Atheist Holiday
duke32
Atheist Holiday
An atheist was quite incensed over the preparation for Easter and
Passover holidays and decided to contact the local ACLU about the
discrimination inflicted on atheists by the constant celebrations
afforded to Christians and Jews with all their holidays while the
atheists had no holidays for them to celebrate.
The ACLU jumped on the opportunity to once again pick up the cause of
the downtrodden and assigned their sharpest attorney to the case. The
case was brought up before a learned judge who after listening to the
passionate presentation by the ACLU representative promptly banged his
gavel and said, "Case dismissed!"
The ACLU lawyer stood up and objected to the ruling and said, "Your
honor, how can you dismiss this case? Surely the Christians have
Christmas, Easter and many other observances, and the Jews. In
addition to Passover, they have Yom Kippur and Hanukkah, and yet my
client and all other atheists have no such holiday!"
The judge leaned back in his chair and simply said, "Obviously your
client is too confused to know about, or for that matter, even
celebrate the atheists holiday!"
The ACLU lawyer pompously said, "We are aware of no such holiday for
atheists...just when might that be?"
The judge said, "Well, it comes every year at the same time - April
1st.
'The fool says in his heart, 'There is no God.' " Psalm 53:1, Psalm
14:1.
duke, American-American
*****
First Principle and Foundation: Man was created
to praise, reverence, and serve God, and by this
means to save his soul; and the other things on
the face of the earth were created for man's sake,
and in order to aid him in the prosecution of the
end for which he was created.
*****
Steve Knight
>
>Atheist Holiday
>
>An atheist was quite incensed over the preparation for Easter and
>Passover holidays and decided to contact the local ACLU about the
>discrimination inflicted on atheists by the constant celebrations
>afforded to Christians and Jews with all their holidays while the
>atheists had no holidays for them to celebrate.
We celebrate christmas the same way you celebrate April Fools.
Warlord Steve
BAAWA
www.sonic.net/~wooly
Don Kresch
<duk...@earthlink.net> let us all know that:
>'The fool says in his heart, 'There is no God.' " Psalm 53:1, Psalm
>14:1.
Anyone who says to another "you fool" shall be liable to burn in
hellfire. Matt 5:22.
Contradiction!
MINI-FAQ: Psalms 14:1
"The fool has said in his heart, 'There is no God.' They are corrupt,
they
have done abominable works, there is none that does good."" (Psalms
14:1)
AD HOMINEM FALLACY: An argument is discounted based on attacking the
character of the person making the argument. ("He is wrong when he
says there is no God, because he is a fool.")
STRAWMAN FALLACY: Arguing against a postion by creating a different,
weaker, or irrelevant position and refuting that position instead of
the original. ("There is no God" misrepresents "There isn't sufficient
evidence that God exists.")
CIRCULAR REASONING: The truth of the conclusion is assumed in order
to justify the premises. ("The fool says there is no God, because
anyone who says there is no God is a fool.")
BEGGING THE QUESTION: The argument creates a secondary proposition
that is related to the primary proposition, which requires a similar
argument that is missing. (The existence of God is assumed, while
addressing propositions of whether God exists.)
FALLACY OF INCONSISTENCY: The argument is inconsistent with other
arguments within the same context. (In the Christian context, Jesus
commands against the invective in Psalms 14:1, warning that "whoever
says 'You fool!' shall be liable to the hell of fire" in Matthew
5:22.)
SPECIAL PLEADING: The inappropriate attribution of emotive functions
to objects that do not have that capability. (Hearts are not capable
of "knowing" or of feeling emotions.)
REDUNDANCY: Psalm 53 is identical to Psalm 14.
QUESTIONABLE PREMISE: It is obviously not the case that all atheists
do nothing but bad deeds. This premise is invalidated by a single
example of an atheist doing a single charitable act.
Wayne Delia, red...@ibm.net, Atheist #61, MSTie #37634
Don
---
aa #51, Knight of BAAWA, DNRC o-, Member of the [H]orde
Atheist Minister for St. Dogbert.
"No being is so important that he can usurp the rights of another"
Picard to Data/Graves "The Schizoid Man"
Robibnikoff
>
>
>Atheist Holiday
Hey Jackass, how do you feel about the fact that all your major christian
holidays aren't even christian in origin?
Robyn
Resident Witchypoo & EAC Spellcaster
#1557
Tom Servo
> >Passover holidays and decided to contact the local ACLU about the
> >discrimination inflicted on atheists by the constant celebrations
> >afforded to Christians and Jews with all their holidays while the
> >atheists had no holidays for them to celebrate.
>
> We celebrate christmas the same way you celebrate April Fools.
Christians do LAN parties on 1st april?
-ts
Gregory A Greenman
duk...@earthlink.net says...
>
> Atheist Holiday
>
Well that convinced me. Some asshole called me a fool.
Obviously, the only reasonable response is to convert to
christianity.
Greg the Reprobate
Missionary of Death
-------------------
greg -at- spencersoft -dot- com
Rev. Phylter
news:pCHCa.7131$95....@www.newsranger.com:
Better yet, ANY excuse for a public holiday....
--
Phylter
Denizen of Darkness #44 & AFJC Antipodean Attaché
http://www.rudraigh.com/afjc/regulars.html
Ghost Rider
wrote:
> In article <smbmdv0p91q21se19...@4ax.com>,
> duk...@earthlink.net says...
>>
>> Atheist Holiday
>>
>
>
>
> Well that convinced me. Some asshole called me a fool.
> Obviously, the only reasonable response is to convert to
> christianity.
>
>
In that case I prefer to be unreasonable.
--
Ghost Rider
aa # 2011
EAC Nonexistent Director of Alcohol, Tobacco and Bad Puns
rm - 2003 Yamaha V-Star 650 Custom
"Don't be afraid, man is man-made."
[Greg Lake, "Infinite Space" - Emerson, Lake & Palmer]
david asman
Gregory A Greenman wrote:
> In article <smbmdv0p91q21se19...@4ax.com>,
> duk...@earthlink.net says...
> >
> > Atheist Holiday
> >
>
> Well that convinced me. Some asshole called me a fool.
> Obviously, the only reasonable response is to convert to
> christianity.
Actually wouldn't it be Judaism, since that line is from the
Tanakh? After all, the NT says calling people a fool puts
one at risk of hellfire. . .
Dave
Bob Pease
"Don Kresch" <ROT13....@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote in message
news:jkdmdvcr8jcmguhv2...@4ax.com...
> In alt.atheism on Mon, 02 Jun 2003 11:02:55 GMT, duke32
> <duk...@earthlink.net> let us all know that:
>
> >'The fool says in his heart, 'There is no God.' " Psalm 53:1, Psalm
> >14:1.
>
> Anyone who says to another "you fool" shall be liable to burn in
> hellfire. Matt 5:22.
>
> Contradiction!
>
> MINI-FAQ: Psalms 14:1
>
> "The fool has said in his heart, 'There is no God.' They are corrupt,
> they
> have done abominable works, there is none that does good."" (Psalms
> 14:1)
The Popester sez ( not knowing what the hell he's tlaking about 24% of the
time , but beware the other 78%)
.....
An attempt to point out false or emotional rhetorical techniques to Dook is
like giving a Calculus proof to a third grader who make an arithmetic
mistake. (innapropriate analogy)
But even so, a condition of humanity is that effective argumentation depends
on use of shady rhetoric . ( metaphor on the word "Shady",using personal
opinion )
Anyone NOT using things in the list of fallacies will generate a response
of SLEEP to the listener.
I contend that Fallacies are fun, and usually a person pointing out
percieved fallacies is setting him(R)self for artillery practice by
effective communicators, usually reducing the whole argument to a comedy
skit to the delight of the audience.
(Starting out with calling the fallacy purist "Mr Spock" hoping to
sidetrack the whole thing into a comical putdown of the style and content of
their opponent)
As a (re)formed debate judge many years ago, I would have to give you about
20 snore points for overkill
>
> AD HOMINEM FALLACY: An argument is discounted based on attacking the
> character of the person making the argument. ("He is wrong when he
> says there is no God, because he is a fool.")
This applies only to the last of the three scriptures you have quoted.
Psalm 53:1 is not "Ad hominem", because the term "Fool" applies to the
structure of the argument or to the assertion that the opponent is not able
to use effective rhetoric, as established by other means.
What's reall happening IMO was that the writer of the verse was conveying an
opinion that an assertion contrary to his own ideas is foolish.
I don't see how the Matthew 5:22 argument is relevant here in any case.
I understand that the original term is "raca", is some kind of an insult of
unclear exact emotional tone to English speakers
It is a moronic ( foolish) use of scripture to mean that the English word
"Fool" is a magic word that brings evil consequences to the utterer.
the scripture fares slightly better in full context.
however the distinction of why "Fool" (not raca) is worse is not made clear
and open to interpretation.
It is consistent with MY OWN views to assume that Christ or whoever wrote
this was to say that it's uncool to insult people but you must not make a
judgement as to their worth as a human being..
NIV gives:
..
Matthew 5
22But I tell you that anyone who is angry with his brother[1] will be
subject to judgment. Again, anyone who says to his brother, 'Raca,[2] ' is
answerable to the Sanhedrin. But anyone who says, 'You fool!' will be in
danger of the fire of hell.
Footnotes
2 5:22 An Aramaic term of contempt
> STRAWMAN FALLACY: Arguing against a postion by creating a different,
> weaker, or irrelevant position and refuting that position instead of
> the original. ("There is no God" misrepresents "There isn't sufficient
> evidence that God exists.")
Again, used accurately here, but IMO the scriptural author did not intend to
put down skeptics, but Athiests.
> CIRCULAR REASONING: The truth of the conclusion is assumed in order
> to justify the premises. ("The fool says there is no God, because
> anyone who says there is no God is a fool.")
The two verses use together in this manner are indeed circular, but since
when do Funny Mentalists care about Logic??
> BEGGING THE QUESTION: The argument creates a secondary proposition
> that is related to the primary proposition, which requires a similar
> argument that is missing. (The existence of God is assumed, while
> addressing propositions of whether God exists.)
Thank you for this!!
One of my pet peeves is the popular misuse of "begging the question" to mean
"Suggest that a new question or side topic be introduced".
a real teeth-gritter!!
>
> FALLACY OF INCONSISTENCY: The argument is inconsistent with other
> arguments within the same context. (In the Christian context, Jesus
> commands against the invective in Psalms 14:1, warning that "whoever
> says 'You fool!' shall be liable to the hell of fire" in Matthew
> 5:22.)
>
> SPECIAL PLEADING: The inappropriate attribution of emotive functions
> to objects that do not have that capability. (Hearts are not capable
> of "knowing" or of feeling emotions.)
>
> REDUNDANCY: Psalm 53 is identical to Psalm 14.
>
> QUESTIONABLE PREMISE: It is obviously not the case that all atheists
> do nothing but bad deeds. This premise is invalidated by a single
> example of an atheist doing a single charitable act.
>
> Wayne Delia, red...@ibm.net, Atheist #61, MSTie #37634
>
> Don
> ---
> aa #51, Knight of BAAWA, DNRC o-, Member of the [H]orde
> Atheist Minister for St. Dogbert.
>
> "No being is so important that he can usurp the rights of another"
> Picard to Data/Graves "The Schizoid Man"
Pope Bobby II
69th Clench of the Stark Fist of Removal
Reformed Church of the Subgenius.
Bob Pease
"Steve Knight" <wo...@onic.net> wrote in message
news:s4dmdv8aret1dmm9p...@4ax.com...
We don't celebrate Xmas in our household, for different reasons.
I think the name should be changed to
"AMMO"
(American Mad Merchandising Orgy)
Popester
phobos
(nothing of interest)
I thought the atheist holiday was the Feast of Maximum Occupancy?
Ghost Rider
>
> "Don Kresch" <ROT13....@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote in message
> news:jkdmdvcr8jcmguhv2...@4ax.com...
>> In alt.atheism on Mon, 02 Jun 2003 11:02:55 GMT, duke32
>> <duk...@earthlink.net> let us all know that:
>>
>> >'The fool says in his heart, 'There is no God.' " Psalm 53:1, Psalm
>> >14:1.
>>
>> Anyone who says to another "you fool" shall be liable to burn in
>> hellfire. Matt 5:22.
>>
>> Contradiction!
>>
>> MINI-FAQ: Psalms 14:1
>>
>> "The fool has said in his heart, 'There is no God.' They are corrupt,
>> they have done abominable works, there is none that does good.""
>> (Psalms 14:1)
>
> The Popester sez ( not knowing what the hell he's tlaking about 24% of
> the time , but beware the other 78%)
>
So the Pope gets 102%?
Bob Pease
"Ghost Rider" <ghos...@ghost.com> wrote in message
news:Xns938E5E391C456...@127.0.0.1...
> One fine day in alt.atheism, Bob Pease fired a few neurons and wrote:
>
> >
> > "Don Kresch" <ROT13....@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote in message
> > news:jkdmdvcr8jcmguhv2...@4ax.com...
> >> In alt.atheism on Mon, 02 Jun 2003 11:02:55 GMT, duke32
> >> <duk...@earthlink.net> let us all know that:
> >>
> >> >'The fool says in his heart, 'There is no God.' " Psalm 53:1, Psalm
> >> >14:1.
> >>
> >> Anyone who says to another "you fool" shall be liable to burn in
> >> hellfire. Matt 5:22.
> >>
> >> Contradiction!
> >>
> >> MINI-FAQ: Psalms 14:1
> >>
> >> "The fool has said in his heart, 'There is no God.' They are corrupt,
> >> they have done abominable works, there is none that does good.""
> >> (Psalms 14:1)
> >
> > The Popester sez ( not knowing what the hell he's tlaking about 24% of
> > the time , but beware the other 78%)
> >
>
> So the Pope gets 102%?
Gotcha!!
(Feed me a straight line, Clem!!)
Actually this is a condition known as Overlap.
No dirty puns, please!!
The following actually happened.
About ten of us after a celebration of a wedding in Colorado Springs were
having a few Champagnes or Guinnesses or whatever.
Someone opened a bottle of champagne which spouted some drops on the
ceiling.
Then speculation broke out about what the next tenants would think of the
spots on the ceiling..
Without cue, we all broke out into the song
"WE SHALL OVERCOME.."
Popester
Mark Gradwell
"duke32" <duk...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:smbmdv0p91q21se19...@4ax.com...
>
> Atheist Holiday
>
> An atheist was quite incensed over the preparation for Easter and
> Passover holidays and decided to contact the local ACLU about the
> discrimination inflicted on atheists by the constant celebrations
> afforded to Christians and Jews with all their holidays while the
> atheists had no holidays for them to celebrate.
>
> The ACLU jumped on the opportunity to once again pick up the cause of
> the downtrodden and assigned their sharpest attorney to the case. The
> case was brought up before a learned judge who after listening to the
> passionate presentation by the ACLU representative promptly banged his
> gavel and said, "Case dismissed!"
>
> The ACLU lawyer stood up and objected to the ruling and said, "Your
> honor, how can you dismiss this case? Surely the Christians have
> Christmas, Easter and many other observances, and the Jews. In
> addition to Passover, they have Yom Kippur and Hanukkah, and yet my
> client and all other atheists have no such holiday!"
>
> The judge leaned back in his chair and simply said, "Obviously your
> client is too confused to know about, or for that matter, even
> celebrate the atheists holiday!"
>
> The ACLU lawyer pompously said, "We are aware of no such holiday for
> atheists...just when might that be?"
>
> The judge said, "Well, it comes every year at the same time - April
> 1st.
Suits me. Get it sorted. Nice early spring day like that all to meself and
paid to do nowt. Anyway if I can get a holiday on April 1st just because I'm
an atheist it really makes fools of theists now then doesn't it;o).
>
> 'The fool says in his heart, 'There is no God.' " Psalm 53:1, Psalm
> 14:1.
>
> duke, American-American
> *****
> First Principle and Foundation: Man was created
> to praise, reverence, and serve God, and by this
> means to save his soul; and the other things on
> the face of the earth were created for man's sake,
> and in order to aid him in the prosecution of the
> end for which he was created.
> *****
--
Yours,
Mark
aa#1478
Daniel Kolle
>'The fool says in his heart, 'There is no God.' " Psalm 53:1, Psalm
>14:1.
Fool, of course, refers to those who are "morally deficient".
--
-Kolle; 15 A.A. #2035
Koji Kondo, Yo-Yo Ma, and Gustav Mahler are my Gods.
"May the worms of death lay eggs in your blind eyes!"
-Skywise
duke32
wrote:
>>Atheist Holiday
>Hey Jackass, how do you feel about the fact that all your major christian
>holidays aren't even christian in origin?
>Robyn
Sure they are Christain in origin. We picked our desired days and
celebrated something of value on them.
duke32
wrote:
>Actually wouldn't it be Judaism, since that line is from the
>Tanakh? After all, the NT says calling people a fool puts
>one at risk of hellfire. . .
Not if he is being truthful.
Happy next holiday.
Robibnikoff
>
>On Mon, 02 Jun 2003 12:41:57 GMT, Robibnikoff <nos...@newsranger.com>
>wrote:
>
>>>Atheist Holiday
>
>>Hey Jackass, how do you feel about the fact that all your major christian
>>holidays aren't even christian in origin?
>>Robyn
>
>Sure they are Christain in origin. We picked our desired days and
>celebrated something of value on them.
Please explain how Christmas (originally the Pagan Winter Soltice) and
Easter(originally Ostre, Pagan fertility festival) are christian in origin.
Also, please explain how all of the traditions associated with said holidays are
also christian in origin.
And while you're at it, please provide evidence that Jesus was born on December
25th.
The other Donald
Christmas is a bastardized version of the Pagan Celebration of the Winter
Solstice, combined with several other pagan traditions: Christmas and the
Star of Bethlehem. - There is no historical evidence that Christ was born on
December 25th. December 25th was officially adopted by Bishop Liberius of
Rome in 354. December 25th occurs during the rainy season in the Holy Land,
so it is highly unlikely that shepherds would be outside in their pastures.
The Hayden Planetarium in New York recreated the heavens as they were in the
time that Christ was allegedly born. Although nothing spectacular happened
in the skies on the date of Christ's birth, the Planetarium went back to the
year 6 B.C. On that date, there were three stars in close proximity which
created a spectacularly bright beacon, which may account for the stories of
the Star of Bethlehem. The most plausible reason that December 25 was chosen
as a day to celebrate Christ's birth was that the Christian fathers were
trying to compete with another growing religion, Mithraism - the worship of
a sun god - whose holy day was also December 25.
Easter - The name "Easter' derives from Eostre, the Anglo-Saxon dawn
goddess. She was traditionally honored at the beginning of spring. Easter
wasn't celebrated in North America until after the Civil War when religious
leaders decided that the country needed a holiday which stressed rebirth.
http://www.islandnet.com/~luree/silly.html
Here is the "Top 10 Pagan Concepts in Christianity:"
http://web.gnu.walfield.org/mail-archive/sinai/2000-July/0005.html
Your entire "story" (court appearance) was nothing more than another story
concocted by the blood-cult idiots to try to lower atheists to their level.
It fails miserably.
It wouldn't surprise me if a few years from now if your "story" took on a
life of its own as an "Urban Myth."
-Donald
AA #2104
"duke32" <duk...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:215ndv4tre2ddor0e...@4ax.com...
david asman
duke32 wrote:
> On Mon, 02 Jun 2003 10:46:34 -0400, david asman <das...@wayne.edu>
> wrote:
>
> >Actually wouldn't it be Judaism, since that line is from the
> >Tanakh? After all, the NT says calling people a fool puts
> >one at risk of hellfire. . .
>
> Not if he is being truthful.
>
> Happy next holiday.
>
> duke, American-American
Mt 5:22 (NAS)
"But I say to you that everyone who is angry with his brother shall be
guilty before thecourt; and whoever says to his brother, `You
good-for-nothing,' shall be guilty before the supreme court; and
whoever says, `You fool,' shall be guilty enough to go into the fiery
hell."
I see no mention of how the statements accuracy, or lack thereof, has
any effect on the eternal implications of making the statement.
Dave
Darklady
"Robibnikoff" <nos...@newsranger.com> wrote in message
news:99NCa.7230$95....@www.newsranger.com...
I think the answer has something to do with might vs. right. The
Christians kicked the asses of the pagans, stole their holidays fair and
square, and not feel they have the right to re-write history to their
liking. Thus, all holidays practiced by Christians, regardless of origin,
are and have always been Christian.
Frankly, as an atheist and a human being, I don't feel the need to have
a "holiday" from reality. I like the world as it is just fine and celebrate
the precious things in life on a daily basis. I focus special attention on
days and events of particular importance to me and mine: birthdays,
anniversaries, periods of important transition, the changing of the seasons,
celebrations of accomplishment, gatherings to mourn and honor loss, etc. And
I don't ask the government to finance them, promote them, or endorse them.
Nor do I ask for the day off or demand public celebration.
--
-- Darklady
http://www.darklady.com
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Dark-Lady
http://www.masturbate-a-thon.org
Darklady
"Gregory A Greenman" <s...@sig.below> wrote in message
news:MPG.19450f38e...@netnews.attbi.com...
> In article <smbmdv0p91q21se19...@4ax.com>,
> duk...@earthlink.net says...
> >
> > Atheist Holiday
> >
>
>
>
> Well that convinced me. Some asshole called me a fool.
> Obviously, the only reasonable response is to convert to
> christianity.
If he's right about you being a fool, then yes, that would be the only
reasonable response. ;)
Douglas Berry
Pease" <bobnosp...@concentric.net> warmed at our fire and told
this tale:
>We don't celebrate Xmas in our household, for different reasons.
We just celebrate "Winter." and have a party for all our friends.
--
Douglas E. Berry grid...@mindspring.com
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/
"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as
when they do it from religious conviction."
Blaise Pascal (1623-1662), Pense'es, #894.
Douglas Berry
duke32 <duk...@earthlink.net> warmed at our fire and told this tale:
>Sure they are Christain in origin. We picked our desired days and
>celebrated something of value on them.
Which just happened to be on top of Pagan holidays.
Hell, Easter is the name of a Celtic Goddess!
You religion has nothing original. Probably why it became so
popular.. no new rituals, just learn a few new names!
The other Donald
"Douglas Berry" <grid...@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:6ihndvcevlqkkut33...@4ax.com...
raven1
>'The fool says in his heart, 'There is no God.' "
Two responses:]
"The wise man proclaims it openly", or
"If even a fool can figure it out, what's your excuse?"
The other Donald
Never heard those before, and I certainly need to remember the second one
for future reference.
"raven1" <psyched...@flashmail.com> wrote in message
news:bmlndv0vmhekbkdmv...@4ax.com...
Ghost Rider
>
> "Ghost Rider" <ghos...@ghost.com> wrote in message
> news:Xns938E5E391C456...@127.0.0.1...
>>
>> So the Pope gets 102%?
>
> Gotcha!!
> (Feed me a straight line, Clem!!)
>
> Actually this is a condition known as Overlap.
> No dirty puns, please!!
>
> The following actually happened.
>
> About ten of us after a celebration of a wedding in Colorado Springs
> were having a few Champagnes or Guinnesses or whatever.
>
> Someone opened a bottle of champagne which spouted some drops on the
> ceiling.
>
> Then speculation broke out about what the next tenants would think of
> the spots on the ceiling..
> Without cue, we all broke out into the song
>
> "WE SHALL OVERCOME.."
>
> Popester
>
>
Ooooo-kay. THAT explains it....
--
Ghost Rider
aa # 2011
EAC Nonexistent Director of Alcohol, Tobacco and Bad Puns
rm - '03 Yamaha V-Star 650 Custom
"How can you just obey?"
Ghost Rider
>
> And while you're at it, please provide evidence that Jesus was born on
> December 25th.
>
(piggybacking)
Good shot!
Here are a few others, purported to have been born on December 25.
Horus of Egypt (remember silly Horus, Puke?)
Dionysus/Bacchus
Attis of Phrygia
Krishna of India
Mithra of Persia
Buddha
Christianity isn't even an original myth. Grow up, Puke.
Douglas Berry
other Donald" <the_do...@yahoo.com> warmed at our fire and told
this tale:
>Not to mention the paid Federal Holidays...
In the services, they are starting to realize that different soldiers
have different needs. There are pagan troops who get things like
Samhain as religious observences, meaning they are not assigned to
duties if possible.
I enjoyed Christian holidays.. I made out like a thief taking other
peoples' guard and CQ duties on Christmas and the like.
chibiabos
> On Mon, 02 Jun 2003 12:41:57 GMT, Robibnikoff <nos...@newsranger.com>
> wrote:
>
> >>Atheist Holiday
>
> >Hey Jackass, how do you feel about the fact that all your major christian
> >holidays aren't even christian in origin?
> >Robyn
>
> Sure they are Christain in origin. We picked our desired days and
> celebrated something of value on them.
Wait a minute. I thought the original purpose of Easter was to
celebrate the existence of the vulva.
Oh. I forgot. You've never seen one.
That makes you an avulvaist.
-chib
--
Member of SMASH:
Sarcastic Middle-aged Atheists with a Sense of Humor
(email: change out to in)
Wayne Delia
> "Don Kresch" <ROT13....@jv.ee.pbz.com> wrote in message
> news:jkdmdvcr8jcmguhv2...@4ax.com...
> > In alt.atheism on Mon, 02 Jun 2003 11:02:55 GMT, duke32
> > <duk...@earthlink.net> let us all know that:
> >
> > >'The fool says in his heart, 'There is no God.' " Psalm 53:1, Psalm
> > >14:1.
> >
> > Anyone who says to another "you fool" shall be liable to burn in
> > hellfire. Matt 5:22.
> >
> > Contradiction!
> >
> > MINI-FAQ: Psalms 14:1
That sounds familiar! Where have I heard that before? :-)
> > "The fool has said in his heart, 'There is no God.' They are corrupt,
> > they
> > have done abominable works, there is none that does good."" (Psalms
> > 14:1)
>
> The Popester sez ( not knowing what the hell he's tlaking about 24% of the
> time , but beware the other 78%)
That's pretty cool. Reminds me of Yogi Berra - "90% of the game is
half mental."
> .....
> An attempt to point out false or emotional rhetorical techniques to Dook is
> like giving a Calculus proof to a third grader who make an arithmetic
> mistake. (innapropriate analogy)
duke32, as in errrrrrrl weber? He's a certified net.kook, just good
for comic relief.
> But even so, a condition of humanity is that effective argumentation depends
> on use of shady rhetoric . ( metaphor on the word "Shady",using personal
> opinion )
Effective - maybe. Valid? No. That's why they call 'em "logical
fallacies" - because a mistake is being made.
> Anyone NOT using things in the list of fallacies will generate a response
> of SLEEP to the listener.
There are audiences who can manage to stay awake during fallacy-free
arguments, though.
> I contend that Fallacies are fun, and usually a person pointing out
> percieved fallacies is setting him(R)self for artillery practice by
> effective communicators, usually reducing the whole argument to a comedy
> skit to the delight of the audience.
Sure, in the case of people like Jeff "Dial-A-Fallacy" Young, who
responded to any statement made by any atheist with his favorite
logical fallacy-du-jour. But in this case, if the shoe fits, the Bible
wears it.
> (Starting out with calling the fallacy purist "Mr Spock" hoping to
> sidetrack the whole thing into a comical putdown of the style and content of
> their opponent)
Isn't that the textbook definition of an ad hominem logical fallacy?
Or is it the case that the most entertaining argument is necessarily
the most valid?
> As a (re)formed debate judge many years ago, I would have to give you about
> 20 snore points for overkill
But you said earlier "I contend that Fallacies are fun." Was that part
of your scoring criteria?
> > AD HOMINEM FALLACY: An argument is discounted based on attacking the
> > character of the person making the argument. ("He is wrong when he
> > says there is no God, because he is a fool.")
>
> This applies only to the last of the three scriptures you have quoted.
Can you be more specific? Which reference?
> Psalm 53:1 is not "Ad hominem", because the term "Fool" applies to the
> structure of the argument or to the assertion that the opponent is not able
> to use effective rhetoric, as established by other means.
Absolutely not. Making the substitution, the verse now reads "The
structure of the argument has said in his heart, There is no God."
That's absurd. The term "fool" does not apply to the structure of the
argument nor to the assertion you cited; it clearly and directly
applies to the person (hence, "ad hominem") who holds the position
that there is no God.
> What's reall happening IMO was that the writer of the verse was conveying an
> opinion that an assertion contrary to his own ideas is foolish.
Again, that's trivially wrong. The verse reads "The fool says in his
heart, there is no God," and not "The person who says in his heart,
there is no God, holds a foolish position." The psalmist uses the term
fool clearly to refer to the person, not to the argument.
> I don't see how the Matthew 5:22 argument is relevant here in any case.
I'd be happy to explain it to you.
> I understand that the original term is "raca", is some kind of an insult of
> unclear exact emotional tone to English speakers
Yes, it certainly is. But there are three things warned about in
Matthew 5:22. First, anyone who is angry with his brother will receive
judgement. Second, anyone who says "raca" to his brother will be
subject to the Sanhedrin. That's what you're referring to. But what
I'm referring to is the third part, in which anyone who says "You
fool" will be in danger of the fire of hell.
> It is a moronic ( foolish) use of scripture to mean that the English word
> "Fool" is a magic word that brings evil consequences to the utterer.
Absolutely, of course. The problem for Christians is that Jesus made
that moronic comment.
> the scripture fares slightly better in full context.
> however the distinction of why "Fool" (not raca) is worse is not made clear
> and open to interpretation.
Beats me as well, especially in light of the psalmist's use of the
term to describe unbelievers. More of Jesus's hyperbole, I presume,
which inerrantists have a hard time defending.
> It is consistent with MY OWN views to assume that Christ or whoever wrote
> this was to say that it's uncool to insult people but you must not make a
> judgement as to their worth as a human being..
"Uncool" in the extreme! (fires of hell, ba-doom ching!)
> NIV gives:
>
> ..
> Matthew 5
> 22But I tell you that anyone who is angry with his brother[1] will be
> subject to judgment. Again, anyone who says to his brother, 'Raca,[2] ' is
> answerable to the Sanhedrin. But anyone who says, 'You fool!' will be in
> danger of the fire of hell.
>
> Footnotes
> 2 5:22 An Aramaic term of contempt
Yes. The inconsistency, in the Christian paradigm, is that the
psalmist calls unbelievers "fools", while Jesus says anyone (including
the psalmist?) who says "You fool" is in danger of the fires of hell.
Incidentally, since errrrl weber is involved in this exchange, I had
him on the ropes when he called me a fool once. He's in danger of the
fires of hell, I guess, if he takes his own theology seriously.
> > STRAWMAN FALLACY: Arguing against a postion by creating a different,
> > weaker, or irrelevant position and refuting that position instead of
> > the original. ("There is no God" misrepresents "There isn't sufficient
> > evidence that God exists.")
>
> Again, used accurately here, but IMO the scriptural author did not intend to
> put down skeptics, but Athiests.
Exactly my point. Atheists withhold belief in gods of any kind. A
subset of atheists maintain the belief that there are no gods. I'm the
type of atheist who withholds belief in gods of any kind based on the
lack of sufficient evidence that any exist.
> > CIRCULAR REASONING: The truth of the conclusion is assumed in order
> > to justify the premises. ("The fool says there is no God, because
> > anyone who says there is no God is a fool.")
>
> The two verses use together in this manner are indeed circular, but since
> when do Funny Mentalists care about Logic??
They care very deeply about logic when they try to apply Pascal's
Wager! :-)
> > BEGGING THE QUESTION: The argument creates a secondary proposition
> > that is related to the primary proposition, which requires a similar
> > argument that is missing. (The existence of God is assumed, while
> > addressing propositions of whether God exists.)
>
> Thank you for this!!
> One of my pet peeves is the popular misuse of "begging the question" to mean
> "Suggest that a new question or side topic be introduced".
> a real teeth-gritter!!
Yeah. I had a professor of logic and rhetoric at Clarkson who gave me
the advice that if you want to accuse someone of begging the question,
always point out exactly what question they are begging.
> > FALLACY OF INCONSISTENCY: The argument is inconsistent with other
> > arguments within the same context. (In the Christian context, Jesus
> > commands against the invective in Psalms 14:1, warning that "whoever
> > says 'You fool!' shall be liable to the hell of fire" in Matthew
> > 5:22.)
> >
> > SPECIAL PLEADING: The inappropriate attribution of emotive functions
> > to objects that do not have that capability. (Hearts are not capable
> > of "knowing" or of feeling emotions.)
> >
> > REDUNDANCY: Psalm 53 is identical to Psalm 14.
> >
> > QUESTIONABLE PREMISE: It is obviously not the case that all atheists
> > do nothing but bad deeds. This premise is invalidated by a single
> > example of an atheist doing a single charitable act.
> >
> > Wayne Delia, red...@ibm.net, Atheist #61, MSTie #37634
Haven't used red...@ibm.net in quite some time; not even sure if the
ibm.net service is still available.
> > Don
> > ---
> > aa #51, Knight of BAAWA, DNRC o-, Member of the [H]orde
> > Atheist Minister for St. Dogbert.
> >
> > "No being is so important that he can usurp the rights of another"
> > Picard to Data/Graves "The Schizoid Man"
>
> Pope Bobby II
> 69th Clench of the Stark Fist of Removal
> Reformed Church of the Subgenius.
SLACK!
Wayne Delia, via groups.google.com
Bob Pease
Thanks for your response.. My comments are sandwiched.
"Wayne Delia" <wayne...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:a6f49994.03060...@posting.google.com...
> "Bob Pease" <bobnosp...@concentric.net> wrote in message
news:<bbfqmq$d...@dispatch.concentric.net>...
.....
Valid, schmalid.
the point of rhetoric is to manipulate the listener so that he/she feels
good about what you said, and might even give your opinions which differ
from his a second thought later because he was delighted in some way with
your presentation.
> > As a (re)formed debate judge many years ago, I would have to give you
about
> > 20 snore points for overkill
>
> But you said earlier "I contend that Fallacies are fun." Was that part
> of your scoring criteria?
fallacies are fun to USE , and even more fun to adhominize people who point
them out.
Anyone who turns a curious shade of puce and sputters has effectively lost
an argument, valid points or no.
>
> > > AD HOMINEM FALLACY: An argument is discounted based on attacking the
> > > character of the person making the argument. ("He is wrong when he
> > > says there is no God, because he is a fool.")
> >
> > This applies only to the last of the three scriptures you have quoted.
>
> Can you be more specific? Which reference?
>
> > Psalm 53:1 is not "Ad hominem", because the term "Fool" applies to the
> > structure of the argument or to the assertion that the opponent is not
able
> > to use effective rhetoric, as established by other means.
>
> Absolutely not. Making the substitution, the verse now reads "The
> structure of the argument has said in his heart, There is no God."
> That's absurd. The term "fool" does not apply to the structure of the
> argument nor to the assertion you cited; it clearly and directly
> applies to the person (hence, "ad hominem") who holds the position
> that there is no God.
I still contend that the use of "Ad hominem" needs to refer to an irlevant
trait, not the fact that your are contending that he is saying it because he
is not structuring his argument to your standards.
To clarify this ..a classical "Ad Hominem" is
Clifton Fadiman/?
How could a dolt like him ever be a good bridge player??
If the tem "illogical" were substituted for "dolt", then the attack would be
an appropriate salvo at his ability to structure arguments correctly.
Personally, I think "Ad hominems" on guys like Ken Ham and Kent Hovind who
have a track record of irrational raves presented as TROOTH, are OK,
"Check out this guy's OTHER stuff, this is the guy who says Noah had a 500
year rard sale to raise money to buy gopher woodand then tell me if you are
going to spend much time on his present point..
Technically a fallacy, but you can make folks dance ..
RP
> > What's reall happening IMO was that the writer of the verse was
conveying an
> > opinion that an assertion contrary to his own ideas is foolish.
WD
Uncool means the sanhedrin kick your butt in this example.
The term "fool" ( supposedly an approximation of the culturally equivalent
Hebrew or Greek word ( I always have doubts about how close they ever come,
as that's the topic of a whole book by Doug Hofstadter) looks to me like it
is a term judging the worth of a person, rather than just an insult.
I'm too lazy to look up the original but it wouldn't matter, because the
cultural connotation filter still applies and Seinfeld in on now!
ciao
slackback atcha
Popester
duke32
wrote:
>I see no mention of how the statements accuracy, or lack thereof, has
>any effect on the eternal implications of making the statement.
>Dave
I guess we agree.
duke, American-American
duke32
wrote:
>Please explain how Christmas (originally the Pagan Winter Soltice) and
>Easter(originally Ostre, Pagan fertility festival) are christian in origin.
That's not what I said.
Many days/months are dual-directed. We picked certain days relative
to our own Christian worship and ran with them.
>And while you're at it, please provide evidence that Jesus was born on December
>25th.
It's the day we chose to celebrate his birth. Something worthwhile to
do on the Winter Soltice.
Most estimate the birth of Jesus somewhere between 4BC and 4AD or
thereabouts (I think).
duke32
wrote:
> I think the answer has something to do with might vs. right. The
>Christians kicked the asses of the pagans, stole their holidays fair and
>square, and not feel they have the right to re-write history to their
>liking. Thus, all holidays practiced by Christians, regardless of origin,
>are and have always been Christian.
Gee, for a few guys, we musta carried a big stick.
> Frankly, as an atheist and a human being, I don't feel the need to have
>a "holiday" from reality. I like the world as it is just fine and celebrate
>the precious things in life on a daily basis.
>I focus special attention on
>days and events of particular importance to me and mine: birthdays,
>anniversaries, periods of important transition, the changing of the seasons,
>celebrations of accomplishment, gatherings to mourn and honor loss, etc. And
You focus special attention on your own birthday, I focus on Jesus'
birthday.
A good atheist - always thinking of one's self.
>I don't ask the government to finance them, promote them, or endorse them.
>Nor do I ask for the day off or demand public celebration.
Neither does Christ. But we that believe do, and you atheists happily
take the day off too.
duke32
wrote:
>> And while you're at it, please provide evidence that Jesus was born on
>> December 25th.
>Good shot!
I had a better answer - Jesus was not born on December 25th.
>Here are a few others, purported to have been born on December 25.
>Horus of Egypt (remember silly Horus, Puke?)
>Dionysus/Bacchus
>Attis of Phrygia
>Krishna of India
>Mithra of Persia
>Buddha
>Christianity isn't even an original myth. Grow up, Puke.
That's quite right - it's not a myth at all.
duke32
<the_do...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>To Duke:
>Christmas is a bastardized version of the Pagan Celebration of the Winter
>Solstice, combined with several other pagan traditions: Christmas and the
>Star of Bethlehem. - There is no historical evidence that Christ was born on
>December 25th.
That's right.
>December 25th was officially adopted by Bishop Liberius of
>Rome in 354. December 25th occurs during the rainy season in the Holy Land,
>so it is highly unlikely that shepherds would be outside in their pastures.
>The Hayden Planetarium in New York recreated the heavens as they were in the
>time that Christ was allegedly born. Although nothing spectacular happened
>in the skies on the date of Christ's birth, the Planetarium went back to the
>year 6 B.C. On that date, there were three stars in close proximity which
>created a spectacularly bright beacon, which may account for the stories of
>the Star of Bethlehem.
I thought maybe 4BC to 4AD.
>The most plausible reason that December 25 was chosen
>as a day to celebrate Christ's birth was that the Christian fathers were
>trying to compete with another growing religion, Mithraism - the worship of
>a sun god - whose holy day was also December 25.
You're waaaaaaaay behind the times on mithra.
>Easter - The name "Easter' derives from Eostre, the Anglo-Saxon dawn
>goddess. She was traditionally honored at the beginning of spring. Easter
>wasn't celebrated in North America until after the Civil War when religious
>leaders decided that the country needed a holiday which stressed rebirth.
Thanks, other donald.
>Your entire "story" (court appearance) was nothing more than another story
>concocted by the blood-cult idiots to try to lower atheists to their level.
>It fails miserably.
????????
>It wouldn't surprise me if a few years from now if your "story" took on a
>life of its own as an "Urban Myth."
"My" story????????
duke32
<grid...@mindspring.com> wrote:
>>Sure they are Christain in origin. We picked our desired days and
>>celebrated something of value on them.
>Which just happened to be on top of Pagan holidays.
I guess the pagan beliefs were too weak to stand up to truth.
>Hell, Easter is the name of a Celtic Goddess!
Ever wonder why we dye hard-boiled eggs on Easter for the kids?
>You religion has nothing original. Probably why it became so
>popular.. no new rituals, just learn a few new names!
The pagans had *nothing* to offer compared to the Christian worship.
duke32
<the_do...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>Not to mention the paid Federal Holidays...
Come, come, other donald. Don't you realize that paid absence is
factored into the wage rate.
Peter Cassidy
<duk...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> On Mon, 02 Jun 2003 19:00:21 GMT, Robibnikoff <nos...@newsranger.com>
> wrote:
>
> >Please explain how Christmas (originally the Pagan Winter Soltice) and
> >Easter(originally Ostre, Pagan fertility festival) are christian in origin.
>
> That's not what I said.
Earl, you said; "Sure they are Christain [sic] in origin.". I think
it's fair to say that Christmas and Easter/Eostre are 'major Christian
holidays'.
> Many days/months are dual-directed. We picked certain days relative
> to our own Christian worship and ran with them.
How's that figure with December 25, then?
Read the letter from Pope Gregory to Abbot Mellitus (601 CE) regarding
such matters. It's interesting ....
> >And while you're at it, please provide evidence that Jesus was born on
> >December
> >25th.
>
> It's the day we chose to celebrate his birth. Something worthwhile to
> do on the Winter Soltice.
>
> Most estimate the birth of Jesus somewhere between 4BC and 4AD or
> thereabouts (I think).
You haven't answered the question.
> duke
Pete C
Therion Ware
GMT, duke32 <duk...@earthlink.net> brought the total lines of text
written about "Re: Atheist Holiday" to 28. I decided to observe the
following about them:
>On Mon, 02 Jun 2003 14:50:08 -0700, Douglas Berry
><grid...@mindspring.com> wrote:
>
>>>Sure they are Christain in origin. We picked our desired days and
>>>celebrated something of value on them.
>
>>Which just happened to be on top of Pagan holidays.
>
>I guess the pagan beliefs were too weak to stand up to truth.
>
>>Hell, Easter is the name of a Celtic Goddess!
>
>Ever wonder why we dye hard-boiled eggs on Easter for the kids?
>
>>You religion has nothing original. Probably why it became so
>>popular.. no new rituals, just learn a few new names!
>
>The pagans had *nothing* to offer compared to the Christian worship.
In my experience they have better parties and more intelligent
conversation.
--
"Do Unto Others As You Would Have Them Do Unto You."
- Attrib: Pauline Reage.
Inexpensive VHS & other video to CD/DVD conversion?
See: <http://www.Video2CD.com>. 35.00 gets your video on DVD.
all posts to this email address are automatically deleted without being read.
** atheist poster child #1 **
Peter Cassidy
<duk...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> On Mon, 02 Jun 2003 19:58:52 GMT, "Darklady" <dark...@darklady.com>
> wrote:
>
> > I think the answer has something to do with might vs. right. The
> >Christians kicked the asses of the pagans, stole their holidays fair and
> >square, and not feel they have the right to re-write history to their
> >liking. Thus, all holidays practiced by Christians, regardless of origin,
> >are and have always been Christian.
>
> Gee, for a few guys, we musta carried a big stick.
Not really, but the winner in such matters gets to write the history
books.
> >I don't ask the government to finance them, promote them, or endorse them.
> >Nor do I ask for the day off or demand public celebration.
>
> Neither does Christ. But we that believe do,
Do what? Demand public celebration? Well, you got that about right ...
> and you atheists happily
> take the day off too.
Any Christians I know living in Singapore take the day off at Easter
*and* Diwali. Should they not?
> duke
Pete C
arjay
>On Mon, 02 Jun 2003 11:02:55 GMT, duke32 <duk...@earthlink.net> wrote:
>
>>'The fool says in his heart, 'There is no God.' "
>
>Two responses:]
>
>"The wise man proclaims it openly", or
Thanks for reminding me of that one.
>"If even a fool can figure it out, what's your excuse?"
This one's new to me. If it's your own coinage, congratulations.
arjay
Ubi dubium ibi libertas
>
>
arjay
>On Mon, 02 Jun 2003 18:45:15 GMT, a wanderer, known to us only as
>duke32 <duk...@earthlink.net> warmed at our fire and told this tale:
>
>>Sure they are Christain in origin. We picked our desired days and
>>celebrated something of value on them.
>
>Which just happened to be on top of Pagan holidays.
>
>Hell, Easter is the name of a Celtic Goddess!
>
>You religion has nothing original. Probably why it became so
>popular.. no new rituals, just learn a few new names!
Ever read a bed-time story to a pre-school child?
Hard to sell a story if it's never been heard before.
arjay
Ubi dubium ibi libertas
We should always be disposed to believe that which appears to us to be
white is really black, if the hierarchy of the church so decides.
-St. Ignatius Loyola (1500)
Robibnikoff
>
>On Mon, 02 Jun 2003 14:50:08 -0700, Douglas Berry
><grid...@mindspring.com> wrote:
>
>>>Sure they are Christain in origin. We picked our desired days and
>>>celebrated something of value on them.
>
>>Which just happened to be on top of Pagan holidays.
>
>I guess the pagan beliefs were too weak to stand up to truth.
LOL - Not at all; there are plenty of pagans out there. Thankfully YOUR
religion didn't manage to kill them all - despite their best efforts.
>>Hell, Easter is the name of a Celtic Goddess!
>
>Ever wonder why we dye hard-boiled eggs on Easter for the kids?
Not at all - I KNOW why. Why do you think it's done? (and it doesn't have
anything to do with the RCC or Jesus)
>
>>You religion has nothing original. Probably why it became so
>>popular.. no new rituals, just learn a few new names!
>
>The pagans had *nothing* to offer compared to the Christian worship.
There is your mere opinion.
Robyn
Resident Witchypoo & EAC Spellcaster
#1557
Robibnikoff
>
>On Mon, 02 Jun 2003 19:00:21 GMT, Robibnikoff <nos...@newsranger.com>
>wrote:
>
>>Please explain how Christmas (originally the Pagan Winter Soltice) and
>>Easter(originally Ostre, Pagan fertility festival) are christian in origin.
>
>That's not what I said.
>
>Many days/months are dual-directed. We picked certain days relative
>to our own Christian worship and ran with them.
You need to do some research into your religion - your statement above is
incorrect.
>
>>And while you're at it, please provide evidence that Jesus was born on December
>>25th.
>
>It's the day we chose to celebrate his birth. Something worthwhile to
>do on the Winter Soltice.
Tell me, when you celebrate either one of these holidays, do you decorate with
all the original Pagan trappings?
The other Donald
"duke32" <duk...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:m1kpdvkcdmo8k69jv...@4ax.com...
>duke32: " 'My' story????????"
Yes, your story....the one about the atheist going to the ACLU. Or is that
story you posted just more Christer propaganda that you regurgitated?
Remember this post that started the thread:
news:smbmdv0p91q21se19...@4ax.com
Darklady
> On Mon, 02 Jun 2003 19:58:52 GMT, "Darklady" <dark...@darklady.com>
> wrote:
>
> > I think the answer has something to do with might vs. right. The
> >Christians kicked the asses of the pagans, stole their holidays fair and
> >square, and not feel they have the right to re-write history to their
> >liking. Thus, all holidays practiced by Christians, regardless of origin,
> >are and have always been Christian.
>
> Gee, for a few guys, we musta carried a big stick.
Where do you get this "for a few guys" nonsense?
This isn't a controversial idea that I've promoted as part of some
insideous atheist agenda, Duke. It's history. It was part of early
Christians doing two things: 1) using pagan festivals as cover for their own
Christian celebrations when they were the power minority and then 2)
converting pagan festivals into Christian celebrations once they became the
ruling power. The Catholic church has a long history of using the native
beliefs and holidays in order to ease the populous toward more Catholic
practices. This was recently cited by a priest doing outreach to Haitians
when it was discovered that he was incorporating voodoo beliefs into the
Catholic mass in order to get more Haitians and those with Haitian ancestory
into the RCC.
> > Frankly, as an atheist and a human being, I don't feel the need to
have
> >a "holiday" from reality. I like the world as it is just fine and
celebrate
> >the precious things in life on a daily basis.
>
> >I focus special attention on
> >days and events of particular importance to me and mine: birthdays,
> >anniversaries, periods of important transition, the changing of the
seasons,
> >celebrations of accomplishment, gatherings to mourn and honor loss, etc.
And
>
> You focus special attention on your own birthday, I focus on Jesus'
> birthday.
>
> A good atheist - always thinking of one's self.
Did I say only my own birthday? No. But since you wish to see me as
being selfish you only commented on that. I celebrate the births of my
friends and family and yes, I acknowledge my own birth and show appreciation
to my mother for being a big part of that. Having been dead three times I
gotta admit that having a birthday is a pretty big deal for me. On my
birthday I always think of a nice way to thank my friends for being part of
my life and I usually throw a party for them, which I attend since it's my
birthday.
Yup. Pretty selfish.
> >I don't ask the government to finance them, promote them, or endorse
them.
> >Nor do I ask for the day off or demand public celebration.
>
> Neither does Christ. But we that believe do, and you atheists happily
> take the day off too.
We're not talking about Christ here since he didn't celebrate Christmas.
We're talking about Christians, many of whom demand their religious holidays
off and want them to be national holidays promoted by the government and
supported by tax payer dollars.
I don't take your holidays off, btw. I work pretty much 365 days a year.
Even before I became self-employed I was willing to work on Easter and
Christmas and would fill in for the Christians who wanted the days off. It's
their holiday so I figure they should enjoy it. I have no animosity towards
them for that, as long as all other religious people can take their holidays
off, as well. And with that said, it might be nice to have an Ingersoll Day
for atheists to have off or something. <shrug>
> duke, American-American
Blithering-idiot would be more accurate.
-- Darklady
http://www.darklady.com
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Dark-Lady
http://www.masturbate-a-thon.org
Darklady
> On Mon, 02 Jun 2003 14:50:08 -0700, Douglas Berry
> <grid...@mindspring.com> wrote:
>
> >>Sure they are Christain in origin. We picked our desired days and
> >>celebrated something of value on them.
>
> >Which just happened to be on top of Pagan holidays.
>
> I guess the pagan beliefs were too weak to stand up to truth.
Or the pagans were too busy being killed. Do try to read a wee bit of
history before making stupid comments that you might have to eat someday.
> >Hell, Easter is the name of a Celtic Goddess!
>
> Ever wonder why we dye hard-boiled eggs on Easter for the kids?
Because they relate to the menstruation rituals practiced by the Celts,
of course. It is a lunar holiday, after all.
> >You religion has nothing original. Probably why it became so
> >popular.. no new rituals, just learn a few new names!
>
> The pagans had *nothing* to offer compared to the Christian worship.
Oh, please. The only thing worse than poor loser is a poor winner.
> duke, American-American
duke, Poor-Winner
--
Eric Pepke
> Hey Jackass, how do you feel about the fact that all your major christian
> holidays aren't even christian in origin?
Let alone the fact that the one that comes closest to having a Christian
origin is Halloween, along with All Saints' Day and All Souls' Day.
It's the only one that is clearly defined in terms of the Roman calendar,
and the practice of wearing costumes on the night before and going to
people's houses on commemerates secret Christians wearing disguises and
traveling to safe houses for gatherings on the first.
Douglas Berry
duke32 <duk...@earthlink.net> warmed at our fire and told this tale:
>On Mon, 02 Jun 2003 14:50:08 -0700, Douglas Berry
><grid...@mindspring.com> wrote:
>
>>>Sure they are Christain in origin. We picked our desired days and
>>>celebrated something of value on them.
>
>>Which just happened to be on top of Pagan holidays.
>
>I guess the pagan beliefs were too weak to stand up to truth.
No, it had something to do with massacres. In the Norse countries,
the standard was to send in a few missionaries. When the residents
explained they were perfectly happy as they were, thank you, the
missionaries would leave.. only to come back with a band of solders
who would kill all but a handful and destroy the village. The lesson
was clear: convert or die.
>>Hell, Easter is the name of a Celtic Goddess!
>
>Ever wonder why we dye hard-boiled eggs on Easter for the kids?
And put up Christmas trees. I really alugh when I see Christers
getting all excited about Easter. I wonder if they know theylre
supposed to have an orgy?
>>You religion has nothing original. Probably why it became so
>>popular.. no new rituals, just learn a few new names!
>
>The pagans had *nothing* to offer compared to the Christian worship.
Other than peace, understanding and no guilt?
Douglas Berry
arjay <ar...@hobbiton.net> warmed at our fire and told this tale:
>Ever read a bed-time story to a pre-school child?
>Hard to sell a story if it's never been heard before.
Every been a professional writer? Stealing someone else's story and
claiming it as your own is plagiarism.
Darklady
"Eric Pepke" <epe...@acm.org> wrote in message
news:ef37f531.03060...@posting.google.com...
And, ironically, it's Halloween that so many Christians claim is an evil
and demonic holiday.
OldguyTeck
Actually I haven't put up a tree is some time now..
Of course we have the Nativity Scene each year.
When we did put up a tree I preffered the little angles and stars etc...
Nothing too fancy now mind ya LOL
Ed.....................(Oldguyteck)
OldguyTeck
Duke! Your gonna have to stop with the confuseing atheist. I mean don't they
have a hard enough time with all that high falootin 'free thinking' there
always talking bout..LOL
They seem to back off however when I ask them about the scientest
[Elusive-particle] Wonder why ?
Ed....................(Oldguyteck)
OldguyTeck
"The other Donald" <the_do...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:ou6Da.75844$ui.51...@twister.austin.rr.com...
bout the 'Greatest story EVER told'
Ed...............................(Oldguyteck)
OldguyTeck
"Douglas Berry" <grid...@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:7m2odv08i8qml1r0r...@4ax.com...
> On Mon, 02 Jun 2003 23:01:18 GMT, a wanderer, known to us only as "The
> other Donald" <the_do...@yahoo.com> warmed at our fire and told
> this tale:
>
> >Not to mention the paid Federal Holidays...
>
> have different needs. There are pagan troops who get things like
> Samhain as religious observences, meaning they are not assigned to
> duties if possible.
>
> I enjoyed Christian holidays.. I made out like a thief taking other
> peoples' guard and CQ duties on Christmas and the like.
Ahhh! Your still stationed then... How are things going ?
Ed.....................(Oldguyteck)
OldguyTeck
"Therion Ware" <autod...@city-of-dis.com> wrote in message
news:c5mpdvgtd8l2edj6u...@4ax.com...
> In alt.atheism (and doubtless elsewhere), on Tue, 03 Jun 2003 16:49:34
> GMT, duke32 <duk...@earthlink.net> brought the total lines of text
> written about "Re: Atheist Holiday" to 28. I decided to observe the
> following about them:
>
> >On Mon, 02 Jun 2003 14:50:08 -0700, Douglas Berry
> ><grid...@mindspring.com> wrote:
> >
> >>>Sure they are Christain in origin. We picked our desired days and
> >>>celebrated something of value on them.
> >
> >>Which just happened to be on top of Pagan holidays.
> >
> >I guess the pagan beliefs were too weak to stand up to truth.
> >
> >>Hell, Easter is the name of a Celtic Goddess!
> >
> >Ever wonder why we dye hard-boiled eggs on Easter for the kids?
> >
> >>You religion has nothing original. Probably why it became so
> >>popular.. no new rituals, just learn a few new names!
> >
> >The pagans had *nothing* to offer compared to the Christian worship.
>
> In my experience they have better parties and more intelligent
> conversation.
Even 'you' would have to admitt that is very debatable !
Wouldn't you @ least agree with me on that ?
Ed.....................(Oldguyteck)
OldguyTeck
> In article <0akpdvkvvb27cs22b...@4ax.com>, duke32 says...
> >
> >On Mon, 02 Jun 2003 14:50:08 -0700, Douglas Berry
> ><grid...@mindspring.com> wrote:
> >
> >>>Sure they are Christain in origin. We picked our desired days and
> >>>celebrated something of value on them.
> >
> >>Which just happened to be on top of Pagan holidays.
> >
> >I guess the pagan beliefs were too weak to stand up to truth.
>
> LOL - Not at all; there are plenty of pagans out there. Thankfully YOUR
> religion didn't manage to kill them all - despite their best efforts.
>
> >>Hell, Easter is the name of a Celtic Goddess!
> >
> >Ever wonder why we dye hard-boiled eggs on Easter for the kids?
>
> Not at all - I KNOW why. Why do you think it's done? (and it doesn't have
> anything to do with the RCC or Jesus)
So the chicks don't turn into baby rabbits ?
Ed..................(Oldguyteck)
> >
> >>You religion has nothing original. Probably why it became so
> >>popular.. no new rituals, just learn a few new names!
> >
> >The pagans had *nothing* to offer compared to the Christian worship.
>
> There is your mere opinion.
Don't believe that for a nano-second.
Now where is my [Elusive-particle] ?
OldguyTeck
"Darklady" <dark...@darklady.com> wrote in message
news:HI8Da.855556$Zo.195004@sccrnsc03...
>
> "duke32" <duk...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
> news:0akpdvkvvb27cs22b...@4ax.com...
> > On Mon, 02 Jun 2003 14:50:08 -0700, Douglas Berry
> > <grid...@mindspring.com> wrote:
> >
> > >>Sure they are Christain in origin. We picked our desired days and
> > >>celebrated something of value on them.
> >
> > >Which just happened to be on top of Pagan holidays.
> >
> > I guess the pagan beliefs were too weak to stand up to truth.
>
> Or the pagans were too busy being killed. Do try to read a wee bit of
> history before making stupid comments that you might have to eat someday.
Yet you 'claim' to be workng on it 48 - 7. So what's your excuse now ?
Are you devoting to much time to the 'smut' perhaps ?
Ed.....................(Oldguyteck)
>
> > >Hell, Easter is the name of a Celtic Goddess!
> >
> > Ever wonder why we dye hard-boiled eggs on Easter for the kids?
>
> Because they relate to the menstruation rituals practiced by the
Celts,
> of course. It is a lunar holiday, after all.
>
> > >You religion has nothing original. Probably why it became so
> > >popular.. no new rituals, just learn a few new names!
> >
> > The pagans had *nothing* to offer compared to the Christian worship.
>
> Oh, please. The only thing worse than poor loser is a poor winner.
>
> > duke, American-American
>
> duke, Poor-Winner
Stop the whineing......
Ed.................(OGT)
OldguyTeck
> On Tue, 03 Jun 2003 16:49:34 GMT, a wanderer, known to us only as
> duke32 <duk...@earthlink.net> warmed at our fire and told this tale:
>
> >On Mon, 02 Jun 2003 14:50:08 -0700, Douglas Berry
> ><grid...@mindspring.com> wrote:
> >
> >>>Sure they are Christain in origin. We picked our desired days and
> >>>celebrated something of value on them.
> >
> >>Which just happened to be on top of Pagan holidays.
> >
> >I guess the pagan beliefs were too weak to stand up to truth.
>
> No, it had something to do with massacres. In the Norse countries,
> the standard was to send in a few missionaries. When the residents
> explained they were perfectly happy as they were, thank you, the
> missionaries would leave.. only to come back with a band of solders
> who would kill all but a handful and destroy the village. The lesson
> was clear: convert or die.
>
> >>Hell, Easter is the name of a Celtic Goddess!
> >
> >Ever wonder why we dye hard-boiled eggs on Easter for the kids?
>
> And put up Christmas trees. I really alugh when I see Christers
> getting all excited about Easter. I wonder if they know theylre
> supposed to have an orgy?
>
> >>You religion has nothing original. Probably why it became so
> >>popular.. no new rituals, just learn a few new names!
> >
> >The pagans had *nothing* to offer compared to the Christian worship.
>
> Other than peace, understanding and no guilt?
Oh? How is it you don't seem to acknowledge that more human lives were
destroyed, killed in this century alone than in any and ALL theistic
actions....
On a scale never seen before..... Just though I'd jog that 'free-thinking'
[apparently asleep at present] mind of yours....LOL
Ed........................(Oldguyteck)
OldguyTeck
> On Tue, 03 Jun 2003 18:26:48 GMT, a wanderer, known to us only as
> arjay <ar...@hobbiton.net> warmed at our fire and told this tale:
>
> >Ever read a bed-time story to a pre-school child?
> >Hard to sell a story if it's never been heard before.
>
> Every been a professional writer? Stealing someone else's story and
> claiming it as your own is plagiarism.
Who's stealing......?
Ed..................(OGT)
OldguyTeck
"chibiabos" <ch...@outreach.com> wrote in message
news:020620031945527598%ch...@outreach.com...
> In article <215ndv4tre2ddor0e...@4ax.com>, duke32
> <duk...@earthlink.net> wrote:
>
> > On Mon, 02 Jun 2003 12:41:57 GMT, Robibnikoff <nos...@newsranger.com>
> > wrote:
> >
> > >>Atheist Holiday
> >
> > >Hey Jackass, how do you feel about the fact that all your major
christian
> > >holidays aren't even christian in origin?
> >
> > Sure they are Christain in origin. We picked our desired days and
> > celebrated something of value on them.
>
> celebrate the existence of the vulva.
>
> Oh. I forgot. You've never seen one.
>
> That makes you an avulvaist.
>
> -chib
Well like the 'atheist' so oft like to say..What you off your meds again ?
LOL
Now remember.. I'm just borrowing the phrase.
Not stealing it.. But I think it appropiate in this case if not many
others....
Your old pal...!
Ed.............................(Oldguyteck)
>
> --
> Member of SMASH:
> Sarcastic Middle-aged Atheists with a Sense of Humor
> (email: change out to in)
OldguyTeck
So here we have an avowed atheist confessing that the Christians 'had' to do
something to avoide 'persecution'
I think it was a wonderfull idea.. but am saddened that yes! Even in this
millinium we believers yet have to 'fight for our religiose freedoms'
Good day.
Ed......................(OGT)
OldguyTeck
>
> "Eric Pepke" <epe...@acm.org> wrote in message
> news:ef37f531.03060...@posting.google.com...
> > Robibnikoff <nos...@newsranger.com> wrote in message
> news:<pCHCa.7131$95....@www.newsranger.com>...
> > > Hey Jackass, how do you feel about the fact that all your major
> christian
> > > holidays aren't even christian in origin?
> >
> > Let alone the fact that the one that comes closest to having a Christian
> > origin is Halloween, along with All Saints' Day and All Souls' Day.
> > It's the only one that is clearly defined in terms of the Roman
calendar,
> > and the practice of wearing costumes on the night before and going to
> > people's houses on commemerates secret Christians wearing disguises and
> > traveling to safe houses for gatherings on the first.
>
> And, ironically, it's Halloween that so many Christians claim is an
evil
> and demonic holiday.
Apparently it does not take 'any' holiday to bring out the 'dark side' of
you eh ? LOL
Like ya said you work 48 - 7 on it !
Ed..............................(Oldguyteck)
OldguyTeck
"arjay" <ar...@hobbiton.net> wrote in message
news:30d961d707b5eb9a...@free.teranews.com...
Are you kiddng? New.. Nothing new about it..! I though @ least you would
have heard that one.. I know I did. and I though I has authored it.. I think
I was addressing an atheist that claimed to be a 'free-thinker' LOL
Ed.........................(Oldguyteck)
chibiabos
OldguyTeck <ec...@attbi.com> wrote:
> "chibiabos" <ch...@outreach.com> wrote in message
> news:020620031945527598%ch...@outreach.com...
> > In article <215ndv4tre2ddor0e...@4ax.com>, duke32
> > <duk...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> >
> > > On Mon, 02 Jun 2003 12:41:57 GMT, Robibnikoff <nos...@newsranger.com>
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > > >>Atheist Holiday
> > >
> > > >Hey Jackass, how do you feel about the fact that all your major
> christian
> > > >holidays aren't even christian in origin?
> > > >Robyn
> > >
> > > Sure they are Christain in origin. We picked our desired days and
> > > celebrated something of value on them.
> >
> > Wait a minute. I thought the original purpose of Easter was to
> > celebrate the existence of the vulva.
> >
> > Oh. I forgot. You've never seen one.
> >
> > That makes you an avulvaist.
> >
> > -chib
>
> Well like the 'atheist' so oft like to say..What you off your meds again ?
Completely sober. Do you disagree that there is anything more worthy of
worship than the human vulva? After all, you wouldn't be here if not
for one of those.
-chib
caillean mcmahon
duke32 wrote:
>
> I guess the pagan beliefs were too weak to stand up to truth.
>
We are still around Sir. We are the fastest growing faith in the States.
> >Hell, Easter is the name of a Celtic Goddess!
>
> Ever wonder why we dye hard-boiled eggs on Easter for the kids?
Actually decorating the eggs is a Pagan tradition Sir.
>
> >You religion has nothing original. Probably why it became so
> >popular.. no new rituals, just learn a few new names!
>
> The pagans had *nothing* to offer compared to the Christian worship.
We offer balance, the idea of stewardship and responsibility for the
world instead of conquest of it.
Blessings;
Caillean `aSiobhan, Lady Carrigaholt
>
> duke, American-American
> *****
> First Principle and Foundation: Man was created
> to praise, reverence, and serve Womyn, and by this
> means to save his soul
> *****
--
Today I am searching for it
A feeling that won't go away
Today I am searching for
The one that I only know
Trying to break free
I just can't help myself
I'm feeling like I'm going out of my head
Tears my soul into two
I'm not the one I thought I always knew
caillean mcmahon
duke32 wrote:
>
> I guess the pagan beliefs were too weak to stand up to truth.
Not really, however systematic extermination of Pagans and destruction
of their religious sites and ritual materials conducted on a far larger
scale thatn Diocletian's persecutions was indeed effective in driving us
underground, though the Catholic Church preserved enough of Pagan
practice to help with our re-birth.
For that, many thanks....
For the death squads led by John Chrysostom in Anatolia, we are still
waiting for an apology.
Blessings;
Caillean `aSiobhan, Lady Carrigaholt
>
> duke, American-American
> *****
> First Principle and Foundation: Man was created
> to praise, reverence, and serve God, and by this
> means to save his soul; and the other things on
> the face of the earth were created for man's sake,
> and in order to aid him in the prosecution of the
> end for which he was created.
caillean mcmahon
OldguyTeck wrote:
>
> "Therion Ware" <autod...@city-of-dis.com> wrote in message
> news:c5mpdvgtd8l2edj6u...@4ax.com...
> > In alt.atheism (and doubtless elsewhere), on Tue, 03 Jun 2003 16:49:34
> > GMT, duke32 <duk...@earthlink.net> brought the total lines of text
> > written about "Re: Atheist Holiday" to 28. I decided to observe the
> > following about them:
> >
> > >On Mon, 02 Jun 2003 14:50:08 -0700, Douglas Berry
> > ><grid...@mindspring.com> wrote:
> > >
> > >>>Sure they are Christain in origin. We picked our desired days and
> > >>>celebrated something of value on them.
> > >
> > >>Which just happened to be on top of Pagan holidays.
> > >
> > >I guess the pagan beliefs were too weak to stand up to truth.
> > >
> > >>Hell, Easter is the name of a Celtic Goddess!
> > >
> > >Ever wonder why we dye hard-boiled eggs on Easter for the kids?
> > >
> > >>You religion has nothing original. Probably why it became so
> > >>popular.. no new rituals, just learn a few new names!
> > >
> > >The pagans had *nothing* to offer compared to the Christian worship.
> >
> > In my experience they have better parties and more intelligent
> > conversation.
>
> Even 'you' would have to admitt that is very debatable !
>
> Wouldn't you @ least agree with me on that ?
>
> Ed.....................(Oldguyteck)
> >
My dear Edward;
In my own experience Parties hosted by Pagans have had a broader
intellectual and artistic mix and tend to be more fun, at least for an
acadamecian.
Blessings always(want an invite?)
Caillean `aSiobhan, Lady Carrigaholt
> >
> > --
> > "Do Unto Others As You Would Have Them Do Unto You."
> > - Attrib: Pauline Reage.
> > Inexpensive VHS & other video to CD/DVD conversion?
> > See: <http://www.Video2CD.com>. 35.00 gets your video on DVD.
> > all posts to this email address are automatically deleted without being
> read.
> > ** atheist poster child #1 **
--
caillean mcmahon
My dear Sir;
Most of the countries doing the killing in the last (20th) Century
were Christian- with the notable exception of Japan. In this century,
the countries that have fought more than one war in the century(21st)
are Christian, most notably, Great Britain. Theoretically, at least, the
US is not Christian though it is making ominous moves in that direction.
Blessings always Edward;
Caillean `aSiobhan, Lady Carrigaholt
> --
> >
> > Douglas E. Berry grid...@mindspring.com
> > http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/
> >
> > "Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as
> > when they do it from religious conviction."
> > Blaise Pascal (1623-1662), Pense'es, #894.
--
caillean mcmahon
Dear Edward;
Be very careful mentioning persecution. On Mons Vaticanus, Christians
murdered Pagan priestesses wholesale in their quarters on what is now
the site of the Casino Pio IV in the Vatican Gardens. John Chrysostom
led death squads through the mountains of Anatolia to kill off pagan
clergy and believers. By far, more Pagans died at Christian hands than
did Christians at Pagan hands during the Roman Empire.
Blessings;
Caillean `aSiobhan, Lady Carrigaholt
--
arjay
> On Tue, 03 Jun 2003 18:26:48 GMT, a wanderer, known to us only as
> arjay <ar...@hobbiton.net> warmed at our fire and told this tale:
>
> >Ever read a bed-time story to a pre-school child?
> >Hard to sell a story if it's never been heard before.
>
> Every been a professional writer?
In a manner of speaking, yes.
> Stealing someone else's story and
> claiming it as your own is plagiarism.
Yup.
But the kids (chronological and metaphorical) aren't big on checking sources.
And in the Levant, during the 1st century C.E., there were no copyrights laws
governing fantasy.
--
arjay
Ubi dubium ibi libertas
Where knowledge ends, religion begins.
-Benjamin Disraeli
Woden
news:3EDD6481...@gallae.com:
>
>
> duke32 wrote:
>
>>
>> I guess the pagan beliefs were too weak to stand up to truth.
> Not really, however systematic extermination of Pagans and destruction
> of their religious sites and ritual materials conducted on a far larger
> scale thatn Diocletian's persecutions was indeed effective in driving us
> underground, though the Catholic Church preserved enough of Pagan
> practice to help with our re-birth.
> For that, many thanks....
> For the death squads led by John Chrysostom in Anatolia, we are still
> waiting for an apology.
The expression, I believe appropriate is "When Hell freezes over".
--
Woden
"religion is a socio-political institution for the control of
people's thoughts, lives, and actions; based on
ancient myths and superstitions perpetrated through
generations of subtle yet pervasive brainwashing."
brian
"caillean mcmahon" <cail...@gallae.com> wrote in message
news:3EDD63BC...@gallae.com...
>
Piggy backing
Snipped alt.Atheism.
>
> duke32 wrote:
> >
>
> > I guess the pagan beliefs were too weak to stand up to truth.
Pagan beliefs have been around and consistent for over 20 thousand years in
some traditions, I E the Aborigines for one. Now as for the Pagans not
being strong. The Institutional Church "won" over the pagans using the
sword, the rope, the stake, intimidation, bribery, mass forced conversions.
It is noted that Pagans did the same thing to some extent when they were
dominate state religion. Funny Jesus said his kingdom is not of this Earth.
He also said if his Kingdom was of this Earth his followers would have
fought that he not be taken. One might conclude that he did not want his
followers to use the methods of "state sponsored" religion to convert
people.
It is true though Jesus has little or nothing do do with modern
Christianity.
Darklady
Japan isn't the only non-Christian nation that was good at slaughter.
The Russians were doing a pretty good job of it there for a while during the
Revolutionary period, alas.
Darklady
"OldguyTeck" <ec...@attbi.com> wrote in message
news:5rcDa.561719$Si4.5...@rwcrnsc51.ops.asp.att.net...
What on earth are you raving about? How is my "dark side" coming out by
my mentioning that many Christians consider Halloween to be an evil and
demonic holiday?
Oh, and what planet are you from that there are 48 hours in a day?
brian
Personally I think it is "True Believerism" that causes many of the
slaughters.
johac
duke32 <duk...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> On Mon, 02 Jun 2003 14:50:08 -0700, Douglas Berry
> <grid...@mindspring.com> wrote:
>
> >>Sure they are Christain in origin. We picked our desired days and
> >>celebrated something of value on them.
>
> >Which just happened to be on top of Pagan holidays.
>
> I guess the pagan beliefs were too weak to stand up to truth.
No. The pagans were unable to defend themselves against slaughter by
the xtians.
>
> >Hell, Easter is the name of a Celtic Goddess!
>
> Ever wonder why we dye hard-boiled eggs on Easter for the kids?
Eggs, a symbol of fertility, were part of Spring festivals in many
cultures. I recently posted an article which described how the ancient
Egyptians consumed them at their Spring festivals.
>
> >You religion has nothing original. Probably why it became so
> >popular.. no new rituals, just learn a few new names!
>
> The pagans had *nothing* to offer compared to the Christian worship.
The pagans probably thought the same of xtian worship for which they
were tortured and killed.
--
John Hachmann, aa #1782
"In those parts of the world where learning and science has prevailed,
miracles ceased; but in those parts that are barbarous and ignorant,
miracles are still in vogue." -Letters of Ethan Allen to Thomas Jefferson
Darklady
"brian" <brian_...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:HQfDa.640$C13.66...@newssvr13.news.prodigy.com...
Ultimately, yes. Fanaticism -- whether it be in a religion, a political
system, or a philosophical belief is utterly irrational, completely
heartless, and uncompromisingly brutal. My guess is that fanatics care less
about what they promote than the fact they get to direct their
obsessive-compulsive energy into it and into ensuring that it be forced upon
others. It's the madness of crowds and pychosis on a large scale. You pinned
that one square on the donkey's bottom, Brian. Good show.
--
Peter Cassidy
Pepke <epe...@acm.org> wrote:
> Robibnikoff <nos...@newsranger.com> wrote in message
> news:<pCHCa.7131$95....@www.newsranger.com>...
> > Hey Jackass, how do you feel about the fact that all your major christian
> > holidays aren't even christian in origin?
>
> Let alone the fact that the one that comes closest to having a Christian
> origin is Halloween, along with All Saints' Day and All Souls' Day.
> It's the only one that is clearly defined in terms of the Roman calendar,
> and the practice of wearing costumes on the night before and going to
> people's houses on commemerates secret Christians wearing disguises and
> traveling to safe houses for gatherings on the first.
Even then, Halloween doesn't have a Christian origin. Where I'm from,
it's called Oíche Shamhna (Samhain) - what we celebrated as kids is
nothing like the modern American holiday ...
Pete C
Robibnikoff
Exactly - Samhain (Halloween) doesn't have anything to do with christianity - or
their Satan, for that matter.
david asman
OldguyTeck wrote:
I didn't know anyone would have to explain a lie.
>
> On a scale never seen before..... Just though I'd jog that 'free-thinking'
> [apparently asleep at present] mind of yours....LOL
Apparently making stuff up is not part of being a free thinker. . .
Dave
Robibnikoff
Actually, Fake Ed, what was posted about the origins of Halloween is incorrect.
Miranda Writes, Devil's Advocate
>"caillean mcmahon" <cail...@gallae.com> wrote
>>
>> OldguyTeck wrote:
>> >
>> > "Douglas Berry" <grid...@mindspring.com> wrote i
.
Hon, I think the Russians who lived in the St. Pete area ( and other big
cities where the Revolution was seen up-close and personal) during that
time were xtains.... Russian Orthodox , rcc, etc.
Rev. Phylter
news:smbmdv0p91q21se19...@4ax.com:
>
> Atheist Holiday
>
> An atheist was quite incensed over the preparation for Easter and
> Passover holidays and decided to contact the local ACLU about the
> discrimination inflicted on atheists by the constant celebrations
> afforded to Christians and Jews with all their holidays while the
> atheists had no holidays for them to celebrate.
>
> The ACLU jumped on the opportunity to once again pick up the cause of
> the downtrodden and assigned their sharpest attorney to the case. The
> case was brought up before a learned judge who after listening to the
> passionate presentation by the ACLU representative promptly banged his
> gavel and said, "Case dismissed!"
>
> The ACLU lawyer stood up and objected to the ruling and said, "Your
> honor, how can you dismiss this case? Surely the Christians have
> Christmas, Easter and many other observances, and the Jews. In
> addition to Passover, they have Yom Kippur and Hanukkah, and yet my
> client and all other atheists have no such holiday!"
>
> The judge leaned back in his chair and simply said, "Obviously your
> client is too confused to know about, or for that matter, even
> celebrate the atheists holiday!"
>
> The ACLU lawyer pompously said, "We are aware of no such holiday for
> atheists...just when might that be?"
>
> The judge said, "Well, it comes every year at the same time - April
> 1st.
>
> 'The fool says in his heart, 'There is no God.' " Psalm 53:1, Psalm
> 14:1.
>
> duke, American-American
> *****
> First Principle and Foundation: Man was created
> to praise, reverence, and serve God, and by this
> means to save his soul; and the other things on
> the face of the earth were created for man's sake,
> and in order to aid him in the prosecution of the
> end for which he was created.
> *****
>
Duke32, you are the clown Prince of Idiocy.
Every post you make reiterates your stupidity.
However, you are too stupid to be told that you're being stupid.
Shut the fuck up and listen, instead of drowning people out.
You are too busy talking to hear from the people you are talking to.
Not everyone shares your take on life.
That's life. Deal with it.
--
Phylter
Denizen of Darkness #44 & AFJC Antipodean Attaché
http://www.rudraigh.com/afjc/regulars.html
Peter Cassidy
<duk...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> and decided to contact the local ACLU about the
> discrimination inflicted on atheists by the constant celebrations
> afforded to Christians and Jews
[snip]
Quoted verbatim from;
http://www.gospelcom.net/peggiesplace/tnt54.htm
"Tickles 'n Truth - Fun 'n Faith at Peggie's Place!"
.. without bothering to post attributions. Naughty, naughty!
Pete C
Ghost Rider
> On Tue, 03 Jun 2003 01:55:59 GMT, Ghost Rider <ghos...@ghost.com>
> wrote:
>
>>> And while you're at it, please provide evidence that Jesus was born on
>>> December 25th.
>
>>Good shot!
>
> I had a better answer - Jesus was not born on December 25th.
You're close. He was never born at all.
>
>>Here are a few others, purported to have been born on December 25.
>
>>Horus of Egypt (remember silly Horus, Puke?)
>>Dionysus/Bacchus
>>Attis of Phrygia
>>Krishna of India
>>Mithra of Persia
>>Buddha
>
>>Christianity isn't even an original myth. Grow up, Puke.
>
> That's quite right - it's not a myth at all.
>
>
Bedtime story?
How about miniseries?
--
Ghost Rider
aa # 2011
EAC Nonexistent Director of Alcohol, Tobacco and Bad Puns
rm - 2003 Yamaha V-Star 650 Custom
"Don't be afraid, man is man-made."
[Greg Lake, "Infinite Space" - Emerson, Lake & Palmer]
Douglas Berry
"OldguyTeck" <ec...@attbi.com> warmed at our fire and told this tale:
>Oh? How is it you don't seem to acknowledge that more human lives were
>destroyed, killed in this century alone than in any and ALL theistic
>actions....
This century we've had over two billion people on the planet, and
mechanized methids of warfare. Much easier to kill 100,000 people in
a single night when you have B-29s attacking Tokyo.
Now, find me an Aztec city. Who's the current Inca? Christians
destroyed entire cultures.
>On a scale never seen before..... Just though I'd jog that 'free-thinking'
>[apparently asleep at present] mind of yours....LOL
With more people, and better methods, why are you surprised?
Douglas Berry
"OldguyTeck" <ec...@attbi.com> warmed at our fire and told this tale:
>> Every been a professional writer? Stealing someone else's story and
>> claiming it as your own is plagiarism.
>
>Who's stealing......?
Been reading the thread?
Christmas sits right on the Satrunalia. December 25th is also the
holy day for many early religions that pre-date Christianity.
Easter is a opagan holiday or rebirth. Even the name is that of a
Celtic goddess, Eostre.
Christianity stole almost every piece of its mythos, all its holidays,
and most of its rituals.
Douglas Berry
"OldguyTeck" <ec...@attbi.com> warmed at our fire and told this tale:
>They seem to back off however when I ask them about the scientest
>[Elusive-particle] Wonder why ?
I didn't back off. I flat out told you we don'ty have all the answers
yet, and continue to look for the little beasties.
Theory says they are there, we just haven't observed them yet, so we
keep smacking atoms together and looking at the results.
There's the difference between science and religion, sir. We demand
evidence.
Douglas Berry
"OldguyTeck" <ec...@attbi.com> warmed at our fire and told this tale:
>Gosh and here we wuzz thinking you were thinking.
>bout the 'Greatest story EVER told'
What does a Grateful Dead song have to do with anything?
Douglas Berry
"OldguyTeck" <ec...@attbi.com> warmed at our fire and told this tale:
>> I enjoyed Christian holidays.. I made out like a thief taking other
>> peoples' guard and CQ duties on Christmas and the like.
>
>Ahhh! Your still stationed then... How are things going ?
Been out for a while now. Still have great memories of my time in the
Army, and managed to see the elephant while I was in.
Douglas Berry
"OldguyTeck" <ec...@attbi.com> warmed at our fire and told this tale:
>
>Yet you 'claim' to be workng on it 48 - 7. So what's your excuse now ?
>Are you devoting to much time to the 'smut' perhaps ?
48? Where do you live that there are 48 hours in a day?
Alan Ferris
<grid...@mindspring.com> wrote:
>On Wed, 04 Jun 2003 01:49:15 GMT, a wanderer, known to us only as
>"OldguyTeck" <ec...@attbi.com> warmed at our fire and told this tale:
>
>>
>>Yet you 'claim' to be workng on it 48 - 7. So what's your excuse now ?
>>Are you devoting to much time to the 'smut' perhaps ?
>
>48? Where do you live that there are 48 hours in a day?
Ed is in a world of his own making.
--
Alan "Ferrit" Ferris
()'.'.'()
( (T) )
( ) . ( )
(")_(")
eligo, ergo sum Atheist #1211
Official Member of Paddy-boy's Troll list
EAC(UK)#252 Ironic Torture Div.
Alan Ferris
wrote:
>Oh? How is it you don't seem to acknowledge that more human lives were
>destroyed, killed in this century alone than in any and ALL theistic
>actions....
>On a scale never seen before..... Just though I'd jog that 'free-thinking'
>[apparently asleep at present] mind of yours....LOL
Lets see.....all those fire bombed in Japan and nuked....all by a
christian president.
He must have surely been following the commandment thou shalt kill.
But nobody has ever come close to their god, he supposedly killed
millions when he sent the flood. Wonder why they like that and
worship such a murderer?
jwk
> On Mon, 02 Jun 2003 19:00:21 GMT, Robibnikoff <nos...@newsranger.com>
> wrote:
>
> >Please explain how Christmas (originally the Pagan Winter Soltice) and
> >Easter(originally Ostre, Pagan fertility festival) are christian in origin.
>
> That's not what I said.
>
> Many days/months are dual-directed. We picked certain days relative
> to our own Christian worship and ran with them.
>
Your computer must be acting up. You must have typed "stole" but what
came out was "picked". The correct sentence would have read "we stole
certain [holli]day [then forced the pagans to spend their happy
celebrations in our nasty churches being quiet]. See? I'm sure
that's what you meant. (Because that is what you xains did.)
jwk
jwk
>
> >duke32: " 'My' story????????"
>
> Yes, your story....the one about the atheist going to the ACLU. Or is that
> story you posted just more Christer propaganda that you regurgitated?
> Remember this post that started the thread:
> news:smbmdv0p91q21se19...@4ax.com
It wasn't a story. It was another little xian dig. The ACLU is not a
ridiculous organization. Only stupid christers would try to make them
look foolish in this way. The ACLU does great work, and they are not
dedicated to atheist causes either. They work to preserve the
American (US) Constitution and civil liberties of all citizens and
visitors. Only bitter hate-mongers like puke-on-my-shoes there keep
trying to associate them solely with atheists.
jwk