Lightning Cycle Dynamics P-38
Tom Sherman
> JimmyMac was probably stupid enough purchase a Lightning P-38, even though
> it was not a very good recumbent. He thought he would be fast on it. So much
> for forlorn hopes!
While there are some things on the P-38 that should have been better
sorted out [1], it is likely the fastest unfaired bike with an UPRIGHT
seating position. The very closed position created by the high BB and
upright seat is good for climbing and sprinting, though a bike with a
high bottom bracket and laid back seat will be considerably faster on
the flats. The P-38 would be a good choice for urban riding [2], since
the upright position allows the rider to keep track of traffic in
addition to accelerating well, or for a ride with a lot of climbing
relative to flat areas (particularly those exposed to wind).
[1] And LCD really needs to offer a narrower seat for those who do not
have wide pelvises and shoulders.
[2] As long a fork that can take a reasonably wide (> 28-mm) front tire
is used, unless the rider is very light.
--
Tom Sherman - 42.435731,-83.985007
LOCAL CACTUS EATS CYCLIST - datakoll
Edward Dolan
"Tom Sherman" <sunsetss000...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:gh295p$1c0$1...@news.motzarella.org...
I just about bought one of these contraptions myself many years ago, but I
got so much static from the manufacturer that we ended up telling one
another to go to Hell! My relationships with folks who sell things do not
always go smoothly. They seem to want to rob me and I do not want to be
robbed. I usually end up telling them to keep their product and I will keep
my money. At least that way, I end up happy and have avoided buying a lot of
junk over the years.
Regards,
Ed Dolan the Great - Minnesota
aka
Saint Edward the Great - Order of the Perpetual Sorrows - Minnesota
Tom Sherman
than satisfactory.
JimmyMac
wrote:
> Ed Dolan wrote:
> > JimmyMac was probably stupid enough purchase a Lightning P-38, even though
> > it was not a very good recumbent. He thought he would be fast on it. So much
> > for forlorn hopes!
Well this is interesting. Ed pretends to be hazarding a guess when he
know perfectly well that I own a Lightning P-38. Now as for the rest,
well the purveyor of disinformation is trash talking without any basis
in fact. I know. I know ... nothing new about any of that. Dolan
has often indicated that he has utmost respect for Tom Sherman's
knowledge about recumbents; and, as Tom points out, the P-38 has much
to recommend it. As for not being fast. not everyone is an old, fat
slow rider like Dolan. Forlorn hopes would aptly describe Dolan's
hopes of ever holding my wheel. The fastest I have hit in a flat,
without wind at my back, was 33.5 mph, but anything approaching 30 mph
is a very serious effort. I am about 3 mph slower on the recumbent
than I am on my upright. I now ride my upright much more than my
recumbent. I guess I'm still more of an upright rider although I do
enjoy riding the recumbent.
> While there are some things on the P-38 that should have been better
> sorted out [1], it is likely the fastest unfaired bike with an UPRIGHT
> seating position. The very closed position created by the high BB and
> upright seat is good for climbing and sprinting, though a bike with a
> high bottom bracket and laid back seat will be considerably faster on
> the flats. The P-38 would be a good choice for urban riding [2], since
> the upright position allows the rider to keep track of traffic in
> addition to accelerating well, or for a ride with a lot of climbing
> relative to flat areas (particularly those exposed to wind).
>
> [1] And LCD really needs to offer a narrower seat for those who do not
> have wide pelvises and shoulders.
> [2] As long a fork that can take a reasonably wide (> 28-mm) front tire
> is used, unless the rider is very light.
Tom ... a fiar enugh assessment, although I find riding into a stiff
headwind to be difficult in such an upright seating position II
quirte agree about the front wheel. It didnt' tke me long to dump the
small 349mm/16in for a larger 406mm/20in. Retro fitted with a
Ballistic BMX suspension fork and running wider tires proved to be a
good combination.
JimmyMac
Tom ... meant "fair enough", "didn't take", "quite", etc. ... just
can't type
Edward Dolan
"JimmyMac" <jimmy...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:3ced7e6b-0e66-402c...@33g2000yqm.googlegroups.com...
[...]
> Tom ... a fair enough assessment, although I find riding into a stiff
> headwind to be difficult in such an upright seating position. I
> quite agree about the front wheel. It didn't take me long to dump the
> small 349mm/16in for a larger 406mm/20in. Retro fitted with a
> Ballistic BMX suspension fork and running wider tires proved to be a
> good combination.
Your seating position on the P-38 is not much of an improvement over your
seating position on an upright. They are both uncomfortable in the extreme.
All a larger front wheel does is raise the bottom bracket, thereby insuring
foot numbness. Finally, speed isn't everything on any kind of a bike.
Comfort counts for far more since it means you will be able to ride longer
and further.
JimmyMac
> "JimmyMac" <jimmyma...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> news:3ced7e6b-0e66-402c...@33g2000yqm.googlegroups.com...
> [...]
>
> > Tom ... a fair enough assessment, although I find riding into a stiff
> > headwind to be difficult in such an upright seating position. I
> > quite agree about the front wheel. It didn't take me long to dump the
> > small 349mm/16in for a larger 406mm/20in. Retro fitted with a
> > Ballistic BMX suspension fork and running wider tires proved to be a
> > good combination.
>
> Your seating position on the P-38 is not much of an improvement over your
> seating position on an upright.
You of course meant to qaulify that with ... MY OPINION.
> They are both uncomfortable in the extreme.
More unqualified opinion state as fact? I ride 5000-7000 miles a year
in a 7-8 month riding season, but not in extreme discomfort??? If I
found my riding position to be uncomfortable in the extreme, I
wouldn't do that much riding. You know nothing about my upright which
is a comfortable bike. As for my recumbent, I replaced the seat chord
with electrical ties and replaced the original foam (closed cell I
think) pad with a self-inflating open cell foam pad that I top off
with a bit more air. This combination makes for a very comfortable
seat.
> All a larger front wheel does is raise the bottom bracket, thereby insuring foot numbness.
You of course meant to qualify that with ... MY OPINION. ALL, you
assert??? What a larger front wheel also does is negotiate potholes
better and provide a more comfortable ride on tires that will last
longer among other things, but you seem to know it all so why should I
continue to preach to the choir. INSURING NUMBNESS??? Perhaps I
should contact Lightning Cycle Dynamics and pitch a bitch then as I
have been deprived of an experience that I apparently paid for but
have missed out on. Maybe you are confusing bottom bracket height
with that cheap rotgut red wine you drink as the cause of your foot
numbness which appears now to have progressed to your head.
> Finally, speed isn't everything on any kind of a bike.
> Comfort counts for far more since it means you will be able to ride longer
> and further.
Correct me if I am wrong here, but you intorduced the topic of speed
when, in reference to my P-38, you emphatically, but incorrectly,
asserted of me ... He thought he would be fast on it. I never
contended that speed is everything on a bike, if that is what you're
implying. I merely pointed out that I am capable of generating what
you are not ... speed, if an when I so desire to. I agree that
comfort is very important and you left out another ... safety. As far
as riding longer and further is concerned ... at age 50, I rode my
upright quite comfortably on an organized century (100 miler) in 4
hours 43 minutes, averaging 21 mph, so one can ride long and far
without having to suffer discomfort and one can do so at a fast pace
provided the body is acclimated to the riding position and one has a
fit "engine". Comfort in and of itself is no guarantee that one will
be able to ride longer and/or further.
Edward Dolan
On Dec 2, 2:32 pm, "Edward Dolan" <edo...@iw.net> wrote:
> "JimmyMac" <jimmyma...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> news:3ced7e6b-0e66-402c...@33g2000yqm.googlegroups.com...
> [...]
>
> > Tom ... a fair enough assessment, although I find riding into a stiff
> > headwind to be difficult in such an upright seating position. I
> > quite agree about the front wheel. It didn't take me long to dump the
> > small 349mm/16in for a larger 406mm/20in. Retro fitted with a
> > Ballistic BMX suspension fork and running wider tires proved to be a
> > good combination.
>
> Your seating position on the P-38 is not much of an improvement over your
> seating position on an upright.
>>> You of course meant to qaulify that with ... MY OPINION.
This newsgroup is fortunate indeed to have an opinion from One so Great as
Myself! I ought to be charging a hefty fee for it.
> They are both uncomfortable in the extreme.
>>> More unqualified opinion state as fact? I ride 5000-7000 miles a year
in a 7-8 month riding season, but not in extreme discomfort??? If I
found my riding position to be uncomfortable in the extreme, I
wouldn't do that much riding. You know nothing about my upright which
is a comfortable bike. As for my recumbent, I replaced the seat chord
with electrical ties and replaced the original foam (closed cell I
think) pad with a self-inflating open cell foam pad that I top off
with a bit more air. This combination makes for a very comfortable
seat.
No way anyone can be comfortable sitting in an upright position. After a few
hours, your backside will ache.
> All a larger front wheel does is raise the bottom bracket, thereby
> insuring foot numbness.
>>> You of course meant to qualify that with ... MY OPINION. ALL, you
assert??? What a larger front wheel also does is negotiate potholes
better and provide a more comfortable ride on tires that will last
longer among other things, but you seem to know it all so why should I
continue to preach to the choir. INSURING NUMBNESS??? Perhaps I
should contact Lightning Cycle Dynamics and pitch a bitch then as I
have been deprived of an experience that I apparently paid for but
have missed out on. Maybe you are confusing bottom bracket height
with that cheap rotgut red wine you drink as the cause of your foot
numbness which appears now to have progressed to your head.
About 25% of all cyclists will experience foot numbness if the bottom
bracket is too high.
> Finally, speed isn't everything on any kind of a bike.
> Comfort counts for far more since it means you will be able to ride longer
> and further.
>>> Correct me if I am wrong here, but you intorduced the topic of speed
when, in reference to my P-38, you emphatically, but incorrectly,
asserted of me ... He thought he would be fast on it. I never
contended that speed is everything on a bike, if that is what you're
implying. I merely pointed out that I am capable of generating what
you are not ... speed, if an when I so desire to. I agree that
comfort is very important and you left out another ... safety. As far
as riding longer and further is concerned ... at age 50, I rode my
upright quite comfortably on an organized century (100 miler) in 4
hours 43 minutes, averaging 21 mph, so one can ride long and far
without having to suffer discomfort and one can do so at a fast pace
provided the body is acclimated to the riding position and one has a
fit "engine". Comfort in and of itself is no guarantee that one will
be able to ride longer and/or further.
Folks got the the P-38 because they thought they would be fast on it. The
fact is that you will not be all that fast on it and you will be enormously
more uncomfortable on it than you would on properly laid back seat with a
medium height bottom bracket. But Lightning Cycles never got anything right
in its entire life. Furthermore, the Asian bitch that communicated with
prospective buyers was too dumb to be believed.
Finally, you can ride a bike all day and all night if you are comfortable on
it. Anyone who cannot do this has missed the boat. They have sacrificed
comfort for speed, never a good tradeoff.
Tom Sherman
> On Dec 1, 9:13 pm, Tom Sherman <sunsetss0003REMOVET...@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
>> the upright position allows the rider to keep track of traffic in
>> addition to accelerating well, or for a ride with a lot of climbing
>> relative to flat areas (particularly those exposed to wind).
>>
>> [1] And LCD really needs to offer a narrower seat for those who do not
>> have wide pelvises and shoulders.
>> [2] As long a fork that can take a reasonably wide (> 28-mm) front tire
>> is used, unless the rider is very light.
>
> Tom ... a fiar enugh assessment, although I find riding into a stiff
> headwind to be difficult in such an upright seating position
Jim misunderstands here - I was contending that the P-38 would be a good
bicycle for a place like SW Wisconsin where there is a lot of climbing,
but the trees and valley protect the rider from the wind.
> I
> quirte agree about the front wheel. It didnt' tke me long to dump the
> small 349mm/16in for a larger 406mm/20in. Retro fitted with a
> Ballistic BMX suspension fork and running wider tires proved to be a
> good combination.
>
The tires available for the ISO 349-mm size, such as the 32-349 Primo
Comet are really not suitable for an average weight adult, and should
only be used by shorter stature riders that need the small front wheel.
Similarly, the LCD fork that only accepts narrow tires should be avoided
by all but light riders on smooth roads.
Tom Sherman
> [...]
> Folks got the the P-38 because they thought they would be fast on it. The
> fact is that you will not be all that fast on it and you will be enormously
> more uncomfortable on it than you would on properly laid back seat with a
> medium height bottom bracket. But Lightning Cycles never got anything right
> in its entire life. Furthermore, the Asian bitch that communicated with
Do you mean LeQuan Brummer (Tim's wife)?
Unfortunately, I can not repeat here some of the stories I have heard
about her responses to customer inquires.
Edward Dolan
> Edward Dolan wrote:
>> [...]
>> Folks got the the P-38 because they thought they would be fast on it. The
>> fact is that you will not be all that fast on it and you will be
>> got anything right in its entire life. Furthermore, the Asian bitch that
>> communicated with prospective buyers was too dumb to be believed.[...]
>
> Do you mean LeQuan Brummer (Tim's wife)?
>
> Unfortunately, I can not repeat here some of the stories I have heard
> about her responses to customer inquires.
Yes, I think you must be right about the above person. Tim Brummer is an
idiot for allowing such a moronic female to have anything to do with
customers. By and large, since LCD is still in business, I can't help but
think that many recumbent cyclists are not too smart when it comes to
dealing with manufacturers. Anyone to whom I am thinking of giving plus
$1000 had at least better be polite and courteous.
Tom Sherman
Customer service training is not part of the requirements for that
occupation.
JimmyMac
wrote:
> JimmyMac aka Jim McNamara wrote:
>
> > On Dec 1, 9:13 pm, Tom Sherman <sunsetss0003REMOVET...@yahoo.com>
> > wrote:
> >> [...]The P-38 would be a good choice for urban riding [2], since
> >> the upright position allows the rider to keep track of traffic in
> >> addition to accelerating well, or for a ride with a lot of climbing
> >> relative to flat areas (particularly those exposed to wind).
>
> >> [1] And LCD really needs to offer a narrower seat for those who do not
> >> have wide pelvises and shoulders.
> >> [2] As long a fork that can take a reasonably wide (> 28-mm) front tire
> >> is used, unless the rider is very light.
>
> > headwind to be difficult in such an upright seating position
>
> Jim misunderstands here - I was contending that the P-38 would be a good
> bicycle for a place like SW Wisconsin where there is a lot of climbing,
> but the trees and valley protect the rider from the wind.
I don't think I misunderstood. I was just considering the geography
where I mos often ride. You stated that the P-38 would be a good
choice for urban riding or for a ride with a lot of climbing relative
to flat areas (particularly those exposed to wind), the key operative
word being "OR". I agree that the P-38 is a good choice for an urban
recumbent, but as far as climbing goes, I find an upright superior to
any recumbent I've even ridden up hill. All I was trying to convey
though is that with such an upright seating position a stiff headwind
becomes a challenging. Many rollers that I've ridden in Wisconsin are
lined with farmer's fields and the wind is still remains a factor on
climbs. At least that's been my experience.
> > I quite agree about the front wheel. It didn't take me long to dump the
> > small 349mm/16in for a larger 406mm/20in. Retro fitted with a
> > Ballistic BMX suspension fork and running wider tires proved to be a
> > good combination.
>
> The tires available for the ISO 349-mm size, such as the 32-349 Primo
> Comet are really not suitable for an average weight adult, and should
> only be used by shorter stature riders that need the small front wheel.
> Similarly, the LCD fork that only accepts narrow tires should be avoided
> by all but light riders on smooth roads.
Agreed. The Primo Comet is so poor as to be unsafe at almost any
speed. The changes I made to fork, rim and tires improved the bike
measurably.
Edward Dolan
On Dec 2, 10:46 pm, Tom Sherman <sunsetss0003REMOVET...@yahoo.com>
wrote:
> JimmyMac aka Jim McNamara wrote:
>
> > On Dec 1, 9:13 pm, Tom Sherman <sunsetss0003REMOVET...@yahoo.com>
> > wrote:
> >> [...]The P-38 would be a good choice for urban riding [2], since
> >> the upright position allows the rider to keep track of traffic in
> >> addition to accelerating well, or for a ride with a lot of climbing
> >> relative to flat areas (particularly those exposed to wind).
>
> >> [1] And LCD really needs to offer a narrower seat for those who do not
> >> have wide pelvises and shoulders.
> >> [2] As long a fork that can take a reasonably wide (> 28-mm) front tire
> >> is used, unless the rider is very light.
>
> > Tom ... a farr enough assessment, although I find riding into a stiff
> > headwind to be difficult in such an upright seating position
>
> Jim misunderstands here - I was contending that the P-38 would be a good
> bicycle for a place like SW Wisconsin where there is a lot of climbing,
> but the trees and valley protect the rider from the wind.
>>> I don't think I misunderstood. I was just considering the geography
where I most often ride. You stated that the P-38 would be a good
choice for urban riding or for a ride with a lot of climbing relative
to flat areas (particularly those exposed to wind), the key operative
word being "OR". I agree that the P-38 is a good choice for an urban
recumbent, but as far as climbing goes, I find an upright superior to
any recumbent I've ever ridden up hill. All I was trying to convey
though is that with such an upright seating position a stiff headwind
becomes a challenging. Many rollers that I've ridden in Wisconsin are
lined with farmer's fields and the wind is still remains a factor on
climbs. At least that's been my experience.
Jim is quite right about uprights being far superior to any recumbent when
it comes to climbing hills. However, I think a low bottom bracket recumbent
is better for urban cycling since you will often have to stop and put your
feet down in various congested traffic situations. A low bottom bracket
recumbent is better for that.
> > I quite agree about the front wheel. It didn't take me long to dump the
> > small 349mm/16in for a larger 406mm/20in. Retro fitted with a
> > Ballistic BMX suspension fork and running wider tires proved to be a
> > good combination.
>
> The tires available for the ISO 349-mm size, such as the 32-349 Primo
> Comet are really not suitable for an average weight adult, and should
> only be used by shorter stature riders that need the small front wheel.
> Similarly, the LCD fork that only accepts narrow tires should be avoided
> by all but light riders on smooth roads.
>>>> Agreed. The Primo Comet is so poor as to be unsafe at almost any
speed. The changes I made to fork, rim and tires improved the bike
measurably.
I have to laugh! I never got so many flats in my life as when I had those
Primo Comet tires on my Vision. One day on GRABAAWR I got 4 flats and just
about went crazy from the frustration of it all. I decided then and there
that more hardy tires were well worth the cost of not being quite so fast.
Edward Dolan
> Edward Dolan wrote:
>> "Tom Sherman" <sunsetss000...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>> news:gh53lm$les$1...@news.motzarella.org...
>>> Edward Dolan wrote:
>>>> [...]
>>>> Folks got the the P-38 because they thought they would be fast on it.
>>>> The fact is that you will not be all that fast on it and you will be
>>>> enormously more uncomfortable on it than you would on a properly laid
>>>> back seat with a medium height bottom bracket. But Lightning Cycles
>>>> never got anything right in its entire life. Furthermore, the Asian
>>>> bitch that communicated with prospective buyers was too dumb to be
>>>> believed.[...]
>>> Do you mean LeQuan Brummer (Tim's wife)?
>>>
>>> Unfortunately, I can not repeat here some of the stories I have heard
>>> about her responses to customer inquires.
>>
>> Yes, I think you must be right about the above person. Tim Brummer is an
>> idiot for allowing such a moronic female to have anything to do with
>> customers. By and large, since LCD is still in business, I can't help but
>> think that many recumbent cyclists are not too smart when it comes to
>>
> My understanding is that Ms. Brummer is a former aerospace engineer.
> Customer service training is not part of the requirements for that
> occupation.
Even so, there is something drastically wrong with the way her brain
functions. You may think I am one contentious bastard, but I would never
behave like she did with a customer. You do not need any training for this.
You just need to have some common courtesy, something that you learn from
your parents and your elders as a child.
JimmyMac
> "JimmyMac" <jimmyma...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> news:ebc434a9-a9d4-4911...@13g2000yql.googlegroups.com...
> On Dec 2, 2:32 pm, "Edward Dolan" <edo...@iw.net> wrote:
>
> > "JimmyMac" <jimmyma...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> >news:3ced7e6b-0e66-402c...@33g2000yqm.googlegroups.com...
> > [...]
>
> > > Tom ... a fair enough assessment, although I find riding into a stiff
> > > headwind to be difficult in such an upright seating position. I
> > > quite agree about the front wheel. It didn't take me long to dump the
> > > small 349mm/16in for a larger 406mm/20in. Retro fitted with a
> > > Ballistic BMX suspension fork and running wider tires proved to be a
> > > good combination.
>
> > Your seating position on the P-38 is not much of an improvement over your
> > seating position on an upright.
> >>> You of course meant to qaulify that with ... MY OPINION.
>
> This newsgroup is fortunate indeed to have an opinion from One so Great as
> Myself! I ought to be charging a hefty fee for it.
Although yours is an opinion that few respect, you mustn't allow that
to dissuade you from appending your egocentric, delusional signature
to your superfluous posts!
> > They are both uncomfortable in the extreme.
> >>> More unqualified opinion state as fact? I ride 5000-7000 miles a year
>
> in a 7-8 month riding season, but not in extreme discomfort??? If I
> found my riding position to be uncomfortable in the extreme, I
> wouldn't do that much riding. You know nothing about my upright which
> is a comfortable bike. As for my recumbent, I replaced the seat chord
> with electrical ties and replaced the original foam (closed cell I
> think) pad with a self-inflating open cell foam pad that I top off
> with a bit more air. This combination makes for a very comfortable
> seat.
>
> No way anyone can be comfortable sitting in an upright position. After a few
> hours, your backside will ache.
Emphatic, but errant opinion stated as fact. When Dolan is possessed
of neither knowledge nor experience to draw upon to formulate a
conclusion that doesn't deter him from exercising common sense ...
rabidly driven to run his mouth and publicly put his ignorance on
display to his own embarrassment. I have scoliosis and after early
season acclimation manage to do just fine.
> > All a larger front wheel does is raise the bottom bracket, thereby
> > insuring foot numbness.
> >>> You of course meant to qualify that with ... MY OPINION. ALL, you
>
> assert??? What a larger front wheel also does is negotiate potholes
> better and provide a more comfortable ride on tires that will last
> longer among other things, but you seem to know it all so why should I
> continue to preach to the choir. INSURING NUMBNESS??? Perhaps I
> should contact Lightning Cycle Dynamics and pitch a bitch then as I
> have been deprived of an experience that I apparently paid for but
> have missed out on. Maybe you are confusing bottom bracket height
> with that cheap rotgut red wine you drink as the cause of your foot
> numbness which appears now to have progressed to your head.
>
> About 25% of all cyclists will experience foot numbness if the bottom
> bracket is too high.
Not 24%? Not 26%. Just where does Dolan obtain his statistics
from ... inquisitve minds want to know??? Acceptin (an I'm not), that
25% suffer from foot numness, perhap Dolan, in reference to high
bottom brackets, should not have used the word "insure" then should
he?
> > Finally, speed isn't everything on any kind of a bike.
> > Comfort counts for far more since it means you will be able to ride longer
> > and further.
> >>> Correct me if I am wrong here, but you introduced the topic of speed
>
> when, in reference to my P-38, you emphatically, but incorrectly,
> asserted of me ... He thought he would be fast on it. I never
> contended that speed is everything on a bike, if that is what you're
> implying. I merely pointed out that I am capable of generating what
> you are not ... speed, if an when I so desire to. I agree that
> comfort is very important and you left out another ... safety. As far
> as riding longer and further is concerned ... at age 50, I rode my
> upright quite comfortably on an organized century (100 miler) in 4
> hours 43 minutes, averaging 21 mph, so one can ride long and far
> without having to suffer discomfort and one can do so at a fast pace
> provided the body is acclimated to the riding position and one has a
> fit "engine". Comfort in and of itself is no guarantee that one will
> be able to ride longer and/or further.
>
> Folks got the the P-38 because they thought they would be fast on it.
Is it possible for you to ever state an opinion (read assertion) as an
opinion and a bit less emphatically. Almost every one of your
assertions are stated definitively as dogma. Not ALL folks got the
P-38 because they thought they would be fast even though the P-38 had
that reputation and appeal. There are lot of attributes to recommend
it beyond speed. You considered buying one and you couldn't go fast
on anything that you have to pedal.
> The
> fact is that you will not be all that fast on it and you will be enormously
> more uncomfortable on it than you would on properly laid back seat with a
> medium height bottom bracket.
The seat on the P-38 is not fixed and can be laid back. The P-38 can
and has been ridden fast and in comfort. Lacking first had
experience, upon what do you base your disinformation?
> But Lightning Cycles never got anything right
> in its entire life.
Not more unsubstantiated dogmatic opinion. You need to rectify this
or no one will ever pay any attention to anything you say.
> Furthermore, the Asian bitch that communicated with
> prospective buyers was too dumb to be believed.
There is nothing quite like an insensitive bigot.
> Finally, you can ride a bike all day and all night if you are comfortable on
> it. Anyone who cannot do this has missed the boat. They have sacrificed
> comfort for speed, never a good tradeoff.
I presume then that you missed the boat. I put in a significant
number of miles and and ge pretty fit and I wouldn't say that I could
ride all day and all night as you claim in your inimitable unqualified
style (read dogmatic uncorroborated opinion stated as fact). More
than mere comfort is a required to ride all day and all night. I
suspect that only properly trained ultra marathon endurance cyclists
can ride all day and all night. Another thing ... comfort cannot be
sacrificed for speed. In order to go fast one still has to have some
degree of comfort. A super time trial bike that was faster on paper
and in wind tunnel testing proved to be slower when ridden by Lance
Armstrong. Why ... because he was not comfortable on the super time
trial bike.
If you insist upon speaking ex cathedra, then why not become a pope!
JimmyMac
> "JimmyMac" <jimmyma...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> news:aed0994b-d32d-4d5a...@u14g2000yqg.googlegroups.com...
> On Dec 2, 10:46 pm, Tom Sherman <sunsetss0003REMOVET...@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
>
>
>
> > JimmyMac aka Jim McNamara wrote:
>
> > > On Dec 1, 9:13 pm, Tom Sherman <sunsetss0003REMOVET...@yahoo.com>
> > > wrote:
> > >> [...]The P-38 would be a good choice for urban riding [2], since
> > >> the upright position allows the rider to keep track of traffic in
> > >> addition to accelerating well, or for a ride with a lot of climbing
> > >> relative to flat areas (particularly those exposed to wind).
>
> > >> [1] And LCD really needs to offer a narrower seat for those who do not
> > >> have wide pelvises and shoulders.
> > >> [2] As long a fork that can take a reasonably wide (> 28-mm) front tire
> > >> is used, unless the rider is very light.
>
> > > headwind to be difficult in such an upright seating position
>
> > Jim misunderstands here - I was contending that the P-38 would be a good
> > bicycle for a place like SW Wisconsin where there is a lot of climbing,
> > but the trees and valley protect the rider from the wind.
> >>> I don't think I misunderstood. I was just considering the geography
>
> where I most often ride. You stated that the P-38 would be a good
> choice for urban riding or for a ride with a lot of climbing relative
> to flat areas (particularly those exposed to wind), the key operative
> word being "OR". I agree that the P-38 is a good choice for an urban
> recumbent, but as far as climbing goes, I find an upright superior to
> any recumbent I've ever ridden up hill. All I was trying to convey
> though is that with such an upright seating position a stiff headwind
> becomes a challenging. Many rollers that I've ridden in Wisconsin are
> lined with farmer's fields and the wind is still remains a factor on
> climbs. At least that's been my experience.
>
> Jim is quite right about uprights being far superior to any recumbent when
> it comes to climbing hills. However, I think a low bottom bracket recumbent
> is better for urban cycling since you will often have to stop and put your
> feet down in various congested traffic situations. A low bottom bracket
> recumbent is better for that.
I have a 35 inch inseam so putting my feet down is not a problem for
me.
> > > I quite agree about the front wheel. It didn't take me long to dump the
> > > small 349mm/16in for a larger 406mm/20in. Retro fitted with a
> > > Ballistic BMX suspension fork and running wider tires proved to be a
> > > good combination.
>
> > The tires available for the ISO 349-mm size, such as the 32-349 Primo
> > Comet are really not suitable for an average weight adult, and should
> > only be used by shorter stature riders that need the small front wheel.
> > Similarly, the LCD fork that only accepts narrow tires should be avoided
> > by all but light riders on smooth roads.
> >>>> Agreed. The Primo Comet is so poor as to be unsafe at almost any
>
> speed. The changes I made to fork, rim and tires improved the bike
> measurably.
>
> I have to laugh! I never got so many flats in my life as when I had those
> Primo Comet tires on my Vision. One day on GRABAAWR I got 4 flats and just
> about went crazy from the frustration of it all. I decided then and there
> that more hardy tires were well worth the cost of not being quite so fast.
I fount the Avocet FasGrip Freestyle tires to be a reliable and fast
tire. I hate to sound Dolan like here, but the Primo Comet tire is
horrible, then again many would agree with me who have likne myself
experieced them first hand.
Edward Dolan
> No way anyone can be comfortable sitting in an upright position. After a
> few
> hours, your backside will ache.
>> Emphatic, but errant opinion stated as fact. When Dolan is possessed
of neither knowledge nor experience to draw upon to formulate a
conclusion that doesn't deter him from exercising common sense ...
rabidly driven to run his mouth and publicly put his ignorance on
display to his own embarrassment. I have scoliosis and after early
season acclimation manage to do just fine.
Get a proper recumbent with a laid back seat and you will do even "finer".
By the way, I have a world of experience (30 years) with both uprights and
recumbents. Even Tom Sherman likes a laid back seat.
[...]
> Folks got the the P-38 because they thought they would be fast on it.
>> Is it possible for you to ever state an opinion (read assertion) as an
opinion and a bit less emphatically. Almost every one of your
assertions are stated definitively as dogma. Not ALL folks got the
P-38 because they thought they would be fast even though the P-38 had
that reputation and appeal. There are lot of attributes to recommend
it beyond speed. You considered buying one and you couldn't go fast
on anything that you have to pedal.
There is nothing to recommend the P-38 beyond speed. It is uncomfortable
because of the upright seat position. Most sensible folks get recumbents for
comfort, not for speed.
[...]
> Finally, you can ride a bike all day and all night if you are comfortable
> on
> it. Anyone who cannot do this has missed the boat. They have sacrificed
> comfort for speed, never a good tradeoff.
>> I presume then that you missed the boat. I put in a significant
number of miles and and ge pretty fit and I wouldn't say that I could
ride all day and all night as you claim in your inimitable unqualified
style (read dogmatic uncorroborated opinion stated as fact). More
than mere comfort is a required to ride all day and all night. I
suspect that only properly trained ultra marathon endurance cyclists
can ride all day and all night. Another thing ... comfort cannot be
sacrificed for speed. In order to go fast one still has to have some
degree of comfort. A super time trial bike that was faster on paper
and in wind tunnel testing proved to be slower when ridden by Lance
Armstrong. Why ... because he was not comfortable on the super time
trial bike.
You wouldn't last more than a few days on a week long cross state tour on
your upright. You might last on your P-38 but you would last even better on
my Vision.
>> If you insist upon speaking ex cathedra, then why not become a pope!
God Damn It ... I am far Greater than the Pope. I am a Great Saint and the
Pope is merely the Pope.
Tom Sherman
> [...]
> Get a proper recumbent with a laid back seat and you will do even "finer".
> By the way, I have a world of experience (30 years) with both uprights and
> recumbents. Even Tom Sherman likes a laid back seat.
> [...]
I like a seat between 30 and 40° from the horizontal, in conjunction
with a bottom bracket between 15 and 25 cm above the seat.
JimmyMac
> "JimmyMac" <jimmyma...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> news:5344b8d5-e31f-463f...@a12g2000yqm.googlegroups.com...
> On Dec 2, 5:13 pm, "Edward Dolan" <edo...@iw.net> wrote:
> [...]
>
> > No way anyone can be comfortable sitting in an upright position. After a
> > few
> > hours, your backside will ache.
> >> Emphatic, but errant opinion stated as fact. When Dolan is possessed
>
> of neither knowledge nor experience to draw upon to formulate a
> conclusion that doesn't deter him from exercising common sense ...
> rabidly driven to run his mouth and publicly put his ignorance on
> display to his own embarrassment. I have scoliosis and after early
> season acclimation manage to do just fine.
>
> Get a proper recumbent with a laid back seat and you will do even "finer".
> By the way, I have a world of experience (30 years) with both uprights and
> recumbents. Even Tom Sherman likes a laid back seat.
> [...]
So then, the P-38 is not proper recumbent ... IN YOUR OPINION (you
again neglected to qualify)? I have 50+ years of experience riding
uprights and 10+ years of experience riding recumbents but just how
much experience do you have riding a P-38 since that is the recumbent
you are disrespectfully expounding about? I too like a laid back
seating position and, using a clock as a point of reference, I would
estimate my seat angle to be right at or about 35 degrees, so the
position of my seat it is not all that upright.
> > Folks got the the P-38 because they thought they would be fast on it.
> >> Is it possible for you to ever state an opinion (read assertion) as an
>
> opinion and a bit less emphatically. Almost every one of your
> assertions are stated definitively as dogma. Not ALL folks got the
> P-38 because they thought they would be fast even though the P-38 had
> that reputation and appeal. There are lot of attributes to recommend
> it beyond speed. You considered buying one and you couldn't go fast
> on anything that you have to pedal.
>
> There is nothing to recommend the P-38 beyond speed.
OK, I will ask again ... Is it possible for you to ever state an
opinion (read assertion) as an opinion and a bit less emphatically?
There is nothing to recommend your opinion until you provide a
reasonable, acceptable explanation. Tom Sherman who you have often
cited as a recumbent guru had some very positive things to say about
the P-38. If I were to buy another recumbent, I'd give the titanium
Rotator Tiger and titanium Bacchetta Aero a serious look.
> It is uncomfortable because of the upright seat position. Most sensible folks get recumbents for comfort, not for speed.
You meant in your opinion of course. Since I have my seat adjusted to
approximately 35 degrees of tilt, with some additional latitude
remaining to provide an even more laid back position, I am left to
assume that your your persistent babbling about the P-38 being
uncomfortable due to its upright seating position is just so much
irrelevant, indefensible, disinformation, so feel free to stop
babbling about something you know little about in order to spare
yourself further embarrassment.
> > Finally, you can ride a bike all day and all night if you are comfortable
> > on
> > it. Anyone who cannot do this has missed the boat. They have sacrificed
> > comfort for speed, never a good tradeoff.
> >> I presume then that you missed the boat. I put in a significant
>
> number of miles and and get pretty fit and I wouldn't say that I could
> ride all day and all night as you claim in your inimitable unqualified
> style (read dogmatic uncorroborated opinion stated as fact). More
> than mere comfort is a required to ride all day and all night. I
> suspect that only properly trained ultra marathon endurance cyclists
> can ride all day and all night. Another thing ... comfort cannot be
> sacrificed for speed. In order to go fast one still has to have some
> degree of comfort. A super time trial bike that was faster on paper
> and in wind tunnel testing proved to be slower when ridden by Lance
> Armstrong. Why ... because he was not comfortable on the super time
> trial bike.
>
> You wouldn't last more than a few days on a week long cross state tour on
> your upright. You might last on your P-38 but you would last even better on
> my Vision.
Says who ... know nothing Dolan? When are you going to begin
qualifying your unsubstantiated errant opinions. Even three simple
letters will suffice ...IMO. You can leave out the "H" since you are
anything but HUMBLE. Understand that something is not a FACT just
because you say so. I will grant you that a long distance ride is
more comfortable on a recumbent, but I can also tell you that I rode
465 miles in four days in single digit wind chills on my upright, so I
think I would be up to the challenge of a week long cross state tour
on my bike of choosing. You know nothing of my riding capabilities,
just like you know little about the P-38.
> >> If you insist upon speaking ex cathedra, then why not become a pope!
>
> God Damn It ... I am far Greater than the Pope. I am a Great Saint and the
> Pope is merely the Pope.
Oh you are of a higher order ... that order being the order of
obnoxious, opinionated, jerks. Your posts satnd in testimony. Most
have a familiar underlying self-serving egotistical suspect message
reminiscent of ... I'm the government and I'm here to help you. The
fact, is this forum and for that matter this planet will be a better
place with your passage. You'll not be missed nor mourned.
Edward Dolan
> Get a proper recumbent with a laid back seat and you will do even "finer".
> By the way, I have a world of experience (30 years) with both uprights and
> recumbents. Even Tom Sherman likes a laid back seat.
> [...]
>> So then, the P-38 is not proper recumbent ... IN YOUR OPINION (you
again neglected to qualify)? I have 50+ years of experience riding
uprights and 10+ years of experience riding recumbents but just how
much experience do you have riding a P-38 since that is the recumbent
you are disrespectfully expounding about? I too like a laid back
seating position and, using a clock as a point of reference, I would
estimate my seat angle to be right at or about 35 degrees, so the
position of my seat it is not all that upright.
I rode a P-38 once for about 5 minutes and couldn't wait to get off of it.
The contraption is actually a torture machine.
[...]
> There is nothing to recommend the P-38 beyond speed.
>> OK, I will ask again ... Is it possible for you to ever state an
opinion (read assertion) as an opinion and a bit less emphatically?
There is nothing to recommend your opinion until you provide a
reasonable, acceptable explanation. Tom Sherman who you have often
cited as a recumbent guru had some very positive things to say about
the P-38. If I were to buy another recumbent, I'd give the titanium
Rotator Tiger and titanium Bacchetta Aero a serious look.
Tom Sherman wouldn't be caught dead on a P-38. I would advise you never to
even think about getting another recumbent since you haven't a clue as to
what they are good for. Titanium indeed!
> It is uncomfortable because of the upright seat position. Most sensible
> folks get recumbents for comfort, not for speed.
>> You meant in your opinion of course. Since I have my seat adjusted to
approximately 35 degrees of tilt, with some additional latitude
remaining to provide an even more laid back position, I am left to
assume that your your persistent babbling about the P-38 being
uncomfortable due to its upright seating position is just so much
irrelevant, indefensible, disinformation, so feel free to stop
babbling about something you know little about in order to spare
yourself further embarrassment.
I was not aware that the seat lay back could be adjusted. The one I rode had
me all crunched up so that my legs seemed to be coming into my gut as I
pedaled. If I wanted a racing position, I would get an upright, not a
recumbent.
[...]
> You wouldn't last more than a few days on a week long cross state tour on
> your upright. You might last on your P-38 but you would last even better
> on
> my Vision.
>> Says who ... know nothing Dolan? When are you going to begin
qualifying your unsubstantiated errant opinions. Even three simple
letters will suffice ...IMO. You can leave out the "H" since you are
anything but HUMBLE. Understand that something is not a FACT just
because you say so. I will grant you that a long distance ride is
more comfortable on a recumbent, but I can also tell you that I rode
465 miles in four days in single digit wind chills on my upright, so I
think I would be up to the challenge of a week long cross state tour
on my bike of choosing. You know nothing of my riding capabilities,
just like you know little about the P-38.
I know all about upright cyclists who do week long bike tours. They suffer
horribly. Their back sides hurt them so bad they can hardly walk at the end
of the day. Furthermore, who cares how many miles you go or how fast. I only
care about being on the bike for as long as possible - usually 8 to 10 hours
a day. I let the miles and the speed take care of themselves.
> >> If you insist upon speaking ex cathedra, then why not become a pope!
>
> God Damn It ... I am far Greater than the Pope. I am a Great Saint and the
> Pope is merely the Pope.
>> Oh you are of a higher order ... that order being the order of
obnoxious, opinionated, jerks. Your posts satnd in testimony. Most
have a familiar underlying self-serving egotistical suspect message
reminiscent of ... I'm the government and I'm here to help you. The
fact, is this forum and for that matter this planet will be a better
place with your passage. You'll not be missed nor mourned.
Do not ever wish the passage of others. All that does is call up the Grim
Reaper - for you!
JimmyMac
> "JimmyMac" <jimmyma...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> news:baf468b6-859e-4a1b...@s20g2000yqh.googlegroups.com...
> On Dec 3, 9:42 pm, "Edward Dolan" <edo...@iw.net> wrote:
> [...]
>
> > Get a proper recumbent with a laid back seat and you will do even "finer".
> > By the way, I have a world of experience (30 years) with both uprights and
> > recumbents. Even Tom Sherman likes a laid back seat.
> > [...]
> >> So then, the P-38 is not proper recumbent ... IN YOUR OPINION (you
>
> again neglected to qualify)? I have 50+ years of experience riding
> uprights and 10+ years of experience riding recumbents but just how
> much experience do you have riding a P-38 since that is the recumbent
> you are disrespectfully expounding about? I too like a laid back
> seating position and, using a clock as a point of reference, I would
> estimate my seat angle to be right at or about 35 degrees, so the
> position of my seat it is not all that upright.
>
> I rode a P-38 once for about 5 minutes and couldn't wait to get off of it.
> The contraption is actually a torture machine.
> [...]
O N L Y I N Y O U R O P I N I O N ... you keep forgetting
that ... I know dementia!!! And you contend that 5 minutes is an
sufficient in which to evaluate any kind of bicycle?
> > There is nothing to recommend the P-38 beyond speed.
> >> OK, I will ask again ... Is it possible for you to ever state an
>
> opinion (read assertion) as an opinion and a bit less emphatically?
> There is nothing to recommend your opinion until you provide a
> reasonable, acceptable explanation. Tom Sherman who you have often
> cited as a recumbent guru had some very positive things to say about
> the P-38. If I were to buy another recumbent, I'd give the titanium
> Rotator Tiger and titanium Bacchetta Aero a serious look.
>
> Tom Sherman wouldn't be caught dead on a P-38. I would advise you never to
> even think about getting another recumbent since you haven't a clue as to
> what they are good for. Titanium indeed!
I didn't know that Tom hired you as his mouthpiece. Tom likes
lowracers ... his preference. I've never ridden one, but suspect that
I too would like them. Thanks for the advice that was not requested,
required or wanted. You haven't a clue about almost anything. You
suffer from clue deficiency disorder. I know what for me a recumbent
is good for and know what kind of recumbent suits my particular needs
and that decision a prerogative for each of us to make and not your to
make for us. Among yor many twisted proclivities, you are also a
control freak. You are a cornucopia of mental disorders.
> > It is uncomfortable because of the upright seat position. Most sensible
> > folks get recumbents for comfort, not for speed.
> >> You meant in your opinion of course. Since I have my seat adjusted to
>
> approximately 35 degrees of tilt, with some additional latitude
> remaining to provide an even more laid back position, I am left to
> assume that your your persistent babbling about the P-38 being
> uncomfortable due to its upright seating position is just so much
> irrelevant, indefensible, disinformation, so feel free to stop
> babbling about something you know little about in order to spare
> yourself further embarrassment.
>
> I was not aware that the seat lay back could be adjusted. The one I rode had
> me all crunched up so that my legs seemed to be coming into my gut as I
> pedaled. If I wanted a racing position, I would get an upright, not a
> recumbent.
> [...]
A gut is not a good thing to have when riding a recumbent compared to
an upright. You apparently rode an earlier vintage before a change of
design allowed for adjustment of seat angle. If you were not aware of
that feature, which is years old, then perhaps you should have made a
point to become aware before running your mouth. In the future a bit
of familiarity with the subject matter would be advisable before
spewing erroneous opinions as though they were facts ... just a
thought. That has to be about as close to admission of being wrong
and posting a retraction that I have ever heard from you. That
didn't; hurt now did it? Congratulations, you are making progress.
> > You wouldn't last more than a few days on a week long cross state tour on
> > your upright. You might last on your P-38 but you would last even better
> > on
> > my Vision.
> >> Says who ... know nothing Dolan? When are you going to begin
>
> qualifying your unsubstantiated errant opinions. Even three simple
> letters will suffice ...IMO. You can leave out the "H" since you are
> anything but HUMBLE. Understand that something is not a FACT just
> because you say so. I will grant you that a long distance ride is
> more comfortable on a recumbent, but I can also tell you that I rode
> 465 miles in four days in single digit wind chills on my upright, so I
> think I would be up to the challenge of a week long cross state tour
> on my bike of choosing. You know nothing of my riding capabilities,
> just like you know little about the P-38.
>
> I know all about upright cyclists who do week long bike tours. They suffer
> horribly. Their back sides hurt them so bad they can hardly walk at the end
> of the day.
Those are obviously examples of person who did not sufficiently train
for the event. Many cyclist make that mistake. Those who make that
mistake on a recumbent will likely suffer less than those who make
that mistake on an upright, but in order to minimize suffering or
eliminate such suggering require proper preparation (time and miles)
regardless of that platform ridden.
> Furthermore, who cares how many miles you go or how fast. I only
> care about being on the bike for as long as possible - usually 8 to 10 hours
> a day. I let the miles and the speed take care of themselves.
On it or riding it? If you are on a bike 8-10 hours, I am willing to
bet that you are just puttering along and cover little distance in
relation to the hours spent. Whereas there is nothing wrong with that
and this is not a criticism, you should realize that there is nothing
wrong with riding far or riding fast either and you should afford the
same courtesy and refrain from being critical others for riding as
they choose ... to each his own, so to speak. Is that so difficult to
comprehend?
> > >> If you insist upon speaking ex cathedra, then why not become a pope!
>
> > God Damn It ... I am far Greater than the Pope. I am a Great Saint and the
> > Pope is merely the Pope.
> >> Oh you are of a higher order ... that order being the order of
>
> obnoxious, opinionated, jerks. Your posts stand in testimony. Most
> have a familiar underlying self-serving egotistical suspect message
> reminiscent of ... I'm the government and I'm here to help you. The
> fact, is this forum and for that matter this planet will be a better
> place with your passage. You'll not be missed nor mourned.
>
> Do not ever wish the passage of others. All that does is call up the Grim
> Reaper - for you!
Another unqualified opinion, I presume??
Tom Sherman
> seating position and, using a clock as a point of reference, I would
> estimate my seat angle to be right at or about 35 degrees, so the
35° from the vertical? Recline of recumbent seats is by convention
measured from the horizontal, and I would not think that a P-38 seat
would recline that far.
Tom Sherman
> [...]
> Tom Sherman wouldn't be caught dead on a P-38.[...]
Ed is right. I was alive the last time I rode a P-38 (on a metric century).
JimmyMac
wrote:
> "JimmyMac" aka Jim McNamara wrote:
>
> > [...] I too like a laid back
> > seating position and, using a clock as a point of reference, I would
> > estimate my seat angle to be right at or about 35 degrees, so the
> > position of my seat it is not all that upright.[...]
>
> 35° from the vertical? Recline of recumbent seats is by convention
> measured from the horizontal, and I would not think that a P-38 seat
> would recline that far.
I wasn't aware that, by convention, seat angle was measured from the
horizontal (the seat or the seat back????). Yes, I measured from the
vertical. Allow me to try to clarify. Looking at a clock, the seat
(meaning seat back) is tilted at an angle approximate to where the
second hand would be between 1 and 2 o'clock, but closer to the number
one than the number 2. Does that description help Tom?
JimmyMac
wrote:
> Edward Dolan wrote:
> > [...]
> > Tom Sherman wouldn't be caught dead on a P-38.[...]
>
> Ed is right. I was alive the last time I rode a P-38 (on a metric century).
Well, that'll meet with his Dolan's approval since he hates to be
proven wrong. As is often the case, however, Ed will likely not
appreciate your sense of humor, although I do.
Edward Dolan
> Furthermore, who cares how many miles you go or how fast. I only
> care about being on the bike for as long as possible - usually 8 to 10
> hours
> a day. I let the miles and the speed take care of themselves.
On it or riding it? If you are on a bike 8-10 hours, I am willing to
bet that you are just puttering along and cover little distance in
relation to the hours spent. Whereas there is nothing wrong with that
and this is not a criticism, you should realize that there is nothing
wrong with riding far or riding fast either and you should afford the
same courtesy and refrain from being critical others for riding as
they choose ... to each his own, so to speak. Is that so difficult to
comprehend?
All week long group bike tours are set up so they can be accomplished by
anyone riding at about 10 mph or so. That is my accustomed speed which is
easy to do on a recumbent without any discomfort at all. Most upright
cyclists like to go as fast as they can in order to get the ride over with
as soon as possible. Many can easily average 20 mph. I regard this kind of
hard riding as completely insane. The only reason to go that fast is to
minimize the suffering. But it doesn't do any good. They still hurt at the
end of the day.
[...]
Tom Sherman
> On Dec 4, 6:19 pm, Tom Sherman <sunsetss0...@REMOVETHISyahoo.com>
> wrote:
>> "JimmyMac" aka Jim McNamara wrote:
>>
>>> [...] I too like a laid back
>>> seating position and, using a clock as a point of reference, I would
>>> estimate my seat angle to be right at or about 35 degrees, so the
>>> position of my seat it is not all that upright.[...]
>> 35° from the vertical? Recline of recumbent seats is by convention
>> measured from the horizontal, and I would not think that a P-38 seat
>> would recline that far.
>
> I wasn't aware that, by convention, seat angle was measured from the
> horizontal (the seat or the seat back????). Yes, I measured from the
> vertical. Allow me to try to clarify. Looking at a clock, the seat
> (meaning seat back) is tilted at an angle approximate to where the
> second hand would be between 1 and 2 o'clock, but closer to the number
> one than the number 2. Does that description help Tom?
>
recall measures seat back recline referenced to horizontal. So by
convention, Jim's P-38 has a seat recline of 55°, which is quite upright
by lowracer/highracer standards, but much more reclined than a typical
CLWB (e.g. BikeE) or the well known Easy Racers Tour Easy/GRR LWB.
--
JimmyMac
> "JimmyMac" <jimmyma...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> news:fd17aa3c-bd41-4f72...@3g2000yqs.googlegroups.com...
> On Dec 4, 3:11 pm, "Edward Dolan" <edo...@iw.net> wrote:
> [...]
>
> > Furthermore, who cares how many miles you go or how fast. I only
> > care about being on the bike for as long as possible - usually 8 to 10
> > hours
> > a day. I let the miles and the speed take care of themselves.
>
> On it or riding it? If you are on a bike 8-10 hours, I am willing to
> bet that you are just puttering along and cover little distance in
> relation to the hours spent. Whereas there is nothing wrong with that
> and this is not a criticism, you should realize that there is nothing
> wrong with riding far or riding fast either and you should afford the
> same courtesy and refrain from being critical others for riding as
> they choose ... to each his own, so to speak. Is that so difficult to
> comprehend?
>
> All week long group bike tours are set up so they can be accomplished by
> anyone riding at about 10 mph or so. That is my accustomed speed which is
> easy to do on a recumbent without any discomfort at all.
So the answer is on it then. Most peopl wal about 3 mph and speed
walker attain speeds of 5+mph. 10 mph woudl be for me a bike boring
pace aking to a bike balancing act. for the less skilled.
> Most upright
> cyclists like to go as fast as they can in order to get the ride over with
> as soon as possible.
In your opinion you meant to say. Stating opinion as fact appears to
be an incurable bad habit of yours. I ride fast some days and smell
the roses on other regardless of whether I am on the recumbent or the
upright.
> Many can easily average 20 mph.
They can? Try it sometime. I am willing to bet you can't do that for
5 miles.
> I regard this kind of hard riding as completely insane.
Congratulations ... you finally qualified an opinion . There is hope
for you after all.
> The only reason to go that fast is to
> minimize the suffering. But it doesn't do any good. They still hurt at the
> end of the day.
I take is all back since you immediately reverted back to your usual
style ... the Dolan de facto maifesto. Readers, this should not come
as a revelation ... a purveyor of disinformation, Dolan fancies
himself to be a polymathic profundity (just look it up Conan the
Librarian), then again Ed is known to place far more stock in his
unqaulified, wayward opinions than do others.
JimmyMac
OK, then as conventionally measured, 55 degrees is about right I'd
say. Ligntning indicates on their website that seat angle has
adjustable range of 50-65 degrees but with electrical ties keeping the
seat taught so that it doesn't contact the tire, 45 (maybe even 40)
might just be possible. Regardless, my seat angle is upright in
comparison to lowracer/highracer standards and comfortable enough, but
still noticeably challenging into a stiff headwind.
Jim
Tom Sherman
> [...]
>
> They can? Try it sometime. I am willing to bet you can't do that for
In the country, riding along at 20 mph on the flats typically results in
average speeds of 16-18 mph. In town, that would usually drop to 12-14
mph. Many riders report what they typically ride at on the flats, not
the true rolling average.
--
Edward Dolan
On Dec 5, 4:06 pm, "Edward Dolan" <edo...@iw.net> wrote:
> "JimmyMac" <jimmyma...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> news:fd17aa3c-bd41-4f72...@3g2000yqs.googlegroups.com...
> On Dec 4, 3:11 pm, "Edward Dolan" <edo...@iw.net> wrote:
> [...]
>
> > Furthermore, who cares how many miles you go or how fast. I only
> > care about being on the bike for as long as possible - usually 8 to 10
> > hours
> > a day. I let the miles and the speed take care of themselves.
>
> On it or riding it? If you are on a bike 8-10 hours, I am willing to
> bet that you are just puttering along and cover little distance in
> relation to the hours spent. Whereas there is nothing wrong with that
> and this is not a criticism, you should realize that there is nothing
> wrong with riding far or riding fast either and you should afford the
> same courtesy and refrain from being critical others for riding as
> they choose ... to each his own, so to speak. Is that so difficult to
> comprehend?
>
> All week long group bike tours are set up so they can be accomplished by
> anyone riding at about 10 mph or so. That is my accustomed speed which is
> easy to do on a recumbent without any discomfort at all.
>> So the answer is on it then. Most people walk about 3 mph and speed
walker attain speeds of 5+mph. 10 mph would be for me a bike boring
pace akin to a bike balancing act for the less skilled.
Yes, you no doubt ride your bike the way you lead your life - frenetic and
senseless! The only thing you are rushing to is your death.
> Most upright
> cyclists like to go as fast as they can in order to get the ride over with
> as soon as possible.
>> In your opinion you meant to say. Stating opinion as fact appears to
be an incurable bad habit of yours. I ride fast some days and smell
the roses on other regardless of whether I am on the recumbent or the
upright.
Upright cyclists do not ever ride slowly on a week long tour. If they did,
it would kill them.
> Many can easily average 20 mph.
>> They can? Try it sometime. I am willing to bet you can't do that for
5 miles.
A hard, fast ride takes all the enjoyment out of cycling.
> I regard this kind of hard riding as completely insane.
Congratulations ... you finally qualified an opinion . There is hope
for you after all.
> The only reason to go that fast is to
> minimize the suffering. But it doesn't do any good. They still hurt at the
> end of the day.
>> I take is all back since you immediately reverted back to your usual
style ... the Dolan de facto maifesto. Readers, this should not come
as a revelation ... a purveyor of disinformation, Dolan fancies
himself to be a polymathic profundity (just look it up Conan the
Librarian), then again Ed is known to place far more stock in his
unqaulified, wayward opinions than do others.
Usenet is all about opinion and nothing else. Even Tom Sherman, who likes to
be factual, ends up being as opinionated as anyone. It is not opinion per
say that matters so much as the quality of the opinion being expressed. Ed
Dolan the Great is in a class by himself when it comes to opinion. These
cycling newsgroups are fortunate indeed to have such a Great One in their
midst.
Edward Dolan
"Tom Sherman" <sunset...@REMOVETHISyahoo.com> wrote in message
news:ghe5ir$e9e$3...@news.motzarella.org...
> JimmyMac aka Jim McNamara wrote:
>> [...]
>>> Many can easily average 20 mph.
>>
>> They can? Try it sometime. I am willing to bet you can't do that for
>> 5 miles.[...]
>
> In the country, riding along at 20 mph on the flats typically results in
> average speeds of 16-18 mph. In town, that would usually drop to 12-14
> mph. Many riders report what they typically ride at on the flats, not the
> true rolling average.
On most week long bike tours the riders at the end of the day would compare
their average speeds on their bike computers. A 20 mph average speed was not
at all uncommon. I would show them my less than 10 mph average speed and
proceed to tell them how stupid they were to go so fast. They were missing
everything a bike tour is set up to give you - to ride casually along taking
in the countryside and talking to your fellow cyclists about cabbages and
kings.
Edward Dolan
Your P-38 seat angle is also very upright compared to most normal
recumbents - which is why I don't like it. An upright seat angle puts too
much weight on your butt. You want some weight on your back in order to
maximize comfort. Either get laid back or forget about it!
JimmyMac
wrote:
> JimmyMac aka Jim McNamara wrote:
>
> > [...]
> >> Many can easily average 20 mph.
>
> > They can? Try it sometime. I am willing to bet you can't do that for
> > 5 miles.[...]
>
> In the country, riding along at 20 mph on the flats typically results in
> average speeds of 16-18 mph. In town, that would usually drop to 12-14
> mph. Many riders report what they typically ride at on the flats, not
> the true rolling average.
I find that on routes comprised of mixture of urban plus "less urban"
roads yields averages about 3-4 mph less than the typical speed
ridden . Those stops and starts just destroy the rolling average as
any computer, even those with the auto start/stop feature plainly
reveal. I always report actual average (true rolling speed) speed,
not the typical ride speed reported by many riders.
JimmyMac
> "JimmyMac" <jimmyma...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
I tend to slouch in upright furniture and drive my car (which isn't
often (just over 5000 miles on a 2003 Infiinti G35 sport coupe) with
the seat reclined much more than most. I find the angle at which I
now have the P-38 seat to suit me as is, but I might experiment with
an even more laid back position next year, but the truth is, I only
rode it about 1000 miles last year. I have returned to my roots
somewhat ... preferring to ride upright.
JimmyMac
> "JimmyMac" <jimmyma...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> news:1b767776-576d-4834...@f13g2000yqj.googlegroups.com...
> On Dec 5, 4:06 pm, "Edward Dolan" <edo...@iw.net> wrote:
>
>
>
> > "JimmyMac" <jimmyma...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> >news:fd17aa3c-bd41-4f72...@3g2000yqs.googlegroups.com...
> > On Dec 4, 3:11 pm, "Edward Dolan" <edo...@iw.net> wrote:
> > [...]
>
> > > Furthermore, who cares how many miles you go or how fast. I only
> > > care about being on the bike for as long as possible - usually 8 to 10
> > > hours
> > > a day. I let the miles and the speed take care of themselves.
>
> > On it or riding it? If you are on a bike 8-10 hours, I am willing to
> > bet that you are just puttering along and cover little distance in
> > relation to the hours spent. Whereas there is nothing wrong with that
> > and this is not a criticism, you should realize that there is nothing
> > wrong with riding far or riding fast either and you should afford the
> > same courtesy and refrain from being critical others for riding as
> > they choose ... to each his own, so to speak. Is that so difficult to
> > comprehend?
>
> > All week long group bike tours are set up so they can be accomplished by
> > anyone riding at about 10 mph or so. That is my accustomed speed which is
> > easy to do on a recumbent without any discomfort at all.
> >> So the answer is on it then. Most people walk about 3 mph and speed
>
> pace akin to a bike balancing act for the less skilled.
>
> Yes, you no doubt ride your bike the way you lead your life - frenetic and
> senseless! The only thing you are rushing to is your death.
No doubt??? OPINION ... OPINION ... UNQUALIFIED ERRANT OPINION!!!
You have neither knowledge redagrading how I lead my life nor is is
any concern of yours.
> > Most upright
> > cyclists like to go as fast as they can in order to get the ride over with
> > as soon as possible.
> >> In your opinion you meant to say. Stating opinion as fact appears to
>
> be an incurable bad habit of yours. I ride fast some days and smell
> the roses on other regardless of whether I am on the recumbent or the
> upright.
>
> Upright cyclists do not ever ride slowly on a week long tour. If they did,
> it would kill them.
In your OPINION, you mean???
> > Many can easily average 20 mph.
> >> They can? Try it sometime. I am willing to bet you can't do that for
>
> 5 miles.
>
> A hard, fast ride takes all the enjoyment out of cycling.
One that doesn't address the issue and two you have again stated an
opinion as though it were fact. I enjoy both fast and slow rides. In
order for you to have some basis for your opinion adn difinitively
know if riding fast is enjoyable you would first have to be capable of
riding fast. First hand experience and knowledge have never been
prerequisites required for you to formulate an uninformed opinion not
to present it as fact.
> > I regard this kind of hard riding as completely insane.
>
> Congratulations ... you finally qualified an opinion . There is hope
> for you after all.
>
> > The only reason to go that fast is to
> > minimize the suffering. But it doesn't do any good. They still hurt at the
> > end of the day.
> >> I take is all back since you immediately reverted back to your usual
>
> style ... the Dolan de facto maifesto. Readers, this should not come
> as a revelation ... a purveyor of disinformation, Dolan fancies
> himself to be a polymathic profundity (just look it up Conan the
> Librarian), then again Ed is known to place far more stock in his
> unqualified, wayward opinions than do others.
>
> Usenet is all about opinion and nothing else. Even Tom Sherman, who likes to
> be factual, ends up being as opinionated as anyone. It is not opinion per
> say that matters so much as the quality of the opinion being expressed.
Quality of opinion is largely dependent upon the quality and quantity
of firsthand knowledge and/or experience. Most of your opinions lack
both prerequisites. An opinion not based upon knowledge and/or
experience, is not one of quality and to contend so makes for yet
another characteristic groundless opinion lacking in quality.
> Ed
> Dolan the Great is in a class by himself when it comes to opinion.
No argument with that opinion as you are the most opinionated person I
have ever encountered ... good that you are in a class by
yourself .and are are not a twin.
> These
> cycling newsgroups are fortunate indeed to have such a Great One in their
> midst.
GRATE One, why not chage your self-serving, egocentric signature to
the Delusional One???
Edward Dolan
> Yes, you no doubt ride your bike the way you lead your life - frenetic and
> senseless! The only thing you are rushing to is your death.
>> No doubt??? OPINION ... OPINION ... UNQUALIFIED ERRANT OPINION!!!
You have neither knowledge redagrading how I lead my life nor is is
any concern of yours.
I KNOW you should be taking your two poor old longsuffering hound dogs for a
walk more and talking to your poor old longsuffering wife more - and do far
less posting nonsensical messages to Usenet.
[...]
> A hard, fast ride takes all the enjoyment out of cycling.
>> One that doesn't address the issue and two you have again stated an
opinion as though it were fact. I enjoy both fast and slow rides. In
order for you to have some basis for your opinion adn difinitively
know if riding fast is enjoyable you would first have to be capable of
riding fast. First hand experience and knowledge have never been
prerequisites required for you to formulate an uninformed opinion not
to present it as fact.
If you want to go fast, I suggest you get on a jet airplane and fly to
Fairbanks, Alaska. Once there, you will discover that the only thing to do
is to hibernate and drink Livingston Cellars Red Rose, the finest wine Gallo
ever invented.
[...]
> Usenet is all about opinion and nothing else. Even Tom Sherman, who likes
> to
> be factual, ends up being as opinionated as anyone. It is not opinion per
> se that matters so much as the quality of the opinion being expressed.
>> Quality of opinion is largely dependent upon the quality and quantity
of firsthand knowledge and/or experience. Most of your opinions lack
both prerequisites. An opinion not based upon knowledge and/or
experience, is not one of quality and to contend so makes for yet
another characteristic groundless opinion lacking in quality.
Ed Dolan the Great belongs in the camp of a priori type of knowledge.
Experience is unnecessary and only screws things up. Experience is the main
thing that constantly leads Tom Sherman astray. Nay, it is far better to
think a thing through without any experience at all. Either get a proper
contempt for facts or get lost!
[...]
Edward Dolan
"Little Meow" <me...@meow.meow> wrote in message
news:Xns9B6D6A2B...@140.99.99.130...
> "Edward Dolan" <edo...@iw.net> wrote in
> news:hOednbRzVIDZTafU...@prairiewave.com:
>
>>
>> Ed Dolan the Great is in a class by himself when it
>> comes to opinion. These cycling newsgroups are fortunate indeed to
>> have such a Great One in their midst.
>>
>
> far more qualified opinions.
>
> Are you related to T. Herman Zweibel?
Are you related to Marika? Talk about two peas in a pod!
Edward Dolan
> Your P-38 seat angle is also very upright compared to most normal
> recumbents - which is why I don't like it. An upright seat angle puts too
> much weight on your butt. You want some weight on your back in order to
> maximize comfort. Either get laid back or forget about it!
>> I tend to slouch in upright furniture and drive my car (which isn't
often (just over 5000 miles on a 2003 Infiinti G35 sport coupe) with
the seat reclined much more than most. I find the angle at which I
now have the P-38 seat to suit me as is, but I might experiment with
an even more laid back position next year, but the truth is, I only
rode it about 1000 miles last year. I have returned to my roots
somewhat ... preferring to ride upright.
I don't think you can get much lay back with the P-38. If and when you
decided to get back to recumbents, you might want to consider a truly
comfortable recumbent where you can lay back the seat to the max. Never mind
about any titanium bikes. They are for the young and the speedy, not for the
old and the decrepit like us.
JimmyMac
> "JimmyMac" <jimmyma...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
1. He who wishes to be heard must first learn to listen.
2. I do not require nor did I ask for your advice. Your advice was
unwelcome and will go unheeded. I am capable of making my own
decisions.
3. I have stated this several times before, but it continues to elude
your poor powers of perception With the current tilt angle, installed
BMX suspension fork, larger front wheel, electrical tie laced mesh
seat with inflatable seat cushion, I find my P-38 very comfortable
Your speculation is immaterial and your conjecture irrelevant. I'm
the one riding the bike and what works for me is what is significant,
not your gratuitious, unwarranted and errant opinion.
4. When are you going to learn that you can speak for yourself but not
for others? Titanium is a choice for me to make and not for you to
make for me. My upright is titanium and I find it to be a great
material for a bike frame, Old inevitably equates to slower, but not
necessarily slow. You may be old and slow, but I'm not, so you
needn't refer to "US" as if we were one and the same ... WE ARE
NOT!!!. You couldn't hold my wheel, Ed. I trained for years with a
professional 19 years my junior. I've ridden with national and world
record holders, champions and an Olympian and earned their respect.
Can you say the same? Granted, most people my age don't ride like I
do and that is specifically why all my riding companions are in the
30's an 40's. You may be decrepit, but unlike you, I am still
SPEEDY. You need to get up to speed in more ways than one it would
appear.
JimmyMac
It is worthy to note that an opinion corresponds with fact in direct
correlation to the extent with which it is based in fact. A purveyor
of disinformation, your opinions are most often comprised of
immaterial speculation and irrelevant supposition. In referring to
your own personal opinion, you should never use quality and opinion in
the same sentence. There is a immense difference between opinion and
conjecture. You are not all about opinion. You are all about
conjecture ... a none too subtle distinction which exceeds your poor
powers of perception.
gotbent
"JimmyMac"
<snip>
Old inevitably equates to slower, but not
necessarily slow. You may be old and slow, but I'm not, so you
needn't refer to "US" as if we were one and the same ... WE ARE
NOT!!!. You couldn't hold my wheel, Ed. I trained for years with a
professional 19 years my junior. I've ridden with national and world
record holders, champions and an Olympian and earned their respect.
Can you say the same? Granted, most people my age don't ride like I
do and that is specifically why all my riding companions are in the
30's an 40's. You may be decrepit, but unlike you, I am still
SPEEDY. You need to get up to speed in more ways than one it would
appear.
<end quote>
Hi JimmyMac.
You might want to add a few disclaimers to your resume, up there. Fast is,
when talking about other riders, a subjective and argumenitive metric. Truth
be told, I've never met you, but since just about anyone on the planet can
ride faster than me, I'll assume you can too. But as far as the claim you
make about your relative fastness...I can imagine the monkey islanders
laughing their collective asses off at you right now. Maybe next spring I
can be one of the spectators watching you take on the monkeys for a repeat
of the classic Kaneville century. If you want bragging rights though, you'll
have to ride your titanium road bike. If you ride the P38 you'll have too
much of an advantage over those old slowpokes on their stuffy old fashioned
carbon land missles. You could be strong competition for cuda-boy, though.
You'll probably sit in on the baracuda's draft and slingshot around right at
the very end for a sub 3 and a half hour century. That would give you some
bragging rights. Just kicking everyone riding on carbon and steel lowracers
asses while you're blasting by on the P38...there's no sport in it.
I also have to give props where they are due JimmyMac. I admit to passing on
almost every set of posts the has Ed and then your name and then using the
'catch-up' button to mark all the stupid shit you two post to each other as
read. But for some reason I decided to open this post. I might have been
thinking that the real dirt on LeQuann was going to show up, but instead, I
got to read the load of SPEEDY Olympic World Champion Jimmymac CRAP. This is
one of the funniest posts in the history of ARBR...even better than Cletus
telling Martin Krieg to fok-off. Thanks for the BIG LAFF JimmyMac. You've
brightened my day.
gotbent, aka FRT rider
ps see ya in Kaneville?
Edward Dolan
> I don't think you can get much lay back with the P-38. If and when you
> decided to get back to recumbents, you might want to consider a truly
> comfortable recumbent where you can lay back the seat to the max. Never
> mind
> about any titanium bikes. They are for the young and the speedy, not for
> the
> old and the decrepit like us.
>>> 1. He who wishes to be heard must first learn to listen.
He who wishes to be heard must first learn not to stalk. In other words, get
a life!
>>> 2. I do not require nor did I ask for your advice. Your advice was
unwelcome and will go unheeded. I am capable of making my own
decisions.
You belong in an asylum where others can make ALL your decisions for you.
Whoever heard of a stalker who had any brains.
>>> 3. I have stated this several times before, but it continues to elude
your poor powers of perception With the current tilt angle, installed
BMX suspension fork, larger front wheel, electrical tie laced mesh
seat with inflatable seat cushion, I find my P-38 very comfortable
Your speculation is immaterial and your conjecture irrelevant. I'm
the one riding the bike and what works for me is what is significant,
not your gratuitious, unwarranted and errant opinion.
You would know what comfort was if it jumped up bit you in your dumb ass.
>>> 4. When are you going to learn that you can speak for yourself but not
for others? Titanium is a choice for me to make and not for you to
make for me. My upright is titanium and I find it to be a great
material for a bike frame, Old inevitably equates to slower, but not
necessarily slow. You may be old and slow, but I'm not, so you
needn't refer to "US" as if we were one and the same ... WE ARE
NOT!!!. You couldn't hold my wheel, Ed. I trained for years with a
professional 19 years my junior. I've ridden with national and world
record holders, champions and an Olympian and earned their respect.
Can you say the same? Granted, most people my age don't ride like I
do and that is specifically why all my riding companions are in the
30's an 40's. You may be decrepit, but unlike you, I am still
SPEEDY. You need to get up to speed in more ways than one it would
appear.
If you are old (65 I think), then you are slow - period! You are also self
deluded. Ask your wife if she thinks you are young and speedy? I may be old
and decrepit but I still have some common sense - nor am I self deluded like
you!
Edward Dolan
"gotbent" <dont...@memail.com> wrote in message
news:493d60ab$0$21884$7836...@newsrazor.net...
Gotbent, I have been saddled with one of the most crazy persons I have ever
encountered on Usenet. JimmyMac cannot possibly be sane. I have prodded and
poked him every which way I can think of, and yet he comes back for more. I
think he must be the most lonely person in the entire universe to want to
send messages to someone like me. I am here for farce (even Tom Sherman
figured that much out) and he is dumb enough to take me seriously. I mean,
how do you get to be so clueless?
JimmyMac
give the monkeys this much. There is some very fast company in that
group and some advanced fast bikes (carbon land misiles [sic] as you
refer to them) ... aerodynamic low racers that offer a distinct
advantage over the upright platform when it comes to blazing the
tarmac. Always wanted to spend some time on one, but never have. I
just prefer the upright I guess. If that means I am slower on a
titanium upright than I would be on a carbon lowracer missile, I can
accept that since cycling isn't all about speed fo me. Selectively
reading just a portion, and not all of the thread, you apparently
missed that. Like I said to Dolan .. I enjoy riding be it fast or
slow. I just enjoy being on a bike.
JimmyMac
> "JimmyMac" <jimmyma...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
62 actually. Age and performance do not equate quite like your
distorted pointless point of view insists. You know Ed, there guys 70
years of age and older that are still tuning in sub hour 40K (25 mile)
time trials. Averaging better than 25 miles per hour for an hour at
that age is not slow no matter what kind of spin you put on it. As
for asking my wife ... there's no need. She often remarks how young I
still look and how fast I still am on a bike. I hope that I will
become old and decrepit long after you were stricken. You are not
self-deluded? Thanks for the best laugh of the day. I see you had
nothing more worthwhile to add to the tread in response to each of my
points.
1. You still don't and won't listen. You're to busy talking.
2. You still give advice not asked for or needed.
3. You still contend that you and not I should determine what is
suitable and comfortable for me ... preposterous.
4. You still feel you can speak on behalf of others and in your
characteristic myopic manner still fee that you can state errant
opinions not supported by fact.
Pull up a chair and pay attention. It is worthy to note that an
opinion coincides with fact only in direct relation to the degree with
which it is based in fact. A purveyor of disinformation, your
opinions are most often comprised of immaterial speculation and
irrelevant supposition. There is a immense difference between opinion
and conjecture. You are not all about opinion. You are all about
conjecture ... a none too subtle distinction which exceeds your poor
powers of perception.
> > Regards,
JimmyMac
> "gotbent" <donts...@memail.com> wrote in message
You aren't hear for farce. You are a farce and you are hear for
reasons than you are unwilling to recognize or admit to.
Edward Dolan
>
>Money Islander opinions and yours in particular matter not, but I will
give the monkeys this much. There is some very fast company in that
group and some advanced fast bikes (carbon land misiles [sic] as you
refer to them) ... aerodynamic low racers that offer a distinct
advantage over the upright platform when it comes to blazing the
tarmac. Always wanted to spend some time on one, but never have. I
just prefer the upright I guess. If that means I am slower on a
titanium upright than I would be on a carbon lowracer missile, I can
reading just a portion, and not all of the thread, you apparently
missed that. Like I said to Dolan .. I enjoy riding be it fast or
slow. I just enjoy being on a bike.
An older person attempting to be fast on any kind of a bike is an absurdity.
Grow up and act your age. When you have become wise like Ed Dolan the Great,
you will KNOW that going slow is the ultimate high. Leave speed to the young
and the foolish.
[...]
Edward Dolan
> If you are old (65 I think), then you are slow - period! You are also self
> deluded. Ask your wife if she thinks you are young and speedy? I may be
> old
> and decrepit but I still have some common sense - nor am I self deluded
> like
> you!
>> 62 actually. Age and performance do not equate quite like your
distorted pointless point of view insists. You know Ed, there guys 70
years of age and older that are still tuning in sub hour 40K (25 mile)
time trials. Averaging better than 25 miles per hour for an hour at
that age is not slow no matter what kind of spin you put on it. As
for asking my wife ... there's no need. She often remarks how young I
still look and how fast I still am on a bike. I hope that I will
become old and decrepit long after you were stricken. You are not
self-deluded? Thanks for the best laugh of the day. I see you had
nothing more worthwhile to add to the tread in response to each of my
points.
What fun is it to go fast if you have to kill yourself doing it? The young
can go fast without much effort at all.
>> 1. You still don't and won't listen. You're to busy talking.
2. You still give advice not asked for or needed.
3. You still contend that you and not I should determine what is
suitable and comfortable for me ... preposterous.
4. You still feel you can speak on behalf of others and in your
characteristic myopic manner still fee that you can state errant
opinions not supported by fact.
It is all part of My Greatness to tell others what is good for them. No one
else should ever do this unless they are also Great like Me! What are the
chances of lightning (the Grace of God) ever striking anyone twice? Yea,
there can only be one Ed Dolan the Great!
>> Pull up a chair and pay attention. It is worthy to note that an
opinion coincides with fact only in direct relation to the degree with
which it is based in fact. A purveyor of disinformation, your
opinions are most often comprised of immaterial speculation and
irrelevant supposition. There is a immense difference between opinion
and conjecture. You are not all about opinion. You are all about
conjecture ... a none too subtle distinction which exceeds your poor
powers of perception.
Please look up "a priori" in your dictionary to get an idea of where I am
coming from. I spit on facts and experience. What is there about this that
you do not understand?
An opinion and a conjecture are one and the same thing. Leave the splitting
of hairs to a genius like me.
Tom Sherman
> [...]But for some reason I decided to open this post. I might have been
> thinking that the real dirt on LeQuann was going to show up, but instead[...]
I do have a couple of somewhat funny short stories concerning what
LeQuan told someone about a substandard part and Tim about a setup
problem, but I should not post them on a public forum. I think we also
have a mutual acquaintance who threated to kick Brummer's posterior over
problems with an R-84 [1].
[1] The one the AARP [2] guy broke the drive-train on.
[2] An Aerogant (sic) Recumbent Pusher.
--
JimmyMac
> "JimmyMac" <jimmyma...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> news:4234b4da-0f9c-4298...@j38g2000yqa.googlegroups.com...
>
> >Money Islander opinions and yours in particular matter not, but I will
>
> give the monkeys this much. There is some very fast company in that
> group and some advanced fast bikes (carbon land misiles [sic] as you
> refer to them) ... aerodynamic low racers that offer a distinct
> advantage over the upright platform when it comes to blazing the
> tarmac. Always wanted to spend some time on one, but never have. I
> just prefer the upright I guess. If that means I am slower on a
> titanium upright than I would be on a carbon lowracer missile, I can
> accept that since cycling isn't all about speed for me. Selectively
> reading just a portion, and not all of the thread, you apparently
> missed that. Like I said to Dolan .. I enjoy riding be it fast or
> slow. I just enjoy being on a bike.
>
> An older person attempting to be fast on any kind of a bike is an absurdity.
> Grow up and act your age. When you have become wise like Ed Dolan the Great,
> you will KNOW that going slow is the ultimate high. Leave speed to the young
> and the foolish.
> [...]
A person of your age refusing to acknowledge the capabilities and
achievements of those in his age group, demonstrates absurdity. There
are those of age who not only attempt to be fast on a bicycle but
succeed. Just because you are incapable, it does not follow that
everyone else should follow in the footsteps of an underachiever. You
are not only opinionated. You are bullheaded. In your case, with age
comes wisdom just doesn't apply. I hope that I will never become so
close minded as you as I grow older. Oh, and I will ride I as I
choose and not as you advise. I guess you still haven't got the
message that your advice, like you opinion is of no value.
Edward Dolan
I never cease to be amazed at my own genius. How did I ever get to be so
Great? Yea, that is the question!
JimmyMac
>
> I never cease to be amazed at my own genius. How did I ever get to be so
> Great? Yea, that is the question!
I never cease to be amazed now very often you deliberately ignore or
misconstrue what others say and rely with nothing more than an
immaterial, irrelevant, cavalier rejoinder.
JimmyMac
> "gotbent" <donts...@memail.com> wrote in message
Not that it much matters, but I think you missed the point that
Gotbent doesn't think very highly of either of us.
JimmyMac
Oops. I forgot to add that one of your Monkey Islanders once said of
me that I was the fastest 50 year old he knew and added that even the
pros think he's [me] fast, although cycling isn't all about going
fast. Oh and Gotbent ..... GET BENT!
Edward Dolan
> Gotbent, I have been saddled with one of the most crazy persons I have
> ever
> encountered on Usenet. JimmyMac cannot possibly be sane. I have prodded
> and
> poked him every which way I can think of, and yet he comes back for more.
> I
> think he must be the most lonely person in the entire universe to want to
> send messages to someone like me. I am here for farce (even Tom Sherman
> how do you get to be so clueless?
>> Not that it much matters, but I think you missed the point that
Gotbent doesn't think very highly of either of us.
The point is that I don't care what anyone on Usenet thinks of me and you
do. From that alone stems all your troubles.
Edward Dolan
> > An older person attempting to be fast on any kind of a bike is an
> > absurdity.
> > Grow up and act your age. When you have become wise like Ed Dolan the
> > Great,
> > you will KNOW that going slow is the ultimate high. Leave speed to the
> > young
> > and the foolish.
> > [...]
> >> A person of your age refusing to acknowledge the capabilities and
> achievements of those in his age group, demonstrates absurdity. There
> are those of age who not only attempt to be fast on a bicycle but
> succeed. Just because you are incapable, it does not follow that
> everyone else should follow in the footsteps of an underachiever. You
> are not only opinionated. You are bullheaded. In your case, with age
> comes wisdom just doesn't apply. I hope that I will never become so
> close minded as you as I grow older. Oh, and I will ride I as I
> choose and not as you advise. I guess you still haven't got the
> message that your advice, like your opinion is of no value.
>
> I never cease to be amazed at my own genius. How did I ever get to be so
> Great? Yea, that is the question!
>>>> I never cease to be amazed now very often you deliberately ignore or
misconstrue what others say and rely with nothing more than an
immaterial, irrelevant, cavalier rejoinder.
I must insist that you cease from this constant praise of My Greatness. It
is starting to embarrass me. Yes, I am Great and you aren't, but that does
not give you free reign to wallow in unrestrained envy. After all, I am not
(yet) a god! I urge you to moderate your enthusiasm for Ed Dolan the Great.
It is unseemly to be so worshipful.
JimmyMac
> "JimmyMac" <jimmyma...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> news:d23cf524-9420-4bc0...@g1g2000pra.googlegroups.com...
> On Dec 8, 2:57 pm, "Edward Dolan" <edo...@iw.net> wrote:
> [...]
>
> > Gotbent, I have been saddled with one of the most crazy persons I have
> > ever
> > encountered on Usenet. JimmyMac cannot possibly be sane. I have prodded
> > and
> > poked him every which way I can think of, and yet he comes back for more.
> > I
> > think he must be the most lonely person in the entire universe to want to
> > send messages to someone like me. I am here for farce (even Tom Sherman
> > figured that much out) and yet he is dumb enough to take me seriously. I
> > mean,
> > how do you get to be so clueless?
> >> Not that it much matters, but I think you missed the point that
>
> Gotbent doesn't think very highly of either of us.
>
> The point is that I don't care what anyone on Usenet thinks of me and you
> do. From that alone stems all your troubles
Oh really now??? Another unsubstantiated opinion??? Actually, I
couldn't care less what you or Gotbent think. As I have often
reiterated ... what anyoone thinks of me does not define who and what
I am. How many time have I said ... your opinion matters not because
you matter not??? Sooner or later this will all sink into that thick
skull of yours.
JimmyMac
> "JimmyMac" <jimmyma...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
Me thinks that Conan the Librarian needs to reacquaint himself with
the meaning of the word ... MISCONSTRUE!