The Rule of Three
Dragonmama
: Merry Meet,
: As my earlier post (Divination) states, I've been studying Wicca for a
: couple months. It's hard to describe how I feel about the Rule of Three,
: so please bear with me. I've always believed in karma. Do most Wiccans
: take the Rule of Three literally? I believe that what goes around comes
: around, but will it literally come back thrice?
All such concepts are not literal. If you don't see the Rule of Three in
action, look around you. It does work, it just doesn't wear a "X3" label
in all cases, or even in most. If I do harm to another, it will come back
on me 3X, though usually not in the same form I out out. If I trip you so
that you fall down, I won't be tripped by the next three folks I meet on
the road, but I will have a flat tire, lose a $20 bill, and perhaps be
stood up by a date. That is how it works. If I help you find your keys,
my love will bring me chocolate, my "too small" jeans will suddenly fit,
and perhaps I will win $5 on the lottery. No direct returns but I will
have three or more things happen in return for what I put out to the
World.
I know the temptation to be literal, and expect to get a similar reward
for doing right by someone, but it just doesn't work that way. It does
come back, just not in direct kind.
Watch the world around you. You'll see it work. We sometimes call it
"Instant Karma" when we see it bite someone very soon after a negative
act.
B*B
Dragonmama
--
Jessica Rasku
<SNIP>
> All such concepts are not literal. If you don't see the Rule of Three in
> action, look around you.
<SNIP>
Okay, I thought that I would comment on this personaly. I think
it does work very much. Lets look at the simple act of say holding a door
for someone. The first time it is returned, is the feeling good about
doing good, the second is the feeling good about the appreciation you get
for holding the door, and the third is in knowing that in a small way, you
such a small act has ``increased'' the positive energy in the world. I
say that is just absolutely automatic. There is no need for ``three
people to hold the door for me'', for my ``good'' to be returned thrice...
Jessica
--
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Markessa
>Merry Meet,
>As my earlier post (Divination) states, I've been studying Wicca for a
>couple months. It's hard to describe how I feel about the Rule of Three,
>so please bear with me. I've always believed in karma. Do most Wiccans
>take the Rule of Three literally?
This goes back to the probelms of "most wiccans" who do anything. Noone can
say that "most wiccans" take the Rule of Three literally. Who can tell?
I would think it safe to say that the majority of pagans believe that what
you do will affect you in some fashion. If you "curse" someone to break their
leg, you will not break your leg three times. Rather, something three times
worse than breaking your leg will happen to you.
Call it karma. Sounds as good a label as any and is probably pretty
accurate.
The problem? The Powers That Be do not act on our time table. Some things
might happen quickly, some things might not happen for years. Doing a good deed
with the idea that you need a favor from the heavens is a waste of time.
I tend to think that it is more an idea of counting pluses and minuses in a
constantly changing world. I am a basically good person, so my "balance" is
more heavily weighted toward good things. And I do tend to have more good luck
than bad.
> I believe that what goes around comes
>around, but will it literally come back thrice? I'm inclined to say no.
>Why would it? I've always been a very nice person, and in most
>circumstances others are nice to me, but my life isn't a bundle of roses
>because I'm getting three times the good I'm putting out. Or at least it
>doesn't appear that way.
While I understand where you are going with this, it sounds odd. If I do
something good, I should get three times the good out of it. If I cast a love
spell for someone, I should get three times the love (three times the
boyfriends, the times the dates, three times the gifts..etc.). Since I don't
get three times something back, it must not work....
Nope. I don't think it works that way. I know what I *think* would make me
happy, but I also know that I may be wrong. What I think I want and what would
be good for me (and make me happy) are frequently two different things! (I
think I want a dinner of lasagna and garlic bread with a huge bowl of chocolate
decadence ice cream for dessert. What would be good for me is a Better Than
Burger on a whole wheat bun with veggies on the side and a dessert of fresh
fruit, and even that would have to be spread out over 2 hours.)
What is good for you may be learning how to live without something. Or maybe
you have to learn patience. Or, like in my case, a sudden lesson in relaxation,
stress reduction, meditation and life style shifting may be next on the list.
Since I have previously learned how to live on a fixed income, how to survive
without air conditioning and how to admit I can't control outcomes; I am able
to take my current lesson and use the chance to try to discover what I am
supposed to do now. As a good person, my "balance" is over into the positive
side. I am not being punished by being forced to step away from my previous
life, I am being redirected. I have put my faith on The Powers That Be to guide
me to where I am needed - at this point in time. And I understand that "This,
too, shall pass."
>Does this make sense? Does it even matter if I
>don't believe it literally, so long as I believe in karma? My mind is
>spinning...please help!
Chill. Take a deep breath and relax. Karma is what karma does. Belief makes
it real. Things will work out the way they are supposed to, we just have to
give it time and energy. It will be all right in the end.
Best thoughts,
Markessa
Remove NOSPAM to reply.
oldo...@my-deja.com
I take the rule of three quite literally. Others do not. We don't
always get back the good we do in life right away. It may also be that
the good we do get back will come to someone we love as opposed to
ourselves. I am positive that if I do harm to someone, it will come
back to haunt me, so I am careful in deed and try to be so in thought.
This is a choice that only you can make for yourself.
Oldone
"chick-a-roach" <dma...@MEATBALLSmindspring.com> wrote:
> Merry Meet,
> As my earlier post (Divination) states, I've been studying Wicca for
a
> couple months. It's hard to describe how I feel about the Rule of
Three,
> so please bear with me. I've always believed in karma. Do most
Wiccans
> take the Rule of Three literally? I believe that what goes around
comes
> around, but will it literally come back thrice? I'm inclined to say
no.
> Why would it? I've always been a very nice person, and in most
> circumstances others are nice to me, but my life isn't a bundle of
roses
> because I'm getting three times the good I'm putting out. Or at least
it
> doesn't appear that way. Does this make sense? Does it even matter if
I
> don't believe it literally, so long as I believe in karma? My mind is
> spinning...please help!
>
> Blessed be,
> Dixie
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> "I'd rather be shot in the face
> Than hear what you're gonna say" - FNM
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>
>
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Share what you know. Learn what you don't.
Shiva
<dma...@MEATBALLSmindspring.com> wrote:
>Merry Meet,
>As my earlier post (Divination) states, I've been studying Wicca for a
>couple months. It's hard to describe how I feel about the Rule of Three,
>so please bear with me. I've always believed in karma. Do most Wiccans
>take the Rule of Three literally?
In my experience, it is very rare for the rule of three to be taken
literally. There are just too many factors and possibilities to take
into account for us to be able to quantify exactly what "three times x
="
> I believe that what goes around comes
>around, but will it literally come back thrice? I'm inclined to say no.
I don't believe so, either. I also take a somewhat darker approach to
the karmic function in that I believe it intentionally (as far as any
universal force of nature can be personified to actually have
intentions) sets us up according to a pre-destined, divinely inspired
plan.
>Why would it? I've always been a very nice person, and in most
>circumstances others are nice to me, but my life isn't a bundle of roses
>because I'm getting three times the good I'm putting out.
I think we all have our *not* nice times, no matter how nice we are
over all. And keep in mind that "niceness" is subjective. But, when
all is said and done, I believe that, karmically, we balance out.
While the classic examples of super-do-gooders (ghandi, mother
theresa, etc. and evil-to-the-core folks (hitler, martin luther [he he
he], etc.) stand out to the rest of humanity, the majority of us have
elements of both.
> Or at least it
>doesn't appear that way. Does this make sense? Does it even matter if I
>don't believe it literally, so long as I believe in karma? My mind is
>spinning...please help!
I'll give you an example (on the positive side). A friend of mine is
one of those really laid back, take-things-in-stride kind of women.
She's totally agnostic demanding proof of everything. But the one
thing she does believe in is that if you do the right thing, and you
stay positive, everything will work out and everything will balance
out in the end. Case in point, we went through the drive in at
Mcdonalds. They forgot to give her her fries. She didn't bitch about
it or cause a stink. A week later we went out to lunch and she
didn't have any money... when she got out of her car, there was a $5
bill under her tire. Coincedence? Maybe. But the more I hang
around her, the more I realize that on the whole, things always work
out for her.
I don't think you have to worry about analyzing karma too much. The
important thing to realize is that its out there, and it affects us
all, and it follows a set of rules that we had no part in making.
namaste,
Shiva
consta...@netscape.net
<dma...@MEATBALLSmindspring.com> wrote:
>Merry Meet,
>As my earlier post (Divination) states, I've been studying Wicca for a
>couple months. It's hard to describe how I feel about the Rule of Three,
>so please bear with me. I've always believed in karma. Do most Wiccans
>take the Rule of Three literally? I believe that what goes around comes
>around, but will it literally come back thrice? I'm inclined to say no.
>Why would it? I've always been a very nice person, and in most
>circumstances others are nice to me, but my life isn't a bundle of roses
>because I'm getting three times the good I'm putting out. Or at least it
>doesn't appear that way. Does this make sense? Does it even matter if I
>don't believe it literally, so long as I believe in karma? My mind is
>spinning...please help!
>
>
>Blessed be,
>Dixie
>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>"I'd rather be shot in the face
>Than hear what you're gonna say" - FNM
>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>
>
Hi,
Being a solitair it hasn't mattered if i 'believe' in the rule of
the three. I am but one opinion. I believe there is a reaction for
every action.
I have however noticed i can go months without breaking a glass
then when i do break one it seems i will break two more in the within
the following weeks. Bad news always comes in three's. So I feel
there is more to it then i have thought in the past.
Constantina
Baird Stafford
> As my earlier post (Divination) states, I've been studying Wicca for a
> couple months. It's hard to describe how I feel about the Rule of Three,
> so please bear with me. I've always believed in karma. Do most Wiccans
> take the Rule of Three literally?
Ask two Wiccans, get five opinions - on this as on most other questions.
> I believe that what goes around comes
> around, but will it literally come back thrice? I'm inclined to say no.
And yet the superstition that bad luck comes in threes is very, very old
- certainly predating the establishment of Wicca. I've read old novels
in which servants who broke a piece of the most expensive china were
handed two more cheap earthenware objects to shatter, just to forestall
the certainty that if they didn't, the whole expensive set would have to
be replaced.
> Why would it? I've always been a very nice person, and in most
> circumstances others are nice to me, but my life isn't a bundle of roses
> because I'm getting three times the good I'm putting out. Or at least it
> doesn't appear that way.
I think you may have answered your own question: "it doesn't appear
that way" - at least not right now. Looking back over the past
half-century, I can't claim that all the uncomfortable bits that I
*know* were the result of my own thoughtlessness or even malice have
made me a "better" person - but I do think that if I hadn't undergone
them, I'd probably be a worse person now than I am though possibly in
different ways.
And yes, I think that the good I've put out has come back to me
threefold. I have a job I like, a spouse who loves me and whom I love
in return; we own our own house and make enough to support ourselves in
the lifestyle to which we never thought we'd be able to become
accustomed; and I'm doing volunteer work here on usenet which I think is
truly making a positive difference in the world. And all these good
things add up to about three times as much good as I expended on other
people in the past. That expenditure, though, seems to have been a
long-term investment rather than having granted an immediate return.
Perhaps the Rule of Three isn't instantaneous....
<snip>
Blessed be,
Baird
--
Modkin for soc.religion.paganism,
Modstaff for alt.religion.wicca.moderated
"We, the Person" <http://newstaffinc.com/person>
.Nisaba Merrieweather
chick-a-roach wrote in message <7jrdf7$u3n$1...@nntp9.atl.mindspring.net>...
> It's hard to describe how I feel about the Rule of Three,
>so please bear with me. I've always believed in karma. Do most Wiccans
>take the Rule of Three literally? I believe that what goes around comes
>around, but will it literally come back thrice? I'm inclined to say no.
There are a couple of things worth considering here.
I take the Rule of Three seriously, but not literally.
Firstly, there is the issue of "payback". Just say we have two people, a
millionaire, and someone struggling very hard on a small income. The poor
person was looking forward to spending $3.95 at Mcdonalds this week.The
millionaire mugs the poor person, and steals a hundred and fifty dollars,
their rent for the week and ten dollars towards food, leaving them with not
enough money to pay for their housing, and they end up evicted and homeless.
The poor person steals three times that sum from the millionaire as revenge,
four hundred and fifty dollars. The millionaire probably spends tens of
thousands of dollars in a week, on maintaining several expensive homes and
office suites, fuelling his private jet, and eating four hundred dollar
meals in top restaurants every day.What kind of karmic punishment would the
loss of $450 be to hiim? Considerably less, I'll bet, than the $3.95 that
would have bought a burger for the pauper. As a threefold return on a theft
of a hundred and fifty from soneone who couldn't afford it, it is woefully
inadequate. Clearly, an equitable threefold return would have to cause
proportional suffering to the person as they have caused to others.
Then we have the idea of "instant karma". Given that the majority of us
believe in reincarnation, why should we be so short-sighted as to assume
that all our karmic debts should be paid out within a decade or our deeds,
or even a lifetime of our deeds, or even several lifetimes of our deeds?
Perhaps Christopher Skase will suffer horribly in a few centuries' time as a
kind of balance for the families and small investors whose lives he has
ruined.
The last thing I'd like you to think about is this, the workings of your own
mind. Does it not make you feel good to help others, do you not feel guilt,
or at least shame in the knowledge of having done harm? The happiness and
peace we find within ourselves when we are able to bring a little good into
the world is more than a fitting reward for our deeds. And the self-doubt or
self-disgust we feel at our misdeeds could be seen, sometimes, as an
adequate or even excessive punishment for whatever we have done.
.Nisaba Merrieweather
nis...@primus.com.au
ICQ: 40506438
Mail: P.O. Box 93,
Gosford, NSW, 2250,
Australia.
To subscribe to Herbs_and_healing, go to www.onelist.com
Gale
> Merry Meet,
> As my earlier post (Divination) states, I've been studying Wicca for a
> couple months. It's hard to describe how I feel about the Rule of Three,
> so please bear with me. I've always believed in karma. Do most Wiccans
> take the Rule of Three literally? I believe that what goes around comes
> around, but will it literally come back thrice? I'm inclined to say no.
> Why would it? I've always been a very nice person, and in most
> circumstances others are nice to me, but my life isn't a bundle of roses
> because I'm getting three times the good I'm putting out. Or at least it
> doesn't appear that way. Does this make sense? Does it even matter if I
> don't believe it literally, so long as I believe in karma? My mind is
> spinning...please help!
I've been avoiding this one, but it's a quiet Sunday morning, as good a time
as any for me to wade into it with both feet. Let me get my big, fat IMO in
first -- put this one in red letters, or maybe run it through my entire
reply in the form of an html background. then:
The Three-Fold Law is short-hand for a number of concepts. The first is that
we are unable to determine the full consequences of any action. A single act
of kindness may return & return & RETURN; a great effort may dissipate
itself without apparently moving a single molecule of the Universe. The
reaction may be said to depend on "how we are aligned with the Universe" at
the time -- don't take that literally; it's a shorthand for "we don't
understand quite where we fit." More goes into (and comes out of) each of
our actions than we realize.
Second, the concept is linked to some notion of a just Universe. Many
Eastern religions offer an automatic dispensation of justice in the form of
reincarnation based on past "success." If you screw up being Emperor badly
enough, you can be a dung beetle a few times around. ;-) Some of the
neo-Pagan traditions have stolen & bastardized this concept. Monotheistic
Western faiths tend to turn their deity into a great judge -- as evidenced
by Kant's proof for the existence of God (very simplified): there must be
justice; there is no justice on earth; therefore a divine judge exists. Most
neo-Pagans firmly reject this "great judge" notion but also embrace the
notion of an ultimately just Universe. Thus the Rule of Three is necessary
for karmic balance (justice!).
Back when as a child I was trying to figure out why a certain monotheistic
deity wouldn't talk to me despite my best intentions, I never expected my
blessings to return in a literal "thousand-fold." When some of my friends
were flitting through brief romances with Buddhism, I rather quickly
concluded (with a shiver of terror) that "none of us deserve to get what we
deserve" and opted out. And now I look at the three-fold law not as though
the Universe was giving or charging interest on a debt (a usurious rate, at
that), but that the Universe is folding all the implications of my actions
into its fabric, and I will be rewarded by its terms, not my own.
--
Blessed Be,
Gale
http://www.capstonebeads.com/Magick.html (Tarot)
modstaff, alt.religion.wicca.moderated
shipping assistant: Capstone Jewelry Co. (we sell beads & semi-precious
stones)
http://www.capstonebeads.com
Shiva
<nis...@primus.com.au> wrote:
>The poor person steals three times that sum from the millionaire as revenge,
>four hundred and fifty dollars.
I'm glad you brought this up, because I think many people overlook the
"agent of karma" effect, whereby they believe that the "wronged" party
is then justified in wreaking revenge against those who commit the
original wrongdoing in the name of karmic payback.
The problem with that type of scenario is that the karmic function
always acts as a double edged sword. While it may give immediate (or
not so immediate, depending on your point of view) justice, it sets
the wielder up for a fall of equal magnitude; regardless of any
conditional circumstances and independent of all other actions.
In other words, the poor person who thinks he's acting as the agent of
karma and getting revenge upon the rich person by following the rich
person's example of stealing, may be, ultimately, helping to serve
the "karmic" cause, but has just set himself up for his own karmic
backlash, despite the fact that the rich person did it first.
[snip]
>Then we have the idea of "instant karma". Given that the majority of us
>believe in reincarnation, why should we be so short-sighted as to assume
>that all our karmic debts should be paid out within a decade or our deeds,
>or even a lifetime of our deeds, or even several lifetimes of our deeds?
And also, how do we know that the karmic backlash will even be in the
same form of the original crime, so to speak? Like other natural
forces, karma takes the route of least resistance. I wouldn't be
surprised if, at times, our karmic retributions or rewards gets
"gang-banged" together; which would stay within the *spirit* of
threefold return, but not within the literalist interpretation
(becuase it might be 12 or 15 times returned, etc.)
namaste,
Shiva