HP Corvallis tours...
George Chow
I'm planning to take a trip down to Oregon in October and I was
wondering if HP Corvallis gives any tour of their facilities. It would
interesting to see the home of all the great HP calculators... Does
anyone know whether this is available or not?
George
Joseph K. Horn
> I was wondering if HP Corvallis gives any tour of their facilities.
> It would interesting to see the home of all the great HP
> calculators... Does anyone know whether this is available or not?
There have been several International Conferences held by HP
calculator users' clubs, and at each one HP gave a wonderful tour of
the factory. Sometimes they had to steer us clear of areas that were
top-secret, because they were developing a new, unannounced product
line or some such thing. The HP employees' nametags bore familiar
names, and it was exciting to meet the real people behind the tags.
The robotics on the assmebly lines are really cool. I found it
fascinating how they could randomly mix different products on the same
conveyor belt at the same time, and the robots would never get
confused because they read the barcode on the tray that the product
was riding in, and perform the appropriate function. Way cool... not
to mention cost effective.
One fond memory was the "HP Hall of Fame", a corridor upon whose walls
are hanging all the HP calculators in historical order, with their
release date and internal HP project code name engraved in brass. Even
the products that were born when the stars were askew, like "Salad"
and "Titan", are on display for all to see, as if HP were a proud
grandmother insisting that all passersby look at photographs of all
her grandchildren.
If any other calculator company attempted such a thing, it'd make us
laugh; their designs are so obviously dictated by the Marketing
Department that using one in public is very much like wearing clothes
with company names emblazoned upon them; it tells everyone who sees
you that you're a sucker for advertising hype. But HP calculators are
different. They are quietly, sometimes even shyly, Excellent. Their
intrinsic Quality is not seen, but felt, experienced, and discovered.
HP's Wall of Fame is a tribute not only to the love that Ma HP has for
her products, but also to the love we have for them.
Forgive me; I'm waxing romantic. But that's how I felt when I visited
Corvallis and went on that memorable tour at 1000 N.E. Circle Blvd. I
know you'll enjoy it, too.
-Joseph K. Horn- -Peripheral Vision, Ltd.-
akcs.j...@hpcvbbs.cv.hp.com
Disclaimer: I don't work for HP, EduCALC, or anybody else.
George chow
>geo...@unixg.ubc.ca [George Chow] writes:
>
>> I was wondering if HP Corvallis gives any tour of their facilities.
>> It would interesting to see the home of all the great HP
>> calculators... Does anyone know whether this is available or not?
>
>There have been several International Conferences held by HP
>calculator users' clubs, and at each one HP gave a wonderful tour of
>the factory. Sometimes they had to steer us clear of areas that were
>top-secret, because they were developing a new, unannounced product
>line or some such thing. The HP employees' nametags bore familiar
>names, and it was exciting to meet the real people behind the tags.
>The robotics on the assmebly lines are really cool.
>Forgive me; I'm waxing romantic. But that's how I felt when I visited
>Corvallis and went on that memorable tour at 1000 N.E. Circle Blvd. I
>know you'll enjoy it, too.
But are they gonna give tours to small groups? Like a group of 2-5? And
BTW, the Canadian Thanksgiving weekend is Oct 9-12. I'm planning to go
down then. Is that a holiday in the states? (I think it is called Columbus
Day but I don't know if businesses are closed that day.)
>-Joseph K. Horn- -Peripheral Vision, Ltd.-
>akcs.j...@hpcvbbs.cv.hp.com
>Disclaimer: I don't work for HP, EduCALC, or anybody else.
George
Steven T. Abell
writes:
>One fond memory was the "HP Hall of Fame", a corridor upon whose walls
>are hanging all the HP calculators in historical order, with their
>release date and internal HP project code name engraved in brass. Even
>the products that were born when the stars were askew, like "Salad"
>and "Titan", are on display for all to see, as if HP were a proud
>grandmother insisting that all passersby look at photographs of all
>her grandchildren.
>If any other calculator company attempted such a thing, it'd make us
>laugh; their designs are so obviously dictated by the Marketing
>Department that using one in public is very much like wearing clothes
>with company names emblazoned upon them; it tells everyone who sees
>you that you're a sucker for advertising hype.
Flame on:
Mr. Horn, I was there when Titan (HP-71B) was born. I wrote a *very* large
chunk of its ROM. I designed CALC mode. I left in August '83, and I am still
furious.
The marketeers wanted an algebraic machine. They said that selling RPN was
just too hard. For programmability, they wanted BASIC, so that people could
run "all that software already out there." We gave them what they wanted. It
had what was arguably the most powerful BASIC HP had ever released on *any*
machine up to that time. It had multiple language capability. It had multiple
file systems. It had math and stat software to *die* for. It was radically
extensible. And it was an algebraic calculator.
The marketing boys ran one ad, then started complaining when they discovered
that selling the world's most powerful calculator might mean that they had to
do some actual work, not only in concocting new slogans, but just understanding
the consequences of what they had demanded.
And then there was John Young, high mucky-muck of HP and exemplar of fine
American management, whose only question about the product was "Can you play
PacMan on it?" He asked me this question during an official dog-and-pony show.
I regret not calling him an imbecile to his face.
There are several problems with a BASIC-language calculator. Management and
marketing were warned, but paid no heed. There are limitations on what you
can do in a one-line display (such as not running WordStar, I kid you not,
they wanted it), but they didn't understand. So Titan was a hard sell, anyway.
But HP marketing and management turned it into a no-sell.
When discussing future products, the stock answers from marketing and
management were:
"We can't do that."
"You don't understand: you're an engineer, not like a real user."
"We can't do that."
"What housewife will ever use that feature?"
"We can't do that."
"Will it run CPM software?"
"We can't do that."
Prior to my exit, we had discussed personal databases, handwriting analysis,
cellular radio, and most of the other stuff that Apple is trying to make into
a Newton. We had a mockup of the HP-95LX floating around the lab in 1983.
All killed by management and marketing, who were busy designing products for
"real users" and then going to work for Apple, where they probably didn't do
much useful work either.
If you like your 48, thank Bill Wickes. I regret that I didn't stick around to
work for him, but, quite frankly, I didn't think he could keep the HP goons at
bay. Symbolic math is, after all, one of those things that "real users" don't
use.
That Titan was born when the stars were askew is arguable. The problem
was very complex, and it started and ended with HP marketing decrees.
But don't badmouth my child very much: taken as a whole, it's still the most
powerful handheld computer that's ever been made.
Flame off.
Steve ab...@netcom.com
Steve VanDevender
Abell) writes:
[much flaming against marketroids deleted]
And then there was John Young, high mucky-muck of HP and
exemplar of fine American management, whose only question
about the product was "Can you play PacMan on it?" He asked me
this question during an official dog-and-pony show. I regret
not calling him an imbecile to his face.
[more flaming against marketroids deleted]
Now we know why the HP 48 has such a large graphics display.
John Young asks Bill Wickes, "Can you play PacMan on it?" :-)
And thanks to the user community, now you can.
But more seriously, I can sympathize with the problems that
generally clueless marketroids cause for engineering. I was
quite interested in the HP 71B when I found out about it from my
aunt who works at HP Corvallis, although at the time I didn't
have the money to buy one.
It would seem, in fact, that HP's calculator division had a dry
spell in the early 80s where they were surviving off the
continued popularity of the HP 41 series but were not doing so
well at introducing new designs. At least you've been somewhat
vindicated by the HP 48--people really _do_ want powerful
technical features, because the 48 is selling like hotcakes.
--
Steve VanDevender ste...@greylady.uoregon.edu
"Bipedalism--an unrecognized disease affecting over 99% of the population.
Symptoms include lack of traffic sense, slow rate of travel, and the
classic, easily recognized behavior known as walking."
Flavio Casetta
how many of you really believe that after the HP48 we will see an HP49 (or
something like that) ?
I bought an HP71 in the early 1984, its serial number was 2406A00021.
I suppose that it was one of the first units shipped from Corvallis.
I bought it after hearing of the great success obtained by the HP71B at
the Consumer Electronics Show.
After eight years I am still convinced that the Titan is the most powerful
handheld computer ever designed.
I am also convinced that the HPIL was a major feature of the Titan and
I still find difficult to believe that it was abandoned because 'some users
complained with the cables'.
The HPIL interface was an expensive device in terms of development but
I think that it is not much more difficult than programming an HPIB...
Mr. Harper could explain much of this aspect.
I was told by several people that the Saturn CPU, as it is, has come to its
natural end.
I invested a lot of money and time in the development of a RPL-Saturn
development system: the perspective to throw everything in the trash is
not too far.
I would be happy if facts would give me the lie.
What do you think about Dr. Wickes ?
__
* fla...@cflav.sublink.org (Flavio Casetta)
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