Why I endorsed the Kodak 5100, 5300, & 5500 printer that everybody hates!!!
facts2...@gmail.com
hates!!!
FACT: Kodak will be selling their OEM ink fo $10.00 for black and
white, $15.00 for tri-color. They will also have a combo (color/
black&white) for $21.99 (bestbuy.com). These ridiculously low prices
is for Kodak OEM ink. Of coarse you will need to buy a new printer
such as the Kodak 5000 series, starting at $149.00.
WHY PRINTER COMPANIES HATE KODAK (FACT): The major printer companies
(Canon, Epson, HP) hate this printer because it's going to cause a
price war on the ink. Printer companies in general don't make much
money on printers, and sometime lose money when they sell printers.
However, they make a lot of money on the ink. An article in CNET NEWS
stated, "Printing is HP's most profitable business and it relies
heavily on customer purchases of its ink cartridges, which offer much
better profit margin than the actual printing hardware." (http://
news.com.com/8300-10784_3-7-0.html?keyword=ink+cartridges) Epson even
did a very negative article about the Kodak printer and accused them
of having poor tank efficiency. The ironic thing is Epson is
notorious known for poor ink tank efficiency. (http://
www.computerworld.com/blogs/node/5706).
WHY AFTER-MARKET INK COMPANIES HATE KODAK (FACT): If Kodak sells this
ink for so cheap $21.99 for the tri-color and black&white, the after
market ink companies are going to have a hard time competing. The
price that Kodak is selling their 2 pack for $21.99 is cheaper then
most after-market ink. The last time I paid for an 'after-market
combo HP 56 and 57' was about $25.00.
WHY PEOPLE ON THE BULLETIN BOARDS HATE THIS PRINTER (THEORY): I have
come to believe that this bulletin board is run by people that have a
financial interest in either the 'printer companies that charge a lot
for OEM ink' or the 'after-market ink companies'. Therefore, you
will find a lot of post that hate me in general, because I'm endorsing
an item that will cause both companies to lose money: the major
printer companies and the after market ink companies. This thread
will not be moderated, and you will see people bashing me on the
following post. However, watch how they bash me. Can they back up
their Opinions with Facts?
OPINION: I totally endorse this printer since you will be saving a
lot of money on ink. However, this is still not the cheapest way to
go. If you actually refill your ink cartridges yourself (I'm not
talking about buying after market ink cartridges) then you will still
be saving more money then this Kodak printer. However, if you are
sick and tired of refilling, then you got to take a look at this
printer.
Here's are some link to do some research on yourself.....
http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/resources/streaming/KodakEasyShare...
http://www.kodak.com/eknec/PageQuerier.jhtml?pq-path=9/1441/10580/11170&pq-locale=en_US
http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,1895,2090449,00.asp
http://www.engadget.com/2007/02/06/kodak-enters-the-desktop-printer-m...
http://reviews.cnet.com/multifunction-devices/kodak-easyshare-5300-al...
http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,1759,2121643,00.asp
http://www.trustedreviews.com/printers/review/2007/06/08/Kodak-EasySh...
http://www.printerspot.com/reviews/kodak/es5300-review/index.php
(No, I don't work for Kodak. I don't even own this printer yet.
However, I do hope that Kodak might consider giving me this printer
for free since I wrote such a positive article about them. Kodak, if
you are interested in donating a 5000 series printer to me, please
send me a email to my mailing address.)
Frank
> Why I endorsed the Kodak 5100, 5300, & 5500 printer that everybody
> hates!!!
---------------deleted an idiot's copy/paste diatribe-------------------
You endorse? Who the hell are you? Who do you think you are?
Hold on...we know who you are! You can run but you can't hide. You can
post using a different email addy but you can disguise your posting path
(HA!) nor your style nor your dumb ignorant opinions.
Get lost and get a real life (BTW, how's that "free" life insurance plan
working out?).
Frank
Frank
> Frank,
> thanks for proving my point. You must work for an after market ink
> company.
Thanks for proving me you retard.
There is no one any dumber than meashershithead, aka stan, aka joe, on
the entire web.
Moron!
Frank
Frank
> Frank,
>
> think about this...
meashershithead...think about this (I know that's difficult!)...only if
in your reduced mental state will allow you to...
..
>
> I started a post that told people to buy the kodak printer (I backed
> my opinion with several facts). I started another post that asked
> people to list after-market ink jet companies to avoid. Then I
> started another post that suggested people buy the Dataproducts Ink
> Refill System (I backed my opinion from consumer reports.)
And all of this is headed towards meashershithead/stan
recommending...tada...oem ink!
>
> So you hate me because I started 3 threads. When I read your post you
> hate me enough that you appear threatening.
Hate you? You're a non-person. You're a pretend identity. You don't
exist! You're just a sicko wacko.
I truly feel sorry for you. You need help.
>
> This was first amusing, not anymore. When I post my opinion you are
> so strongly against me and believe that I'm wrong; but you haven't
> posted any facts to disprove me.
No...you have posted the facts that prove (and the ones you can't
control)...posting path...hello...hello...is anybody home.
Instead you take on the action of
> calling me names and accusing me of being measekite.
Names...you're sick...get help...prove you're not meashershithead!
Do it, ok?
You can't can you? Well?
>
> Then I did a search on your name and I discovered that you might have
> a financial interest in Hobbicolor
I do? Then where is my check? You're beyond stupid. Prove I have any
financial interest in hobbicolors ok.
Well...prove it!
and you even promoted them by giving out their phone number. I also
found out that you are possibly
> playing the role of user name Branwynn also.
Post the same ISP and posting path of him and me ok?
Do it!
Look who's calling the
> kettle black.
Not me! You're the moron idiot in this deal!
>
> Now you really hate me. I'm sorry to anger you. However, I do have a
> right to post my opinions. Whether people believe me or not is up to
> them.
>
You don't really have an opinion. ALL YOU HAVE IS YOUR DEEP SEATED ANGER
AGAINST ANYONE WHO HAS FOUND AFTER MARKET INKS TO BE THEIR CHOICE OVER
YOUR BELOVED OEM INKS!
> Do you think that your anger against me is kind of unusual?
>
> Stan
> ps. If you have a financial interest in Hobbicolor, I'm sorry for
> damaging your business. However, it's part of life. Get over it.
If I had any financial interest in hobbicolcors we wouldn't be having
this wacko conversation you idiot!
You are really stupid aren't you.
I mean really stupid.
Frank
Arthur Entlich
use of your "facts, opinions and theories" send you off in never-neverland.
I have been on this newsgroup on and off (mainly on) for probably over
10 years. I see people come and go, but the core group of people (there
are really less than a dozen, including myself), are people I have come
to know outside of this group. Some I have met personally, some I know
for other reasons, like other groups we are on together.
Of these core people, one is now a retired employee of a major inkjet
manufacturer. One or possibly two work in the 3rd party and refill
printer consumable markets. The one I am sure of, keeps his options
very well balanced and rarely even steps into the issue of OEM versus
3rd party consumables. Two or three are just power users of inkjet
products and may sell their output product and do a lot of printing. The
rest, including myself partially fit into that last group or assist on
some websites, provide free consulting services or general free service
help and have no affiliation with any printer related businesses whatsoever.
So, you are WAY off base. Kodak has a representative here who responds
to questions regarding Kodak's paper and printer products. Overall, the
attitude here is to welcome anyone to the group, and to appreciate when
industry reps come here to provide assistance and information regarding
their products. Personally, I wish there was active interest by Canon,
Lexmark, HP and Epson (and others) enough to make their reps accessible
here.
As to Kodak's product, there are both good and bad to be considered.
I have yet to to see the quality of the output and I have no idea how
the heads will end up responding (lifespan, clogging, etc). I like the
idea of pigment inks, especially if the color gamut is good and clogging
is minimized. I am not keen on 5 color cartridges, and I don't yet know
enough about how the ink colors have been distributed in terms of volume
or how the drivers have been designed. What I mean is to make best use
and get best yield from a 5 color cartridge (CcMmY) the volumes of the
c, m and Y inks need to have larger volumes than the M and C do, because
of how most drivers work... they use much more of the first three inks
than the second two. In an average situation, on a 3 color system
(CMY) the yellow is usually used up first. Having black separate is a
good idea because if you print a lot of text you will use it up first,
but if not, you may use it up last. On average, the CMY inks tend to
run out pretty much at the same time (as I said, Yellow often goes
first, because it is used for all yellows, greens, reds, oranges, and
browns), however, in the CcMmY the small c is usually the one to run out
first, followed by m and then Y. If the cartridge has equal amounts of
each color, then the cartridge will be left with a fair amount of unused
ink. HP addressed this with some of their printers by using a larger
chamber for the c, m and Y inks, with more ink. How great an issue this
is partially depends on how the driver uses the light color load colored
inks. Most drivers use a lot of c and m to make things like skies, and
m and Y and c is used to make Caucasian flesh tones, for instance.
These issues will determine the cartridge yield and how much ink is wasted.
I am opposed to any system that makes 3rd party and refill inks
difficult or impossible to use, on a number of grounds. Firstly, it
probably violates laws in several countries where it is not legal to
force people to buy specific consumables. Secondly, companies go out of
business or stop providing consumables (Kodak unfortunately tends to
abandon whole product lines and move out of certain industries more
often than others in the industry), things like that can lead to
millions of units to become obsolete overnight if the consumables become
unavailable. This can put a lot of units into the landfill overnight.
Thirdly, it creates a type of extortion, since the users become reliant
upon the OEM products, so prices are in total control of the
manufacturer without the usual market forces.
Also, some people wish to use a non-standard inkset for special use like
black and white printing, or a special ink type like dye sublimation.
Lastly, the technology required to make printers only accept OEM ink
cartridges tend to make them more costly and complex and can and do make
them work more poorly, or not at all, as a result of these system
breaking down. Ask how many people using OEM ink cartridges end up
having their printer not acknowledge the cartridge due to communications
issues between the cartridge and the printer.
My first color Epson printer (the Stylus color) cost $1000 (1996 in
Canadian dollars). The huge cartridges which were a good 6-10 times
larger than some today and were about $40 each (for the CMY) and the
black was perhaps $30. Those were still somewhat inflated costs for the
cartridges, but reasonable in relationship to the printer cost. The
Stylus Color is still running today, because it was built to last. It
had a 2 or 3 year manufacturer's warranty, and they covered all shipping
in both directions if it broke under warranty.
Today, you can buy similar (in terms of printing abilities) printers for
$60 CAN or less, the cartridges cost about $60 or more to replace, but
the amount of ink is considerably less. The warranty is now one year at
best, and the cost to ship to the warranty depot is only covered on some
models. The printers rarely last much beyond 18 months. Difficult to
justify repairing such a printer, and difficult to even justify buying
OEM ink when it costs the same as a new printer with ink.
Very bad for the environment.
If the printer manufacturers are going to use this business model, then
I support 3rd party inks, because it is almost the only way people will
use their printers for the full duty cycle rather than just toss it when
they need new ink cartridges. For me, that's one major benefit of the
low cost 3rd party cartridges and refill inks.
So, if you want to accuse me of anything, accuse me of supporting 3rd
party consumables because they allow people to use their printers longer
without discarding them. Its the same reason I offer people service
advice to keep their printer going. If, overall, 3rd party consumables
ruined the printers, it would be completely contrary to my purpose.
So now you know my "bias", and my reasoning. I have never, and I mean
never, made a cent on any ink product, printer consumable, printer,
printer service, or printer consulting. Many have offered to pay me,
and I have always encouraged them to send the money to a charity of
their choice (I try to suggest an environmental organization or a human
development organization, but I never make any requirements).
So, please don't paint me with your "theoretical", "opinionated" or
"factual" brush, because you'd likely be incorrect in your assumptions.
Art
measekite
facts2...@gmail.com wrote:
> Why I endorsed the Kodak 5100, 5300, & 5500 printer that everybody
> hates!!!
>
> FACT: Kodak will be selling their OEM ink fo $10.00 for black and
> white, $15.00 for tri-color. They will also have a combo (color/
> black&white) for $21.99 (bestbuy.com). These ridiculously low prices
> is for Kodak OEM ink. Of coarse you will need to buy a new printer
> such as the Kodak 5000 series, starting at $149.00.
>
I read a report that to get the best quality you need to buy the ink
separately from the paper and not in a combo pack. It is still cheaper
but not as cheap as some advertising touts.
> WHY PRINTER COMPANIES HATE KODAK (FACT): The major printer companies
> (Canon, Epson, HP) hate this printer because it's going to cause a
> price war on the ink.
I think it would be nice if Kodaks ploy helps lower the price of quality
OEM ink from the big 3.
> Printer companies in general don't make much
> money on printers, and sometime lose money when they sell printers.
>
Only the standard format printers. The Canon Pro 9000 is about $500 and
the Pro 9500 is even more. The Epson 2400 is more yet and the Epson
3800 is out of site.
> However, they make a lot of money on the ink. An article in CNET NEWS
> stated, "Printing is HP's most profitable business and it relies
> heavily on customer purchases of its ink cartridges, which offer much
> better profit margin than the actual printing hardware." (http://
> news.com.com/8300-10784_3-7-0.html?keyword=ink+cartridges) Epson even
> did a very negative article about the Kodak printer and accused them
> of having poor tank efficiency. The ironic thing is Epson is
> notorious known for poor ink tank efficiency. (http://
> www.computerworld.com/blogs/node/5706).
>
>
> WHY AFTER-MARKET INK COMPANIES HATE KODAK (FACT): If Kodak sells this
> ink for so cheap $21.99 for the tri-color and black&white, the after
> market ink companies are going to have a hard time competing.
You need to recognize that currently Kodak does not make a printer.
They make a multi function device and many people to not like a
combination. I like an Epson Scanner and a Canon printer. I also like
the Epson 3800 but the price and the upkeep for a pigmented ink printer
can be high. It cannot sit unused for long. i
measekite
Arthur Entlich wrote:
> Stan, this posting shows how flawed your thinking can be, and how the
> use of your "facts, opinions and theories" send you off in
> never-neverland.
>
> I have been on this newsgroup on and off (mainly on) for probably over
> 10 years. I see people come and go, but the core group of people
> (there are really less than a dozen, including myself), are people I
> have come to know outside of this group. Some I have met personally,
> some I know for other reasons, like other groups we are on together.
>
> Of these core people, one is now a retired employee of a major inkjet
> manufacturer. One or possibly two work in the 3rd party and refill
> printer consumable markets.
I suspected this. Now I know why they throw a tizzy when I express my
opinion.
> The one I am sure of, keeps his options very well balanced and rarely
> even steps into the issue of OEM versus 3rd party consumables. Two or
> three are just power users of inkjet products and may sell their
> output product and do a lot of printing. The rest, including myself
> partially fit into that last group or assist on some websites, provide
> free consulting services or general free service help and have no
> affiliation with any printer related businesses whatsoever.
>
> So, you are WAY off base. Kodak has a representative here who
> responds to questions regarding Kodak's paper and printer products.
This is not a forum for a corporate representative to do public relations.
Frank
>
> I suspected this. Now I know why they throw a tizzy when I express my
> opinion.
>
You need a brain in order to have an opinion!
>>
>> So, you are WAY off base. Kodak has a representative here who
>> responds to questions regarding Kodak's paper and printer products.
>
Thank G_d for that small favor! We've very lucky indeed to have all of
the real professionals give their expert opinions here. Especially since
they put up with your ignorant stupid drivel.
> This is not a forum for a corporate representative to do public relations.
Want to bet! You're not in charge of anything in this ng.
>> As to Kodak's product, there are both good and bad to be considered.
So?
You just don't get it do you? You must be the most clueless person ever
to post in any ng on the web.
Totally clueless!
Frank
measekite
I think it would be nice if Kodaks ploy helps lower the price of quality OEM ink from the big 3.
Measekite, Now you are confusing me. Your statement make it appear that maybe you don't have a financial interest in Canon. Can you answer me why somebody would spend a lifetime promoting OEM ink.
I did not like the fact that most of the relabeler websites did not properly disclose what they were selling. They do not disclose the brand / formulator. Bad ink from one place could easily be purchased from another since they are selling the exact same product under different names using their own packaging. It is too hard to track ink that may not be as bad. Also all of the professional reviewers do admit that OEM ink has better photo quality and longevity. I also called many since I was considering the possibility of using the generic ink but did not feel that these vendors were the kind of places I wanted to do business with.
When I initially posted my findings and opinions I must have touched a nerve from some of the other posters who really must work for or are somehow associated with the relabelers. Then the insults started and much like you certain posters began accusations and the hate postings started. I have since killfiled all of them and only see their postings infrequently.
That is the short version.
Stan P.s. Since you didn't post for most of the day yesterday, I actually told my wife that Measekite must of called in sick at Canon yesterday. pss. Your last posting sounds more professional. Your creditiabilty just went up again. If you always back up your opinion with some facts, I think I will be competing against your for the next David Horitiz.
Frank
------------demented drivel from an idiot deleted-----------
Get mental help immediately. You're delusional and living in a fantasy
world.
You're a real sicko.
Frank
zakezuke
> Why I endorsed the Kodak 5100, 5300, & 5500 printer that everybody
> hates!!!
>
> FACT: Kodak will be selling their OEM ink fo $10.00 for black and
> white, $15.00 for tri-color. They will also have a combo (color/
> black&white) for $21.99 (bestbuy.com). These ridiculously low prices
> is for Kodak OEM ink. Of coarse you will need to buy a new printer
> such as the Kodak 5000 series, starting at $149.00.
I was in part interested in the Kodak printer when I heard about the
low prices. But I can't say I am presently interested. The black
yield i'm told is about 350p @ 5% for about USD$10, which is not bad
if those numbers are true, somewhere between a canon ip4000 and
ip4300. The cost of the printer isn't all that exciting. I just
bought the Canon mp830 for $230 shipped. I needed the document
feeder, and I already have a mp760 and ip5200. I can't say I was that
interested in the EasyShare 5500 for $300.
Until I see some hard data on the new EasyShare series, i'm going to
remain skeptical. It's nice to have the thimble class at a reasonable
price, and even better yet cost per page which seems to be on par with
older inkjets, but without seeing one in action I can't only say to
anyone buy one. Not like canon is a home office dream for their AIOs,
their AIOs are very minimalistic in terms of features and software,
but in my case all I need is something to scan to PDF.