Crossjammer, you misunderstood me
juon...@bvc.edu
My message is that experimentation is fine and dandy... you don't need a
stamp of approval to do NOTHIN'. My point IS that said experimentation
needs to be taken with a grain of salt by the hip-hop audience, as is
already done. Some experimentation works, like Jazzmatazz. Some doesn't,
like PM Dawn. What we need to do is keep an eye on where these experiments
take us, and diss them if they are wack.
The Crossjammer
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This one is easy enough... "true" hip-hop is good... this includes
jazz/hip-hop fusion, as long as it is done respectfully, for both jazz and
hip-hop. What is wack is when people try to fuzz music styles together
without any consideration of how the the people in the respective genres
feel, or do it without any taste.
....
Obviously not (ahem). I suppose it doesn't bother you that LL Cool J is
trying to rap with the Boston Philharmonic playing in the background.
WACK! WACK! I'm saying if you are coming into hip-hop with something
outside hip-hop, you better be 150% sure that it will fit musically and
culturally into what is already defined as hip-hop, or you are distorting
what "true" hip-hop is. Reggae, yes... jazz, yes... Opera? NEVER!
----------------------------------------------------------------------
If L.L. could come off with a def Opera/Hip Hop mixup he'd get props. Yet
you seem to believe this would automagically be booty just because it
doesn't fit into your notion of "true" hip hop. What do you think about
Special Ed's "Hoedown", a pretty bumpin track from back in the day that bit
a little C&W, that's right Country and Western.
Even more interestingly at the time it first came out you wouldn't have
considered "Rockbox" by Run-DMC "legit" since it combined hardcore guitar
and hip hop.
Also, since jazz hop doesn't fit Wynton's concept of jazz and one of the
giants (and many other jazz afficianados) consider it disrespectful
shouldn't hip hoppers discontinue the jazz hop? And who knew when they
first tried the jazz hop mix that it would actually work? Turns out it has,
but the real pioneers didn't say, "Damn, I wonder if I'm ruining true
hip hop if mix these two styles." Probably more like, "This could sound
dope lets give it a shot." That's the only way hip hop has and will
continue to grow.
Some attempts will be booty, some will be great. Most interesting but in
need of work ala "Judgement Day". Why single them out on the the basis of
style mixing?
It doesn't matter where the style comes from, it's what you do with it that counts.
--
xj...@cork.Berkeley.EDU Fiiiive Thousand Boomin Watts...... -The JBeez
They can't come on and play me in prime time, | Free Millipede coin op
Cause I know the time, cause I'm gettin' mine. | and House music at my
I get on the mix late in the night... -Public Enemy | place! Drop by sometime.
R. Wagner
Who defines "wack"? Who decides whether an experiment "works"? What you
define as wack may be all that to somebody else. You seem to not like much
in the hip-hop/whatever mixture catagory. Have you ever heard Enigma? They
set a Gregorian chant up with a bass heavy beat. I happen to like it. It's
not the most played tape in my truck, but I like it. Is that "wack"? Am I
"wack" because I like it. It's a question of taste. If you don't like
broccoli, does that mean it's a "wack" vegetable and shouldn't be grown? I
like broccoli and would be upset it if was not grown because some 3rd party
decided it was "wack". If you want hip-hop to remain pure, then pick your
"pure" artists and follow them, but if an artist wants to slide a tentacle
into the realm of R&B or jazz or reggae or whatever, who are you to say "you
can't do that"? Personally, most country music makes my teeth itch, but my
wife loves it, so is country "wack" or not? Depends on who you ask. Just
remember that your opinion is exactly that, YOURS. If you want to let it
be known that you think hip-hop+reggae is "wack" that's cool, but you can't
tell the fans of that type of music (me) that it's "wack" on a global basis
just because you don't like it.
Raydude. (longwinded master of the runon sentence)
David J.
>Personally, most country music makes my teeth itch, but my
>wife loves it, so is country "wack" or not? Depends on who you ask. Just
>remember that your opinion is exactly that, YOURS.
True story: My mother is getting into country music much more heavily these
days, and while I was inthe car with her, she was scanning the radio stations
looking for something worthwhile (at least for her) to listen to. She gets
to one station and hears what she thinks is some kind of country swing thing
and sticks with it. That is, until she hears...
"Just wakin' up in the morning, gotta thank God.
I don't know, but today seems kinda odd..."
She laughed, at least.
>Raydude. (longwinded master of the runon sentence)
--
David J.---------...@silver.ucs.indiana.edu------------GO HOOSIERS!!!
| Hip Hop |************ HIP HOP CENTRAL with David J. Warner ************|
| Junkie and |**** Cable radio's phattest show - Saturdays 9pm-Midnight ****|
| MST3K Fan |***** Exclusively on WIUS--95.1 FMCable, Bloomington, IN *****|
Enuma Olanrewaju Ogunyemi
I don't think he misunderstood you - at least that is the same way I read
the issue. If you think they are wack DON"T BUY THEM.
BTW: To the person who was talking about Shabba in the Hammer files, that was
true but Ranking Slackness has come back rough with a TRUE DANCEHALL hit: "Shine
yuh gun" or "Shine & Criss" (depending on whether you got it on 12" from Epic or
7" from Shang (Straight from yard). On the B side is a Bounty Killer track, "Fat
and Sexy." It is interesting that Shabba who made his name of talking bout women
is coming back rough with the gun talk while the ultimate non-Ninjaman bad boy,
Bounty Killa is featured here with a girls tune.
However this 12" is due to be released on a compilation album - I guess
they are trying to diversify Shabba's appeal - one product for the true fans and
a pop product for.. well you know.
For those who don't know Bounty Killer (formerly Bounty Hunter), he is
one of the most requested DJs in JA about now. Tunes include "Mine De Gals,"
"New Gun," "Spy fi Die," etc..
Selector Dudu Black.
Jeffrey R. Meade
>BTW: To the person who was talking about Shabba in the Hammer files, that was
>true but Ranking Slackness has come back rough with a TRUE DANCEHALL hit: "Shine
>yuh gun" or "Shine & Criss" (depending on whether you got it on 12" from Epic or
>7" from Shang (Straight from yard).
Unfortunately (for Shabba), it is going to take him a *very* long time to
regain the acceptance among dancehall fans that he once had, even with new
tunes like "Shine & Criss" and "Mr. Take It Back". His collaboration with
Johnny Gill, while gaining him much acceptance among the American (foreign)
crowd, has also made the dancehall massive in general consider him as
somewhat of a sellout. I recently heard a story on how Shabba was greeted
at a dancehall, somewhere in the Bronx (N.Y), with boos and airborne
(glass) beer bottles. I myself wonder how he would allow someone to
make such a terribly fake attempt at a caribbean accent on his album; I
also wonder why he allowed that girl (who can't sing IMO) to perform on the
remake to "Mr. Lover Man." I can't see why, politics aside, the original
singer (Crytal) couldn't be included on the remake. Shabba's seemed to
have made a few wrong choices since "As Raw As Ever," and he's going to
have to come out with a long string of hits, ala Buju B., if he wants to
return to the point he was a couple of years ago.
Peace & Unity,
Koqui
David J.
be unfounded for the time being. However, if everything goes as planned in
the next couple of days, KRS-One himself may be doing a brief phone interview
on MY SHOW!!! (Hip Hop Central on WIU...just look at my .sig)
The reason? This weekend my show is dedicated to BDP. I'm playing nothing
but BDP tracks from all seven albums and a few rare items to boot. I sent
a quick fax to Front Page Entertainment, which represents KRS, merely to test
my software, and they called back and said we might be able to do this.
Sooooo....if anyone has a question that they'd like to ask KRS, e-mail it to
me. The interview, if it goes off as planned (cross your fingers, hold your
breath, snatch your purse, purse your snatch), will be published in HardCORE
Vol. 9.
Ken Rose
school, Syracuse University. Until one hears a complete lecture by this
man, one cannot begin to appreciate the knowledge this man possesses.
His albums represent only a small fraction of what he knows. Anyway,
during the lecture, he started speaking about the American government,
and how it taxes everyone, how it is colorbling, money hungry, but not
racist.(I believe he refers to this on "Edutainment" and uses Leona
Helmsley as an example). Anyway, after the lecture, he was taking
pictures and answering questions. I was first in line and I got a
picture taken w/him. He signed it "to the other Kenny, KRS1" because my
name is Kenny also(the same name as his brother). I was so in awe that
I asked him something stupid about his old battles w/ MC Shan and the
Juice Crew. He just said something like, "He(Shan) lost, and the juice
got stomped. What a stupid question! This is what I really would like
to ask him. "Kris, you have often referred to the government as a
colorbling, money hungry group of elites who are not racist. If this is
the case, then how would you explain the fact that in the 50's and 60's
Black people had their money and still were refused services in
restaurants, and convienent stores,etc.? This certainly sounds racist
to me being that the only reason these folks weren't served is because
they were black. It was pefectly legal to discriminate in this manner."
Also, if D-Nice was really a part of BDP, then why was he never
featured in any songs save bit parts on "7deejays", and "South Bronx"
ala Vinnie from Naughty by Nature. Do not forget, however, to give a
shout out to the man w/ unlimited lyrical styles, and hands down the
best rapper in the world, KRS1. Return of the Boom Bap stomps the
Chronic, perhaps the most overrated album of all time. Peace!
The other Kenny,
Kenny Rose
Sunil R Maragh
Rude boy, mi couldn't seh it betta. Yuh di chek out weh mi di
write bout hip-hop and reggae mixin'? A di same ting me seh. Easy.
Sunil "Snail Don" Maragh
David J.
3 hours of BDP, including some rare tracks like "Essays On BDP-ism" and "Party
Together" from Sly & Robbie's "Silent Assassin" album, is STILL phat. =^)
I'll be placing a call back to Front Page Entertainment to see if I can get
the 411 on KRS's current tour. If I do, I'll be posting that to alt.rap.
Keep your eyes peeled. I know I will. =^)
Enuma Olanrewaju Ogunyemi
Actually, the singer on Mr. Lover Man was Chevelle Franklin who CAN sing,
though the original "Champion Lover" with Krystal's vocals was a million times
better.
Switching topics slightly, what do people think of the big Three (Terry
Ganzie, Buju B., Terror Fabulous)? Terry Ganzie has eased back a lot but Terror
Fabulous is coming REALLY ROUGH with his recent releases which have always been
more varied topically and lyrically than Buju's: "Drop it Cool" and the new
EastWest release "Gangster's Anthem." I say look for him to BLOW up further...
Dudu Black
"Have you ever seen a .45 before.... You would a bawl don't murder me"
"How many morning unnu get up and pray, thank massa God fi see a bright new day?
Not one, everybody shout hip-hooray!... But Cool unnu fi drop it, nuff adem a
chat but some are false prophet?"
Erik Domstad
>|> make such a terribly fake attempt at a caribbean accent on his album; I
>|> also wonder why he allowed that girl (who can't sing IMO) to perform on the
>|> remake to "Mr. Lover Man." I can't see why, politics aside, the original
>|> singer (Crytal) couldn't be included on the remake. Shabba's seemed to
The girl who sang on the original version of "Mr. Loverman" was Deborahe
Glasgow. She also recorded it without Shabba as "Champion lover".
Erik
Kevin Montague
>Well, KRS-One didn't call, so I didn't get to ask him anything, but no matter.
>3 hours of BDP, including some rare tracks like "Essays On BDP-ism" and "Party
>Together" from Sly & Robbie's "Silent Assassin" album, is STILL phat. =^)
>I'll be placing a call back to Front Page Entertainment to see if I can get
>the 411 on KRS's current tour. If I do, I'll be posting that to alt.rap.
>Keep your eyes peeled. I know I will. =^)
Dave| Not sure why he missed your show, but Kris is coming by the Wake-Up show
tomorrow night to kick it; I'll try to remember to ask him. In any case,
what a lot of people don't realize is that he's putting most, if not all of
this together himself, so things are bound to be hectic w/him. I'll keep
you posted, if I can deal w/this @#@#*!! editor. . .
Kevvy K
?
D
D
D
B
B
"Socrates' philosophies were fatal"
Jeffrey R. Meade
>
> Actually, the singer on Mr. Lover Man was Chevelle Franklin who CAN sing,
>though the original "Champion Lover" with Krystal's vocals was a million times
>better.
Exactly my point...quality haffi come first.
> Switching topics slightly, what do people think of the big Three (Terry
>Ganzie, Buju B., Terror Fabulous)? Terry Ganzie has eased back a lot but Terror
>Fabulous is coming REALLY ROUGH with his recent releases which have always been
>more varied topically and lyrically than Buju's: "Drop it Cool" and the new
>EastWest release "Gangster's Anthem." I say look for him to BLOW up further...
>
As far as Terror Fabulous is concerned, I agree that he's been coming out
with some good releases lately, but I would be hesitant to say he's always
been more varied topically; I've always considered him, until JUST
recently, to be more of a ladies' D.J., kinda following Shabba's footsteps.
You have to admit, with the exception of his (first?) big song ("Big Man
Have The Money"), that most of his songs over the past couple of years have
been about women, in some way, shape, or form. Buju's had quite a few
songs, both big hits and small classics, that cover a varied range of
topics. I could be wrong (and if so, post some of Terror's songs that
you'd consider topically varied), but I'd say Buju's the more lyrically
varied of the two.
Peace & Unity,
Koqui
Jeffrey R. Meade
> Switching topics slightly, what do people think of the big Three (Terry
>Ganzie, Buju B., Terror Fabulous)? Terry Ganzie has eased back a lot but Terror
While we're on the topic of the big D.J.'s today, what do you think of
Bajja Jedd? I've heard a couple selectors consider him the next Buju
and the next Shabba, and I myself don't think that's a bad prediction.
He's only been around for a year or so now, but everything he's released
has been wicked, from the well-known stuff to the lyrics he's done over
dub-plates for sound systems. His two latest: "Honor Dem" and
"12 Inches an' More" a go mash it up, seen? Look for Bajja to keep coming
out strong this year, and look for him to blow up sky high in '94. This is
my favorite, most underrated d.j. today, an' mi cyaan wait fi him to
explode.
Peace & Unity,
Koqui
John Smith
>
> > Switching topics slightly, what do people think of the big Three (Terry
> >Ganzie, Buju B., Terror Fabulous)? Terry Ganzie has eased back a lot but Te
>
> Bajja Jedd? I've heard a couple selectors consider him the next Buju
> and the next Shabba, and I myself don't think that's a bad prediction.
> He's only been around for a year or so now, but everything he's released
> has been wicked, from the well-known stuff to the lyrics he's done over
> dub-plates for sound systems. His two latest: "Honor Dem" and
> "12 Inches an' More" a go mash it up, seen? Look for Bajja to keep coming
> out strong this year, and look for him to blow up sky high in '94. This is
> my favorite, most underrated d.j. today, an' mi cyaan wait fi him to
> explode.
>
> Peace & Unity,
> Koqui
I agree, Bajja does have a bright future. But you all neglected
to mention a few of my favorites - Ninja Kid (there's just something I
like about his voice) and Garnett Silk...
Enuma Olanrewaju Ogunyemi
>
|> > Switching topics slightly, what do people think of the big Three (Terry
|> >Ganzie, Buju B., Terror Fabulous)? Terry Ganzie has eased back a lot but Terror
|> >Fabulous is coming REALLY ROUGH with his recent releases which have always been
|> >more varied topically and lyrically than Buju's: "Drop it Cool" and the new
|> >EastWest release "Gangster's Anthem." I say look for him to BLOW up further...
|> >
|>
|> As far as Terror Fabulous is concerned, I agree that he's been coming out
|> with some good releases lately, but I would be hesitant to say he's always
|> been more varied topically; I've always considered him, until JUST
|> recently, to be more of a ladies' D.J., kinda following Shabba's footsteps.
|> You have to admit, with the exception of his (first?) big song ("Big Man
|> Have The Money"), that most of his songs over the past couple of years have
|> been about women, in some way, shape, or form. Buju's had quite a few
|> songs, both big hits and small classics, that cover a varied range of
|> topics. I could be wrong (and if so, post some of Terror's songs that
|> you'd consider topically varied), but I'd say Buju's the more lyrically
|> varied of the two.
Alright as a rejoinder: "Satisfaction" (stop the long talking 'bout the
gheto youth want more satisfaction) [on the battyrider riddim], "Bad Boy Gringo"
9how unnu a gwan so, tek that look off your face, badness you a talk, bwo that is
a disgrace) [John John records]; "Order" (Order unnu coffin an put down)
[Heal the world riddim]; "Talk bout" etc...
You have a point though that with Buju's more recent album he has become
more topically varied) though 80%+ off his songs are still about women).
Lyrically (and I'm talking here about the store of words and lyrical structures)
Terror Fabulous beats Buju hands down (IMNSHO) :) At one point not too long ago,
I remember wondering if Buju would become like Cutty - reusing lyrics over and
over again. Again I'm not simply making a "Wait deh Man" (Cutty on the "Yu dead
now!" riddim -> "Who seh me done" (Cutty on the "Wonderful world, Beautiful
people"/"Murder she wrote" riddim; to "Love me Browning" -> "Love Black Woman"
comparison...
Anyway, you have to admit that Terror Fabulous' first release on Eastwest
has to be one of the most hardcore first releases of a dancehall artist on a
major label. [Well, let's wait for my man Archangel's release on Warner Bros!! :)]
Life, love, peace, and equality
Selector Dudu Black
PS. "X-S amount a badness if necessary"
"Show me unnu hand, all original die-hearted gun man!!!" - Terror F. ("Gangsters
Anthem, EastWest Records"
Enuma Olanrewaju Ogunyemi
I personally thought that "Bedwork Sensation" was the wickedest track on
the Carolina (oops, Bedwork) riddim. His voice has that growl that is
reminiscent of Double Ugly or a more coherent Pampidoo. And it does not appear
to be vinegar and petrol enhanced, unlike.... The only thing is that the only
releases I have seen of his have been on the NY dancehall labels/production
houses: Phillip Smart's Tan Yah Records, and Sting And Robert Livingston's Signet
records. I don't know how large he is in yard - Joel Moo, any comments??
It appears that the whole Ruff Entry crew: Shaggy, Red Fox, Nikey Fungus,
and Bajja (I assume Mikey Jarrett, whom I can do without, isn't a crew member)
are set for major label releases. BTW Bajja has some new releases, I received
some advance copies thanx to Rafi at Sting...
There was a review in the latest Vibe of Red Fox, praising his album
muchly... I didn't think it was all that, in fact I even think Nikey Fungus would
be a better bet then Red Fox...
Next shot for the scene in Massachusetts (yes there is a scene, small
tho)
- Shabba, Lady Patra, Madd Cobra, Culture, Ghost, and supposedly
Bounty Killa are playing at the Officer's club out in Saugus Mass, this Thursday
catch it if you can. (Interviews on Sunday 2-6pm, WMBR 88.1 FM)
- Kid Capri at Metropolis on Friday Oct 22nd, (catch tix on same show as well as
Choice is Yours, Dope Jams (saturday 8-12pm) and Funkhouse (Sunday 6-8pm).
-Barrington Levy in town next week, will post info.
- this past week, Nigger Mikey, And Derrick Parker were in Cambridge. Stoppeds
by my show and did the first ever performance of their version of the new Yardie
anthem, "Bringin' in the weed" with part 2, a scathing political commentary
"Bringin' in the gun" to follow..
Nuff respect to both of them as well as Ninja Fabulous, Terrorist and The
Whole Ranksmaster Crew. Can't forget Volcano and Techniques Sounds for the dubplates.
Mr. Dudu Black ("Wha you call it???" - from an incredulous NIGGER Mikey. "'Dudu'
means Black in Yoruba" I replied, "it's a long story." Sympathetic nod from
Derrick Parker)
Tin Pan
> You have a point though that with Buju's more recent album he has become
>more topically varied) though 80%+ off his songs are still about women).
>Lyrically (and I'm talking here about the store of words and lyrical structures)
>Terror Fabulous beats Buju hands down (IMNSHO) :)
No disrepect intended, seen,
BUT ....
There is no way Terror can beat Buju.
Man, are you crazy?!
( going into fits right about now )
If you talking about structure and how phrases follow each other, Buju
definitely have it. I agree with you that Terror coming strong, and I admit
that the man have him stuff togeda, but me feel say Buju a go run tings fi years
and years widout fears.
I have yet to see a DJ that can come close to Buju; them wi try fi soun like him
but them caan touch him style.
My vote dey pan Buju.
Tin Pan
"Tin Pan stand aside, he look and he said, some how or de edda, whole heap a
sound a go dead"
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