Help with fungus stories

[icarp...@aol.com]

Innsmouth Free Press is publishing an anthology of stories centered around fungi.

http://www.innsmouthfreepress.com/?p=17437

They are trying to compile a database of stories, books and movies involving fungi. If you know of any and want to expand their database, you can follow the link provided.

Matt

[tphile2]

Well there is also
Nivens The Ringworld Engineers. natives grew mushrooms in the shadows
of the floating cities.

japanese movie
Matango aka The Attack of the Mushroom People. A classic cheesy/fungi
flick from the 1960's

[Ted Nolan <tednolan>]

In article <17313064.2040.1335301916987.JavaMail.geo-discussion-forums@ynmm9>,

Well, I'm going haring off after their link, but:

"Boys! Raise Giant Mushrooms In Your Cellar!"

_The Wonderful Flight To The Mushroom Planet_

and
_The Forgotten Planet_

are obvious contenders.
--
------
columbiaclosings.com
What's not in Columbia anymore..

[Paul Ciszek]

In article <17313064.2040.1335301916987.JavaMail.geo-discussion-forums@ynmm9>,
icarp...@aol.com <icarp...@aol.com> wrote:

What I want to find is the movie that contained a line that my parents,
some of my teachers, and even John Denver on a muppet special would
quote: "There is a fungus among us!" Googling just shows how wide-
spread the meme is.

--
Please reply to: | "We establish no religion in this country, we
pciszek at panix dot com | command no worship, we mandate no belief, nor
Autoreply is disabled | will we ever. Church and state are, and must
| remain, separate." --Ronald Reagan, 10/26/1984

[art...@yahoo.com]

Freeware Rudy Rucker (involves synthetic life forms that are mixtures
of molds and algae).

[Brenda Clough]

Thanks for the tip! I am sure they do not have "Gray to Black" in it,
so I went and filled out the form. (Parasitic space spore establishes
beach-head in young woman's body, film at 11.)

Brenda

--
My latest novel SPEAK TO OUR DESIRES is available exclusively from Book
View Cafe.
http://www.bookviewcafe.com/index.php/Brenda-Clough/Novels/Speak-to-Our-Desires-Chapter-01

[Quadibloc]

On Apr 24, 3:11 pm, "icarpen...@aol.com" <icarpen...@aol.com> wrote:
> Innsmouth Free Press is publishing an anthology of stories centered around fungi.

I was going to ask if the Mi-Go counted, but that was before I looked
carefully at the name of the publisher.

John Savard

[Kay Shapero]

In article <jn799u$5sj$3...@reader1.panix.com>, nos...@nospam.com says...

>
> What I want to find is the movie that contained a line that my parents,
> some of my teachers, and even John Denver on a muppet special would
> quote: "There is a fungus among us!" Googling just shows how wide-
> spread the meme is.

Dunno about a movie, but there's a song written and recorded by Terry
Noland in 1958: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OwEKoMQj9io

Which was later covered by Hugh Barrett and the Victors in 1961
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VUyjL_NZrUo) which I think is the
version I first heard.

It was supposed to be based on a catchphrase that was wandering around
Chicago at the time; I'm not entirely sure I want to know the details...
:)

--
Kay Shapero
http://www.kayshapero.net
Address munged, to email use kay at the above domain (everything after
the www.)

[Butch Malahide]

Lewis Carroll, _Alice in Wonderland_
Jack Williamson, "Twelve Hours to Live!"
Stanley G. Weinbaum, "Parasite Planet"
John Keir Cross, _The Angry Planet_(?) [I think the Terrible Ones (bad
Martians) were fungi but I'm not sure.]

Thousands of others. The entry for "fungi" in the index of Bleiler's
_Science Fiction: The Gernsback Years_ points to about three dozen
science fiction stories in the 1926-1936 genre magazines.

[jgharston]

Hothouse, Brian Aldis
There's a Doom Watch episode which I think has plastic-eating fungus
destroying
an aeroplane
I can picture dozens of cheapo scifi flicks from my youth that
could have had sentient alien fungus monsters
"From Another Kingdom" has a chapter: "Fungal Monsters in Science
Fiction"

I for one welcome our fungal overlords.

[Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)]

On 4/24/12 6:26 PM, Paul Ciszek wrote:
> In article<17313064.2040.1335301916987.JavaMail.geo-discussion-forums@ynmm9>,
> icarp...@aol.com<icarp...@aol.com> wrote:
>> Innsmouth Free Press is publishing an anthology of stories centered
>> around fungi.
>>
>> http://www.innsmouthfreepress.com/?p=17437
>>
>> They are trying to compile a database of stories, books and movies
>> involving fungi. If you know of any and want to expand their database,
>> you can follow the link provided.
>
> What I want to find is the movie that contained a line that my parents,
> some of my teachers, and even John Denver on a muppet special would
> quote: "There is a fungus among us!"

At which point John started singing:

"Nobody knows
The truffles I've seen..."

And the fungi attacked him.


--
Sea Wasp
/^\
;;;
Website: http://www.grandcentralarena.com Blog:
http://seawasp.livejournal.com

[tphile2]

On Apr 24, 8:32 pm, "Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)"

<seaw...@sgeinc.invalid.com> wrote:
> On 4/24/12 6:26 PM, Paul Ciszek wrote:
>
> > In article<17313064.2040.1335301916987.JavaMail.geo-discussion-forums@ynmm9>,

> > icarpen...@aol.com<icarpen...@aol.com>  wrote:

> >> Innsmouth Free Press is publishing an anthology of stories centered
> >> around fungi.
>
> >>http://www.innsmouthfreepress.com/?p=17437
>
> >> They are trying to compile a database of stories, books and movies
> >> involving fungi.  If you know of any and want to expand their database,
> >> you can follow the link provided.
>
> > What I want to find is the movie that contained a line that my parents,
> > some of my teachers, and even John Denver on a muppet special would
> > quote:  "There is a fungus among us!"
>
>         At which point John started singing:
>
>         "Nobody knows
>          The truffles I've seen..."
>
>         And the fungi attacked him.
>
> --
>                       Sea Wasp
>                         /^\
>                         ;;;
> Website:http://www.grandcentralarena.com Blog:http://seawasp.livejournal.com

That's the very yeast they could do to rise to the occassion
That kind of singing is not to my lichen

[Kip Williams]

Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor) wrote:
> On 4/24/12 6:26 PM, Paul Ciszek wrote:
>> In
>> article<17313064.2040.1335301916987.JavaMail.geo-discussion-forums@ynmm9>,
>>
>> icarp...@aol.com<icarp...@aol.com> wrote:
>>> Innsmouth Free Press is publishing an anthology of stories centered
>>> around fungi.
>>>
>>> http://www.innsmouthfreepress.com/?p=17437
>>>
>>> They are trying to compile a database of stories, books and movies
>>> involving fungi. If you know of any and want to expand their database,
>>> you can follow the link provided.
>>
>> What I want to find is the movie that contained a line that my parents,
>> some of my teachers, and even John Denver on a muppet special would
>> quote: "There is a fungus among us!"
>
> At which point John started singing:
>
> "Nobody knows
> The truffles I've seen..."
>
> And the fungi attacked him.

[insert bad pun involving 'spore' here]



Kip W
rasfw

[Kip Williams]

Tintin: "The Shooting Star" (by Hergé, real name Georges Remi)


Kip W
rasfw

[David DeLaney]

Ted Nolan <tednolan> <t...@loft.tnolan.com> wrote:
>icarp...@aol.com <icarp...@aol.com> wrote:
>>Innsmouth Free Press is publishing an anthology of stories centered
>>around fungi.
>>
>>http://www.innsmouthfreepress.com/?p=17437
>>
>>They are trying to compile a database of stories, books and movies
>>involving fungi. If you know of any and want to expand their database,
>>you can follow the link provided.
>>
>>Matt
>
>Well, I'm going haring off after their link, but:
>
> "Boys! Raise Giant Mushrooms In Your Cellar!"
> _The Wonderful Flight To The Mushroom Planet_
>and
> _The Forgotten Planet_
>
>are obvious contenders.

There was a subplot in Gary Gygax's Greyhawk-setting books about Zuggtmoy,
the demon Queen of Fungi, and her relationship with one of the other villains.
Juiblex, demon lord of slimes and oozes, did not show up as much more than
a cameo, but Zuggtmoy was one of the layers of regular villain in its plots.

Dave "forty-two pounds of edible fungus" DeLaney
--
\/David DeLaney posting from d...@vic.com "It's not the pot that grows the flower
It's not the clock that slows the hour The definition's plain for anyone to see
Love is all it takes to make a family" - R&P. VISUALIZE HAPPYNET VRbeable<BLINK>
http://www.vic.com/~dbd/ - net.legends FAQ & Magic / I WUV you in all CAPS! --K.

[Cryptoengineer]

"The Trouble with Lichen" - John Wyndham.

There's an entire zone in the game World of Warcraft (Zangramarsh)
which is a mushroom forest.

pt

[jack...@bright.net]

Piers Anthony's novel, _Omnivore_ has sapient creatures evolved from
fungus. I think there's an excerptable chapter laying out their view
of life.

--
-Jack

[Greg Weeks]

The Mad Planet by Murray Leinster
http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/35425

Greg Weeks

[Charles Combes]

Is there a morel to this, or are you just trying to push our buttons?

[Bill Snyder]

You guys are making me green around the gills.

--
Bill Snyder [This space unintentionally left blank]

[Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)]

By Crimini, can't we shelf this?

[Kip Williams]

Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor) wrote:
> On 4/25/12 9:42 AM, Charles Combes wrote:
>> tphile2 wrote:
>>> On Apr 24, 8:32 pm, "Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)"
>>> <seaw...@sgeinc.invalid.com> wrote:
>>
>>>>> What I want to find is the movie that contained a line that my
>>>>> parents,
>>>>> some of my teachers, and even John Denver on a muppet special would
>>>>> quote: "There is a fungus among us!"
>>>>
>>>> At which point John started singing:
>>>>
>>>> "Nobody knows
>>>> The truffles I've seen..."
>>>>
>>>> And the fungi attacked him.

>>>> Blog:http://seawasp.livejournal.com
>>>
>>> That's the very yeast they could do to rise to the occassion
>>> That kind of singing is not to my lichen
>>
>> Is there a morel to this, or are you just trying to push our buttons?
>>
>
> By Crimini, can't we shelf this?

You're no fun, guy.


Kip W
rasfw

[Larry]

In article <MPG.2a00d8e0a...@news.eternal-september.org>,
k...@invalid.net says...

>
> In article <jn799u$5sj$3...@reader1.panix.com>, nos...@nospam.com says...
> >
> > What I want to find is the movie that contained a line that my parents,
> > some of my teachers, and even John Denver on a muppet special would
> > quote: "There is a fungus among us!" Googling just shows how wide-
> > spread the meme is.
>
> Dunno about a movie, but there's a song written and recorded by Terry
> Noland in 1958: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OwEKoMQj9io
>
> Which was later covered by Hugh Barrett and the Victors in 1961
> (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VUyjL_NZrUo) which I think is the
> version I first heard.
>
> It was supposed to be based on a catchphrase that was wandering around
> Chicago at the time; I'm not entirely sure I want to know the details...
> :)

I never heard the song, but the phrase was current when I was a kid in the
1950s in Oregon. I have no idea how much older than that it is, but doubt it
predates the 17th century.

[JRStern]

YASID:

There was a story long ago maybe 1980 plus or minus five, probably in
F&SF, about a rich ecologist who builds an enclosed environment to
speed up evolution, and a debate about whether that is safe, and
apparently it evolves a mutant fungus that would be extremely
dangerous if it got out, but the greenies say it's natural and safe
and go inside to demonstrate, ....

I don't know if that's in their list or not.

--

The other one that occurs to me I presume is the Ray Bradbury, "Boys
grow mushrooms in your basement".

Presume all fungi stories are creepy?

J.

[David Dyer-Bennet]

Obviously, _The Wonderful Flight to the Mushroom Planet_ and other books
in that series!
--
David Dyer-Bennet, dd...@dd-b.net; http://dd-b.net/
Snapshots: http://dd-b.net/dd-b/SnapshotAlbum/data/
Photos: http://dd-b.net/photography/gallery/
Dragaera: http://dragaera.info

[Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)]

Of course not; I'm a cnidarian, and when they made me they broke the mold.

[Ted Nolan <tednolan>]

In article <19378304.3289.1335360337170.JavaMail.geo-discussion-forums@vbcg6>,

I think that's the original version of _The Forgotten Planet_. IIRC, he
wrapped a "seeded for life up to the insect & fungal stage" and then
lost in the bureaucracy and never finished terraforming frame around it
to put it in his "landing grid" universe.

[Greg Weeks]

It's about the first half of _The Forgotten Planet_. I couldn't remember what the second story or the combined titles were.

Greg Weeks

[Howard Brazee]

Was Herbert's _Saratoga Barrier_ drug a fungus?

--
"In no part of the constitution is more wisdom to be found,
than in the clause which confides the question of war or peace
to the legislature, and not to the executive department."

- James Madison

[Kay Shapero]

In article <MPG.2a01af3db...@news.aioe.org>,
lar...@peaksky.com says...

>
> In article <MPG.2a00d8e0a...@news.eternal-september.org>,
> k...@invalid.net says...

> >

> > It was supposed to be based on a catchphrase that was wandering around
> > Chicago at the time; I'm not entirely sure I want to know the details...
> > :)
>
> I never heard the song, but the phrase was current when I was a kid in the
> 1950s in Oregon. I have no idea how much older than that it is, but doubt it
> predates the 17th century.

True. :) Though I'm now having fun thinking of Linnaeus determining
the appropriate morphologies to be labeled fungi, and moments later
observing a nearby mushroom and murmuring "hmmmm... there's a fungus
amongus!" Though he'd have probably used latin and "fungus inter nos"
(assuming google translator is correct which is rather a big assumption)
just doesn't have the same kick. His native Swedish appears to be even
worse ("svamp bland oss"?). Oh well...

[Stewart Robert Hinsley]

In message
<17313064.2040.1335301916987.JavaMail.geo-discussion-forums@ynmm9>,
"icarp...@aol.com" <icarp...@aol.com> writes

>Innsmouth Free Press is publishing an anthology of stories centered
>around fungi.
>
>http://www.innsmouthfreepress.com/?p=17437
>
>They are trying to compile a database of stories, books and movies
>involving fungi. If you know of any and want to expand their database,
>you can follow the link provided.
>

>Matt

There's a George R.R. Martin short. I've I recall correctly it's "Men of
Graywater Station". (Also "A Song for Lya".)
--
Stewart Robert Hinsley

[Kip Williams]

icarp...@aol.com wrote:
> Innsmouth Free Press is publishing an anthology of stories centered around fungi.
>
> http://www.innsmouthfreepress.com/?p=17437
>
> They are trying to compile a database of stories, books and movies involving fungi. If you know of any and want to expand their database, you can follow the link provided.

There's lots of fungus in that Bradbury story about just how darn rainy
it gets on Venus. "The Long Rain," included in _The Illustrated Man_.

(In checking back, I see that David DeLaney invokes "Forty-two pounds of
edible fungus" from Homer Price. Superb.)


Kip W
rasfw

[Anthony Nance]

icarp...@aol.com <icarp...@aol.com> wrote:
> Innsmouth Free Press is publishing an anthology of stories centered around fungi.
>
> http://www.innsmouthfreepress.com/?p=17437
>
> They are trying to compile a database of stories, books and movies involving fungi. If you know of any and want to expand their database, you can follow the link provided.
>

> Matt


It's a bit of a spoiler to mention a certain Garrett PI book
by Glen Cook, so I'll leave some space before giving the title
and the reason it fits.

spoiler

space

for

a

Glen

Cook

Garrett

PI

Novel

just

in

case

In _Cruel Zinc Melodies_ the Weiders are building a theatre, and
the construction ultimately (as I skip over the detailed chain of
events) results in the awakening of a subterranean sentient fungus.

Tony

[Mark Zenier]

In article <17313064.2040.1335301916987.JavaMail.geo-discussion-forums@ynmm9>,

icarp...@aol.com <icarp...@aol.com> wrote:
>Innsmouth Free Press is publishing an anthology of stories centered around fungi.
>
>http://www.innsmouthfreepress.com/?p=17437
>
>They are trying to compile a database of stories, books and movies
>involving fungi. If you know of any and want to expand their database,
>you can follow the link provided.

_Hiero's Journey_ by Sterling Lanier

Maybe?: _The Vang: The Military Form_ and _The Vang: The Battlemaster_ by
Christopher Rowley

Mark Zenier mze...@eskimo.com
Googleproofaddress(account:mzenier provider:eskimo domain:com)

[Jerry Brown]

On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 14:11:56 -0700 (PDT), "icarp...@aol.com"

<icarp...@aol.com> wrote:

>Innsmouth Free Press is publishing an anthology of stories centered around fungi.
>
>http://www.innsmouthfreepress.com/?p=17437
>
>They are trying to compile a database of stories, books and movies involving fungi. If you know of any and want to expand their database, you can follow the link provided.
>

>Matt

Stanley Weinbaum: "Parasite Planet"

--
Jerry Brown

A cat may look at a king
(but probably won't bother)

[William December Starr]

In article <19378304.3289.1335360337170.JavaMail.geo-discussion-forums@vbcg6>,

Greg Weeks <gweeks....@gmail.com> said:

> The Mad Planet by Murray Leinster
> http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/35425

_Love and War_, an original Doctor Who novel (7th Doctor) by Paul
Cornell.

The Doctor explains that the fungus is an alien life form,
known as the Hoothi. The Hoothi feed on death and decay, and
travel in giant organic spheres filled with toxic gases that
are invisible to tracking systems. They are master planners,
laying traps for their enemies across time; everyone infected
by the spores is now linked to the Hoothi group mind, and
they can use them to gather intelligence or do their bidding,
before eventually transforming them into fungus creatures.

-- <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Love_and_War_(Doctor_Who)>

-- wds

[Robert Carnegie]

They've got that one, but they didn't have
_Parasite_ by Jim Mortimore, in which fungus is
just one of many aggressive forms of life
inhabiting the strange world that is The Artifact,
and I think they didn't have Brian Aldiss's
_Hothouse_, either, in which one major character
is a fungus infection. There's sort of a theme of
ignoring fungus unless it becomes personal.

And there's a Marvel Comics character called
Death's Head, but he's a scary robot mercenary
and not fungus-related, and I'm not sure if
that's really the name of one anyway. Most of
the Google references to it are from _Shrooms_.

[ncw...@hotmail.com]

On Wednesday, April 25, 2012 3:32:07 AM UTC+2, Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor) wrote:
> On 4/24/12 6:26 PM, Paul Ciszek wrote:
> > In article<17313064.2040.1335301916987.JavaMail.geo-discussion-forums@ynmm9>,

> > icarp...@aol.com<icarp...@aol.com> wrote:
> >> Innsmouth Free Press is publishing an anthology of stories centered
> >> around fungi.
> >>
> >> http://www.innsmouthfreepress.com/?p=17437
> >>
> >> They are trying to compile a database of stories, books and movies
> >> involving fungi. If you know of any and want to expand their database,
> >> you can follow the link provided.
> >

> > What I want to find is the movie that contained a line that my parents,
> > some of my teachers, and even John Denver on a muppet special would
> > quote: "There is a fungus among us!"
>
> At which point John started singing:
>
> "Nobody knows
> The truffles I've seen..."
>
> And the fungi attacked him.
>

ObLonnieDonegan: I say, I say, I say, My dustbin's absolutely full with toadstools (How do you know it's full) 'Cos there's not mush room inside


Cheers,
Nigel.

[Linda Taber]

On Apr 27, 7:39 am, ncwa...@hotmail.com wrote:
> On Wednesday, April 25, 2012 3:32:07 AM UTC+2, Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor) wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On 4/24/12 6:26 PM, Paul Ciszek wrote:
> > > In article<17313064.2040.1335301916987.JavaMail.geo-discussion-forums@ynmm9>,

> > > icarpen...@aol.com<icarpen...@aol.com>  wrote:

> > >> Innsmouth Free Press is publishing an anthology of stories centered
> > >> around fungi.
>
> > >>http://www.innsmouthfreepress.com/?p=17437
>
> > >> They are trying to compile a database of stories, books and movies
> > >> involving fungi.  If you know of any and want to expand their database,
> > >> you can follow the link provided.
>
> > > What I want to find is the movie that contained a line that my parents,
> > > some of my teachers, and even John Denver on a muppet special would
> > > quote:  "There is a fungus among us!"
>
> >    At which point John started singing:
>
> >    "Nobody knows
> >     The truffles I've seen..."
>
> >    And the fungi attacked him.
>
> ObLonnieDonegan: I say, I say, I say, My dustbin's absolutely full with toadstools (How do you know it's full) 'Cos there's not mush room inside
>
> Cheers,
> Nigel.

There was a book in the '50s or '60s, the title of which escapes me --
A SCENT OF GRASS?? The ISFD doesn't seem to recognize it. A fungus,
I think, consumed/altered the infected person. The reclusive woman,
growing gradually into something else in her darkened bedroom,
thinking to herself, "it's almost like growing something" has remained
with me. Ah hah: maybe John Christopher, NO BLADE OF GRASS?

Doug

[Dorothy J Heydt]

In article <cd76f0c8-6f37-430c...@9g2000yqp.googlegroups.com>,

I haven't been following this thread much.

But has anyone mentioned _The Wonderful Flight to the Mushroom
Planet_?

--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
Should you wish to email me, you'd better use the gmail edress.
Kithrup's all spammy and hotmail's been hacked.

[Dorothy J Heydt]

[original attribution lost, sorry]

>>> > > What I want to find is the movie that contained a line that my parents,
>>> > > some of my teachers, and even John Denver on a muppet special would
>>> > > quote:  "There is a fungus among us!"

[followups snipped]

I don't know about the movie.

But I know a book (written in the mid-1950s but, from internal
evidence, set during WWII) in which a young girl uses what appears
to have been a popular remark at the time: "There's a fungus among
us and malaria in the area."

(Mary Bard, _Just Be Yourself_, 1956.)

[Brian M. Scott]

On Wed, 25 Apr 2012 12:37:02 -0600, Howard Brazee
<how...@brazee.net> wrote in
<news:i1hgp75pcen2blkh6...@4ax.com> in
rec.arts.sf.written:

> Was Herbert's _Saratoga Barrier_ drug a fungus?

I'm not sure that we ever found out what it was, but the
book's title is _The Santaroga Barrier_.

Brian

[Howard Brazee]

Thanks. That's one book I never bought, after reading it serialized.

[Joy Beeson]

On Sat, 28 Apr 2012 20:23:43 -0700 (PDT), Linda Taber
<lta...@gmail.com> wrote:

> There was a book in the '50s or '60s, the title of which escapes me --
> A SCENT OF GRASS?? The ISFD doesn't seem to recognize it. A fungus,
> I think, consumed/altered the infected person. The reclusive woman,
> growing gradually into something else in her darkened bedroom,
> thinking to herself, "it's almost like growing something" has remained
> with me. Ah hah: maybe John Christopher, NO BLADE OF GRASS?

I vaguely recall a book of that era called "A Scent of New-Mown Hay".
Ah, Wikipedia says that John Blackburn wrote a horror novel of that
name in 1958.

--
Joy Beeson
joy beeson at comcast dot net
http://roughsewing.home.comcast.net/
The above message is a Usenet post.
I don't recall having given anyone permission to use it on a Web site.

[Linda Taber]

On Apr 29, 12:36 pm, Joy Beeson <jbee...@invalid.net.invalid> wrote:
> On Sat, 28 Apr 2012 20:23:43 -0700 (PDT), Linda Taber
>

> <ltab...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > There was a book in the '50s or '60s, the title of which escapes me --
> > A SCENT OF GRASS??  The ISFD doesn't seem to recognize it.  A fungus,
> > I think, consumed/altered the infected person.  The reclusive woman,
> > growing gradually into something else in her darkened bedroom,
> > thinking to herself, "it's almost like growing something" has remained
> > with me.  Ah hah: maybe John Christopher, NO BLADE OF GRASS?
>
> I vaguely recall a book of that era called "A Scent of New-Mown Hay".
> Ah, Wikipedia says that John Blackburn wrote a horror novel of that
> name in 1958.
>
> --
> Joy Beeson

> joy beeson at comcast dot nethttp://roughsewing.home.comcast.net/

> The above message is a Usenet post.
> I don't recall having given anyone permission to use it on a Web site.

That's the one. It came to me this morning, and I tracked it down via
Amazon. Strange that it's not in the ISFDB.

Doug

[David DeLaney]

Dorothy J Heydt <djh...@kithrup.com> wrote:
>But has anyone mentioned _The Wonderful Flight to the Mushroom Planet_?

Yes, right near the top. They mentioned the sequels but didn't name them
specifically (Stowaway to the Mushroom Planet, Mr. Bass's Planetoid, A Mystery
for Mr. Bass, and Time and Mr. Bass). Of which I'm still missing the last
three. :(

Dave
--
\/David DeLaney posting from d...@vic.com "It's not the pot that grows the flower
It's not the clock that slows the hour The definition's plain for anyone to see
Love is all it takes to make a family" - R&P. VISUALIZE HAPPYNET VRbeable<BLINK>
http://www.vic.com/~dbd/ - net.legends FAQ & Magic / I WUV you in all CAPS! --K.

[Ted Nolan <tednolan>]

In article <slrnjprhd...@gatekeeper.vic.com>,

David DeLaney <d...@vic.com> wrote:
>Dorothy J Heydt <djh...@kithrup.com> wrote:
>>But has anyone mentioned _The Wonderful Flight to the Mushroom Planet_?
>
>Yes, right near the top. They mentioned the sequels but didn't name them
>specifically (Stowaway to the Mushroom Planet, Mr. Bass's Planetoid, A Mystery
>for Mr. Bass, and Time and Mr. Bass). Of which I'm still missing the last
>three. :(
>

I remember the last one as being very creepy as a kid. The whole "Narrow
Brain" as the villian thing..

[Kay Shapero]

In article <a06blj...@mid.individual.net>, t...@loft.tnolan.com
says...

>
> In article <slrnjprhd...@gatekeeper.vic.com>, David DeLaney
> <d...@vic.com> wrote:

> > orothy J Heydt <djh...@kithrup.com> wrote:
> >> but has anyone mentioned _The Wonderful Flight to the Mushroom
> >> Planet_?
> >

> > es, right near the top. They mentioned the sequels but didn't name
> > them specifically (Stowaway to the Mushroom Planet, Mr. Bass's

> > Planetoid, A Mystery or Mr. Bass, and Time and Mr. Bass). Of which

> > I'm still missing the last three. :(
> >
>
> I remember the last one as being very creepy as a kid. The whole
> "Narrow Brain" as the villian thing..

I vaguely recall a really creepy story I encountered as a kid about a
couple who get stranded on an island (possibly with others), which has a
fungus that grows on EVERYTHING. Hygvzngryl vapyhqvat gurz fb gurl
ershfr gb or erfphrq (nyfb gurl ybbx cerggl fcbatl). Anybody know what
this is?

[Butch Malahide]

On Apr 30, 3:57 am, Kay Shapero <k...@invalid.net> wrote:
> I vaguely recall a really creepy story I encountered as a kid about a
> couple who get stranded on an island (possibly with others), which has a
> fungus that grows on EVERYTHING. Hygvzngryl vapyhqvat gurz fb gurl
> ershfr gb or erfphrq (nyfb gurl ybbx cerggl fcbatl). Anybody know what
> this is?

"The Voice in the Night" by William Hope Hodgson:

http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/title.cgi?58911

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Voice_in_the_Night

Plot summary lifted from E. F. Bleiler's _Science Fiction: The Early
Years_:

"Somewhere in the North Pacific, the narrator who is fogbound on a
small vessel, is hailed by an unseen man in a rowboat. The
circumstances are suspicious, particularly when the stranger, who asks
for food, will not come close to the ship and insists that the lights
be extinguished. But the compassionate sailors float a box of supplies
to him. Some time later the invisible rower returns and tells his
story from out of the fog. Victims of a shipwreck, he and his fiancee
have been living on a nearby island that is covered with fungi. The
fungus is not only omnipresent, but some examples are shaped like
trees and humans. The narrator and his fiancee tried to avoid the
fungus, but after a time observed that it was sprouting on them. There
was nothing they could do, for even carbolic acid would not kill it.
When their food was nearly gone, they yielded to temptation and began
to eat the fungus, though with strong feelings of guilt. They do not
expect to live long. As the stranger moves away, the fog lifts for a
moment, and the sailors see what seems to be a blob-shaped fungus in
the rowboat."

I think the Hodgson must be the one your looking for. A later story on
the same theme, but different (SPOILER: it has a happy ending) and
much less famous, is "Fungus Isle" by Philip M. Fisher.

http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/title.cgi?91734

[Butch Malahide]

On Apr 30, 6:07 am, Butch Malahide <fred.gal...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Apr 30, 3:57 am, Kay Shapero <k...@invalid.net> wrote:
>
> > I vaguely recall a really creepy story I encountered as a kid about a
> > couple who get stranded on an island (possibly with others), which has a
> > fungus that grows on EVERYTHING. Hygvzngryl vapyhqvat gurz fb gurl
> > ershfr gb or erfphrq (nyfb gurl ybbx cerggl fcbatl). Anybody know what
> > this is?
>
> "The Voice in the Night" by William Hope Hodgson:

Oops, I just noticed that Hodgson's story (more precisely the Japanese
movie based on it) was already mentioned by "tphile2" near the
beginning of this thread.

[Paul Ciszek]

In article <2f8543f9-7d7a-49e8...@z17g2000yqf.googlegroups.com>,

Butch Malahide <fred....@gmail.com> wrote:
>On Apr 30, 3:57 am, Kay Shapero <k...@invalid.net> wrote:
>> I vaguely recall a really creepy story I encountered as a kid about a
>> couple who get stranded on an island (possibly with others), which has a
>> fungus that grows on EVERYTHING. Hygvzngryl vapyhqvat gurz fb gurl
>> ershfr gb or erfphrq (nyfb gurl ybbx cerggl fcbatl). Anybody know what
>> this is?
>
>"The Voice in the Night" by William Hope Hodgson:

There was a series of stories about oddball biology published in Asimovs',
centered around a university in, I think, Wisconsin. One of them
featured bit of land that had been inexpicably uplifted recently, the
top of which had undergone some weird ecological changes to the point
where it was dominated by slime molds. The slime molds were evolving
rapidly and in strange directions, and one of their "tricks" was using
available objects as makeshift "skeletons" that would enable them to
do things they would not otherwise be able to do. This may have
included using the bodies of people who had already succumed to
slime mold infestation to improve their locomotion. The POV
guy escapes via hang glider and radios ahead to make sure that he
and everything on his hang glider are hosed down with disinfectant
the moment he lands. No one believes him when he claims that the
flannel shirt stuck to the upper surface of his glider had been
slithering around.

I know the author was Kandis Elliot because I was able to look up
another story in the series ("Cretaceous Park"), but I do not know
the title of the slime mold story. None of the titles on ISFDB
seem to fit.

Wil McCarthy wrote a slime mold story set on a tropical island.
It had a Lovecraftian flavor to it--the biologist barely makes
it back to civilization alive, relates his story as he is dying
in a hospital, most of it is dismissed as the ravings of a
fevered brain, etc.

--
Please reply to: | "We establish no religion in this country, we
pciszek at panix dot com | command no worship, we mandate no belief, nor
Autoreply is disabled | will we ever. Church and state are, and must
| remain, separate." --Ronald Reagan, 10/26/1984

[Howard Brazee]

On Mon, 30 Apr 2012 13:32:36 +0000 (UTC), nos...@nospam.com (Paul
Ciszek) wrote:

>slime molds


Slime molds aren't fungi.

[Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)]

On 4/30/12 4:57 AM, Kay Shapero wrote:
> In article<a06blj...@mid.individual.net>, t...@loft.tnolan.com
> says...
>>
>> In article<slrnjprhd...@gatekeeper.vic.com>, David DeLaney
>> <d...@vic.com> wrote:
>>> orothy J Heydt<djh...@kithrup.com> wrote:
>>>> but has anyone mentioned _The Wonderful Flight to the Mushroom
>>>> Planet_?
>>>
>>> es, right near the top. They mentioned the sequels but didn't name
>>> them specifically (Stowaway to the Mushroom Planet, Mr. Bass's
>>> Planetoid, A Mystery or Mr. Bass, and Time and Mr. Bass). Of which
>>> I'm still missing the last three. :(
>>>
>>
>> I remember the last one as being very creepy as a kid. The whole
>> "Narrow Brain" as the villian thing..
>
> I vaguely recall a really creepy story I encountered as a kid about a
> couple who get stranded on an island (possibly with others), which has a
> fungus that grows on EVERYTHING. Hygvzngryl vapyhqvat gurz fb gurl
> ershfr gb or erfphrq (nyfb gurl ybbx cerggl fcbatl). Anybody know what
> this is?
>

Interesting. I'd presume that was the basis for the Japanese horror
film "Matango", as the plot summary is very close.


--
Sea Wasp
/^\
;;;
Website: http://www.grandcentralarena.com Blog:
http://seawasp.livejournal.com

[michael]

On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 14:11:56 -0700 (PDT), "icarp...@aol.com"

<icarp...@aol.com> wrote:

>Innsmouth Free Press is publishing an anthology of stories centered around fungi.
>
>http://www.innsmouthfreepress.com/?p=17437
>
>They are trying to compile a database of stories, books and movies involving fungi. If you know of any and want to expand their database, you can follow the link provided.
>

>Matt

In Sterling Lanier's "Hiero's Journey", the protagonist engages in
a series of skirmishes with a colony of mutated, sentient fungi.

The story is a post-apocalyptic quest through the ruins of what
had once been North America.

[Butch Malahide]

On Apr 30, 8:51 am, "Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)"

That movie (aka "Attack of the Mushroom People) is indeed based on
William Hope Hodgson's "The Voice in the Night" according to the IMDB
and the Wikipedia articles on the movie and the story.

[Michael Stemper]

In article <is6tp79p7eqs2i35m...@4ax.com>, michael <m...@here.com> writes:
>On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 14:11:56 -0700 (PDT), "icarp...@aol.com" <icarp...@aol.com> wrote:

>>Innsmouth Free Press is publishing an anthology of stories centered around fungi.
>>
>>http://www.innsmouthfreepress.com/?p=17437
>>
>>They are trying to compile a database of stories, books and movies involving fungi. If you know of any and want to expand their database, you can follow the link provided.
>

>In Sterling Lanier's "Hiero's Journey", the protagonist engages in
>a series of skirmishes with a colony of mutated, sentient fungi.
>
>The story is a post-apocalyptic quest through the ruins of what
>had once been North America.

Has anybody mentioned the forest of mushrooms in _Journey to the Center
of the Earth_? (Or was that only in the movie?)

--
Michael F. Stemper
#include <Standard_Disclaimer>
There is three erors in this sentence.

[Paul Ciszek]

In article <jk5tp7pfheb7sarbk...@4ax.com>,

Howard Brazee <how...@brazee.net> wrote:
>On Mon, 30 Apr 2012 13:32:36 +0000 (UTC), nos...@nospam.com (Paul
>Ciszek) wrote:
>
>>slime molds
>
>Slime molds aren't fungi.

No, but depending on whose cladistic tree you accept, they're not that
far away.

The story described in the article to which I was replying contained
elements in common with two slime mold stories by different authors.

[Howard Brazee]

On Mon, 30 Apr 2012 19:32:28 +0000 (UTC), nos...@nospam.com (Paul

Ciszek) wrote:

>
>In article <jk5tp7pfheb7sarbk...@4ax.com>,
>Howard Brazee <how...@brazee.net> wrote:
>>On Mon, 30 Apr 2012 13:32:36 +0000 (UTC), nos...@nospam.com (Paul
>>Ciszek) wrote:
>>
>>>slime molds
>>
>>Slime molds aren't fungi.
>
>No, but depending on whose cladistic tree you accept, they're not that
>far away.
>
>The story described in the article to which I was replying contained
>elements in common with two slime mold stories by different authors.

Slime molds are, IMHO, more fun for SF, as they are *weird*!

[Robert Carnegie]

Is Larry Niven's (ROT13) "avtug ba zvfcrp zbbe" a fungus story?

YASID: a fairly old short story, possibly a British writer,
where a ship of the solar system(?) fleet is attacked by
red stuff that grows slowly but basically irresistibly.
I think the crew successfully evacuate to another ship,
or so they think... was that fungus, or can't they tell?
I thought "Red Weed", but that is mainly listed as from
_The War of the Worlds_.

[Chris]

On Apr 24, 5:11 pm, "icarpen...@aol.com" <icarpen...@aol.com> wrote:
> Innsmouth Free Press is publishing an anthology of stories centered around fungi.
>
> http://www.innsmouthfreepress.com/?p=17437
>
> They are trying to compile a database of stories, books and movies involving fungi.  If you know of any and want to expand their database, you can follow the link provided.
>

> Matt

Stephen King had a short story about a guy who sends his kid to the
store for beer. He opens one and chugs it before realizes it had gone
really, really bad. IIRC he turns into some kind of mobile, monster
man-eating fungal creature. Anyone know?

Also, there was a drug pusher in Chalker's _Midnight at the Well of
Souls_. I believe the drug he was using to control the female victim
in the story was some kind of fungus.

[Kay Shapero]

In article <2f8543f9-7d7a-49e8-8717-
0ff023...@z17g2000yqf.googlegroups.com>, fred....@gmail.com
says...

>
> On Apr 30, 3:57 am, Kay Shapero <k...@invalid.net> wrote:
> > I vaguely recall a really creepy story I encountered as a kid about a
> > couple who get stranded on an island (possibly with others), which has a
> > fungus that grows on EVERYTHING. Hygvzngryl vapyhqvat gurz fb gurl
> > ershfr gb or erfphrq (nyfb gurl ybbx cerggl fcbatl). Anybody know what
> > this is?
>
> "The Voice in the Night" by William Hope Hodgson:
>

That's it. Don't recall it giving me nightmares but it probably should
have. :)

[Kurt Busiek]

On 2012-04-30 22:53:36 +0000, Chris <chris.li...@gmail.com> said:

> On Apr 24, 5:11 pm, "icarpen...@aol.com" <icarpen...@aol.com> wrote:
>> Innsmouth Free Press is publishing an anthology of stories centered
>> around fungi.
>>
>> http://www.innsmouthfreepress.com/?p=17437
>>
>> They are trying to compile a database of stories, books and movies involv
> ing fungi.  If you know of any and want to expand their database, you can
> follow the link provided.
>>
>> Matt
>
> Stephen King had a short story about a guy who sends his kid to the
> store for beer. He opens one and chugs it before realizes it had gone
> really, really bad. IIRC he turns into some kind of mobile, monster
> man-eating fungal creature. Anyone know?

"Gray Matter."

kdb
--
Visit http://www.busiek.com -- for all your Busiek needs!

[Ted Nolan <tednolan>]

In article <10222640.2796.1335825817887.JavaMail.geo-discussion-forums@vbx14>,

That sort of puts me in the mind of a Nourse where the ship is filled
with some sort of growing protoplasm that is happy to engulf and eat
crew members. They didn't have anything that would kill it, though it
could be stunned with a blowtorch.

The solution was that they had to *eat* it. It was awful, and even the
stunned, cut, portions would quiver on the plate, but they were able to
keep it sufficently in check to get home and be able to abandon ship.

I doubt it was a fungus, but I liked that story.

[David DeLaney]

Robert Carnegie <rja.ca...@excite.com> wrote:
>Is Larry Niven's (ROT13) "avtug ba zvfcrp zbbe" a fungus story?

As far as anyone can tell without getting close enough to be affected, yes.

[Stewart Robert Hinsley]

In message <jnmpcc$17i$1...@reader1.panix.com>, Paul Ciszek
<nos...@nospam.com> writes

>
>In article <jk5tp7pfheb7sarbk...@4ax.com>,
>Howard Brazee <how...@brazee.net> wrote:
>>On Mon, 30 Apr 2012 13:32:36 +0000 (UTC), nos...@nospam.com (Paul
>>Ciszek) wrote:
>>
>>>slime molds
>>
>>Slime molds aren't fungi.
>
>No, but depending on whose cladistic tree you accept, they're not that
>far away.

Only in the case of fonticulid slime molds.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slime_mold

>
>The story described in the article to which I was replying contained
>elements in common with two slime mold stories by different authors.
>
--

Stewart Robert Hinsley

[Michael Stemper]

In article <slrnjpuuo...@gatekeeper.vic.com>, d...@gatekeeper.vic.com (David DeLaney) writes:
>Robert Carnegie <rja.ca...@excite.com> wrote:

>>Is Larry Niven's (ROT13) "avtug ba zvfcrp zbbe" a fungus story?
>
>As far as anyone can tell without getting close enough to be affected, yes.

Fungus? I thought that it was a virus.

--
Michael F. Stemper
#include <Standard_Disclaimer>

I feel more like I do now than I did when I came in.

[Michael Stemper]

In article <2130d70e-a214-413d...@n5g2000vbf.googlegroups.com>, Chris <chris.li...@gmail.com> writes:
>On Apr 24, 5:11=A0pm, "icarpen...@aol.com" <icarpen...@aol.com> wrote:
>> Innsmouth Free Press is publishing an anthology of stories centered aroun=
>d fungi.

>Stephen King had a short story about a guy who sends his kid to the
>store for beer. He opens one and chugs it before realizes it had gone
>really, really bad. IIRC he turns into some kind of mobile, monster
>man-eating fungal creature. Anyone know?

No, but that reminds me of Dick's "The Father-Thing". The pods in which
the x-things were formed seemed to be fungal in nature.

[Chris]

On Apr 30, 7:54 pm, Kurt Busiek <k...@busiek.com> wrote:

> Visithttp://www.busiek.com-- for all your Busiek needs!

Good call!

Chris

[Greg Goss]

Linda Taber <lta...@gmail.com> wrote:

>There was a book in the '50s or '60s, the title of which escapes me --
>A SCENT OF GRASS?? The ISFD doesn't seem to recognize it. A fungus,
>I think, consumed/altered the infected person. The reclusive woman,
>growing gradually into something else in her darkened bedroom,
>thinking to herself, "it's almost like growing something" has remained
>with me. Ah hah: maybe John Christopher, NO BLADE OF GRASS?

Not that one -- standard British disaster novel of its period where
most crops vanish with a new plant disease. Nothing except hunger
directly affects the people.
--
I used to own a mind like a steel trap.
Perhaps if I'd specified a brass one, it
wouldn't have rusted like this.

[Marcus L. Rowland]

In message
<cd76f0c8-6f37-430c...@9g2000yqp.googlegroups.com>, Linda
Taber <lta...@gmail.com> writes
>On Apr 27, 7:39 am, ncwa...@hotmail.com wrote:
>> On Wednesday, April 25, 2012 3:32:07 AM UTC+2, Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor) wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> > On 4/24/12 6:26 PM, Paul Ciszek wrote:
>> > > In
>> >
>> > >>article<17313064.2040.1335301916987.JavaMail.geo-discussion-forums@ynmm9>,

>> > > icarpen...@aol.com<icarpen...@aol.com>  wrote:
>> > >> Innsmouth Free Press is publishing an anthology of stories centered
>> > >> around fungi.
>>
>> > >>http://www.innsmouthfreepress.com/?p=17437
>>
>> > >> They are trying to compile a database of stories, books and movies

>> > >> involving fungi.  If you know of any and want to expand their database,

>> > >> you can follow the link provided.
>>

>> > > What I want to find is the movie that contained a line that my parents,
>> > > some of my teachers, and even John Denver on a muppet special would
>> > > quote:  "There is a fungus among us!"
>>
>> >    At which point John started singing:
>>
>> >    "Nobody knows
>> >     The truffles I've seen..."
>>
>> >    And the fungi attacked him.
>>
>> ObLonnieDonegan: I say, I say, I say, My dustbin's absolutely full
>>with toadstools (How do you know it's full) 'Cos there's not mush room
>>inside
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Nigel.

>
>There was a book in the '50s or '60s, the title of which escapes me --
>A SCENT OF GRASS?? The ISFD doesn't seem to recognize it. A fungus,
>I think, consumed/altered the infected person. The reclusive woman,
>growing gradually into something else in her darkened bedroom,
>thinking to herself, "it's almost like growing something" has remained
>with me. Ah hah: maybe John Christopher, NO BLADE OF GRASS?
>

>Doug

_A Scent of New Mown Hay_ by John Blackburn (1961) probably - it's an
evil fungus novel, Blackburn's first book (written in 1958).

Later edit - ok, someone else spotted it first - I'm very pleased to say
I remembered the author and all but one word of the title correctly
without looking it up, which pleased me immensely. The little grey cells
still work, to some extent...
--
Marcus L. Rowland www.forgottenfutures.com
www.forgottenfutures.org
www.forgottenfutures.co.uk
Forgotten Futures - The Scientific Romance Role Playing Game
Diana: Warrior Princess & Elvis: The Legendary Tours
The Original Flatland Role Playing Game

[Nix]

On 1 May 2012, Ted Nolan outgrape:

> That sort of puts me in the mind of a Nourse where the ship is filled
> with some sort of growing protoplasm that is happy to engulf and eat
> crew members. They didn't have anything that would kill it, though it
> could be stunned with a blowtorch.
>
> The solution was that they had to *eat* it. It was awful, and even the
> stunned, cut, portions would quiver on the plate, but they were able to
> keep it sufficently in check to get home and be able to abandon ship.

Sounds like someting out of Harry Potter and the Terrible Plotting,
where if you have a bowl full of horrible toxic nasty stuff with
something you need at the bottom of it, and a cup, of *course* you can
only empty the bowl by repeatedly drinking the horrible toxic nasty
stuff and dying heroically for the cause, rather than, e.g. just
reaching into the bowl to fish the thing you need out, or (safer) using
the cup to empty the bowl onto the floor.

I note that three-year-olds readily come up with this solution, but
Rowling didn't manage to.

--
NULL && (void)

[Ted Nolan <tednolan>]

In article <87k40mz...@spindle.srvr.nix>,

As I recall it, Dumbledore came to the conclusion that it had to be
drunk. We weren't privy to his thought processes, but presumably
he recognized the type of magic and its requirements. In fact, it
probably would have undercut the scene (probably the single
best in the series) if Harry had started raising all these objections
and Dumbledore had to explain everything. Presumably Harry went over
them mentally and concluded that Dumbledore knew what he was about.

[Robert Carnegie]

It's like: why can't you quit the Triwizarding Tournament
in "Goblet of Fire" when it's dangerous? Because magic.
Or, the defences around the Philosopher's Stone: why do
you have to solve the puzzles? Because if you don't,
then you don't get the prize.

[Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)]

She managed to. She also had Dumbledore say that you HAD to do it this
way, which meant that Dumbledore had figured out that the magic wouldn't
LET you do it. IIRC, Harry DID try emptying it out in a mundane fashion
and it wouldn't work. The magic made it so you could ONLY access it by
doing things Voldemort's way.

[Nix]

On 9 May 2012, Sea Wasp stated:

Firstly, that's a cheat: it's tantamount to saying "the reason you can
only do it this way is that the plot wouldn't work if another route was
open". But more importantly, if Voldemort had figured out that someone
was likely to find the Horcrux such that he had put ridiculous
protections like that on it, why not dump a ton of concrete on top of it
as well? Leaving it out in the open was just stupid villainy (though by
this point it is plain, after the demented and almost-entirely-avoidable
plot of book 4, that either Voldemort is a really thick villain or
Rowling is better at coming up with complex plots than in analyzing
those plots for giant gaping holes where anybody with her characters'
stated goals would have done something much more sensible.)

Sure, this is not HPMoR, but the ridiculousness of this particular bit
just blew my WSOD completely out of the water.

--
NULL && (void)

[David DeLaney]

Nix <nix-ra...@esperi.org.uk> wrote:
>Firstly, that's a cheat: it's tantamount to saying "the reason you can
>only do it this way is that the plot wouldn't work if another route was
>open". But more importantly, if Voldemort had figured out that someone
>was likely to find the Horcrux such that he had put ridiculous
>protections like that on it, why not dump a ton of concrete on top of it
>as well? Leaving it out in the open was just stupid villainy (though by
>this point it is plain, after the demented and almost-entirely-avoidable
>plot of book 4, that either Voldemort is a really thick villain or
>Rowling is better at coming up with complex plots than in analyzing
>those plots for giant gaping holes where anybody with her characters'
>stated goals would have done something much more sensible.)
>
>Sure, this is not HPMoR, but the ridiculousness of this particular bit
>just blew my WSOD completely out of the water.

I surfed through it in the original Harry Potter books without much trouble;
after all, it's fairly prominent there that wizards, collectively, are NOT
the brightest salamanders in the bonfire.

HP&tMoR does poke savage fun at both said demented plot (in a one-or-two-
paragraph reference) and the "where would you hide them?" subplot.
(Rational!Quirrel poses it to rational!Harry as an, er, riddle, and seems to
be slightly unexpecting of Harry's answer...)

[Howard Brazee]

On Wed, 09 May 2012 19:22:52 -0400, d...@gatekeeper.vic.com (David
DeLaney) wrote:

>I surfed through it in the original Harry Potter books without much trouble;
>after all, it's fairly prominent there that wizards, collectively, are NOT
>the brightest salamanders in the bonfire.

I suppose when you have magic, you don't need brains so much.

[Robert Carnegie]

On Wednesday, May 9, 2012 5:09:43 PM UTC+1, Nix wrote:
> On 9 May 2012, Sea Wasp stated:
>

> > IIRC, Harry DID try emptying it out in a
> > mundane fashion and it wouldn't work. The magic made it so you could
> > ONLY access it by doing things Voldemort's way.
>
> Firstly, that's a cheat: it's tantamount to saying "the reason you can
> only do it this way is that the plot wouldn't work if another route was
> open". But more importantly, if Voldemort had figured out that someone
> was likely to find the Horcrux such that he had put ridiculous
> protections like that on it, why not dump a ton of concrete on top of it
> as well? Leaving it out in the open was just stupid villainy (though by
> this point it is plain, after the demented and almost-entirely-avoidable
> plot of book 4, that either Voldemort is a really thick villain or
> Rowling is better at coming up with complex plots than in analyzing
> those plots for giant gaping holes where anybody with her characters'
> stated goals would have done something much more sensible.)

Maybe Voldie wanted to be able to retrieve it himself.
After all, it's part of him. Of course he'd need to
bring a victim...

[David DeLaney]

Howard Brazee <how...@brazee.net> wrote:
>d...@gatekeeper.vic.com (David DeLaney) wrote:
>>I surfed through it in the original Harry Potter books without much trouble;
>>after all, it's fairly prominent there that wizards, collectively, are NOT
>>the brightest salamanders in the bonfire.
>
>I suppose when you have magic, you don't need brains so much.

This also explains a _lot_ about the collective behavior of various pantheons,
and even individual deities.

[Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)]

On 5/10/12 12:41 AM, David DeLaney wrote:
> Howard Brazee<how...@brazee.net> wrote:
>> d...@gatekeeper.vic.com (David DeLaney) wrote:
>>> I surfed through it in the original Harry Potter books without much trouble;
>>> after all, it's fairly prominent there that wizards, collectively, are NOT
>>> the brightest salamanders in the bonfire.
>>
>> I suppose when you have magic, you don't need brains so much.
>
> This also explains a _lot_ about the collective behavior of various pantheons,
> and even individual deities.

Or superheroes. For a long time there was no indication that Superman
knew anything of TECHNIQUE in how to fight, because he really didn't
ever have any reason to learn. "I swing my fist, I hit it, it goes down."

[Howard Brazee]

On Thu, 10 May 2012 08:13:49 -0400, "Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)"
<sea...@sgeinc.invalid.com> wrote:

>>> I suppose when you have magic, you don't need brains so much.
>>
>> This also explains a _lot_ about the collective behavior of various pantheons,
>> and even individual deities.
>
> Or superheroes. For a long time there was no indication that Superman
>knew anything of TECHNIQUE in how to fight, because he really didn't
>ever have any reason to learn. "I swing my fist, I hit it, it goes down."

I wonder how he got so buff looking. Isometrics?

[Michael Stemper]

In article <6gulq7t6vlnl9poht...@4ax.com>, Howard Brazee <how...@brazee.net> writes:
>On Wed, 09 May 2012 19:22:52 -0400, d...@gatekeeper.vic.com (David DeLaney) wrote:

>>I surfed through it in the original Harry Potter books without much trouble;
>>after all, it's fairly prominent there that wizards, collectively, are NOT
>>the brightest salamanders in the bonfire.
>
>I suppose when you have magic, you don't need brains so much.

The same idea was portrayed earlier, in Niven's _World of Ptavvs_. Since
the Thrintun could use the Power to make others meet their needs, there
was never really any selection for intelligence. I believe that the
narration describes them as being about as bright as a human with an
I.Q. of 75.

(Use as many grains of salt regarding the validity of "I.Q." as you need.)

--
Michael F. Stemper
#include <Standard_Disclaimer>

COFFEE.SYS not found. Abort, Retry, Fail?

[Bill Snyder]

On Thu, 10 May 2012 16:59:22 +0000 (UTC),
mste...@walkabout.empros.com (Michael Stemper) wrote:

>In article <6gulq7t6vlnl9poht...@4ax.com>, Howard Brazee <how...@brazee.net> writes:
>>On Wed, 09 May 2012 19:22:52 -0400, d...@gatekeeper.vic.com (David DeLaney) wrote:
>
>>>I surfed through it in the original Harry Potter books without much trouble;
>>>after all, it's fairly prominent there that wizards, collectively, are NOT
>>>the brightest salamanders in the bonfire.
>>
>>I suppose when you have magic, you don't need brains so much.
>
>The same idea was portrayed earlier, in Niven's _World of Ptavvs_. Since
>the Thrintun could use the Power to make others meet their needs, there
>was never really any selection for intelligence. I believe that the
>narration describes them as being about as bright as a human with an
>I.Q. of 75.

A typical Usenet poster, in fact.

--
Bill Snyder [This space unintentionally left blank]

[Lawrence Watt-Evans]

On 2012-05-10 09:49:21 -0400, Howard Brazee said:

> On Thu, 10 May 2012 08:13:49 -0400, "Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)"
> <sea...@sgeinc.invalid.com> wrote:
>
>>>> I suppose when you have magic, you don't need brains so much.
>>>
>>> This also explains a _lot_ about the collective behavior of various pantheons,
>>> and even individual deities.
>>
>> Or superheroes. For a long time there was no indication that Superman
>> knew anything of TECHNIQUE in how to fight, because he really didn't
>> ever have any reason to learn. "I swing my fist, I hit it, it goes down."
>
> I wonder how he got so buff looking. Isometrics?

Kryptonian genetics. Apparently Kryptonians don't store fat the way humans do.


--
Now available on Amazon or B&N: One-Eyed Jack.
Greg Kraft could see ghosts. That didn't mean he could stop them...

[Nix]

On 10 May 2012, Sea Wasp stated:

> On 5/10/12 12:41 AM, David DeLaney wrote:
>> Howard Brazee<how...@brazee.net> wrote:
>>> d...@gatekeeper.vic.com (David DeLaney) wrote:
>>>> I surfed through it in the original Harry Potter books without much trouble;
>>>> after all, it's fairly prominent there that wizards, collectively, are NOT
>>>> the brightest salamanders in the bonfire.
>>>
>>> I suppose when you have magic, you don't need brains so much.
>>
>> This also explains a _lot_ about the collective behavior of various pantheons,
>> and even individual deities.
>
> Or superheroes. For a long time there was no indication that
> Superman knew anything of TECHNIQUE in how to fight, because he really
> didn't ever have any reason to learn. "I swing my fist, I hit it, it
> goes down."

See also the Star Trek grasp of military strategy (which didn't come in
until very late in DS9 and was treated as an amazing new thing both by
the writers and the characters), and the Discworld gods' grasp of, well,
anything at all really.

--
NULL && (void)

[Nix]

On 10 May 2012, Michael Stemper verbalised:

> The same idea was portrayed earlier, in Niven's _World of Ptavvs_. Since
> the Thrintun could use the Power to make others meet their needs, there
> was never really any selection for intelligence. I believe that the
> narration describes them as being about as bright as a human with an
> I.Q. of 75.

As is typical of Niven this works at first sight but requires some rapid
arm-waving to make it keep working after you think things through. Why
would an organism like that be more intelligent than a shrew? We *have*
a large number of different species of mind-controlling organism on
Earth: they are all without exception obligate parasites, are entirely
devoid of intelligence -- many are unicellular, some are fungi -- and
can do really rather nifty and intricate things to the parasitised
organisms' behaviour, at least as nifty as anything we see done with the
Power.

The same should have happened to the thrintun. Why didn't it? The
thrintun *are* intelligent, far more intelligent than any organism on
Earth other than humanity: any explanation for the Power must explain
this, and Niven doesn't. If Niven is right and the Power eliminates any
selection pressure for increased intelligence, the Power must postdate
the thrintun's acquisition of intelligence: perhaps the thrintun were
once much more intelligent and engineered the Power into themselves
without realising what it would do to their intellect over the ages. If
they have no sentient neighbours on their homeworld (none are
mentioned), this would explain how they managed to get access to
interstellar travel: they came up with it when they were smarter. (An
alternative is that someone with FTL contacted *them* after they gave
themselves the Power and lost some intelligence, and was taken over.)


But another explanation is possible. The Power is a very generalist
ability: unlike Cordyceps fungi, which manipulate ants into spreading
the fungi automatically, a being with the Power has to *think* about
what orders to give, and when, and why. Thus, perhaps the Power came
first, and *itself* served as a spur for the evolution of intelligence.
A more intelligent entity can give better orders, and can arrange things
such that a temporarily non-controlled slave will have no reason to
rebel. This seems especially likely when you consider that in order to
do this you have to maintain models of the mindstate of those of your
slaves you are not currently controlling, and certainly models of the
mindstate of other thrintun. And *that*, ladies and gentlemen, is the
one thing we *do* know leads to the evolution of intelligence, because
it did so in us. (The lethal nature of inter-Thrintun contests alluded
to in the text makes the even more likely. And they have a complex
society: more social modelling.)

So I'd say the thrintun are likely to be growing more intelligent at a
very rapid pace at the time we see them, spurred by the red queen's race
of modelling of states of increasing numbers of slaves and other
thrintun. (Their slaves will be growing more intelligent too, for the
same reason, unless selectively bred to stop it). It's just that the
Power let them get off their planet at a point long before their unaided
intellect would otherwise have allowed them to.

For the latter explanation to work, someone with FTL *must* have
contacted them and been taken over, unless this is a universe in which
interstellar travel is so easy that someone with an IQ of 75 could do it
unaided. Who knows, maybe they got lucky and found an FTL mechanism by
chance that even an idiot can build, but that is so hard to discover by
reasoning from other known facts about the universe that even the
puppeteers and Outsiders haven't discovered it. Seems unlikely, but it
would explain why they have a nifty FTL mechanism that appears nowhere
else in the Known Space universe.


I think I may be overthinking this.

--
NULL && (void)

[Michael Stemper]

In article <87aa1f6...@spindle.srvr.nix>, Nix <nix-ra...@esperi.org.uk> writes:
>On 10 May 2012, Michael Stemper verbalised:

>> The same idea was portrayed earlier, in Niven's _World of Ptavvs_. Since
>> the Thrintun could use the Power to make others meet their needs, there
>> was never really any selection for intelligence. I believe that the
>> narration describes them as being about as bright as a human with an
>> I.Q. of 75.
>
>As is typical of Niven this works at first sight but requires some rapid
>arm-waving to make it keep working after you think things through.

Yeah, but they're still fun stories.

> Why
>would an organism like that be more intelligent than a shrew?

>can do really rather nifty and intricate things to the parasitised
>organisms' behaviour, at least as nifty as anything we see done with the
>Power.
>
>The same should have happened to the thrintun. Why didn't it? The
>thrintun *are* intelligent, far more intelligent than any organism on
>Earth other than humanity:

This exact thought occurred to me as I was writing the previous post.

> If Niven is right and the Power eliminates any
>selection pressure for increased intelligence, the Power must postdate
>the thrintun's acquisition of intelligence:

That's the answer that I came up with.

> perhaps the thrintun were
>once much more intelligent and engineered the Power into themselves
>without realising what it would do to their intellect over the ages.

That's not where I went. My thoughts were more along the line that the
Power came along as the race was gradually growing more intelligent. At
that point, the ones with the Power had an advantage over the ones that
got smarter, and out-reproduced them.

Kind of like teenage boys.

>mentioned), this would explain how they managed to get access to
>interstellar travel: they came up with it when they were smarter.

That's a point that I never really thought about. It kind of trashes
my theory.

> (An
>alternative is that someone with FTL contacted *them* after they gave
>themselves the Power and lost some intelligence, and was taken over.)

Something that we might have seen recapitulated in "The Handicapped".

>But another explanation is possible. The Power is a very generalist
>ability: unlike Cordyceps fungi, which manipulate ants into spreading
>the fungi automatically,

ObAsimov: "Each an Explorer"

> a being with the Power has to *think* about
>what orders to give, and when, and why. Thus, perhaps the Power came
>first, and *itself* served as a spur for the evolution of intelligence.
>A more intelligent entity can give better orders, and can arrange things
>such that a temporarily non-controlled slave will have no reason to
>rebel.

I like that better than mine.

This could apply to the Jedi, too.

>I think I may be overthinking this.

I think that you may be correct.

[Butch Malahide]

On May 10, 2:39 pm, Nix <nix-razor-...@esperi.org.uk> wrote:
>
> For the latter explanation to work, someone with FTL *must* have
> contacted them and been taken over, unless this is a universe in which
> interstellar travel is so easy that someone with an IQ of 75 could do it
> unaided. Who knows, maybe they got lucky and found an FTL mechanism by
> chance that even an idiot can build, but that is so hard to discover by
> reasoning from other known facts about the universe that even the
> puppeteers and Outsiders haven't discovered it. Seems unlikely, but it
> would explain why they have a nifty FTL mechanism that appears nowhere
> else in the Known Space universe.

Maybe there are some physical laws--among them the one on which the
hyperdrive is based--are so silly and dumb that nobody with an IQ
*over* 75 could think of them?

[David DeLaney]

Nix <nix-ra...@esperi.org.uk> wrote:
>If Niven is right and the Power eliminates any
>selection pressure for increased intelligence, the Power must postdate
>the thrintun's acquisition of intelligence: perhaps the thrintun were
>once much more intelligent and engineered the Power into themselves
>without realising what it would do to their intellect over the ages.

...I like this one.

>If they have no sentient neighbours on their homeworld (none are
>mentioned),

(and if they had, they would have turned into the thrintuns' first slave race)

>this would explain how they managed to get access to
>interstellar travel: they came up with it when they were smarter. (An
>alternative is that someone with FTL contacted *them* after they gave
>themselves the Power and lost some intelligence, and was taken over.)

Which rules out the Outsiders...

>So I'd say the thrintun are likely to be growing more intelligent at a
>very rapid pace at the time we see them, spurred by the red queen's race
>of modelling of states of increasing numbers of slaves and other
>thrintun. (Their slaves will be growing more intelligent too, for the
>same reason, unless selectively bred to stop it). It's just that the
>Power let them get off their planet at a point long before their unaided
>intellect would otherwise have allowed them to.

And, unfortunately, they didn't grow in IQ fast enough to catch up with
the tnuctipun before disaster overtook the galaxy...

>I think I may be overthinking this.

That's okay, it'll make your children smarter!

Dave "of course, they'll be of the opinion that they already ARE" DeLaney

[Greg Goss]

Nix <nix-ra...@esperi.org.uk> wrote:

>I think I may be overthinking this.

I've always figured that it was most likely that they enslaved a
visiting race and captured their spacefaring capability.

Note that despite their primary abilities being organism design, the
non-enslaved tnuctipun (sp?) had very advanced engineering
capabilities (per the Soft Weapon) as well, technology that looks more
advanced than the Slaver version. (of course the rebellion would have
been sometime after Kzanol entered stasis and wars boost technology.)

[Nix]

On 10 May 2012, Michael Stemper verbalised:

> In article <87aa1f6...@spindle.srvr.nix>, Nix <nix-ra...@esperi.org.uk> writes:
>>On 10 May 2012, Michael Stemper verbalised:
>
>>> The same idea was portrayed earlier, in Niven's _World of Ptavvs_. Since
>>> the Thrintun could use the Power to make others meet their needs, there
>>> was never really any selection for intelligence. I believe that the
>>> narration describes them as being about as bright as a human with an
>>> I.Q. of 75.
>>
>>As is typical of Niven this works at first sight but requires some rapid
>>arm-waving to make it keep working after you think things through.
>
> Yeah, but they're still fun stories.

Oh yes. _World of Ptavvs_ in particular is both impossible to spell
right *and* explores territory that Niven never goes near again.
I think the only books of his I enjoy more are _Ringworld_ (natch) and
_A Gift from Earth_ (modulo only its collision with the sexism fairy).

(I do wish he managed to come up with something else as wonderfully
bleak as _Bordered in Black_ though.)

>> perhaps the thrintun were
>>once much more intelligent and engineered the Power into themselves
>>without realising what it would do to their intellect over the ages.
>
> That's not where I went. My thoughts were more along the line that the
> Power came along as the race was gradually growing more intelligent. At
> that point, the ones with the Power had an advantage over the ones that
> got smarter, and out-reproduced them.

That would be the second case, the Power evolving on its own and serving
as a spur to intelligence. This one is the case with more textual
backing, where the Power reduces selection for intelligence.

> Kind of like teenage boys.

Kind of like the BRCA1 and BRCA2 genes, which it seems give carriers
breast cancer before they're 60... but also a 50% increase in fertility.
The question isn't why it is rare, but why it isn't ubiquitous.

>>But another explanation is possible. The Power is a very generalist
>>ability: unlike Cordyceps fungi, which manipulate ants into spreading
>>the fungi automatically,
>
> ObAsimov: "Each an Explorer"

An Asimov I missed! noooo! (not least since Asimov has palled on me in
the last fifteen years. I think he only really works if you're a
teenager, or at least if you don't have wide experience of more modern
SF.)

--
NULL && (void)

[Michael Stemper]

In article <87havm1...@spindle.srvr.nix>, Nix <nix-ra...@esperi.org.uk> writes:
>On 10 May 2012, Michael Stemper verbalised:
>> In article <87aa1f6...@spindle.srvr.nix>, Nix <nix-ra...@esperi.org.uk> writes:
>>>On 10 May 2012, Michael Stemper verbalised:

>>>> The same idea was portrayed earlier, in Niven's _World of Ptavvs_. Since
>>>> the Thrintun could use the Power to make others meet their needs, there
>>>> was never really any selection for intelligence. I believe that the
>>>> narration describes them as being about as bright as a human with an
>>>> I.Q. of 75.
>>>
>>>As is typical of Niven this works at first sight but requires some rapid
>>>arm-waving to make it keep working after you think things through.
>>
>> Yeah, but they're still fun stories.
>
>Oh yes. _World of Ptavvs_ in particular is both impossible to spell
>right

Yeah, I looked it up before posting. Otherwise, it would have had a
double "A" rather than a double "V".

>right *and* explores territory that Niven never goes near again.
>I think the only books of his I enjoy more are _Ringworld_ (natch) and
>_A Gift from Earth_ (modulo only its collision with the sexism fairy).

I don't recall anything more sexist than the protagonist trying to get
laid. What jarred me was "hundreds of years in the future, on a planet
in another solar system, the oppressed still go to cocktail parties."

>>>But another explanation is possible. The Power is a very generalist
>>>ability: unlike Cordyceps fungi, which manipulate ants into spreading
>>>the fungi automatically,
>>
>> ObAsimov: "Each an Explorer"
>
>An Asimov I missed!

If you're going to be a completist, it's collected in:

<http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/title.cgi?58940>

--
Michael F. Stemper
#include <Standard_Disclaimer>

"Writing about jazz is like dancing about architecture" - Thelonious Monk

[Nix]

On 14 May 2012, Michael Stemper verbalised:

> In article <87havm1...@spindle.srvr.nix>, Nix <nix-ra...@esperi.org.uk> writes:
>>right *and* explores territory that Niven never goes near again.
>>I think the only books of his I enjoy more are _Ringworld_ (natch) and
>>_A Gift from Earth_ (modulo only its collision with the sexism fairy).
>
> I don't recall anything more sexist than the protagonist trying to get
> laid. What jarred me was "hundreds of years in the future, on a planet
> in another solar system, the oppressed still go to cocktail parties."

Jo Walton covered it better than I could a couple of years ago:
<http://www.tor.com/blogs/2009/09/invisible-man-and-organ-banks-larry-nivens-a-gift-from-earth>.
The same instances occurred to me when I read it most recently (about
six years ago).

>>>>But another explanation is possible. The Power is a very generalist
>>>>ability: unlike Cordyceps fungi, which manipulate ants into spreading
>>>>the fungi automatically,
>>>
>>> ObAsimov: "Each an Explorer"
>>
>>An Asimov I missed!
>
> If you're going to be a completist, it's collected in:
>
> <http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/title.cgi?58940>

Aaah, it's part of the Buy Jupiter thing, is it? I never got around to
reading any of those before I ran out of being young enough to enjoy
Asimov :)

--
NULL && (void)

[Butch Malahide]

On May 14, 12:34 pm, Nix <nix-razor-...@esperi.org.uk> wrote:
> On 14 May 2012, Michael Stemper verbalised:
>

> > In article <87havm1j5l....@spindle.srvr.nix>, Nix <nix-razor-...@esperi.org.uk> writes:
> >>right *and* explores territory that Niven never goes near again.
> >>I think the only books of his I enjoy more are _Ringworld_ (natch) and
> >>_A Gift from Earth_ (modulo only its collision with the sexism fairy).
>
> > I don't recall anything more sexist than the protagonist trying to get
> > laid. What jarred me was "hundreds of years in the future, on a planet
> > in another solar system, the oppressed still go to cocktail parties."
>
> Jo Walton covered it better than I could a couple of years ago:

> <http://www.tor.com/blogs/2009/09/invisible-man-and-organ-banks-larry-...>.

I see Walton was visited by the spelling fairy who created a "Buzzard
ramjet".

[Robert Carnegie]

On Monday, May 14, 2012 1:31:09 PM UTC+1, Michael Stemper wrote:
[A Gift From Earth]

> I don't recall anything more sexist than the protagonist trying to get
> laid. What jarred me was "hundreds of years in the future, on a planet
> in another solar system, the oppressed still go to cocktail parties."

Oppression is relative. I forget, but I
assume that crew and colonists don't mingle.
IIRC, up- and down-town are quite literal
terms?

And elsewhere:

"The principle of generating small amounts of
finite improbability by simply hooking the
logic circuits of a Bambleweeny 57 Sub-Meson
Brain to an atomic vector plotter suspended
in a strong Brownian Motion producer (say a
nice hot cup of tea) were of course well
understood - and such generators were often
used to break the ice at parties by making
all the molecules in the hostess's undergarments
leap simultaneously one foot to the left,
in accordance with the Theory of Indeterminacy.
Many respectable physicists said that they
weren't going to stand for this - partly because
it was a debasement of science, but mostly
because they didn't get invited to those sort
of parties."

[Michael Stemper]

In article <87aa1ar...@spindle.srvr.nix>, Nix <nix-ra...@esperi.org.uk> writes:
>On 14 May 2012, Michael Stemper verbalised:
>> In article <87havm1...@spindle.srvr.nix>, Nix <nix-ra...@esperi.org.uk> writes:

>>>I think the only books of his I enjoy more are _Ringworld_ (natch) and
>>>_A Gift from Earth_ (modulo only its collision with the sexism fairy).
>>
>> I don't recall anything more sexist than the protagonist trying to get
>> laid. What jarred me was "hundreds of years in the future, on a planet
>> in another solar system, the oppressed still go to cocktail parties."
>
>Jo Walton covered it better than I could a couple of years ago:
><http://www.tor.com/blogs/2009/09/invisible-man-and-organ-banks-larry-nivens-a-gift-from-earth>.
>The same instances occurred to me when I read it most recently (about
>six years ago).

Yeah, now that she mentions it, I do recall the "whoring for the troops"
bit being a speed-bump last time I read it.

>>>>>ability: unlike Cordyceps fungi, which manipulate ants into spreading
>>>>>the fungi automatically,
>>>>
>>>> ObAsimov: "Each an Explorer"
>>>
>>>An Asimov I missed!
>>
>> If you're going to be a completist, it's collected in:
>>
>> <http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/title.cgi?58940>
>
>Aaah, it's part of the Buy Jupiter thing, is it? I never got around to
>reading any of those before I ran out of being young enough to enjoy
>Asimov :)

Too bad about the missed opportunity. I wouldn't say that it's worth
seeking out if you've generally lost your Asimov appreciation.

--
Michael F. Stemper
#include <Standard_Disclaimer>

[Nix]

On 14 May 2012, Butch Malahide uttered the following:

> I see Walton was visited by the spelling fairy who created a "Buzzard
> ramjet".

This may have been on the general theory that you leave a spelling error
in now and again for everyone to point out. It keeps them happy.

--
NULL && (void)

[Michael Stemper]

In article <23da478b-5a8a-4d2b...@jx17g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>, Butch Malahide <fred....@gmail.com> writes:

Such as in "The Road Not Taken", perhaps?

--
Michael F. Stemper
#include <Standard_Disclaimer>

There is three erors in this sentence.

[James Nicoll]

In article <a15bt8...@mid.individual.net>,

Greg Goss <go...@gossg.org> wrote:
>Nix <nix-ra...@esperi.org.uk> wrote:
>
>>I think I may be overthinking this.
>
>I've always figured that it was most likely that they enslaved a
>visiting race and captured their spacefaring capability.
>

If I recall correctly, there aren't many cases of species independently
inventing hyperdrive in Known Space. That could be because the Outsiders
are everywhere in the current era, ready to drop working FTL into the laps
of anyone who can meet their price.

The Puppeteers seem to have come up with an improved version in the QII
hyperdrive, which makes me wonder if the Outsiders know about it but
refrain from sharing it to keep each cluster of civilizations nicely
limited to a few hundred light years wide.

Come to think of it, the hyperdrive the Slavers used doesn't act like the
either the regular three days to the light year one most cultures use in
Known Space or the 75 seconds to the light year QII hyperdrive. Again,
I have to wonder if the Outsiders know about it and are just keeping it
to themselves to keep rival hegemonic cultures from spreading across
the galaxy.
--
http://www.livejournal.com/users/james_nicoll
http://www.cafepress.com/jdnicoll (For all your "The problem with
defending the English language [...]" T-shirt, cup and tote-bag needs)

[Michael Stemper]

In article <jp08d0$1e$1...@reader1.panix.com>, jdni...@panix.com (James Nicoll) writes:
>In article <a15bt8...@mid.individual.net>, Greg Goss <go...@gossg.org> wrote:

>If I recall correctly, there aren't many cases of species independently
>inventing hyperdrive in Known Space. That could be because the Outsiders
>are everywhere in the current era, ready to drop working FTL into the laps
>of anyone who can meet their price.
>
>The Puppeteers seem to have come up with an improved version in the QII
>hyperdrive, which makes me wonder if the Outsiders know about it but
>refrain from sharing it to keep each cluster of civilizations nicely
>limited to a few hundred light years wide.
>
>Come to think of it, the hyperdrive the Slavers used doesn't act like the
>either the regular three days to the light year one most cultures use in
>Known Space or the 75 seconds to the light year QII hyperdrive.

Try as I can, I don't remember what properties the Slaver hyperdrive
had. If I remember correctly from _World of Ptavvs_, Kzanol's hyperdrive
was damaged, which is why he had to set up a collision course with a
moon or planet and then go into stasis. So, I don't think that we saw
Slaver hyperdrive in that story.

What were its operational characteristics?

--
Michael F. Stemper
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