Feudal Barons?
Alex
Regards,
Alex
Don Aitken
<aha...@directvinternet.com> wrote:
>How is a baron called if they hold a feudal barony? Your Excellancy?
>
I thought you would find these eventually. A feudal barony (in
Scotland only, not England, Ireland or elsewhere) is indeed something
which does exist and can be bought. It used to be attached to the
ownership of land, but this has recently changed. It is something you
*own*, not a title or a form of address, although you can attach it to
your name if you choose. It does not confer any particular rank of
status, even in Scotland.
--
Don Aitken
jlk7e
> How is a baron called if they hold a feudal barony? Your Excellancy?
>
> Regards,
> Alex
In Britain, they're "Your Lordship". In Germany, you'd call them
"Freiherr", I think. Not sure about other countries.
Alex
thought you call them Your Excellancy?
So these arent titles? I dont quite understand what they are then. If it
doesnt confer any particular rank, you might as well be a laird. I thought
Baron was a hereditary title that can be inherited to your descendants.
Regards,
Alex
"jlk7e" <jl...@juno.com> wrote in message
news:bdf17ac8.03011...@posting.google.com...
Louis Epstein
: So you would call a Feudal Baron different from a normal Baron? I always
: thought you call them Your Excellancy?
No barons I know of are called Your Excellency,
unless they happen to be Ambassadors,or holders
of other offices to which that style attaches.
: So these arent titles? I dont quite understand what they are then. If it
: doesnt confer any particular rank, you might as well be a laird. I thought
: Baron was a hereditary title that can be inherited to your descendants.
It can be inhjerited with the relevant land.
: "jlk7e" <jl...@juno.com> wrote in message
: news:bdf17ac8.03011...@posting.google.com...
:> "Alex" <aha...@directvinternet.com> wrote in message
: news:<3e206d62$1...@nopics.sjc>...
:> > How is a baron called if they hold a feudal barony? Your Excellancy?
:> >
:> > Regards,
:> > Alex
:>
:> In Britain, they're "Your Lordship". In Germany, you'd call them
:> "Freiherr", I think. Not sure about other countries.
-=-=-
The World Trade Center towers MUST rise again,
at least as tall as before...or terror has triumphed.
jlk7e
> So you would call a Feudal Baron different from a normal Baron? I always
> thought you call them Your Excellancy?
> So these arent titles? I dont quite understand what they are then. If it
> doesnt confer any particular rank, you might as well be a laird. I thought
> Baron was a hereditary title that can be inherited to your descendants.
>
> Regards,
> Alex
Oh, a feudal baron. I thought you were just asking about normal
barons. Never mind then. I don't know much about Scottish feudal
baronies, except that they're purchasable. I assume that, like any
other form of property, they can be inherited by your children. They
are, I think, very expensive.
Gary Holtzman
> "Alex" <aha...@directvinternet.com> wrote in message
> news:<3e20a67b$1...@nopics.sjc>...
> > So you would call a Feudal Baron different from a normal Baron? I
> > always thought you call them Your Excellancy?
> > So these arent titles? I dont quite understand what they are then. If
> > it doesnt confer any particular rank, you might as well be a laird. I
> > thought Baron was a hereditary title that can be inherited to your
> > descendants.
>
> barons. Never mind then. I don't know much about Scottish feudal
> baronies, except that they're purchasable. I assume that, like any
> other form of property, they can be inherited by your children. They
> are, I think, very expensive.
No doubt they are expensive, but they are not peerages. Unlike life barons, who
sit in the House of Lords, and hereditary barons(-peers) of England (and lords of
Parliament of Scotland), who formerly did, isn't it the case that these feudal
barons are not "lords" in the official sense?
--
Gary Holtzman
-------------------- http://NewsReader.Com/ --------------------
Alex
parliament in Scotland before its demise. Yes, they are expensive. I was
reading about one of the barons whose father bought the baron title and
died, the son moved to the barony and has been helping out its citizens.
They were calling him "Your Excellancy" (the citizens of the barony were
interviewed and they reffered to the baron that way).
Regards,
Alex
"Gary Holtzman" <ghol...@bellatlantic.net> wrote in message
news:20030112001106.492$y...@newsreader.com...
Alex
not members of the peerage. Hey they are part of the nobility :) I will be
soon owning a feudal barony everyone. I of course will still frequent the
newsgroups even after Im titled. I hope to visit the barony a lot and help
the town in its projects, events etc.
Regards,
Alex
"Alex" <aha...@directvinternet.com> wrote in message
news:3e2107d7$1...@nopics.sjc...
Alex
Matriculation of previously recorded Armorial Bearings, including shield and
crest or New Grant of Armorial Bearings, including shield and crest.
Regards,
Alex
"Alex" <aha...@directvinternet.com> wrote in message
news:3e210...@nopics.sjc...
Guy Stair Sainty
It confers special precedence, particular heraldic privileges and the style
of "Much Honored". The question of how Lord Lyon and the Land Registrar will
treat feudaL baronies sepaarated from the land has not been resolved yet.
Guy Stair Sainty
www.chivalricorders.org/index3.htm
James Hill
Alex
observe in parliament or become a real barony as it once was? I would think
the original baronial feudal families would be dissapointed about the
changes in their title.
Regards,
Alex
"Guy Stair Sainty" <g...@sainty.org> wrote in message
news:avrp4...@drn.newsguy.com...
Nicholas Kutozov
> When I petition Lord Lyon I was wondering what would be more wise to do:
> Matriculation of previously recorded Armorial Bearings, including shield and
> crest or New Grant of Armorial Bearings, including shield and crest.
>
> Regards,
> Alex
You raise a number of points in your postings. As to your Armorial
bearings, you do not state wheather you are already armigerous.
I doubt very much that the "citizens" (your word) of a barony would
ever address a feudal baron as "Your excellency" and I fear that in
reality, unless you very quickly become well known as a benefactor to
the community when you make it publicly known that you are the new
(paper) baron you will be treated as something as an excentric
curiosity and possible even ignored by those who reside in your
barony.
Whilst I would be the first to admit that there has been and remains a
good deal of respect for the established baronial families I fear that
of late (and especially since the abolition of feudal tenure) there is
a good deal of suspicion of the motives of new (possibly foreign)
barons who know little or nothing of the estate and merely wish to be
noble.
I am not even sure that you would be considered as noble by your
"citizens".
If you wish to be a social benefactor, you do not need to purchase a
barony.
As you have gathered, I have very mixed feelings over baronies. I
respect and admire the old established land owning feudal baronies and
accept that there are even those "new" barons who have the best of
intentions and will make a go of it so to speak. However I do question
wheather someone such as yourself (you say you will shortly be a
baron)who it would appear has very little knowledge of the traditions
and status of feudal barons, has the correct motive.
Sorry if I offend but I of late too old to practise the gentle art of
diplomacy and there seems to be an awful lot of missunderstanding out
there as to what feudal baronies are. Some people just seem to have
more money than sense.
Nicholas
Alex
immediately as soon as I own the feudal baronial title. I will make it my
perogative to fund town projects and events.
Regards,
Alex
"Nicholas Kutozov" <heral...@mail.ru> wrote in message
news:4ef40530.03011...@posting.google.com...
fabrizio
Fab
"Nicholas Kutozov" <heral...@mail.ru> ha scritto nel messaggio
news:4ef40530.03011...@posting.google.com...
Alex
treat their baron well :)
Regards,
Alex
"fabrizio" <fabrizio....@libero.it> wrote in message
news:jjiU9.111857$Ou4.3...@twister2.libero.it...
Jean Sue Libkind
on 1/12/03 1:24:
> Ok I found out that Scottish feudal Barons are members of the nobility but
> not members of the peerage. Hey they are part of the nobility :) I will be
> soon owning a feudal barony everyone. I of course will still frequent the
> newsgroups even after Im titled. I hope to visit the barony a lot and help
> the town in its projects, events etc.
>
> Regards,
> Alex
You certainly deserve something for your persistence!
Actually, your next four-five years should be most interesting. I hope you
will keep meticulous notes as well as keeping all of us informed of your
good works and the reception by your citizens. There is, at least, a book in
it.
(And, if you need an agent......)
The Bookschlepper
Alex
past couple months. I hope I can write a book for this. I'd like a movie one
day lol... I can see it in the trailor for the movie... " A mand who bought
his way into nobility ".......
Regards,
Alex
"Jean Sue Libkind" <jea...@bookschlepper.com> wrote in message
news:BA476545.AB1E%jea...@bookschlepper.com...
Alex
money. I should start a site called "Make Me A Baron" and hope for people to
donate money.
Regards,
Alex Haxton
Paypal: aha...@directvinternet.com
"Alex" <aha...@directvinternet.com> wrote in message
news:3e2204f3$1...@nopics.sjc...
Trey
> I am visiting the barony before I buy it. I will help the barony starting
> immediately as soon as I own the feudal baronial title. I will make it my
> perogative to fund town projects and events.
>
> Regards,
> Alex
>
You don't have to justify it yourself, not to us. Though the money to
buy your barony might help too. Also, please stop top-posting.
Trey
Trey
> So you would call a Feudal Baron different from a normal Baron? I always
> thought you call them Your Excellancy?
> So these arent titles? I dont quite understand what they are then. If it
> doesnt confer any particular rank, you might as well be a laird. I thought
> Baron was a hereditary title that can be inherited to your descendants.
>
Excellency
Alex
excellency?
Regards,
Alex
"Trey" <tshehan@rockbridge[remove].net> wrote in message
news:MPG.188bd8721...@news.rockbridge.net...
Trey
> Just checking my spelling error or telling me you can call them their
> excellency?
>
> Regards,
> Alex
Spelling error. Sorry if I'm being rude. I'm just strongly against
titles, and even more strongly against fake titles.
Trey
Michael F. McCartney
older American readers will recall the "Classics Illustrated" of our youth.
And I'm not entirely sure that an agent is what is really needed, rather than a
conservator. As NK noted, some folk have more money than sense; & I'm afraid
that even abject poverty would not remedy that assessment in some cases.
On a slightly more serious note, re: our future baron's question regarding
arms, grant vs. matriculation really isn't a choice. The arms of the previous
owners of yon fair barony are not & cannot be included in the sale price, at
any price (unless you also married the previous owner's only daughter & took
her name, followed by a large bank draft to LL made out to HM Treasury...).
You would have to either rematriculate arms of your documented agnatic ancestor
already in LR (or at least previously granted from a source LL will accept)
with the extra Santa's hat & cloak; or absent existing arms acceptable to LL,
you would need a fresh grant.
As an aside (for possible use as a motto) - what would be the Latin and/or
Gaelic for "There goes the neighborhood"??
Michael Fannin McCartney
Fremont, California
(Delete "delete" from e-mail address)
Nicholas Kutozov
If Mr. Haxton's intended baronial purchase is from the e-bay site he
has so obviously visited and possibly now wishes to emulate - I quote
his earlier posting:
"If you can create documents like these please email me at
aha...@nospam.com
(change nospam to directvinternet) Profits will be shared per each
document
set made.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=355&item=935837363
"
then I fear that all he can hope for is ridicule since the baronies in
question (and indeed the so called Kingdoms and College of Arms)
quoted on the e-bay site are fake and fictitious.
Mr. Haxton please be aware that there are those who seek to mislead
the unwary and Please please resist the temptation (as your earlier
posting I fear indicates) to copy the fast buck con merchants.
Those who remain in the real world can spot an embarasing fake
"nobleman" a mile off.
Nicholas
Alex
while. The whole documents thing has nothing to do with selling fake titles.
I am just looking for a heraldic artist who can do such good work as those
documents on the ebay site.
"Nicholas Kutozov" <heral...@mail.ru> wrote in message
news:4ef40530.03011...@posting.google.com...
Alex
Dear Mr Alex Haxton,
thank you for your mail.
We invite to send us some more information
abaut yourself in CV and also to communicate
us abaut your intentions to obtain a title on
nobility.
Yours faithfully.
The Chancellor
"Alex" <aha...@directvinternet.com> wrote in message
news:3e2219fe$1...@nopics.sjc...
Jean Sue Libkind
wrote on 1/12/03 19:14:
> Funny you mentioned that. Ive basically been writing everything down for the
> past couple months. I hope I can write a book for this. I'd like a movie one
> day lol... I can see it in the trailor for the movie... " A mand who bought
> his way into nobility ".......
>
> Regards,
> Alex
You might get a TV show to underwrite part of it. And if you're not married,
the search for a Baroness could be next. Then the search for a chateau. The
little ones.... a virtual video empire could be made with the right
marketing.
js
Alex
Well Ive been contacted by the royal house of portugal and Im in talks with
them so soon I may have a title through the royal house of portugal
Regards,
Alex
.
"Jean Sue Libkind" <jea...@bookschlepper.com> wrote in message
news:BA4850A0.AB6B%jea...@bookschlepper.com...
Alex
think this guys a scam artist?
FROM THE PRIVATE OFFICE OF
HIS IMPERIAL AND ROYAL HIGHNESS
PRINCE KARL FREDERICKE OF GERMANY, DUKE OF SWABIA,
de jure CHARLES VIII I.R.
Monday 13th January, 2003.
Mr. Haxton,
I have formally instructed by His Imperial Highness, to reply to your recent
E-mail sent to His Imperial Highness', private office on the 9th of January,
2003.
His Imperial Highness, would of course be able to confer a Title of Nobility
upon yourself in return for services to His Imperial and Royal House, as
such the Title would be that of Count or Baron of The Holy Roman Empire, by
the Sovereign Act of Letters Patent, for the aforementioned services.
Please would you formally petition His Imperial Highness, directly at His
Imperial Highness, private office, along with your full family details being
that of yourself and your parents and grand-parents to cover at least 100
hundred years of family records, Thank you.
Yours Sincerely,
Maria von Wettinberg.
Private Secretary.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----------------
The Private Office of His Imperial and Royal Highness
Prince Karl Fredericke von Deutschland,
Royal Mail Post Office Box 276,
Teddington, Middlesex, TW11 OUL,
UNITED KINGDOM.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----------------
"Alex" <aha...@directvinternet.com> wrote in message
news:3e22e024$1...@nopics.sjc...
jlk7e
> What does cv mean (I got this email from the royal house of portugal)
curriculum vitae - like a resume, essentially.
eirikr1
> How is a baron called if they hold a feudal barony? Your Excellancy?
If it's a ULC barony, then he is addressed as "your Blessed High Holiness"
in first person :
or
in third person it's "His Most August Holiness, the Illustrious Grand Baron
<name> of the sovereign territory of <insert fictional territory here>.
Don't forget to add the initials "N.N." behind your name. Probably still for
sale, and the knighthoods were even recognized by an Italian court!
eirikr1
> Is there ever a possibility that Scottish Feudal Barons might be allowed
to
> observe in parliament or become a real barony as it once was? I would
think
> the original baronial feudal families would be dissapointed about the
> changes in their title.
>
> Regards,
> Alex
Finally found a legit way to purchase a title, now you whine about attending
parliment, instead of whining about non-noblesse.....
eirikr1
> Nicholas, money talks these days. Trust me if the barony wants money
theyll
> treat their baron well :)
With wisdom and attitude like that, how could your petitions for nobility
have been denied in the past???
eirikr1
> Ive seen sites where people ask to pay off their debts etc and actually
get
> money. I should start a site called "Make Me A Baron" and hope for people
to
> donate money.
And I was thinking you deserved an award for chutzpah *before* I read the
above...
Alex
Regards,
Alex
"eirikr1" <eir...@cox.net> wrote in message
news:PzGU9.17493$H76.1...@news1.east.cox.net...
Alex
well I was happy to see this:
Burke's Peerage & Baronetage intends including Scottish feudal barons in its
next edition, the 107th. Would any holders of these territorial
jurisdictions kindly contact Hugh Peskett FSA (Scot), Consulting Editor
Scotland, c/o 1 Avenue Road, Winchester SO22 5AQ, with full details of name,
location and mode and date of acquisition of the barony.
"Alex" <aha...@directvinternet.com> wrote in message
news:3e2340a2$1...@nopics.sjc...
Mike Girouard
> What does cv mean (I got this email from the royal house of portugal)
>
>
> Dear Mr Alex Haxton,
>
> thank you for your mail.
>
> We invite to send us some more information
> abaut yourself in CV and also to communicate
> us abaut your intentions to obtain a title on
> nobility.
>
> Yours faithfully.
>
> The Chancellor
And when the book is written, this particular incident should have its
own chapter. "The Man Who Would Be Noble Receives A Polite Form
Letter."
Alex
can make the original investment in the title a lot more.
Regards,
Alex
"eirikr1" <eir...@cox.net> wrote in message
news:nJGU9.17495$H76.1...@news1.east.cox.net...
George Lucki
> I don't care about being in parliament geez. I just want to know if new
laws
> can make the original investment in the title a lot more.
>
> Regards,
> Alex
Isn't it awful that legislatures can just arbitrarily change the rules and
reduce the value of an investment.
I'm glad to hear that you see purchasing a 'title of nobility' as an
investment rather than a vanity.
Are these titles sold by Prospectus? What is the historical return on
baronies?
I know past results are not a promise of future performance but still - it
would be good to get what you deserve for your hard earned money.
How do Scottish baronies compare with Irish ones in terms of 5 year rate of
return?
But really in economic terms does purchasing a title really make sense?
Would it not be better to merely lease one?
Alex, thank you for the smiles and joy your thread has brought on cold
January days.
:))
With tongue firmly lodged in cheek,
Kind regards, George Lucki
Alex
irish baronies though since I thought they were unrecognized in a republic.
My solicitor recommened buying a cheap barony (the name of it usually isnt
as well known) but those usually can make more money in the long run.
Regards,
Alex
"George Lucki" <cps...@attglobal.net> wrote in message
news:3e246...@news1.prserv.net...
George Lucki
> Scottish Feudal Baronies seem the best so far. Ive never seen legitimate
> irish baronies though since I thought they were unrecognized in a
republic.
> My solicitor recommened buying a cheap barony (the name of it usually isnt
> as well known) but those usually can make more money in the long run.
>
> Regards,
> Alex
Alex,
That is interesting. In other purchases - fine art or antiques for example
the wisdom would be to search out quality. With items tthat are more like
bulk commodities the wisdom would be to buy on price only. Purchased noble
titles would then be more like second grade grain than treasured antiques.
But I defer to your solicitor. Who else would know better abour purchasing
titles.
While playing with these analogies - is it better to buy old or new? You
have set aside the idea of have a 'bespoke' or new tailor-made title created
for yourself and have definitely decided to buy used and off the rack?
:))
Kind regards, George Lucki
PS Have you looked at non-European titles? African or Asian tribal
dignities? Ecclesiastical dignities?
Alex
No I havent looked into non-european titles, african or asian tribal
dignities or Ecclesiastical dignities as I havent found any legitimate
websites.
Regards,
Alex
"George Lucki" <cps...@attglobal.net> wrote in message
news:3e248...@news1.prserv.net...
The Chief
> How is a baron called if they hold a feudal barony? Your Excellancy?
>
> Alex
Why do you keep posting on this and other threads, when the perfect
product for you has been available for years?
See
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&selm=37E3F2C5.4506F9A9%40worldnet.att.net
The Chief
PWW
Maybe you should give serious consideration to spending the money on a great
deal of therapy instead?
yaffaDina
>
> On Tue, 14 Jan 2003 15:03:12 -0800,
> Alex (aha...@directvinternet.com) says:
>
> > Hey,
> >
> > No I havent looked into non-european titles, african or asian tribal
> > dignities or Ecclesiastical dignities as I havent found any legitimate
> > websites.
> >
>
> even consider offering titles on their website. If this discussion
> weren't so funny, I'd ask it to leave rec.heraldry since it has nothing
> to do with heraldry. Also, please stop top-posting.
>
> Trey
>
> PS> Perhaps "Alex" is a troll?
Perhaps?
yD
Francois R. Velde
> PS> Perhaps "Alex" is a troll?
You don't say.
Obviously too many people enjoy feeding this troll, so we can expect it to
to hang around for the attention and see "Alex" fire up one inane thread
after another for a long while.
--
François R. Velde
ve...@nospam.org (replace by "heraldica")
Heraldica Web Site: http://www.heraldica.org/
yaffaDina
>
> Trey <tshehan@rockbridge[remove].net> wrote:
> >
> > Maybe you should realize that very few legitimate fontes honorum would
> > even consider offering titles on their website. If this discussion
> > weren't so funny, I'd ask it to leave rec.heraldry since it has nothing
> > to do with heraldry. Also, please stop top-posting.
> >
>
> through the generations of his family, a coat of arms might be a more realistic
> option than a title.
>
> --
> Gary Holtzman
>
> -------------------- http://NewsReader.Com/ --------------------
Also cross-posted to gossip royalty.
yD