[ChurchillChat] Daily Mail: Half of young people do not recognise Winston Churchill... and he will be 'forgotten' in 80 years

[John David Olsen]

It seems that we have a lot of work to do....

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1278079/Half-young-people-recognise-Winston-Churchill---forgotten-80-years.html

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JOHN DAVID OLSEN
+1-323-855-7595

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[san...@churchillsbritainfoundation.org]

We do, and we're doing it now!

If you have any advice then I'm all ears.

Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry

---

From: John David Olsen <johndav...@gmail.com>

Date: Thu, 13 May 2010 05:44:08 -0700

To: <Church...@googlegroups.com>

Subject: [ChurchillChat] Daily Mail: Half of young people do not recognise Winston Churchill... and he will be 'forgotten' in 80 years

[Anthony Calabrese]

I tend not to worry too much about recognizing photos, which is what the article was about.  I am more concerned about recognizing the person for who they were and what they did.  I could not pick out a photo of WIlliam Pitt but I know what he did.
 
It is a bit different for the US because many of our past leaders are on money.  Everyone knows what Washington, Jefferson, Franklin, Jackson or Lincoln look like.  I would probably also pick out John Adams  but if someone showed me a picture of James Madison (who wrote the Constitution after all) I probably could not. 
 
I did find the comments to the Mail article quite funny. 
 
 



 




 

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Subject: Re: [ChurchillChat] Daily Mail: Half of young people do not recognise Winston Churchill... and he will be 'forgotten' in 80 years
To: church...@googlegroups.com
From: san...@churchillsbritainfoundation.org
Date: Thu, 13 May 2010 12:50:13 +0000

---

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[Editor/Finest Hour]

"Kevin Clancy, head of Historical Services at the Royal Mint,
added...to mark the 70 years that have passed since he was Prime
Minister we're immensely proud to have designed a new £5 coin
featuring an iconic Churchillian image, to help his memory live on."


Has anyone located on the a photo of this coin on the web?

[Sandy Finlayson]

A friend of mine who is originally from the UK did point out that the article appeared in the Daily Mail. Does it ever print an article which doesn't begin `Why, oh, why.......'?

:-)

Sandy


--------------------------------------------------------
Mr. Sandy Finlayson
Director of Library Services &
Professor of Theological Bibliography
Westminster Theological Seminary
Philadelphia, PA
'Nothing makes a man more reverent than a library'
Sir Winston Churchill

[Sandy Finlayson]

Friends

Has anyone heard anything from Hillsdale College about when the volume 6
of the Gilbert Biography and companion volumes will be released? I
thought it was supposed to be released over a month ago.

Thanks,

Sandy

--------------------------------------------------------
Mr. Sandy Finlayson
Director of Library Services &
Professor of Theological Bibliography
Westminster Theological Seminary
Philadelphia, PA
'Nothing makes a man more reverent than a library'
Sir Winston Churchill

[richard geschke]

The old adage of out of sight, out of mind plays prominently in this type of story.  Most people in America know the likes of George Washington because we almost see him everyday on our currency, same goes for the likes of Lincoln and Jefferson.  Most young generations see and sense what is around them in their current everyday lives.  This type of article in the daily mail typifies the culture we live in, with no sense of history.  The lack of our educational systems to give a proper historical prospective of just what has transpired is also a major factor in seeing such articles in print.
Richard C. Geschke
 

---

Date: Thu, 13 May 2010 05:44:08 -0700

Subject: [ChurchillChat] Daily Mail: Half of young people do not recognise Winston Churchill... and he will be 'forgotten' in 80 years
From: johndav...@gmail.com
To: Church...@googlegroups.com

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[Jonathan Sandys]

John,

Churchill's Britain Foundation is working towards changing this. The
Churchill Centre is doing a great job promoting things and also by the
recent starting of the Churchill Centre in Houston.

We need to do more things to bring my generation into a realisation
that history is important and the morals, values and principles of my
great-grandfather are remembered so they can be duplicated in future
generations.

A knowledge of history will ensure that we can recognise the potential
rise of the next 'Adolf Hitler', a knowledge of Churchill will ensure
we have a way to deal with him!

Any thoughts you or the other members have as to how we can make
Churchill and history more exciting and appealing to my generation and
the next, please do let me know. Thanks.

God Bless!

Jonathan

On May 13, 7:44 am, John David Olsen <johndavidol...@gmail.com> wrote:
> It seems that we have a lot of work to do....
>

> http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1278079/Half-young-people-rec...
>
> --
> JOHN DAVID OLSEN+1-323-855-7595

[Carol Mueller]

There is a small depiction of the new  Churchill coin at www.royalmint.com/churchill       Carol Lea Mueller        --- On Thu, 5/13/10, Editor/Finest Hour <tcc...@sneakemail.com> wrote:

From: Editor/Finest Hour <tcc...@sneakemail.com> Subject: [ChurchillChat] Re: Daily Mail: Half of young people do not recognise Winston Churchill... and he will be 'forgotten' in 80 years To: "ChurchillChat" <church...@googlegroups.com> Date: Thursday, May 13, 2010, 6:55 AM

"Kevin Clancy, head of Historical Services at the Royal Mint, added...to mark the 70 years that have passed since he was Prime Minister we're immensely proud to have designed a new £5 coin featuring an iconic Churchillian image, to help his memory live on." Has anyone located on the a photo of this coin on the web? -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "ChurchillChat" group. To post to this group, send email to church...@googlegroups.com.

To unsubscribe from this group, send email to churchillchat+unsub...@googlegroups.com.

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[Stan A. Orchard]

I had a look at The Royal Mint coin which says "Celebration of Britain" but is apparently tied to the 2012 Special Olympics.  There's nothing wrong with that other than the fact that Churchill has no direct connection to this event while many other notables do.  Churchill's image could have been tied to so many events that have some real historical or cultural connection to him.  Then I looked at an enlargement of a quote that is overlayed on the image of Churchill on the coin, "Be daring, be first, be different, be just".  As good a quote as this is, it isn't quoting Churchill.  It's a quote from Anita Roddick.  So to tie this marketing campaign to a previous discussion, Britain's youth would be forgiven for concluding that Churchill had something to do with the Special Olympics and that he is responsible for the quote, which he isn't.  Arghh!!!

 

Stan

[Carey Stronach]

Anthony, If you saw a full-body picture of James Madison you'd likely recognize him, because he was the shortest president we ever had (all of 5 feet, 4 inches). Please don't ask me to convert that to metric. :)

----- Original Message -----
From: Anthony Calabrese <amcal...@hotmail.com>
To: List Churchill <church...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Thu, 13 May 2010 13:27:06 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: RE: [ChurchillChat] Daily Mail: Half of young people do not recognise Winston Churchill... and he will be 'forgotten' in 80 years


I tend not to worry too much about recognizing photos, which is what the article was about. I am more concerned about recognizing the person for who they were and what they did. I could not pick out a photo of WIlliam Pitt but I know what he did.



It is a bit different for the US because many of our past leaders are on money. Everyone knows what Washington, Jefferson, Franklin, Jackson or Lincoln look like. I would probably also pick out John Adams but if someone showed me a picture of James Madison (who wrote the Constitution after all) I probably could not.



I did find the comments to the Mail article quite funny.

Subject: Re: [ChurchillChat] Daily Mail: Half of young people do not recognise Winston Churchill... and he will be 'forgotten' in 80 years
To: church...@googlegroups.com
From: san...@churchillsbritainfoundation.org
Date: Thu, 13 May 2010 12:50:13 +0000

We do, and we're doing it now!

If you have any advice then I'm all ears.
Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry

From: John David Olsen <johndav...@gmail.com>
Date: Thu, 13 May 2010 05:44:08 -0700
To: <Church...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: [ChurchillChat] Daily Mail: Half of young people do not recognise Winston Churchill... and he will be 'forgotten' in 80 years

It seems that we have a lot of work to do....

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1278079/Half-young-people-recognise-Winston-Churchill---forgotten-80-years.html
--
JOHN DAVID OLSEN
+1-323-855-7595


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[Harlan Cooper]

Students today are subjected not only to vapid history lessons, but to politically revisionist history.  For example, how many today would recognize a photo or even the name of Jan Smuts, a distinguished contemporary of Churchill, a member of his war cabinet, and a prime minister in his own right?  Smuts, who deserved better, has been subjected to a politically-correct purge.  (What happened to Jan Smuts International Airport?) Why?  He was a white man from South Africa. 

Harlan Cooper
coo...@aTexas.com

[richard geschke]

 Good point,
While Smuts was very influential he never the less was no Churchill.  But your point is well taken.  There are many figures in history who were very influential and yet they have faded into the abyss of historical legend.  For example how about George C. Marshall.
Richard C. Geschke

---

Date: Thu, 13 May 2010 16:14:19 -0500
From: Coo...@aTexas.com
To: church...@googlegroups.com
CC: rges...@hotmail.com
Subject: Re: [ChurchillChat] Daily Mail: Half of young people do not recognise Winston Churchill... and he will be 'forgotten' in 80 years

[Binden Shovel]

I agree with the comment about the Daily Mail, I was once offered a
copy free with a Latte and refused to accept it. My dad used to read
it and it always wanted to make me slit my wrists.

On the wider note about engaging the younger generation, I have twin
boys of 14 and if anything as a result of the likes of the History
channel etc they have a better appreciation of history and WW2 than I
ever did at their age. They have recently come back from a WW1 tour of
Belgium, we didn't do that sort of thing when I was a lad.
I wrote a book with my boys in mind called Churchill's Secret Skills
which takes Winstons WW2 talents for running the war and applies them
to modern business. I figured if I could keep them interested enough
to read it through to the end then I had just about pitched it right.
You have to keep it engaging and throw in as much homour as possible.
Teenage kids are a tough crowd

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[Paul Courtenay]

Smuts was probably the only person whom Churchill recognized as being not only on an equal level to himself, but in many ways superior.   When Smuts died in 1950, Churchill wrote to Mrs Smuts as follows:

 

        "Please accept my deepest sympathy in your sorrow and deprivation.   I know how vain are words in such sadness, and how much worse it is for those who stay than for those who go.   But there must be comfort in the proofs of admiration and gratitude that have been evoked all over the world for a warrior-statesman and philosopher who was probably more fitted to guide struggling and blundering humanity through its sufferings and perils towards a better day than anyone who lived in any country during his epoch."

 

Paul Courtenay

 

 

 

 

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[Harlan Cooper]

Imagine receiving such words from such a man!

Not to deflect the thread from Churchill himself, but I would like to add one other thought about Smuts.  I became interested in him while working up a talk on the Other Club, of which Smuts was a member.  Smuts strikes me as a man deserving serious historical attention in the Churchillian context and beyond. 

Smuts was the only person to sign the peace treaties ending both the First and Second World Wars.  He was the only person to sign the charters of both the League of Nations and the United Nations.  He was not from Britain, and English was his second language.  A statue of him stands in Parliament Square.  He was prime minister in his own country (South Africa), and he became a field marshal in the British Army in 1941 and served in Churchill's Imperial War Cabinet.  He led commandos in1899 (?), and that year he interrogated a newly captured 25-year-old (?) prisoner of war named Winston Churchill.  He graduated from Cambridge with a double First.  A Master of Christ's College said about 1970 that "in 500 years of that College's history, three members had been truly outstanding:  John Milton, Charles Darwin, and Jan Smuts.  Smuts wrote a book in 1926,  "Holism and Evolution."  Alfred Einstein read the book and subsequently wrote that two mental constructs will direct human thinking in the next millennium: Einstein's own construct of relativity, and Smuts' construct.  Smuts' last office was Chancellor of Cambridge University.

FYI, "Holism and Evolution" is available from Kessinger Publishing's Rare Reprints.

Harlan Cooper

On 5/14/2010 8:21 AM, Paul Courtenay wrote:

Smuts was probably the only person whom Churchill recognized as being not only on an equal level to himself, but in many ways superior.   When Smuts died in 1950, Churchill wrote to Mrs Smuts as follows:

 

        "Please accept my deepest sympathy in your sorrow and deprivation.   I know how vain are words in such sadness, and how much worse it is for those who stay than for those who go.   But there must be comfort in the proofs of admiration and gratitude that have been evoked all over the world for a warrior-statesman and philosopher who was probably more fitted to guide struggling and blundering humanity through its sufferings and perils towards a better day than anyone who lived in any country during his epoch."

 

Paul Courtenay

 

 

 

 

----- Original Message -----

From: richard geschke

To: church...@googlegroups.com ; coo...@atexas.com

Sent: Friday, May 14, 2010 12:01 AM

Subject: RE: [ChurchillChat] Daily Mail: Half of young people do not recognise Winston Churchill... and he will be 'forgotten' in 80 years

 Good point,
While Smuts was very influential he never the less was no Churchill.  But your point is well taken.  There are many figures in history who were very influential and yet they have faded into the abyss of historical legend.  For example how about George C. Marshall.
Richard C. Geschke

[pete...@picturemaker.freeserve.co.uk]

This just shows how the culture in the UK has changed. When Churchill passed away i was 5 yrs old. But our nation still had a sense of duty, patriotism and loyalty. Which was reflected in the way History was taught. Many of our teachers had fought or been through WW2.  Sadly they are no longer in the education system.   We can see results of todays UK education system reflected in the lives of young people. Also the currant media plays apart.  

One suggestion is a Churchill Centre Travelling Exhibition though out the UK and maybe other nations to educate children and adults.  Even a state of the Art travelling Bus could also serve this purpose where it was difficult to find venues. 

I am sure this would generate alot of interest for local press and Newspapers wherever an exhibition went.   If a travelling Churchill Exhibtion was seen out on the road.....I am sure it would help.  
 
Regards

Peter

[Antoine Capet]

Interesting discussion of "Dunkirk" on Indynews :

 

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/this-britain/adrian-hamilton-a-great-escape-dunkirk-was-actually-a-humiliation-for-british-forces-1978769.html

 

A.C.