Limux FZ30
Bill Again
professionally produced piece of equipment.
Now I have a couple of hours of instruction reading, during which I can
charge up the battery, before trying the thing out.
My supplier had ordered 10 cameras, but only received three. There were 40
people on his waiting list so I feel that I did well to get one of the
first.
Best regards,
Robert R.
PS Anyone want to buy an FZ10 ? :-)
Pete Fenelon
grin, I've promised my '10 to my dad next year, if/when I buy a '30 ;)
pete
--
pe...@fenelon.com "Obviously crime pays, or there'd be no crime"-G Gordon Liddy
Jack Carter
"Bill Again" <a017...@addcom.de> wrote in message
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Bill Again
So far I am very impressed with it. Workload has meant that I have had
little time to test it, and I have to admit that so far it has merely been
play, but I can give you some first impressions.
I ordered the FZ30 because it seemed to me to have rolled up all the best
functions into one camera.
I particularly like the speed with which it turns on. With its fixed in
position lens there is no need to wait for lens extension, it simply turns
on. Presumably this helps with battery life too, there is no power wasted on
pushing that lens out when you turn on.
Its fast focus mode is very fast, in most circumstances it almost amounts to
simply point and shoot with a good crisp focus in every case. In practice
shutter lag is non-existent. No doubt I could measure it with some sort of
instrument and it may turn out to be .06 of a second, but in practice one
presses the shutter and it takes a shot.
As a long time user of "old" SLRs I was never really happy with digitals
that use a little thumb lever to change the zoom, so going back to a lens
ring is a great pleasure. Ditto the manual focus.
Noise is not a problem, not at least as far as I can see. For instance it
copes extremely well with night shots. Setting it up on a tripod and letting
it decide its own exposure results in a picture of a relatively dark street
scene that is amazingly sharp, noiseless and really quite spooky in the
detail that it has picked out. It is far better in this respect than the
FZ10 and way excels any of the Olympus cameras that have I used.
I am also impressed with the way it holds the contrast in bright sun light.
Shadows remain dark, while lit objects stand out clear and bright. I have
had other digital cameras that tried to smooth out these contrasts and only
ended up making a mess of the scene.
The stabiliser is effective too. Out of 4 or 5 hundred shots very very few
show any sign of camera shake. Far fewer than with the FZ10 that I used. I
should mention that the system is noisy though. Using setting 1, full time
stabilisation, you can hear the system working. Agreed it is only noticeable
as a low pitched variable buzz and it is not intrusive, you really have to
listen hard to hear it.
I have ordered extra batteries and an extension shutter cable which I should
be able to pick up in the next few days. Next week I am off to Sardinia for
a weeks hiking and I hope then to be able to give it a better trial.
Take care,
Robert
Jack Carter" <jcarter10...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:5_idnV6rnt7...@comcast.com...
measekite
Bill Again wrote:
>Hello Jack,
>
>So far I am very impressed with it. Workload has meant that I have had
>little time to test it, and I have to admit that so far it has merely been
>play, but I can give you some first impressions.
>
>I ordered the FZ30 because it seemed to me to have rolled up all the best
>functions into one camera.
>
>I particularly like the speed with which it turns on. With its fixed in
>position lens there is no need to wait for lens extension, it simply turns
>on. Presumably this helps with battery life too, there is no power wasted on
>pushing that lens out when you turn on.
>
>Its fast focus mode is very fast, in most circumstances it almost amounts to
>simply point and shoot with a good crisp focus in every case. In practice
>shutter lag is non-existent. No doubt I could measure it with some sort of
>instrument and it may turn out to be .06 of a second, but in practice one
>presses the shutter and it takes a shot.
>
>As a long time user of "old" SLRs I was never really happy with digitals
>that use a little thumb lever to change the zoom, so going back to a lens
>ring is a great pleasure. Ditto the manual focus.
>
>Noise is not a problem,
>
If "Noise is not a problem" then why would the professional reviewers (thus far) make such a large issue in point out noise. Are they mistaken or has the conditions under which noise occurs not be specifically defined. It would seem that with more MP on the same small sensor noise would be comparatively greater than the other cameras in the line.
jcar...@comcast.net
I've been trying to make up my mind about which one of the 12x-zoom zlrs
to
buy for several weeks. And the FZ30 sounded like it was a perfect fit -
except for the noise problem that the reviewers keep harping on. If it's
something that only shows up in technical reports - and doesn't actually
look bad - I could probably live with it. When Costco gets them in stock,
I'll buy one. So if it's something I just can't tolerate, I know I won't
have a problem returning it. I guess we have to make some compromises when
we buy almost anything. And the FZ30 seems to have ALL of the bases
covered - even with the reviewers, except for the noise.
Have a good trip!
"Bill Again" <a017...@addcom.de> wrote in message
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webwald
> > Noise is not a problem,
>
> If "Noise is not a problem" then why would the professional reviewers
> (thus far) make such a large issue in point out noise. Are they
> mistaken or has the conditions under which noise occurs not be
> specifically defined. It would seem that with more MP on the same
> small sensor noise would be comparatively greater than the other
> cameras in the line.
There is no doubt that there is noise, but whether it is a major issue
or not depends somewhat on the how individual users perceives these
noise levels in their own photographs. At ISO 100 and shooting in
conditions with plenty of light, it can be relatively easy to spot
noise in the shadows, and also sometimes in other better-lit areas of
the image. Although visible on screen at 100%, I still don't know how
this noise will show up in 6"x4" prints. As there are plenty of pixels,
it may not be all that evident.
In any case, noise levels are but one part of a camera's imaging
performance, and there are many other aspects of the FZ30's image
quality that help to produce nice looking images. Amongst these I would
include a pleasing color rendition and an optically sharp lens that
produces image detail that seems to be very good. In the end, the FZ30
has its own blend of strengths and weaknesses, just like any other
camera. Noise may be a real issue for some people, especially if doing
big prints, but for others it may not spoil many of their photographs.
--
Witold
Paul Allen
> Noise is not a problem, not at least as far as I can see. For instance it
> copes extremely well with night shots. Setting it up on a tripod and letting
> it decide its own exposure results in a picture of a relatively dark street
> scene that is amazingly sharp, noiseless and really quite spooky in the
> detail that it has picked out. It is far better in this respect than the
> FZ10 and way excels any of the Olympus cameras that have I used.
When you get a chance, could you shoot some night shots with both the
FZ30 and your old FZ10? I bet that would help out a lot of us who have
been on pins and needles waiting for images from production FZ30's.
Paul Allen
measekite
had nothing; I think that if one has an FZ20 then a DSLR would be the
path to go if you desired an upgrade.
Diamond Dave wrote:
>On Sat, 24 Sep 2005 20:26:29 -0700, Paul Allen <"paul dot l dot allen at comcast
>dot net"> wrote:
>
>
>>When you get a chance, could you shoot some night shots with both the
>>FZ30 and your old FZ10? I bet that would help out a lot of us who have
>>been on pins and needles waiting for images from production FZ30's.
>>
>>
>
>There's a lot of FZ30 pix in the Panasonic forum on DPreview and from what
>I've seen they're pretty bad if they contain an shadow area. It may be noise,
>I don't know, but shadows are grainy with the FZ30. Whatever it is, it's an
>effect that I haven't seen in pictures from my FZ20. If/when I upgrade, it won't
>be to the FZ30, it's more likely that I'll go DSLR.
>
>
Jan Böhme
> Even if the FZ30 is better than the FZ20 and would be the choice if one
> had nothing; I think that if one has an FZ20 then a DSLR would be the
> path to go if you desired an upgrade.
I'm in exactly that situation. Although the FZ30 and a DSLR have
different strengths and weaknesses, one still only wants to own so many
cameras. Thus, the FZ30 will have to compete with the KM Dynax 5D for
my next camera purchase. A DSLR doesn't have a swivelable LCD, which is
a great plus for the FZ30 over both the Dynax 5D and my FZ20. OTOH,
reviewers say that the swivelable LCD in the FZ30 is rather awkward and
impractical compared to the competition.
Jan Böhme
measekite
using an EVF I still recommend using the viewfinder. When using any
digital camera I recommend using the viewfinder. I see so many people,
the majority, holding a camera with arms outstretched composing with an
LCD that is constantly in motion. That is why most people do not get
great shots when using a digital camera.
Paul Allen
> On Sat, 24 Sep 2005 20:26:29 -0700, Paul Allen <"paul dot l dot allen at comcast
> dot net"> wrote:
>
>>FZ30 and your old FZ10? I bet that would help out a lot of us who have
>>been on pins and needles waiting for images from production FZ30's.
>
>
> I've seen they're pretty bad if they contain an shadow area. It may be noise,
> I don't know, but shadows are grainy with the FZ30. Whatever it is, it's an
> effect that I haven't seen in pictures from my FZ20. If/when I upgrade, it won't
> be to the FZ30, it's more likely that I'll go DSLR.
You didn't say whether you were talking about the ISO 80 or the ISO 400
shots on the DPreview samples page. The ISO 400 images are awful, but I
don't see any noise to worry about in the ISO 80 shots. The one thing
that stood out was the dramatic CA in the macro shot of the Rolex. My
old Oly C700 doesn't do that.
That review does have a direct comparison between the FZ20 and the FZ30.
In the studio still-life shot you can see some noise in the gray-scale
and color charts in the FZ30 image. There's some noise in the FZ20
image but it looks less obvious to me. In both cases the noise almost
completely disappears if I view at less than 100%.
I'd still like to see low-light comparison shots with the FZ30 and
either the FZ10 or the FZ20. I know what my C700 does with a 4-second
exposure of a 45-minute old sunset. (It's pretty ugly!) I'd like
to see what the FZ30 and its kindred do with a similar challenge.
Isn't it nice to have choices? You look at the FZ30 images and figure
your next step is a DSLR. I look at the same images and see a radical
upgrade that is financially within my reach. You going to sell your
20? :-)
Paul Allen
Paul Heslop
>
> When taking pics using a DSLR one composes using the viewfinder. When
> using an EVF I still recommend using the viewfinder. When using any
> digital camera I recommend using the viewfinder. I see so many people,
> the majority, holding a camera with arms outstretched composing with an
> LCD that is constantly in motion. That is why most people do not get
> great shots when using a digital camera.
>
c-725) at all. In bright light, however, I HAVE to use it with my hand
over the camera for shade, where the rear screen becomes almost
useless.
There are occasions when I find the rear screen a boon and will use
it first, these being the time when I would have to find something to
climb on to take a picture. I find I can hoist the cam a fair bit over
my head and use the screen to get a rough idea of my subject, which
isn't ideal but better than nothing. I usually take a few shots as I
know at least some will not be good. I also find the screen better
when shooting very close to the ground and I'm not usually physically
up to getting down and dirty, so as with the high shots I can look at
the screen from slightly above and judge the shot that way. Again, hit
and miss but better than nothing.
--
Paul (And I'm, like, "yeah, whatever!")
-------------------------------------------------------
Stop and Look
http://www.geocities.com/dreamst8me/
David J Taylor
> Even if the FZ30 is better than the FZ20 and would be the choice if
> one had nothing; I think that if one has an FZ20 then a DSLR would be
> the path to go if you desired an upgrade.
I don't see it that way, the P&S and DSLR are two different camera types
each with their own advantages and disadvantages. For example, a camera
like the Panasonic FZ5 is much lighter, easier to carry, and costs less
than any DLSR with an equivalent image-stabilised 432mm zoom would be, but
the DSLR will do better in high-ISO situations or if an interchangeable
lens facility is required.
For the higher-ISO capability in a fixed lens camera, the new Sony is the
first example of a different, third path to take:
http://www.dpreview.com/articles/sonydscr1/
David
measekite
Diamond Dave wrote:
>On Sun, 25 Sep 2005 16:40:26 GMT, measekite <inkys...@oem.com> wrote:
>
>
>>Even if the FZ30 is better than the FZ20 and would be the choice if one
>>had nothing; I think that if one has an FZ20 then a DSLR would be the
>>path to go if you desired an upgrade.
>>
>>
>
>There sure are a pile of FZ20 owners changing over to the FZ30 among
>the DPreview posters. I just don't see it as sensible.
>
>
These are the people who think they will get better pictures by
upgrading. They may find getting some photos a little easier and again
they may not. While a real pro photographer can get great photos with
most cameras; a good camera will make it easier for him/her to do better
but the differences between the FZ20/30 will not change a sows ear to a
silk purse.
That said if the person is really excited about the new camera and
really believes the results will due better then many times that will
occur. Much like an athlete who does a lot better because he believes
in himself. On the flip side of the coin there are bound to be many who
are disappointed when they do not achieve the imagined gains.
Ed
results are much better (lower noise) with the FZ. Also, I didn't need to
bring a tripod due to the stabilizer.
You can see some comparison shots between the two cameras that I shot in my
house.
http://www.catskill.net/ekirstein/test_photo_page.htm
I just sold my C750 and put my Promaster 5750DX automatic flash on eBay.
Ed
"Paul Allen" <"paul dot l dot allen at comcast dot net"> wrote in message
news:u7adnYBA-I_...@comcast.com...
David J Taylor
> I bought the FZ30 to upgrade from my c750. I shoot some theatre and
> the results are much better (lower noise) with the FZ. Also, I
> didn't need to bring a tripod due to the stabilizer.
> You can see some comparison shots between the two cameras that I shot
> in my house.
>
> http://www.catskill.net/ekirstein/test_photo_page.htm
>
> I just sold my C750 and put my Promaster 5750DX automatic flash on
> eBay.
>
> Ed
Thanks for posting that, Ed. The noise results are a lot better than the
doom merchants predicted! I would do the same as I do on my FZ5, and
stick with ISO 50/80/100 for normal use, and only use 200 or 400 where it
was essential. The lower ISO pictures, particularly the lowest are really
good, with much improved detail and less "over-sharpening" in the FZ30. I
do see some effects at ISO 200, and I wouldn't like to shoot a face (with
smooth skin tones) at ISO 400.
How do you like the camera otherwise?
Cheers,
David
King Sardon
wrote:
>I bought the FZ30 to upgrade from my c750. I shoot some theatre and the
>results are much better (lower noise) with the FZ. Also, I didn't need to
>bring a tripod due to the stabilizer.
>You can see some comparison shots between the two cameras that I shot in my
>house.
>
>http://www.catskill.net/ekirstein/test_photo_page.htm
>
>I just sold my C750 and put my Promaster 5750DX automatic flash on eBay.
>
>Ed
What is the shutter lag with autofocus working? IOW, how would the
FZ30 be for shooting kids scampering around in the back yard?
Ed
camera. Has the feel of my old Nikkormat SLR from decades ago. The size
and weight are fine with me. Easier to hold steady than a mini digital.
So many great features that I appreciate after two previous digitals. The
zoom ring and focus ring on the lens. I like that I can switch between auto
focus and manual and macro without going through any menus (switch on side
of lens).
Fast turn on makes a huge difference. The batteries will last all day,
cause I can shut off the camera between shots and never worry about the
startup time. It is less than the time it takes me to lift it to my face
and get ready to shoot.
Love the swiveling screen so I can protect it against my face oils. I
almost always use the EVF to shoot and the screen to playback. They are
both clear and bright.
Of course, the stabilizer is invaluable for me, since I get some shakes.
It just has a great feel.
Just bought a Sunpak 383 flash for it and love the extra capabilities that
gives it.
Ed
"King Sardon" <Sar...@isp.com> wrote in message
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Swingman
<jcar...@comcast.net> wrote in message
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> Hi Bill: And thanx for the reply.
> I've been trying to make up my mind about which one of the 12x-zoom zlrs
> to
> buy for several weeks. And the FZ30 sounded like it was a perfect fit -
> except for the noise problem that the reviewers keep harping on. If it's
> something that only shows up in technical reports - and doesn't actually
> look bad - I could probably live with it. When Costco gets them in stock,
> I'll buy one. So if it's something I just can't tolerate, I know I won't
> have a problem returning it. I guess we have to make some compromises when
> we buy almost anything. And the FZ30 seems to have ALL of the bases
> covered - even with the reviewers, except for the noise.
> Have a good trip!
FWIW, I have the FZ20 and depending on shooting conditions there is
sometimes visible noise in my pictures when viewed on the computer. If I
intend to regularly viewed a picture on the computer, for instance if I turn
it into a wallpaper, I may process it with NeatImage to remove the noise.
However, if I'm going to print the picture it doesn't appear to make much
difference - the noise is not apparent in my prints and I go up to 8x10. I
don't know if there's a digital camera of any make or model that produces
prints that are completely free of noise if examined closely on a computer
screen. That said, it's still a good idea to buy the camera from a dealer
you can return it to if it doesn't work out <g>.