Modification date shouldn't be updating...
Zeph
Whenever a .doc is opened with Word 2004 on one of our servers, the
modification date of the file is updated even if no changes are made or
saved. Any ideas?
Thanks,
z
Jeffrey Weston [MSFT]
What are the OS versions your running. Both on client and on server?
--
Jeffrey Weston
Mac Word Test
Macintosh Business Unit
Microsoft
"Zeph" <ze...@nospam.nowhere.net> wrote in message
news:240620051002390214%ze...@nospam.nowhere.net...
Delfino Rodriguez
multiple locations. I've also heard from a friend of mine that the
same situation is happening for him on 10.3 clients running under an
ASIP 6 server.
Thanks,
z
In article <uRNHatBf...@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl>, Jeffrey Weston
Jeffrey Weston [MSFT]
If you create a Word document starting from a blank document that contains
only say... a paragraph of text (no fields or links or anything else), and
save it.
Does the Date Modified still change when you open that file back up and
close it?
We originally thought it was an OS issue that was fixed, but it could very
well not be.
Thanks
--
Jeffrey Weston
Mac Word Test
Macintosh Business Unit
Microsoft
This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no rights.
"Delfino Rodriguez" <drodr...@avistic.org> wrote in message
news:210720050816046486%drodr...@avistic.org...
ggr...@kemper-schlomski.de
open with Excel.
I dunno if this happened before but it increased massively after we
upgraded our server from Mac Os X 10.3.9 to 10.4.2.
It happens with Mac Os X 10.39 and 10.4.2 clients.
With Excel 10.1.5 it happens sometimes (havent proved it by myself but
our 2nd admin told me),
Excel 10.1.6 does it most likely although not always (proved myself)
and Excel from Office 2004 (Excel 11 ?) doesnt do it ever (but has lots
of other bugs that made us switch back to Office X) proved by myself as
well.
This applies to normal use of files (having them open longer then just
10 seconds).
What we know is, that if you open a file from the file server it gets a
new modification date after about 10 mins (although automatic save is
off) if we close the file it sometimes keep the new modification date
(depends on the version of Excel).
We thought it could be a finder issue due to cahing file and directory
information (it does this sometimes with access rights) but even ls
showed the same "new" modification dates.
We also did tests like opening a file 50 times and closing it right
away this lead to about 5 changes of modification dates with Excel
10.1.6. none with with 10.1.5 and none with Excel from Office 2004.
If you have any solution to this problem please post it.
IF we could help you in tracking this down just contact me.
thx Michael
Jeffrey Weston [MSFT]
I've forwarded your post internally to the group, and we'll get back to you.
--
Jeffrey Weston
Mac Word Test
Macintosh Business Unit
Microsoft
This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no rights.
<ggr...@kemper-schlomski.de> wrote in message
news:1122900045.7...@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
ggr...@kemper-schlomski.de
thx for your response :)
ok i did some more sophisticated testing to this issue and i found the
reason why this happens i cant explain it and i dont have a proper
solution to fix this in an acceptable way but i found the reason :) (at
least the one why this happens for us)
k lets start - ill try to give as much information as possible thats
why this post is somewhat large.
Equipment: Xserve running OS X Server 10.4.2, G4 Client running OS X
10.4.2 Client both had all the latest updates to Mac OS X, I Used Excel
10.1.5 and Excel 11.1.1 to test.
- first of all i tried opening excel documents from an afp share, a smb
share and from my local harddrive with Excel 10.1.5 and Excel 11.1.1.
I tried this with a local profile and a server profile as well.
Results:
on both network shares with both versions of excel and both types of
profiles the behaviour is all the same it changes the modification
date.
the files i opened from my local harddrive havent had a changed
modification date after i opened and closed them. it didnt matter which
version of excel or type of profile i used.
this and other things lead to the decision it got something to do with
the network shares.
- so i tried opening the files on the network shares as different
users.
after lots of testing with different files it appeared to depend on an
the file itself or the user or on a combination of both.
Explanation:
i got files i could open as myself and they didnt changed but when i
opened them as another user they did change their modification date.
and i got files that always changed their modification date no matter
which user profile type or excel version i used.
so i took a closer look on ACL and unix access rights in MacOSX 10.4.2
i read that ACL are always prior to unix access rights and that unix
acess rights are only considered when no ACE matches.
Situation:
2 Users that belong to the same groups, except to their own group, they
both have the same primary group that is different from group (see
below)
a folder an the network share with the following ACL
- user (different from the 2 mentioned above) can do anyhting (all 4
checkboxes activated in ACL dialog)
- admin same rights as user
- group can do anything except "administration" (sorry it just the
translation of the german phrase, dunno what it is exactly called in
the english version) (its the first checkbox in the ACL dialog)
the folder on the network share also has the following unix access
rights
user group world 770 user and group are identical to the ones mentioned
above
first of all i noticed if i create a folder or a file on the share it
doesnt have the same owner and group as the superordinately folder
although the checkbox to inherit the unix access rights is activated in
the configuration dialog of the network share - this definatively
happens since 10.4.2 it never happened with 10.3.9 (maybe its just our
fault because of the configuration - but as i didnt do it i cant tell
for sure).
i dont know if this behaviour is correct or can be altered through
ACL's in OSX.
ok back to the problem itself whenever i open a file i own it DOESNT
change its modification date.
when i open a file somebody else own it ALWAYS change its modification
date.
strange thing is that ACL's should be on top of unix access rights and
the users i tried with all belong to the same group. and the folder has
an ACE for this group (read above). the folder doesnt have ACE's for
the users themselves. from my point of view every user of this group
should have the same rights to a file within this folder (gained from
the group ACE). but apparently there is a difference between the owner
and other users. I dont know why.
my guess is, that the backup file excel creates when opening a file
couldnt be copied back properly if you are not the owner of the
original file and that leads excel to save the working copy with a new
modification date or something like that. this also explains why i
didnt had the problem when working from my local harddrive (where you
usually are the owner, at least the files i tested were owned by me).
next strange thing is if we assume that everything works like i said
and would function properly, a newly created file would gain its owner
and group from the superordinately folder, everyone should have the
problem with changing modification dates so i would consider this as a
bug (whatever would be the reason for this ( OSX or Office ))
ok i hope this could help any although my english isnt the best
if you need any more information just contact me, ill look into this
some more if i got some time
Michael
Jeffrey Weston [MSFT]
Thanks for all the info.
We've managed to reproduce your problem in our lab.
We're in contact and working with Apple on it. Unfortunatly, I can't
recommend any solution or workaround to your problem, at this point. If
something comes up I'll post back.
But thanks agian for the great investigative work, it really helped!
--
Jeffrey Weston
Mac Word Test
Macintosh Business Unit
Microsoft
This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no rights.
<ggr...@kemper-schlomski.de> wrote in message
news:1123062555.3...@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
ggr...@kemper-schlomski.de
i just wanted to ask if there are any news according to this issue.
thx for your time
Michael
Jeffrey Weston [MSFT]
So far no news. I would recommend that when Apple releases their next
update to Tiger you test your issue on it. But at this point I can't
guarantee anything.
--
Jeffrey Weston
Mac Word Test
Macintosh Business Unit
Microsoft
This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no rights.
<ggr...@kemper-schlomski.de> wrote in message
news:1124957293.8...@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...