Plydome

[Biagio Di Carlo]

Hi Taff,

please where I can find the dimensions  and the distances of the holes 

in the flat rectangular sheets of the geodesic plydome?

-Biagio

[TaffGoch]

Biagio,

If you are referring to the "Plydome" that I posted in the 3D Warehouse...

http://sketchup.google.com/3dwarehouse/details?mid=1d83f477ed4d439cf4db8f25bbdf63f2

...there are no holes in the plywood sheets.

____________________

Is this the plydome to which you refer?

-Taff

[Paul Kranz]

Here's a real plydome.

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Very high regards,

 

Paul sends...

ReviveTheFlame.com

[nuconz]

pretty awesome!

love to see interior photos.

[Biagio Di Carlo]

Yes is this the plydome to which I refer.

There is only one or more  rectangular modules?

What are the measurements inside the module?

bdc

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<Plydome.jpg>

[Paul Kranz]

Nuconz:

 

Sorry, but that is the only photo I have of that building. I am told it has a geodesic substructure and that the plywood sheets were soaked in something to make them more pliable before they were secured to the dome.

 

Paul sends...

[nuconz]

any idea when the photo was taken?

On 12/05/2012 08:04 AM, Paul Kranz wrote:

Nuconz:

 

Sorry, but that is the only photo I have of that building. I am told it has a geodesic substructure and that the plywood sheets were soaked in something to make them more pliable before they were secured to the dome.

 

Paul sends...

 

On Tue, Dec 4, 2012 at 9:43 PM, nuconz <nuc...@gmail.com> wrote:

pretty awesome!

love to see interior photos.

On 12/04/2012 09:15 PM, Paul Kranz wrote:

Here's a real plydome.

On Tue, Dec 4, 2012 at 4:57 PM, TaffGoch <taff...@gmail.com> wrote:

Biagio,

If you are referring to the "Plydome" that I posted in the 3D Warehouse...

http://sketchup.google.com/3dwarehouse/details?mid=1d83f477ed4d439cf4db8f25bbdf63f2

...there are no holes in the plywood sheets.

____________________

Is this the plydome to which you refer?

-Taff

--

[Paul Kranz]

I took a picture of that picture about thirty years ago and then made a J-peg out of it. I think the book was called Geodesics, but I'm not sure.

 

Paul sends...

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[Dick Fischbeck]

Plydomes are "self strutted." Each sheet has 5 bends. One is at each corner and one is across the middle.

http://www.google.com/patents/US2905113

On Wed, Dec 5, 2012 at 10:17 AM, nuconz <nuc...@gmail.com> wrote:

[nuconz]

that makes sense.  the lady's attire seemed "dated".

[TaffGoch]

Dick is quite right -- The structure is a "shell" only construct.

With modern glues/adhesives, such construction would be much more robust today, compared to 1959.

1959 U.S. patent:

[TaffGoch]

Biagio,

A sheet of plywood, in the U.S., has a standard-size of 4x8 feet

I used that dimension, when "assembling" this 3D model

[TaffGoch]

Steve Miller built this size dome, about ten years ago:

http://web.archive.org/web/20050312225916/http://www.sover.net/~triorbtl/ply_42_2.html

[Biagio Di Carlo]

About the  Fig. 3 on his patent, Fuller says:

... The sheets are now marked , or perforated for the fastenings, following the designs laid out as above....

Probably  with SUp we can get:

- how many different basic modules we need to construct the self-strutted geodesic plydome,

  maybe only one?

- what is the exact disposition of the 9 rectangular sheets in the maxi -module (angles)?

- where  we have to mark or perforate the rectangular modules?

bdc

[Dick Fischbeck]

In a plydome, each sheet is two triangles. The bends are cylindrical and form the struts. 1/4 inch thick marine plywood is Steve's preferred material. 3/8 inch thick is not flexible enough. 

The randome is the cousin to the plydome. In a randome the struts are also cylindrical bends but are vertex to vertex, and only come in to being when two vertex elements are connected. A triangle is created between any 3 vertex elements. There are no holes at the vertexes like in the plydome. Both are wonderful structures. One is simple.

Hope that makes sense.

[TaffGoch]

Biagio,

Positioning is in the model, which is full-scale, so measurements can be taken directly from the model.

(I purposely included bolt-holes; one for each "corner."

[Dick Fischbeck]

I think Steve will supply the data (if he is in a good mood). I don't know why he took his beautiful wedsite down.

I'll call him and see if he is checking his email.

[TaffGoch]

Here, you can see the "bends" in the thin plywood. (You don't want sharp "folds.")

The bends correspond to the edges of a class-II, 6v geodesic tessellation.

Note Dick's description, above, about each sheet of plywood covering two triangles (with overlapping corners, of course.)

[TaffGoch]

By the way, to see the bends in SketchUp, turn on "hidden line" visibility, using "View > Hidden Geometry" in the menu-bar.

[Biagio Di Carlo]

Now I will try, thank you Taff.

bdc

On 5 dic 2012, at 22:25, TaffGoch wrote:

By the way, to see the bends in SketchUp, turn on "hidden line" visibility, using "View > Hidden Geometry" in the menu-bar.

[TaffGoch]

Note that this class-II,6v tessellation, using 4x8-foot plywood, will produce a dome 40+ feet in diameter.

A class-II, 4v dome, also using 4x8-foot plywood, should be much easier to manage.

[Dick Fischbeck]

Steve is "out of the offices" for a couple of days so hopefully he will write when he returns. Turns out he didn't remove his website. It just got lost when he changed servers. So we may get it back someday.

[Biagio Di Carlo]

Thank you Dick !

[TaffGoch]

Steve Miller also built a plydome, using the class-II, 4v tessellation, producing a 17' diameter dome:

http://web.archive.org/web/20050311230747/http://www.sover.net/~triorbtl/small_domes.html

[Biagio Di Carlo]

More simple and very beautiful

On 5 dic 2012, at 22:34, TaffGoch wrote:

Steve Miller also built a plydome, using the class-II, 4v tessellation, producing a 17' diameter dome:

http://web.archive.org/web/20050311230747/http://www.sover.net/~triorbtl/small_domes.html

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<D17-88-75.jpg>

[Dick Fischbeck]

Construction pictures of the 42 footer at bottom here.

http://web.archive.org/web/20080705161627/http://www.sover.net/~triorbtl/ply_42_1.html

[Pavel Brayvo (domesworld.ru)]

Here is topic about Plydomes from Domesworld.ru:

http://forum.domesworld.ru/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=478

Google-Tranlation: http://goo.gl/vT5rY

Hi All!

pb

///

4.12.2012 г., 18:56:55 UTC+4 biagiodicarlo написал:

Hi Taff,

please where I can find the dimensions  and the distances of the holes 

in the flat rectangular sheets of the geodesic plydome?

-Biagio

[And-Ray]

Hi all.

This is my paramentric 3D model of plydome.

Diameter dome 7.6 meters. This size is chosen based on a sheet of plywood (1.525 X 1, 525 m), which are produced in Russia.

One half of the sphere. Only 160 parts.

68 sheets of plywood.

See pictures and ask your questions.

вторник, 4 декабря 2012 г., 18:56:55 UTC+4 пользователь biagiodicarlo написал:

[Katrina Fairley]

The Photo appeared in several books. This is from Geodesics by Edward Popko.  The Dymaxion World of Buckminster Fuller by Robert W. Marks includes several different versions of the Plydome.  My father, TC Howard did a lot of experimenting with plywood for the Plydome.  Wong dissertation is also very informative.  I scanned the four pages in Geodesics.

[TaffGoch]

"Better Homes & Gardens" - 1957

This is the photo that I examined, to determine class & frequency, when starting my 3D model.

[And-Ray]

I analyzed this picture and created a rough 3d model.

Assuming the height of the door 2m have identified key dimensions of the elements.

It is interesting that the base icosahedron is oriented relative to the horizon in an unusual way. I suppose it's so convenient to make the entrance to the house.

Top view

Front view

пятница, 14 декабря 2012 г., 9:02:05 UTC+4 пользователь TaffGoch написал:

[And-Ray]

I found one more reason this orientation of the icosahedron.

The bottom sheets of plywood sheets are cut very convenient and economical.

[TaffGoch]

The Class-II, 4v tessellation produces a hemispherical dome that is 14' tall, 28' diameter, when 4x8' sheets of plywood are used.

As indicated earlier, this size dome is easier to manage, and would better support a snow-load (due to tighter sphere curvature, and thicker shell, relative to diameter.)

-Taff

[Biagio Di Carlo]

Dear Taff,

please can you add the SUp file

with the planar modules for 

constructing a model of  the plydome?

- Biagio

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<Plydome; class-II, 4v.png>

[TaffGoch]

Biagio,

I've added the smaller, 4v plydome to the 3D Warehouse:

http://sketchup.google.com/3dwarehouse/details?mid=a4a9195dc736216d467b16dc4bcac5c0

_____________________________

Compare the image, below, to the previous post. You should see that the triangular hole is smaller. I shifted, inwards, the three sheets that surround the hole, to make all the holes, in the shell, more consistent in size. That revision also demonstrates that the positioning of the sheets, in the model, is not necessarily unique. The plywood positions can be "adjusted," without compromising the dome. Just make sure that you make adjustments uniform at all similar locations around the circumference of the dome.

In other words, my 3D model of the Class-II, 4v plydome is not the only viable solution. The underlying geodesic tessellation is precisely defined, but the positions of the plywood sheets are potentially variable (within limits, of course.)

I'm inclined to think that a metal-conduit frame would make plywood positioning, "folding" & attachment/gluing/bolting foolproof. The frame could be then dismantled, from the inside, for subsequent use in the assembly of multiple self-similar plydomes.

-Taff

[TaffGoch]

This arrangement is closer to Steve Miller's plydome, and apex is just under 17' high (height reported by Miller.)

So, again, demonstrates no one "correct" solution....

[Blair Wolfram]

If I remember, Steve's plydome went down under the weight of snow, so I guess this is an incorrect solution.

Blair

On Mon, Dec 17, 2012 at 7:48 PM, TaffGoch <taff...@gmail.com> wrote:

This arrangement is closer to Steve Miller's plydome, and apex is just under 17' high (height reported by Miller.)

So, again, demonstrates no one "correct" solution....

--

[TaffGoch]

Yep, he wrote that a portion of his large dome severely "dimpled" under snow-load, but he was able to "pop" it back out, using interior support poles.

What happened after that, I dunno....

(Maybe, keeping a conduit frame in place is a good idea, for a "shallow curvature" plydome. Kinda defeats the purpose of the plydome concept, though.)

[Dick Fischbeck]

That was the 42 footer.

--

[TaffGoch]

On Tue, Dec 18, 2012 at 12:52 AM, Domerama posted a message that showed up in my mailbox, but would not post to the group, for some unknown reason:

_____________________________

Well, I attached my idea of the only structure that can withstand snow loads. 

Hey, one week away from Christmas, I have diplomatic immunity in posting this. And way too much time on my hands. 

Next week, kids, we'll learn how to make geodesic snowballs engineered to only target math teachers and physicists!

[sk8sonh2o]

I wonder if you could make a bowl form- a mold - on the ground and stand inside it to assemble the plywood sheets, rotating the assembly upward as you progressed. That way you could use thicker sheets, since it would be easier to bend them by standing on them. And how about making a double-walled plydome, using the two patterns you posted here,  the outer dome being a 4" larger radius. Squirt foam between the walls.

Tom