Wish I may, Wish I might
John Dean
get a particular drug he thought would be of value.
The v.o. said "He was unable to obtain the drug which may have saved his
life."
Since the poor chap is dead without even having a single dose of the item,
I'd assume "... the drug which might have saved his life" is what we're
after.
But this confusion between how to use 'may' and how to use 'might' occurs
more often these days. Anyone else see it in the wild?
--
John Dean
Oxford
Cece
Oh, yes. For a while, "might" was almost never heard, only "may."
Then William Safire wrote about this in an article titled "The Merry
Month of Might" and shortly after that, "may" disappeared. Both are
used now, but it seems hardly anyone is sure when to use which.
A couple-three years ago, a TV reporter (on scene where a house had
burned) said, "If they couldn't get out of the window, they may have
burned" -- as the two residents of the house stared over her shoulder
into the camera!
Robert Lieblich
>
> On Nov 19, 9:47 am, "John Dean" <john-d...@fraglineone.net> wrote:
> > Item on BBC news concerning a cancer sufferer who died without being able to
> > get a particular drug he thought would be of value.
> > The v.o. said "He was unable to obtain the drug which may have saved his
> > life."
> > Since the poor chap is dead without even having a single dose of the item,
> > I'd assume "... the drug which might have saved his life" is what we're
> > after.
> > But this confusion between how to use 'may' and how to use 'might' occurs
> > more often these days. Anyone else see it in the wild?
>
> Then William Safire wrote about this in an article titled "The Merry
> Month of Might" and shortly after that, "may" disappeared. Both are
> used now, but it seems hardly anyone is sure when to use which.
>
> A couple-three years ago, a TV reporter (on scene where a house had
> burned) said, "If they couldn't get out of the window, they may have
> burned" -- as the two residents of the house stared over her shoulder
> into the camera!
I actually remember my first encounter with the usage. It was a day
in, I think, 1981. I was presiding over something that looked like a
trial (in my administrative jedge days), and the attorney representing
the government agency "may"ed repeatedly where I wanted "might." His
meaning was clear, and I wasn't there to teach him English usage, so I
said nothing. I remember thinking that perhaps his problem was a
less-than-perfect grasp of English -- he was ethnically Chinese and
spoke with a bit of a Chinese-type accent.
But it kept happening. In fact, it has happened frequently here in
the bosom of AUE, to the point that we have had several threads branch
off into discussions of "may" where "might" was needed. Some creative
Googling is likely to turn up a few of those.
As with plural verbs with "neither," or "as such" meaning "therefore,"
the battle is lost, and the topic comes up only when we elderly
veterans of the language battles congregate.
--
Bob Lieblich
Who should long since have received a Purple Heart for injuries in the
usage wars
Wood Avens
Oh, yes, frequently. Dammit. It's on my list of cringe-makers. I'll
spare you the rest of the list.
--
Katy Jennison
spamtrap: remove the first two letters after the @
Nick
I'm afraid that I'm obviously a barbarian, and cannot see anything at
all wrong with it. In that context "might", "may", "could have" and
"had the potential to [with subsequent changes]" are pretty well synonyms.
--
Online waterways route planner: http://canalplan.org.uk
development version: http://canalplan.eu
James Hogg
Here it's a question of tense. "The drug which may have saved his life"
means that he's still alive, and his survival is possibly due to the
drug that he was given. "The drug which might have saved his life" means
that he's dead, but the drug could possibly have saved him if it had
been given to him.
--
James
Peter Duncanson (BrE)
wrote:
A temporary temporal slip - a trip into the historical present, wannit?
--
Peter Duncanson, UK
(in alt.usage.english)
Nick
I think so.
John Dean
Right. So *you're* the one.
In the example I quoted, saying the drug "may have saved his life" means
he's alive and it may be that the drug deserves the credit.
What the reporter meant was that the drug *might* have saved his life if
he'd had it. Which he didn't.
Fowler's Third goes into more detail about the subtleties. Basically, we
blame the Americans.
--
John Dean
Oxford
CDB
unspoken condition ([if things had been different,] it *might*) to
straightforward reporting of a possibility ([under the circumstances,]
it *may*).
Robert Lieblich
[ ... ]
> In the example I quoted, saying the drug "may have saved his life" means
> he's alive and it may be that the drug deserves the credit.
> What the reporter meant was that the drug *might* have saved his life if
> he'd had it. Which he didn't.
> Fowler's Third goes into more detail about the subtleties. Basically, we
> blame the Americans.
Blame the Americans, sez he. Who murdered the subjunctive, fella?
Who lost "gotten"? Who walks on pavement?
On the merits of may/might, I'm with you all the way. Fortunately,
there aren't that many people in the last ditch with us, so it's not
too uncomfortable.
--
Bob Lieblich
Who may have ignored this thread had he been wiser
Roland Hutchinson
I think most Americans are, in fact, in the ditch with y'all.
--
Roland Hutchinson
He calls himself "the Garden State's leading violist da gamba,"
... comparable to being ruler of an exceptionally small duchy.
--Newark (NJ) Star Ledger ( http://tinyurl.com/RolandIsNJ )
Peter Moylan
> On Sat, 21 Nov 2009 16:04:57 -0500, Robert Lieblich wrote:
>
>> John Dean wrote:
>>
>> [ ... ]
>>
>>> In the example I quoted, saying the drug "may have saved his life"
>>> means he's alive and it may be that the drug deserves the credit. What
>>> the reporter meant was that the drug *might* have saved his life if
>>> he'd had it. Which he didn't.
>>> Fowler's Third goes into more detail about the subtleties. Basically,
>>> we blame the Americans.
>> Blame the Americans, sez he. Who murdered the subjunctive, fella? Who
>> lost "gotten"? Who walks on pavement?
>>
>> On the merits of may/might, I'm with you all the way. Fortunately,
>> there aren't that many people in the last ditch with us, so it's not too
>> uncomfortable.
>
> I think most Americans are, in fact, in the ditch with y'all.
>
--
Peter Moylan, Newcastle, NSW, Australia. http://www.pmoylan.org
For an e-mail address, see my web page.
Mike Lyle
"John Dean" <john...@fraglineone.net> wrote in message
news:7ml7mnF...@mid.individual.net...
I've been spitting myself of it for about thirty years. It can be
genuinely misleading, not just pedant-pretending misleading. I propose
the death penalty.
--
Mike.