Sick Scene in Palestine.
Jane
I say if those fucks want any foreign to tell them to eat shit!!!
Yet another arguement for the elimination of religion.
ircle2
against the innocent unborn child, there's no difference except your's is
a more cowardly terrorism, and you're not religious.
John Smith
No need to sell crazy here dude, we're all stocked up
"ircle2" <irc...@netscape.net> wrote in message
news:3B9E778A...@netscape.net...
james
However, the fact that you state religion should be eliminated is
disturbing. This was already tried by the USSR; it failed. The fact
is, religion exists in the USA (and Canada) in many forms and
denominations. In countries such as ours, it is the privilege of
citizens to belong to whatever religious denomination they choose, or
not to partake not at all. Once again, this is all part of free choice
in our society. The fact that you advocate removing that right is very
disturbing. And disgusting.
The fact that some of the Palestinian people celebrated these cowardly
acts is repulsive, but it is in no way, shape or form a reason for the
elimination of religion. Your logic is so flawed that it is almost
laughable.
james
However, the fact that you state religion should be eliminated is
disturbing. This was already tried by the USSR; it failed. The fact
is, religion exists in the USA (and Canada) in many forms and
denominations. In countries such as ours, it is the privilege of
citizens to belong to whatever religious denomination they choose, or
in our society. The fact that you advocate removing that right is very
disturbing. And disgusting.
The fact that some of the Palestinian people celebrated these cowardly
acts is repulsive, but it is in no way, shape or form a reason for the
elimination of religion. Your logic is so flawed that it is almost
laughable.
Jane
situations that I do find justified.
They should strap their Jahweh fearing asses to a chair, force feed them
pork, liquor anything else their not allowed, surround them with strippers
then feed them to rabid feral pigs on live tv.
The idea that any religion or ideology is worth the butcher of 10's of
thousands of innocent people is senseless.
As for the religion. Hey, I've never seen a religion that doesn't advocate
violence, segregation, or misgyny.
"james" <grey...@somethingorother.com> wrote in message
news:3B9E9EFB...@somethingorother.com...
7h3_Fr13nd1y...@salmahayeksknockers.edu
> The idea that any religion or ideology is worth the butcher of 10's of
> thousands of innocent people is senseless.
Jane, on this point, I'm sure that the thousands of palestinians who have
been displaced, murdered, or tortured would completely agree with you.
--
..............................................................................
"...the London Sunday Times... found evidence of torture [by Israel] so
widespread and systematic that 'it appears to be sanctioned at some level
as deliberate policy,' perhaps 'to persuade Arabs in occupied territories
that it is least painful to behave passively'"
-Noam Chomsky, The Fateful Triangle, p 127.
..............................................................................
www.geocities.com/pentagon/bunker/1022 dan...@swan.com
Sugar Pie
"james" <grey...@somethingorother.com> wrote in message
news:3B9E9EFB...@somethingorother.com...
7h3_Fr13nd1y...@salmahayeksknockers.edu
> Isn't religion what causes war? Looks that way to me...
SP, I think this is a superficial view. Religion doesn't cause war any more
than differing jerseys cause a soccer game.
War usually has simpler causes, such as competition for living space,
autonomy, or resources. Often this occurs between differing cultures, which
happen to have different religions.
The conflict in Northern Ireland, and the Palestinian-Jewish conflict are
both good examples of this interpretation.
--
..............................................................................
"The motive for Israel's attacks against civilian populations.. was dual: to
disperse the Palestinian refugees, and to embitter relations between them
and the local population in the areas to which they had been driven."
-Noam Chomsky, The Fateful Triangle, p. 182
..............................................................................
www.geocities.com/pentagon/bunker/1022 dan...@swan.com
Kingpenguin
about land and resource disputes. Religion is what often seperates
two warring factions, but seldomly is religion what the war is about.
On Wed, 12 Sep 2001 00:51:20 GMT, "Sugar Pie" <imagin...@home.com>
wrote:
james
Jane wrote:
>
> Not only do I not approve of the act, this is one of those eye for an eye
> situations that I do find justified.
>
> They should strap their Jahweh fearing asses to a chair, force feed them
> pork, liquor anything else their not allowed, surround them with strippers
> then feed them to rabid feral pigs on live tv.
Aren't you jumping to conclusions by assuming a particular group is
responsible? I have been watching and listening to the news for the
entire day and have not yet heard of one single individual or group
identified as the guilty party. When the US responds, it will do so
knowing that they are 100% certain that they have the correct guilty
party. They have proven this in the past, and no doubt will do so in
this case again.
>
> The idea that any religion or ideology is worth the butcher of 10's of
> thousands of innocent people is senseless.
Senseless slaughter is pointless. But it is not any religion that
advocates this, only the minds of a sick and twisted few.
> As for the religion. Hey, I've never seen a religion that doesn't advocate
> violence, segregation, or misgyny.
I am beginning to see what Santa finds so despicable about your logic,
or lack thereof. You are branding all believers of a particular faith
as being evil for the wrong doings of a few; another poor and incorrect
assumption. Just because a few persons commit misdeeds does not mean
that the whole group is responsible. Just because a few sick minds
commit evil deeds does not mean that an entire religious belief is wrong
and should be eliminated, as you suggest.
Sammi
"Sugar Pie" <imagin...@home.com> wrote in message
news:ckyn7.3061$xa2.4...@news2.rdc1.ab.home.com...
> Isn't religion what causes war? Looks that way to me...
Idiot.
Calgary Rob
news:jdyn7.32962$Gi6.3...@news0.telusplanet.net...
> Jane <1...@home.ca> wrote:
>
> > The idea that any religion or ideology is worth the butcher of 10's of
> > thousands of innocent people is senseless.
>
> Jane, on this point, I'm sure that the thousands of palestinians who have
> been displaced, murdered, or tortured would completely agree with you.
Dan, those kids and mothers really looked displaced, murdered and tortured,
didnt they? So did you also cheer when you heard the news of the terrorist
attacks>?
--
Calgary Rob
calga...@home.com
I Like Gravy
Sugar Pie
"Sammi" <sammi@_remove_alt2600.com> wrote in message
news:BWyn7.1455$KT.6...@eagle.america.net...
Evil Eddie
russ p
lesse if i can clear this up a bit for you dick.. i mean, rob. i believe
(and dan, correct me if i'm wrong) that dan was referring to the past, oh,
10 years or so where palestinians have been displaced, murdered, and
tortured because of their religion - not the footage of the street parties
there today. i shouldn't get too much more specific here about it since i
haven't really followed the situation too closely.
"Calgary Rob" <calga...@home.com> wrote in message
news:l5zn7.3175$xa2.5...@news2.rdc1.ab.home.com...
russ p
> I am beginning to see what Santa finds so despicable about your logic,
> or lack thereof. You are branding all believers of a particular faith
> as being evil for the wrong doings of a few; another poor and incorrect
> assumption. Just because a few persons commit misdeeds does not mean
> that the whole group is responsible. Just because a few sick minds
> commit evil deeds does not mean that an entire religious belief is wrong
> and should be eliminated, as you suggest.
by "few persons" you are referring, of course, in part, to the tens of
thousands of christians who went to war with tens of thousands of muslims
because the muslim faith was obviously wrong?
while jane's logic is often somewhat skewed, at least she has some history
behind her. you must never have heard of the Crusades....
russ p
james
russ p wrote:
>
> "james" <grey...@somethingorother.com> wrote in message
> news:3B9EB9B5...@somethingorother.com...
> > I am beginning to see what Santa finds so despicable about your logic,
> > or lack thereof. You are branding all believers of a particular faith
> > as being evil for the wrong doings of a few; another poor and incorrect
> > assumption. Just because a few persons commit misdeeds does not mean
> > that the whole group is responsible. Just because a few sick minds
> > commit evil deeds does not mean that an entire religious belief is wrong
> > and should be eliminated, as you suggest.
>
> by "few persons" you are referring, of course, in part, to the tens of
> thousands of christians who went to war with tens of thousands of muslims
> because the muslim faith was obviously wrong?
You are completely missing my point. Jane has stated that such acts
are an argument for the elimination of religions. (As stated in the
original post of this thread.) While I do not approve of seeing the
Palistinians celebrating this disgusting act, I do not believe in any
way that the actions of these Palistinians reflects the beliefs of the
entire Islamic world. This was the point that I was trying to make.
Next time read the post a little more carefully before you respond.
>
> while jane's logic is often somewhat skewed, at least she has some history
> behind her. you must never have heard of the Crusades....
The Crusades? What does that have to do with anything that happened
today? Get real. A despicable crime happened today. This has nothing
to do with the Crusades. And tell me, what history is behind Jane in
this case? Jane has made a stupid connection between the terrorist act
and the elimination of religion. This has nothing to do with history or
the Crusades. My point was that the acts of these despicable criminals
are not necessarily reflective of a larger group. I'll repeat for your
benefit, next time read the post a little more carefully before you
respond.
russ p
actually reading back over this, i realize that while i wasn't wrong about
what i said, i wasn't saying it in the current context. your remark about
not blaming an entire society/religion due to a few bad apples - i took that
to mean the partiers in the streets, not the few who hijacked the planes. as
for my history comment, this, again, while technically correct, was spoken
out of context.
next time i'll read a little more carefully :)
Sammi
> lemming...
>
ahahahahahaa......shouldn't you at least come up with an original thought or
two before casting such words?
Sugar Pie
topic* post in this thread from you....doesn't that make you a flaming
troll? We already know you're a flaming queen...
By the way - lemming is only ONE word! Learn to count.
"Sammi" <sammi@_remove_alt2600.com> wrote in message
news:8oKn7.1566$KT.6...@eagle.america.net...
Sugar Pie
war...
Our society uses religion to damn homosexuals...this creates a lot of hatred
between the hetro and homo communities...check out http://www.gpac.org/ -
click the Hate Crimes tab...I'm sure you you'll find lots of reading on the
violent acts that are comitted against homosexuals/transexuals, all in the
name of 'religion' and 'god'.
Fortunately this related violence hasn't escalated to full blow war yet, but
the concept is the same - let's rape beat and kill those that don't fit our
religious specs...
On a slightly different topic, the Taliban, historically a group in place to
preserve and maintain the muslim faith and the writings of the Quaran,
resort to violence and murder, particularly against MUSLIM women!!! - in
their quest to religiously rule Afghanistan...
I'm still waiting for anyone to provide me with excerps from the Bible or
the Quaran where I can clearly read that KILLING anyone, for any reason,
isat God is telling these people to do...
My original post was made in the hopes that people would respond and maybe
provide me information that I DON'T have so that perhaps I would see things
in a clearer light. Now Sammi has gone and started a flame war in here and
no doubt, I'm gonna lose my train of thought, so I think I'm going to plonk
him and hope the rest of the folks in this thread can continue offering some
stimulating conversation by which I may learn something new.
"russ p" <russp...@link1up.com> wrote in message
news:rRBn7.3637$xa2.7...@news2.rdc1.ab.home.com...
Calgary Rob
> whoops, another shitpost by rob - almost missed this one :)
>
> lesse if i can clear this up a bit for you dick.. i mean, rob. i believe
> (and dan, correct me if i'm wrong) that dan was referring to the past, oh,
> 10 years or so where palestinians have been displaced, murdered, and
> tortured because of their religion - not the footage of the street parties
> there today. i shouldn't get too much more specific here about it since i
> haven't really followed the situation too closely.
Boy Russ, you are a sharp one arent you? I did not know that this was
happening to them because of their religion, or do you mean that they behave
this way because of their religion? Please clear that up.
Calgary Rob
>so I think I'm going to plonk
> him and hope the rest of the folks in this thread can continue offering
some
> stimulating conversation by which I may learn something new.
Who else are you going to plonk?!!!!!
james
Hey Russ,
I think that I spoke a little out of tune also. I have a few friends
who live in the States; while all of this was going on, I could not help
but to think of them...I think that it kinda made me loose my cool in a
few posts. Well, at least my post to you. Thank goodness they are all
ok. Please accept my appologies for some poorly chosen words on my
part.
I have been listening to the news a fair bit today (probably like
everyone else), one of the things that I heard was that someone heard
from a friend who heard from a neighbour, etc etc that there were a few
Muslims here in Calgary that were celebrating this nonsense. While I
know that this in no way reflects the attitude of the entire Islamic
world, I hope that the people of this City (and Canada also) will not
take out their anger on innocent Islamic believers, just because of what
a few ignorant morons do. I think that the good Muslims are equally
shocked by what has happened just like everyone else.
russ p
trying to "convert" them - both their religion and their political system.
their political system promotes (and enforces) their religion and no others.
our "more enlightened" system protects the rights of the individual to
practice whatever religion they choose - provided it doesn't interfere with
other people's rights. we (and by we i mean pretty much every democratic 1st
world nation on the planet) try to make other countries without democracy
adopt our system - or at least one based on it.
so you could say that they behave this way because of both their religion
and their politics.
i should've explained that i guess before flaming you :)
Calgary Rob
I believe in complete freedom etc. I do not believe in terrorism, and think
that harsh reaction is the only way to treat terrorism. Many people have
pointed fingers at Israel over the years, but now they see why Israel has
reacted the way they have over the years (and keep in mind the minimal
casualties in attacks from Israel over the years).
--
Calgary Rob
calga...@home.com
I Like Gravy
"russ p" <russp...@link1up.com> wrote in message
news:XCTn7.6316$xa2.1...@news2.rdc1.ab.home.com...
Sammi
> Russ - Sammi is a perfect example of my statement about religion causing
> war...
Oh? Where have I ever promoted a religion?
Seems *you're* the one using religion to cause war. War against the
religous.
What a flaming hypocrite.
> Our society uses religion to damn homosexuals..
Whereas you seek them out and taunt them...uh...why exactly?
If not religion, what's your excuse?
>Now Sammi has gone and started a flame war
Hmmm, didn't know someone as stupid as you could also be conceited.
One word, stated once, against one person, you.
And you have the audacity to consider that a flame war.
Your estimation of yourself is highly over rated.
> so I think I'm going to plonk him
Heard that many times sweetiepuss, yet you never do.
I fascinate you, you envy me.
russ p
no one's blaming Isreal for the actions of an extremist terrorist group. we
don't know (for sure) who is responsible for it.
the fingers point to countries like Isreal, Iraq, and Iran because that is
where the majority of terrorists end up "setting up shop" so to speak. this
has become a knee-jerk reaction for many people.
Isreal has expressed it's deepest condolences at this horror. they claim to
want to cooperate with an investigation. they have agreed to extradite any
people they arrest whom US authorities feel may be connected.
and in any case, this is not the point of this thread. others here are
asking us to try to understand the motivation behind the celebrations that
were broadcast. you, however, refuse to. this is the point i was trying to
make - it really has little to do with Isreal, Palestine, or terrorists.
"Calgary Rob" <calga...@home.com> wrote in message
news:2fUn7.6434$xa2.1...@news2.rdc1.ab.home.com...
russ p
> Russ - Sammi is a perfect example of my statement about religion causing
> war...
>
> Our society uses religion to damn homosexuals...this creates a lot of
hatred
> between the hetro and homo communities...check out http://www.gpac.org/ -
> click the Hate Crimes tab...I'm sure you you'll find lots of reading on
the
> violent acts that are comitted against homosexuals/transexuals, all in the
> name of 'religion' and 'god'.
preference (aside from minors). religion is secondary to society. without
society there can be no religion. without religion, there will still be a
society.
hate crimes, again, are not necessarily related to religion. MANY people are
just ignorant about that type of thing. many religions, while not promoting
non-hetro relationships, are far from condemning them either. when was the
last time you heard of a Buddhist beating someone up because they're gay?
> Fortunately this related violence hasn't escalated to full blow war yet,
but
> the concept is the same - let's rape beat and kill those that don't fit
our
> religious specs...
this is a cornerstone of some religions. "make everyone see the light" or
some such nonsense. i don't believe this "related violence" is related to
religion. i believe it's politics. granted, politics in certain countries is
pretty much synonymous with religion, so the line can be drawn either way.
> On a slightly different topic, the Taliban, historically a group in place
to
> preserve and maintain the muslim faith and the writings of the Quaran,
> resort to violence and murder, particularly against MUSLIM women!!! - in
> their quest to religiously rule Afghanistan...
again, their way, not ours. their practices infringe on human rights (as
agreed on by pacts like NATO and the UN), so we are obligated to prevent
those practices. the fact that they're religious practices is beside the
point.
> I'm still waiting for anyone to provide me with excerps from the Bible or
> the Quaran where I can clearly read that KILLING anyone, for any reason,
> isat God is telling these people to do...
don't think you'll find that in the bible. the problem with catholocism in
the middle ages was a matter of interpretation. the bible does say to bring
christianity to the ignorant, but it does not say how or to what extent.
> My original post was made in the hopes that people would respond and maybe
> provide me information that I DON'T have so that perhaps I would see
things
> in a clearer light. Now Sammi has gone and started a flame war in here
and
> no doubt, I'm gonna lose my train of thought, so I think I'm going to
plonk
> him and hope the rest of the folks in this thread can continue offering
some
> stimulating conversation by which I may learn something new.
here's something new: religion doesn't cause wars. people cause wars.