An Ethic Question...
>Zeke<
What are some of you fellow drivers thinking about smokey reports on the cb
radio. I seldom if ever exceed the speed limit by 3 mph, whether it be in
CA, OR, NV, etc. I've come to the conclusion that giving out smokey reports
when I am driving legal would be kind of hypocritical. By giving out smokey
reports I was just condoning bad behavior on behalf of my fellow truckers.
Opinions? Insight?
--
Having been a known poster in a group used by a group of people for an
intended purpose does not make that person what the group intent implies.
You have assumed wrongfully, that alt.sex.children, caters only to
pedophiles. - Richard the Stupid
It is true I posted in certain newsgroups that catered to child
pornography at various times in the past. - Richard the Stupid
I have found many newsgroups which do carry kiddy porn where the
name of the group suggests no such thing. - Richard the Stupid
TD©
been done...and used as seen fit
you may run legal like most do...but gives you heads up
on maybe sometime you might have missed before getting to
where they are at
--
Del
ICQ 41839896
==================================================
TD© The artist formerly know as Truck Driver©
"Remember JuneBug"
"Beer and Smokes to Ding........."
"Remember alang"
The trouble with life is, you're half way through it before you realize it's
a "do it yourself" thing
As you know being cautious is not a fault, it is something one has learned.
"Truck Driver"
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">Zeke<" <n...@spam.org> wrote in message
news:vtPBa.711$Zk4...@fe01.atl2.webusenet.com...
tscottme
>Zeke< <n...@spam.org> wrote in message
news:vtPBa.711$Zk4...@fe01.atl2.webusenet.com...
> As far as smokie reports go...
>
> What are some of you fellow drivers thinking about smokey reports on
the cb
> radio. I seldom if ever exceed the speed limit by 3 mph, whether it
be in
> CA, OR, NV, etc. I've come to the conclusion that giving out smokey
reports
> when I am driving legal would be kind of hypocritical. By giving out
smokey
> reports I was just condoning bad behavior on behalf of my fellow
truckers.
>
> Opinions? Insight?
>
I rarely give bear reports. Frankly, I usually only turn on my CB to
talk to the guard shack at both ends of my trip. If I see another
company truck, I blink my lights to say hello. Sometimes I forget to
turn off my CB and an opposite direction truck will volunteer a bear
report for me. In that case, I will tell him if I've seen anything, but
I also mention that the road we're on has lots of hiding spots. I might
say "I didn't see anything but the bears are awful sneaky right through
here.".
I do report accidents, or more often the numerous deer along or in the
road.
Dave Smith
> As far as smokie reports go...
>
> What are some of you fellow drivers thinking about smokey reports on the cb
> radio. I seldom if ever exceed the speed limit by 3 mph, whether it be in
> CA, OR, NV, etc. I've come to the conclusion that giving out smokey reports
> when I am driving legal would be kind of hypocritical. By giving out smokey
> reports I was just condoning bad behavior on behalf of my fellow truckers.
>
> Opinions? Insight?
If you see someone speeding you can always give a false alert :-)
~Tony~
news:vtPBa.711$Zk4...@fe01.atl2.webusenet.com:
> As far as smokie reports go...
>
> What are some of you fellow drivers thinking about smokey reports on
> the cb radio. I seldom if ever exceed the speed limit by 3 mph,
> whether it be in CA, OR, NV, etc. I've come to the conclusion that
> giving out smokey reports when I am driving legal would be kind of
> hypocritical. By giving out smokey reports I was just condoning bad
> behavior on behalf of my fellow truckers.
>
> Opinions? Insight?
I quit giving bear reports many years ago. In my opinion, it is helping
others evade being caught for violating the law. The speed limits are high
enough that you'd think that no bear reports would even be an issue.
It's also my opinion that a fully loaded truck going 65-70 mph is about as
fast as it needs to be going. The control that a driver would be able to
maintain at that speed, if something goes wrong, is highly questionable.
Personally, I'd like the national speed limit go back to 55 mph. At least,
as it was, speeders were topping out at 70-75 mph back then. Nowadays, it's
nothing to see some going 80-90 mph or more down I-75 in my area.
I don't do it anymore, but it used to highly piss off drivers when they
were fishing for bear reports, and I answered their call for a truck going
the direction opposite of theirs, and I told them that I do not give out
bear reports. I've had my life threatened.....literally.
These days....I just ignore the CB for the most part.
I do warn others of hazards, accidents, bad weather, etc., but not law
enforcement presence or scale activity.
By the same token, I don't ask for this type of information either....ever.
~Tony~
Have time to kill and need a laugh?
Curious to see just how sick a person can be?
Read up on the most notorius poster in MTT! -"Richard"
He even has several websites dedicated in his honor.
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~Tony~
news:3ED7E2A4...@sympatico.ca:
> If you see someone speeding you can always give a false alert :-)
This will certainly upset someone, but I have absolutely been known to do
that.
When one or two of those large cars passes me well above the speed limit, I
have keyed up and offered:
"Smokey Bear hammer down,"
"Where's he at driver?" as they hit the brakes, bring it back to earth....
<dead silence>
"Well...where the hell is he at driver?"
<dead silence>
"I guess it's a secret"
I'd give a dollar for every time I've heard that exact scenario and words
spoken....
It doesn't slow them down for long, but who knows? At least it slows them
down for a few moments,
RobZip
I listen to them but rarely pass anything on. Sometimes a smokie will wait
at the bottom of a long but not particularly steep grade, knowing that a big
truck will eventually come off the hill over the speed limit. That sort of
opportunistic prickiness is unwarranted. If a guy comes off a hill seriously
over - 15 mph or so, he is begging to be popped. His control and collision
avoidance is seriously reduced.
The CB tends to be quite unreliable if thats all you pay attention to for
other traffic info. Coming through Nashville last week, the overhead signs
downtown very clearly stated 'Center lane closed 10 mi. ahead - Rt lane exit
only - Lt lane thru traffic' Damned if there weren't drivers close to the
backup swearing that the center lane was open and thats where you needed to
be.
Gunslinger
And Tony wrote:
>I quit giving bear reports many years ago. In my opinion, it is helping
>others evade being caught for violating the law. The speed limits are high
>enough that you'd think that no bear reports would even be an issue.
>
>It's also my opinion that a fully loaded truck going 65-70 mph is about as
>fast as it needs to be going. The control that a driver would be able to
>maintain at that speed, if something goes wrong, is highly questionable.
>
>Personally, I'd like the national speed limit go back to 55 mph.
To which I reply:
Guys like Dave and Tony are what's becoming the death of the "brotherhood" that
trucking used to be. I will always give a bear report, if asked - and sometimes
even if not asked. Even though I'm most likely to be running close to the speed
limit. It's just another courtesy to extend to my fellow drivers out there... of
course, "courtesy" is something relatively rare these days even amongst
truckers. You ride around with your CB off, refusing to associate with your
fellow drivers, and then wonder why truckers can't "stick together" on anything?
YOU are the reason trucking has become "just a job". I can tell which ones do
that; they're the ones coming up to a traffic jam, turning their CB's on, and
hollering "What's going on up there? What's going on up there?". If you'd had it
on before, you'd already know about the jam, and would be over here on the back
roads with me passing it by....
Hey, who am *I* to be a sanctimonious asshole about how fast somebody *else* is
going (unless IMO they're *also* driving dangerously)? I might have a need to
get in a hurry on occasion, and then would appreciate a heads up on the bears.
And FWIW, y'all know as well as I do that cops *like* to nail truckers - and
will do so for far less speed than 4-wheelers (in general). And for lots of
things that are NOT speed-related.
So, YES! - give those bear reports! That just gives your fellow drivers out
there a little warning. The cop might have a vehicle pulled over close to the
edge lines. He might be watching for something OTHER THAN speeding. Cars might
slam on their brakes the instant they see him, like usual. There are LOTS of
GOOD reasons to give bear reports besides the speed-related ones.
As for Tony's speed limit comments.... horse puckey! The Interstate Highway
system was designed to handle traffic at speeds in excess of 75 mph. Yes, it
takes a truck longer to stop at higher speeds - same as for any other vehicle.
Speed, in and of itself, has never caused an accident or killed anybody. Speed,
in and of itself, is NOT unsafe. OTHER unsafe driving habits, inattention, and
inexperience, are the main causes of accidents. Higher speeds *may* [note the
emphasis on "may"] increase the damages WHEN an accident happens - but do NOT
cause the accidents.
As for maintaining control at speeds over 70 mph "if anything goes wrong"..
well... if it is serious enough to cause a loss of control, that isn't gonna
change because of speed. And inversely, if a driver can maintain control at 45
mph, s/he can maintain it at 75+. And yes, I have had 2 steering tire blowouts
over almost 20 years time. One a couple year ago on I-10 right smack in the
middle of Houston at about 55-60 mph - without losing control. The other maybe
16 years ago on route 35 in Ohio near the Schoolhouse Truckstop (2-lane road, no
shoulder at all, 4-foot ditches) at maybe 75 mph (yeah, yeah, I know - I was
younger and dumber in those days) and brought that one to a stop IN MY LANE with
no loss of control. Speed was not a factor in either case.
One last comment: IMNSFHO, any driver who would deliberately give a false bear
report falls into the same category as the cops who do the same trying to entrap
a trucker - 100%, dyed-in-the-wool, Grade A "Asshole"...... JMO.
Sorry if I offended anybody (well... maybe not, now I think about it), but y'all
stepped on a nerve with this one.
__--Gunslinger--__
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Truckinsp
>Guys like Dave and Tony are what's becoming the death of the "brotherhood"
>that
>trucking used to be.
And we all know what a wonderful brotherhood that used to be.....that
"brotherhood" is the main reason I have a job.....
I believe the real brotherhood of truckers are those who run legal and are sick
and tired of those who don't......because it's that old "brotherhood" that has
given truck driving a bad name....
>I will always give a bear report, if asked - and
>sometimes
>even if not asked. Even though I'm most likely to be running close to the
>speed
>limit. It's just another courtesy to extend to my fellow drivers out there...
>of
>course, "courtesy" is something relatively rare these days even amongst
>truckers. You ride around with your CB off, refusing to associate with your
>fellow drivers, and then wonder why truckers can't "stick together" on
>anything?
>YOU are the reason trucking has become "just a job".
No actually, drivers like you are....
>I can tell which ones do
>that; they're the ones coming up to a traffic jam, turning their CB's on, and
>hollering "What's going on up there? What's going on up there?". If you'd had
>it
>on before, you'd already know about the jam, and would be over here on the
>back
>roads with me passing it by....
>
>Hey, who am *I* to be a sanctimonious asshole about how fast somebody *else*
>is
>going (unless IMO they're *also* driving dangerously)? I might have a need to
>get in a hurry on occasion, and then would appreciate a heads up on the
>bears.
You talk about sticking together and being a "brotherhood" and then you say,
"Who am I to ....... You got the wrong Idea of what a brotherhood is all about
unless you think the "brotherhood" is like a street gang......
>And FWIW, y'all know as well as I do that cops *like* to nail truckers -
We can't "nail" truckers that are running legal........
> and
>will do so for far less speed than 4-wheelers (in general). And for lots of
>things that are NOT speed-related.
>
>So, YES! - give those bear reports! That just gives your fellow drivers out
>there a little warning. The cop might have a vehicle pulled over close to the
>edge lines.
LOLOL....I only pull you over when you are weaving back and forth over
them....getting "close" to them has NEVER been a reason for pulling someone
over.......
>He might be watching for something OTHER THAN speeding.
Well, yea.....that's our job!!!
>Cars
>might
>slam on their brakes the instant they see him, like usual. There are LOTS of
>GOOD reasons to give bear reports besides the speed-related ones.
>
>As for Tony's speed limit comments.... horse puckey! The Interstate Highway
>system was designed to handle traffic at speeds in excess of 75 mph. Yes, it
>takes a truck longer to stop at higher speeds - same as for any other
>vehicle.
>Speed, in and of itself, has never caused an accident or killed anybody.
BS.....I have gone to LOTS AND LOTS of crashes where speed kills!!!....
>Speed,
>in and of itself, is NOT unsafe. OTHER unsafe driving habits, inattention,
>and
>inexperience, are the main causes of accidents.
BS....it is harder to control a vehicle at higher speeds, it is harder to make
turns at higher speeds, it is harder to avoid obstacles (that are going to be
in the road whether you like it or not) at higher speeds.....it is harder to
stop at higher speeds...it is much EASIER to go out of control at higher
speeds, a small over correction has much worse consequences at higher
speeds....a momentary blink, sneeze, etc., has much worse consequences at
higher speeds......
.
If you don't think speed kills, you are living in a FANTASY LAND!!
> Higher speeds *may* [note the
>emphasis on "may"] increase the damages WHEN an accident happens - but do NOT
>cause the accidents.
Oh, yes it does!!!! And every single officer in this country has proof that it
does.....
You don't have a CLUE!!!!
>
>As for maintaining control at speeds over 70 mph "if anything goes wrong"..
>well... if it is serious enough to cause a loss of control, that isn't gonna
>change because of speed. And inversely, if a driver can maintain control at
>45
>mph, s/he can maintain it at 75+.
What BS.....take a 45 mph curve at 75+.....
> And yes, I have had 2 steering tire
>blowouts
>over almost 20 years time. One a couple year ago on I-10 right smack in the
>middle of Houston at about 55-60 mph - without losing control. The other
>maybe
>16 years ago on route 35 in Ohio near the Schoolhouse Truckstop (2-lane road,
>no
>shoulder at all, 4-foot ditches) at maybe 75 mph (yeah, yeah, I know - I was
>younger and dumber in those days) and brought that one to a stop IN MY LANE
>with
>no loss of control. Speed was not a factor in either case.
How would you know????
>
>One last comment: IMNSFHO, any driver who would deliberately give a false
>bear
>report falls into the same category as the cops who do the same trying to
>entrap
>a trucker - 100%, dyed-in-the-wool, Grade A "Asshole"...... JMO.
>
>Sorry if I offended anybody (well... maybe not, now I think about it), but
>y'all
>stepped on a nerve with this one.
>
Well, guys like you out there will always guarantee that I have a
job....Thanks!!
>
>__--Gunslinger--__
>
>Zeke<
news:LpSdnYCTW72...@comcast.com...
>
> I do report accidents, or more often the numerous deer along or in the
> road.
>
>
>Zeke<
news:Xns938C673433FFal...@65.82.44.187...
> Dave Smith <adavid...@sympatico.ca> wrote in
> news:3ED7E2A4...@sympatico.ca:
>
> > If you see someone speeding you can always give a false alert :-)
>
> This will certainly upset someone, but I have absolutely been known to do
> that.
>
> When one or two of those large cars passes me well above the speed limit,
I
> have keyed up and offered:
>
> "Smokey Bear hammer down,"
>
> "Where's he at driver?" as they hit the brakes, bring it back to earth....
>
> <dead silence>
>
> "Well...where the hell is he at driver?"
>
> <dead silence>
>
> "I guess it's a secret"
>
> I'd give a dollar for every time I've heard that exact scenario and words
> spoken....
>
> It doesn't slow them down for long, but who knows? At least it slows them
> down for a few moments,
>
> ~Tony~
LOL... I'll have to give that a try. You know them cowboy super truckers
with the large car and the large radio. They drive scared in Oregon.
>Zeke<
> I quit giving bear reports many years ago. In my opinion, it is helping
> others evade being caught for violating the law. The speed limits are high
> enough that you'd think that no bear reports would even be an issue.
>
That's exactly what I've been thinking.
> It's also my opinion that a fully loaded truck going 65-70 mph is about
as
> fast as it needs to be going. The control that a driver would be able to
> maintain at that speed, if something goes wrong, is highly questionable.
>
> Personally, I'd like the national speed limit go back to 55 mph. At least,
> as it was, speeders were topping out at 70-75 mph back then. Nowadays,
it's
> nothing to see some going 80-90 mph or more down I-75 in my area.
>
I don't think I could deal with the 55 mph speed limit everywhere. Once in
a while I have to drive down to Las Vegas and you are driving for 100's and
100's of miles seeing very little traffic. I think 65 or 70 is entirely
reasonable in such cases. Now driving 55 in the LA basin is appropriate for
sure.
> I don't do it anymore, but it used to highly piss off drivers when they
> were fishing for bear reports, and I answered their call for a truck going
> the direction opposite of theirs, and I told them that I do not give out
> bear reports. I've had my life threatened.....literally.
>
That does not suprise me at all. Must be one of the "brotherhood" gang.
> These days....I just ignore the CB for the most part.
>
> I do warn others of hazards, accidents, bad weather, etc., but not law
> enforcement presence or scale activity.
>
> By the same token, I don't ask for this type of information
either....ever.
>
Same here. Who cares what the scale is doing? If you've got your ducks in
a row what does it matter?
~Tony~
news:ff4hdvkotsslpkjed...@4ax.com:
> Guys like Dave and Tony are what's becoming the death of the
> "brotherhood" that trucking used to be.
I've heard this argument before, and with all due respect, applied to this
particular subject, it's pathetic.
I have no idea how long you have been around in the industry. I came into
the picture shortly after deregulation. I can't imagine that to have been a
part of this "brotherhood", "back then", was to help your fellow trucker to
violate the law. After all, why would there be any reason to have to know
where a "smoky" was, if you were driving within the confines of the law?
Just because I choose to decline to contribute to what I consider
lawlessness, and possible endangerment to the public at large, I reject
being labeled in this manner by you and anyone else that would state such a
thing.
To put it in a nutshell, if you are in the right, I'm there with you
brother. If you are in the wrong, I'm not.
> I will always give a bear
> report, if asked - and sometimes even if not asked. Even though I'm
> most likely to be running close to the speed limit. It's just another
> courtesy to extend to my fellow drivers out there... of course,
> "courtesy" is something relatively rare these days even amongst
> truckers.
Giving a bear report is not a courtesy. It's a willful act of endorsing and
helping others to violate the law. There is not one justifiable reason for
giving a bear report that you can conjure up, that would prove anything
contrary, UNLESS the bear is parked in such a way that he might present an
accident risk.
> You ride around with your CB off, refusing to associate with
> your fellow drivers, and then wonder why truckers can't "stick
> together" on anything?
I've never refused to associate with my fellow drivers. What do you think
that my participation in this group is? I associate over the CB as well,
but on a more limited and infrequent basis. For some reason, intelligent
life on the CB is hard to find.
I hate to break this to you, but just because I drive a truck, this does
not mean that I am obligated to adopt every last one of the problems that
face drivers out there, and cry and whine about them. I quit that crap a
long time ago.
"Sticking together" on things does not include having to help others break
the law, despite what you think.
> YOU are the reason trucking has become "just a job".
Well...since you are going to apply that kind of logic, then I'll respond
with: Your type of mentality and contributing to a problem of speeding
truckers, who routinely put their middle finger up to the public each time
they put "the hammer down", is what has degraded many of the freedoms we
used to have, and why we are put under a microscope at every opportunity.
> I can tell which ones do that; they're the ones coming up to a
> traffic jam, turning their CB's on, and hollering "What's going on up
> there? What's going on up there?". If you'd had it on before, you'd
> already know about the jam, and would be over here on the back roads
> with me passing it by....
Well...it's a small price to pay. Forgive me if I get sick and tired of
hearing "CB karate" all day, along with chatter about wanting to see naked
women, how fast everyone's truck can go, and what a lousy day everyone is
having, because they have been shafted by.....<fill in the blank>.
> Hey, who am *I* to be a sanctimonious asshole about how fast somebody
> *else* is going (unless IMO they're *also* driving dangerously)?
How sad it is, that you view my failure to endorse bear reports, as being
an asshole, rather than trying to force people to be safe and mindful of
the responsibility we have to share the road with others, and not cruising
at speeds that create hazards and that can result in injury or death, if
something goes awry.
> I
> might have a need to get in a hurry on occasion, and then would
> appreciate a heads up on the bears.
Look...when you are walking on your own two feet, and the result might be a
bumping into someone if they happen to cross your path, is all that can
come from it, hurry all you want. When you are driving an 80,000 pound
missile down the highway, where the result can be far more devastating to
you and others if you cannot stop in time or maintain control of that
vehicle, if something crosses your path, then there are NO excuses for
being in a hurry.
> And FWIW, y'all know as well as I do that cops *like* to nail truckers -
> and will do so for far less speed than 4-wheelers (in general).
Is it any wonder WHY? Are you capable of understanding the vast differences
in vehicle sizes and weights, and what can happen?
Do you EVER drive an automobile and find yourself subjected to this
insidious jerks behind the wheel of a big truck? Do you not realize that
people are sick and tired of being intimidated by thoughtless and careless
drivers, and this stupid mentality that truckers own the road? We are
supposed to be the one's that KNOW BETTER!!
Try to imagine a freight train with tires, bearing down on you at speeds
that are 20 mph or more above the speed limit, weaving in and out of
traffic, because HE is in a hurry. Try to imagine what your truck is going
to look like, as well as what YOU will look like, if the operator of that
mega-ton string of cars can't stop, if he is behind you and you are forced
to stop suddenly for any number of reasons.
Don't you realize that the difference between the way a car can react to an
emergency situation, and the way your truck can react, is about the same as
the difference between your truck and a freight train?
The playing ground is not equal out there, and it is because of this, that
we are held to a higher standard, and why our violations are taken more
seriously. If someone screws up and you become entangled in an accident,
you're very likely to come out okay, but the chances of those in smaller
vehicles having the same outcome, are right the opposite.
> And for lots of things that are NOT speed-related.
Again, it's no wonder. The cowboy mentality, and flippant attitudes towards
the public are at the CORE, as to why we are scrutinized so much.
You bring up the "brotherhood of trucking", as if it's a good thing
anymore. It's not. It's been altered and morphed into something that it
never was to begin with. We used to be admired, envied, and respected.
Why not take time to think about WHY this is not the case any longer? It's
not the cops or the public that has changed.....it's our industry that has
changed, and you can point all the fingers you want at others, but unless
you acknowledge that we have had a great deal of responsibility in how
things have come to where they are now, then you are turning a blind eye to
it, and you're deluded.
> So, YES! - give those bear reports! That just gives your fellow
> drivers out there a little warning. The cop might have a vehicle
> pulled over close to the edge lines.
As I stated above. THAT is the only legitimate reason to give the location
of a bear. If his presence is a possible hazard....fine.
> He might be watching for
> something OTHER THAN speeding. Cars might slam on their brakes the
> instant they see him, like usual.
And if you are keeping plenty of space out there in front of you, this
should present no problem. Of course, if you are glued to the tail of a
four-wheeler, in anticipation that the second he moves to the right, that
you can drop the hammer, then you're going to have a problem.
> There are LOTS of GOOD reasons to
> give bear reports besides the speed-related ones.
No. There is only ONE good reason to give a bear report, and the rest are
absolutely acts of evading the speed limit laws.
> As for Tony's speed limit comments.... horse puckey! The Interstate
> Highway system was designed to handle traffic at speeds in excess of
> 75 mph.
That argument might hold water, if it were not for the fact that traffic on
these interstates, has doubled and quadrupled in some areas, in recent
years.
If you were the only vehicle for miles, doing a hundred miles per hour
consistently would not be a problem. When there are a thousand vehicles
going the same direction and close in proximity, too much can go wrong, in
a second. You're betting that every one of those vehicles is going to
maintain control at all times, with no chance whatsoever that something
will go wrong. The odds might be good that all will go well, but I'm not a
betting man.
You missed my point completely. My comments were specifically to the
stability of a fully loaded truck, and ability to maintain control at high
speeds. You can dismiss it any way you wish, but the fact remains that the
stability of a truck going 75 mph versus 55 mph, is as different as night
and day. Hit a hole in the road, blow a tire, or have to swerve suddenly,
and you are far more likely to lose control at 75 mph, than at 55 mph, and
I don't care what road you are on, what is around you, what the road or
weather conditions are at the time.
> Yes, it takes a truck longer to stop at higher speeds - same
> as for any other vehicle. Speed, in and of itself, has never caused an
> accident or killed anybody. Speed, in and of itself, is NOT unsafe.
That's an extremely ignorant statement. I cannot imagine what rationale you
base this on. I suppose if you remove every possible other factor of an
accident out of the equation, there might be some basis for this theory,
but since that is absolutely impossible to do at any time anyone is in a
vehicle on public highway, what is the point? You're never going to have an
opportunity for speed to be the only hazard presented.
And to generally debunk that theory, I can recall as a teenager, having
struck a tree after losing control in a curve. What was the ONLY thing I
did wrong? I was going too fast to make the curve. It wasn't the curve's
fault for being there. It wasn't the car's fault for not having the ability
to overcome inertia. It was my fault for going too damn fast to make it
safely around that curve.
> OTHER unsafe driving habits, inattention, and inexperience, are the
> main causes of accidents. Higher speeds *may* [note the emphasis on
> "may"] increase the damages WHEN an accident happens - but do NOT
> cause the accidents.
Oh...only "may"? You're certainly not grounded in anything scientific, or
something that has been researched to a logical conclusion. You are simply
offering a counter argument based upon your own assessment. Why? I have no
idea. You're grasping at straws that do not exist.
> As for maintaining control at speeds over 70 mph "if anything goes
> wrong".. well... if it is serious enough to cause a loss of control,
> that isn't gonna change because of speed. And inversely, if a driver
> can maintain control at 45 mph, s/he can maintain it at 75+.
Again...where do you get this theory from? Did you just reach out an
conjure it up? Your words defy logic and laws of physics. You use the
phrase "if it is serious enough"...as a disclaimer. What about the times
when the situation is NOT serious enough to lose complete control? Your
chances are far better to maintain control at slower speeds.
> And yes,
> I have had 2 steering tire blowouts over almost 20 years time. One a
> couple year ago on I-10 right smack in the middle of Houston at about
> 55-60 mph - without losing control. The other maybe 16 years ago on
> route 35 in Ohio near the Schoolhouse Truckstop (2-lane road, no
> shoulder at all, 4-foot ditches) at maybe 75 mph (yeah, yeah, I know -
> I was younger and dumber in those days) and brought that one to a stop
> IN MY LANE with no loss of control. Speed was not a factor in either
> case.
If you say so....
> One last comment: IMNSFHO, any driver who would deliberately give a
> false bear report falls into the same category as the cops who do the
> same trying to entrap a trucker - 100%, dyed-in-the-wool, Grade A
> "Asshole"...... JMO.
So be it. After reading your testimony, I'm more convinced than ever, that
it's a good thing to do. I had no idea that someone could completely ignore
obvious facts, after years of having them drummed in our heads, and justify
lawlessness in such a manner.
> Sorry if I offended anybody (well... maybe not, now I think about it),
> but y'all stepped on a nerve with this one.
Look Pal, I'll stand on the right side of things, until the world is on
fire. You can step around the issue all you want, and try to state that
anyone who is not with you, is against you. I'm not impressed, nor am I
bothered one bit that your nerves are stepped on.
You're absolutely off-base on this, and I hope one day you discover this,
and I pray that it is not for the wrong reason, or under the worst of
circumstances.
Meat-->Plow
>As far as smokie reports go...
>
>What are some of you fellow drivers thinking about smokey reports on the cb
>radio. I seldom if ever exceed the speed limit by 3 mph, whether it be in
>CA, OR, NV, etc. I've come to the conclusion that giving out smokey reports
>when I am driving legal would be kind of hypocritical. By giving out smokey
>reports I was just condoning bad behavior on behalf of my fellow truckers.
>
>Opinions? Insight?
It's tradition.
tscottme
Gunslinger <gunsl...@no.spam.net> wrote in message
news:ff4hdvkotsslpkjed...@4ax.com...
>
> To which I reply:
>
> Guys like Dave and Tony are what's becoming the death of the
"brotherhood" that
> trucking used to be.
<snip>
Add me to that list. Sticking together is a good idea only if the
purpose is valid. Sticking together just to stick together is what the
mafia does. Similar to the monthly call for a strike or parade of
morons to drive to Washington for "truckers' rights", it matters greatly
what the purpose is not just that we stick together.
I think the low education level common in this industry is partly
responsible for this desire for blind loyalty. You'll notice how
seldom this call to stick together is used to pressure drivers to stop
throwing piss bottles out the window, littering at every opportunity, or
keeping lazy drivers from parking 10 deep beside the last fuel pump.
When anyone mentions those things and the brotherhood, the universal
reply is "you drive your truck, let him drive his truck". That proves
to me that sticking together isn't the point of even those that keep
saying those words, it's just a tactic used when they have nothing else
to offer.
--
Scott
--------
Saudi Arabia is the enemy, let's stop pretending otherwise.
~Tony~
news:gA3Ca.6524$Zk4....@fe01.atl2.webusenet.com:
> I don't think I could deal with the 55 mph speed limit everywhere.
> Once in a while I have to drive down to Las Vegas and you are driving
> for 100's and 100's of miles seeing very little traffic. I think 65
> or 70 is entirely reasonable in such cases. Now driving 55 in the LA
> basin is appropriate for sure.
I can agree with that completely. There are places where it makes perfect
sense to drive faster, and out west, it's completely a different story than
it is out on this side of the woods.
I run a tight circle these days, and don't get out there anymore, and I try
to stay out of everyone's way, even when they are driving like a moron. I
don't have a problem with those that want to stretch it out and conditions
allow for it. But I still see too many cowboys out there, who just don't
seem to have respect for others, and fail to realize that they are more a
part of the problem, than the one's they are cussing at all the time....for
being in their "way"...
~Tony~
news:AJWcnTvO6_m...@comcast.com:
> You'll notice how
> seldom this call to stick together is used to pressure drivers to stop
> throwing piss bottles out the window, littering at every opportunity, or
> keeping lazy drivers from parking 10 deep beside the last fuel pump.
> When anyone mentions those things and the brotherhood, the universal
> reply is "you drive your truck, let him drive his truck". That proves
> to me that sticking together isn't the point of even those that keep
> saying those words, it's just a tactic used when they have nothing else
> to offer.
You absolutely said a mouthful there, Scott....
Wonderful point.....absolutely wonderful.....
I wish I had thought of that.....
~Tony~
tscottme
were trumping up charges against truck drivers? How about Priests
sticking together if they knew one of their brothers was engaged in
misconduct? Someone tell Richard there's no need for him to answer that
last question.
Dave Smith
> Guys like Dave and Tony are what's becoming the death of the "brotherhood" that
> trucking used to be. I will always give a bear report, if asked - and sometimes
> even if not asked. Even though I'm most likely to be running close to the speed
> limit. It's just another courtesy to extend to my fellow drivers out there... of
> course, "courtesy" is something relatively rare these days even amongst
> truckers. You ride around with your CB off, refusing to associate with your
> fellow drivers, and then wonder why truckers can't "stick together" on anything?
I would think that the reason that so many drivers turn off their CBs is because of
all the crap and BS they hear on it. There are enough bad apples in the business
that the more professional drivers have every reason to want to disassociate
themselves from them.
>
> YOU are the reason trucking has become "just a job". I can tell which ones do
> that; they're the ones coming up to a traffic jam, turning their CB's on, and
> hollering "What's going on up there? What's going on up there?". If you'd had it
> on before, you'd already know about the jam, and would be over here on the back
> roads with me passing it by....
Do you mean that it's not just a job? That is all it ever was to me, a way to make
money. There were a lot of things about it that made it an enjoyable job. Still, it
was just a job.
> Hey, who am *I* to be a sanctimonious asshole about how fast somebody *else* is
> going (unless IMO they're *also* driving dangerously)? I might have a need to
> get in a hurry on occasion, and then would appreciate a heads up on the bears.
> And FWIW, y'all know as well as I do that cops *like* to nail truckers - and
> will do so for far less speed than 4-wheelers (in general). And for lots of
> things that are NOT speed-related.
I don't think that is true at all. The fact is that most cops do not deal with
trucks. Other than specialized CMV enforcement teams the only involvement that most
cops have with trucks is accident investigations. And before you tear off on that
one, I am not suggesting that trucks are involved in more accidents than 4
wheelers, only that truck accidents tend to be more serious in terms of death,
injuries, proper damage and road closures.
> So, YES! - give those bear reports! That just gives your fellow drivers out
> there a little warning. The cop might have a vehicle pulled over close to the
> edge lines. He might be watching for something OTHER THAN speeding. Cars might
Heaven forbid that one trucker might actually suggest to the speeders that their
speed in endangering other people on the road. Speed is a factor in most
accidents, especially truck accidents, and that heavy vehicles travelling at higher
speeds are likely to cause much more serious damage.
>
> Speed, in and of itself, has never caused an accident or killed anybody. Speed,
> in and of itself, is NOT unsafe. OTHER unsafe driving habits, inattention, and
> inexperience, are the main causes of accidents. Higher speeds *may* [note the
> emphasis on "may"] increase the damages WHEN an accident happens - but do NOT
> cause the accidents.
That is obviously you opinion, and not likely to be changed. However, it is
diametrically opposed to all evidence.
Detour
>
> What are some of you fellow drivers thinking about smokey reports on the
cb
> radio. I seldom if ever exceed the speed limit by 3 mph, whether it be in
> CA, OR, NV, etc. I've come to the conclusion that giving out smokey
reports
> when I am driving legal would be kind of hypocritical. By giving out
smokey
> reports I was just condoning bad behavior on behalf of my fellow truckers.
>
> Opinions? Insight?
>
Personally I don't do bear reports and never have. I have hesitations about
interfering with someone who is only doing their job, especially when their
job is "to protect and serve". It has also occurred to me that bear reports
may endanger people. If Mr. Bear is looking for someone specific who is
wanted by the law, e.g. a kidnapper or serial killer who was seen in the
area; then if that criminal is listening too, and I give a bear report, I
could be responsible for that person not getting caught, and therefore
responsible for the harm they cause in the future. I honestly believe bear
reports cause far more harm than simply allowing speeding drivers to get
away with it.
Detour
gpsman
can't believe it's tolerated. Who needs one...?
I think most LEO's tolerate 10mph over the limit *depending on
conditions*. It seems many "drivers" are not content unless running as
fast as possible... regardless of conditions. When a driver blows by me
at 90 or 100 (5 times in 1 day) it makes me wonder... "How fast is fast
enough" and "Where is this guy in such a hurry to be?".
I think these reports are only needed by gross violators; unsafe drivers
I would prefer were running Euclids in coal mines. The drivers who are
stealing loads from you and me. If they get under one extra load per
month by running *too fast* that's one less load for those of us who run
sensibly. These are the same drivers who underbid loads because they can
run faster... and still steal those extra loads... thanks to their
"brotherhood". WTH kind of brotherhood is that?! A brotherhood of
pickpockets and thieves stabbing the rest of us in the back. Seems it's
time for a "changing of the guard" and a real Brotherhood to me.
How does a guy hauling the same loads as me - fuel a 600 CAT in a new
rig running 75mph+ carrying 1000 extra pounds of chrome - be home 7 days
of every 28? Incredible money management skills? I see some pretty fancy
rigs parked in the muddy, filthy yards of $12k trailers ... and it makes
me wonder...
And too many drivers never consider the unintended consequences of
their actions. Suppose the speeding driver is involved in a crash
because they were able to avoid LE. Crashes are the result of a chain
of events that, it can be argued, began at birth. A difference of
seconds in travel progress can contribute to the avoidance or occurance
of a crash. IMNSHO, assisting a driver in avoiding LE contributes to
*any* accident that driver has... from that point forward! Years later,
that driver would not be occupying that particular place on the planet
where and when a crash occurs... had they not received a Bear Report
and avoided LE.
And... AFAIK, no truck tire is rated for speeds over 65mph.
--
Posted at http://www.layover.com/
Trucking jobs, news, features, chat rooms, and more!
SLW TRK
n...@spam.org (>Zeke<)
I don't listen to 19. I don't see how anyone can, who works mainly close
in to a city. When I do it's usually to thank a roadtruck for the chance
to check my anti-locks.
The ten or so of us that work together run on a different channel and
don't bother about speed cops, but we will pass along the where abouts
of those damn black and white pickups, or any state/county/city vehicle
that carries scales.
Why?
Because 80% of our loads are not scaled and we could very well be 500
pounds over on a given load. If they bother to leave the shoulder and
come after you it's almost guaranteed you'll get weighed.
Besides, who doesn't mind stepping out of a nice cool truck to be
scrutinized?
--
Nick
SLW TRK
Truckinsp wrote;
>We can't "nail" truckers that are running
>legal........
enough you could find something wrong with
almost every truck on the road?
Your statement above sounds like "You don't
need a lawyer if you're innocent".
--
Nick
SLW TRK
gpsman&dricersmail.com (gpsman)
>Years later, that driver would not be occupying
>that particular place on the planet where and
>when a crash occurs... had they not received a
>Bear Report and avoided LE.
--
Nick
Truckinsp
Well, when you are out in your travels, look at the right lower windshields of
other trucks....those with the little CVSA stickers are the ones we found
nothing wrong with.....
There are A LOT of vehicles out there that are in excellent condition.....I
look for the ones I know have violations....and as for finding something wrong
if I look long and hard enough.....I can't find what isn't there.....
>
>
>
>
Daniel Mahoney
> As far as smokie reports go...
>
> What are some of you fellow drivers thinking about smokey reports on the cb
> radio. I seldom if ever exceed the speed limit by 3 mph, whether it be in
> CA, OR, NV, etc. I've come to the conclusion that giving out smokey reports
> when I am driving legal would be kind of hypocritical. By giving out smokey
> reports I was just condoning bad behavior on behalf of my fellow truckers.
>
> Opinions? Insight?
I think everyone is blowing this thing way out of proportion.
I usually run 2 or 3 MPH above the speed limit. I feel pretty
safe doing so. Have I heard of people getting ticketed at 2 or
3 MPH above the limit? Yes, I have. I can't swear the reports
are true, but I've sure heard 'em.
When I hear a bear report on the CB, and I'm close to where the
smokey was reported, I'll drop my speed down to the limit. I
figure there's no point in risking it when it's just that small
difference in speed. That means I appreciate hearing bear reports.
Since I appreciate smokey reports, I'll also give them. That
seems fair to me.
Of course, if I'm in the granny lane driving safely and some
bozo supertrucker goes roaring by me at 15 or 20 MPH over the
limit, I'll also mention that on the CB. "Eastbounders near
mile marker 110, watch out for the asshole trucker doing 80".
If a bear happens to have his CB on, hears that report, and
nails the idiot, so be it.
I don't think that I'm endorsing unsafe driving by giving bear
reports. Most of the truckers that I meet drive like I do - just
a hair over the limit.
--
Posted via Mailgate.ORG Server - http://www.Mailgate.ORG
Gunslinger
I don't think I'm gonna address this point by point; it'll get too long. But I
think in a couple of places either I was not being clear enough, or you were not
understanding what I was trying to say....
>> Guys like Dave and Tony are what's becoming the death of the
>> "brotherhood" that trucking used to be.
>
> I can't imagine that to have been a
>part of this "brotherhood", "back then", was to help your fellow trucker to
>violate the law. After all, why would there be any reason to have to know
>where a "smoky" was, if you were driving within the confines of the law?
Because "back then", the law had ridiculously lowered speed limits to 55mph even
on stretches of highway where you might travel for 50-100 miles and never see
another vehicle.
>Giving a bear report is not a courtesy. It's a willful act of endorsing and
>helping others to violate the law. There is not one justifiable reason for
>giving a bear report that you can conjure up, that would prove anything
>contrary, UNLESS the bear is parked in such a way that he might present an
>accident risk.
I've seen that too, all too many times - the cop parked partly in the travel
lanes. But in general, I think it's a good idea to know where they are. If
*they* can hide behind a bush and watch *me*, why shouldn't *I* do the same (via
a CB)? A quick "heads up" is not necessarily being a lawbreaker.
>For some reason, intelligent
>life on the CB is hard to find.
Agreed. When ALL the "intelligent life" thinks as you do, and refuses to talk on
the CB, then the idiots will have won. IMO, it's a matter of principle.
>> Hey, who am *I* to be a sanctimonious asshole about how fast somebody
>> *else* is going (unless IMO they're *also* driving dangerously)?
>
>How sad it is, that you view my failure to endorse bear reports, as being
>an asshole, rather than trying to force people to be safe
Never said you were an asshole... although on re-reading what I wrote I can see
how you could interpret it that way. My apologies. FWIW, you cannot "force"
people to be safe. Or unsafe, FTM. And also FWIW, I will rag a trucker's ass for
tailgating FAR more than worrying about speed. Also FWIW, *you* mention speeds
like "20 miles over the limit" and so on. Yeah, in the eastern half, that's a
bit too strong IMO. But cops can/will nail a trucker for 4-5 over, too. And
THAT, IMO, sucks.
>> And FWIW, y'all know as well as I do that cops *like* to nail truckers -
>> and will do so for far less speed than 4-wheelers (in general).
>
>Is it any wonder WHY?
Mainly because the fine is usually 5-10 times what the exact same violation
would be in a car - and they know a trucker is FAR less likely to come back to
Bumfuck, Montana to dicker with a judge over it.
>> And for lots of things that are NOT speed-related.
>
>Again, it's no wonder. The cowboy mentality, and flippant attitudes towards
>the public are at the CORE, as to why we are scrutinized so much.
Hmm... how about a $50 ticket for a top corner marker light on a trailer not
working. That's a BS citation, and I see no way to correlate that with a "cowboy
mentality". But yes, I do agree that there are some truck operators out there
who do have that kind of mentality. The one I just cannot understand is getting
put out of service for a log book violation! Hey, it takes 3 minutes a day to do
a log. Why on earth would anyone risk getting shut down for 8 hours PLUS a big
fine, for 3 minutes a day. No, I have never had a logbook ticket....
>You bring up the "brotherhood of trucking", as if it's a good thing
>anymore. It's not. It's been altered and morphed into something that it
>never was to begin with. We used to be admired, envied, and respected.
years ago, truckers would almost always help each other out in any way they
could. That included "smoky reports", breakdown assistance, making a phone call,
any so on. That was so even before I started driving - even before the CB. Ask
some of the real old-timers about the hand signals they gave each other as smoky
reports.... It's a different kind of person driving trucks these days, and an
entirely different attitude. That's what I was trying to get at with the
"brotherhood of trucking" comment - NOT anything like the Teamsters or the Mafa
(same thing?). Back when, a trucker was a special kind of person, mostly. Now, I
think many would be just as happy flipping burgers at McD's if they could make
the same money.
I can recall when we used to sorta "work with" the cops, and give 'em a "heads
up" on unsafe drivers. And vice-versa, some of them would give *us* a "heads-up"
on a speed trap ahead, too. BTDT. But it has now become an adversarial
relationship which has done a lot of damage to the reps on BOTH sides of the
aisle, IMO.
>> Yes, it takes a truck longer to stop at higher speeds - same
>> as for any other vehicle. Speed, in and of itself, has never caused an
>> accident or killed anybody. Speed, in and of itself, is NOT unsafe.
>And to generally debunk that theory, I can recall as a teenager, having
>struck a tree after losing control in a curve. It was my fault for going too damn fast to make it
>safely around that curve.
Right. The cause of that accident was directly attributable to inexperience. Or
stupidity, if you prefer. Hey, I did the same thing when I was 17. We get older,
we get smarter. Or we don't get *much* older....
>> One last comment: IMNSFHO, any driver who would deliberately give a
>> false bear report falls into the same category as the cops who do the
>> same trying to entrap a trucker - 100%, dyed-in-the-wool, Grade A
>> "Asshole"...... JMO.
>
>So be it. After reading your testimony, I'm more convinced than ever, that
>it's a good thing to do.
And here, we will continue to disagree.
Dave Smith
> Because "back then", the law had ridiculously lowered speed limits to 55mph even on stretches of
> highway where you might travel for 50-100 miles and never see another vehicle.
It does seem a little slow. The German autobahn has long stretches where there is no speed limit but
trucks are limited to 90 kph, which is approx. 55 mph. The traffic moves at a steady rate and there are
few accidents. When we had photo radar here a few years ago, it was restricted to the main arteries
around Toronto. Traffic was much smoother because everyone was doing the same speed. There were fewer
accidents and fewer traffic tie ups.
> like "20 miles over the limit" and so on. Yeah, in the eastern half, that's a
> bit too strong IMO. But cops can/will nail a trucker for 4-5 over, too. And
> THAT, IMO, sucks.
I have never heard of a speeding ticket for 4-5 over anywhere in the US. Not to say that it never
happens, because I got a ticket from a photo radar site in Holland two years ago for 54 kph in a 50 kph
zone. But that was a machine.
> Mainly because the fine is usually 5-10 times what the exact same violation
> would be in a car - and they know a trucker is FAR less likely to come back to
> Bumfuck, Montana to dicker with a judge over it.
It's a funny thing about traffic tickets. Car drivers take them personally. Truckers consider them a
cost of doing business. I can think of cases where it took high fines to have any effect. Brake
adjustment is a prime example. It used to be our biggest single OOS defect. Our OOS rate at RoadCheck
was up over 40% for several years in a row, and approximately 90% of those OOS defects were for brake
adjustment. The $90 fines had been raised to $180 and there was still a problem. It was when the fines
hit $500 that we saw a reduction in OOS rates for brake adjustment. So don't tell me that trucks are
getting those fines only because they are less likely to come to court to fight them. The fines are
that high because the lower fines had demonstrated that they were not effective.
> Hmm... how about a $50 ticket for a top corner marker light on a trailer not
> working. That's a BS citation,
I agree. And that's why I have *never* laid a charge for a clearance light. Nor have I laid charges for
brake lights, signal lights, or any other lights when they were the only defect.
> The one I just cannot understand is getting
> put out of service for a log book violation! Hey, it takes 3 minutes a day to do
> a log. Why on earth would anyone risk getting shut down for 8 hours PLUS a big
> fine, for 3 minutes a day. No, I have never had a logbook ticket....
Yet, an amazing number of drivers fail to maintain their logs to the last change of status. I tend to
lay most of my log book charges at the beginning of a shift or when first arriving at an inspection
location. I used to start almost every shift with a log book charge. I would show up and pull over the
first truck as it came out of the customs compound. I could almost guarantee that the first one would
be behind, and I mean way behind, not just a few hours. I could also guarantee that the guy would get
on the CB and warn the others and that everyone else would get their logs caught up.
> years ago, truckers would almost always help each other out in any way they
> could. That included "smoky reports", breakdown assistance, making a phone call, any so on.
The industry has changed since deregulation. Everyone is too busy trying to undercut everyone else
these days. Their business used to be protected under regulation. Now it is a dog eat dog world.
> Right. The cause of that accident was directly attributable to inexperience. Or
> stupidity, if you prefer. Hey, I did the same thing when I was 17. We get older,
> we get smarter. Or we don't get *much* older....
Yet, I keep getting called out to investigate accidents where trucks have gone off the road or rolled
over going around curves.
gpsman
Coincidence. CO- (two or more) and INCIDENCE- (occurance of an event).
Coincidences occur every second, of every day, of every life. Life is
only a series of coincidences.
Remarkable coincidences only seem remarkable until you consider how many
remarkable coincidences *could* occur, opposed to how many *do* occur.
A man who bends over to pick up his weapon only to have his buddy
directly behind him catch his bullet spends a good portion of the
remainer of his life contemplating this seemingly impossible and
unlikely coincidence. The events that led one man to be holding his
weapon and the other man's to be on the ground are the result of each
mans' coincidences.
It only seems like "Twilight Zone". Instead, coincidence is a fact of
existence...
Hope this helps.
>Zeke<
news:vdhqede...@corp.supernews.com...
> If Mr. Bear is looking for someone specific who is
> wanted by the law, e.g. a kidnapper or serial killer who was seen in the
> area; then if that criminal is listening too, and I give a bear report, I
> could be responsible for that person not getting caught, and therefore
> responsible for the harm they cause in the future.
Interesting point... I never looked at it that way. Thanks.
>Zeke<
"gpsman" <gps...@dricersmail.com> wrote in message
news:3ed8ef68$1...@news.vic.com...
> How does a guy hauling the same loads as me - fuel a 600 CAT in a new
> rig running 75mph+ carrying 1000 extra pounds of chrome - be home 7 days
> of every 28? Incredible money management skills? I see some pretty fancy
> rigs parked in the muddy, filthy yards of $12k trailers ... and it makes
> me wonder...
Filthy trailer trash....LMAO! Sounds like Bullis, but he doesn't drive a
truck let alone a nice one.
SLW TRK
Truckinsp wrote;
>Well, when you are out in your travels, look at
>the right lower windshields of other
>trucks....those with the little CVSA stickers are
>the ones we found nothing wrong with.....
and it hasn't discouraged a DOT ins. yet.
>There are A LOT of vehicles out there that are
>in excellent condition.....I look for the ones I
>know have violations....and as for finding
>something wrong if I look long and hard
>enough.....I can't find what isn't there.....
pencils away.
--
Nick
Truckinsp
>
>... if you can. This philosophy of the connection of events is called
>Coincidence. CO- (two or more) and INCIDENCE- (occurance of an event).
>Coincidences occur every second, of every day, of every life. Life is
>only a series of coincidences.
>
>Remarkable coincidences only seem remarkable until you consider how many
>remarkable coincidences *could* occur, opposed to how many *do* occur.
>
>A man who bends over to pick up his weapon only to have his buddy
>directly behind him catch his bullet spends a good portion of the
>remainer of his life contemplating this seemingly impossible and
>unlikely coincidence. The events that led one man to be holding his
>weapon and the other man's to be on the ground are the result of each
>mans' coincidences.
Not hardly....I've spent a lot of time with firearms....it is not a
"co-incidence" that the gun was loaded....it is not a "co-incidence" that the
gun was on the ground....it is not a "co-incidence" that the person picked it
up with his finger on the trigger, it is not a "co-incidence" that he pressed
the trigger....it is not a "co-incidence" that the safety was off, or in the
case of a double action, that the guy pressed the trigger hard enough to
release a round......
You want to get more gun laws, then make sure you list every stupid shooting as
a "co-incidence"....that'll just give more arguements to people who want to
take away guns - that they can't be safely handled....when in fact, the PERSON
who was handling this gun was just plain STUPID and refusing to take
responsibility for a number of acts that culminated in his buddy getting
shot.....
Where the buddy was standing might have been a co-incidence....but you won't
get me to stand anywhere around someone carelessly picking up a gun.....if
there's a gun lying on the ground, I clear the area and pick it up....nobody
else - because I will always make sure the muzzle is pointed in a safe
direction!
Truckinsp
If I reported violations that didn't exist, that would put me in the same
category with drivers that falsify their logs.....I choose not to be in that
category.....
>
>--
>Nick
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
SLW TRK
(gpsman) wrote;
>Hope this helps.
A bigger help would have been the "channel"
you get. I love the old Twilight Zones.
--
Nick
Dave Smith
> Truckinsp wrote;
> >Well, when you are out in your travels, look at
> >the right lower windshields of other
> >trucks....those with the little CVSA stickers are
> >the ones we found nothing wrong with.....
> Well, from my perspective it's in the lower left,
> and it hasn't discouraged a DOT ins. yet.
From your perspective?? Is black white from your
perspective? CVSA stickers are affixed to the lower
right corner of the windshield. That is the right, as
in passenger side, the side of the truck that is next
to the right side of the road, as opposed to the left,
which is on the other side of the truck.
More bizarre
>>only a series of coincidences.
Fate or coincidences?
How about fateful coincidences?
Any coincidence can have "meaning" -- all one has to do is find some
meaning in a coincidence and viola!...instant meaningful coincidence.
But a meaningful coincidence does not a synchronicity make.
Coincidence is a nice word we have thought up, for situations of
high improbability, when we are incapable of calculating, or even attempting
to calculate the probability, because there are just too many factors and
our heads would hurt.
.
Truckinsp
>Date: 5/31/2003 6:11 PM Mountain Standard Time
>Message-id: <3ED944C5...@sympatico.ca>
>
>SLW TRK wrote:
>
>> Truckinsp wrote;
>> >Well, when you are out in your travels, look at
>> >the right lower windshields of other
>> >trucks....those with the little CVSA stickers are
>> >the ones we found nothing wrong with.....
>> Well, from my perspective it's in the lower left,
>> and it hasn't discouraged a DOT ins. yet.
>
>From your perspective?? Is black white from your
>perspective? CVSA stickers are affixed to the lower
>right corner of the windshield. That is the right, as
>in passenger side, the side of the truck that is next
>to the right side of the road, as opposed to the left,
>which is on the other side of the truck.
>
the sounds of his whining, he's been inspected a lot.....
Truckinsp
>
>Truckinsp wrote;
>>Well, when you are out in your travels, look at
>>the right lower windshields of other
>>trucks....those with the little CVSA stickers are
>>the ones we found nothing wrong with.....
>Well, from my perspective it's in the lower left,
>and it hasn't discouraged a DOT ins. yet.
Here, because you've never seen one....
http://www.cvsa.org/inspections/cvsa_decals.htm
SLW TRK
Truckinsp wrote;
>If I reported violations that didn't exist, that
>would put me in the same category with drivers
>that falsify their logs.....I choose not to be in that
>category.....
You sir, as an individual.
But I can't discount my real life experiences,
such as a truck being cited for lettering that has
passed three different annual inspections, or a
citation for being 200 lbs over on the rear
tandems although being under the 46,000 lb
limit.
I will continue to warn my friends of the
whereabouts of anyone who can ruin their
whole week.
--
Nick
gpsman
"...only to have his buddy directly behind him [catch his bullet] spends
a good portion..."
What I *should* have said... and meant to convey was:
..."catch the bullet *intended* [for] him" and not "catch the bullet
*launched* [by] him".
When I was in the military we often referred to rounds that were
"caught" as belonging to the recipient and not the person responsible
for distribution, (i.e. "the bullet with your name on it".)
Thereby making my coincidence example a profoundly deep and thoughtful
essay rather than the ramblings of an idiot...!
Sorry for the confusion. My bad.
And yet, it would still be a coincidence for a man to be standing behind
the idiot who would lay his weapon on the ground with a round chambered
and the safety off and launch probably the only accidental round he ever
fired... backward! I stand by my premise (it's not really mine. I could
never have seen this had it not been pointed out by a man much smarter
than myself) EVERYTHING is a coincidence. This case just another of
place and time.
SLW TRK
adavid.smith&sympatico.ca (Dave Smith)
>From your perspective?? Is black white from
>your perspective?
>CVSA stickers are affixed to the lower right
>corner of the windshield. That is the right, as in
>passenger side, the side of the truck that is next
>to the right side of the road, as opposed to the
>left, which is on the other side of the truck.
The annual sticker goes directly under the
registration sticker. Am I missing something
here?
--
Nick
SLW TRK
Truckinsp wrote;
>LOLOLOL....my guess is that he's never ever
>passed an inspection....
>.and from
>the sounds of his whining, he's been inspected
>a lot.....
LOL, From where I sit you profiling accused
shitheads aren't doing your jobs.
--
Nick
Whitelightning
"tscottme" <blah...@blah.net> wrote in message
news:AJWcnTvO6_m...@comcast.com...
>
>
> Gunslinger <gunsl...@no.spam.net> wrote in message
> news:ff4hdvkotsslpkjed...@4ax.com...
> >
> > To which I reply:
> >
> > Guys like Dave and Tony are what's becoming the death of the
> "brotherhood" that
> > trucking used to be.
>
> Add me to that list. Sticking together is a good idea only if the
> purpose is valid. Sticking together just to stick together is what the
> mafia does. Similar to the monthly call for a strike or parade of
> morons to drive to Washington for "truckers' rights", it matters greatly
> what the purpose is not just that we stick together.
>
> I think the low education level common in this industry is partly
> responsible for this desire for blind loyalty. You'll notice how
> seldom this call to stick together is used to pressure drivers to stop
> throwing piss bottles out the window, littering at every opportunity, or
> keeping lazy drivers from parking 10 deep beside the last fuel pump.
> When anyone mentions those things and the brotherhood, the universal
> reply is "you drive your truck, let him drive his truck". That proves
> to me that sticking together isn't the point of even those that keep
> saying those words, it's just a tactic used when they have nothing else
> to offer.
>
> --
> Scott
> --------
I disagree with you on some points Scott. I've seen posts and heard
complaints form every quarter of the industry except the preps about piss
bottles out the window, and parking "10 deep beside the last fuel pump". I
also take it personally your statement about the "low education level common
to the industry". While I do have some college, some of the most ignorant
jerks I have ever meet had degrees enough to paper a mansion. some of the
most intelligent and common sensed individuals I have meet in my life had
barely a HS diploma. seems to me even in the group we have seen a lot of
people with high education levels in here looking to move into trucking.
Whitelightning
Whitelightning
for had governers the only time speed was an issue was on the down grades
like 80 east bound through Penn when I would just take my foot of the pedal
and let gravity do the rest (in gear of course, I have no suicidal
tendencies). I can only speak for myself, in the personal vehicle I find
myself much more alert to what is going on around me when I am pushing it.
I've had no accidents driving truck, and no speeding tickets(did get an
overload back in 85). I've had two accidents driving four wheeler, both
times while being a "good boy" and driving at or below the posted limit. I
give smoky reports in the big truck, and in my personal, and appreciate
getting them. Even when your in the limits its nice to know cause sure as
the sun rises in the east and sets in the west the four wheeler in front of
you is going to hit the brakes when he spots him. Its human nature behind
the wheel, tap the brakes, check your speed, better safe than sorry.
Knowing where he is gives you a heads up. As to the tickets 3-4 mph over
the speed limit, I used to have a list of states that were zero tolerance,
meaning no lee-way. Florida is one, New York another as well as both
virginia and west virginia, and of course ohio Seems to me all but about
six states were that way. What an officer does is another matter entirely
Whitelightning
~Tony~
news:vdhqede...@corp.supernews.com:
> It has also occurred to me
> that bear reports may endanger people. If Mr. Bear is looking for
> someone specific who is wanted by the law, e.g. a kidnapper or serial
> killer who was seen in the area; then if that criminal is listening
> too, and I give a bear report, I could be responsible for that person
> not getting caught, and therefore responsible for the harm they cause
> in the future. I honestly believe bear reports cause far more harm
> than simply allowing speeding drivers to get away with it.
Another GREAT point, and one that I had not considered before.
~Tony~
~Tony~
news:90d95096bfa92accaf9...@mygate.mailgate.org:
> I think everyone is blowing this thing way out of proportion.
>
> I usually run 2 or 3 MPH above the speed limit. I feel pretty
> safe doing so. Have I heard of people getting ticketed at 2 or
> 3 MPH above the limit? Yes, I have. I can't swear the reports
> are true, but I've sure heard 'em.
I've had plenty of people swear they received tickets for this, but to
date, I have yet to have one person produce a ticket for less than 10 mph
over the posted speed limit....in any state. I do know that Ohio and
California are reported to be stricter, and I've driven many miles in both
states, and never had any problems when I drove slightly above the speed
limit.
> I don't think that I'm endorsing unsafe driving by giving bear
> reports. Most of the truckers that I meet drive like I do - just
> a hair over the limit.
Well...my experience is different. I live in North Georgia, and I-75 from
Chattanooga to Atlanta seems to be a haven for speeders, and this includes
trucks. Four wheelers routinely drive close to 100 mph. Trucks have been
clocked at speeds of 15-20 mph over the speed limit, but not quite as
frequently as autos.
I run I-20 and I-59 in Alabama routinely, and the experience is similar,
but not nearly as bad as I-75. Enforcement is lax in North Georgia due to
State Patrolmen having to work many miles of side roads, and the accident
rate up here is phenominally bad. When they get breaks from working wrecks,
they hit the interstate, and there is never a shortage of those seeking a
driving award.
Obviously, you're not endorsing bad driving for those that use sense and a
little self-control, but there are those out there who seem to not find
themselves capable of restraining themselves, and for some reason, they
always seem to of the "large car" persuasion. For some reason, some who buy
or drive a Peterbuilt, a Classic Freightliner, or KW, must affix a "shark's
tooth" bugscreen on the front, and terrorize the public by tailgating until
someone moves to the right, and then demonstrating how fast they can
recover speed to blow the doors off of Granny Grunt's putt-putt mobile.
I'm truly not exaggerating. I see this all the time, and I know that I'm
not the only one.
~Tony~
Have time to kill and need a laugh?
Curious to see just how sick a person can be?
Read up on the most notorius poster in MTT! -"Richard"
He even has several websites dedicated in his honor.
http://www.lart.com/rtsfaq/
http://www.netstoopid.com/fbifile/
http://www.fustercluck.com/cenkoc/index1.html
http://bolo_bullis.tripod.com/
http://www.lart.com/stupidrichard/
http://www.lart.com/cenkoc.html
http://convict.iwarp.com/bullis-single.jpg
http://www.cabal.net/cenkoc/spanked.html
http://www.databasix.com/~cipher/RtS/index1.html
http://www.sputum.com/shame.html
~Tony~
news:n71idv0tmc500m3ld...@4ax.com:
> Because "back then", the law had ridiculously lowered speed limits to
> 55mph even on stretches of highway where you might travel for 50-100
> miles and never see another vehicle.
I'm with you. 55 mph in some places was low, and when speed limits were
increased, there was no one more happy than myself. The problem seems to
be, that some people don't ever think in terms of speed limits. They think
in terms of how much they can get away with and not get caught.
> I've seen that too, all too many times - the cop parked partly in the
> travel lanes. But in general, I think it's a good idea to know where
> they are. If *they* can hide behind a bush and watch *me*, why
> shouldn't *I* do the same (via a CB)? A quick "heads up" is not
> necessarily being a lawbreaker.
No, and I willingly offer that most all who give reports are not problem
drivers. They are doing it as a courtesy, and a tradition that has been
around for as long as I've been driving trucks.
Those that routinely drive much faster than the speed limit, are few and
far between, but they are a problem, and I simply feel that even if we
offer reports for the right reasons, they do take advantage of them, to
violate the law.
> Agreed. When ALL the "intelligent life" thinks as you do, and refuses
> to talk on the CB, then the idiots will have won. IMO, it's a matter
> of principle.
Fair enough, but I do talk on the CB. It's not often, and I listen much
more than I talk. I have it on about half the time. I run two lanes the
vast majority of the time, and rarely have it on while on those roads, but
on interstates, I almost always have it on. I don't feel right on an
interstate with no CB on. Don't ask me why.....it's just a quirk.
> Never said you were an asshole... although on re-reading what I wrote
> I can see how you could interpret it that way. My apologies. FWIW, you
> cannot "force" people to be safe. Or unsafe, FTM. And also FWIW, I
> will rag a trucker's ass for tailgating FAR more than worrying about
> speed. Also FWIW, *you* mention speeds like "20 miles over the limit"
> and so on. Yeah, in the eastern half, that's a bit too strong IMO. But
> cops can/will nail a trucker for 4-5 over, too. And THAT, IMO, sucks.
I apologize for misunderstanding your comment. You're right....I can't
force the issue, and find that it's more trouble than it's worth to shame
people too. It's sad, but there are some bad elements out there. Sure, most
are probably more mouth than action, and despite the fact that I have a
carry permit valid in the two states I run, I have no desire to ever have a
showdown with an unstable individual.
I'm not disputing your word, but I've heard the tales, of a driver knowing
a driver who supposedly received tickets for this amount over the speed
limit, but I have yet to have seen one. I don't say they don't exist, but I
can probably explain them if they do.
They probably copped an attitude upon the officer walking up to them, when
the intention was to simply issue a warning, or they might have been issued
to them to avoid a more costly amount for some other violation, or it was a
reduction to give the driver a break.
I run across drivers all the time who have an anti-cop mentality, or who
seem to have more than their share of encounters with officers. To be
clear, I'm not saying you are one of these people.
I used to be an active cop, and am still certified. My father is still an
active State Patrolman in Georgia, and I swear to God, I have never made
this known when I have had encounters with law enforcement...ever. I am
always respectful and polite, and take my lumps if they are deserved. The
last ticket I received was issued from a patrolman that my father knew very
well. He pointedly asked if I was related to him, and I denied it. He was
told later the truth.
Anyway...I guess the point I am getting at, is that the outcome of any
traffic stop is going to be largely determined by the way you carry
yourself, whether or not you try to talk an officer out of a ticket, and
whether or not you admit that you were wrong.
My tactic has always been to immediately fess up that I was wrong, offer no
excuse, and apologize for the error. My percentage rate of success in
leaving with no more than a warning, is about 75%. It's been more than
three years since I have even been stopped for a thing, except for brief
paperwork checks at a scale.
> Hmm... how about a $50 ticket for a top corner marker light on a
> trailer not working. That's a BS citation, and I see no way to
> correlate that with a "cowboy mentality".
I agree. A fine for one marker light being out is ludicrous, unless a
driver has failed to write up in his logbook that he performed a pre-trip
inspection. Even then....$50.00 is a bit stiff.
> But yes, I do agree that
> there are some truck operators out there who do have that kind of
> mentality. The one I just cannot understand is getting put out of
> service for a log book violation! Hey, it takes 3 minutes a day to do
> a log. Why on earth would anyone risk getting shut down for 8 hours
> PLUS a big fine, for 3 minutes a day. No, I have never had a logbook
> ticket....
That's one I have never received either. I've been as guilty as anyone of
forgetting to draw a line when I was supposed to, and did get caught two
times, once in NC, and once in TN, and both times I was allowed to catch it
up and go on my way.
> years ago, truckers would almost always help each other out in any way
> they could. That included "smoky reports", breakdown assistance,
> making a phone call, any so on. That was so even before I started
> driving - even before the CB. Ask some of the real old-timers about
> the hand signals they gave each other as smoky reports.... It's a
> different kind of person driving trucks these days, and an entirely
> different attitude. That's what I was trying to get at with the
> "brotherhood of trucking" comment - NOT anything like the Teamsters or
> the Mafa (same thing?). Back when, a trucker was a special kind of
> person, mostly. Now, I think many would be just as happy flipping
> burgers at McD's if they could make the same money.
> I can recall when we used to sorta "work with" the cops, and give 'em
> a "heads up" on unsafe drivers. And vice-versa, some of them would
> give *us* a "heads-up" on a speed trap ahead, too. BTDT. But it has
> now become an adversarial relationship which has done a lot of damage
> to the reps on BOTH sides of the aisle, IMO.
I don't think it's quite as bad as it has been. In my experience, when I
put the officer at ease that I know that he is doing his job, things almost
always go my way. I find that most officers are capable of knowing and
understanding that we are people too, and what kind of person they have in
front of them at the moment. I've had only two bad encounters with LEO's in
more than 20 years.
By the same token, I've witnessed firsthand, how a driver can ruin
someone's day with an attitude, and it's possible that I just happened to
be next in line after that encounter.
The thing to keep in mind, is that there are good and bad people
everywhere, and in all kinds of professions. Being a cop is not easy, and
if a person is not careful, they get cynical and will view people in the
same light. Not all drivers are cut out for their job, and the same goes
for cops as well.
I've met all kinds of people through the years, and have met only a handful
that were not easy in any way to relate to. There are some people that seem
to hate everyone. I'm sure that a few of these get to wear a badge.
> Right. The cause of that accident was directly attributable to
> inexperience. Or stupidity, if you prefer. Hey, I did the same thing
> when I was 17. We get older, we get smarter. Or we don't get *much*
> older....
Okay...but speed was the only factor that caused me to lose control. I did
this on a road that I drove nightly, to and from work.
> And here, we will continue to disagree.
For what it's worth....I haven't done that in awhile.
Naturally, not all of us are going to agree on everything, and this is just
one example of how some differ on things.
I appreciate your response, and have every respect for your position on
this.
~Tony~
news:gheCa.3827$JW6....@nwrddc02.gnilink.net:
> I also take it personally your statement about the "low
> education level common to the industry". While I do have some
> college, some of the most ignorant jerks I have ever meet had degrees
> enough to paper a mansion. some of the most intelligent and common
> sensed individuals I have meet in my life had barely a HS diploma.
> seems to me even in the group we have seen a lot of people with high
> education levels in here looking to move into trucking. Whitelightning
There's no need in taking offense to a statement that does not apply to
yourself. The trucking industry is an occupation that is largely filled
with people of lower education levels. It's a fact.
He wasn't saying that all truck drivers are dumb. He wasn't saying that all
truck driver's are ignorant either.
I'll make some statements that might surprise you even further.
Most truck drivers don't read a newspaper...ever.
Most truck drivers vote for Democrats, if they vote at all.
Most truck drivers do not vote in elections.
More truck drivers smoke cigarettes in larger percentages than the rest of
the population, when compared to those in other professions.
Most truck drivers couldn't tell you the name of our Vice-President if
asked.
More truck drivers rent living quarters than own them.
Most truck drivers have lower credit scores than those in other
professions.
Most truck drivers would join a union, if one existed that they could
participate in.
Compared to those in other fields of work, there are larger percentages of
those with less than a high school education.
If you happen upon a piss bottle on the side of a road, or in a truck stop
parking lot, the chances that a truck driver put it there is about
99.999999999%.
Does all of this mean that we are sub-standard people? That would depend
upon several factors, and whom you asked.
I don't think that a highway worker or truck stop employee, who is charged
with piss bottle detail, thinks highly of drivers. I don't think that any
highway worker, who in the throes of cutting grass, is sprayed from head to
toe with fermented urine, when the blades slice through the bottle, is
inclined to dole out positive comments on truck drivers.
~Tony~
> And... AFAIK, no truck tire is rated for speeds over 65mph.
Well now....THAT's interesting to say the least.
Can you point us to a source of this info?
I'm not discounting it. I want to learn more about it.....
Dave Smith
>
> >CVSA stickers are affixed to the lower right
> >corner of the windshield. That is the right, as in
> >passenger side, the side of the truck that is next
> >to the right side of the road, as opposed to the
> >left, which is on the other side of the truck.
> In Texas, as a local?
> The annual sticker goes directly under the
> registration sticker. Am I missing something
> here?
>
Apparently you are missing something. Following a
comment i the thread about nailing innocent truckers,
you suggested that if an inspector looks long enough
and hard enough that he will find something wrong with
a truck, and truckinsp pointed out that there are lots
of trucks running around displaying CVSA stickers.
Those are the stickers that we affix to trucks after
inspecting them and finding no defects. They are
green, yellow, orange or white, have a single number on
the middle and may have one or two of the top corners
clipped off. They go on the bottom right corner of the
windshield.You seem to have them confused with the
annual inspection sticker.
SLW TRK
Dave Smith wrote;
>Apparently you are missing something.
>Following a comment i the thread about nailing
>innocent truckers, you suggested that if an
>inspector looks long enough and hard enough
>that he will find something wrong with a truck,
knowledge to back it up. My "they'd take your
pencils away" comment was an attempt at
humor. Apparently lost on those who think
"innocent truck driver" is an oxymoron.
>and truckinsp pointed out that there are lots of
>trucks running around displaying CVSA
>stickers. Those are the stickers that we affix to
>trucks after inspecting them and finding no
>defects.
You have said you don't cite someone for
something as silly as a clearance light, but it's
clearly possible and done every day. An officer
_can_ be as picayune as his mood dictates. He
can, if nothing else, park a truck for something
as common as two air lines that have rubbed
together and claim one or the other or both
could fail.
About twenty years ago, at a roadcheck, I was
put oos for frayed cotton batting around the
spring brake air line on the right rear driver of a
one year old truck. It was a plastic line not a
braided hose. I tried to tell the cop it had
nothing to do with the strength of the hose, but
he wouldn't have it. I took off the line, called for
a ride, went into town and had a meal. While in
the parking lot of the restaurant I stripped the
batting off, cleaned it and polished the fittings.
When I called the cop over after reinstalling the
line he sent me on my way.
That shit happens.
So does being put oos for a turn signal, then
put back in service, claiming the defect was
repaired on the scene, without ever touching
the damn bulb.
That's not opinion, that's fact. Irrefutable
>single number on the middle and may have one
>or two of the top corners clipped off. They go on
>the bottom right corner of the windshield.
radius I deal with CMV enforcement consisting
of the cities of Ft. Worth, Arlington, Tarrant and
Denton counties, and state DPS and DOT. I
see and deal with more L.E. per load than most
road trucks in a day. More in thirty miles than
most do in several hundred. All day, every day,
for the last 28 years, and I have never heard of
cvsa stickers, or had an officer put one on my
windshield after a roadcheck. I wish they would,
sounds like a three month free pass.
>annual inspection sticker.
--
Nick
SLW TRK
(SLW TRK)
I took exception to being called a whiner, and
for not maintaining a truck at least as well as
the shit I see on the road everyday.
But my last comment was uncalled for.
I'm sorry.
--
Nick
--
Nick
Dave Smith
>
> I read the link he provided.
> You have said you don't cite someone for
> something as silly as a clearance light, but it's
> clearly possible and done every day.
It is possible and it may happen every day. I don't do
it, and neither do the guys who I work with.
> An officer
> _can_ be as picayune as his mood dictates. He
> can, if nothing else, park a truck for something
> as common as two air lines that have rubbed
> together and claim one or the other or both
> could fail.
The CVSA OOS criterion for hoses applies to rubber hoses
that have been worn through the reinforcing layer, or
plastic hoses worn through the outer layer. That is in
black and white in the OOS criteria. We have no choice
but to put them OOS if they are in that condition. It is
a liability issue for us if we do not put them OOS. I
do not put vehicles OOS for hoses rubbing. However, it
is a violation of our maintenance regulations if hoses
are rubbing. I would not write a ticket for it if that
was the only violation, but if there were other defects,
it would be included in the list.
> About twenty years ago, at a roadcheck, I was
> put oos for frayed cotton batting around the
> spring brake air line on the right rear driver of a
> one year old truck. It was a plastic line not a
> braided hose. I tried to tell the cop it had
> nothing to do with the strength of the hose, but
> he wouldn't have it. I took off the line, called for
> a ride, went into town and had a meal. While in
> the parking lot of the restaurant I stripped the
> batting off, cleaned it and polished the fittings.
> When I called the cop over after reinstalling the
> line he sent me on my way.
According to what you say, it would appear that the
officer was wrong. Some seem to have trouble telling the
hose from conduits.
> That shit happens.
> So does being put oos for a turn signal, then
> put back in service, claiming the defect was
> repaired on the scene, without ever touching
> the damn bulb.
The bulb is not always the problem. Sometimes it is just
a bad connection in the system or at the plug.
>
> >They are green, yellow, orange or white, have a
> >single number on the middle and may have one
> >or two of the top corners clipped off. They go on
> >the bottom right corner of the windshield.
> 95% of my work is in a 30 mile radius. In that
> radius I deal with CMV enforcement consisting
> of the cities of Ft. Worth, Arlington, Tarrant and
> Denton counties, and state DPS and DOT. I
> see and deal with more L.E. per load than most
> road trucks in a day. More in thirty miles than
> most do in several hundred. All day, every day,
> for the last 28 years, and I have never heard of
> cvsa stickers, or had an officer put one on my
> windshield after a roadcheck. I wish they would,
> sounds like a three month free pass.
They are not a free pass. Our policy is that a vehicle
displaying a current sticker is low on the priority list
for inspection. During RoadCheck we do not do vehicles
where there is a current sticker on both the truck and
the trailer.
Truckinsp
>I read the link he provided.
>You have said you don't cite someone for
>something as silly as a clearance light, but it's
>clearly possible and done every day. An officer
>_can_ be as picayune as his mood dictates. He
>can, if nothing else, park a truck for something
>as common as two air lines that have rubbed
>together and claim one or the other or both
>could fail.
Hoses touching is not a violation, hoses chaffing into each other is, and it IS
an out of service if the chaffing is so bad that the the inner core is showing
on one of the hoses...
>About twenty years ago, at a roadcheck, I was
>put oos for frayed cotton batting around the
>spring brake air line on the right rear driver of a
>one year old truck. It was a plastic line not a
>braided hose. I tried to tell the cop it had
>nothing to do with the strength of the hose, but
>he wouldn't have it. I took off the line, called for
>a ride, went into town and had a meal. While in
>the parking lot of the restaurant I stripped the
>batting off, cleaned it and polished the fittings.
>When I called the cop over after reinstalling the
>line he sent me on my way.
>That shit happens.
Can't comment on what truck inspections were like 20 years ago.....back then
every state did its own thing....
>So does being put oos for a turn signal, then
>put back in service, claiming the defect was
>repaired on the scene, without ever touching
>the damn bulb.
When I ask you to turn on a rear turn signal on your load and it doesn't work,
then it is an out of service....I really don't care if the bulb is loose, if a
wire is frayed, or if the pigtail isn't on tight.....you've been driving down
the highway like that.......so you jiggle something and "fix" it....great....so
when you get pulled in again, if the inspector has computer access and looks up
your recent inspections and sees the same violation, he's going to write you
for violating an out of service order....around here that could cost you your
driver's license for 90 days depending on what kind of picayune mood the judge
is in.....I suggest you find out why it isn't working all the time and make a
permanent fix.....
>That's not opinion, that's fact. Irrefutable
>>They are green, yellow, orange or white, have a
>>single number on the middle and may have one
>>or two of the top corners clipped off. They go on
>>the bottom right corner of the windshield.
>95% of my work is in a 30 mile radius. In that
>radius I deal with CMV enforcement consisting
>of the cities of Ft. Worth, Arlington, Tarrant and
>Denton counties, and state DPS and DOT. I
>see and deal with more L.E. per load than most
>road trucks in a day. More in thirty miles than
>most do in several hundred. All day, every day,
>for the last 28 years, and I have never heard of
>cvsa stickers, or had an officer put one on my
>windshield after a roadcheck.
Then you aren't paying attention....I've been in that area and seen many CVSA
stickers......
Course you have to PASS an inspection to get one.....
>I wish they would,
>sounds like a three month free pass.
Only from vehicle inspections unless the inspector sees a violation or suspects
one...
>>You seem to have them confused with the
>>annual inspection sticker.
>Ignorance is bliss.
Really? I don't think so......
>
>--
>Nick
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
tscottme
Whitelightning <white.li...@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:gheCa.3827$JW6....@nwrddc02.gnilink.net...
I know people can be quite sensitive about education in this industry
but let's face it, rarely is anything more than being 21 years old and
able to stay awake for a 3 week CDL class required to enter the field.
Superstition and rumor is rampant in the industry. I know it makes
people feel better to think that all the people that have degrees don't
have any common sense. But few people, except maybe in trucking, would
argue that learning more would make someone less intelligent. There is
a reason people sell bogus radar jammers to truck drivers, bogus
"nutritional" supplements to truck drivers, and that this industry is
filled with O-Os that think being a business owner means signing a
contract and buying chrome and carting the money off in a wheel barrow.
You can take my comment personally, people do that whether it was
directed at them or not. Rarely do I hear anyone say something like
"this left-handed cab driver ripped me off and left me stranded" without
someone else chiming in to say "well, I'm left-handed and it's wrong for
you to say all left-handed people are cheats." When I say something
like that I will argue the point, when I don't make such a point, I'm
not going to clarify my point to disprove someone's notion.
When was the last time you've heard a parent tell little Johnny "to stay
in school if you want to be a truck driver"?
--
Scott
--------
Saudi Arabia is the enemy, let's stop pretending otherwise.
tscottme
accountants, dentists, engineers, etc. do you suppose pay someone to
make them sound as ridiculous as possible? I dare say there are far
more truck drivers using echo and reverb to sound like inbred morons
than the others.
Can anyone ever imagine calling an attorney or doctor for an appointment
and he answers the phone sounding like some drunk phuck with his head in
a trash can? Well there are drivers that try to *impress* their
co-workers by doing just that.
gpsman
Fisher (the woman who knows more about truck tires than I know about
anything).
I checked her site and found the link below. If you look at the product
specs you'll see the max. sustained speed ratings for the tire on this page
is... 75mph! So I stand corrected and enlightened.
Thanks Tony
~Tony~
news:oprp3wnd...@news.fuse.net:
Thanks....I'll check it out...
~Tony~
egpowers
turn it on to pass along hazards or accidents, or if the road
conditions suddenly change. However, on a 2 lane I will tend to have
it on, and perhaps be more likely to give a bear report, or listen for
one. Especially on some of the 2 lanes that I run where the 65 mph
limit is lower than it maybe should be, and the cops like to nail at 2
over. The reason I usually leave the CB off has more to do with the
fact that I get tired of the static, and ignorant "billy big riggers"
on the radio. What's the old saying "if you can't say something nice,
don't say anything at all". It seems that many of the drivers on the
road have forgotten that.
">Zeke<" <n...@spam.org> wrote in message news:<vtPBa.711$Zk4...@fe01.atl2.webusenet.com>...
> As far as smokie reports go...
>
> What are some of you fellow drivers thinking about smokey reports on the cb
> radio. I seldom if ever exceed the speed limit by 3 mph, whether it be in
> CA, OR, NV, etc. I've come to the conclusion that giving out smokey reports
> when I am driving legal would be kind of hypocritical. By giving out smokey
> reports I was just condoning bad behavior on behalf of my fellow truckers.
>
> Opinions? Insight?
>
> --
>
>
>
> Having been a known poster in a group used by a group of people for an
> intended purpose does not make that person what the group intent implies.
> You have assumed wrongfully, that alt.sex.children, caters only to
> pedophiles. - Richard the Stupid
>
> It is true I posted in certain newsgroups that catered to child
> pornography at various times in the past. - Richard the Stupid
>
> I have found many newsgroups which do carry kiddy porn where the
> name of the group suggests no such thing. - Richard the Stupid
Whitelightning
"~Tony~" <alp...@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:Xns938DD0556AC6Aa...@65.82.44.187...
Whitelightning
SLW TRK
>Course you have to PASS an inspection to get
>one.....
I'm done with this thread.
--
Nick
Whitelightning
Whitelightning
Whitelightning
>
>
> I know people can be quite sensitive about education in this industry
> but let's face it, rarely is anything more than being 21 years old and
> able to stay awake for a 3 week CDL class required to enter the field.
Well other than the "3 week CDL class" that discription fits just about
every blue collar and manufacturing job in the country, or about 75% of the
working population.
> Superstition and rumor is rampant in the industry.
Name an industry they arent rampant in.
> I know it makes
> people feel better to think that all the people that have degrees don't
> have any common sense.
First off I said "some of the most ignorant people" key word was "some" But
I will add that thise "some" are in the top 20% of ignorant non common
sensed people I have ever meet. But then a wise old sage by the name of
Will Rogers once said "The problem with common sense is it taint common at
all" If it were we wouldnt be asked to take long nose rig with a 72" walk
in sleeper pulling a 53 foot trailer in places like Manhatten, or LA, or
Chicago etc.
> But few people, except maybe in trucking, would
> argue that learning more would make someone less intelligent. There is
> a reason people sell bogus radar jammers to truck drivers, bogus
> "nutritional" supplements to truck drivers
It isnt just truck drivers, in fact as a whole we probably buy less. Its
the American people in general who want it fixed right now, but dont want to
do anything to bring it about, give me a pill to fix it Doc. Bogus weight
loss pills, heck the amount of money spent on hairloss remidies alone is
stagering to the mind. Those same supplements are found in just about every
convience store, and in every health food store in every shopping mall in
the country.
>, and that this industry is
> filled with O-Os that think being a business owner means signing a
> contract and buying chrome and carting the money off in a wheel barrow.
I fail to see why there is such disregard for the guy who wants his rig to
look a certian way. If he can afford to dress his rig out so be it good for
him. Just like the guy who never washs his rig, its his perogative. What
ever floats his boat, as long as its legal.
> You can take my comment personally, people do that whether it was
> directed at them or not.
I do take your comments personally. I take everything that is stated in a
derogatory manner about or related to an industry I love personally. I'ld
give my left gonad for a cure to my MS so I could get back behind the wheel
as living again.
> When was the last time you've heard a parent tell little Johnny "to stay
> in school if you want to be a truck driver"?
>
perhaps that would change if the misconceptions about the industry would
change, but if we cant even get our members to think its a worthy
occupation manned by intelligent poeple of worth, and believe that our
people are as good as any other occupations workers, how the hell can we
expect outsiders to change there opinion? Its not the same industry it was
in 1940, the people working in it are not the same people that were in 1940,
but its still being portrayed that way today by the media, by advertisers.
erveryone wants changes, everyone complains about the 5% bad apples that
give us a black eye, but no one wants to do anything about it.
> --
> Scott
> --------
Personally I cant figure out why, with your opinions of the industry and its
members as a whole, the hell you are still driving a truck.
tscottme
--
Scott
--------
Saudi Arabia is the enemy, let's stop pretending otherwise.
Whitelightning <white.li...@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:GvBCa.28962$Pb....@nwrddc01.gnilink.net...
Superstition and rumor aren't common at all in engineering or science.
That's why airplanes fly and we can have electricity. But it takes
about 30 seconds to find some yahoo with his CB antennas in the "will
trade money for magic beans" position or jabbering on the radio with
every idiotic noisemaking device attached to his signal.
If a O-O wants to cover his truck and his children with chrome, yes,
that's his prerogative. It's also a waste of money and gaudy as Hell.
He has a right to put shark's teeth on his grill and naked lady mudflaps
on his truck and enjoy the "admiration" of the public. Nobody has said
he has no right, and all those choices bring about a response from the
public, that's their right.
If you really love this industry, I'd think trying to improve it would
be a better approach than hoping nobody criticizes it or members of it.
My approach is to be a constant force to improve it and the people I
know in it. There will never be a shortage of drivers trying to take
short-cuts and risks to do less or get by with more, that doesn't do
anything but hurt this industry. For whatever reason, when I've found
myself being expected to be deficient that makes me work harder to
excel. Being from the South, I would never be caught dead watching
wrastlin and try very hard to get rid of any redneck accent and racism.
People often assume those are requirements of Southerners, so I am extra
careful to never let anyone's prejudice be confirmed by me. Nearly
every person I knew in college was from NY/NJ/PA and numerous times they
would discover I was from TN and always the response was "you're from
Tennessee, no really where are you from?" I never hid my heritage, but
I proved to them and others that being from here doesn't mean what they
thought it meant. Had I been one more racist hick, even just
infrequently, it would have confirmed every stereotype they ever had
about people from the South. Well that goes for people in this
industry. The general public thinks we're about one step above drug
dealers and used car salesmen. The typical response from many drivers
to a public disclosure of this opinion is to talk about organizing some
boycott or some other protest. In short, some drivers try and bully
people into not expressing their opinion rather than giving a good
example to change their mind.
The way to change this industry isn't to ignore what is happening in it
or pretend we've made more progress than we have. We progress by making
it more and more difficult for the bad apple to be bad, not excusing the
badness and comforting ourselves that he's only one driver. It doesn't
take many drivers dumping trash each time they stop for the property
owners to have a poor opinion of all truck drivers. It's rare I see a
place where a truck parks that doesn't have litter near by.
gpsman
Impressions" or "Stupid Drivers"..
I think this thread is just about pooped and these ideas are pretty well
hidden in here...
Nice posts!
Whitelightning
>
> >
>
> Superstition and rumor aren't common at all in engineering or science.
> That's why airplanes fly and we can have electricity. But it takes
> about 30 seconds to find some yahoo with his CB antennas in the "will
> trade money for magic beans" position or jabbering on the radio with
> every idiotic noisemaking device attached to his signal.
I've seen just as many white shirt and ties on a job site veer their path
to go
around a ladder rather than under it as I have blue collars. And there are
about as pilots that wouldnt think of taking off with out their good luck
charm as there are truckers with the same.
>
> If a O-O wants to cover his truck and his children with chrome, yes,
> that's his prerogative. It's also a waste of money and gaudy as Hell.
> He has a right to put shark's teeth on his grill and naked lady mudflaps
> on his truck and enjoy the "admiration" of the public. Nobody has said
> he has no right, and all those choices bring about a response from the
> public, that's their right.
There are more O/O who chrome with out the naked ladys than with. Another
case of your paint everyone with the same broad brush. I like chrome, grew
up an old school hot rodder as a teen, the motto of the day, if it dont
move, chrome it. I loved the chrome laden sleds from the 50's, and the
bright metal work on cars from the 20's, 30's, and 40's. cars like
Dusenburgs, Stutz, and Auborn Speedsters. I think todays cars are about as
exciting to look at as cream of wheat with prunes. The same goes for alot of
trucks coming off the assembly line.
>
> If you really love this industry, I'd think trying to improve it would
> be a better approach than hoping nobody criticizes it or members of it.
> My approach is to be a constant force to improve it and the people I
> know in it. There will never be a shortage of drivers trying to take
> short-cuts and risks to do less or get by with more, that doesn't do
> anything but hurt this industry. For whatever reason, when I've found
> myself being expected to be deficient that makes me work harder to
> excel. Being from the South, I would never be caught dead watching
> wrastlin and try very hard to get rid of any redneck accent and racism.
> People often assume those are requirements of Southerners, so I am extra
> careful to never let anyone's prejudice be confirmed by me. Nearly
> every person I knew in college was from NY/NJ/PA and numerous times they
> would discover I was from TN and always the response was "you're from
> Tennessee, no really where are you from?" I never hid my heritage, but
> I proved to them and others that being from here doesn't mean what they
> thought it meant. Had I been one more racist hick, even just
> infrequently, it would have confirmed every stereotype they ever had
> about people from the South.
I can somewhat relate to your being from Tenn. See I was born in NY, way up
almost as far north in the state as you can get and its where I was raised,
and still call home. But as soon as I say I am from NY it is automaticaly
assumed that means a slicker from NY city to anyone not from the state. I
find in the majority of cases hicks and rednecks tend to be more forth right
and honest than sophisticates and upper crust snobs. They tend to be true
to their word, and are not what I call sunny day friends, meaning if a
little rain starts to fall they dont leave you hanging. Alvin York was more
than bit of a redneck, and most diffently a hick by any definition of the
word, and most diffenetly one of the greatset Americans that ever lived,
born and raised in Tenn, I think he might be bit ashamed of your being
ashamed of your birth place and its people. You are also confused and
equate redneck with racist. Not all rednecks are raciest, and nether are
all racists rednecks. Racists come from all walks of life, and in all the
colors of the rainbow. When I went to basic training out of 42 people in my
training unit, only two of use were not from the city. And most them, the
other 40 were the most raciest people I had ever meet in my life, oh I
almost forgot, we were pretty evenly split race wise. Those folks you
admire from PA/NY/NJ have more gated communities and closed country clubs
than Tenn ever thought of. since I was born and grew up there with all my
mothers relatives from PA I think I am qualified to speak on the matter.
The race riots in Syracuse, NYC, Binghamton, Pittsburg, Boston, and a host
of other were just as bloody and met with just as much racism as any held in
the south.
>Well that goes for people in this
> industry. The general public thinks we're about one step above drug
> dealers and used car salesmen. The typical response from many drivers
> to a public disclosure of this opinion is to talk about organizing some
> boycott or some other protest. In short, some drivers try and bully
> people into not expressing their opinion rather than giving a good
> example to change their mind.
Where do they get those ideas from? It isnt because they ever talk to us,
they certianly havent sat in the cab with us. They get the idea from the
media, ever notice how every article about an accident involving a truck is
slanted from the get go against the driver, even though every published
report from reputible sources states its not our fault almost 90% of the
time? And from hollywood, when have you ever seen a movie or tv show that
paints us in good light? About the cloeset might be the old 70's series
Moving On. I dont ever recall seeing Sonny gulping down handfulls of
"little white pills" and running cars off the road. Every other movie or
show I can think of has us popping pills, running cars off the road and
starting bar room brawls. Do we express our opinion with our wallets when
that happens? Very seldom. Remember Shells little TV add? How many people
still use Rotella oil?
You ever heard the expression "the squeaky wheel gets the grease"? The
typical response you bring forth is usually brought up when drivers start
feeling their being singled out unfairly. 75% of the time they are right
about the singled out part. Ohio is a very good example. They know the
speed limits they set forth are a royal pain in the arse. They know the
time schedules we run on, they know the BS they shovel about safty is
exactly that bs. They also know that 90% of the truckers running the
federal highways through their state have absolutly no choice in the matter.
And its a very good source of revenue. Can you name three other states
where you see as many troopers per mile as in Ohio? The only option they
see to express their opinion on the matter is a protest or boycott. Its the
only thing they can do that would attract attention that might fix some of
the problems, only it wont work because there are too many other drivers
willing to cut another drivers throat for a load. Did you notice how fast
the problems on the west coast were addressed when the shipping companies
locked the stevadores out because the stevadores wanted a new contract? The
gerneral population has not the foggiest idea of the stuff we out uop with
from late loads to late unloads to unrealistic JITD schedules. Untill they
do , those problems will not go away. and untill they do go away, the the
billy big riggers will be around.
> The way to change this industry isn't to ignore what is happening in it
> or pretend we've made more progress than we have. We progress by making
> it more and more difficult for the bad apple to be bad, not excusing the
> badness and comforting ourselves that he's only one driver. It doesn't
> take many drivers dumping trash each time they stop for the property
> owners to have a poor opinion of all truck drivers. It's rare I see a
> place where a truck parks that doesn't have litter near by.
I rarely see any place man stops for any period of time that doesnt get
dumped on. I fully agree that the bad apples need to go. But you dont get
rid of them by painting the whole group with the same brush. You single
them out, you let them know your opinion, you ostracize them. You pick up
your cell phone and you drop a dime on them when they are driving unsafe,
first call to someone who can stop it fast, second call to their company.
Whitelightning
PerryrsbR
>> accountants, dentists, engineers, etc. do you suppose pay someone to
>> make them sound as ridiculous as possible? I dare say there are far
>> more truck drivers using echo and reverb to sound like inbred morons
>> than the others.
>>
>> Can anyone ever imagine calling an attorney or doctor for an appointment
>> and he answers the phone sounding like some drunk phuck with his head in
>> a trash can? Well there are drivers that try to *impress* their
>> co-workers by doing just that.
>>
>> --
>> Scott
Good point Scott. I found if you want to be treated like a professional, it is
a good idea to try to talk, and work like one. But what do I know, these young
drivers I've been talking to must be the smartest guys around, they know
everything, in fact a couple were trying to tell me how to fix my truck, sure
was nice of them.
R Perry
tscottme
It would be helpful if you would read what I wrote instead of seeing a
couple of words and assuming the rest.
I was in aviation for many years before getting in a truck. I started as
a pilot and not only graduated from the country's premier aviation
university, I worked for the second largest flight school, and worked as
an A&P mechanic in south Florida, in short for many years the only
people I knew by first name were pilots, students, instructors, or
owners. I didn't know one of them that had any lucky charm. Even
though all of that experience happened in the Bermuda Triangle, nothing
but serious people showed up. I guess that doesn't count for as much as
your claim of so many pilots having these imaginary items.
While you may think a truck covered in a bunch of unnecessary chrome is
impressive, many people not in the truck worshipping community see it as
gaudy and tacky as a Tijuana taxi cab covered in every manner of glitz.
There's a reason chrome isn't plastered all over every car made by
Detroit, like in the pre-Japanese days, and it's not a conspiracy to
keep truck drivers down. It's a meaningless fad that's about 40 years
out of date.
Setting aside your in-depth research study proving the genuineness of
country folk versus city folk, I never said that being from the South
means you are a racist, a hick, or anything else. To be clear for the
slow readers, I said that is a stereotype that others have about
Southerners, and I will be damned if I do anything to help promote that
stereotype. I work hard to turn that stereotype upside down. I also
didn't say anything about being ashamed of where I come from. If this
reply is a measure of your ability, do me a favor and don't bother
replying. There's no sense me spending time to write the message if I
also have to tell you what I said in my next post and what I didn't say.
Remember I was the one that mentioned the low education level common in
this industry. I'm not sure you are disproving my point.
As for litter, I see lots of places that only trucks park and they never
fail to have plenty of trash surrounding them. In all my years OTR, I
never found a reason to litter, and my truck was my only real place to
live the first year I drove. Not a night goes by that the shoulder just
outside the plant I p&d to doesn't get more trash on it, and I've never
seen one single car park there. I didn't even mention the buckets of
cigarette butts left everywhere truck drivers stop, or the millions of
butts thrown out the window, even during drought season. I didn't
mention the low class filth that seem only able to empty a coffee cup
once they park their truck exactly where the next truck will park and
then open their driver's door and dump in on the ground for the next
driver to step in. There's a reason a truck stop parking lot smells
like a cross between a landfill and a sewage treatment plant after a
brief summer rain, and it's not because one or two drivers make a mess.
The public gets its impression about the industry from many places, but
what sticks with them is what they see with their own eyes. That's why
even a few close calls with a few trucks is a black eye for the entire
industry. They don't really care that the truck that is tailgating them
only does it occasionally. That one brief impression confirms the
stereotype portrayed on TV and in movies. When they see a 400 pound
driver in green cut-off sweat pants and a tank top and cowboy boots,
they aren't likely to count him as one strange example.
Lastly, I'm not painting the whole group as anything. I describe the
low class human filth that keeps the industry with no respect from much
of the public and mercilessly criticize them. If I have to begin and
end every sentence with "...but if you aren't like this than please
don't think I am talking about you..." to make you happy, you're out of
luck. An adult should be able to make that distinction without being
directed by me to do so.
Whitelightning
>
I'll try and make this short.
In my dictionaries common is defined as 1) belonging equally to all, 2) of
or relating to the whole community, 3) widespread, prevalent, so your use of
it describing the "low education level common in the industry" is a very
broad brush, kind of all inclusive.
"this industry is filled with O-O....."
Mr. Webster says Fill: to occupy completely, pervade that sounds rather a
broad all inclusive paint brush as well.
I knew a lot of pilots when I was younger. They flew C-130s, UH1s, AH-64's,
Falcons, Tomcats, DC10's and KC-135's tankers(I can sort of understand these
guys, the ultimate suicide jockey flying antiques that should have been
replaced ages ago). All during peace time. And just about everyone of them
had some thing they had to have or something they had to do before every
flight, and some of them after the flight as well. These were all college
educated men. No one was shooting at them
Chrome is gone from cars because chrome grills and bumpers are a lot more
expensive to manufacture than painted rubberized plastic. Besides, they can
sell a lot more replacement parts as well, minor 3-5 mph bumps that might
have meant a small ding 40 years ago, now cost about $800 on average to
repair, some cars get off a lot cheaper, many cost a lot more.
To me someone who does everything in his power to change everything about
himself that relates to were he is from is not someone who is proud of that
local or its people. Its also letting other people dictate how you live
your life. I got a close friend, probably my best friend, and for the
reasons you list he refuses to eat fried chicken, or watermelon.
All of the negative things you describe, the slobs, the bad drivers etc are
still less than 5%, and I am being generous with that number as I believe
its less than that. Some of the stuff you lament about would go away if
ignored. Billy big rigger on the whistles and bells radio is looking for
attention, just like trolls on a newsgroup. The truckstops would stay a bit
cleaner if there were a few more garbage receptacles and they were emptied a
bit more often especially on the week-ends. You don't see the Iowa I-80, or
the Giant outside Gallop NM looking like that. Most of the Flying-Js I've
stopped at for a break didn't look that way ether. And if we dropped a dime
on the horses asses tailgating and excessively speeding that would go away
as well, one or two tickets and they aren't driving anymore. You see
something in the media that paints us badly, you let them know, you let the
sponsors know, and you talk with your wallet. The newest one that I don't
like is the new Volvo ad where the woman driving puts the squeeze on a rig
to get on the expressway. 37 cents for a stamp is not much to spend to let
someone know what you think. Even 5 minutes to send an e-mail is pretty
much free.
Whitelightning
tscottme
Whitelightning <white.li...@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:haeDa.13950$JW6...@nwrddc02.gnilink.net...
"Common" in common usage also means not out of place or not rarely
found, as in "it's common to see a drunk in a bar." That doesn't mean
everyone in a bar or everyone that has ever visited a bar is a drunk.
Just because you don't or won't understand a word doesn't mean I have
used it incorrectly. Tell me are hotdogs common at a baseball game or
is it rare to see one? Ditto for your "fill" attempt.
You can chrome anything. Even after you buy a car you can chrome the
grill or the steering wheel or the front seat, how common do you think
it is for people to add a lot of chrome to their cars? If people
wanted lots and lots of chrome, it would be widely installed at the
factory or after-market. Chrome is not the status symbol you might hope
it to be. I don't see anyone but Rap stars and teenagers wasting their
money like that.
How many long discussion did you have with these "suicide jockeys" about
their magic charms? It sounds to me like you've watched "Iron Eagle"
and its 98 sequels too many times. Please excuse me if my experience
flying airplanes, fixing airplanes, working in flight schools, and
living and working with other people that do that counts more than your
vague stories of "suicide jockeys". The lucky trinket is a staple of
bad movies.
As to whether I've "done everything in [my] power to change everything
about himself that relates to were he is from..." now who is being
overly broad? I said I consciously avoid reinforcing the negative
stereotype of Southerners. I hope you'll excuse me for being
self-conscious about doing anything that others might think is racist or
redneck. I don't let others dictate how I live my life in matters like
this, I simply choose not to volunteer to carry the "baggage" of being
seen as racist, illiterate, or a hick. It's not a hard choice since I
wouldn't want to be seen as any of those whether anyone was watching or
not. It's one thing to know your heritage, it's quite another to never
advance from it.
Litter on the road or in the parking lot is not the fault of people that
don't put trash cans out. If it were every driver would be as likely to
litter as every other driver. I'm adult enough to know the difference
between trash that has fallen from an over-full trash can and trash left
by a lazy, fat, slob that can't be bothered to walk 4 feet or 40 feet or
keep it until a better place to dispose of it is near. I don't ever
remember having a hard time finding a trash can, although sometimes it
meant I might have to get off my rear end and walk.
As for this incessant campaign to cry every time some advertiser shows a
truck, those ads wouldn't be shown to the public if the advertiser
didn't think consumers (most of which are car drivers) would recognize
the situation. Advertisers aren't in business to make overly sensitive
people happy with how they are portrayed in ads, they are in business to
get a message to an audience. The only thing I remember seeing in an ad
with a truck that I don't commonly see in real life was the XM ad with a
piano falling in front of the homeless looking truck driver and the
Monster.com ad showing a driverless truck going down the road.
I do complain to drivers when I see them intimidating cars or littering,
or when I hear them being stupid on the radio. But guess what the
response is on most occasions: "you drive your truck..." Patting
ourselves on the back that only 5% are reckless or slobs doesn't seem to
me to show much promise for improving them. Harping on the fact that we
have to clean up our act if we want better treatment seems like a better
approach.
Jake
a gas guzzler at that. Some of you drivers don't mind if I hang
in the back of your slip stream to save gas, others do and simply drive into the
shoulder of the road and
muck and trash my hood with rocks and crap if I do.
I guess I deserve it if I don't ask first.
But I have to say for the most part the best drivers are still truck drivers.
I think you guys should have exclusive use of the passing lane. but
then what do I know, you only pay for the roads and keep the economy
going.
Dave Smith
> I had to reply to this one. I drive a Pontiac full size wagon and
> a gas guzzler at that. Some of you drivers don't mind if I hang
> in the back of your slip stream to save gas, others do and simply drive into the
> shoulder of the road and
> muck and trash my hood with rocks and crap if I do.
> I guess I deserve it if I don't ask first.
Why on Earth would a transport driver want you hanging on to his tail end? If he has
to brake suddenly you are going to hit him from behind. He is going to be tied up
for hours while the accident is investigated and his record will show that he was
involved in an accident even though it was not his fault.
> But I have to say for the most part the best drivers are still truck drivers.
> I think you guys should have exclusive use of the passing lane. but
> then what do I know, you only pay for the roads and keep the economy
> going.
Yes, what do you know? It must be rough to have to finance those roads single
handed. Exclusive use of passing lanes for trucks is one of the lamest suggestions
that I have heard yet. You may have noticed that trucks are a little slower than
most cars and sometimes have trouble passing.
Gunslinger
>
>You can chrome anything. Even after you buy a car you can chrome the
>grill or the steering wheel or the front seat, how common do you think
>it is for people to add a lot of chrome to their cars? If people
>wanted lots and lots of chrome, it would be widely installed at the
>factory or after-market. Chrome is not the status symbol you might hope
>it to be.
Instead of using cars as a comparison, since most people see them as merely
transportation, how about using motorcycles. Pick up a bike magazine or catalog,
or stop in a bike shop, and see how much chrome is available for most any bike.
Why do we add chrome or stainless or polished aluminum to our rides? Easy.
Because it LOOKS GOOD. No, chrome don't get ya home, as the old saying goes. But
it does for damn sure show an indication of pride in the ride. And AFAICT, that
pride generally carries over to other aspects of the driver's attitude as well.
Yeah, there's a good bit of non-factory chrome on my Pete. Most of it was there
when I bought the truck. Did that cause me to buy it? Of course not - but it
surely DID cause me to *look* at the truck, at a time when a Pete was NOT was I
was looking for. I found that the truck was a good buy at the time, and bought
it. But had it been a bare-bones truck, I probably never would have looked
twice. The shiny chrome makes a good impression. Customers *will* remember that!
What company is it with those pink car-hauler rigs (truck, trailer, and all...
all pink!) One of their drivers told me that often the customer may not recall
the name of their company, but knows he wants his cars hauled by "the guys with
the pink trucks". Similarly, the chrome and polished aluminum on a shiny truck
stand out from a crowd; they grab your attention; you remember them!
>Litter on the road or in the parking lot is not the fault of people that
>don't put trash cans out.
Agreed. I have seen a driver parked in a truckstop drop a bag of trash out the
window before leaving, when there was a trash barrel less than 20 feet from
where he sat. And I've seen people in cars and pickups throw trash out the
window, too. There's no accounting for plain-out sorriness.
>As for this incessant campaign to cry every time some advertiser shows a
>truck.... Blah, blah - snipped.
It isn't the fact of the ads themselves; it's the fact that they almost always
portray the trucker as the "bad guy". Unfair! (like anyone ever said the world
was supposed to be fair, right?). Voicing an objection to an unfair stereotype
is not only our right, but IMO is our DUTY. Hell, that's what the NAACP lives
for! If they can, so can we.
>I do complain to drivers when I see them intimidating cars or littering,
>or when I hear them being stupid on the radio. But guess what the
>response is on most occasions: "you drive your truck..."
BTDT. If they tell me that dry old "you drive your truck and I'll drive mine", I
just tell 'em that at least I *can* drive mine, whereas they look like they need
all the help they can get....
__--Gunslinger--__
-x- 100 Proof News - http://www.100ProofNews.com
-x- 3,500+ Binary NewsGroups, and over 90,000 other groups
-x- Access to over 700 Gigs/Day - $8.95/Month
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Gunslinger
>But I have to say for the most part the best drivers are still truck drivers.
>I think you guys should have exclusive use of the passing lane. but
>then what do I know, you only pay for the roads and keep the economy
>going.
Jake for President!
Gunslinger
>You may have noticed that trucks are a little slower than
>most cars and sometimes have trouble passing.
Speak for yourself. Mine isn't. Of course, it does take me a tad longer to get
it wound up.....
Did you ever notice the funny looks you get from car drivers when you pass 'em,
in a truck, in a set of uphill s-turns? It's almost comical.
Dave Smith
>
> >You may have noticed that trucks are a little slower than
> >most cars and sometimes have trouble passing.
>
> Speak for yourself. Mine isn't. Of course, it does take me a tad longer to get
> it wound up.....
>
> Did you ever notice the funny looks you get from car drivers when you pass 'em,
> in a truck, in a set of uphill s-turns? It's almost comical.
Yours may not be, but I think that you have to admit that , in most cases, it is
the cars passing the trucks on those hills.
tscottme
Gunslinger <gunsl...@no.spam.net> wrote in message
news:p6msdv4vfkul77mss...@4ax.com...
<snip>
<snip>
Please explain how looking at a motorcycle magazine and the chrome on a
certain segment of bikes (I suppose sport bikes don't count)
demonstrates the public's admiration of chrome. You know there are
people that think a baby-blue tuxedo with frilly, ruffle shirt is the
height of fashion and sophistication. Wearing one of those might
impress the few others dudes but it makes one look like a clown to most
people. Maybe someone will suggest that I look at chrome-plated
revolvers to see what the shooting public thinks of chrome? Chrome is a
matter of taste and as can be seen by what is widely sold to the public,
they don't care for it. To you it might look good, there are many other
people that think is looks trashy and low-class. Maybe we can get into
the merits of diamond plate? You might think plastering chrome all over
demonstrates pride, too me it demonstrates a complete waste of money.
How on Earth will most customers even know if your truck is covered in
chrome or not. Rarely have I visited a customer when anyone but another
truck driver saw the trucks at the dock. I guess we would all like to
think that the people in the warehouse and the offices drop what they're
doing and rush out to admire our trucks, I've never seen that happen.
Even if they did do that how on Earth does that count for anything? I
can see the Shipping Manager discussing with a trucking company if they
have much chrome on their trucks. Please, not even a truck driver
believes that do they?
tscottme
Gunslinger <gunsl...@no.spam.net> wrote in message
news:p6msdv4vfkul77mss...@4ax.com...
>
> Instead of using cars as a comparison, since most people see them as
merely
> transportation, how about using motorcycles. Pick up a bike magazine
or catalog,
<snip>
So the 10 or 20 million new cars sold each year aren't a good measure of
what the general public likes, but a few hundred thousand or a million
motorcycles are a good barometer of public taste? Seems to me your
argument is that people that buy chrome covered motorcycles like chrome
covered motorcycles. That hardly seems relevant to the general public.
Moving Vision
>So the 10 or 20 million new cars sold each year aren't a good measure of
>what the general public likes, but a few hundred thousand or a million
>motorcycles are a good barometer of public taste? Seems to me your
>argument is that people that buy chrome covered motorcycles like chrome
>covered motorcycles. That hardly seems relevant to the general public.
>
>--
>Scott
>--------
>Saudi Arabia is the enemy, let's stop pretending otherwise.
>
>
Mr Scott
I don't always agree with you, but I appreciate the way you think.
John Lubran
Dumb assed ignorance is the enemy, lets stop pretending otherwise.
Gunslinger
>Please explain how looking at a motorcycle magazine and the chrome on a
>certain segment of bikes (I suppose sport bikes don't count)
>demonstrates the public's admiration of chrome.
I never mentioned the "general public". What I said was:
----------------
Why do we add chrome or stainless or polished aluminum to our rides? Easy.
Because it LOOKS GOOD. No, chrome don't get ya home, as the old saying goes. But
it does for damn sure show an indication of pride in the ride.
---------------
A clean and shiny truck (or bike, or car, or pickup) looks good, and shows a
measure of pride taken in the vehicle. That pride tends to carry over into other
aspects of one's bearing, too.
>Chrome is a
>matter of taste and as can be seen by what is widely sold to the public,
>they don't care for it.
Here's where you are conveniently leaving out the main factor in the equation:
car makers aren't using much, if any, actual chrome on cars. Why? First, it's
*expensive* - way more costly than mere painted plastic. Second, EPA and OSHA
regs have made it all but impossible for most chrome platers to stay in
business- those that are still around have tons of rules to follow, and a hell
of a lot of money tied up in equipment. Third, since the advent of
impact-absorbing bumpers and body panels, and small aerodynamic grilles, there
isn't much place to even *put* chrome on most cars that would look "right".
Thus the general public doesn't have much in the way of chrome on their cars -
not because they don't *want* it; rather because they CAN'T GET IT.
> To you it might look good, there are many other
>people that think is looks trashy and low-class. Maybe we can get into
>the merits of diamond plate? You might think plastering chrome all over
>demonstrates pride, too me it demonstrates a complete waste of money.
Whatever....
FWIW, I have NEVER, under ANY set of circumstance, heard ANYONE, EVER, say that
chrome or polished aluminum, or stainless steel looks "trashy". Methinks you
might be showing a tinge of envy here. As for the "waste of money" comment....
you waste your however you want; don't gripe about how others spend theirs, OK?
>How on Earth will most customers even know if your truck is covered in
>chrome or not.
Covered? Hardly... But I have had many a customer make various "good-looking
truck!" type comments. Of course, you have to actually HAVE a sharp truck before
you're likely to ever hear such statements..... which you obviously don't.
>Even if they did do that how on Earth does that count for anything? I
>can see the Shipping Manager discussing with a trucking company if they
>have much chrome on their trucks. Please, not even a truck driver
>believes that do they?
No, not even a trucker believes that. Coincidentally, I doubt many will also
believe that it *hurts* your business to make a GOOD impression on a customer,
either. If having a little extra chrome and a few extra lights on my truck
causes a customer to remember *ME*, then how can it possibly be a "waste", as
you so eloquently phrased it?
Ryan Lankford
> Please explain how looking at a motorcycle magazine and the chrome on a
> certain segment of bikes (I suppose sport bikes don't count)
> demonstrates the public's admiration of chrome. You know there are
> people that think a baby-blue tuxedo with frilly, ruffle shirt is the
> height of fashion and sophistication. Wearing one of those might
> impress the few others dudes but it makes one look like a clown to most
> people. Maybe someone will suggest that I look at chrome-plated
> revolvers to see what the shooting public thinks of chrome? Chrome is a
> matter of taste and as can be seen by what is widely sold to the public,
> they don't care for it. To you it might look good, there are many other
> people that think is looks trashy and low-class.
When people around here do that to cars around here(Chrome everywhere, and
most notably, chrome wheels that stick out 12 inches from the fenders,)
people just laugh. The drivers tip their seats way back and beam with pride
as they drive around, oblivious to the people pointing and laughing at how
the driver took a beautiful, $25,000 piece of American engineering and
turned it into rolling monstrosity that only a drug dealer could fully
appreciate.
--
Rev. Ryan Lankford
http://www.ryan-lankford.com
Have time to kill?
See my net.kook mirrors!
Richard Bullis, net.pedo: http://www.ryan-lankford.com/cenkoc
Brad Jesness, Minneapolis net.stalker: http://www.ryan-lankford.com/bj_faq
Welcome to Hell. Here's your copy of Windows.
>Zeke<
>laughing at how
>the driver took a beautiful, $25,000 piece of American engineering and
>turned it into rolling monstrosity that only a drug dealer could fully
>appreciate.
We have the same kind of stupidity out west.... after all, it's just a car.
If you're an asshole, whatever you drive won't change that fact.
Dave Smith
> We have the same kind of stupidity out west.... after all, it's just a car.
> If you're an asshole, whatever you drive won't change that fact.
>
Reminds me of an old joke:
What is the difference between a Camero and a cactus?
The cactus has the pricks on the outside.
Pat Durkin
news:3EE0142D...@sympatico.ca...
> Reminds me of an old joke:
>
> What is the difference between a Camero and a cactus?
Lemme guess. On a cactus the pricks are on the OUTSIDE?!
--
Pat
http://home.pacbell.net/clovers
Truckinsp
>
>I had to reply to this one. I drive a Pontiac full size wagon and
>a gas guzzler at that. Some of you drivers don't mind if I hang
>in the back of your slip stream to save gas, others do and simply drive into
>the
>shoulder of the road and
>muck and trash my hood with rocks and crap if I do.
>I guess I deserve it if I don't ask first.
>But I have to say for the most part the best drivers are still truck drivers.
>I think you guys should have exclusive use of the passing lane. but
>then what do I know, you only pay for the roads and keep the economy
>going.
Jake, I can't believe there is one sane truck driver out there who would let
ANYONE stay in their "slip stream".....that is dangerous and downright
stupid......as is your comment about letting trucks have the passing lane....as
is your comment about only truck drivers paying for the roads.....
Truckinsp
>
>Did you ever notice the funny looks you get from car drivers when you pass
>'em,
>in a truck, in a set of uphill s-turns? It's almost comical.
>
>
>__--Gunslinger--__
>
Yea, it sure is "comical" when that truck driver goes out of control because he
can't control his vehicle in the turn because he was going too fast......it
sure is "comical" when I see it and write the driver a reckless driving
citation.....it sure is "comical" when he wipes out a car or a guardrail with
his trailer because he forgot he wasn't driving a sports car and doesn't have a
CLUE about the laws of physics.....
Amy D
>Do you mean that it's not just a job? That
>is all it ever was to me, a way to make
>money. There were a lot of things about it
>that made it an enjoyable job. Still, it was
>just a job.
Oh good god! It better not be "just a job". If it is I'm getting a
divorce. There are PLENTY of "just a jobs" that would have him in my
bed every night.
amy