House for sale, not enough drywall screws, what to do?

[andyeverett]

Went to a costumers home (about 35 years old) to estimate some work.
Noticed that nearly all the ceiling drywall sags. A 5 foot straight
edge across the ceiling drywall showed 3/4 gaps in many places. On
entering the rooms and looking up it was quite obvious. The funny
thing was that along the long tapered edges the drywall looked tight
against the ceiling joists but in the middle of the tapered edges was
the maximum sag. Enough fasteners along the edges but not enough in
the middle?

The costumer is trying to get the house ready for sale. If I was
looking at the house the sagging drywall would be a big question mark.
What can be done in this situation short of new ceiling drywall? Would
you try and stabilize the drywall with extra fasteners, spackle, and
paint?

Thanks for any help or suggestions.

[jamesgang]

On Tuesday, April 2, 2013 1:18:51 PM UTC-4, andyeverett wrote:
> Went to a costumers home (about 35 years old) to estimate some work. Noticed that nearly all the ceiling drywall sags. A 5 foot straight edge across the ceiling drywall showed 3/4 gaps in many places. On entering the rooms and looking up it was quite obvious. The funny thing was that along the long tapered edges the drywall looked tight against the ceiling joists but in the middle of the tapered edges was the maximum sag. Enough fasteners along the edges but not enough in the middle? The costumer is trying to get the house ready for sale. If I was looking at the house the sagging drywall would be a big question mark. What can be done in this situation short of new ceiling drywall? Would you try and stabilize the drywall with extra fasteners, spackle, and paint? Thanks for any help or suggestions.

Determine where the joists are first. You might have to use a small drill bit. You can use a ceiling lift to push the drywall back up and add screws if you find joists.

One common problem that causes that effect is ceiling joists on 24" centers with 1/2" wallboard ceiling. Also common on ceilings that are the bottom part of a premanufactured roof truss installed on 24". Or cathedral ceilings. Looks fine when installed but after a few years sags. You should always use 5/8" wallboard on 24" centered joists. If that's your problem then there is no fix except rip it out and install 5/8".

[Oren]

What James said.

3/4 " sag is an awful lot. Perhaps the drywall is not 5/8"?

[DerbyDad03]

Is this happening in every room? It may be that the dryall is too thin
for the joist spacing. e.g. 1/2" vs 5/8".

Have you pushed on the sags to see how far up they move? If it is a
"not enough fasteners in the field" problem then you may be able to
secure the drywall to the joists, assuming there are joists above the
sags.

If the sags don't move then maybe the joists are not even. That would
entail a new ceiling with shims on the high joists.

Now, don't shoot the messenger... I'm just tossing this out there.

Thick stippling where it doesn't sag and thinner where it does to even
the ceiling out. You might be able to hide the sag.

I know, I know...it's a crappy suggestion but some sellers might not
care enough about the buyer to do a proper fix..

[EXT]

"DerbyDad03" <teama...@eznet.net> wrote in message
news:ad8b423d-40c9-4756...@m1g2000vbe.googlegroups.com...

> On Apr 2, 1:18 pm, andyeverett <andyeveret...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Went to a costumers home (about 35 years old) to estimate some work.
>> Noticed that nearly all the ceiling drywall sags. A 5 foot straight
>> edge across the ceiling drywall showed 3/4 gaps in many places. On
>> entering the rooms and looking up it was quite obvious. The funny
>> thing was that along the long tapered edges the drywall looked tight
>> against the ceiling joists but in the middle of the tapered edges was
>> the maximum sag. Enough fasteners along the edges but not enough in
>> the middle?
>>
>> The costumer is trying to get the house ready for sale. If I was
>> looking at the house the sagging drywall would be a big question mark.
>> What can be done in this situation short of new ceiling drywall? Would
>> you try and stabilize the drywall with extra fasteners, spackle, and
>> paint?
>>
>> Thanks for any help or suggestions.
>
> Is this happening in every room? It may be that the dryall is too thin
> for the joist spacing. e.g. 1/2" vs 5/8".
>

I may not be even 1/2", someone may have gone cheap with some 3/8" drywall.
Around here it is more expensive than 1/2", but about 35 years ago it was
cheaper and may have attracted someone to cut corners. You need to find
where the joists or whatever framing there is to attach it to and then lift
gently with a jack of some sorts and use lots of screws as the normal count
may pull through as the drywall has taken a set.

[bob haller]

pull down cieling in one room to get a better idea of whats going
on......

plan for the balance of the rooms

[andyeverett]

This happens in all the rooms! We can get above the drywall in the
unfinished attic.

So there is a solution, no easy way out.

If you guys saw this it would raise a red flag with you, right?

Thanks for your help!

[bob haller]

yeah big red flag that will kill sale.

dont forget theres wiring and plumbing potentially everywhere.....

running a screw into a water line may not leak much intially but start
a flood later

at least pull down one room to see whats going on.....

too thin drywall? studs 24 on center? etc etc?

[andyeverett]

Will have to get back in the house, will report back. Thanks!

[tra...@optonline.net]

A little eager to pull down drywall, no? He said he can
see the other side from the attic......

[EXT]

<tra...@optonline.net> wrote in message
news:1885e30c-d45c-4ad0...@hl5g2000vbb.googlegroups.com...

Seeing the other side doesn't tell you much about the drywall but will tell
you about the structure and joist spacing or if there is any strapping,
thickness of the drywall can be checked at a wall or ceiling outlet.

[John Grabowski]

*Are you absolutely sure that it is only the drywall sagging? I did several
jobs for one customer over a two year period who had a sagging spot in her
dining room ceiling. Everyone thought the drywall had warped from a drip
that she had a few years before in that ceiling. It turned out that the
trusses in that area had started to separate from the gusset plates holding
them together. The trusses were sagging and bringing the drywall down. The
water from the drip weakened the areas that the gussets were nailed into.

[k...@attt.bizz]

That was my immediate thought. With that much sag, it could even be
3/8". I wouldn't put past any builder (or rock jockey).

[k...@attt.bizz]

On Tue, 2 Apr 2013 18:14:28 -0400, "EXT" <noe...@reply.in.this.group>
wrote:

The printing on the other side of the sheetrock might give a clue.

[andyeverett]

If you imagined fastening the ceiling drywall, running perpendicular
to the joists, with three fasteners per joist, one at each tapered
edge and one fastener in the middle and then imagine what the drywall
would look like in 35 years, that is what you would see. Its scarey
bad and it is a wonder it has not fallen. You see the same pattern in
all the ceilings in the entire house. If I get back in the house
(might have scared him with my estimate) I will take some photos.

[Oren]

On Tue, 02 Apr 2013 19:39:48 -0400, k...@attt.bizz wrote:

>>3/4 " sag is an awful lot. Perhaps the drywall is not 5/8"?
>
>That was my immediate thought. With that much sag, it could even be
>3/8". I wouldn't put past any builder (or rock jockey).

Aw, c'mon. I've hung a lot of drywall in my younger days. The
ceilings were ALWAYS 5/8". It was the way I learned... IMO every
ceiling should be 5/8". Same the last time I did a basement ceiling
in New Yawk.

Heck, now days they use screws. In my early days it was blue nails.

[Ed Pawlowski]

I'd be out the door before the flag was raised fully. No way would I
touch that place.

Could be the drywall guys cheated, but also could be the rest of the
house is substandard also. I'm not going to invest to find out.

[cl...@snyder.on.ca]

I'd buy it for the right price - but the price would be about
$10,000 less than the price of the bare lot so I could afford to
bulldoze the place if I had to.

[k...@attt.bizz]

On Tue, 02 Apr 2013 17:38:15 -0700, Oren <Or...@127.0.0.1> wrote:

>On Tue, 02 Apr 2013 19:39:48 -0400, k...@attt.bizz wrote:
>
>>>3/4 " sag is an awful lot. Perhaps the drywall is not 5/8"?
>>
>>That was my immediate thought. With that much sag, it could even be
>>3/8". I wouldn't put past any builder (or rock jockey).
>
>Aw, c'mon. I've hung a lot of drywall in my younger days. The
>ceilings were ALWAYS 5/8". It was the way I learned... IMO every
>ceiling should be 5/8". Same the last time I did a basement ceiling
>in New Yawk.

They weren't always. They were always *supposed* to be, but that's a
different discussion. ;-)

>Heck, now days they use screws. In my early days it was blue nails.

Screws are nice but they won't help sagging rock, even a little bit.

[Harry K]

I am fairly certain that code _requires_ 5/8 on ceilings.

Harry K

[Harry K]

As a customer, I certainly would not buy the house in that condition.
I doubt that adding screws will pull it back up. It's worth trying
but don't expect it to succeed.

Harry K

[The Daring Dufas]

I remember working with my dad and brothers building our house on the
mountain top. The drywall was installed with blue flat head nails that
were hammered in and we were taught to give it one last measured smack
to set the nail head in a dimple that would be filled and smoothed over
with sheet rock mud. Dad tore down and salvaged a cafeteria and a church
to obtain the lumber to build the house. We laid the salvaged hardwood
flooring that looked like hell until Dad rented a big belt sander and
that old hardwood cleaned right up and we wound up with beautiful
hardwood floors. The salvaged wood from the buildings was amazing
because of the quality and the seasoned wood. Me and my brothers sat
around pulling the nails out of the salvaged lumber and straightening
the bent nails so we could reuse them. The big attic fan was one of the
items salvaged from the cafeteria. Not much was wasted, the barn and
outbuildings got a lot of salvage lumber and tin roofing. Dad got a
bunch of switch yard cross ties which we used to build the frame of the
barn. Folks don't do that sort of thing anymore, I believe it's one of
those lost arts. o_O

TDD

[tra...@optonline.net]

On Apr 2, 7:41 pm, k...@attt.bizz wrote:
> On Tue, 2 Apr 2013 18:14:28 -0400, "EXT" <noem...@reply.in.this.group>
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ><trad...@optonline.net> wrote in message

> The printing on the other side of the sheetrock might give a clue.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

And even if it's not what it should be, it's probably a moot
point anyway. Is anyone going to redo all the sheetrock,
instead of just screwing it in more places?

Thinking about how to do that, it might be easiest if a
helper were in the attic to drive a finishing nail through
near the ends of the ceiling joists, one at a time. The
other person has a string and screw gun and drives
them in.

[tra...@optonline.net]

Yeah, I was wondering about that too. Over time it's
sagged, probably more so when it was humid, etc.
Depending on how much it's sagged, it may crack
when you try to screw it back in. May have to push it
back into place with some supports or else the new
drywall screw may just pull right through.

[denni...@gmail.com]

On Tuesday, April 2, 2013 1:18:51 PM UTC-4, andyeverett wrote:

> What can be done in this situation short of new ceiling drywall? Would
> you try and stabilize the drywall with extra fasteners, spackle, and
> paint?

The drywall is sagging BETWEEN the joists/rafters/trusses.

The problem is the drywall contractor cheaped out and used 1/2" drywall when they should have used 5/8".

You can drive screws until you're blue in the face and it won't help because the sag is in the open spaces where there is nothing to screw to.

At this point the drywall has taken a "set" so even if you could screw it, it would just crack and crumble.

The right way to fix it is to pull it all down and start over with the right thickness drywall, meant for ceilings.

Or, you could install a drop ceiling to hide the poor drywalling job.

[Chomper]

"andyeverett" <andyev...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:0b9bbf30-f917-4da9...@k1g2000yqf.googlegroups.com...

Aside from several replies of it could be 1/2" instead of 5/8", a common
building practice (which, I despise) is to screw/nail the edges & cheat the
field of screws/nails because the hangers used adhesive on the truss
chords. This makes it easier for the finishers also. The hangers don't
always put enough PL on the studs. Don't shoot the messenger, just saying.

Someone mentioned about texturing. I think I may be tempted to go this
route, but putting more screws in the field. You'd have to look up the
appropriate number, but it's somewhere around every 8" on butt joints, and
I believe every 12" in the field.

I had this problem in my own home, especially on the walls.

[tra...@optonline.net]

On Apr 3, 10:34 am, dennisga...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Tuesday, April 2, 2013 1:18:51 PM UTC-4, andyeverett wrote:
> > What can be done in this situation short of new ceiling drywall? Would
> > you try and stabilize the drywall with extra fasteners, spackle, and
> > paint?
>
> The drywall is sagging BETWEEN the joists/rafters/trusses.
>
> The problem is the drywall contractor cheaped out and used 1/2" drywall when they should have used 5/8".

Nonsense. The vast majority of drywall in homes is 1/2".
It depends on the joist spacing. If it's 16" OC which is
common, then 1/2" is fine.

>
> You can drive screws until you're blue in the face and it won't help because the sag is in the open spaces where there is nothing to screw to.

Maybe, if it's on greater than 16" spacing. Or it could be
that they didn't screw it correctly. Who knows what he
has without someone actually looking.

>
> At this point the drywall has taken a "set" so even if you could screw it, it would just crack and crumble.

That could very well be the case.

>
> The right way to fix it is to pull it all down and start over with the right thickness drywall, meant for ceilings.

I sure would explore other options FIRST.

[k...@attt.bizz]

More screws aren't going to help if it's sagging between joists. If
there are only ~three screws per sheet, then it's certainly the way to
go. It's still not likely to be perfect because the rock has already
sagged (the ripples will be smaller;).

[Oren]

On Wed, 03 Apr 2013 02:56:14 -0600, The Daring Dufas
<the-dari...@stinky-finger.net> wrote:

>>
>> Heck, now days they use screws. In my early days it was blue nails.
>>
>
>I remember working with my dad and brothers building our house on the
>mountain top. The drywall was installed with blue flat head nails that
>were hammered in and we were taught to give it one last measured smack
>to set the nail head in a dimple that would be filled and smoothed over
>with sheet rock mud.

Yep. We used a drywall hatchet, which had a razor blade on one side to
score the material (then snap it off) and a milled face. The nails
were tossed in your mouth for faster work (nasty black lips at the end
of the day. It was easy to bust a thumb or finger wide open with a
face, if you were not paying attention (BTDT).

All these new fangled screws and tips for setting the screw dimple:-\

[bob haller]

A OUT OF THE BOX IDEA:)

get a sheet of plywood or some such and put holes in the wood where
the framimg is. then put the plywood up, jack it securely in place and
then add lots of screws.

but truly if your selling a home worth a least a 100 grand replacing
the cieling although costly.....

not doing it right can cost you much more in inspection hassles,
buyers who get scared off, etc etc

at least pull down one room to see exactly whats wrong

[tra...@optonline.net]

One more time, he said it's open attic above. So,
why do you keep saying to tear down even one room?
From above it can be determined if it's sagging between
joists or at joists for lack of screws, etc.

[bob haller]

On Apr 3, 4:46 pm, "trad...@optonline.net" <trad...@optonline.net>
wrote:

looking down on it isnt nearly as informative as pulling it down and
looking at the thickness of the drywall, the number of screws etc.

sometimes its easier to just dig into a job than spending too much
time analyzing it

[k...@attt.bizz]

On Wed, 3 Apr 2013 15:33:56 -0700 (PDT), bob haller <hal...@aol.com>

wrote:

>On Apr 3, 4:46 pm, "trad...@optonline.net" <trad...@optonline.net>
>wrote:
>> On Apr 3, 4:28 pm, bob haller <hall...@aol.com> wrote:
>>
>> > A OUT OF THE BOX IDEA:)
>>
>> > get a sheet of plywood or some such and put holes in the wood where
>> > the framimg is. then put the plywood up, jack it securely in place and
>> > then add lots of screws.
>>
>> > but truly if your selling a home worth a least a 100 grand replacing
>> > the cieling although costly.....
>>
>> > not doing it right can cost you much more in inspection hassles,
>> > buyers who get scared off, etc etc
>>
>> > at least pull down one room to see exactly whats wrong
>>
>> One more time, he said it's open attic above.   So,
>> why do you keep saying to tear down even one room?
>> From above it can be determined if it's sagging between
>> joists or at joists for lack of screws, etc.
>
>looking down on it isnt nearly as informative as pulling it down and
>looking at the thickness of the drywall, the number of screws etc.

Read the printing on the back! Or as (I think it was) Trader said,
pull a ceiling fixture. Don't rip into anything until you're ready to
finish the job. It's hard to be ready when you don't have a clue what
you're up against. But...

>sometimes its easier to just dig into a job than spending too much
>time analyzing it

I guess if you can't think...

[gen...@internet.com]

On Tue, 2 Apr 2013 10:18:51 -0700 (PDT), andyeverett
<andyev...@gmail.com> wrote:

>Went to a costumers home (about 35 years old) to estimate some work.
>Noticed that nearly all the ceiling drywall sags. A 5 foot straight
>edge across the ceiling drywall showed 3/4 gaps in many places. On
>entering the rooms and looking up it was quite obvious. The funny
>thing was that along the long tapered edges the drywall looked tight
>against the ceiling joists but in the middle of the tapered edges was
>the maximum sag. Enough fasteners along the edges but not enough in
>the middle?
>
>The costumer is trying to get the house ready for sale. If I was
>looking at the house the sagging drywall would be a big question mark.

>What can be done in this situation short of new ceiling drywall? Would
>you try and stabilize the drywall with extra fasteners, spackle, and
>paint?
>

>Thanks for any help or suggestions.

Have a friend hold an 8 foot long 2x6 to the ceiling, take a small floor
jack and a 2x4 that extends from the jack to the board on the ceiling,
and jack the drywall tight. Apply lots of screws.

Remove jack and boards, and do the same on the next sheet.

When they are all done, apply drywall compound to the screw heads and
any joints that need repair. Sand, reapply compound, sand and paint.

Job done!!!!

---
I once ran into a house which had a nice log interior. It was an actual
log cabin. Some tenant applied drywall over the logs, and only used six
screws on each sheet. (3 along each side), and then they painted the
drywall. (no joints taped). It looked like shit. I was asked to repair
it. I removed the 6 screws and took off one sheet, and showed the owner
the log walls. He said he just wanted the logs exposed. That was easy,
remove the screws, take off the full sheets of drywall, and I even told
the owner to save the drywall which was darn near what comes from the
store except for the paint and a few sheets which had been cut around
windows/doors. Whoever put up that drywall even covered most of the
outlets..... The owner didn't want the drywall, so I took it and used
it for a project at home.

We live in a world filled with idiots!!!

[AMo...@handyman.com]

On 3-Apr-2013, "Chomper" <inv...@none.net> wrote:

> Someone mentioned about texturing. I think I may be tempted to go this
> route, but putting more screws in the field.

Probably dampness as it will make it sag. Guessing. Popcorn the ceilings
for a cheap way out. Here in MA going back maybe 5 years ago we now have
screw inspectors here. Have to wait for them before you can finish tape or
skim coat.

--
Fake email in case you were wondering. So much spam. Real woodart AT
email-com I am sure you can convert that.

[Oren]

On Wed, 3 Apr 2013 13:46:34 -0700 (PDT), "tra...@optonline.net"
<tra...@optonline.net> wrote:

>> at least pull down one room to see exactly whats wrong
>
>One more time, he said it's open attic above. So,
>why do you keep saying to tear down even one room?

The Pittsburgh Way? Build a max prison? Give the contractors 5 years..

[Oren]

On Wed, 3 Apr 2013 15:33:56 -0700 (PDT), bob haller <hal...@aol.com>
wrote:

>> One more time, he said it's open attic above.   So,
>> why do you keep saying to tear down even one room?
>> From above it can be determined if it's sagging between
>> joists or at joists for lack of screws, etc.
>
>looking down on it isnt nearly as informative as pulling it down and
>looking at the thickness of the drywall, the number of screws etc.
>

Knock a damn hole in the ceiling, dang, don't you get it?

>sometimes its easier to just dig into a job than spending too much
>time analyzing it

Logic is cheaper, right?

Have you ever heard of the notion: do the least harm?

[The Daring Dufas]

On 4/2/2013 11:18 AM, andyeverett wrote:
> Went to a costumers home (about 35 years old) to estimate some work.
> Noticed that nearly all the ceiling drywall sags. A 5 foot straight
> edge across the ceiling drywall showed 3/4 gaps in many places. On
> entering the rooms and looking up it was quite obvious. The funny
> thing was that along the long tapered edges the drywall looked tight
> against the ceiling joists but in the middle of the tapered edges was
> the maximum sag. Enough fasteners along the edges but not enough in
> the middle?
>
> The costumer is trying to get the house ready for sale. If I was
> looking at the house the sagging drywall would be a big question mark.
> What can be done in this situation short of new ceiling drywall? Would
> you try and stabilize the drywall with extra fasteners, spackle, and
> paint?
>
> Thanks for any help or suggestions.
>

I just had a thought, paint the ceiling with an ocean scene using the
sagging areas as waves. ^_^

Sorry, couldn't help it.

TDD

[gen...@internet.com]

Paint a big circle in the middle of each sag, then paint nipples in the
middle of each circle. You now have BOOBS on the ceiling. For some
real fun, have someone sew some huge bras, and put them on a few of the
boobs but not all of them..... Men will love it. Women will probably
kick your ass, but that can be fun too!!!!

[cl...@snyder.on.ca]

And sell the place to a midget.

[cl...@snyder.on.ca]

Never nheard "don't try to make a silk purse of a sow's ear"?

You've got the female porcine aurio. Cut your losses and buy proper
silk.

[bob haller]

laws in pennsylvania require disclosure of any defects basically in
the time you owned the home.

so even if a way is found to make it look ok, at home sales time the
owner must disclose the problem and what was done to fix it.

now imagine a cheap quick fix, but no disclosure because it would
cause a lot of questions. like a popcorn cieling.

the home is sold and the new owner finds the cieling is getting more
sags.

the new owner mentions it in passing to someone say a neighbor, or
anyone who was aware of it......

that person says it was a ongoing problem the old owner must of
fixed......

the old owner can and most likely will be sued for all the costs of
repairs.......

hey it took weeks to move all our posessions out of the house, have
the cielings ripped down and replaced, temorary housing during that
time, plus fix some unrelated troubles uncovered when the cielings
came down.......

20 grand should cover the costs, plus the old owners will have to pay
legal fees all around...

the new owners will win in court.

far better to fix it right now, than kick the can till later. at least
now the owner has control over the home and costs

[k...@attt.bizz]

On Thu, 4 Apr 2013 05:50:33 -0700 (PDT), bob haller <hal...@aol.com>
wrote:

>laws in pennsylvania require disclosure of any defects basically in
>the time you owned the home.

Oh, good grief. Here we go again! I bet you can't get insurance if
the ceiling is sagging, either.

<drivel snipped>

[bob haller]

On Apr 4, 10:27 am, k...@attt.bizz wrote:
> On Thu, 4 Apr 2013 05:50:33 -0700 (PDT), bob haller <hall...@aol.com>

> wrote:
>
> >laws in pennsylvania require disclosure of any defects basically in
> >the time you owned the home.
>
> Oh, good grief. Here we go again!  I bet you can't get insurance if
> the ceiling is sagging, either.
>
> <drivel snipped>

Laugh if you want. a neighbor leared it the hard way.......

her main sewer was collapsing. she sold the house and failed to
disclose it.

new owner had flood, called a plumber who had been there in the past.
he told the new owner about the problem and that the old owner knew
sewer was bad..

so new owner sued old owner for damages, including all new sewer line
including under home, tree roots all the way to the street, plus
replacement driveway.

20 grand or so total

home had sold for 100 grand...

so old owner lost 20% of total sales price......

years ago people could get away with stuff like this, but not these
days

[k...@attt.bizz]

On Thu, 4 Apr 2013 08:53:16 -0700 (PDT), bob haller <hal...@aol.com>
wrote:

>On Apr 4, 10:27 am, k...@attt.bizz wrote:
>> On Thu, 4 Apr 2013 05:50:33 -0700 (PDT), bob haller <hall...@aol.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> >laws in pennsylvania require disclosure of any defects basically in
>> >the time you owned the home.
>>
>> Oh, good grief. Here we go again!  I bet you can't get insurance if
>> the ceiling is sagging, either.
>>
>> <drivel snipped>
>
>Laugh if you want. a neighbor leared it the hard way.......

Answer the question. It's *still* valid.

<even more Haller bullshit snipped>

[Mike]

On 04/04/2013 06:50 AM, bob haller wrote:
> laws in pennsylvania require disclosure of any defects basically in
> the time you owned the home.
>
> so even if a way is found to make it look ok, at home sales time the
> owner must disclose the problem and what was done to fix it.
>

Have you people learned nothing from the Clintons?

All you have to do is say "I don't recall".

How can you possibly disclose something you can't remember?

Both Clinton's were Rhodes Scholars yet neither can remember anything while giving testimony.

So, if it works for the Clinton's, it can work for you.

[Oren]

On Thu, 04 Apr 2013 18:29:14 -0600, Mike <mi...@alt.home.repair.inc>
wrote:

>On 04/04/2013 06:50 AM, bob haller wrote:
>> laws in pennsylvania require disclosure of any defects basically in
>> the time you owned the home.
>>
>> so even if a way is found to make it look ok, at home sales time the
>> owner must disclose the problem and what was done to fix it.
>>
>
>Have you people learned nothing from the Clintons?

Yes. He smoked pot three times an never inhaled. Allowed Willie
Nelson to smoke to top of the White House.

>
>All you have to do is say "I don't recall".
>

When caught sleeping on the job, say Amen and raise your head. No
boss would fire you for that.

>How can you possibly disclose something you can't remember?
>
>Both Clinton's were Rhodes Scholars yet neither can remember anything while giving testimony.
>
>So, if it works for the Clinton's, it can work for you.

Break down interpretation: Book of Orenthians, "I was asleep".

[bob haller]

On Apr 5, 12:16 am, Oren <O...@127.0.0.1> wrote:
> On Thu, 04 Apr 2013 18:29:14 -0600, Mike <m...@alt.home.repair.inc>

I had a old girl friend who called me one day she was buying a home
and wanted my opinion.

I said sure and lined up a roofer, plumber, electrician etc to all
meet at the home to inspect it.

The roofer a personal friend showed up and standing on the ground said
it needs a new roof, the roof deck is soft in the middle, the
flashing is bad around the chimney and because of ice dams I recommend
the ice shield stuff.......

Hey you havent even been on the roof, how do you know all this?

Err have been here fixing leaks 4 times in the past 3 years the
homeowner didnt have the $$$ to do it right:(

The house had hidden K&T, a good bit of the crawl space water lines
were galvanized and leaking.

This is how sellers get in trouble the owner had described the home in
great condition. The sale fell thru.......

my old irl friend took me to dinner as a thank you, she said she would
of been in way over her head.

[The Daring Dufas]

You proved what friends are for. ^_^

TDD

[bob haller]

On Apr 5, 12:08 pm, The Daring Dufas <the-daring-du...@stinky-

I believe in helping others, tats been my life..........

[The Daring Dufas]

It's a good way to approach life because I do believe there is a sort of
Karma that exists. Perhaps not a spiritual force but definitely a
bug in the minds of people it affects. I was on the phone a while ago
with the widow of my friend GB and she's like a little sister to me and
she can call me at any time and I'll do my best to assist her. She needs
some outdoor lights fixed, my friend LM needs a fan motor for his home
AC system, my gal has parts that her late husband and I collected over
the years doing work on HVAC systems so I'll get LM to help fix her
lights and LM will wind up with a fan motor and since he owns a metal
working shop, my adopted little sister will be apt to tell her friends
from her church about a nice guy with a metal shop whenever she hears of
someone who needs such work done. I helped LM fix the vandalized AC at
his church, LM helped me do the horribly difficult job of removing the
big plastic gas tank on my van so I could service the fuel pump. I
loaned LM $200 yesterday for the power bill at his shop and I need some
secure storage space for some tools and equipment. When GB was alive we
helped a lot of elderly folks with repairs and didn't charge them a lot
of money but their families would call us to do repairs and pay us full
price. It's funny how Karma or whatever you want to call it works. ^_^

TDD

[andyeverett]

On Apr 3, 9:56 pm, gene...@internet.com wrote:
> On Wed, 03 Apr 2013 20:11:22 -0600, The Daring Dufas
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> <the-daring-du...@stinky-finger.net> wrote:
> >On 4/2/2013 11:18 AM, andyeverett wrote:
> >> Went to a costumers home (about 35 years old) to estimate some work.

> >> Noticed that nearly all the ceilingdrywallsags. A 5 foot straight
> >> edge across the ceilingdrywallshowed 3/4 gaps in many places. On

> >> entering the rooms and looking up it was quite obvious. The funny

> >> thing was that along the long tapered edges thedrywalllooked tight

> >> against the ceiling joists but in the middle of the tapered edges was
> >> the maximum sag. Enough fasteners along the edges but not enough in
> >> the middle?
>
> >> The costumer is trying to get the house ready for sale. If I was

> >> looking at the house the saggingdrywallwould be a big question mark.
> >> What can be done in this situation short of new ceilingdrywall? Would
> >> you try and stabilize thedrywallwith extra fasteners, spackle, and

[andyeverett]

On Apr 3, 9:56 pm, gene...@internet.com wrote:

> On Wed, 03 Apr 2013 20:11:22 -0600, The Daring Dufas
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> <the-daring-du...@stinky-finger.net> wrote:
> >On 4/2/2013 11:18 AM, andyeverett wrote:
> >> Went to a costumers home (about 35 years old) to estimate some work.

> >> Noticed that nearly all the ceilingdrywallsags. A 5 foot straight
> >> edge across the ceilingdrywallshowed 3/4 gaps in many places. On

> >> entering the rooms and looking up it was quite obvious. The funny

> >> thing was that along the long tapered edges thedrywalllooked tight

> >> against the ceiling joists but in the middle of the tapered edges was
> >> the maximum sag. Enough fasteners along the edges but not enough in
> >> the middle?
>
> >> The costumer is trying to get the house ready for sale. If I was

> >> looking at the house the saggingdrywallwould be a big question mark.
> >> What can be done in this situation short of new ceilingdrywall? Would
> >> you try and stabilize thedrywallwith extra fasteners, spackle, and

> >> paint?
>
> >> Thanks for any help or suggestions.
>
> >I just had a thought, paint the ceiling with an ocean scene using the
> >sagging areas as waves. ^_^
>
> >Sorry, couldn't help it.
>
> >TDD
>
> Paint a big circle in the middle of each sag, then paint nipples in the
> middle of each circle.  You now have BOOBS on the ceiling.  For some
> real fun, have someone sew some huge bras, and put them on a few of the
> boobs but not all of them.....  Men will love it.  Women will probably
> kick your ass, but that can be fun too!!!!

Just a follow up, I got up in the attic of the house in question;
ceiling joists are on 16 inch centers, drywall is 1/2 inch, and it
looks like the drywall installers were expecting the construction
adhesive to do the work of a bunch of nails, in some places there were
no nails in the middle!, less then 3 nails per joist. Some of the gaps
between the drywall and the joist were an inch or bigger.

What might be a ballpark estimate to re-drywall a ceiling given that
there is blown-in fiberglass insulation in the ceiling. Say we have
1400 sq ft of drywall, with repainting 10$/sq ft? 14,000$ to re-rock,
re-insulate, and repaint. That sounds way too low, double that?
Jacking up the drywall sounds better if doable.

Thanks for all your advice!

[andyeverett]

> ceiling joists are on 16 inch centers,drywallis 1/2 inch, and it
> looks like thedrywallinstallers were expecting the construction

> adhesive to do the work of a bunch of nails, in some places there were
> no nails in the middle!, less then 3 nails per joist. Some of the gaps

> between thedrywalland the joist were an inch or bigger.
>
> What might be a ballpark estimate to re-drywalla ceiling given that

> there is blown-in fiberglass insulation in the ceiling. Say we have

> 1400 sq ft ofdrywall, with repainting 10$/sq ft? 14,000$ to re-rock,

> re-insulate, and repaint. That sounds way too low, double that?

> Jacking up thedrywallsounds better if doable.

>
> Thanks for all your advice!

Looking at the ceilings today I was thinking this would be a great
time for false beams on 2 foot centers. There is no easy fix sometimes.