Arbuckle's Fatal Blow
StormChaser
The above link is to Court TV's Crime Library. This particular chapter,
"How Did She Die", speculates that Virginia Rappe died as a result
of Roscoe's knee jerking upward and jabbing her in the stomach
after she tickled him. This was a habitual response of his after being
tickled. This stomach blow worsened her bladder condition causing
it to rupture. Is this true or is it as fake as the picture in Ken Anger's
Hollywood Babylon that showed a picture of Arbuckle's hotel bedroom
after the party complete with smashed furniture?
Mark
Lloyd Fonvielle
The source for this story is Minta Durfee at the very end of her life in
an interview with Andy Edmonds for his book "Frame-Up!". Edmonds says
that Durfee told him this was the story Arbuckle confessed to her and
other intimates privately about what happened. The accidental bump
happened in the public part of the suite prior to Rappe entering
Arbuckle's bedroom and was not connected with any sort of sexual
activity. It was apparently decided by the defense to leave out this
part of the story, since, though it wasn't evidence of Arbuckle's guilt
is any way shape or form, and its contribution to Rappe's death could
hardly be proved one way or the other, it might influence the jury to
think badly of Arbuckle, despite the innocence of the incident.
It's hard to know how credible Edmonds's reporting of Durfee's
words was, or how credible Durfee was at this stage of her life. It's
odd that neither she nor any other intimate of Arbuckle ever shared this
information publicly prior to the Edmonds's "scoop" -- even with David
Yallop, whose earlier book seems more carefully researched than
Edmonds's, though just as sympathetic to Arbuckle.
Glen Ort
This is an unsubstantiated rumour that's circulated for awhile, along
with the coke bottle etc. See Frame Up! by Andy Edmonds for more
detail. There is zero reliable proof of this, at least in the
available material, and the likelihood of such a blow being delivered
and causing such a rupture is also pretty slim.
Bob Birchard
Andy is a she not a he. Her sources are remarkable. She interviewed 90 year old
gangsters who were willing to spill their guts about Thelma Todd for Hot Toddy and
interviewed Charley Chase in the spirit world.
--
Bob Birchard
Coming from the University Press of Kentucky in 2004
“Cecil B. DeMille’s Hollywood”
by Robert S. Birchard
Frederica
"Bob Birchard" <bbir...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:3FB2606A...@earthlink.net...
> Andy is a she not a he. Her sources are remarkable. She interviewed 90
year old
> gangsters who were willing to spill their guts about Thelma Todd for Hot
Toddy and
> interviewed Charley Chase in the spirit world.
Ah, the Ouija Board interviews.
Our very own Lokke Heiss last year proposed what I think is the most
sensible
of the explanations regarding Rappe's death. I've copied the post below.
From a medical perspective (my other life)--it seems to me the answer
to what happened to Rappe comes down to couple of key questions:
When was her last abortion??? If it had been in the two weeks prior
to her death, then she was at high risk for a post-AB infection, which
would have been serious enough on its own right. If she had the
abortion longer than two weeks, it could have been a problem called
PID (pelvic inflammatory disease). Both problems would have caused
pelvic pain. In combination with her probably being very drunk, that
would have presented a real problem of diagnosis (and proper
treatment) from anyone, doctor or concerned party-goer. The other
point made is that Rappe suffered from bladder problems in the past.
Urinary retention can be very painful and could cause acute distress.
So we have three possible medical conditions (or combination of them)
that would set things up. I vote for the last one, as that would have
explained why the doctor was trying to use the catheter.
The ruptured bladder, in my opinion, would have occurred from the
catheter. I've had to place catheters, and sometimes it's very
difficult even with the right equipment, and I bet whatever they used
back then wasn't especially safe. Modern catheters are soft plastic
tubes, a little research would be required, but I'm guessing back then
they were harder (even glass? gulp) and it would be much easier to
cause an iatrogenic (doctor-caused) problem.
Once the bladder is perforated, the case becomes life-or-death, esp.
back then before antibiotics.
In my opinion, a bladder couldn't be ruptured by jumping on someone.
Don't know if its EVER happened, but it would be incredibly hard to
occur, do to the anatomy of the human body. The concept of him
jumping on her smacks of 'urban folk' and it has the moralistic scent
that often separates fact from fiction (like Murnau dying on the road
to Santa Barbara while servicing his driver, don't let the facts get
in the way of a good story).
Of course to me, the persecution of Arbuckle was never really about
Rappe, she was the (sad and unfortunate)vehicle that the public and
press used to make Roscoe a scapegoat, or perhaps more accurately, a
lightning rod, focusing a nation's guilty reaction from a perceived
(collective) libertine lifestyle. In other words, Fatty died for our
sins.
Max Nineteennineteen
make it the medical event that actually caused her death. It might
well be that he simply fell back on that personally as a possible
innocent explanation, when in fact it had nothing to do with it.
Or it could all be bs....
Lokke Heiss
> "How Did She Die", speculates that Virginia Rappe died as a result
> of Roscoe's knee jerking upward and jabbing her in the stomach
> after she tickled him. This was a habitual response of his after being
> tickled. This stomach blow worsened her bladder condition causing
> it to rupture. Is this true or is it as fake as the picture in Ken Anger's
> Hollywood Babylon that showed a picture of Arbuckle's hotel bedroom
> after the party complete with smashed furniture?
>
> versions... >>
She died of peritonitis from a ruptured bladder. Why a ruptured
bladder? Here's a cut-and-paste from an earlier post I wrote
regarding this question, also check out the site's FAQ (this is a
very FAQ!)
The point made is that Rappe suffered from bladder problems in the
past. Urinary retention can be very painful and could cause acute
distress.
So we have possible medical conditions (or combination of them)
that would set things up. I vote for urinary retention as that would
have explained why the doctor was trying to use the catheter.
The ruptured bladder, in my opinion, would have occurred from the
catheter. I've had to place catheters, and sometimes it's very
difficult even with the right equipment, and I bet whatever they used
back then wasn't especially safe. Modern catheters are soft plastic
tubes, a little research would be required, but I'm guessing back then
they were harder (even glass? gulp) and it would be much easier to
cause an iatrogenic (doctor-caused) problem.
Once the bladder is perforated, the case becomes life-or-death, esp.
back then before antibiotics.
In my opinion, a bladder couldn't be ruptured by jumping on someone.
Don't know if its EVER happened, but it would be incredibly hard to
occur, do to the anatomy of the human body. The concept of him
jumping on her smacks of 'urban folk' and it has the moralistic scent
that often separates fact from fiction.
To me, the most likely event by far was a botched cath by the doctor.
This fits with all the other facts, and everything else falls into
place.
In terms of the testimony of the case, for me the most interesting
comment is the doctor saying that the bladder 'appeared to have been
ruptured by an outside source.' I'd love to know what kind of medical
information was left behind after the trial. If detailed notes were
left, we could send this case to a modern day pathologist. Was Rappe
buried or cremated? If buried, then all we need is an exhumation, and
modern medical science might tell us what happened.
Lloyd Fonvielle
> In terms of the testimony of the case, for me the most interesting
> comment is the doctor saying that the bladder 'appeared to have been
> ruptured by an outside source.' I'd love to know what kind of medical
> information was left behind after the trial. If detailed notes were
> left, we could send this case to a modern day pathologist. Was Rappe
> buried or cremated? If buried, then all we need is an exhumation, and
> modern medical science might tell us what happened.
Not a possibility. The autopsy was performed under highly suspicious
circumstances, outside legal channels, in an odd venue -- a maternity
hospital which often treated unwed mothers. Edmonds reports a rumor
that abortions could be had there. Rappe's friend Maude Delmont
summoned one of the physicians from this hospital, a Dr. Rumwell, in to
treat Rappe, and he assisted in the autopsy. Rappe's organs, including
the bladder and uterus, were removed, examined and destroyed in the
course of the autopsy at the direction of Rumwell -- which is what has
led many to suspect that the doctors were removing evidence of a recent
abortion, perhaps to protect the doctor who performed it, in all
likelihood Rumwell.
The doctors who performed the autopsy concluded that the bladder
was ruptured as the result of an outside blow, but they recorded no
evidence of a recent pathological change in the area of the rupture,
which is strong evidence that it occurred as the result of a
pre-existing condition and not as the result of an outside blow.
Unrebutted testimony to this effect by defense doctors concluded
Arbuckle's first trial, and seemed the strongest possible evidence of
Arbuckle's innocence -- but by then at least one juror had already made
up her mind about his guilt, and couldn't be swayed by facts of any
kind. Hence the hung jury in round one of Arbuckle's ordeal.
Frederica
"Lokke Heiss" <lokke...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:50c2fb1d.03111...@posting.google.com...
> In terms of the testimony of the case, for me the most interesting
> comment is the doctor saying that the bladder 'appeared to have been
> ruptured by an outside source.' I'd love to know what kind of medical
> information was left behind after the trial. If detailed notes were
> left, we could send this case to a modern day pathologist. Was Rappe
> buried or cremated? If buried, then all we need is an exhumation, and
> modern medical science might tell us what happened.
Dunno, but whatever was left is at Hollywood Forever, in the ground.
Frederica