sven Mischkies]

RED DEVIL <RED...@XXXXZCharter.net> wrote:

> On Tue, 5 Mar 2013 14:28:38 -0800 (PST), Google Beta User
> <wany...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >No press conference from Ferguson? Because he's "upset"?
>
>
> Can you blame him?

That's one of the things that I don't get. He isn't a spring chicken
anymore, he had plenty of tie to grow up, but he still throws tantrums
like a 3 year old.

[mehdi]

On 06/03/2013 01:00, The Scrutineer wrote:

> That isn't opposite, it's exactly the issue... English referees ruin
> matches as well you know!!!

They ruin matches by leaving players on the pitch not by sending them
off it.

--
http://soccer-europe.com
http://soccer-europe.com/RSS/News.xml
http://www.dailymotion.com/HDCalcio
https://twitter.com/calcioeurope

[Alkamista]

On Mar 5, 6:59 pm, "The Scrutineer" <vla...@bigpond.com> wrote:
> "RED DEVIL"  wrote in message
>
> news:erqcj85die338hbln...@4ax.com...
>

> > A red noone else but the ref saw and 2 PK:s denied. Real Cheaters go on.
>

> > I don't think it was Real's fault that the ref was incompetent They
> > may have won anyway but it would have been nice to have seen a fair
> > contest and not one ruined by that kind of decision.
>
> Referee decisions knocking out teams? I never...
>
> I'd urge United to move on, they have a big FA Cup match against Chelsea
> next up!!!

Bwahaha

[Alkamista]

On Mar 5, 5:03 pm, RED DEVIL <REDE...@XXXXZCharter.net> wrote:
> On Tue, 05 Mar 2013 22:35:53 +0100, anders t

>
> <anthu_...@-nospam-hotmail.com> wrote:
> >A red noone else but the ref saw and 2 PK:s denied. Real Cheaters go on.
>
> I don't think it was Real's fault that the ref was incompetent They
> may have won anyway but it would have been nice to have seen a fair
> contest and not one ruined by that kind of decision.

Real would have definitely won, either way.

[HASM]

hs...@der-ball-ist-rund.net (Sven Mischkies) writes:

>> Of course it does, there has to be some kind of intent otherwise it's
>> just a yellow.

> No, you just need to be reckless.

Careless is a foul.
Reckless is a foul and a caution (yellow).
Excessive force is a foul and an ejection (red).

Intent is not necessary for any of the above, but may bring a caution or
ejection when reckless or excessive force are not present.

-- HASM

[Google Beta User]

On Tuesday, March 5, 2013 7:11:25 PM UTC-5, RED DEVIL wrote:
> On Tue, 5 Mar 2013 14:28:38 -0800 (PST), Google Beta User

>

> >No press conference from Ferguson? Because he's "upset"?
>
> Can you blame him?

For being upset? No. For the tantrum and hiding? Certainly. Come out and face the music. Come out and argue your case--forcefully, but with dignity.

There is no reason he coulnd't have said what Phelan did.

[Diabolik]

"Abubakr " <aa...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:op.wthzsqiep9blxg@adamkhalidi-hp...
> On Wed, 06 Mar 2013 10:59:41 +1100, The Scrutineer <vla...@bigpond.com>

> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> "RED DEVIL" wrote in message
>> news:erqcj85die338hbln...@4ax.com...
>>

>>> A red noone else but the ref saw and 2 PK:s denied. Real Cheaters go on.
>>>
>>> I don't think it was Real's fault that the ref was incompetent They
>>> may have won anyway but it would have been nice to have seen a fair
>>> contest and not one ruined by that kind of decision.
>>

>> Referee decisions knocking out teams? I never...
>

> I don't think the refereeing decision knocked them out. They were still in
> the lead but couldn't hold. It was not like Nani such an important clog in
> their defensive shape. He could've easily been covered for. It did hamper
> ManU of course, once they went behind.

1-0 up, a big Italian side could have held on.

This shows how inflexible Ferguson is with his tactics.

[Diabolik]

"RED DEVIL" <RED...@XXXXZCharter.net> wrote in message
news:erqcj85die338hbln...@4ax.com...

> On Tue, 05 Mar 2013 22:35:53 +0100, anders t
> <anthu_001@-nospam-hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>>A red noone else but the ref saw and 2 PK:s denied. Real Cheaters go on.
>
> I don't think it was Real's fault that the ref was incompetent They
> may have won anyway but it would have been nice to have seen a fair
> contest and not one ruined by that kind of decision.

The decision was 50/50, it could have gone either way.

But forget about the decision, what did ManU do to deserve the win, or hold
on to 1-0?

Ferguson is inflexible with his tactics, and this isn't the first time this
has happened.

If a player like Nani is sent off and you're leading 1-0, you just don't
play on as if nothing happened, you take a forward off, put a midfielder on
and try and hold the result, especially against a team like RM.

And...
- why leave Rooney out?
- why start with Giggs who is old?

Blaming the ref is a cope out.

[ixion martin - GdBx]

Abubakr a formulￜ la demande :

> On Wed, 06 Mar 2013 11:48:34 +1100, ixion martin - GdBx
> <ix...@martin.invalid> wrote:
>

>> Dans son message prï¿œcï¿œdent, Abubakr a ï¿œcrit :

>>> On Wed, 06 Mar 2013 11:34:36 +1100, ixion martin - GdBx
>>> <ix...@martin.invalid> wrote:
>>>

>>>> Abubakr a exprimￜ avec prￜcision :
>>>>

>>>>> The contact with the player was inadvertent and that
>>>>> being the case, it was reckless play at worst, and
>>>>> yellow card would suffice.
>>>>
>>>> "would", yes. Not "must".
>>>
>>> It *should* suffice in that case.
>>
>> No. It *could*.
>
> No, it *should*. That is is the punishment for reckless play.

That's referee interpretation, not yours.

>> OK, so you admit that the decision was made because of the
>> player, not because of the action. Thanks to agree me.
>
> No, I don't.

Yes, you do, talking about dirty / non dirty player.

>
>> Do you know Esseyric ? A nice guy. Never a red card, some
>> yellow... A very correct player. But bad mistake last
>> saturday :
>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JKz1S_tvW9E (caution : hard
>> foul)
>>
>> So, if I think like you, he doesn't deserve his red card
>> because he is not a dirty player ?

you don't answer ?

> Nani:
>
> 1) ball is coming over his shoulder
> 2) he is looking at the ball
> 3) the ball is high
> 4) he goes to trap it in mid air
> 5) there's a player coming in from his blind side
> 6) the high leg catches opponent
> 7) Nani isn't a dirty player
>
> Ibra
>
> 1) hasn't done jack all game
> 2) loses the ball for umpteenth time
> 3) the ball is loose
> 4) another player is coming in to take it
> 5) Ibra sees the other player coming in to take it
> 6) he goes over the ball with his studs
> 7) Ibra is a dirty player, especially when he's frustrated

Ibra has the ball, is on the ground, is making a slow movement,
doesn't touch his opponent (or so few) who starts to fall
before the contact.

Nani is flying, leg forward and put his foot in the Arbeloa
body.

I don't care whether he is a dirty player or not. If you cannot
see the difference, I cannot do more for you.

End of discussion with you for me.

[Sven Mischkies]

Sure, they could have done better (and many sides would have), but they
did ok afterwards - when it was too late - and should have scored.

In any case, you would expect a side of ManU's caliber to adjust better
to a sending off. 10-20 minutes time out are too much.

[Werner Pichler]

On 5 Mrz., 23:59, MH <MHnos...@ucalgary.ca> wrote:
> On 13-03-05 2:11 PM, anders t wrote:> Another ref with a fatter bank account.
>
> Never attribute to malevolence anything that can be explained by
> incompetence !
>
> Bad decision.  It was dangerous play.  Indirect free kick, and in this
> case possibly a yellow card.

The Laws of the Game are pretty clear

"Playing in a dangerous manner involves no physical contact between
the
players. If there is physical contact, the action becomes an offence
punishable
with a direct free kick or penalty kick. In the case of physical
contact, the
referee should carefully consider the high probability that misconduct
has also
been committed."

Certainly no indirect free kick.

Ciao,
Werner

[Diabolik]

"Sven Mischkies" <hs...@der-ball-ist-rund.net> wrote in message
news:1kzazeh.1vatxix1andrggN%hs...@der-ball-ist-rund.net...

> Diabolik <diab...@nospam.com> wrote:
>
>> "Abubakr " <aa...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:op.wthzsqiep9blxg@adamkhalidi-hp...
>> > On Wed, 06 Mar 2013 10:59:41 +1100, The Scrutineer <vla...@bigpond.com>
>> > wrote:
>> >
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> "RED DEVIL" wrote in message
>> >> news:erqcj85die338hbln...@4ax.com...
>> >>
>> >>> A red noone else but the ref saw and 2 PK:s denied. Real Cheaters go
>> >>> on.
>> >>>
>> >>> I don't think it was Real's fault that the ref was incompetent They
>> >>> may have won anyway but it would have been nice to have seen a fair
>> >>> contest and not one ruined by that kind of decision.
>> >>
>> >> Referee decisions knocking out teams? I never...
>> >
>> > I don't think the refereeing decision knocked them out. They were still
>> > in
>> > the lead but couldn't hold. It was not like Nani such an important clog
>> > in
>> > their defensive shape. He could've easily been covered for. It did
>> > hamper
>> > ManU of course, once they went behind.
>>
>> 1-0 up, a big Italian side could have held on.
>>
>> This shows how inflexible Ferguson is with his tactics.
>
>
> Sure, they could have done better (and many sides would have), but they
> did ok afterwards - when it was too late - and should have scored.

RM were through already and relaxed, ManU needed to score 2 goals.

> In any case, you would expect a side of ManU's caliber to adjust better
> to a sending off. 10-20 minutes time out are too much.

Exactly

[zeebjii]

On Wednesday, March 6, 2013 8:31:18 AM UTC+8, RED DEVIL wrote:
> On Wed, 06 Mar 2013 11:22:32 +1100, "Abubakr " <aa...@hotmail.com> wrote: >On Wed, 06 Mar 2013 11:15:08 +1100, RED DEVIL <RED...@xxxxzcharter.net> >wrote: > >> On Wed, 06 Mar 2013 10:03:50 +1100, "Abubakr " <aa...@hotmail.com> >> wrote: >> >>> On Wed, 06 Mar 2013 09:11:37 +1100, anders t >>> <anthu_001@-nospam-hotmail.com> wrote: >>> >>>> Retired referee Dermot Gallagher on BBC Radio 5 live: "[The decision >>>> was] >>>> harsh to say the least but in fairness the Real player did Nani no >>>> favours >>>> whatsoever. At worst Nani catches the underside of his arm, certainly >>>> not >>>> the ribs as the guy has gone down and shown. >>>> >>>> "I can't reiterate enough that he [Nani] is watching the ball over his >>>> shoulder, there was no malice in him. At worst it was a yellow for >>>> dangerous play, but if I was refereeing that game I cannot se [Sic!] >>>> what >>>> stretch of the imagination where I would have sent him off for that." >>> >>> We hardly require a retired referee's verdict to know that was a bad >>> decision. However, it was somewhat evened out later on by not awarding a >>> penalty (and red card) for the blatant handball on the line by Rafael. >> >> Definite handball by Rafael but there was also two handballs in the >> Madrid penalty area, one a 50/50 the other just as blatant as >> Rafael's. > >Which one? Can't pinpoint the actual occurrence for you this minute but I'll watch it again and post. There were actually three handballs, two by Real and one by United. One of the Madrid handballs was definitely not a penalty since the Madrid player had his hands behind his back and the ball hit his arm, the other was blatant and should have been a penalty. It was fairly late in the match. These things happen, win some lose some. I'm proud of the way United fought all the way and played pretty well considering being down a man. On to the Chelsea match!

You know man u in europe it's win a little, lose a lot, not win some, lose some.

RD, deep down you should know the real reasons are man utd are inept in europe, alex ferguson is inept in europe. RVP is enept in europe.

That's why all the memorable 'footballing lesson' kind of matches of the past few years all had man u at the losing end.

With or without the sending off man u will lose in the end. Even if they lucked this game they will lose in the next round.

The 3-pin plug joke is invented specifically for alex ferguson's man u in europe.

[Murat Ataman]

6 Mart 2013 Çarşamba 02:18:21 UTC+2 tarihinde RED DEVIL yazdı:
> On Tue, 5 Mar 2013 15:36:24 -0800 (PST), Murat Ataman
>
> <gerika...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> >6 Mart 2013 Çar?amba 00:11:37 UTC+2 tarihinde anders t yazd?:

>
> >> Retired referee Dermot Gallagher on BBC Radio 5 live: "[The decision was]
>
> >>
>
> >> harsh to say the least but in fairness the Real player did Nani no favours
>
> >>
>
> >> whatsoever. At worst Nani catches the underside of his arm, certainly not
>
> >>
>
> >> the ribs as the guy has gone down and shown.
>
> >>
>
> >>
>
> >>
>
> >> "I can't reiterate enough that he [Nani] is watching the ball over his
>
> >>
>
> >> shoulder, there was no malice in him. At worst it was a yellow for
>
> >>
>
> >> dangerous play, but if I was refereeing that game I cannot se [Sic!] what
>
> >>
>
> >> stretch of the imagination where I would have sent him off for that."
>
> >>
>
> >>
>
> >>
>
> >>
>
> >>
>

> >> --
>
> >>
>
> >> Manchester United FC - CHAMPIONS
>
> >>
>
> >> Latest: England 2011 (19th), UEFA 2008, World 2009
>
> >
>
> >i thought it was red.. and knowing the referee from his games in turkish league,
>
> i said "red" the moment i saw the instant replay.. i also thought he'd
>
> send off ferguson if he kept bothering the fourth official.. that guy
>
> (cuneyt cakir, the referee) is a mass murderer in big games, his reds
>
> are all over the pitch..
>
>
>
> Then he should be demoted from taking such high profile matches since
>
> he's obviously not up to the task.

he's not a bad referee, he's a good referee, and obviously the uefa and fifa think the same since they appoint him to officiate such high profile games, which are high career points for a referee.. he's just harsh and not shy to eject players and coaches when he thinks appropriate, not a referee for players and coaches to mess around with..

as for last night's incident, i agree with him on his ejection of nani. it was dangerous play, and it's a red card in europe any day of the week.. fifa rules are clear..

[Bruce D. Scott]

anders t <anthu_001@-nospam-hotmail.com> wrote:
|> Another ref with a fatter bank account.

Boo hoo.

--
ciao,
Bruce

drift wave turbulence: http://www.rzg.mpg.de/~bds/

[Werner Pichler]

On 6 Mrz., 09:06, anders t <anthu_...@-nospam-hotmail.com> wrote:

> Quoting HASM in rec.sport.soccer:
>
> >hs...@der-ball-ist-rund.net (Sven Mischkies) writes:
>
> >>> Of course it does, there has to be some kind of intent otherwise it's
> >>> just a yellow.
>
> >> No, you just need to be reckless.
>
> >Careless is a foul.
>

> 75%

>
> >Reckless is a foul and a caution (yellow).
>

> 25%

>
> >Excessive force is a foul and an ejection (red).
>

> 0%

Certainly not 0%

http://cdn.bleacherreport.net/images_root/article/media_slots/photos/000/751/629/NaniRedCard_original.gif?1362517301

And whether he sees him or not, is irrelevant.

Ciao,
Werner

> >Intent is not necessary for any of the above, but may bring a caution or
> >ejection when reckless or excessive force are not present.
>

> So, all in all, at most a borderline yellow.

[Abubakr]

On Wed, 06 Mar 2013 22:05:56 +1100, Werner Pichler <wpic...@gmail.com>
wrote:

> On 6 Mrz., 09:06, anders t <anthu_...@-nospam-hotmail.com> wrote:
>> Quoting HASM in rec.sport.soccer:
>>
>> >hs...@der-ball-ist-rund.net (Sven Mischkies) writes:
>>
>> >>> Of course it does, there has to be some kind of intent otherwise
>> it's
>> >>> just a yellow.
>>
>> >> No, you just need to be reckless.
>>
>> >Careless is a foul.
>>
>> 75%
>>
>> >Reckless is a foul and a caution (yellow).
>>
>> 25%
>>
>> >Excessive force is a foul and an ejection (red).
>>
>> 0%
>
> Certainly not 0%
>
> http://cdn.bleacherreport.net/images_root/article/media_slots/photos/000/751/629/NaniRedCard_original.gif?1362517301
>
> And whether he sees him or not, is irrelevant.

I think what did him was that extra little kick out right at the end. I
think that made it violent conduct in the eyes of the officials.

[Futbolmetrix]

On 3/5/2013 4:55 PM, anders t wrote:
> Jose Mourinho to ITV Sport: "Independent of the decision, the best team
> lost. We didn't deserve to win but football is like this.
>
> "I am not speaking about the decision as I am not sure about it.
> Independent of that, the best team lost."

He's campaigning for the ManU job.

D

[Werner Pichler]

On 5 Mrz., 23:08, anders t <anthu_...@-nospam-hotmail.com> wrote:
> Quoting Sven Mischkies in rec.sport.soccer:

>
> >anders t <anthu_...@-nospam-hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> >> A red noone else but the ref saw and 2 PK:s denied. Real Cheaters go on.
>

> >The red one was clear, you can't kung fu kick your opponents. In all
> >likelyhood not malicious, but for sure reckless.
>

> Noone saw that coming. A yellow, well, yes.
>
> >Regarding Real:
>
> >- Why was their first goal not given? It was scored from an offside
> >position, but I thought the ball came from a ManU player? Was it called
> >as a foul on him?
>
> >- Why was ManU's little right back not sent off after his deliberate
> >handball on the line?
>
> >ManU:
>
> >- The first pen you refer to was when Ramos pushed Welbeck (or some
> >other red shirt) out of the way?
>
> That's three. The one I meant was when Welbeck (I think) got hit in the
> head by a defender just inside the p-box.
>
> There was also TWO handballs by Real inside the box, but I'd accept they
> weren't clearcut deliberate, but one did posssibly save a goal (but the
> goalie could possibly have saved).
>

I wouldn't have given any of the three 'handball' penalties,
the Khedira incident was actually a perfect example of
where to put the arms as to avoid a handball to happen.
If these things would start to get called, it'd be ugly.

OTOH why is noone mentioning the incident in the 1st
half (34th minute) when on a corner kick Diego López
went for the ball but instead hit Vidić on the head with
both fists?

These things practically never get called, but a goalkeeper
cannot do as he pleases inside his area.

Ciao,
Werner

[Clément]

"Futbolmetrix" escreveu:

Definitely the kind of thing one would say in a job interview.

Abra�o,

Luiz Mello

[mehdi]

On 06/03/2013 10:31, Murat Ataman wrote:

> he's not a bad referee, he's a good referee, and obviously the uefa
and fifa think the same since they appoint him to officiate such high
profile games, which are high career points for a referee.. he's just
harsh and not shy to eject players and coaches when he thinks
appropriate, not a referee for players and coaches to mess around with..
>
> as for last night's incident, i agree with him on his ejection of
nani. it was dangerous play, and it's a red card in europe any day of
the week.. fifa rules are clear..

Yep. The hysterical reaction is typical of British media who, despite
red cards in international tournaments and in the UCL over the years,
haven't realised that it's English, not 'foreign' referees that are the
problem. English referees try to keep 11 players on the pitch, 'foreign'
referees feel no such obligation.

[Jesus Petry]

Since I like both clubs, I guess I can give an unbiased opinion.

Correct red card call for Nani. And I've seen red cards been shown for less.

Tchau!
Jesus Petry

[Binder Dundat]

I totally agree! Once in my illustrious career did I get a penalty
call when a keeper actually came out on a corner and flattened me,
making no attempt to get the ball. I could not start to count the
number of times I have had keepers trample over me, have my head
double fisted, knees or studs to the ribs, been used as a springboard
etc. I have had to have stitches in one case and not a foul, or
anything. Dont think they even stopped the play? ( it was in the days
when a player could be bloody on the field and we were playing against
Bavarian pig farmers)


>
> Ciao,
> Werner

[Abubakr]

On Thu, 07 Mar 2013 01:01:58 +1100, Werner Pichler <wpic...@gmail.com>
wrote:

Do you mean you also wouldn't give a penalty for Rafael's blatant use of
his arm on the line to parry Higuain's header?

> OTOH why is noone mentioning the incident in the 1st
> half (34th minute) when on a corner kick Diego López
> went for the ball but instead hit Vidić on the head with
> both fists?
>
> These things practically never get called, but a goalkeeper
> cannot do as he pleases inside his area.

That's the way it is. Goalies are allowed clutter into people and hit them
on the head but the slightest nudge on a gk invokes a whistel.

[Clément]

"mehdi" escreveu:

> On 06/03/2013 10:31, Murat Ataman wrote:

>> as for last night's incident, i agree with him on his of

>> nani. it was dangerous play, and it's a red card in europe any day of
>> the week.. fifa rules are clear..
>
> Yep. The hysterical reaction is typical of British media who, despite red
> cards in international tournaments and in the UCL over the years, haven't
> realised that it's English, not 'foreign' referees that are the problem.
> English referees try to keep 11 players on the pitch, 'foreign' referees
> feel no such obligation.

And nor should they.

I can see why last night's card may be debatable, but to suggest that a red
is out of line makes no sense at all.

And, for the record, I was supporting United in this matchup.

Abra�o,

Luiz Mello

[Werner Pichler]

On 6 Mrz., 15:33, "Abubakr " <a...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> On Thu, 07 Mar 2013 01:01:58 +1100, Werner Pichler <wpich...@gmail.com>

Yes. Too short a distance. I don't like to see these called.

> > OTOH why is noone mentioning the incident in the 1st
> > half (34th minute) when on a corner kick Diego López
> > went for the ball but instead hit Vidić on the head with
> > both fists?
>
> > These things practically never get called, but a goalkeeper
> > cannot do as he pleases inside his area.
>
> That's the way it is. Goalies are allowed clutter into people and hit them
> on the head but the slightest nudge on a gk invokes a whistel.

It wasn't even inside his six-yard box, where a goalkeeper is
usually especially protected (even though this is not explicitly
mentioned in the LOTG, as far as I'm aware).

Ciao,
Werner

[Werner Pichler]

On 6 Mrz., 15:56, anders t <anthu_...@-nospam-hotmail.com> wrote:

> Quoting Werner Pichler in rec.sport.soccer:
>
> >OTOH why is noone mentioning the incident in the 1st
> >half (34th minute) when on a corner kick Diego López

> >went for the ball but instead hit Vidi? on the head with

> >both fists?
>
> >These things practically never get called, but a goalkeeper
> >cannot do as he pleases inside his area.
>

> It has absolutely been brought up elsewhere. Generelly the response is that
> the keeper gets away with anything such and that's just the way it is.

Maybe the standards are different, ever since Schumacher/Battiston.

Ciao,
Werner

[Futbolmetrix]

On 3/6/2013 9:28 AM, Jesus Petry wrote:
> Since I like both clubs, I guess I can give an unbiased opinion.
>
> Correct red card call for Nani. And I've seen red cards been shown for less.

I also don't have a horse in this one. I a red like that had been given
against one of my players, I would be incensed.

D

[RED DEVIL]

On Wed, 06 Mar 2013 01:33:43 +0100, ixion martin - GdBx
<ix...@martin.invalid> wrote:

>RED DEVIL a expos� le 06/03/2013 :
>> On Tue, 05 Mar 2013 23:19:50 +0100, ixion martin - GdBx
>> <ix...@martin.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>> RED DEVIL vient de nous annoncer :
>>>> On Tue, 5 Mar 2013 21:48:34 +0000,
>>>> hs...@der-ball-ist-rund.net (Sven Mischkies) wrote:

>>>>
>>>>> anders t <anthu_001@-nospam-hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> A red noone else but the ref saw and 2 PK:s denied. Real
>>>>>> Cheaters go on.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> The red one was clear, you can't kung fu kick your
>>>>> opponents. In all likelyhood not malicious, but for sure
>>>>> reckless.

>>>> That statement is so fucking idiotic!
>>>>
>>>> Nani didn't even see the other player and was clattered
>>>> into
>>>
>>> And ?
>>> That doens't exclude a red card.

>>
>> Of course it does, there has to be some kind of intent
>> otherwise it's just a yellow.
>

>Hmmm.
>I would like to see the law of the game which says that.


Get on with your ABU day celebrations

[RED DEVIL]

On Wed, 06 Mar 2013 01:41:16 +0100, ixion martin - GdBx
<ix...@martin.invalid> wrote:

>Il se trouve que RED DEVIL a formul� :
>> On Tue, 5 Mar 2013 14:28:38 -0800 (PST), Google Beta User
>> <wany...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> No press conference from Ferguson? Because he's "upset"?
>>
>>
>> Can you blame him?
>
>Yes I can.
>I remember Lille-Manchester when he was shocked by Lille upset
>!

Has Alex Ferguson fucked your mom or little sister or something?