RESULT: aus.rec.cuisine fails vote 21:0
snail
>The newsgroup aus.rec.cuisine has Failed its vote by 21 YES votes to 0
Bummer. I had a feeling it wouldn't have the numbers :(
--
snail | sn...@careless.net.au | http://www.careless.net.au/~snail/
I'm a man of my word. In the end, that's all there is. - Avon
David Gerard
:The newsgroup aus.rec.cuisine has Failed its vote by 21 YES votes to 0
:NO votes. There were 0 abstentions and forgeries detected.
:For a group to pass, YES votes must be at least 2/3 of all valid (YES
:and NO) votes. There must also be at least 40 more YES votes than NO
:votes. Abstentions and Forgeries do not affect the outcome.
ooh bugger, I actually forgot to vote for this one.
If we can find 18 other people who also forgot, I will LART myself and try
to *remember* when it's brought up again in six months ...
--
http://xenu.netizen.com.au/ http://www.caube.org.au/
"Drunk dolled-up DethChyk
Tottering over dance-floor
Happy hour too brief" (Cleo, alchog0ff)
aus group admin
The newsgroup aus.rec.cuisine has Failed its vote by 21 YES votes to 0
NO votes. There were 0 abstentions and forgeries detected.
For a group to pass, YES votes must be at least 2/3 of all valid (YES
and NO) votes. There must also be at least 40 more YES votes than NO
votes. Abstentions and Forgeries do not affect the outcome.
VOTERS:
Blackwel...@bhp.com.au
G.Pan...@biochem.usyd.edu.au
a10...@anugpo.anu.edu.au
am...@ics.org.au
br...@apex.net.au
br...@virtual.net.au
david...@anu.edu.au
dbro...@fang.omni.com.au
de...@eudoramail.com
gae...@videocam.net.au
gmul...@scu.edu.au
graeme...@start.com.au
ha...@start.com.au
martine...@eudoramail.com
ma...@netizen.com.au
s319...@bohm.anu.edu.au
sn...@careless.net.au
tek...@tekhne.com.au
thad...@dingoblue.net.au
tom...@hotmail.com
z221...@pop3.student.unsw.edu.au
[ Note: CFVs and control messages will be signed with the ausadmin key.
Download it from http://aus.news-admin.org/ausadmin.asc now! --nick ]
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Robert Smith
Hey I've got an idea, lets just not start any new newsgroups!
Robert Smith
aus group admin <ausa...@aus.news-admin.org> wrote in message
news:8a2uha$8g3$1...@ultraman.zeta.org.au...
David Bromage
> On 8 Mar 2000 00:00:26 +1100, aus group admin <ausa...@aus.news-admin.org> wrote:
> :The newsgroup aus.rec.cuisine has Failed its vote by 21 YES votes to 0
> :NO votes. There were 0 abstentions and forgeries detected.
> :For a group to pass, YES votes must be at least 2/3 of all valid (YES
> :and NO) votes. There must also be at least 40 more YES votes than NO
> :votes. Abstentions and Forgeries do not affect the outcome.
> ooh bugger, I actually forgot to vote for this one.
> If we can find 18 other people who also forgot, I will LART myself and try
> to *remember* when it's brought up again in six months ...
Thanks to everybody who did vote. It's heartening to see that there
weren't any NO votes. When was the last time a newsgroup creation was
unanimous?
Cheers
David (now thinking about aus.science again..... *grin*)
Greg Pankhurst
sn...@careless.net.au wrote:
>aus group admin <ausa...@aus.news-admin.org> wrote:
>>The newsgroup aus.rec.cuisine has Failed its vote by 21 YES votes to 0
>
>Bummer. I had a feeling it wouldn't have the numbers :(
I'm just wondering if it's time to rethink the thresholds ???
Greg
David Formosa (aka ? the Platypus)
<G.Pan...@biochem.usyd.edu.au> wrote:
[...]
>I'm just wondering if it's time to rethink the thresholds ???
I think there grood as they are.
--
Please excuse my spelling as I suffer from agraphia. See
http://www.zeta.org.au/~dformosa/Spelling.html to find out more.
snail
>On Wed, 08 Mar 2000 12:53:58 +1100, Greg Pankhurst
><G.Pan...@biochem.usyd.edu.au> wrote:
>>I'm just wondering if it's time to rethink the thresholds ???
>I think there grood as they are.
I agree. It was the experience previously that 20 votes is
not enough to sustain a newsgroup.
Greg Pankhurst
dfor...@zeta.org.au (David Formosa (aka ? the Platypus)) wrote:
>On Wed, 08 Mar 2000 12:53:58 +1100, Greg Pankhurst
><G.Pan...@biochem.usyd.edu.au> wrote:
>
>[...]
>
>>I'm just wondering if it's time to rethink the thresholds ???
>
>I think there good as they are.
Define good.
It seems to me as though a lot of well thought out proposals for newsgroups
which would be successful are falling over at the voting stage. You could
argue that this proves there aren't enough interested punters out there to
justify creation. But with some proposed groups (such as the one which just
fell over) there isn't a defined focus to diseminate (sp?) info about the
vote, and I think the much maligned "build it and they will come"
philosophy is actually a very probable scenario.
Greg
Greg Pankhurst
sn...@careless.net.au wrote:
>David Formosa (aka ? the Platypus) <dfor...@zeta.org.au> wrote:
>>On Wed, 08 Mar 2000 12:53:58 +1100, Greg Pankhurst
>><G.Pan...@biochem.usyd.edu.au> wrote:
>>>I'm just wondering if it's time to rethink the thresholds ???
>>I think there grood as they are.
>
>I agree. It was the experience previously that 20 votes is
>not enough to sustain a newsgroup.
Dunno. aus.ads.forsale.cars seems to go well.
Greg
David Formosa (aka ? the Platypus)
<G.Pan...@biochem.usyd.edu.au> wrote:
[...]
>It seems to me as though a lot of well thought out proposals for newsgroups
>which would be successful are falling over at the voting stage. You could
>argue that this proves there aren't enough interested punters out there to
>justify creation.
Wich I would.
> But with some proposed groups (such as the one which just
>fell over) there isn't a defined focus to diseminate (sp?) info about the
>vote,
Could you be more clear? Also if they are unable to diseminate the
info about the vote, how are they to diseminate info about the new
newsgroup?
Ian Staples
f...@thingy.apana.org.au (David Gerard) wrote:
>On 8 Mar 2000 00:00:26 +1100, aus group admin <ausa...@aus.news-admin.org>
> wrote:
>
>:The newsgroup aus.rec.cuisine has Failed its vote by 21 YES votes to 0
>:For a group to pass, YES votes must be at least 2/3 of all valid (YES
>:and NO) votes. There must also be at least 40 more YES votes than NO
>:votes. Abstentions and Forgeries do not affect the outcome.
>
>
>ooh bugger, I actually forgot to vote for this one.
>
>If we can find 18 other people who also forgot, I will LART myself and try
>to *remember* when it's brought up again in six months ...
I'm still waiting for aus.rec.gourmand ;-)
Cheers, Ian S.
David Bromage
> However for something like aus.rec.cuisine, it lacks high traffic focus
> through which info on the proposal & group could be easily spread. So I
> think the failure of the group doesn't reflect a lack of interest, rather a
> lack of awareness.
Well put. One of the problems with aus.rec.cuisine was that it was more or
less accepted without dissent. The lack of dissent was reflected in the
lack of discussion. Everybody said "good idea" and left it at that. The
vote was unanimously in favour, but didn't make a quorum.
The two third majority is a good way to ensure sufficient support in a
vote, but I think the threshold of 40 more YES than NO needs to be lowered
a bit.
I think there may also need to be a second posting of the CFV as a
reminder. Say halfway through the voting period, or 'x' days before voting
closes.
Cheers
David
Barry Ward
Greg Pankhurst <G.Pan...@biochem.usyd.edu.au> wrote in message Define
good.
>
> It seems to me as though a lot of well thought out proposals for
newsgroups
> which would be successful are falling over at the voting stage. You could
> argue that this proves there aren't enough interested punters out there to
just
> fell over) there isn't a defined focus to diseminate (sp?) info about the
> philosophy is actually a very probable scenario.
>
> Greg
I contribute to and participate in a number of newsgroups - all of which
existed before I discovered them . If they had not existed then I wouldn't
be able to share my interests with the other people is these NGs.
Some of these groups are large and have a big following - but others are
quite small and have periodic and spasmodic times when participation is
minimal. However, it is obvious that people are lurking in them even when
they are quiet because a single post is often sufficient to "wake up" the
lurkers and participate.
The current NG creation process is FLAWED!!
So what if a NG is created and doesn't set the world on fire. Go to the
Youth Hostels.UK newsgroup (which is usually fairly quiet -strangely enough
in my opinion!!) and suggest that the NG be closed down due to lack of
participation.
Barry
Barry Ward
David Formosa (aka ? the Platypus) <dfor...@zeta.org.au> wrote in message
news:slrn8cbrdb....@dformosa.zeta.org.au...
> > But with some proposed groups (such as the one which just
> >fell over) there isn't a defined focus to diseminate (sp?) info about the
> >vote,
>
> info about the vote, how are they to diseminate info about the new
> newsgroup?
Newcomers to USENET (of which these days , there are many!) go to the
Newsgroups list as shown in their newsreader, Type in a word for one of
their interests (eg Cuisine) and lo and behold , there is a newsgroup
dedicated solely to discussion of this interest. Maybe , this NG is very
active - maybe not --- BUT if newsgroups are not created in the first place
because of the perverse desire by many people who frequent this NG to
"censor" what subject matter can be discussed , then they will not find a
newsgroup based upon their interests. Perhaps if aus.rec.cuisine had been
created , it may have slowly got off the ground - if not, then SO WHAT!!. As
it is now, it has been killed before it had a chance to do anything.
Barry
Greg Pankhurst
Exactly.
I'm not advocating the "build it and they will come" philosophy about all
proposed newsgroups. For example, I've been toying with the idea of
proposing aus.sport.basketball (in fact that's why I initially came into
aus.net.news about 18 months back), and there are a couple of high traffic,
fan-owned websites about Aussie Basketball through which I'd float the idea
and raise awareness about it. And if after all that, the vote on the group
failed, I'd be happy to concede there wasn't the interest to warrent the
group.
However for something like aus.rec.cuisine, it lacks high traffic focus
through which info on the proposal & group could be easily spread. So I
think the failure of the group doesn't reflect a lack of interest, rather a
lack of awareness.
Obviously this is a rather subjective judgement, and one that cannot be
used in a voting procedure. So I'd suggest we lower the thresholds. I'd
rather see a few bad ngs slip through than trap a good one.
Greg
Dave Proctor
>Well put. One of the problems with aus.rec.cuisine was that it was more or
>less accepted without dissent. The lack of dissent was reflected in the
>lack of discussion. Everybody said "good idea" and left it at that. The
>vote was unanimously in favour, but didn't make a quorum.
>
>The two third majority is a good way to ensure sufficient support in a
>vote, but I think the threshold of 40 more YES than NO needs to be lowered
>a bit.
>
>I think there may also need to be a second posting of the CFV as a
>reminder. Say halfway through the voting period, or 'x' days before voting
>closes.
Aaargh - this is the third time in as many days that I have agreed with you
David. This HAS to stop, for both our sanity.
Dave
snail
>Well put. One of the problems with aus.rec.cuisine was that it was more or
>less accepted without dissent. The lack of dissent was reflected in the
Yeah, not enough controversy to generate debate :-)
>The two third majority is a good way to ensure sufficient support in a
>vote, but I think the threshold of 40 more YES than NO needs to be lowered
>a bit.
>
>I think there may also need to be a second posting of the CFV as a
>reminder. Say halfway through the voting period, or 'x' days before voting
>closes.
To what though...I've just had a look at aus.computers.java and it's
still struggling. Half of what few posts are there are crossposts.
snail
>Newcomers to USENET (of which these days , there are many!) go to the
I'd disagree with that actually. If anything the attraction to usenet
seems to have died down in recent years. It's my impression that there's
not as many newcomers as there were back in the mid 90s, although I have
no stats to back that up. However I've been on usenet for 14 years now,
and newcomers have always been around. Witness the fresh batch of
first year uni students each year.
>because of the perverse desire by many people who frequent this NG to
>"censor" what subject matter can be discussed , then they will not find a
I'd suggest that insulting everyone who disagrees with you is not
conducive to friendly discussion.
>newsgroup based upon their interests. Perhaps if aus.rec.cuisine had been
>created , it may have slowly got off the ground - if not, then SO WHAT!!. As
Check deja for previous iterations of this discussion.
Greg Pankhurst
sn...@careless.net.au wrote:
>David Bromage <dbro...@fang.omni.com.au> wrote:
>>Well put. One of the problems with aus.rec.cuisine was that it was more or
>>less accepted without dissent. The lack of dissent was reflected in the
>
>Yeah, not enough controversy to generate debate :-)
>
>>The two third majority is a good way to ensure sufficient support in a
>>vote, but I think the threshold of 40 more YES than NO needs to be lowered
>>a bit.
>>
>>I think there may also need to be a second posting of the CFV as a
>>reminder. Say halfway through the voting period, or 'x' days before voting
>>closes.
>
>To what though...I've just had a look at aus.computers.java and it's
>still struggling. Half of what few posts are there are crossposts.
I'd suggest a threshold of 20 w/ the two-thirds majority. Sure, some duds
might slide thru, but I'd prefer that to killing a good one. Especially so
given the aus. hierarchy is already littered with poorly named & dead
newsgroups*.
Greg
* this last sentence is no way intended as a kick in the guts for anyone
involved in the admin, nor as my advocating open slather for aus. newsgroup
creation. I just don't think we should scuitinise things as intently as we
do
Margaret Van Emmerik
factor. When I saw that the real e-mail addresses of voters would be
posted (as is proper by the rules & regs that currently govern CFVs I
believe), I just couldn't willingly subject myself to all the resultant
SPAM, thanks to the bots that troll newsgroups for e-mail address to hit.
Regards, Margaret Van Emmerik
Brisbane
>aus group admin <ausa...@aus.news-admin.org> wrote in message
>news:8a2uha$8g3$1...@ultraman.zeta.org.au...
>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>>
>> The newsgroup aus.rec.cuisine has Failed its vote by 21 YES votes to 0
>> NO votes. There were 0 abstentions and forgeries detected.
>>
>> For a group to pass, YES votes must be at least 2/3 of all valid (YES
>> and NO) votes. There must also be at least 40 more YES votes than NO
>> votes. Abstentions and Forgeries do not affect the outcome.
>>
>>
Dave Proctor
>Well, I'm very sad to say that the reason I didn't vote was the SPAM
>factor. When I saw that the real e-mail addresses of voters would be
>posted (as is proper by the rules & regs that currently govern CFVs I
>believe), I just couldn't willingly subject myself to all the resultant
>SPAM, thanks to the bots that troll newsgroups for e-mail address to hit.
I use my real email in the voting and receive, at most, 1 or 2 spams per
day, all of which are dealt with through SpamCop.
Dave
David Gerard
:Well, I'm very sad to say that the reason I didn't vote was the SPAM
:factor. When I saw that the real e-mail addresses of voters would be
:posted (as is proper by the rules & regs that currently govern CFVs I
:believe), I just couldn't willingly subject myself to all the resultant
:SPAM, thanks to the bots that troll newsgroups for e-mail address to hit.
Would it be possible, when posting the voter lists, to replace the @ with a
# ?
Let's take a ride, run with the dogs tonight, in suburbia.
David Formosa (aka ? the Platypus)
[...]
>Would it be possible, when posting the voter lists, to replace the @ with a
># ?
It is possbale, though I may pick anouther letter.
Dave Proctor
>On 11 Mar 2000 01:30:09 GMT, David Gerard <f...@thingy.apana.org.au> wrote:
>
>[...]
>
>>Would it be possible, when posting the voter lists, to replace the @ with
a
>># ?
>
>It is possbale, though I may pick anouther letter.
Using a letter may confuse the actual email address - maybe if it becomes an
uppercase AT - e.g. thadoctaATdingoblue.net.au - this should confuse the
spambots whilst making it obvious what the address is.
Dave
Neville Duguid
> Margaret Van Emmerik wrote in message ...
> >Well, I'm very sad to say that the reason I didn't vote was the SPAM
> >factor. When I saw that the real e-mail addresses of voters would be
> >posted (as is proper by the rules & regs that currently govern CFVs I
> >believe), I just couldn't willingly subject myself to all the resultant
> >SPAM, thanks to the bots that troll newsgroups for e-mail address to hit.
>
> I use my real email in the voting and receive, at most, 1 or 2 spams per
> day, all of which are dealt with through SpamCop.
I concur. When I was posting almost daily on aus.politics, I would get
on average 2.5 spam emails a day. It has dropped right off since I
ceased being a regular poster..
> Dave
--
Neville Duguid * "To see what is in front of one's nose *
nevi...@netspace.net.au * needs a constant struggle." *
Spare me, spam me not * - George Orwell. *
Che Guava
Neville Duguid wrote:
> Dave Proctor <thad...@spambait.dingoblue.net.au> wrote:
>
> > Margaret Van Emmerik wrote in message ...
> > >Well, I'm very sad to say that the reason I didn't vote was the SPAM
> > >factor. When I saw that the real e-mail addresses of voters would be
> > >posted (as is proper by the rules & regs that currently govern CFVs I
> > >believe), I just couldn't willingly subject myself to all the resultant
> > >SPAM, thanks to the bots that troll newsgroups for e-mail address to hit.
> >
> > I use my real email in the voting and receive, at most, 1 or 2 spams per
> > day, all of which are dealt with through SpamCop.
>
> I concur. When I was posting almost daily on aus.politics, I would get
> on average 2.5 spam emails a day. It has dropped right off since I
> ceased being a regular poster..
Since I have been 'killfiled' (;-) by you I find you frequenting other NGs
and lying about me, claiming I engage in Blacklisting behaviour
(Whatever that might be B^p) IN NG's I AM NOT EVEN
PARTICIPATING IN. B^D
What a bare-faced cretinous LIAR!
I will pursue you until an apology is forthcoming.
(Or I stop enjoying it, whichever comes first. ;-)
Che
------
Message-ID: <38CBAA27...@my-deja.com>
From: Che Guava <che_...@my-deja.com>
Newsgroups: aus.net.news, aus.politics, aus.general, soc.culture.australian
Subject: Neville Duguid, Character Assasin and Bare faced liar. was Re: RFD:
aus.politics.multicultural
Nev Duguid wrote:
> Voo: There are three main offenders, Seppo Renfors, Che Guava and Brian
> Ross who feel they have the right to pursue certain people they have
> "blacklisted" wherever they try to post on usenet.
Mr Duigood... why are you perpetrating such a vile slander!
At the time of this post of yours can you please tell us
any post by me which can *IN ANY WAY* be characterised
as some kind of 'BLACKLIST'?
PRIOR TO THIS EVENING I HAVE NOT EVEN POSTED TO
AUS.NET.NEWS ON THIS SUBJECT!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!! B^p
I demand an immediate retraction and public apology.
I have till this point posted three times in aus.general asking the RFD
proponent a couple of questions regarding the liklihood of cross posting!
WHAT "BLACKLIST"???
Moreover: YOU HAVE PUBLICLY DECLARED THAT YOU
KILLFILED ME !!!!!!!!!
How do you determine my guilt IF YOU DON'T SEE THE POSTS
WHICH I HAVEN'T POSTED!?!?!?!? B^D
You are a lying fool!
__________________
Subject:CHE GUAVA PERMANENTLY KILLFILED - IT'S THE ONLY WAY
Date:02/15/2000
Author:Neville Duguid <nevi...@netspace.net.au>
Kill File
Collections: <all entries>
Kill if Sender contains "soapbox", ignore case
Kill if Sender contains "Che Guava", ignore case
Kill if Sender contains "Che_Guava", ignore case
_____________________________________________
<Snip>
THEN HOW CAN YOU MAKE YOUR APALLING,
SLANDEROUS LIES!? PSYCHIC VIBRATIONS?
TEA LEAF READING? CHANNELLING DEAD PEOPLE?
You are the most disgraceful vermin I have ever had the misfortune
to encounter on this or any other NG, and I include here
the notorious fascists!
An annotated copy of your slander will be posted to your
ISP if I do not hear a public apology from you by close of
business Friday 17th March.