Spokes
mark
Is there a significant difference between Wheelsmith and DT spokes? Is
there another high quality stainless steel spoke maker around that I
should look at? Looking to build a sturdy wheel with 3x, butted spokes
on a Velocity Cliffhanger (26") rim.
TIA to all.
mark
Tosspot
Current flavour of the month is the SpoCalc rework
http://vocabforbreakfast.railsplayground.net/edd/
Seems to be meeting with approval.
ngri...@aol.com
Dear Mark,
You might consider Sapim spokes. Never had a problem with them and
less expensive than Wheelsmith and DT. I have been getting mine from
this place:
http://www.thorusa.com/product10.htm
Best wishes,
Nigel Grinter
Well-Spoken Wheels Inc.
www.wellspokenwheels.com
Qui si parla Campagnolo
Sapim is another good spoke altho not as common in the US.
DT is what we build with, about 400 wheels per year. Wheelsmith a
distant third, IMHO.
Qui si parla Campagnolo
Even lengths only, the problem with the US distributor, KHS, as well.
If I calculate 295, I really want to use 295 even tho I know the
'evens' 'may' work but............
Tom Sherman
Any comment on this: <http://www.peterwhitecycles.com/DTspokes.htm>?
--
Tom Sherman - 42.435731,-83.985007
If you are not a part of the solution, you are a part of the
precipitate. - Anon?
Hank
I get Sapims from Dave Ornee, who occasionally posts here.
Search ebay for "Sapim" and you'll find his wares.
dre...@gmail.com
I buy Sapim spokes @ BikeToolsEtc, who have given me excellent service
over the years.
40-14DB X 298mm spokes come to $25 plus $2.80 for silver brass nipples
comes to $27.80 Plus ~ $8 for shipping. That's not bad for retail.
Personally I prefer Sapim over DT and Wheel Smith.
Good luck
landotter
> On Nov 29, 1:44 pm, mark <markfel...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Can someone recommend a good on-line spoke length calculator?
>
> > Is there a significant difference between Wheelsmith and DT spokes? Is
> > there another high quality stainless steel spoke maker around that I
> > should look at? Looking to build a sturdy wheel with 3x, butted spokes
> > on a Velocity Cliffhanger (26") rim.
>
> > TIA to all.
>
> > mark
>
> Dear Mark,
>
> You might consider Sapim spokes. Never had a problem with them and
> less expensive than Wheelsmith and DT. I have been getting mine from
> this place:http://www.thorusa.com/product10.htm
>
I fourth the suggestion of Sapims. I've done many miles of stupiddery,
commuting, and carrying of obscene things in sun and arctic conditions
on a couple sets of Sapim equipped wheels that never needed more than
a 1/4 turn of the wrench if that. They build a strong good wheel.
Better and cheaper.
Chalo
>
> Nigel Grinter wrote:
> >
> > You might consider Sapim spokes. Never had a problem with them and
> > less expensive than Wheelsmith and DT. I have been getting mine from
> > this place:http://www.thorusa.com/product10.htm
>
>
> If I calculate 295, I really want to use 295 even tho I know the
> 'evens' 'may' work but............
Danscomp.com, the BMX mail-order house, offers straight and butted
Sapim spokes. All their spokes are cut to length, so you need not be
a BMXer to make use of their offerings.
I have spoked everything from 16" gearhub-equipped wheels to 29er
wheels with Sapim spokes from Danscomp.com. I often check in at my
neighborhood bike shop before doing so, but I rarely find spokes of
the correct length there for the oddball wheels I build.
Sapim spokes have proven themselves to be as reliable as DT, just
slightly less shiny. I prefer Sapim to Wheelsmith because they do not
have an abrupt step at the butt.
Chalo
Ben C
> Qui si parla Campagnolo aka Peter Chisholm wrote:
>> On Nov 29, 12:44 pm, mark <markfel...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Can someone recommend a good on-line spoke length calculator?
>>>
>>> Is there a significant difference between Wheelsmith and DT spokes? Is
>>> there another high quality stainless steel spoke maker around that I
>>> should look at? Looking to build a sturdy wheel with 3x, butted spokes
>>> on a Velocity Cliffhanger (26") rim.
>>>
>>> TIA to all.
>>>
>>> mark
>>
>> Sapim is another good spoke altho not as common in the US.
>>
>> DT is what we build with, about 400 wheels per year. Wheelsmith a
>> distant third, IMHO.
>
> Any comment on this: <http://www.peterwhitecycles.com/DTspokes.htm>?
This has been posted before, but I can't remember the whole story. I
think they shortened the elbows again. I've used DT spokes within the
last couple of years on Campag and Shimano hubs and they fitted just
fine. Elbows were not too long.
I've not had the heads popping off either. Interesting failure, but he
does say it's rare and not to make a big deal out of it.
Qui si parla Campagnolo
wrote:
Old news and I have never seen any problem with the 'old' or 'new' DT
spokes. Longer elbows are not a problem of we would have seen some
evidence of it by now(about 3200 wheels built sine the dreaded
'change').
Since about 1985 I have been using DT almost exclusively and after
perhaps, I donno, thousands of wheels, I just don't see problems.
I like Sapim but as I mentioned, don't ike their lack of all lengths
in the US.
I have seen way to many Wheelsmith spokes 'give up'. When truing a
wheel have the spoke lose it's strength and just stretch. I'm sure
there isa name for this but turning the nipple to tighten causes the
rim to move the other direction the poke s just failing.
BTW-I guarantee my wheels for the useful life of the rim, meaning I
take care of it for free for the life of the rim. Most decent
wheelbuilders do this. What I also do is design a wheel specific for
the job and rider. I don't do 'dum' builds, that I know will not be
reliable. We see may locally built wheels with 'light rims, too thin
spokes, low spoke count', for a heavy rider-3 strikes and you are out.
I don't intentionally build boat anchors but certain builds I will not
do.
Qui si parla Campagnolo
Good old Dave. Still calls his extensive wheelbuilding business a
'hobby', with the expected low prices, low overhead of his garage
operation.
Tom Sherman
> On Nov 29, 4:42 pm, Tom Sherman <sunsetss0003REMOVET...@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
>> Qui si parla Campagnolo aka Peter Chisholm wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>> On Nov 29, 12:44 pm, mark <markfel...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> Can someone recommend a good on-line spoke length calculator?
>>>> Is there a significant difference between Wheelsmith and DT spokes? Is
>>>> there another high quality stainless steel spoke maker around that I
>>>> should look at? Looking to build a sturdy wheel with 3x, butted spokes
>>>> on a Velocity Cliffhanger (26") rim.
>>>> TIA to all.
>>>> mark
>>> Sapim is another good spoke altho not as common in the US.
>>> DT is what we build with, about 400 wheels per year. Wheelsmith a
>>> distant third, IMHO.
>> Any comment on this: <http://www.peterwhitecycles.com/DTspokes.htm>?
>>
>
> Old news and I have never seen any problem with the 'old' or 'new' DT
> spokes. Longer elbows are not a problem of we would have seen some
> evidence of it by now(about 3200 wheels built sine the dreaded
> 'change').
>
> Since about 1985 I have been using DT almost exclusively and after
> perhaps, I donno, thousands of wheels, I just don't see problems.
>
> I like Sapim but as I mentioned, don't ike their lack of all lengths
> in the US.
>
> I have seen way to many Wheelsmith spokes 'give up'. When truing a
> wheel have the spoke lose it's strength and just stretch. I'm sure
> there isa name for this but turning the nipple to tighten causes the
Were the Wheelsmith spokes in question the old ground ones made in Big
Timber Montana, or the post 2006 spokes made with the former Asahi
equipment in the big warehouse building in Milwaukee with the generic
"Sun Components" sign by the gate?
A Muzi
>>> Can someone recommend a good on-line spoke length calculator?
>>> Is there a significant difference between Wheelsmith and DT spokes? Is
>>> there another high quality stainless steel spoke maker around that I
>>> should look at? Looking to build a sturdy wheel with 3x, butted spokes
>>> on a Velocity Cliffhanger (26") rim.
> Qui si parla Campagnolo aka Peter Chisholm wrote:
>> Sapim is another good spoke altho not as common in the US.
>> DT is what we build with, about 400 wheels per year. Wheelsmith a
>> distant third, IMHO.
Tom Sherman wrote:
> Any comment on this: <http://www.peterwhitecycles.com/DTspokes.htm>?
Nice page. We do not ship to Nigeria either
--
Andrew Muzi
<www.yellowjersey.org/>
Open every day since 1 April, 1971
** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **
mark
question to see what the rest of the cycling world had to say. Peter
White has been known to post things on his website and forget about them
for long periods of time, which dovetails nicely with Mr. Chisholm's
"old news" comment.
mark
mark
Again, many thanks to all who posted. Looks like a coin toss between
Sapim and DT, and I will add the updated spocalc website to the
calculators I found.
Qui si parla Campagnolo
Pretty hard to tell since the wheel came to us for service..we often
don't know the history of it. We have never built with WS spokes never
will.
Tom Sherman
> don't know the history of it. We have never built with WS spokes never
> will.
Pretty closed-minded attitude, since with different production methods
the post 2006 Wheelsmith spokes likely behave differently than the
earlier ones.
Besides, what other spokes besides Wheelsmith are made by USians?
--
Tom Sherman - 42.435731,-83.985007
LOCAL CACTUS EATS CYCLIST - datakoll
jim beam
RS
c52e89...@f13g2000yqj.googlegroups.com>, chalo....@gmail.com
says...
not find appealing. Sapim or DT are both good. Despite Peter White's
article I would place Wheelsmith spokes a 3rd at best.
Qui si parla Campagnolo
Tom Sherman
> On Dec 1, 9:56 pm, Tom Sherman <sunsetss0003REMOVET...@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
>> Qui si parla Campagnolo aka Peter Chisholm wrote:
>>> Pretty hard to tell since the wheel came to us for service..we often
>>> don't know the history of it. We have never built with WS spokes never
>>> will.
>> Pretty closed-minded attitude, since with different production methods
>> the post 2006 Wheelsmith spokes likely behave differently than the
>> earlier ones.
>
> ????
If the newer spokes are made by different people, with different
equipment and methods in a different facility under different ownership
and with likely a different base wire, it would be unreasonable to
consider them equivalent to the older spokes.
Qui si parla Campagnolo
Pass. DT and if I could get Sapim in all lengths, I would use those.
I'm not going to risk a customer's wheel with a potentially crappy set
of spokes. DT are great spokes, plentiful, in all lengths, w/i 2 days
of me shipping, are a great price....ETC..Why use a spoke that in the
past has shown to be a POS??
John Dacey
>I have seen way to many Wheelsmith spokes 'give up'. When truing a
>wheel have the spoke lose it's strength and just stretch. I'm sure
>there isa name for this but turning the nipple to tighten causes the
>rim to move the other direction the poke s just failing.
Count me as being among those who switched the majority of my spoke
inventory from DT to Wheelsmith when DT amended the elbow shape.
I share neither your experience nor opinion of Wheelsmith spokes.
-------------------------------
John Dacey
Business Cycles, Miami, Florida
Since 1983 (25 Years!)
Comprehensive catalogue of track equipment: online since 1996
http://www.businesscycles.com
-------------------------------
Tom Sherman
> On Dec 2, 10:29 pm, Tom Sherman <sunsetss0003REMOVET...@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
>> Qui si parla Campagnolo aka Peter Chisholm wrote:
>>
>>> On Dec 1, 9:56 pm, Tom Sherman <sunsetss0003REMOVET...@yahoo.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>> Qui si parla Campagnolo aka Peter Chisholm wrote:
>>>> [...]
>>>>> Pretty hard to tell since the wheel came to us for service..we often
>>>>> don't know the history of it. We have never built with WS spokes never
>>>>> will.
>>>> Pretty closed-minded attitude, since with different production methods
>>>> the post 2006 Wheelsmith spokes likely behave differently than the
>>>> earlier ones.
>>> ????
>> If the newer spokes are made by different people, with different
>> equipment and methods in a different facility under different ownership
>> and with likely a different base wire, it would be unreasonable to
>> consider them equivalent to the older spokes.
>>
>
> Pass. DT and if I could get Sapim in all lengths, I would use those.
>
> I'm not going to risk a customer's wheel with a potentially crappy set
> of spokes. DT are great spokes, plentiful, in all lengths, w/i 2 days
> of me shipping, are a great price....ETC..Why use a spoke that in the
> past has shown to be a POS??
Why substitute IRRELEVANT past experience for learning the current
situation? Furthermore, why spread outdated information on Usenet? [1]
[1] Cripes, I am starting to read like "beam" here. ;)
Tom Sherman
> "Quid lucrum istic mihi est?" - J. Dortmunder
> On Sun, 30 Nov 2008 05:27:24 -0800 (PST), Qui si parla Campagnolo
> <pe...@vecchios.com> wrote:
>
>> I have seen way to many Wheelsmith spokes 'give up'. When truing a
>> wheel have the spoke lose it's strength and just stretch. I'm sure
>> there isa name for this but turning the nipple to tighten causes the
>> rim to move the other direction the poke s just failing.
>
> Count me as being among those who switched the majority of my spoke
> inventory from DT to Wheelsmith when DT amended the elbow shape.
>
> I share neither your experience nor opinion of Wheelsmith spokes.
>
spokes and newer "Milwaukee" Wheelsmith spokes?
--
Tom Sherman - 42.435731,-83.985007
Tom Sherman
>>> mark <markfel...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> Can someone recommend a good on-line spoke length calculator?
>>>> Is there a significant difference between Wheelsmith and DT spokes? Is
>>>> there another high quality stainless steel spoke maker around that I
>>>> should look at? Looking to build a sturdy wheel with 3x, butted spokes
>>>> on a Velocity Cliffhanger (26") rim.
>
>> Qui si parla Campagnolo aka Peter Chisholm wrote:
>>> Sapim is another good spoke altho not as common in the US.
>>> DT is what we build with, about 400 wheels per year. Wheelsmith a
>>> distant third, IMHO.
>
> Tom Sherman wrote:
>> Any comment on this: <http://www.peterwhitecycles.com/DTspokes.htm>?
>
>
> Nice page. We do not ship to Nigeria either
Any opinion on spokes?
--
Tom Sherman - 42.435731,-83.985007
jim beam
not until you get religion about spoke tension specs.
Qui si parla Campagnolo
Ain't it great to be in America, choice and all???
John Dacey
<sunset...@REMOVETHISyahoo.com> wrote:
>John Dacey wrote:
>> "Quid lucrum istic mihi est?" - J. Dortmunder
>> On Sun, 30 Nov 2008 05:27:24 -0800 (PST), Qui si parla Campagnolo
>> <pe...@vecchios.com> wrote:
>>
>>> I have seen way to many Wheelsmith spokes 'give up'. When truing a
<snip>
>> Count me as being among those who switched the majority of my spoke
>> inventory from DT to Wheelsmith when DT amended the elbow shape.
>>
>> I share neither your experience nor opinion of Wheelsmith spokes.
>>
>Have you noticed any difference between older "Montana" Wheelsmith
>spokes and newer "Milwaukee" Wheelsmith spokes?
None of the Wheelsimth spokes I've received recently appear different
in any way I can identify from spokes I've received in prior years.
Carl Sundquist
"Qui si parla Campagnolo" <pe...@vecchios.com> wrote in message
news:c7948976-f9f4-4b0c...@a26g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
-----------------
What if you want a Catlike helmet?
Qui si parla Campagnolo
I'm outta this one as well......
Tom Sherman
To paraphrase John Paul Jones, "I have not yet begun to argue".
Peter knows a lot about wrenching bicycles, but he is deficient in the
deceased equine flagellation department. ;)