How would you store a mildly used electric fuel pump?

[muzician21]

Wondering what considerations there would be in storing a used
electric fuel pump that likely has a fair number of miles left in it.

Suggestions?

Thanks.

[Vic Smith]

Maybe coat it with a shot of WD-40 and wrap it in Saran wrap.
Then bag it.
I've got some fairly new parts coming off the car I'm junking because
they'll fit my new car.
Alternator, starter motor, coil packs, spark module, A/C compressor,
condenser.
Except for the condenser which I'll just plug, that's what I'm
thinking of doing. Might be years before I use them.
So I'm watching this to see other advice.
I'll have to go buy WD-40. Don't like it, but I hear this is what
it's made for.

[Nate Nagel]

probably not a bad idea, although I would have suggested Diesel fuel for
the small amount of wax in it after it evaporates. Old farmer trick.
Just don't get any on the electric motor portion, just the bits with
seals, exposed uncoated metal, etc. Petroleum based solvents can cause
the windings to swell (or so the story goes, and why take the chance?)
and I would assume that they could wipe out the lube in any
bushings/bearings on the motor shaft.

nate

--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

[jim beam]

for a pump that otherwise lives inside a fuel tank, how exactly do you
think "swelling" [pfffffft!!!!] or "wipe out" is going to happen inside
a plastic bag? anosognosic retard.


--
fact check required

[Nate Nagel]

read for comprehension fuckstick, he also referred to a starter motor
and alternator.

You ought to feel stupid now but we all know you will just somehow
rationalize it to yourself somehow.

[jim beam]

ah, so not only is comprehension an issue, the hamster brain is easily
distracted too. next time nate, re-read the POST TITLE before insisting
how fucking stoooopid you really are.

>
> You ought to feel stupid now but we all know you will just somehow
> rationalize it to yourself somehow.

you couldn't rationalize your way off being stuck to the side of a
toilet bowl.


--
fact check required

[gpsman]

On Mar 21, 6:44 pm, muzician21 <muzicia...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> Suggestions?

I'd opt for the recycle bin.
-----

- gpsman

[gpsman]

On Mar 21, 10:25 pm, Nate Nagel <njna...@roosters.net> wrote:
>
> read for comprehension fuckstick, he also referred to a starter motor
> and alternator.
>
> You ought to feel stupid now but we all know you will just somehow
> rationalize it to yourself somehow.

From: muzician21 <muzicia...@yahoo.com>
Injection-Date: Thu, 21 Mar 2013 22:44:01 +0000
Subject: How would you store a mildly used electric fuel pump?
Newsgroups:
rec.autos.tech,alt.autos.toyota,rec.autos.makers.ford.mustang

"Wondering what considerations there would be in storing a used
electric fuel pump that likely has a fair number of miles left in it.

Suggestions?

Thanks."

http://groups.google.com/group/rec.autos.tech/msg/e9f85caa6aaa6b31?hl=en&dmode=source
-----

- gpsman

[twk]

In article <ag6nk8pcqv604k4s7...@4ax.com>,

WD-40 won't harm the pump, but in a few months it will be gummed up
quite well. It will then take a whole lot more WD-40 to free up all the
moving parts again. I would suggest spraying it with a good grade of
silicone oil. The silicone won't gum up, but will cost a bit more than
twice as much as a can of WD. Go with the silicone spray.

My $.02

--
For all you know this message was...
Sent via an exclusive network, on a snobby portable computing device.

[WindsorFox<SS>]

On 3/22/2013 10:07, twk wrote:
> In article <ag6nk8pcqv604k4s7...@4ax.com>,
> Vic Smith <thismaila...@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>> On Thu, 21 Mar 2013 15:44:01 -0700 (PDT), muzician21
>> <muzic...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Wondering what considerations there would be in storing a used
>>> electric fuel pump that likely has a fair number of miles left in it.
>>>
>>> Suggestions?
>>>
>>> Thanks.
>>
>> Maybe coat it with a shot of WD-40 and wrap it in Saran wrap.
>> Then bag it.
>> I've got some fairly new parts coming off the car I'm junking because
>> they'll fit my new car.
>> Alternator, starter motor, coil packs, spark module, A/C compressor,
>

> WD-40 won't harm the pump, but in a few months it will be gummed up
> quite well. It will then take a whole lot more WD-40 to free up all the
> moving parts again. I would suggest spraying it with a good grade of
> silicone oil. The silicone won't gum up, but will cost a bit more than
> twice as much as a can of WD. Go with the silicone spray.
>
> My $.02
>

Personally I'd throw it the hell away. With as much trouble as it is
to replace a Mustang's fuel pump, I'm certainly not going that far to
install a used fuel pump that "likely has some miles left."

[Vic Smith]

Don't know about the Mustang, but on the Lumina I'm junking due to
engine failure, I put a new gas tank in last year. Swapped in the old
pump that had 180k miles on it. I figured the Lumina was good for
about 3 more years until rust would make it a real eyesore, and I'd
have wet carpets.. OE pumps on that runs $250.
I play helper for my son, and we both figured it wouldn't be hard to
replace the pump if need be. The first time dropping the tank is the
hard one. Then you know the best method, connectors, etc.
Thanks twk, for the silicone vs WD-40 advice.
But on more thought I think I'll just wrap my parts in Saran wrap dry.
Should be enough to keep rust away. I don't think you can do anything
to keep seals from aging, or at least it's not something I'm inclined
to worry about. New parts for old cars is par for the course.

[AMeiwes]

"WindsorFox<SS>" <windsor.f...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:kii22l$ap2$1...@posting2.glorb.com...

agree, new pumps are cheap.

[Jeff Strickland]

"muzician21" <muzic...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:ae951d8e-7aa2-4315...@l9g2000yqp.googlegroups.com...

Wrap it in a plastic bag and put it in a box. Then hope that in 10 or 15
years, the next time you need a fuel pump, you have a car that takes the
same one that you wrapped in plastic and put in a box.

You can get the longest life out of your fuel pump by keeping the gas tank
full.

Gasoline acts as a heat sink, so if the tank runs to E and you put in
five-bucks, whatever, just to hold you till tomorrow, then tomorrow do the
same thing, and keep the tank near E most of the time, then there is no
gasoline to act as a heat sink, and the pump motor runs hot which shortens
its life.

Keep the tank filled more than driving around with it empty, and you will
have a fuel pump that lasts almost as long as the car.

[Jeff Strickland]

"Vic Smith" <thismaila...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:ag6nk8pcqv604k4s7...@4ax.com...

The idea of spraying the pump with a lubricant is okay, I suppose. But WD-40
is the worst stuff you will ever find for this. WD-40 is great to free
sticky mechanisms, but you must wash it off once the mechanism is freed.
WD-40 has a component that when everything else evaporates/dries up, turns
to goo that will glue stuff shut so tightly that a fresh shot of WD-40 might
not be able to free it.

[Jeff Strickland]

"gpsman" <gps...@driversmail.com> wrote in message
news:84976773-29d2-4240...@k4g2000yqn.googlegroups.com...

On Mar 21, 6:44 pm, muzician21 <muzicia...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> Suggestions?

I'd opt for the recycle bin.

+++++++++++++++++++++
That's a good call. Craig's List today, then buy one next year when you need
it, or next decade is more like it.

[uncle_vito]

"Jeff Strickland" <crwl...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:kiicc3$963$1...@dont-email.me...

Electric fuel pumps are DC since they are run off the 12 v battery and there
is no external electronic circuitry to perform AC switching. That means
there must be brushes and slip rings. I have always wondered how sparking
does not ignite the fuel. Perhaps all is OK if the pump is totally
submerged, but how about if you are running out of fuel. How do you
prevent the pump from igniting the gas in the tank?

[jim beam]

1. "silicone spray" you buy at the automotive store or supermarket is
mostly petroleum distillate - i.e. mostly stuff like wd40. the
percentage of silicone is minimal.

2. silicone in fuel will quickly screw up oxygen sensors.

on both counts, either don't bother with anything, or just use wd40.
it's not like it turns into cosmoline.


--
fact check required

[jim beam]

urban legend. when early fuel injection pumps failed, it was because
they were cheap carp, not because they weren't getting any cooling.
fuel circulates through the pump. as long as it's pumping, it's getting
"cooled". [and why "cooling" is considered so important is a complete
mystery. windshield wiper motors can run indefinitely "uncooled".]


--
fact check required

[twk]

In article <kiiip9$ege$1...@dont-email.me>, jim beam <m...@privacy.net>
wrote:

1. I did say a "good grade" of silicon oil. Maybe I should have said a
high percentage of silicone. I have a 100% silicone oil spray on my
shelf right now. It was about 3x the price of WD-40 and well worth it.

2. I also didn't mean to flood the pump with the entire contents of the
can. A light coating inside and out should protect the pump nicely.
Hardly enough to damage any sensor.

Something covered in WD-40 and wrapped in plastic, will get gummy in a
couple of months time. No doubt about it.

[WindsorFox<SS>]

Generally it won't get that far. Once it sucks even a little air the
pressure should drop enough that ti shuts off. Some cars have a float
check too. I know someone with an 86 Grand National and with a 1/4 tank
backed down a loading ramp so no one could park close enough to ding it.
Wouldn't start when he got back. Pulled it out level and it fired right off.

[Paul Hovnanian P.E.]

Gasoline only ignites within a limited air-fuel mixture ratio. Too lean or,
more likely in the fuel tank, too rich and it won't ignite.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gasoline#Flammability

This is even more the case in modern cars, where the fuel tank is not vented
to the atmosphere but is a part of the vapor recovery system. There is very
little oxygen in there. This is also good because gas goes bad faster
exposed to air (oxygen).

--
Paul Hovnanian mailto:Pa...@Hovnanian.com
------------------------------------------------------------------
Time's fun when you're having flies. -- Kermit the Frog

[Frank S]

"twk" <t...@sleepless.knights.com> wrote in message
news:twk-1548E0.1...@news.eternal-september.org...

Genie garage-door company offers a silicon lubricant that remains oily
for six months that I know of. I wonder if it would be a decent
"preservative".

--
Frank ess

[jim beam]

that's supposition, not fact. silicone is a known issue with sensors.
even the traces that can leach from solid rtv "gasket" can be a problem.

>
> Something covered in WD-40 and wrapped in plastic, will get gummy in a
> couple of months time. No doubt about it.

i've got stuff in plastic bags that's got wd40 on it. has been stored
that way for nearly 10 years. no "gumminess" at all. maybe your stuff
had grease in it which leached out?


--
fact check required

[jim beam]

On 03/22/2013 02:14 PM, uncle_vito wrote:
> "Jeff Strickland" <crwl...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:kiicc3$963$1...@dont-email.me...
>>
>> "muzician21" <muzic...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>> news:ae951d8e-7aa2-4315...@l9g2000yqp.googlegroups.com...
>>> Wondering what considerations there would be in storing a used
>>> electric fuel pump that likely has a fair number of miles left in it.
>>>
>>> Suggestions?
>>>
>>> Thanks.
>>
>> Wrap it in a plastic bag and put it in a box. Then hope that in 10 or 15
>> years, the next time you need a fuel pump, you have a car that takes the
>> same one that you wrapped in plastic and put in a box.
>>
>> You can get the longest life out of your fuel pump by keeping the gas tank
>> full.
>>
>> Gasoline acts as a heat sink, so if the tank runs to E and you put in
>> five-bucks, whatever, just to hold you till tomorrow, then tomorrow do the
>> same thing, and keep the tank near E most of the time, then there is no
>> gasoline to act as a heat sink, and the pump motor runs hot which shortens
>> its life.
>>
>> Keep the tank filled more than driving around with it empty, and you will
>> have a fuel pump that lasts almost as long as the car.
>>
>>
>
> Electric fuel pumps are DC since they are run off the 12 v battery and there
> is no external electronic circuitry to perform AC switching. That means
> there must be brushes and slip rings.

technically, those two statements are not logically connected. all the
fans in your computer are brushless dc fans with no external circuitry.

> I have always wondered how sparking
> does not ignite the fuel. Perhaps all is OK if the pump is totally
> submerged, but how about if you are running out of fuel. How do you
> prevent the pump from igniting the gas in the tank?

most modern pumps have commutators bathed in fuel so there's no air in
there. even if there's insufficient fuel to run the engine, there's
still fuel in the pump. the commutators are even placed at the bottom
of the pump, just to make sure this remains so.


--
fact check required

[Jeff Strickland]

"jim beam" <m...@privacy.net> wrote in message
news:kiiirr$ege$2...@dont-email.me...

Windshield wiper motors can be internally lubricated, this is a difficult
accomplishment in an environment that by it's very nature destroys the
lubracative qualities of oil and grease.

In nearly every case on the discussion forums that I participate in, the
people that need to replace fuel pumps report habitually driving around in
the sub-1/4 tank range and buying just enough gas to get to the next day or
the day after. The common thread among this group is low fuel and the need
for a fuel pump. In all of my years, the only time I replaced a fuel pump
was a year os so after buying a used car that I don't know the previous
history of. But, of all the cars that I have owned, only one has needed a
fuel pump. Granted, many of them were not fuel injected, so the fuel pump
was mechanical and mounted to the side of the engine block. But, I've owned
a fair share of fuel injected cars and trucks, and only one fuel pump. I
always fill the tank.

You can drive around with an empty gas tank if you want, but I'll continue
to be happy in the thought that a habitually full tank is better than an
habitually empty one when the fuel pumkp life is in question. I'll not lose
any sleep telling people to lean to keeping the tank filled rather than to
allow it to run on empty for extended periods.

[jim beam]

you said "...no gasoline to act as a heat sink, and the pump motor runs
hot which shortens its life...", so i pointed out that windshield wiper
motors run indefinitely without cooling. you didn't say anything about
lubrication, which is an entirely different topic.

if you're trying to say that fuel pumps are not lubricated, then you're
wrong there too - they use polymer bushings [like delrin] that are
sufficiently lubricated by the fuel that fills the pump when it's used
for the first time.

>
> In nearly every case on the discussion forums that I participate in, the
> people that need to replace fuel pumps report habitually driving around
> in the sub-1/4 tank range and buying just enough gas to get to the next
> day or the day after. The common thread among this group is low fuel and
> the need for a fuel pump. In all of my years, the only time I replaced a
> fuel pump was a year os so after buying a used car that I don't know the
> previous history of. But, of all the cars that I have owned, only one
> has needed a fuel pump. Granted, many of them were not fuel injected, so
> the fuel pump was mechanical and mounted to the side of the engine
> block. But, I've owned a fair share of fuel injected cars and trucks,
> and only one fuel pump. I always fill the tank.
>
> You can drive around with an empty gas tank if you want, but I'll
> continue to be happy in the thought that a habitually full tank is
> better than an habitually empty one when the fuel pumkp life is in
> question. I'll not lose any sleep telling people to lean to keeping the
> tank filled rather than to allow it to run on empty for extended periods.

you can go ahead and believe in urban legend all you want, but the fact
is that fuel pumps are fully internally saturated with fuel. any time
they're working and generating heat, they're circulating that liquid and
the heat is being carried away. [not that it's even an issue in the
first place, but hey.] if there's insufficient fuel to circulate, the
car's not going to work, and even if the ignition is left on, the pump
will be switched off after two seconds by the engine computer if the
engine stops running. thus, there is no situation in which heat can
possibly be a failure mode for the typical modern fuel pump.

early fuel injection pumps did indeed fail regularly, but they were not
the impeller types we see today. impellers don't have any touching
parts and have nothing to wear - they are as reliable as the electric
motor that drives them, and /that/ is reliable as its manufacturer wants
it to be - you don't have any influence over it.


--
fact check required

[uncle_vito]

"jim beam" <m...@privacy.net> wrote in message

news:kiiip9$ege$1...@dont-email.me...

TRASH IT. You want nothing to do with reusing a mildly used and stored
one. I shudder at the thought of being broken down in a bad part of town.
Or along the side of a freeway where you can be killed by a drunk.

[uncle_vito]

"Paul Hovnanian P.E." <pa...@hovnanian.com> wrote in message
news:4audnW4RqO3ihtDM...@giganews.com...

I hear all this reasoning but I also know that welders are very reluctant to
weld fuel tanks. I had a tank out of a motor home and they insisted it be
washed out completely with soapy water before he would weld on it.

I also know of a person that was going to weld on a fuel tanker truck at a
shop next door to where I was working. He put dry ice ( or something
similar) in the tank the night before to remove all the oxygen. The tank
blew up the next day as he was welding. He was instantly killed and body
parts were found over at our place of business. Perhaps a welding torch is
different that fuel pump commutation sparks, but why take any chance at
creating a fire or explosion?

[AMuzi]

If it's absolutely necessary, turn the thing so your work
area is up, fill with water as far as practicable, flash the
remainder with your torch before starting to clean or work
the area. Even soap or detergent with hot water will leave a
dangerous amount of flammable material in a tank and that is
effectively a bomb.

I have leaded in a new bottom panel on a gas tank and that
was the excellent advice I was given by a guy who grew old
without blowing one up. That said, a new tank, where readily
available, is a very good idea.

--
Andrew Muzi
<www.yellowjersey.org/>
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

[Vic Smith]

On Sun, 24 Mar 2013 13:33:53 -0500, AMuzi <a...@yellowjersey.org> wrote:


>
>If it's absolutely necessary, turn the thing so your work
>area is up, fill with water as far as practicable, flash the
>remainder with your torch before starting to clean or work
>the area. Even soap or detergent with hot water will leave a
>dangerous amount of flammable material in a tank and that is
>effectively a bomb.
>
>I have leaded in a new bottom panel on a gas tank and that
>was the excellent advice I was given by a guy who grew old
>without blowing one up. That said, a new tank, where readily
>available, is a very good idea.

Just get a new tank. I had a '76 Impala with a leaky seam due to
rust. I filled it with water and detergent 3 times, agitating and
sloshing it pretty good. Probably spent a couple hours just doing
that. Filled it a fourth time and had to tilt it to keep water from
the seam. As soon I put torch and solder to it damn near blew my head
off with the burst from the pump opening.
Went to the boneyard and got a perfect tank for 25 bucks, already
parted out.
Bought a new Lumina tank last year due to rust.
$99.99 at Autozone. I don't even think about putting heat on a gas
tank anymore. I count that as one of my all-time stupid moves.

[David]

At Fri, 22 Mar 2013 14:14:23 -0700, uncle_vito rearranged some electrons

to write:

> "Jeff Strickland" <crwl...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:kiicc3$963$1...@dont-email.me...
>>
>> "muzician21" <muzic...@yahoo.com> wrote in message

>> news:ae951d8e-7aa2-4315-b365-
af6a44...@l9g2000yqp.googlegroups.com...

>>> Wondering what considerations there would be in storing a used
>>> electric fuel pump that likely has a fair number of miles left in it.
>>>
>>> Suggestions?
>>>
>>> Thanks.
>>
>> Wrap it in a plastic bag and put it in a box. Then hope that in 10 or
>> 15 years, the next time you need a fuel pump, you have a car that takes
>> the same one that you wrapped in plastic and put in a box.
>>
>> You can get the longest life out of your fuel pump by keeping the gas
>> tank full.
>>
>> Gasoline acts as a heat sink, so if the tank runs to E and you put in
>> five-bucks, whatever, just to hold you till tomorrow, then tomorrow do
>> the same thing, and keep the tank near E most of the time, then there
>> is no gasoline to act as a heat sink, and the pump motor runs hot which
>> shortens its life.
>>
>> Keep the tank filled more than driving around with it empty, and you
>> will have a fuel pump that lasts almost as long as the car.
>>
>>
>>
> Electric fuel pumps are DC since they are run off the 12 v battery and
> there is no external electronic circuitry to perform AC switching.
> That means there must be brushes and slip rings. I have always
> wondered how sparking does not ignite the fuel. Perhaps all is OK if
> the pump is totally submerged, but how about if you are running out of
> fuel. How do you prevent the pump from igniting the gas in the tank?

You would need to have oxygen in order to start a fire.

[Jeff Strickland]

"jim beam" <m...@privacy.net> wrote in message

news:kilhlt$akp$1...@dont-email.me...

Be that as it is, I drive a 20-year old car with the original fuel pump, and
lots of people that have cars half the age of mine have already replace the
fuel pump on the same make of car, and they report driving around for days
upon days, weeks on end for some, and the pump ultimately fails. Did the low
fuel level cause the demise of the fuel pump? Who knows. But the very small
data pool that I have says that habitual low fuel and fuel pump failures are
related.

If you can avoid a $150-ish part by doing nothing more than filling the gas
tank, why not do that?

If you are in the habit of driving around with the fuel level very low, then
don't be alarmed that the pump fails. Just make the necessary repair and
move on.

But the OP should sell the pump he has, and wait for the day that he needs
to replace a fuel pump and then go out and buy one.

A windshield wiper motor and a fuel pump motor have little resembelence to
one another after you get past the motor part. A fuel pump is a low torque,
high speed motor. The windshield wipers use a high torque, low speed motor.
A fuel pump directly pumps fuel, the windshield has a reduction gear to
mechanically increase the power of the mechanism. The fuel pump runs as
long as the car is on, more or less, the wiper motor runs much less. Apples
and oranges....

[jim beam]

since the fuel pump doesn't have wearing parts other than the motor
component, the resemblance between both motor units is 100% relevant.

> A fuel pump is a low
> torque, high speed motor. The windshield wipers use a high torque, low
> speed motor. A fuel pump directly pumps fuel, the windshield has a
> reduction gear to mechanically increase the power of the mechanism.

reduction gears mean that you can [and do] use a high speed low torque
electric motor for the wipers.

> The
> fuel pump runs as long as the car is on, more or less, the wiper motor
> runs much less. Apples and oranges....

you've never been to oregon or washington state in the winter then - in
their rainy season, there is 100% correlation between fuel pump hours
and wiper motor hours.


--
fact check required

[WindsorFox<SS>]

On 3/25/2013 19:33, jim beam wrote:

>> A windshield wiper motor and a fuel pump motor have little resembelence
>> to one another after you get past the motor part.
>
> since the fuel pump doesn't have wearing parts other than the motor
> component, the resemblance between both motor units is 100% relevant.
>

Nope, I disagree. There is a big difference between different types
of electric motors, if not I'd be out a side gig. Fuel pumps spin much
faster and always. Wiper motor not so much.

[Jeff Strickland]

"jim beam" <m...@privacy.net> wrote in message

news:kiqq7v$fdc$2...@dont-email.me...

There is nowhere on earth that a windshield wiper motor runs anywhere near
the duty cycle of a fuel pump motor. And, setting a windshield wiper motor
under a panel where it remains dry, filling it with grease where it remains
lubricated, and putting it behind a reduction gear where the mechanical
advantage can be leveraged makes it entirely different than a motor that is
submerged in gasoline where the lubricant is compromised, and the power of
the motor is not leveraged with reduction gears.

A wiper motor is mucl closer to a window motor than to a fuel pump motor,
although these motors are also quite different. The operating environment is
similar, although the duty cycle is not even close. Lots of stuff is
different, but the idea that the motors are located in dry locations instead
of wet ones is the same, the lubrication lasts for decades is the same,
there are reduction gear mechanisms which are similar, and so on.

The point being, a fuel pump motor lives in a hostile environment, and some
of the hostility is used to the benefit of the motor if the fuel levels are
kept high instead of being held low. The external presence of fuel
surrounding the motor has a cooling influence. If the fuel level is held low
for extended periods, the impact is that the motor runs hotter than it has
to if it is submerged, and this additional heat shortens the life of the
motor.

Perhaps the motor lasts 15 years instead of 20, or 7 years instead of 15,
whatever. I'm driving a car that was built 19 years ago, has 150,000 miles
on it, and the pump is the original. I keep the tank filled -- rather, when
the tank gets to E, I fill it instead of just putting in a few dollars-worth
of gas. In EVERY instance of fuel pump failure in cars of similar age as
mine, or younger, the drivers report they let the tank remain below 1/4 for
extended periods -- they drop in a few dollars-worth of gas to get to the
next day or day after then repeat.

Is keeping the tank filled a guarantee that the pump will never fail?
Probably not. But, why not fill the tank hoping to avoid early replacement
of a part that is typically $150-ish to purchase, and often requires the gas
tank to be removed from the car to replace?

[Nate Nagel]

I've never heard of the dry ice trick, but I have seen people fill tanks
mostly full of water to displace all the vapor before welding. Seems
like a reasonable precaution, especially given your anecdote above.

nate

--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

[Nate Nagel]

Good advice, but some of us still have cars where old parts are the only
parts available.

That said, when a better used or new part is available, replacement is
the sane choice.

[Vic Smith]

On Tue, 26 Mar 2013 09:06:38 -0700, "Jeff Strickland"
<crwl...@yahoo.com> wrote:


>
>Perhaps the motor lasts 15 years instead of 20, or 7 years instead of 15,
>whatever. I'm driving a car that was built 19 years ago, has 150,000 miles
>on it, and the pump is the original. I keep the tank filled -- rather, when
>the tank gets to E, I fill it instead of just putting in a few dollars-worth
>of gas. In EVERY instance of fuel pump failure in cars of similar age as
>mine, or younger, the drivers report they let the tank remain below 1/4 for
>extended periods -- they drop in a few dollars-worth of gas to get to the
>next day or day after then repeat.
>
>Is keeping the tank filled a guarantee that the pump will never fail?
>Probably not. But, why not fill the tank hoping to avoid early replacement
>of a part that is typically $150-ish to purchase, and often requires the gas
>tank to be removed from the car to replace?
>

Higher static head pressure probably eases the work the pump has to
do, and more gas in the tank provides a bigger heat sink.
So why not fill your tank when it hits 3/4 or 1/2 full?
In the end it probably won't make a difference that can be measured.
I don't buy the idea that running a car all the time with 1/4 tank is
the main cause of pump failure. They just wear out, and some are
built better than others, even the same pump model from the same
manufacturer. Lemons, or almost lemons.
First off, not many people don't fill up at the gas station. It's a
big waste of time continually putting only a few gallons in a gas
tank. I don't know anybody who does that. My son does, and in fact
he's put new pumps on their cars. But they were high mileage cars
anyway.
Secondly, I've had 2 pumps fail on GM cars at about 120k miles,
and the Lumina I'm junking has the original pump with 180k miles.
All were gassed up the same - basically when it falls below 1/4 tank,
fill it up. It's just initial quality of the pump.
Not saying to run the pump dry, but how much gas you keep in your tank
isn't something I'd ever worry about.
BTW, a typical GM pump runs about 2.5-3 bills at auto parts stores.
It's modular and comes with sending unit. You don't want to cheap out
and try replacing only the pump. High hassle and high failure rate.
Think I paid close to 5 bills when I had one replaced by a shop.
The ones I've done myself took 4-5 hours to do, steady, careful and
somewhat leisurely since there was no clock.
That's with jackstands and creeper.

[Ralph Mowery]

"Vic Smith" <thismaila...@comcast.net> wrote in message

news:btr3l85th16sp7a3f...@4ax.com...

> The ones I've done myself took 4-5 hours to do, steady, careful and
> somewhat leisurely since there was no clock.
> That's with jackstands and creeper.
>
>

I like the redneck way. If you can do it, cut a hole in the trunk with a
jig saw, replace pump and put a piece of tin back over the hole with pop
rivits. Used to work on the freeze plugs also. Just use a hole saw from
the inside on the firewall.

[AMeiwes]

"Ralph Mowery" <rmower...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:V8idnauVJ78jlc_M...@earthlink.com...

just use a large jug for gasoline on the dash board with a rubber hose that
go to the carbo-rator, all gravity feed, no need for a stinkin pump anyway.

you guys.

store it in WD40...... like Grandma's undies......

[Bowerick Wowbagger]

On 3/26/2013 5:50 PM, AMeiwes wrote:

>
> just use a large jug for gasoline on the dash board with a rubber hose that
> go to the carbo-rator, all gravity feed, no need for a stinkin pump anyway.
>
> you guys.
>
> store it in WD40...... like Grandma's undies......
>
>

I used to have a 1950 Ford tractor that worked that way. Gas tank set
over the engine, copper line with a stopcock right to the carb. Worked
great!

[Vic Smith]

The Lumina tank wasn't under the trunk, but the back seat. Same with
my Grand Am. Think the FWD cars use "contoured" tanks, and get more
trunk space that way. Both those tanks were contoured and unlike the
pillow shaped tanks aft of the axle in RWD cars.
So you would cut through the floor under the rear seat.
But pulling the tank might happen only once in the life of a car
anyway, so I won't be cutting holes.

[AMeiwes]

"Bowerick Wowbagger" <us...@inter.net> wrote in message
news:kit6h9$bnl$1...@dont-email.me...

I think on vaccum carbs lots of lattitude to do this, plus that self
regulating gas float valve on the carb.

but the injectors need 40 PSI across them, BUT could hook up the spair tire
air on the roof with a valve and hose to a pressurized gasoline can and have
tube come out the bottom to the fuel rail.

=> NO FUEL PUMP TO STORE in Grandma's WD40 again.

[Bowerick Wowbagger]

You'll get more redneck cred using an empty beer keg for the air
pressure tank.