WARNING!!! Do NOT use Pinball Pal Stealth Mylar on inserts!!!!!!!

[Rare Hero]

Hey guys, just a word of warning to protect your games.

I put some Pinball Pal Stealth Mylar on my NGG a few years ago to
protect the inserts by the flippers/slings. Yesterday I noticed it
was bubbling a bit, so I decided to pull it off. The website states
Stealth Mylar won't damage playfields...but the mylar pulled the art
RIGHT OFF my inserts!!!!!! I just kinda fucked my nice NGG
playfield. :( :( :( I've successfully frozen mylar off of plenty
of playfields, so I'm no mylar noob....if I knew this could happen
with stealth mylar, I would have frozen it off ...I actually froze the
rest of it off after pulling off 2 1/2 inserts. So - a word of
warning to those with Stealth Mylar on your games or thinking about
using it.

BE CAREFUL!

RIP NGG. :(

Greg

[Jesse Wilson]

That stuff isn't even that adhesive(it's not even mylar), that is really
hard to believe but it's good to know.

Jesse

[Tim N.]

Did you put down wax or novus before applying the mylar? I always do
this to anything I mylar as a bit of insurance to protect my PFs from
doing exactly what you are describing...

[ldnayman]

Can we see some pics?

Is your damaged NGG now for sale, and for how much?

[Greg Lightfoot]

Sorry to hear about your situation, thanks for sharing. I've placed
these on most of my machines.
Has anyone else had this problem?

[NM]

Thanks for the warning; sorry to hear about your inserts.


--
NM

Current: AFM, CFTBL, FGY, MB, NGG, SS, STTNG, TAF, ToM, TRON LE, TSPP,
TZ, WH2O, '54 Gottlieb Stage Coach.
This USENET post sent from http://rgparchive.com

[Taylorva]

You need to contact them. If they caused this damage they need to stop
selling this product as advertised and figure out what is going on in
your situation.

Did you buy it directly from them?


--
Taylorva

[Rare Hero]

On Jan 30, 8:15 pm, ldnayman <ldnay...@aol.com> wrote:
> Can we see some pics?
>
> Is your damaged NGG now for sale, and for how much?

It took off the top of the 3, most of the 6, all of the 7 and was
about to pull up the top of the 8 (you can see it hazed now).

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v57/rarehero/NGG/NGG_inserts.jpg

...and yes, it's for sale and someone has dibs on it...lol.
Overreaction? Maybe...it just really bums me out and I'm just not in
the mood to repair it. I actually still have the "insert art", as it
came off clean and I was able to remove it from the mylar. I'm sure
they can be glued/cleared back on to some extent....but I'm trying to
wrap up all my pinball projects and don't want to deal with this...it
just bothers the shit out of me. :(

Greg

[Rare Hero]

On Jan 30, 9:18 pm, Taylorva <Taylorv...@gmail.com> wrote:
> You need to contact them. If they caused this damage they need to stop
> selling this product as advertised and figure out what is going on in
> your situation.
>
> Did you buy it directly from them?

Yeah, I've bought lots of stuff from Mark/Pinball Pal. I have the
button protector mylar on a lot of my game cabinets, and stealth mylar
here and there on various games. I emailed Mark...didn't hear back
yet. Granted, sometimes it takes people a bit to answer their emails
and maybe I should have waited longer before posting to RGP...but I'm
just so bummed out by this I just wanted to make sure no one else
makes the same mistake I did.

I also want to be clear I'm not trying to start a fight with Mark or
anything...what's done is done...I can't go back in time. I just want
to make sure people are very careful if they're removing Stealth Mylar
if it's on inserts. My heart skipped a beat when the art ripped right
off.

Greg

[Michael Paris]

That blows!!

[EZ SLEEZE E]

Karma! Pure Karma.

[Jesse Wilson]

I notice you keep mentioning Mylar. Is this some sort of Mylar type
product that he used to sell or is it the current clear removable vinyl
protectors he currently sells? The vinyl he sells now is very different
than Mylar and from all my experience comes up very easily and cleanly.

I just went and tried to peel off the stealth protectors off of my LOTR
that have been on for 6-7 years and they came up as easily as they came
off the backing when I bought them.

How long was it on the PF exactly? Was it subjected to any extreme heat
or anything by chance? Just trying to figure out what would make the
adhesive change so much over a relatively short period of time. Usually
things get less adhesive over time instead of more.



Jesse

[destruk]

That hurts. Would it have been any better if you cut out the mylar so
it didn't cover the inserts?


--
destruk

[Dave Bishop]

I had this happen with my MINT AFM playfield a few years back. I put
it on and when peeled it of to took the capture 1,2,3 off and lifted a
jackpot insert. Emailed pinball pal straight away....no reply! Was
thinking of taking legal action, but I'm over in UK so too much
hassle. DO NOT USE THIS STUFF

[bigehrl]

Is regular Mylar better, or is it just as bad for inserts? I prefer to
protect the pf when I can.

-jon


--
bigehrl

[Rare Hero]

On Jan 30, 11:53 pm, EZ SLEEZE E <erikhoh...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Karma! Pure Karma.

Meaning? Who have I wronged in the pinball world...please step
forward.

Greg

[Rare Hero]

On Jan 31, 1:24 am, bigehrl <jehrlic...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Is regular Mylar better, or is it just as bad for inserts? I prefer to
> protect the pf when I can.

Well, use regular mylar if you want something "permanent" ...and you
can freeze off mylar pretty successfully from modern playfields
without damaging the art. I've done it a bunch of times. The problem
with this Stealth stuff is that it's advertised as a temporary product
that lifts off easily and without damage.

Greg

[Rare Hero]

On Jan 31, 12:12 am, Jesse Wilson <jarbyji...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Rare Hero wrote:
> > On Jan 30, 9:18 pm, Taylorva<Taylorv...@gmail.com>  wrote:
> >> You need to contact them. If they caused this damage they need to stop
> >> selling this product as advertised and figure out what is going on in
> >> your situation.
>
> >> Did you buy it directly from them?
>
> > Yeah, I've bought lots of stuff from Mark/Pinball Pal.  I have the
> > button protector mylar on a lot of my game cabinets, and stealth mylar
> > here and there on various games.  I emailed Mark...didn't hear back
> > yet.  Granted, sometimes it takes people a bit to answer their emails
> > and maybe I should have waited longer before posting to RGP...but I'm
> > just so bummed out by this I just wanted to make sure no one else
> > makes the same mistake I did.
>
> > I also want to be clear I'm not trying to start a fight with Mark or
> > anything...what's done is done...I can't go back in time.  I just want
> > to make sure people are very careful if they're removing Stealth Mylar
> > if it's on inserts.  My heart skipped a beat when the art ripped right
> > off.
>
> > Greg
>
> I notice you keep mentioning Mylar. Is this some sort of Mylar type
> product that he used to sell or is it the current clear removable vinyl
> protectors he currently sells? The vinyl he sells now is very different
> than Mylar and from all my experience comes up very easily and cleanly.

It's called "Stealth Mylar" ...but yeah, it's vinyl.

> I just went and tried to peel off the stealth protectors off of my LOTR
> that have been on for 6-7 years and they came up as easily as they came
> off the backing when I bought them.

That's what I expected to happen...but it didn't.

> How long was it on the PF exactly? Was it subjected to any extreme heat
> or anything by chance? Just trying to figure out what would make the
> adhesive change so much over a relatively short period of time. Usually
> things get less adhesive over time instead of more.

I put it on the playfield in '08, I think. The game has been in the
garage for a few months...so a little more cold than it would get than
in the house...but it's California cold not too extreme. No extreme
heat this time of year.

Greg

[Dennis Cole]

Iam now going to order a bunch of stealth Mylar, I use it on
everything. Used it on my NGG and after reading this went and pealed
it without issue.sorry you had an issue,but Iam going to stock up in
case something bad happens and it's not for sale anymore.

[Joe Jet]

Thanks for the warning but i am really surprised after working with
this product for years on many games...Is there something about your
NGG or NGG in general that would make it prone to this? Meaning were
the inserts already lifting or bubbling and you put the protectors
over that or was it an all original playfield factory cleared with no
issues? I dont see how this could happen if the inserts were good to
begin with but it obviously did.. :confused:

Sorry that happened it would tear my heart out if it happened to me!

Joe

[Taylorva]

I think NGG is prone to lifting but this is disheartening. I use the
product on my restorations to protect drop areas. In lieu of clearcoat I
don't see this arising but known problematic games, i.e., NGG, CV, and
AFM could have issues.

I'd be bummed as shit.


--
Taylorva

[Rum-Z]

I used some of this stealth protective film on my CV. I had to lift
and reposition the stealth protective film, and I lifted it carefully,
but I noticed it caused a small amount of existing ghosting to
slightly spread under an insert's art. After seeing that, I decided
when it comes time to change it I'm going to freeze it off, like I do
mylar. Hopefully that works the same with the stealh protective film
as with mylar.

[ldnayman]

On Jan 31, 2:12 am, Rare Hero <rarehero...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Jan 30, 8:15 pm, ldnayman <ldnay...@aol.com> wrote:
>
> > Can we see some pics?
>
> > Is your damaged NGG now for sale, and for how much?
>
> It took off the top of the 3, most of the 6, all of the 7 and was
> about to pull up the top of the 8 (you can see it hazed now).
>
> http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v57/rarehero/NGG/NGG_inserts.jpg
>

Wow...I'm not exactly gonna say that game is RIP, but that is a shame.

[ldnayman]

On Jan 31, 3:37 am, destruk <dest...@gmail.com> wrote:
> That hurts.  Would it have been any better if you cut out the mylar so
> it didn't cover the inserts?
>

Then what is the point of putting the mylar on?

[jeffC]

Seems like a chemical reaction if indeed you were able to remove the
lifted artwork from the stealth mylar.

On Jan 31, 2:12 am, Rare Hero <rarehero...@yahoo.com> wrote:

[Glen Peters]

Sorry to hear that, Gregg. Pretty sucky to say the least. Odd though
how others use it with no issues, that's what is confusing. But I'm
sure there is an answer for that. But what that answer is... is
anybody's guess. I could venture a few but don't see as it would help.
But again, sorry to hear that happened....

[jackofdiamonds]

I've used the product and have never had an issue.Sorry about your
game.Scott


--
jackofdiamonds

[Mark Clayton]

Greg:

And I have no desire to start a fight with you or anybody. I'm really
sorry you had problems with the product, but I must come to the defense
of the Stealth protectors, and clarify some misconceptions.

All Stealth protectors are vinyl - not Mylar. I do not call them Mylar,
which is a brand name for a different product. Mylar is stiffer (that's
why it lifts) and it clouds over time. Stealth's vinyl is much more
flexible and lays flat. It also polishes with Novus 2, so it doesn't
cloud up. IF YOU SEE LIFTING UNDER A STEALTH PROTECTOR, IT IS MOST
LIKELY THE ARTWORK UNDERNEATH THAT IS LIFTING.

The Stealth protectors use a removable adhesive that is rated
for years in outdoor conditions. On a playfield, I have yet
to see one fall off, after more years than that. I do not guarantee
that a Stealth protector will not damage your playfield, I cannot
control where or how they are applied, or how the adhesive may change
over years based on particular conditions. But I have tested them
and have never had ANY LIFTING OF ANY KIND. Here's a video I took
showing how easily they were removed from a Banzai Run playfield, where
they sat for a couple of years:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HLshw3ydwTQ&feature=plcp&context=C3faf3e7UDOEgsToPDskLPUczi3CyqJRmSjcOti-kT

And I have conducted similar tests on other playfields such
as a Black Knight and Twilight Zone.

This is from the FAQ that has been on the Stealth protector
web page for years:

"Should removal seem difficult, an adhesive remover such as Goo Gone
will make easy work of it, without the worries of cabinet or playfield
damage that a permanent Mylar adhesive may cause."

I have never guaranteed that things can't be damaged under
unusual circumstances, nobody can. Literally thousands of these
protectors have been used since 2003, and there will inevitably be
occasional problems. I've had a few complaints that they don't
stick well enough, and about the same number saying that they
stick too well. To me, that means it's about right.

But whenever you stick something on top of something else,
there can be damage if the underlying material is not sound.
Was the artwork lifted by previous Mylar removal? Aggressive
machine polishing? Some weird chemical used to clean the
playfield in the past? I have no way of telling, but I do
guarantee that if Mylar had been used, the damage would
be much worse. If extreme pressure is needed to remove
a Stealth protector, use a chemical aid like Goo Gone to
help (as mentioned in the FAQ). If you use normal pressure,
but artwork is lifting, that means the artwork is no longer
adhering to the playfield, and anything applied on top would
cause it to lift when removed. I've applied Stealth protectors
on top of inserts with partially lifting artwork, but I know that
if I ever remove the protector, the lifted artwork will be coming
off with it. That's not a fault with the protector.

Greg, I am sorry that your playfield is damaged, but it is
very unlikely that the damage was "caused" by the Stealth
protector. My tests and 1000's of other applications have
shown that they will not damage a playfield in sound condition.
I will amp up the warnings on the FAQ so that the risk of damage
in unusual circumstances is remotely possible.

-Mark
-----
http://pinballpal.com

[psk445]

Don't see them for sale anywhere, but does not mean they don't exist;
is it possible your game had aftermarket insert decals installed?

Seeing as you destroyed the game, please put me on the interested list
if your first buyer backs out :) (Serious!)

[Magic Mike]

I have been warning you guys about this product for years. Too bad you
didn't bother to listen.

Mike

[Jeff]

Some folks have to learn the hard way. Just sucks the PF got trashed
though.

[Jpop]

Hi...

When I used to work for an operator we stayed away from mylar or other
"industrial" type of adhesive films. Instead we would buy clear shelf
liner from MacTac (sold at WM). It protects fine, is vinyl and has a
**low** tack. So it peels right off and never pulls up the art.

In our case we changed these "liners" all the time and the pfs looked
new for home sale later. We operated them then fixed them up for
pinball folks.

Jpop

[Rare Hero]

On Feb 5, 9:47 am, Jeff <jt.fow...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> Some folks have to learn the hard way. Just sucks the PF got trashed
> though.

Some folks haven't read every post ever written ever on RGP....sorry
for my lack of thoroughness. :(

Greg

[Captain Neo]

also, remember it depends on what game your putting it on. If your
putting it on a gottlieb system 3 or system 11 game, the insert art,
might be so cracked up already, that anything that sticks to it, will
peel up the old cracked lacquer no matter what. That's what system
11's do a lot of the time. Even if it was painters tape, it would do
the same. not all playfields are immune to mylar. Now if it happened
on a WPC95, then the product failed you.

[toyboy6]

Greg,
I've used the stealth protectors on many applications and haven't
had any issues yet. However, I appreciate your post as it serves as a
good reminder to be very careful during removal even though it should
be "safe".

Scott

[EZ SLEEZE E]

Common sense helps. Let me see I'm going to install a sticky Mylar
sticker on my playfield then bitch and cry when I remove it along with
the clear? Best part off the post is pinball pal's fault!! I guess
their so expensive you've got to remove them so you can reuse them.
huh? Hey don't remove ANY Mylar one you install it!!

[Andrew Barney]

EZ, did you read all the words in the OP? Maybe you should, or his
follow up posts...

Andrew

[seymour.shabow]

It's just thin <whatever> (mylar? Vinyl? Who cares?)

It's still got adhesive on it and because it does, there's always
potential there for some kind of damage.

I'd use it but then again, I also use "regular" mylar where warranted.
In either case if I want to pull it up later, I know to use caution and
freeze spray or heat and not just peel it off like a band aid. That's
just common sense, regardless of any demos or claims made.

[metallik]

Some of the later WPC games (CV, NGG, CC, CP) have clearcoat issues
with their playfields... CV is particularly bad, as has been noted
here in the past, but I've seen edge ghosting on the others
mentioned. From Dave's post, it sounds like some AFMs may also have
clearcoat issues. Unfortunately, because of this, people are more
likely use mylar/vinyl protectors on these games to help protect the
inserts.

Mark, based on these anecdotes, you should really put a specific
warning about using your product on WPC965 games, particularly those
listed. One trashed playfield is one too many :/ They are just too
prone to insert lifting in any circumstance.

[ldnayman]

On Feb 5, 1:27 pm, metallik <metal...@fuse.net> wrote:

> Mark, based on these anecdotes, you should really put a specific
> warning about using your product on WPC965 games, particularly those
> listed.  One trashed playfield is one too many :/  They are just too
> prone to insert lifting in any circumstance.

Ehhh...seems like an invitation for grief.

Mark layed it out here pretty good - he makes no promises on any of
this stuff. This is the first time we've heard about any problem so a
"warning" isn't warranted.

[yenningComity]

Sorry, but -1 to the op. First rule of mylar removal is to not just pull
it off. Steal Protectors might not be MYLAR as far as brand goes, but
the idea is slightly modified. Coming on here and whining because you
did something stupid probably shows that you got what was coming to you.
Had you done the freeze spray method, goo gone, or even heat we wouldn't
be having this discussion.


--
yenningComity

[Mark Clayton]

The protectors have been used on HUNDREDS of WPC games over
a period of years, including my own. They are adhesive, a much
milder
adhesive than Mylar. The FAQ already states that if they are
difficult
to remove, something like Goo Gone should be used to soften it.
But if the material that the protector has adhered to has delaminated
from the playfield, it doesn't matter what you stick on top, you're
in deep doo doo and need to proceed with caution. There is no
evidence that the protectors cause this delamination, nor can I think
of a way that they could. In spite of that, I will add an appropriate
warning
to the FAQ that if you see lifting underneath a protector, it probably
is
not the protector but the clear and/or ink underneath.

-Mark

[metallik]

> The protectors have been used on HUNDREDS of WPC games over
> a period of years, including my own.  They are adhesive, a much

WPC != WPC95. I have no doubt your protectors work great 99% of the
time, however, there are known issues with the playfields on the later
WPC95 games. There is plenty of evidence that clearcoats do not
adhere well to the inserts on these games. A simple warning that
extra care should be taken with these titles could spare someone a lot
of grief in the future, not to mention preventing threads like this
from appearing. Again, it's not really your product that's the issue,
it's these machines. Just a thought.

[BC_Gambit]

I am hoping someone on this thread can answer this, but can you freeze
spray Stern's screen printed cabinets to get these protectors off? I
can't see using Goo Gone en masse on my screen printed cabinets, and if
these are stuck on then you are left with heat?

I have some of these button wear protectors installed, just curious on
the best way to get them off and apply fresh ones.

Thank you!


--
BC_Gambit

[bjones]

yenningComity;1877770 Wrote:
> Sorry, but -1 to the op. First rule of mylar removal is to not just pull
> it off. Steal Protectors might not be MYLAR as far as brand goes, but
> the idea is slightly modified. Coming on here and whining because you
> did something stupid probably shows that you got what was coming to you.
> Had you done the freeze spray method, goo gone, or even heat we wouldn't
> be having this discussion.

And please, fill us in how you know what you just said to be such a
matter of fact. Please.


--
bjones

[yenningComity]

I don't know... common sense perhaps? How about not continuing to pull
the protector off when you have inserts coming up with it? Lastly, if I
do such a bonehead move I don't come on here and whine about it. I fix
my mistake and move on. Instead the OP screwed up what looked to be a
nice pf. Doesn't have any intention of fixing his mistake and comes on
here to blame someone else for his actions.


--
yenningComity

[cody chunn]

Huh? I thought the whole point of the stealth product was light tackiness so
it could easily be pulled off and moved around? That tells me it shouldn't
need any special treatment during removal.

-cody


"yenningComity" wrote in message
news:yenningCom...@rrgparchive.com...

[bjones]

yenningComity;1877797 Wrote:
> I don't know... common sense perhaps? How about not continuing to pull
> the protector off when you have inserts coming up with it? Lastly, if I
> do such a bonehead move I don't come on here and whine about it. I fix
> my mistake and move on. Instead the OP screwed up what looked to be a
> nice pf. Doesn't have any intention of fixing his mistake and comes on
> here to blame someone else for his actions.

The whole point of the product is that it doesn't remove artwork and is
removable, it isn't mylar and isn't supposed to remove artwork. Common
sense is just a cool word for you want to sound smart but have no idea
what you're talking about, but that's ok. We needed a new and improved
frank anyway :)


--
bjones

[Jesse Wilson]

cody chunn wrote:
> Huh? I thought the whole point of the stealth product was light
> tackiness so it could easily be pulled off and moved around? That tells
> me it shouldn't need any special treatment during removal.
>
> -cody
>

Unless the artwork is extra fragile or somehow not bonded 100% yea
that's pretty much how it works. It is probably the lightest adhesive
that would still actually stand up to the abuse of being on a PF. So
either use it with all due caution as you would anything or take the
chance of the damage you were trying to prevent.


Jesse

[Revo76]

Seems my post on google did not get through once again......why..why....

Well, here is one more problem to add when it comes to the removal of
the stealth protectors.
I had to remove them from an Iron Man from Stern, this is what it looks
like when you have removed it and no it is not glue residue what your
seeing, that has been removed.
http://tinyurl.com/7o3aeku
The glue has done something to the artwork of the cabinet.
When it is removed you have a very clear area of where the protector
used to be.
Wasn't it supposed to protect the cabinet so that when you remove it
that your cabinet would look like new !!!
Well, it doesn't, it destroys the artwork.

When i tried the freeze spray method on an Avatar, it even took of the
artwork from the cabinet, the vinyl was impossible to get off when it
was frozen, it just gripped tighter to the cabinet instead of separate
the glue and the vinyl and started to break in pieces while pulling it
off.
An Avatar LE which looked like new is now a crappy piece of machine
which no one will want to have. except for a ridiculous low price.

When i did the third machine, it was an indiana jones from williams, it
took off the black paint from the decal while i pulled the protector
off.

These things do more harm to it then preserving what we love.
Anything with black watch out, this stuff works like bleach.


--
Revo76

[Frank Furhter]

Revo76 wrote:
> Well, i also have a nice experience for you all about the stealth
> protectors.
> Try to remove the stealth protector from an Iron Man cabinet from
> Stern.
> This then is what is left of your cabinet :
> https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/rbS0H0OtbvGSDfi28iJxJNARDTba5kmGkEWkiB897fQ?feat=directlink
>
> I removed the protector, removed the glue and this is what was left of
> the cabinet.
> It was hard to remove the protector and on another machine i was going
> the freeze method to see if it would be better in the end.
> The protector just was impossible to get off anymore and shredded in
> small pieces and even took a piece of the cabinets artwork off.
> So if you put these on you better let them there or you will ruin your
> cabinet by taking them off.
> Best is not to use them at all in the end......
>
> It is easier to remove normal mylar then this stuff.
> This just destroys whatever it was put against.
> Chemically these are a dissaster.
> With a williams Indiana Jones it even took the black artwork right off
> the cabinet.
> It was going to be redone anyway, but still, it should not destroy
> cabinet art like that.
> So everyone be warned when you think or when you use these on your
> cabinet, put it there forever or not use them at all.

My question here is, did you wax/buff before application?

[Revo76]

On Feb 11, 5:04 am, Frank Furhter <fr...@furhter.com> wrote:
> Revo76 wrote:
> > Well, i also have a nice experience for you all about the stealth
> > protectors.
> > Try to remove the stealth protector from an Iron Man cabinet from
> > Stern.
> > This then is what is left of your cabinet :

> >https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/rbS0H0OtbvGSDfi28iJxJNARDTba5km...

>
> > I removed the protector, removed the glue and this is what was left of
> > the cabinet.
> > It was hard to remove the protector and on another machine i was going
> > the freeze method to see if it would be better in the end.
> > The protector just was impossible to get off anymore and shredded in
> > small pieces and even took a piece of the cabinets artwork off.
> > So if you put these on you better let them there or you will ruin your
> > cabinet by taking them off.
> > Best is not to use them at all in the end......
>
> > It is easier to remove normal mylar then this stuff.
> > This just destroys whatever it was put against.
> > Chemically these are a dissaster.
> > With a williams Indiana Jones it even took the black artwork right off
> > the cabinet.
> > It was going to be redone anyway, but still, it should not destroy
> > cabinet art like that.
> > So everyone be warned when you think or when you use these on your
> > cabinet, put it there forever or not use them at all.
>
> My question here is, did you wax/buff before application?

No Frank, it was not waxed or buffed before application because when
the client bought and applied it, there was no text on the site about
buffing or waxing the cabinet before application.
Even just browsed the site myself and it says nothing about waxing or
buffing the cabinet before application of the flipper protectors.

[Taylorva]

Sorry to see your wear but that is more indicative of Sterns crappy cab
art than the stealth protectors.


--
Taylorva

[ScottinSGFNY]

He did mention that it did the same to a Williams IJ also, so are you
sure?

ScottinSGFNY

[Taylorva]

He mentioned it was a decal so I was assuming it was not the original
cab art.

I had a HUO LOTR that had felt under the legs from day one. The felt
rubbed off artwork from the cab, really should not have done it IMO.

[James Lewis]

We are not the best of friends but I'm sorry that happened to your game.
Regardless of why or how it happened it bloody sucks. I think Ill go
show my NGG some love now. I think its one of the better games out
there especially for the money.

James


--
James Lewis

[NM]

Bump in case people missed the troubling information in the post above.

Can Pinball Pal please chime in here with a response?


--
NM

Current: AFM, CFTBL, FGY, MB, NGG, SS, STTNG, TAF, ToM, TRON LE, TSPP,
TZ, WH2O, '54 Gottlieb Stage Coach.

[Revo76]

For those who think it just leaves marks on Sterns because of bad
quality cabinets, then read my initial post again, and then also take
a look at the following new pictures.
https://picasaweb.google.com/103307705832051363491/IronManStealthProtectorRemoval?authuser=0&authkey=Gv1sRgCI3M_8PjxaT9vgE&feat=directlink
You can see a Safecracker with original artwork that the glue works
like bleach and leaves a similar marks as on the Iron Man.
It even tore off black paint from the original cabinet art of the
world cup soccer when it was being removed.
The safecracker had these protectors on it for about 3 to 4
months.....and now it is basically destroyed.
You do not want to know how horrible the owner of these machines
feels.
Buying only very nice machines which look like new, even several new
in the box.
Then applying these protectors to protect them, but instead slowly
destroying them in the meantime......

Makes me wonder what pinball pal's policies are in these situations.
I wonder what components are in the glue that they use.

[Frank Furhter]

Bleech :) Its a pinballski palski eastern block conspiracy for sure.

[Revo76]

On Feb 11, 11:09 pm, Frank Furhter <fr...@furhter.com> wrote:
> Revo76 wrote:
> > For those who think it just leaves marks on Sterns because of bad
> > quality cabinets, then read my initial post again, and then also take
> > a look at the following new pictures.

> >https://picasaweb.google.com/103307705832051363491/IronManStealthProt...

> > You can see a Safecracker with original artwork that the glue works
> > like bleach and leaves a similar marks as on the Iron Man.
> > It even tore off black paint from the original cabinet art of the
> > world cup soccer when it was being removed.
> > The safecracker had these protectors on it for about 3 to 4
> > months.....and now it is basically destroyed.
> > You do not want to know how horrible the owner of these machines
> > feels.
> > Buying only very nice machines which look like new, even several new
> > in the box.
> > Then applying these protectors to protect them, but instead slowly
> > destroying them in the meantime......
>
> > Makes me wonder what pinball pal's policies are in these situations.
> > I wonder what components are in the glue that they use.
>
> Bleech :)  Its a pinballski palski eastern block conspiracy for sure.

Trust me, no polish or russians to be found here.
Strange that the spell checker did not show it as an error.
I know that the word i should have typed should been "Bleach".

[Jesse Wilson]

And they were taken off because......?


Jesse

[JimB]

On Feb 11, 11:24 am, NM <rp272...@Yahoo.com> wrote:

> Revo76;1882220 Wrote:
>

> Bump in case people missed the troubling information in the post above.
>
> Can Pinball Pal please chime in here with a response?
>

I have some I never used yet.... any chance that we can send it back
for a credit or refund?

[hugh]

JimB;1882895 Wrote:

> On Feb 11, 11:24*am, NM <rp272... (AT) Yahoo (DOT) com> wrote:
> > Revo76;1882220 Wrote:
> >
>
> > Bump in case people missed the troubling information in the post
> above.
> >
> > Can Pinball Pal please chime in here with a response?
> >
>
> I have some I never used yet.... any chance that we can send it back
> for a credit or refund?

Just curious, why in the world are you asking here?

Hugh


--
hugh

[Frank Furhter]

Not after this thread :) Not a chance in hell. The product has been
'proven' to destroy graphics and they likely don't want to give money
back to someone that bought. Just toss them away, and never do business
with them again?

[Revo76]

Makes me wonder what the value is of a HUO Iron Man with 30 plays on
it, but with flipper protector damage on the cabinet.
Anybody got an idea ?

[turbo20lbs]

Revo,

How many machines were you going to remove the protectors from before
realizing it's not such a good idea? lol Or is there more to the
story here?

Dave

[Revo76]

Hi Dave,
They were going to be removed from all the machines since they tore of
paint from an indiana jones to begin with.
The client did not want them on his machines anymore since he had seen
what they did to his machines in the end
Instead of protecting them it starts to ruin them without noticing it
in the beginning, until you look closer.
On Sterns it works like bleach, but on the indiana jones the colors
were darker then the rest of the decal but peels off the black.
While the indiana jones had not been exposed to light since it is a
closed environment where it was standing.
But they also did leave a mark on each machine, you can still see
where they had been put on the machine.
They all have been removed and it were about 35 machines in total.
Some came out ok, some were damaged, but technically they all left a
mark.