World Trade Center attack.
ME Incorporated
A first plane hit the World Trade Center in New York. Type unknown. That
was about 9:05 Eastern Time, Tuesday September 11, 2001. A second plane was
then aimed at the second tower, a 737. It is on tape. It also crashed.
Both towers are aflame, gaping holes, about 1/5th the way from the top.
It is horrendous. I am stunned. I can barely type. All the people in the
towers, on the ground, and pehaps as is being reported at this time, the
reportedly hijacked airplane(s).
I am shaking. I am so ashamed of my human ancestry that there is the
ability to act in this manner. I am actually nauseous. They ran tape of
the second plane running into the WTC and I just about fainted.
Please pray for the lost people in this tragedy, for the hurt, the injured,
the dead. Pray that this heinous act is the last one, for all the world.
Pray that we can learn from this, punish those who are reponsible, and then
heal this fragile, single place we all live on.
Something like this really does put perspective on our little problems in
life. Please take the time to give thanks for your life, and take nothing
more for granted.
I know that cross posting is not usually allowed, but I'm barely functioning
and I can't keep posting. Thank you for your understanding, I just wanted
to say something.
Stephen Harding
>
> Oh my God. What else is there to say?
It's time to kill Bin Laden, and any other terrorist leader that
comes to US attention.
This is no longer a question of criminal action. It is war, and
you don't need to get warrants or have trials against enemy soldiers.
The Israelis, I'm sorry to say, have been right all along!
How many people died at Pearl Harbor in 1941? 4,000 or so?
How many people do you suppose were killed in these attacks?
I think war is a good way to describe it.
SMH
machf (a.k.a. JTKirk)
>Oh my God. What else is there to say?
>
<snip>
Yes, it is horrible. And on a much bigger scale than anything similar
ever happening here... Oh my God.
--
__________ ____---____ Marco Antonio Checa Funcke
\_________D /-/---_----' Santiago de Surco, Lima, Perú
_H__/_/ http://members.nbci.com/machf
'-_____|( http://www.GeoCities.com/Hollywood/2645
remove the "no_me_j." in front of the address when replying
---< This article was posted through www.newzpig.com >---
LieutenantCordell
buildings. We can't get any inforation right now and I'm so scarred and
worried about them.
Why is this happening?
Cordell
"ME Incorporated" <why...@boddah.me> wrote in message
news:9jon7.731$mq2.12...@newssvr12.news.prodigy.com...
Mr. Toad
"ME Incorporated" <why...@boddah.me> wrote:
> Please pray for the lost people in this tragedy, for the hurt, the
injured,
> the dead. Pray that this heinous act is the last one, for all the world.
> Pray that we can learn from this, punish those who are reponsible, and
then
> heal this fragile, single place we all live on.
There is nothing to learn from this, except for the importance of vigilance
in peace, and swift justice. The people who perpetrated this atrocity are,
like the pirates of old, the common enemy of all mankind. They must be
identified, and then killed in war or brought to justice. IMHO, today's
events are "Pearl Harbor" for a worldwide war on terrorism.
LieutenantCordell
"machf (a.k.a. JTKirk)" <no_me_j....@geocities.com> wrote in message
news:7f9spt8pr6u3gllfi...@4ax.com...
> On Tue, 11 Sep 2001 13:27:33 GMT, "ME Incorporated" <why...@boddah.me>
wrote:
>
> >Oh my God. What else is there to say?
> >
> <snip>
>
> Yes, it is horrible. And on a much bigger scale than anything similar
> ever happening here... Oh my God.
I agree. I say declare war on the bastards and ask questions later. He's
been a problem for a long time and it's time that the United States Do
something about him.
Mr. Toad
"Stephen Harding" <har...@cs.umass.edu> wrote:
> The Israelis, I'm sorry to say, have been right all along!
I never thought otherwise. Certainly, I do not fault anyone who has called
for peace. But when you face an enemy who seeks only your destruction, peace
is not an option. Not until that enemy is destroyed, and more reasonable
human beings can come forward to talk peace.
>
> How many people died at Pearl Harbor in 1941? 4,000 or so?
>
> How many people do you suppose were killed in these attacks?
I think that with few exceptions, every American will have lost a friend or
loved one in today's events.
RossPilot
>comes to US attention.
>
>This is no longer a question of criminal action. It is war, and
>you don't need to get warrants or have trials against enemy soldiers.
>
>The Israelis, I'm sorry to say, have been right all along!
>
>How many people died at Pearl Harbor in 1941? 4,000 or so?
>
>How many people do you suppose were killed in these attacks?
>
>I think war is a good way to describe it.
>
>
Of course it is war. But against whom? That's the problem . . . we don't know
where Bin Laden is or he'd already be dead. There's a five million dollar
reward for him. I mean, we could carpet-bomb Afghanistan, Iraq, Iran, and
Libya . . . but he'd be hiding out in the Sudan.
Mr. Toad
"LieutenantCordell" <mal...@home.com> wrote:
> Why is this happening?
It is happening because we are at war. Today's events are nothing compared
to the blitz of London, or the bombings of Hamburg, Dresden, Tokyo, etc. But
the purpose is the same--an attempt to crush civilian morale and bring
pressure on leaders to acede to the attackers' demands.
Mike Granby
> The Israelis, I'm sorry to say, have been right all along!
It takes a lot to get me to side with the Israelis, but I have to agree.
John S
ME Incorporated wrote:
> Oh my God. What else is there to say?
>
It's time to send the ICBMs to Kabul and blow it off the face of the earth.
Then take out Baghdad. Clinton was too much of a wimp. Bush may be too much of
a fool - let's hope not.
Mr. Toad
Like the OK City bombing, this could turn out to be _domestic_ terrorism.
acrophile
victims, as it becomes available. Toll free: 1-877-RED-CROSS.
"LieutenantCordell" <mal...@home.com> wrote in message
news:ILpn7.11346$P8.32...@news1.elmhst1.il.home.com...
Eugene Griessel
>There is nothing to learn from this, except for the importance of vigilance
>in peace, and swift justice. The people who perpetrated this atrocity are,
>like the pirates of old, the common enemy of all mankind. They must be
>identified, and then killed in war or brought to justice.
Justice? What justice does a rabid dog deserve?
Eugene L Griessel www.dynagen.co.za/eugene
Keith Willshaw
"John S" <john...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:3B9E2B3D...@hotmail.com...
How about we take the time to find out who
did it before launching any ICBM's
You'd look damm silly if you blew up Kabul and
it turned out to be down to a drug cartel
in Colombia
Keith
devil
>
> Here's an even scarier thought:
>
> Like the OK City bombing, this could turn out to be _domestic_ terrorism.
And even if not, it could *not be* the obvious culprits. Anti-US
emotions have been on the rise worldwide, and this thing could have been
done with almost any dedicated fringe group as far as they would be
willing to engage in suicide attack.
So many hijacks by the obvious potential culprits might not have been so
easy. Or else, security was truly down big time.
Steve Coleman
fertilizer and several coordinated hijackings of commercial flights.
This effort required a lot of resources and coordination. What domestic
outfit would accomplish such an effort?
"Mr. Toad" <sp...@nothanks.org> wrote in message
news:tpsasqr...@corp.supernews.com...
Mr. Toad
"Eugene Griessel" <eugene@.dynagen..co..za> wrote:
> "Mr. Toad" <sp...@nothanks.org> wrote:
>
> >There is nothing to learn from this, except for the importance of
vigilance
> >in peace, and swift justice. The people who perpetrated this atrocity
are,
> >like the pirates of old, the common enemy of all mankind. They must be
> >identified, and then killed in war or brought to justice.
>
> Justice? What justice does a rabid dog deserve?
A fair trial before he is found guilty and executed.
Yama
"Stephen Harding" <har...@cs.umass.edu> wrote in message
news:3B9E2514...@cs.umass.edu...
> ME Incorporated wrote:
> >
> > Oh my God. What else is there to say?
>
> It's time to kill Bin Laden, and any other terrorist leader that
> comes to US attention.
>
> This is no longer a question of criminal action. It is war, and
> you don't need to get warrants or have trials against enemy soldiers.
>
> The Israelis, I'm sorry to say, have been right all along!
Isn't it a bit early to declare "[xxxxxx] must be nuked!"?
We have no real idea who did this. I remember the Oklahoma bombing: everyone
was crying all the Arabs to be nailed. Then it turned it was done by
Americans. It was very good that some outspoken member of these NG's weren't
in charge of US foreign policy then.
Not that I have anything against hunting these people down and turning them
to smoking craters, but first you investigate, then you crucify.
Mr. Toad
Think about it: this attack was initiated through the coordinated hijacking
of airliners at US airports. Now, your typical suicide bomber working for
Osama Bin-Laden is _not_ going to be a forty-something white European male.
He is going to stand out in a crowd of Americans. He is going to match
airport security profiles.
On the other hand, three or four Timothy McVeighs might just be able to pull
this off.
C J Campbell
guilty as he is.
"RossPilot" <ross...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20010911110920...@mb-fi.aol.com...
C J Campbell
they are. They are all linked anyway. It ends now.
"Yama" <tj...@paju.oulu.fi> wrote in message
news:9nlaff$c4c$1...@ousrvr3.oulu.fi...
C J Campbell
>
> "LieutenantCordell" <mal...@home.com> wrote:
>
> > Why is this happening?
>
> It is happening because we are at war. Today's events are nothing compared
> to the blitz of London, or the bombings of Hamburg, Dresden, Tokyo, etc.
This may well be the worst aerial attack in history.
C J Campbell
"Keith Willshaw" <keith_w...@compuserve.com> wrote in message
news:1000221951.21673....@news.demon.co.uk...
Steve Coleman
Definitely the worst attack by unarmed aircraft.
"C J Campbell" <christopherc...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:qbqn7.585$QK.3...@news1.sttln1.wa.home.com...
Mr. Toad
> I think there's a big difference between one man with a truckload of
> fertilizer and several coordinated hijackings of commercial flights.
>
> This effort required a lot of resources and coordination. What domestic
> outfit would accomplish such an effort?
How about three angry forty-something white guys? Maybe they all worked as
baggage handlers. They know how to get a gun on board an aircraft. They each
take over the flight deck and order the pilot to fly to Kennedy or Dulles.
Then when the downtown area is in sight, they kill the flight crew and take
the controls.
Anyway, my bet is on domestic terrorists. I don't think we need to conjure
up scary, shadowy dark-skinned agents of death to explain this.
Tim Hogard
: ME Incorporated wrote:
: >
: > Oh my God. What else is there to say?
given up long before the collapse.
: It's time to kill Bin Laden, and any other terrorist leader that
: comes to US attention.
In case you haven't noticed, the US has been doing a damn fine job of
createing these monsters. Bin Laden built more hospitals in than Mother
Theresa. I'm not convinced he's a monster but just the current blame
child of the US govt propagand machine. Of course he knows enough
about engineering and planning to pull this off and does have some
major issues about the US killing children every day in Iraq because
the CIA's boy decided to take over more that he was allowed.
: This is no longer a question of criminal action. It is war, and
: you don't need to get warrants or have trials against enemy soldiers.
Wars are just large criminal acts. Where is the line?
: The Israelis, I'm sorry to say, have been right all along!
What, the British and the US gave land that belongs to other people to
Isereal. If someone kicked you off your land, what would you do? That
land has been fought for over a long time and the US has totally
ignored one side of the aruments until recently. The current leader of
Isreal should be tried for attempted genocide but thats not going to
happen.
: How many people died at Pearl Harbor in 1941? 4,000 or so?
It was well known about before it happended. The US was helping
lots of other countries in the Pascific before it happend. Australia
had already drawn up a retreat plan with US help.
: How many people do you suppose were killed in these attacks?
25,000+
Small compared to how many people in Afganastan that are going to die
in the rest of the year because of stupid games played in the past by
the CIA and the KGB. Its still about the number of children killed in
Iraq in three months because the US won't fix the puppet they put in
place to get even with Iran. There are other puppets that could pull
this off. General Clark is now saying they knew this would happen and
a new world order will keep it from happeing again. I can't belive
these jerks are already spin doctoring this for more funds and their
pet projects.
: I think war is a good way to describe it.
Its war that the US has been involved with much of the rest of the
world but you have chosen to ignore. It just the next stage of the
cold war.
Maybe America needs to fix its Karma. I think it has run out.
-tim
Kyler Laird
>It's time to kill Bin Laden, and any other terrorist leader that
>comes to US attention.
Yes, we must strike terror in the hearts of
terrorists. Oh, wait...that's probably what
*they* were thinking...
--kyler
Michael Khan
Yama wrote:
> Isn't it a bit early to declare "[xxxxxx] must be nuked!"?
Definitely.
There is no hurry, and acting precipitately may well make things worse.
This attack was well-coordinated and well organized. It must have left a
distinct trail that will be very easy to pick up. Pity that nobody acted
on it earlier, but with something of this magnitude, it is impossible
that they did not leave tons of incrtiminating evidence. The
perpetrators can, and will be found out, without the shadow of a doubt.
We will get them, and they will pay.
And there will be no nuking. These people may be in the business of
killing innocent people, women and children alike. We are not, and they
are not going to make us become like them, dragging us down to their
level.
They'll pay, and dearly. When we are good and ready.
What does it matter whether it takes a few days or even week to establsh
beyond doubt who is to be held reponsible? Where are they going to hide?
C J Campbell
killed by the collapse of the towers, etc. -- unfortunately all we can do is
wait for more information. This is a contest I would prefer not to win.
"Steve Coleman" <ni...@csolutions.net> wrote in message
news:3b9e20d8$1...@news.csolutions.net...
Mortimer Schnerd, RN
A first class trial followed by a first class hanging. I
suspect it is safe to assume that this is the act of
somebody of middle eastern extraction. I doubt very
seriously the IRA has declared war on the US.
God damn the guilty parties whoever they are. May they
roast in Hell as soon as they're caught and dispatched to
their greater reward. It'll be the will of God, no
doubt....
--
Mortimer Schnerd, RN
mo...@mortimerschnerd.com.nospam
http://www.mortimerschnerd.com
C J Campbell
fault here. People like you who are willing to excuse any kind of attack
because of past injustices are far more responsible.
"Tim Hogard" <tho...@not.abnormal.com> wrote in message
news:9nlbdg$l...@not.abnormal.com...
Yama
> Sorry. It is now time to turn against all terrorist groups, no matter who
> they are. They are all linked anyway. It ends now.
So, who is going to decide who are terrorists? Osama bin Laden is. Fine. How
about Hamas? Kurds? Tamili Tigers? Chechens? PLO? How are you going to draw
the line between terrorists and freedom fighters?
Getting justice is one thing, running amok in rush of bloodthirst will just
create more this kind of incidents.
Dylan Smith
<christopherc...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>> It is happening because we are at war. Today's events are nothing compared
>> to the blitz of London, or the bombings of Hamburg, Dresden, Tokyo, etc.
>
>This may well be the worst aerial attack in history.
Horrific though this is, I don't think it even comes close to comparing to
the Blitz, let alone Hirsohima or Nagasaki.
--
Dylan Smith, Houston, TX
Flying: http://www.dylansmith.net
Frontier Elite Universe: http://www.alioth.net
"Maintain thine airspeed, lest the ground come up and smite thee"
Mr. Toad
"Mortimer Schnerd, RN" <msch...@mortimerschnerd.com.nospam> wrote:
> A first class trial followed by a first class hanging. I
> suspect it is safe to assume that this is the act of
> somebody of middle eastern extraction.
I don't think it's safe to say that at all.
Mortimer Schnerd, RN
It remains to be seen. When all is said and done, I think
I'll be right. I don't advocate any reaction until such
time as we're sure though. When we know without a doubt,
then we make the bastards pay.
Jim Fisher
> createing these monsters. Bin Laden built more hospitals in than Mother
> Theresa. I'm not convinced he's a monster but just the current blame
> child of the US govt propagand machine.
Tim,
Screw you, asswipe.
Bin Laden himself has, quite publicly and quite proudly (and whether or not
he was involved in this tragedy), admitted to most terrorist acts attributed
to him.
--
Jim Fisher
North Alabama
Cherokee 180
C J Campbell
still say bin Laden needs to be taken out, and any country that harbors him
should be devastated.
"Yama" <tj...@paju.oulu.fi> wrote in message
news:9nlbtm$d0s$1...@ousrvr3.oulu.fi...
Billy Beck
Stephen Harding <har...@cs.umass.edu> wrote:
>How many people do you suppose were killed in these attacks?
Twenty thousand dead in New York will not surprise me.
Billy
VRWC Fronteer
http://www.mindspring.com/~wjb3/free/
andrew
Keith Willshaw
"Dylan Smith" <dy...@vexed.alioth.net> wrote in message
news:slrn9psdcb...@vexed.alioth.net...
> On Tue, 11 Sep 2001 15:35:50 GMT, C J Campbell
> <christopherc...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >> It is happening because we are at war. Today's events are nothing
compared
> >> to the blitz of London, or the bombings of Hamburg, Dresden, Tokyo,
etc.
> >
> >This may well be the worst aerial attack in history.
>
> Horrific though this is, I don't think it even comes close to comparing to
> the Blitz, let alone Hirsohima or Nagasaki.
>
Unfortunately it may easily exceed the number
killed in the blitz
The total number of British civilians killed by the end
of 1940 was about 15,000. The overall damage
was probably greater but most people were in shelters
Keith
Bill Forrester
Campbell wrote:
>Not really. It is time to do it anyway.
Yep, and start WW3, complete with spectacular thermonuclear firework
shows over at least 2 major continents. I suppose you don't mind
yourself and your family being fried in the crossfire....
Bill
Keith Willshaw
You are the first of what promises to be a large number
Keith
"andrew" <and...@no.mail> wrote in message news:3B9E3AD0...@no.mail...
C J Campbell
complete nonsense.
"Bill Forrester" <Bil...@mailandnews.com> wrote in message
news:3ba73cc6...@alfa.externet.net...
C.D.Damron
No apologies.
"andrew" <and...@no.mail> wrote in message news:3B9E3AD0...@no.mail...
C J Campbell
primary targets were military and military production, and the innocent
people were not the primary targets. They were killed, yes, but they were
not the primary targets.
The attacks today were a surprise attack on a nation at peace, against
innocent people who were the primary targets. We not only have the right to
defend ourselves, but the moral obligation to do so. Your suggestion that
the attacks on Hiroshima and New York are somehow morally equivalent is
morally bankrupt.
"andrew" <and...@no.mail> wrote in message news:3B9E3AD0...@no.mail...
Miguel Cruz
> comes to US attention.
Creating martyrs doesn't work when you're not dealing with established,
fixed-location and fixed-resource entities like nations. More fools will
take their place.
Remember the psychology involved in this stuff. Gullible people are
manipulated into believing they will receive reward beyond the scope of
logic in exchange for carrying out these acts.
miguel
--
Hit The Road! Photos and tales from around the world: http://travel.u.nu
Wdtabor
(RossPilot) writes:
>Of course it is war. But against whom? That's the problem . . . we don't
>know
>where Bin Laden is or he'd already be dead. There's a five million dollar
>reward for him. I mean, we could carpet-bomb Afghanistan, Iraq, Iran, and
>Libya . . . but he'd be hiding out in the Sudan.
>
>
So?
All of those countries shelter terrorists. In my view we are at war with all of
them. Any of them which does not immediately hand over any and all terrorists
residing within their borders should receive a full retaliatory response.
Don
Wm. Donald (Don) Tabor Jr., DDS
PP-ASEL
Chesapeake, VA - CPK
C J Campbell
And the moral obligation to do so. bin Laden has the support of established,
fixed-location nations as well, and it is time we recognized that we are in
a state of war with these nations and have been for some time. bin Laden,
and Arafat for that matter, are no more martyrs than Hitler was.
"Miguel Cruz" <sp...@un.u.nu> wrote in message
news:Ugrn7.1318$b7.2...@news.itd.umich.edu...
Dave Stadt
Keith Willshaw <keith_w...@compuserve.com> wrote in message
news:1000221951.21673....@news.demon.co.uk...
>
> "John S" <john...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:3B9E2B3D...@hotmail.com...
> >
> >
> > ME Incorporated wrote:
> >
> > > Oh my God. What else is there to say?
> > >
> >
> > It's time to send the ICBMs to Kabul and blow it off the face of the
> earth.
> > Then take out Baghdad. Clinton was too much of a wimp. Bush may be too
> much of
> > a fool - let's hope not.
> >
>
> How about we take the time to find out who
> did it before launching any ICBM's
>
> You'd look damm silly if you blew up Kabul and
> it turned out to be down to a drug cartel
> in Colombia
>
> Keith
Nope, just means we would get more practice launching another set.
>
>
John S
andrew wrote:
Absurd - you can't get rid of a terrorist surrounded by civilians without
taking out some of the civilians. Perhaps you would have surrendered to
Hitler in WW2, since by engaging in and winning the war, the US necessarily
killed millions of innocent civilians. I guess those innocent Asian and
Japanese civilians were less innocent than the middle eastern ones that will
die if we are able to take out Bin Ladin. How silly of me not to realize
that before.
RossPilot
death is what most clamor for. Death on the poor civilians just trying to feed
their families, death on the innocent women and children and elderly, death for
those completely univolved in policy or politics.
Yet that seems to be the one thing they aren't afraid of . . . the one thing
that makes them able to do these suicide missions.
How does one strike terror into the hearts of those so willing to give up their
lives?
Sheldon Cuff
victims and their families.
I am devastated by this.
My sadness is overwhelming. But ... my anger grows .
God Damn what is wrong with humanity.
"ME Incorporated" <why...@boddah.me> wrote in message
news:9jon7.731$mq2.12...@newssvr12.news.prodigy.com...
> Oh my God. What else is there to say?
>
> A first plane hit the World Trade Center in New York. Type unknown. That
> was about 9:05 Eastern Time, Tuesday September 11, 2001. A second plane
was
> then aimed at the second tower, a 737. It is on tape. It also crashed.
> Both towers are aflame, gaping holes, about 1/5th the way from the top.
>
> It is horrendous. I am stunned. I can barely type. All the people in
the
> towers, on the ground, and pehaps as is being reported at this time, the
> reportedly hijacked airplane(s).
>
> I am shaking. I am so ashamed of my human ancestry that there is the
> ability to act in this manner. I am actually nauseous. They ran tape of
> the second plane running into the WTC and I just about fainted.
>
> Please pray for the lost people in this tragedy, for the hurt, the
injured,
> the dead. Pray that this heinous act is the last one, for all the world.
> Pray that we can learn from this, punish those who are reponsible, and
then
> heal this fragile, single place we all live on.
>
> Something like this really does put perspective on our little problems in
> life. Please take the time to give thanks for your life, and take nothing
> more for granted.
>
> I know that cross posting is not usually allowed, but I'm barely
functioning
> and I can't keep posting. Thank you for your understanding, I just wanted
> to say something.
>
>
Dave Stadt
Miguel Cruz <sp...@un.u.nu> wrote in message
news:Ugrn7.1318$b7.2...@news.itd.umich.edu...
> Stephen Harding <har...@cs.umass.edu> wrote:
> >> Oh my God. What else is there to say?
> >
> > It's time to kill Bin Laden, and any other terrorist leader that
> > comes to US attention.
>
> Creating martyrs doesn't work when you're not dealing with established,
> fixed-location and fixed-resource entities like nations. More fools will
> take their place.
That's why you get rid of all the fools.
Miguel Cruz
> Oh my God. What else is there to say?
Were the hijackers pilots? How did they get commercial pilots to fly into
buildings? Or is it that easy to steer a plane?
Did they choose flights headed to California from the east coast because
they would have a lot of fuel?
Miguel Cruz
>>> comes to US attention.
>>
>> Creating martyrs doesn't work when you're not dealing with established,
>> fixed-location and fixed-resource entities like nations. More fools will
>> take their place.
>
> ourselves.
Of course. I just hope it's done effectively and sensibly, not emotionally
and in a way that makes things worse.
Brien K. Meehan
Yeah, ignore him. That'll teach him.
Mortimer Schnerd, RN
> ME Incorporated <why...@boddah.me> wrote:
> > Oh my God. What else is there to say?
>
> Were the hijackers pilots? How did they get commercial
pilots to fly into
> buildings? Or is it that easy to steer a plane?
It's that easy once the plane is in the air. I think any
low time pilot could do it.
C J Campbell
around blowing up buildings.
The targets in New York were innocent people. Our targets are terrorists.
Now maybe we can't get at the terrorists without hurting innocent people
that the terrorists are using as a shield to protect themselves. That is too
bad, but it does not change the fact that we have to defend ourselves. We
are not the moral equivalent of terrorists, no matter how try to paint us as
such. Your rationalizations are the same as the terrorists themselves would
use. You sound like the bad guy in movies -- you know where the bad guy says
"We aren't really so different, you know." Now it is my turn to say "I'm
sorry you think so."
"RossPilot" <ross...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20010911130006...@mb-fo.aol.com...
Richard C. Steiner
>"LieutenantCordell" <mal...@home.com> wrote:
>
>> Why is this happening?
>
>It is happening because we are at war. Today's events are nothing compared
>to the blitz of London, or the bombings of Hamburg, Dresden, Tokyo, etc. But
>the purpose is the same--an attempt to crush civilian morale and bring
>pressure on leaders to acede to the attackers' demands.
Whoever did this doesn't understand the American psyche very well if that
was the expectation. This will polarize the US government (and probably a
majority of the country) to take action, not cause folks to go hide in a
hole somewhere.
--
-Rich Steiner >>>---> http://www.visi.com/~rsteiner >>>---> Eden Prairie, MN
Written online using slrn 0.9.5.4!
The Theorem Theorem: If If, Then Then.
machf (a.k.a. JTKirk)
>
>
>andrew wrote:
>
>> Oh, you mean like Hiroshima, right?
>>
>> Michael Khan wrote:
>>
>> > These people may be in the business of killing innocent people, women and
>> children alike. We are not, and they are not going to make us become like
>> them, dragging us down to their level.
>
>Absurd - you can't get rid of a terrorist surrounded by civilians without
>taking out some of the civilians.
Well, here when there was the hostage situation at the Japanese Embassy, which
lasted several months, in the end they manage to do it with the loss of just one
hostage and one or two soldiers. So much for your theory.
--
__________ ____---____ Marco Antonio Checa Funcke
\_________D /-/---_----' Santiago de Surco, Lima, Perú
_H__/_/ http://members.nbci.com/machf
'-_____|( http://www.GeoCities.com/Hollywood/2645
remove the "no_me_j." in front of the address when replying
---< This article was posted through www.newzpig.com >---
machf (a.k.a. JTKirk)
>Stephen Harding (har...@cs.umass.edu) wrote:
>: ME Incorporated wrote:
>: >
>: > Oh my God. What else is there to say?
>I hope they got the buildings evacuated and the fire crews had
>given up long before the collapse.
>
Unfortunately, from what I've herad, ther were still policemen and
firemen inside trying to rescue people when the building collapsed...
Richard C. Steiner
>I think that with few exceptions, every American will have lost a friend or
>loved one in today's events.
I doubt that. Most people in the US have little interaction/relationship
with the east coast at all, much less with folks in a small area within
New York City.
However, I do suspect that many of us will know someone who knew someone
who was impacted.
Dave Stadt
machf (a.k.a. JTKirk) <no_me_j....@geocities.com> wrote in message
news:s7ispt0qag2judti7...@4ax.com...
> On Tue, 11 Sep 2001 09:57:30 -0700, John S <john...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> >
> >
> >andrew wrote:
> >
> >> Oh, you mean like Hiroshima, right?
> >>
> >> Michael Khan wrote:
> >>
> >> > These people may be in the business of killing innocent people, women
and
> >> children alike. We are not, and they are not going to make us become
like
> >> them, dragging us down to their level.
> >
> >Absurd - you can't get rid of a terrorist surrounded by civilians without
> >taking out some of the civilians.
>
> Well, here when there was the hostage situation at the Japanese Embassy,
which
> lasted several months, in the end they manage to do it with the loss of
just one
> hostage and one or two soldiers. So much for your theory.
This is far from a hostage situation involving a handfull of people. This
attack is
much worse than Pearl Harbor. To resolve that we notified the general
public then
used the best technology available. Let's hope history repeats itself..
Wdtabor
>So, who is going to decide who are terrorists? Osama bin Laden is. Fine. How
>about Hamas? Kurds? Tamili Tigers? Chechens? PLO? How are you going to draw
>the line between terrorists and freedom fighters?
>
The ones shooting at soldiers and militarized police are freedom fighters. The
ones shooting at civilians in peacetime are terrorists.
Wdtabor
Willshaw" <keith_w...@compuserve.com> writes:
>
>How about we take the time to find out who
>did it before launching any ICBM's
>
>You'd look damm silly if you blew up Kabul and
>it turned out to be down to a drug cartel
>in Colombia
>
Kabul is sheltering terrorists, that is reason enough to nuke them regardless
of which terrorist did this particular act. Elimination of terrorists and
giving them no safe harbor anywhere in the world should be our goal.
Wdtabor
<Michae...@t-online.de> writes:
>What does it matter whether it takes a few days or even week to establsh
>beyond doubt who is to be held reponsible? Where are they going to hide?
>
They will hide where they always hide. Behind the women and children of a
country like Afganistan which gives them shelter on the assumption that we will
not take out those women and children to get the terrorists.
So long as we let that strategy work, we are helpless to prevent these things.
This is WAR and there are no innocents in the enemy's country if they allow the
bad guys in their midst.
If we had taken the proper actions against Libya after PanAM103, or against
Afganistan after the first attempt at the WTO, this would not have happened.
RossPilot
use.>>
I'll let your insult slide in view of the larger picture today. But you have
missed the point entirely. I'll try again.
So we identify the terrorists. We go after them and find them. We bring them
to justice and ultimately do what? Kill them?
So? Obviously that doesn't bother them.
And, like roaches, you can exterminate the ones you can see, but for every one
you kill, there are 10,000 more hiding in the walls.
RossPilot
>with the east coast at all, much less with folks in a small area within
>New York City.
You are showing crass and monumental ignorance.
JerryK
country of the terrorists could be here.
"C J Campbell" <christopherc...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:e8qn7.578$QK.3...@news1.sttln1.wa.home.com...
> So carpet bomb them all. To hell with them. Anyone who harbors him is as
> guilty as he is.
>
> "RossPilot" <ross...@aol.com> wrote in message
> news:20010911110920...@mb-fi.aol.com...
Richard C. Steiner
>Michael Khan wrote:
>
>> These people may be in the business of
>> killing innocent people, women and children alike. We are not, and they
>> are not going to make us become like them, dragging us down to their
>> level.
>
>Oh, you mean like Hiroshima, right?
The nuke dropped on Hiroshima may have been kinder to its victims than the
kind of conventional carpet bombing which would have otherwise occurred in
a full-scale invasion of Japan. Or not. I've heard it both ways.
Personally, I think the entire war with Japan was a shame and a senseless
waste of human life. I wish it had never happened, but *WE* didn't start
it. The Empire of Japan declared war first on the United States.
Richard C. Steiner
>God Damn what is wrong with humanity.
I suspect that most of humanity is fine. It only takes a few extremists,
however, to make a terrible mess of things. :-(
Brian White
"Tim Hogard" <tho...@not.abnormal.com> wrote in message
news:9nlbdg$l...@not.abnormal.com...
> Stephen Harding (har...@cs.umass.edu) wrote:
> : ME Incorporated wrote:
> : >
> : > Oh my God. What else is there to say?
> I hope they got the buildings evacuated and the fire crews had
> given up long before the collapse.
200 Firefighters and approx 10,000 victims from the collapse. at 1:45.
Gattman
> > There's a five million dollar
> >reward for him.
Reuters is reporting from Londong that a reporter there says that Bin
Laden told him three weeks ago that he was going to do something like
this.
"Osama Bin Laden warned three weeks ago that he would attack American
interests in an unprecendented attack, a very big one," Atwan told
Reuters.
"We received several warnings like this. We did not take it so
seriously, preferring to see what would happen before reporting it."
Motherfuckers.
Five million dollars is an insult. The US needs to offer a multibillion
dollar reward, amnesty and citizenship for the person who brings in Bin
Laden and as many of his followers as possible, alive or dead, whether
he did it or not, to demonstrate just exactly what we think of
terrorism.
Five million is a joke. The government blows that much money out its
ass every day.
-gattman
C J Campbell
there are not 10,000 more hiding in the walls. And the people who shelter or
harbor these terrorists, who supply them with arms and money, who transport
them, who are their families and friends, these people are not so
fanatical -- they care about their lives, and their leaders care about
retaining their political power.
"RossPilot" <ross...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20010911133940...@mb-fi.aol.com...
Brian White
"Mortimer Schnerd, RN" <msch...@mortimerschnerd.com.nospam> wrote in
message news:qFrn7.341304$TM5.47...@typhoon.southeast.rr.com...
>
> "Miguel Cruz" <sp...@un.u.nu> wrote in message
> news:aBrn7.1319$b7.2...@news.itd.umich.edu...
> > ME Incorporated <why...@boddah.me> wrote:
> > > Oh my God. What else is there to say?
> >
> > Were the hijackers pilots? How did they get commercial
> pilots to fly into
> > buildings? Or is it that easy to steer a plane?
>
>
> It's that easy once the plane is in the air. I think any
> low time pilot could do it.
Its been reported that these extremist groups are now training their people
in piloting aircraft.
If they are hell bent on their goal, if a pilot says no to the deed, a
bullet will remove him from the chair and in he/she gets.
The shots of the second plane showed the plane WAS under control, and at
full throttle.
Miguel Cruz
> If they are hell bent on their goal, if a pilot says no to the deed, a
> bullet will remove him from the chair and in he/she gets.
Can the pilot dump fuel or otherwise commit the plane to a controlled
failure?
C J Campbell
declare war on the US because of diplomatic sanctions we had taken against
them -- Japan did not have to invade China. Japan did not have to rape
Nanking. Japan did not have to ally itself with Nazi Germany. Japan did not
have to threaten the Soviet Union. Japan did not have to declare war on and
attack US allies. Japan did not have to do any of the things that
precipitated our diplomatic sanctions. The Imperial Japanese government did
what it did, in full view of the world, without apology, with the almost
fanatical support of the general population, and Japan richly deserved
everything that happened to it during the war.
"Richard C. Steiner" <rste...@isis.visi.com> wrote in message
news:slrn9psjc2....@isis.visi.com...
C J Campbell
would call for its destruction.
"JerryK" <jer...@nospam.dotacrues.com> wrote in message
news:9nlift$s...@dispatch.concentric.net...
Wdtabor
(RossPilot) writes:
>How does one strike terror into the hearts of those so willing to give up
>their
>lives?
>
You don't. You kill them.
C J Campbell
"Miguel Cruz" <sp...@un.u.nu> wrote in message
news:fisn7.1324$b7.2...@news.itd.umich.edu...
Chris Ludwig
You'll see more Middle Easterners than anything else. If they're not
working at the airport, then thy're there to pick up some more relatives
from their home country.
Scary thought..... We let these people "clean" commercial airliners. They
are not being sent through metal detectors before entering the planes.
It has been said that if ever the "Ji-had" (Holy War) was declared on the
U.S., New York City would be without any cab drivers.
Anyone see the movie "The Siege" ???? Look familiar ?????
"Mr. Toad" <sp...@nothanks.org> wrote in message
news:tpsbji5...@corp.supernews.com...
>
> "devil" <de...@attglobal.net> wrote:
> > "Mr. Toad" wrote:
> > >
> > > Here's an even scarier thought:
> > >
> > > Like the OK City bombing, this could turn out to be _domestic_
> terrorism.
> >
> > And even if not, it could *not be* the obvious culprits. Anti-US
> > emotions have been on the rise worldwide, and this thing could have been
> > done with almost any dedicated fringe group as far as they would be
> > willing to engage in suicide attack.
> >
> > So many hijacks by the obvious potential culprits might not have been so
> > easy. Or else, security was truly down big time.
>
> Think about it: this attack was initiated through the coordinated
hijacking
> of airliners at US airports. Now, your typical suicide bomber working for
> Osama Bin-Laden is _not_ going to be a forty-something white European
male.
> He is going to stand out in a crowd of Americans. He is going to match
> airport security profiles.
>
> On the other hand, three or four Timothy McVeighs might just be able to
pull
> this off.
>
>
>
>
Dave Stadt
Richard C. Steiner <rste...@isis.visi.com> wrote in message
news:slrn9psjc2....@isis.visi.com...
> In article <3B9E3AD0...@no.mail>, andrew wrote:
>
> >Michael Khan wrote:
> >
> >> These people may be in the business of
> >> killing innocent people, women and children alike. We are not, and they
> >> are not going to make us become like them, dragging us down to their
> >> level.
> >
> >Oh, you mean like Hiroshima, right?
>
> The nuke dropped on Hiroshima may have been kinder to its victims than the
> kind of conventional carpet bombing which would have otherwise occurred in
> a full-scale invasion of Japan. Or not. I've heard it both ways.
Who the heck cares which would have been "kinder" to the Japanese. The only
thing that mattered was which was kinder to the allies.
> Personally, I think the entire war with Japan was a shame and a senseless
> waste of human life. I wish it had never happened, but *WE* didn't start
> it. The Empire of Japan declared war first on the United States.
Ah no, they just decided to bomb Pearl. They declared nothing.
C.D.Damron
landmark.
I would guess that just about any light plane pilot would have a good chance
of success once the plane was off the ground.
"Miguel Cruz" <sp...@un.u.nu> wrote in message
news:aBrn7.1319$b7.2...@news.itd.umich.edu...
> ME Incorporated <why...@boddah.me> wrote:
> > Oh my God. What else is there to say?
>
> Were the hijackers pilots? How did they get commercial pilots to fly into
> buildings? Or is it that easy to steer a plane?
>
> Did they choose flights headed to California from the east coast because
> they would have a lot of fuel?
Richard C. Steiner
Dave Stadt wrote:
>Richard C. Steiner <rste...@isis.visi.com> wrote in message
>news:slrn9psjc2....@isis.visi.com...
>
>> Personally, I think the entire war with Japan was a shame and a senseless
>> waste of human life. I wish it had never happened, but *WE* didn't start
>> it. The Empire of Japan declared war first on the United States.
>
>Ah no, they just decided to bomb Pearl. They declared nothing.
Not much difference, really, though I know we would have considered formal
notification before hostilities commenced to be more "civilized".
Michael Voight
>
> Have you been to Logan Airport and Newark Airport lately ?
>
> You'll see more Middle Easterners than anything else. If they're not
> working at the airport, then thy're there to pick up some more relatives
> from their home country.
>
> Scary thought..... We let these people "clean" commercial airliners. They
> are not being sent through metal detectors before entering the
"these people"?? Are you suggesting they shouldn't be employed at the
airport, or
in the US at all??
I don't blame "these people". I blame individuals based on actions, not
nationality.
Michael
Les Perreaux
out it's actually retired war vets and internal extremists.
Charles K. Scott
"Sheldon Cuff" <sheld...@home.com> writes:
> I am devastated by this.
>
> My sadness is overwhelming. But ... my anger grows .
>
> God Damn what is wrong with humanity.
Forgive me Sheldon but it is the organized belief in God that has
created the atmospere that inspired these men. Bin Laden and his
followers are RELIGIOUS fanatics.
If God loves us, he/she/it has a strange way of demonstrating love, no?
Corky Scott
John Haddock
> > fixed-location and fixed-resource entities like nations. More fools will
> > take their place.
>
> That's why you get rid of all the fools.
Take it from somebody in the UK, it's not that easy to dispose of
terrorists.
This was surely an unbelievably appalling attack - doing nothing in response
is not an option - but the response must be appropriate and intelligent or
it will simply create more people ready to dedicate their lives to
terrorism.
In any event, my thoughts are with those injured and killed and with their
families. The feeling of shock here in the UK is intense.
John
Larry Fransson
Charles...@dartmouth.edu (Charles K. Scott) wrote:
> If God loves us, he/she/it has a strange way of demonstrating love, no?
You would prefer a God that allows you no freedom of choice? How loving
would that be?
It is because we have free will and the freedom to make choices about
the things we do and the God we believe in that these things happen.
People make choices, and people must deal with the consequences. God
has the power to cause anything, and He could force us to do His will.
But He doesn't. He lets us choose.
Decide which you prefer - free will or slavery - and then act
accordingly.
Gattman
Miguel Cruz wrote:
> > It's time to kill Bin Laden, and any other terrorist leader that
> > comes to US attention.
>
> Creating martyrs doesn't work when you're not dealing with established,
> fixed-location and fixed-resource entities like nations. More fools will
> take their place.
>
> Remember the psychology involved in this stuff. Gullible people are
> manipulated into believing they will receive reward beyond the scope of
> logic in exchange for carrying out these acts.
You're both right. We need to play their game and at the same time
subject them to ours:
Offer vast rewards for the capture of terrorists abroad. Show the world
how ol' American capitalism and greed works.
And, play their game: infiltrate and kill. If only I could
volunteer...
-gattman
Gattman
RossPilot wrote:
> to justice and ultimately do what? Kill them?
> So? Obviously that doesn't bother them.
YEAH BUT IT STOPS THEM FROM BLOWING UP JETLINERS AND FUCKING TRADE
CENTERS, DOESN'T IT?
IF BIN DICKHEAD LADEN HAD BEEN KILLED YEARS AGO LIKE THE TERRORIST BITCH
DESERVES, WE WOULDN'T BE QUESTIONING WHETHER HE WAS INVOLVED.
> And, like roaches, you can exterminate the ones you can see, but for every >one you kill, there are 10,000 more hiding in the walls.
That's why you must find ways to kill them all.
-gattman
Keith Willshaw
"Brien K. Meehan" <br...@networkgenius.com> wrote in message
news:tpship5...@news.supernews.com...
> > Welcome to the kill file
>
> Yeah, ignore him. That'll teach him.
>
>
It'll be just one less insane voice in the multitude
of kooks we'll see in the next few weeks
Either start a kill file or give up Usenet for a while
Keith
Keith Willshaw
"Kyler Laird" <la...@gunsmoke.ecn.purdue.edu> wrote in message
news:9nlbl5$84i$1...@mozo.cc.purdue.edu...
> Stephen Harding <har...@cs.umass.edu> writes:
>
> >It's time to kill Bin Laden, and any other terrorist leader that
> >comes to US attention.
>
> terrorists. Oh, wait...that's probably what
> *they* were thinking...
>
Sometimes the only appropriate response to those
who sow the wind is to make them reap the whirlwind
Keith
Gattman
Sheldon Cuff wrote:
>
> I am writing from Canada. My family and friends are praying for the all the
> victims and their families.
> My sadness is overwhelming. But ... my anger grows .
>
> God Damn what is wrong with humanity.
Religion.
-gattman
Keith Willshaw
> In article <tpsaeaa...@corp.supernews.com>, Mr. Toad wrote:
>
> >"LieutenantCordell" <mal...@home.com> wrote:
> >
> >> Why is this happening?
> >
> >It is happening because we are at war. Today's events are nothing
compared
> >to the blitz of London, or the bombings of Hamburg, Dresden, Tokyo, etc.
But
> >the purpose is the same--an attempt to crush civilian morale and bring
> >pressure on leaders to acede to the attackers' demands.
>
> Whoever did this doesn't understand the American psyche very well if that
> was the expectation. This will polarize the US government (and probably a
> majority of the country) to take action, not cause folks to go hide in a
> hole somewhere.
>
And the final death toll will I fear be greater than that of the London
Blitz where a large percentage of the population of the
city were taking shelter
I recall the final price of the Blitz to its perpetrators
was paid in Hamburg, Essen , Berlin and Dresden
Keith
George R. Patterson III
RossPilot wrote:
>
> So we identify the terrorists. We go after them and find them. We bring them
> to justice and ultimately do what? Kill them?
> So? Obviously that doesn't bother them.
I don't care whether it bothers them or not. I'm not out to find the
cruelest punishment; in fact, I don't care about punishment at all.
Once they are dead, they cannot hurt other people. That's good enough
for me.
George Patterson, N3162Q.
Kilo Charlie
it's early in the day it has been estimated to be 20,000 people at the
time of the attack and less than that when both towers collapsed. Hell
yeah this is a lot worse than Pearl Harbor. This is aimed directly at
innocent CIVILIANS.
I think this justifies using the nuke.
Stephen Harding <har...@cs.umass.edu> wrote in message news:<3B9E2514...@cs.umass.edu>...
> ME Incorporated wrote:
> >
> > Oh my God. What else is there to say?
>
> It's time to kill Bin Laden, and any other terrorist leader that
> comes to US attention.
>
> This is no longer a question of criminal action. It is war, and
> you don't need to get warrants or have trials against enemy soldiers.
>
> The Israelis, I'm sorry to say, have been right all along!
>
> How many people died at Pearl Harbor in 1941? 4,000 or so?
>
> How many people do you suppose were killed in these attacks?
>
> I think war is a good way to describe it.
>
>
> SMH
Paul Ponting
>Five million dollars is an insult. The US needs to offer a multibillion
>dollar reward, amnesty and citizenship for the person who brings in Bin
>Laden and as many of his followers as possible, alive or dead, whether
>he did it or not, to demonstrate just exactly what we think of
>terrorism.
>
>Five million is a joke. The government blows that much money out its
>ass every day.
>
AGREED.
Brien K. Meehan
> of kooks we'll see in the next few weeks
No it won't. Your kill file won't make him quiet.
There have been people angry at the US recently. We've decided that they
were insane, and refused to listen.
It didn't help.