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[orjan]

Hi!, The last 16 hours I have got this message when trying to create a
new article.
How do I know when it is time to start again?

Best Regards,

Orjan Lothe

[cornelius]

how many articles did you post in that day?

[Andreas Kemper]

Orjan,

you are copying articles from wikipedia to knol. It's not allowed! The
wp-article "surfboard" has a lot of authors. It's not fair to them to
copy their work to knol without permission. Please don't do that!

Best regards
Andreas

[cornelius]

you referring to this guy?

http://knol.google.com/k/orjan-lothe/orjan-lothe/23sqlkp09vqbo/1#



On Aug 6, 10:16 pm, Andreas Kemper

> > Orjan Lothe- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

[Andreas Kemper]

Yes, all the knols I saw are wikipedia-articles. It's not fair. Google-
Knol has to stop something like that.

[arleen]

i absolutely agree. when i finally publish a knol, i will cite from a variety of internet content, but the article will be mine, my words, my head, my passion. arleen

[Gene Sapp, DDS]

By all means use all references at your disposal, But always use it in
support, not in place of, your own thoughts.

csapp

At 08:00 PM 8/6/2008, arleen wrote:
>i absolutely agree. when i finally publish a knol, i will cite from a
>variety of internet content, but the article will be mine, my words, my
>head, my passion. arleen
>
>
>
>On Wed, Aug 6, 2008 at 6:38 PM, Andreas Kemper

><<mailto:andreas.er...@googlemail.com>andreas.er...@googlemail.com>

[Andreas Kemper]

Orjan, you deleted the own site of your 70+ knols, which was not a
plagiat: your profile. Please delete the other 70 knols.

On 7 Aug., 04:12, "Gene Sapp, DDS" <cs...@tds.net> wrote:
> By all means use all references at your disposal, But always use it in
> support, not in place of, your own thoughts.
>
> csapp
>
> At 08:00 PM 8/6/2008, arleen wrote:
>
> >i absolutely agree. when i finally publish a knol, i will cite from a
> >variety of internet content, but the article will be mine, my words, my
> >head, my passion. arleen
>
> >On Wed, Aug 6, 2008 at 6:38 PM, Andreas Kemper

> ><<mailto:andreas.erich.kem...@googlemail.com>andreas.erich.kem...@googlemail.com>

[girino]

I am flagging all the articles copied from wikipedia, stating the
original article and explaining they are a copyright and licensing
violation. I guess if others start doing it too google might take
those abusers down.

(beware to check the attribution both in wikipedia and in knol, since
some authors might have written the same article on both sites and
thus retain the copyright; this is not the case of those articles
copied by this orjan guy as I checked them all).

About wikipedia, someone with more experience with it could please
tell us how can I warn them that this licensing violation is occurring
so they can send proper DMCA notices to knol/google?


On Aug 7, 7:39 am, Andreas Kemper

[cornelius]

@girino

i dont agree with the whole copying of wikipedia phenomenon

but why are you wasting your time?

this was predicted to happen. im sure google have some crazy
algorithms to deal with this

butthen again google show complete lack of regards for copyrights,
just look at youtube

> > > >Knol has to stop something like that.- Hide quoted text -

[girino]

> but why are you wasting your time?

For many reasons:
1- I am a former wikipedia contributor, so I will eventually be
preventing violation of MY OWN copyright.
2- Because I care for wikipedia!
3- Because i care for knol.

> this was predicted to happen. im sure google have some crazy
> algorithms to deal with this

They don't even deal right with searches, which is google's main
business! No way they've done such things.

> butthen again google show complete lack of regards for copyrights,
> just look at youtube

By what I know of youtube and orkut, both owned by google, they only
remove content whenever someone bothers to ask them in the right way
(or when ordered by court).

[Andreas Kemper]

Here's a link to an article on the topic

http://www.plagiarismtoday.com/2008/07/30/google-knol-the-future-of-spam/

[hezumartin]

Hello all,

I just think that the users of Knol must control what is in Knol, so
flagging every copied knol is a good idea, also giving comments, low
rating, and whatever you can think to stop this.

What we can find on Wikipedia is a good place to find it, it is stupid
trying to copy the same content because it will not work, and WE must
stop it. Google will only answer to content against its content
policy, and this fact is very subjective. I hope you agree.



On 8 ago, 12:29, Andreas Kemper <andreas.erich.kem...@googlemail.com>
wrote:

> Here's a link to an article on the topic
>

> http://www.plagiarismtoday.com/2008/07/30/google-knol-the-future-of-s...

[girino vey]

Well there's serious controversy about "what knol is"!

It's surely a piece of web 2.0, so it's up to the users defining what
it is. But not everyone agrees that the comunity is the best "entity"
to control what should and what should not be on knol. Most of the
criticism over wikipedia that knol is supposed to handle is exactly
this: comunity decides what can and what cannot be there.

That said, I tend to agree that the comunity should show the way thay
want google to follow, but goolge should be the one handling those
issues! We show we do not want wikiepdia articles in knol, but google
should implement the means to remove them. Of course, in this initial
moment we have to use all our "weapons" to show discontent about
plagiarism. And flagging, commenting and lowering ratings is a good
way to do so.

[cornelius]

i dont think users here realize


that google WILL NOT POLICE knol.


why would they pay 50,000$ for their engineers to be doing boring /
repetitive work?


and who is to say a copy of wikipedia (and more) is not why knol was
created in first place?



theres one good explanation why google created knol, they currently
send out bots all over the internet to hoard and index data, with knol
they get to sit back as an army of monkeys gets to type away on a
million typewriters with a lure of easy adsense money as a banana
treat, sonner or later one of these monkeys will write (copy?)
something that resembles Shakespeare :p, who is to say knol is not one
big experiment by google and we are all labrats, thats why i asked
earlier why bother?

> >> > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -

[girino vey]

> that google WILL NOT POLICE knol.

True!

> why would they pay 50,000$ for their engineers to be doing boring /
> repetitive work?

That's why they wont do boring boring work, but rather develop tools that do this work for them! Detecting copies from wikipedia is such a tool (they already have it, when you access some pages that were copied from wikipedia, on the side bar you can see something like: similar sites: wikipedia 99%). Now, all they need is to check if the person has the right to copy it, and remove it. All can be done automatically.

BUT, google will do it "if and only if" WE, users, ask them to do so. Or pressure them into doing so. And as copying from wikipedia into google is illegal *[see note bellow] we SHOULD pressure google to do something about it. If it fails, we should warn wikipedia this is happening, and wikimedia foundation should be able to DMCA notify google.

> big experiment by google and we are all labrats, thats why i asked

So what if we ARE labrats? do we need to be brainless ones?

> earlier why bother?

Because we care about wikipedia, because we care about knol and because we care about the rights of the writers and want them respected. Google is NOT doing it right now.

---
* Except in very special cases when either you are the author of the article on wikipedia or you find a way to comply to the GDFL without breaking google's terms of service.

[cornelius]

i am not arguing with you i just don't think theres any point :)


I don't buy the whole DO NOT EVIL shite Google feed us users

Just look at recent handover of logs over at youtube, once again this
is a company that hoards piles of data, listen with a packet listener
to all the details being sent too google servers by their google
toolbar spyware thats practically on every browser, youll be in for a
suprise

knol is already dissolving into a joke, the knol search is terrible
for a marketing company with the best search engine on their hands
dont tell me they are incapable of providing a better search than knol
currently has


anyways best of luck on your crusade, im skeptical as i don't trust
either wikipedia or google, i find the whole knol concept interesting
but just dont see the point, why not just put these articles on own
site/blogs?

[girino vey]

On Fri, Aug 8, 2008 at 6:10 PM, cornelius <smiley...@gmail.com> wrote:

anyways best of luck on your crusade, im skeptical as i don't trust
either wikipedia or google, i find the whole knol concept interesting
but just dont see the point, why not just put these articles on own
site/blogs?

I guess the idea here is build a reputation system (as for sellers in ebay), so you can trust the articles more or less based on reputation of who wrote it. That's a lot harder to build among individual blogs.

[Andreas Kemper]

The Knols of this guy are flagged. I'm surprised about it. That's a
good sign.

[84user]

Hi girino,
In answer to your question, Wikipedia now has a page for listing non-
compliant knol articles:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Mirrors_and_forks/Knol

There is related discussion here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Village_pump_(miscellaneous)#Google_Knol_to_copy_Wikipedia.3F

I also agree with your efforts to ensure knol articles keep to knol's
Terms of Service.

regards,
84user