AGP Zero Tolerance Policy?
oddlystrange
is as possible... I uh..... have a proposal.
I say, and this is totally open for discussion, that AGP pretty much BAN
all advertising on it.
This will keep spam out -- seeing as to how this is becoming an issue
here.
My take on it is this -- there's AG, AGF, UPG, ACG and others for
putting up ads about your website, or your club nite or whatever.
Zero tolerance leaves little open for debate. You can't say "But its on
topic, but its relevant to all goths, but alt.gothic kicked me off and
I'm trying to find another outlet."
Let this place be for discussions, not a billboard for things.
And frankly (and this is just the underbellied truth) if someone like
Gru posts something about his site being updated (new baby pics! [1]) no
one is going to call it spam, because frankly we all love Gru. And Gru
contributes... blah blah.
And we're going to favor him over some fuckwad who uses a lot of spaces
to appear different, or someone who promotes a club with no city and the
like...
Because we're pretentious and we're allowed to play favorites. Its not a
sin to play favorite.
But saying outright NO ADVERTISING PERMITTED AT ALL is going to give us
a serious answer to the whiney "its on topic!" "I researched this group"
and other comments that only produce a long flame war full of the
regulars imparting their wisdom upon some luser who will eventually
wander off so we can do it all over again to the next twit who enters.
Just say no... it works on two year olds... it can work on people who
need to take a class in advertising.
oddlystrange
(who says neither a fact nor a rule -- discuss)
[1] hint hint
--
"Golf has killed more rock stars than herion."
-- Bobcat Goldwait
referring to Alice Cooper
--< http://www.obscure.org/~perky >--- - - - - - -
.
.
.
.
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
Karl
> In my sincerest hope to keep this newsgroup as close to the utopia it
> is as possible...
*blink blink* It can't be nobody has worshipped at my feet for at least
three mintues
> I uh..... have a proposal.
Okay then meer mortal pray tell what is your little idea.
> I say, and this is totally open for discussion, that AGP pretty much BAN
> all advertising on it.
Yes. Good idea. For that I will allow you into my heaven at a later
(hopefully) stage
> Zero tolerance leaves little open for debate. You can't say "But its on
> topic, but its relevant to all goths, but alt.gothic kicked me off and
> I'm trying to find another outlet."
> Let this place be for discussions, not a billboard for things.
Right. Well....
<booming god like voice>
Let it be decreed and written.
</bglv>
> And frankly (and this is just the underbellied truth) if someone like
> Gru posts something about his site being updated (new baby pics! [1]) no
> one is going to call it spam, because frankly we all love Gru. And Gru
> contributes... blah blah.
> And we're going to favor him over some fuckwad who uses a lot of spaces
> to appear different, or someone who promotes a club with no city and the
> like...
> Because we're pretentious and we're allowed to play favorites. Its not a
> sin to play favorite.
Exactly. Well only if the favourite is me of course...
> But saying outright NO ADVERTISING PERMITTED
> AT ALL is going to give us a serious answer to the whiney
> "its on topic!" "I researched this group" and other comments
> that only produce a long flame war full of the regulars imparting
> their wisdom upon some luser who will eventually
> wander off so we can do it all over again to the next twit who enters.
Yes. Again agreeded. I should sharpen my siccors though I think.
> (who says neither a fact nor a rule -- discuss)
</pretentious>
Personally I think it is an excellent idea and needs to be implemented. I
say
go for it.
Karl - still a god though
Aidan Skinner
>I say, and this is totally open for discussion, that AGP pretty much BAN
>all advertising on it.
Wipe them out.
All of them.
With extreme prejudice.
- Aidan (onwards driver, and don't spare the ammunition)
--
"I say we just bury him and eat dessert"
http://www.skinner.demon.co.uk/aidan/
OpenPGP Key Fingerprint: 9858 33E6 C755 7D34 B5C5 316D 9274 1343 FBE6 99D9
the Gruamach
> In my sincerest hope to keep this newsgroup as close to the utopia it
>is as possible... I uh..... have a proposal.
>
>I say, and this is totally open for discussion, that AGP pretty much BAN
>all advertising on it.
And more, we prolly should put a *real* FAQ up and
repost it now and then.
That way, it directly and absolutely fits under all the
TOS bits that forbid OT and FAQ-violation posts.
No "I didn't know" defenses
>Zero tolerance leaves little open for debate. You can't say "But its on
>topic, but its relevant to all goths, but alt.gothic kicked me off and
>I'm trying to find another outlet."
The only problem to be seen, depending on how the
"official" rule is phrased is.. what about totally ON
topic, and even wanted things like Lixx's advising us
about Hallowmas pics?
(sure, some of us want and asked to see them, so I
guess that one isn't exactly advertizing, but still,
you know what I mean)
>Let this place be for discussions, not a billboard for things.
exactly.
>And frankly (and this is just the underbellied truth) if someone like
>Gru posts something about his site being updated (new baby pics! [1]) no
>one is going to call it spam, because frankly we all love Gru. And Gru
>contributes... blah blah.
So my above example becomes "It's not spam, because
it's from US" right?
Here's just hoping someone doesn't do like s*t*r and
pretend to be a AGP person and "tell" on an actual AGP
person trying to use that rule for revenge... (not
that I forsee it being any problem, though; just
mentioning it)
>And we're going to favor him over some fuckwad who uses a lot of spaces
>to appear different, or someone who promotes a club with no city and the
>like...
that's because I'm too damned cute to hate. :P
Charles (aka: the Gruamach) http://home.stlnet.com/~gothcop
alt.gothic's own Garibaldi,Daddygoff and Jedi Footrubmaster
"It is not enough to conquer,
One must know how to seduce." (Voltaire, 1743)
oddlystrange
gothcopatstlnetdotcomnewtrap wrote:
> That way, it directly and absolutely fits under all the
> TOS bits that forbid OT and FAQ-violation posts.
> No "I didn't know" defenses
First Question of the AGP FAQ:
1) Q: Can I post here?
A: Only if you follow this document to the letter. Because we've been
here longer and that makes us better.
> The only problem to be seen, depending on how the
> "official" rule is phrased is.. what about totally ON
> topic, and even wanted things like Lixx's advising us
> about Hallowmas pics?
> (sure, some of us want and asked to see them, so I
> guess that one isn't exactly advertizing, but still,
> you know what I mean)
I thought I kinda touched on that below. Is timly telling us that
there's new babypics up *advertising* or simply sharing news with
friends?
I'd vote for the later.
If we didn't KNOW timly it would be advertising.
The main difference is the first example will prolly start a discussion.
The second will not. Well other than a flame war and "we're telling your
postmaster" and crap like that.
> So my above example becomes "It's not spam, because
> it's from US" right?
Which actually states it *a LOT* better than I could have. And frankly I
don't see anything wrong with actually saying NO SPAM, and yet having
regulars on here put up things about their sites, or wares or whatever.
Like I said... one is friends sharing news and information the other is
having someone's commercial, fame or other interests shoved down our
throats.
> Here's just hoping someone doesn't do like s*t*r and
> pretend to be a AGP person and "tell" on an actual AGP
> person trying to use that rule for revenge... (not
> that I forsee it being any problem, though; just
> mentioning it)
Well you have a point there. However, really is there no reason why
there shouldn't be a provision that your first few posts to the group
not be an advertisement for something?
I don't know really how to phrase it so a whiney shit like s*t*r can't
twist it right. But everyone here knows what I mean.
> that's because I'm too damned cute to hate. :P
Well that, and the fact ath your idea of content doesn't look like the
introduction to the ford site.
oddlystrange
(who says I'm picking on the poor webbies today!!!)
>
--
"Golf has killed more rock stars than herion."
-- Bobcat Goldwait
referring to Alice Cooper
--< http://www.obscure.org/~perky >--- - - - - - -
Basingstoke
> The only problem to be seen, depending on how the
> "official" rule is phrased is.. what about totally ON
> topic, and even wanted things like Lixx's advising us
> about Hallowmas pics?
And...um...what about .sig ads?
Looking down, I notice that my last revision took my personal page out
(well, it's rubbish), and only the commercial stuff is left.
I suppose I could delete the .sig while posting to this ng if it's a
problem.
Basinke :/
--
Custom rag dolls. http://www.cjnetworks.com/~lms/dollpage.html
things for sale: http://members.ebay.com/aboutme/lms77/
Now on ebay: lace skirt and a gothic rag doll.
the Gruamach
(Aidan Skinner) mumbled:
>On Tue, 09 Nov 1999 16:03:51 GMT, oddlystrange <pe...@obscure.org> wrote:
>
>>I say, and this is totally open for discussion, that AGP pretty much BAN
>>all advertising on it.
>
>Wipe them out.
>All of them.
>With extreme prejudice.
Kill 'em all.
(who cares about sorting them out?)
Charles (aka: the Gruamach) http://home.stlnet.com/~gothcop
alt.gothic's own Garibaldi,Daddygoff and Jedi Footrubmaster
"Every day the stain grows deeper
One day it'll reach you're soul..."
oddlystrange
Basingstoke <b...@yosa.com> wrote:
> I suppose I could delete the .sig while posting to this ng if it's a
> problem.
personally I don't care what's below the "--" on anyone's post so long
as its not extraordinarily long or obnoxious.
I think you miss the whole point that if you're *contributing* to a
group its very much impossible to spam it. [1]
So the answer is. You keep your sig :) We didn't even notice :)
oddlystrange
(who would rather every spammer make a good post and put their
commercial sites in their sigs)
[1] I mean in that good honest citizen sort of way -- not in the
trickery kind of way.
--
"Golf has killed more rock stars than herion."
-- Bobcat Goldwait
referring to Alice Cooper
--< http://www.obscure.org/~perky >--- - - - - - -
.
.
.
.
.
--nightshade--
wrote:
> personally I don't care what's below the "--" on anyone's post
'-- '
--nightshade--
--
--nights...@geocities.canned.meat.com
"whoever said it was a small world was either a liar or a fool"
-concrete blonde
Basingstoke
>
> In article <382876...@yosa.com>,
> Basingstoke <b...@yosa.com> wrote:
>
> > I suppose I could delete the .sig while posting to this ng if it's a
> > problem.
>
> personally I don't care what's below the "--" on anyone's post so long
> as its not extraordinarily long or obnoxious.
>
> I think you miss the whole point that if you're *contributing* to a
> group its very much impossible to spam it. [1]
No, I didn't miss that point. I'm just wondering about the subtleties
of a no-advertising rule.
I do make posts that are strictly commercial, but I keep them to agf and
follow their policies (as best I can...tho fortunately we haven't had
any fucking meta threads lately so the rules haven't changed out from
under me).
Basinke (also pointing out that there is, in fact, a " " after her "--")
;)
johnny & deb
Basingstoke <b...@yosa.com> wrote in message news:382876...@yosa.com...
> the Gruamach wrote:
>
> > The only problem to be seen, depending on how the
> > "official" rule is phrased is.. what about totally ON
> > topic, and even wanted things like Lixx's advising us
> > about Hallowmas pics?
>
> And...um...what about .sig ads?
> Looking down, I notice that my last revision took my personal page out
> (well, it's rubbish), and only the commercial stuff is left.
>
> problem.
>
non-commitial)
like 4 lines, links to e-bay, the gothic order and such would be fine
> Basinke :/
> --
> Custom rag dolls. http://www.cjnetworks.com/~lms/dollpage.html
> things for sale: http://members.ebay.com/aboutme/lms77/
> Now on ebay: lace skirt and a gothic rag doll.
johnny(who forgot to sign my last post on this thread)
(and uses way too many parenthesis)
johnny & deb
oddlystrange <pe...@obscure.org> wrote in message
news:809gl4$2i0$1...@nnrp1.deja.com...
> In my sincerest hope to keep this newsgroup as close to the utopia it
> is as possible... I uh..... have a proposal.
>
i know i am not well known but as a long time lurker i have a few comments,
if you can bear with me.
> I say, and this is totally open for discussion, that AGP pretty much BAN
> all advertising on it.
>
i agree totally, but how is this to be accomp;lished exactly?
> This will keep spam out -- seeing as to how this is becoming an issue
> here.
>
> Let this place be for discussions, not a billboard for things.
>
> And frankly (and this is just the underbellied truth) if someone like
> Gru posts something about his site being updated (new baby pics! [1]) no
> one is going to call it spam, because frankly we all love Gru. And Gru
> contributes... blah blah.
>
the distinction (one distinction) could be between comercial and
non-comercial sites
> And we're going to favor him over some fuckwad who uses a lot of spaces
> to appear different, or someone who promotes a club with no city and the
> like...
>
selective favoritisim, our (i dont like using that term, dont want to sound
presumptious, or pretentious;) group, our rules
> Because we're pretentious and we're allowed to play favorites. Its not a
> sin to play favorite.
>
> But saying outright NO ADVERTISING PERMITTED AT ALL is going to give us
> a serious answer to the whiney "its on topic
advertising is not the topic here, i would like to see thm kept out
> Just say no... it works on two year olds... it can work on people who
> need to take a class in advertising.
>
> oddlystrange
>
> (who says neither a fact nor a rule -- discuss)
>
i would like to see it made official (whatever that means)
> [1] hint hint
johnny & deb
> In article <3830693a...@news.stlnet.com>,
> gothcopatstlnetdotcomnewtrap wrote:
>
> > That way, it directly and absolutely fits under all the
> > TOS bits that forbid OT and FAQ-violation posts.
> > No "I didn't know" defenses
>
>
> First Question of the AGP FAQ:
>
> 1) Q: Can I post here?
> A: Only if you follow this document to the letter. Because we've been
> here longer and that makes us better.
>
>
> Is timly telling us that
> there's new babypics up *advertising* or simply sharing news with
> friends?
>
> I'd vote for the later.
>
exactly, conercial verses non-conercial
> If we didn't KNOW timly it would be advertising.
>
> The main difference is the first example will prolly start a discussion.
> The second will not. Well other than a flame war and "we're telling your
> postmaster" and crap like that.
>
what are anyones thoughts on making a moderated group?
> > So my above example becomes "It's not spam, because
> > it's from US" right?
>
> Which actually states it *a LOT* better than I could have. And frankly I
> don't see anything wrong with actually saying NO SPAM, and yet having
> regulars on here put up things about their sites, or wares or whatever.
> Like I said... one is friends sharing news and information the other is
> having someone's commercial, fame or other interests shoved down our
> throats.
>
>
> However, really is there no reason why
> there shouldn't be a provision that your first few posts to the group
> not be an advertisement for something?
>
good, maybe beter no simply say never, isnt thet what aga is for?
> I don't know really how to phrase it so a whiney shit like s*t*r can't
> twist it right. But everyone here knows what I mean.
>
> > that's because I'm too damned cute to hate. :P
>
> Well that, and the fact ath your idea of content doesn't look like the
> introduction to the ford site.
>
lol
johnny
the Gruamach
<b...@yosa.com> mumbled:
>the Gruamach wrote:
>
>> The only problem to be seen, depending on how the
>> "official" rule is phrased is.. what about totally ON
>> topic, and even wanted things like Lixx's advising us
>> about Hallowmas pics?
>
>And...um...what about .sig ads?
>Looking down, I notice that my last revision took my personal page out
>(well, it's rubbish), and only the commercial stuff is left.
but the distinction of those is in it's own definition:
".sig add" means, obviously, it's in the .sig part of
a post.
The .sig is a small add-on at the end of a POST.
It's a tagline....a bumpersticker, not the whole car.
>I suppose I could delete the .sig while posting to this ng if it's a
>problem.
Not at all.
No need
the Gruamach
<pe...@obscure.org> mumbled:
>First Question of the AGP FAQ:
>
>1) Q: Can I post here?
>A: Only if you follow this document to the letter. Because we've been
>here longer and that makes us better.
Bingo.
Got my vote
>I thought I kinda touched on that below. Is timly telling us that
>there's new babypics up *advertising* or simply sharing news with
>friends?
>
>I'd vote for the later.
>
>If we didn't KNOW timly it would be advertising.
Exactly.
It's like me calling up my friends here and going
"Dude! I just got a killer new stereo! Come over and
check it out!"
That's not only fine and good, but they'd likely be
pissed if I didn't tell them.
But if I were to walk into a busy (or not-too-busy)
coffeehouse and insist on telling that to everyone
there, who don't even know me... That would just plain
be innappropriate. And rude.
Lixx posting that she updated her site's content, on
more than one NG, is not spam. Despite the fact that
that is exactly what wassisname did at the same time.
The difference lies in the fact that a lot of us
actually DID request such info, and would be upset if
we weren't told.
But he stomped into our cafes, and instead of
continuing to be sit quietly and observe the
atmosphere, he started blurting out that we should stop
what we were doing and suddenly focus our attention on
him. Course, Lixx's response is usually "Cool!!"
whereas his is likely "Who the hell are you?"
>The main difference is the first example will prolly start a discussion.
>The second will not. Well other than a flame war and "we're telling your
>postmaster" and crap like that.
>
>> So my above example becomes "It's not spam, because
>> it's from US" right?
>
>Which actually states it *a LOT* better than I could have. And frankly I
>don't see anything wrong with actually saying NO SPAM, and yet having
>regulars on here put up things about their sites, or wares or whatever.
>Like I said... one is friends sharing news and information the other is
>having someone's commercial, fame or other interests shoved down our
>throats.
>
>> Here's just hoping someone doesn't do like s*t*r and
>> pretend to be a AGP person and "tell" on an actual AGP
>> person trying to use that rule for revenge... (not
>> that I forsee it being any problem, though; just
>> mentioning it)
>
>Well you have a point there. However, really is there no reason why
>there shouldn't be a provision that your first few posts to the group
>not be an advertisement for something?
>
>I don't know really how to phrase it so a whiney shit like s*t*r can't
>twist it right. But everyone here knows what I mean.
>
>> that's because I'm too damned cute to hate. :P
>
>Well that, and the fact ath your idea of content doesn't look like the
>introduction to the ford site.
>
>oddlystrange
>
>(who says I'm picking on the poor webbies today!!!)
>
>>
Charles (aka: the Gruamach) http://home.stlnet.com/~gothcop
Rafe
> First Question of the AGP FAQ:
>
> 1) Q: Can I post here?
> A: Only if you follow this document to the letter. Because we've been
> here longer and that makes us better.
2) Q: What can I post here? A: Anything we think doesn't suck, to be
determined, via committee and public beating, after you've already posted
it.
3) Q: What are those severed heads?
A: Your new roommates if you spam us.
> I thought I kinda touched on that below. Is timly telling us that
> there's new babypics up *advertising* or simply sharing news with
> friends?
>
> I'd vote for the later.
>
> If we didn't KNOW timly it would be advertising.
Just to point out something. . . would Timly -want- to sell us his
kids? And who would buy them? Kids, if I'm not mistaken, are EXPENSIVE.
*giggle*
> > So my above example becomes "It's not spam, because it's from US" right?
>
> Which actually states it *a LOT* better than I could have. And frankly I
> don't see anything wrong with actually saying NO SPAM, and yet having
> regulars on here put up things about their sites, or wares or whatever.
Think of it this way: anyone who contributes here regularly (and
doesn't frequently get their head handed to them for being a tool) has
probably demonstrated some decorum and gothic/pertinent content, and, as
such, most things they would be creating or sharing would be of interest to
the community at large.
> I don't know really how to phrase it so a whiney shit like s*t*r can't
> twist it right. But everyone here knows what I mean.
and that's what's important. if so-and-so violates the 'spirit' of the
community/NG FAQ, we can dispose of them accordingly. if a complaint comes
in, it's company policy where i work to generally request input from the
group leader(s) (who are named on the FAQ) to get first-person perspective
on the event. . . . unless, of course, the complaint was made by one of
those folks, in which case we beat immediately upon reciept of sufficient
proof.
-Rafe
V^^^^V
www.digitaldiscipline.com - gear for the twisted pair <= self-spam!
(She speaks with audible semicolons. She's that kind of smart.)
- from Geek Fantasia, www.monkeybagel.com
"I'm synthetic, not stupid." - Bishop
Nile Evil Bastard
: In my sincerest hope to keep this newsgroup as close to the utopia it
:is as possible... I uh..... have a proposal.
:I say, and this is totally open for discussion, that AGP pretty much BAN
:all advertising on it.
Write a FAQ in proper format, get it approved for faqs.org and then it'll be
as official as these things can get.
--
http://netizen.com.au/ http://www.caube.org.au/
"Oh man, how I long for the days when people's eyes glazed over when I told
them I work with computers for a living." (Alan J Rosenthal)
Juliann
>Lixx posting that she updated her site's content, on
>more than one NG, is not spam. Despite the fact that
>that is exactly what wassisname did at the same time.
>The difference lies in the fact that a lot of us
>actually DID request such info, and would be upset if
>we weren't told.
>But he stomped into our cafes, and instead of
>continuing to be sit quietly and observe the
>atmosphere, he started blurting out that we should stop
>what we were doing and suddenly focus our attention on
>him. Course, Lixx's response is usually "Cool!!"
>whereas his is likely "Who the hell are you?"
Which is what most people say at me anyway ;)
Why would I want to post anything to you lot anyway unless it will
make me money? Geez, as if I have *time* for you no-account
pretentious folks anyway, I have a life [1] and a spouse [2] to spend
my oh-so-valuable time [3] on!
~formerly lady id, but sick of the moniker~[4]
[1] OK no, but I have ADSL.
[2] Who shall remain nameless because he greps for t-i-m-m and
s-q-u-i-r-r. Who shall kill me for divulging his secrets.
[3] OK when I bother to work.
[4] Uhm, oh yeah, I am back on usenet. Ta-da?
<insert soon-to-be commercial .sig here>
daddygoth overboming
Rafe suggested......
> oddlystrange wrote:
>
> > First Question of the AGP FAQ:
> >
> > 1) Q: Can I post here?
> > A: Only if you follow this document to the letter. Because we've been
> > here longer and that makes us better.
i think it would be better phrased as: 'because we've been her longer than
_you_ and that makes us *better* than you.
> 2) Q: What can I post here? A: Anything we think doesn't suck, to be
> determined, via committee and public beating, after you've already posted
> it.
what? nothing about the offerings to me required for them to post? after
all, i *am* the whole reason this n.g. is still here. yes, 'tis true. it
exsists as a place on usenet, created soley to be able to contain the
enormity of my personality... : ţ
> 3) Q: What are those severed heads?
> A: Your new roommates if you spam us.
or better yet... A: it's gonna be *your* severed head if you don't shut the
fuck up and quit wasting my fucking time with your stupid fucking questions,
you nattering twit. (or in oddly's words [i think]: you fuck-nugget.)
> > I thought I kinda touched on that below. Is timly telling us that
> > there's new babypics up *advertising* or simply sharing news with
> > friends?
> >
> > I'd vote for the later.
> >
> > If we didn't KNOW timly it would be advertising.
you only *wish* you KNEW me like that...
> Just to point out something. . . would Timly -want- to sell us his
> kids? And who would buy them? Kids, if I'm not mistaken, are EXPENSIVE.
> *giggle*
nope. this kid is way too cute to sell. but, that being the case, there's
lots of people that would buy her, had they the means. but, that's reminding
me of bad daddy-nightmares, so i'm gonna get off this subject.
> > > So my above example becomes "It's not spam, because it's from US"
right?
hell fucking yes!
> Think of it this way: anyone who contributes here regularly (and
> doesn't frequently get their head handed to them for being a tool) has
> probably demonstrated some decorum and gothic/pertinent content, and, as
> such, most things they would be creating or sharing would be of interest
to
> the community at large.
or: anyone that posts regularaly that wants to tell us something about
themselves ('my c17 holos are up!' -isa in 12 years [c'mon, you know they'll
have the technology by then!]).
> > I don't know really how to phrase it so a whiney shit like s*t*r can't
> > twist it right. But everyone here knows what I mean.
well, we can write the FAQ by committe and others can offer suggestion to
solve situations like this. do we have any assho... er, lawyers in our
midst?
> and that's what's important. if so-and-so violates the 'spirit' of
the
> community/NG FAQ, we can dispose of them accordingly.
define 'accordingly'
i think you might have an idea of what my definition would be... : )
--
timly grć
http://people.va.mediaone.net/ovrbomng | icq# 9406642
"imprisioned in my heart, my aches are at war with my love for you,
crushed by the dark,uncertain, i lie in this bed, burning for you." -me.
daddygoth overboming
Juliann said something about...
(re-writing this reply after outlook depressed up and commited suicide on me
a few moments ago...)
> ~formerly lady id, but sick of the moniker~[4]
i'm trying to remember if i know you from back then. when was it last that
you posted regularly to a.g.?
> [4] Uhm, oh yeah, I am back on usenet. Ta-da?
>
> <insert soon-to-be commercial .sig here>
sheyeah! like you've been back long enough to do so! i don't *think* so! : þ
::grin::
gotta welcome you back in the proper a.g.p. way.
--
timly græ (something is screwy with this p.o.s. machine....)
the Gruamach
<ra...@digitaldiscipline.com> mumbled:
>2) Q: What can I post here? A: Anything we think doesn't suck, to be
>determined, via committee and public beating, after you've already posted
>it.
Indeed.
>3) Q: What are those severed heads?
> A: Your new roommates if you spam us.
Rightly so.
> Just to point out something. . . would Timly -want- to sell us his
>kids? And who would buy them? Kids, if I'm not mistaken, are EXPENSIVE.
>*giggle*
Disturbingly so
>> I don't know really how to phrase it so a whiney shit like s*t*r can't
>> twist it right. But everyone here knows what I mean.
>
> and that's what's important. if so-and-so violates the 'spirit' of the
>community/NG FAQ, we can dispose of them accordingly. if a complaint comes
>in, it's company policy where i work to generally request input from the
>group leader(s) (who are named on the FAQ) to get first-person perspective
>on the event. . . . unless, of course, the complaint was made by one of
>those folks, in which case we beat immediately upon reciept of sufficient
>proof.
Ah perfect....
Since a person considering deleting someone's account
based on TOS violation of "NG FAQ violation", you'd
think they'd first read said FAQ to make sure it's not
a NG like alt.advertisements or something.....
So, besides just listing the "top heads", we should
include a note saying "Unless you're recieved
complaints from more than one of these people, please
contact them in regards to reported problems"
the Gruamach
jun...@people-are.strange.com (Juliann) mumbled:
>Which is what most people say at me anyway ;)
Juliann!
Glee!!
Where have you and the squirrine one been hiding? UPG,
right?
>Why would I want to post anything to you lot anyway unless it will
>make me money? Geez, as if I have *time* for you no-account
>pretentious folks anyway, I have a life [1] and a spouse [2] to spend
>my oh-so-valuable time [3] on!
heheheh.
I'll have one of those small furry things I see hiding
in the corner, there...
>[1] OK no, but I have ADSL.
Grrrr
>[2] Who shall remain nameless because he greps for t-i-m-m and
>s-q-u-i-r-r. Who shall kill me for divulging his secrets.
He's so cute when he gets macho
>[3] OK when I bother to work.
work is for the unimaginative
>[4] Uhm, oh yeah, I am back on usenet. Ta-da?
Cool.
the Gruamach
overboming" <ovrb...@mediaone.net> mumbled:
>well, we can write the FAQ by committe and others can offer suggestion to
>solve situations like this. do we have any assho... er, lawyers in our
>midst?
hey now!
Don't insult assholes!
We work for a living....
(the proper slang for lawyers is
moneygrubbingpiecesofshitleechesofhumanity)
Rafe
> i think it would be better phrased as: 'because we've been her longer than
> _you_ and that makes us *better* than you.
agreed!
> what? nothing about the offerings to me required for them to post? after
> all, i *am* the whole reason this n.g. is still here. yes, 'tis true. it
> exsists as a place on usenet, created soley to be able to contain the
> enormity of my personality... : ţ
sorry, your ego was blocking the divine light by which it is illuminated.
in other words, i kicked the damn thing under the bed with the dust ferrets
*g*
> or better yet... A: it's gonna be *your* severed head if you don't shut the
> fuck up and quit wasting my fucking time with your stupid fucking questions,
> you nattering twit. (or in oddly's words [i think]: you fuck-nugget.)
fuck-nugget, fuckwit, fuckwad, oxygen leech, etc, etc, etc. . . *grin*
> nope. this kid is way too cute to sell.
ahh, a value-added product!
> or: anyone that posts regularaly that wants to tell us something about
> themselves ('my c17 holos are up!' -isa in 12 years [c'mon, you know they'll
> have the technology by then!]).
if not be able to beam them directly into each other's minds. . . wheeeeeee.
. . .
> well, we can write the FAQ by committe and others can offer suggestion to
> solve situations like this. do we have any assho... er, lawyers in our
> midst?
i'm just a wordy asshole, not a lawyer, but if the will of the group says it
should be, i can cobble something together in the next couple days and post
revisions for the group to critique & modify.
> > community/NG FAQ, we can dispose of them accordingly.
> define 'accordingly'
> i think you might have an idea of what my definition would be... : )
"hangin's too good for em. shootin's too good for em. let's burn the
fuckers!"
am i close? *g*
-Rafe
V^^^^V
Juliann
Gruamach) wrote:
>Where have you and the sq**rrine one been hiding? UPG,
>right?
Nah, more like MUSHes again :) He's been hiding in some weird
Mac-land.
You had to use the s-q-u-i-r-r word didn't you? Now he'll be onto us!
But after our honeymoon hiatus we're re-emeging into society, so it
might as well be time to grace you with our presence once more.
--
~j~
<uhm...buy more...food. Yeah. Food.>
Juliann
<ovrb...@mediaone.net> wrote:
>i'm trying to remember if i know you from back then. when was it last that
>you posted regularly to a.g.?
Before that wedding-y thing. Most often associated with the C5
shtuff.
>> [4] Uhm, oh yeah, I am back on usenet. Ta-da?
>>
>> <insert soon-to-be commercial .sig here>
>
>sheyeah! like you've been back long enough to do so! i don't *think* so! : ş
>
--
~j~
<uhm, commerce, commerce...Buy Corsets Now!>
Juliann
<ovrb...@mediaone.net> wrote:
>
>well, we can write the FAQ by committe and others can offer suggestion to
>solve situations like this. do we have any assho... er, lawyers in our
>midst?
*ahem*
Actually we have lots of assholes. It's a fundamental law of Usenet:
Thou Shalt Have Assholes. So if you can't think of anyone, someone
had best start acting like it pronto before the asshole patrol sends
more our way.
I nominate Karl.
--
~j~
<Buy more...lawyers. Pale goth needs capitalist enrichment badly.>
HiRez
> [1] OK no, but I have ADSL.
Not right now you don't...
Getting back from Whitby to discover BT have turned your toys off
concentrates the mind wonderfully. (On making the unix box do PPP to
Freeserve)
--
J "Eeeeee-Krccchhhhhhhhhh" H-R
Metamorph
> In my sincerest hope to keep this newsgroup as close to the utopia it
> is as possible... I uh..... have a proposal.
The Queen is listening...
> I say, and this is totally open for discussion, that AGP pretty much BAN
> all advertising on it.
<tilts head to the side> Do we need to officially Ban that which proper
pretentious manners imply?
> Let this place be for discussions, not a billboard for things.
The Horror! *HSF* Adverts here!? <faints>
> And frankly (and this is just the underbellied truth) if someone like
> Gru posts something about his site being updated (new baby pics! [1]) no
> one is going to call it spam, because frankly we all love Gru. And Gru
> contributes... blah blah.
>
> And we're going to favor him over some fuckwad who uses a lot of spaces
> to appear different, or someone who promotes a club with no city and the
> like...
Our Royal Subjects are required to put forth any and all pertinent
information regarding their behavior in our realm. An informed Queen
rules wisely. Misinformation could destroy our realm. Adverts are
designed to lead our Royal Subjects astray. We Will Not Tolerate
Subversion In Our Midst! *waves the Royal Scepter wildly clonking
several innocent Pages at Her Royal Nicely Booted Feet*
> Because we're pretentious and we're allowed to play favorites. Its not a
> sin to play favorite.
Sin? It is Our Duty!
> But saying outright NO ADVERTISING PERMITTED AT ALL
We agree. No ebay, no visit my site, no check this out, no join us on
Pluto, No No NO NONONONO! <sits back down rearranging the Royal Crown>
> Just say no... it works on two year olds... it can work on people who
> need to take a class in advertising.
We disagree. The word "NO" does not mean what you think it means... It
does not work on two year olds, junkies, or the clueless.
We shall call out the guards and rally our forces to Destroy the Enemy
in our midst! <leads charge with banners unfurled>
Metamorph, Queen of A.G.P.
the Gruamach
jun...@people-are.strange.com (Juliann) mumbled:
>On Thu, 11 Nov 1999 07:17:59 GMT, gothcoph...@stlnet.com (the
>Gruamach) wrote:
>
>>Where have you and the sq**rrine one been hiding? UPG,
>>right?
>
>Nah, more like MUSHes again :) He's been hiding in some weird
>Mac-land.
*shudder*
The only time I ever got into a MUSH was over there.
I hated my phone bills
>You had to use the s-q-u-i-r-r word didn't you? Now he'll be onto us!
You know I'm just a shit disturber.
>But after our honeymoon hiatus we're re-emeging into society, so it
>might as well be time to grace you with our presence once more.
I miss my tag-team flaming partner. :)
Miss Felicity
these be posted or should they be posted to a.g.a?
Miss Felicity (my God - I actually *read* most of the posts here)
johnny & deb
Miss Felicity <felic...@home.com> wrote in message
news:382BC5A8...@home.com...
> What about club playlists or announcements of upcoming events? Can
> these be posted or should they be posted to a.g.a?
>
too localized. Events differ slightly, convergence, hollowmass and such
would be fine, local stuff isn't, doesn't affect enough of us. I would like
to see this group remain interesting instead of reading about some little
band who played at some little club that i have never heard of 2000mi away.
my 2 cents
johnny
Nile Evil Bastard
:What about club playlists or announcements of upcoming events? Can
:these be posted or should they be posted to a.g.a?
Not for a.g.p - there is no sensible reason why they need to be here.
"Announcements should go to alt.gothic.announce. Playlists are ideally suited
to alt.gothic and alt.gothic.music - and don't forget the [PLAYLIST] in the
Subject: line. Don't post them to a.g.p."
:Miss Felicity (my God - I actually *read* most of the posts here)
And we want to keep it that way.
Bloodstone
: oddlystrange wrote:
:> First Question of the AGP FAQ:
:>
:> 1) Q: Can I post here?
:> A: Only if you follow this document to the letter. Because we've been
:> here longer and that makes us better.
: 2) Q: What can I post here? A: Anything we think doesn't suck, to be
: determined, via committee and public beating, after you've already posted
: it.
Eh feck... That'll serve me right for reading newsrgoups backwards... I just
posted a message saying that words pretty much to this effect should form the
"ARTICLE CONTENT" section of the charter.
: Think of it this way: anyone who contributes here regularly (and
: doesn't frequently get their head handed to them for being a tool) has
: probably demonstrated some decorum and gothic/pertinent content, and, as
: such, most things they would be creating or sharing would be of interest to
: the community at large.
The danger comes when, say Gru posts something advertising new Baby pics and
then Jo Tosser comes along posting something about visiting his kEwl And wIckEd
mAnsOn sItE mAn... Mr Tosser can then argue that he assumed that personal
adverts were exempt because Gru got away with it... etc.
This is the problem with specifying a charter, people can always twist words
and circumstances so that most of the time (unless they've done something
really dense) they can get away with it.
:> I don't know really how to phrase it so a whiney shit like s*t*r can't
:> twist it right. But everyone here knows what I mean.
Precisely. It's probably best to be non-specific in the charter but in the FAQ
give some guidelines on posting.
I rather like the idea of...
Question X.X You killed my account! You Bastards!
You probably posted something truly dense, like a binary, advert or
troll. Whatever you did you deserved it so stop whining.
I'm enjoying this now I don't actually have to do it :)
--
. . + + <BLOODSTONE> + . |
. + * http://www.karoo.net/midnight * - + -
* . + + -=oOOo=- + . |
Greylock: Numb
dance the two-step and proclaim:
>First Question of the AGP FAQ:
>
>1) Q: Can I post here?
>A: Only if you follow this document to the letter. Because we've been
>here longer and that makes us better.
Second Question:
2) Q: Who owns this newsgroup?
A: The Gothtransformers(1).
(1) Very old (2) AGP reference(3)
(2) Hence legitimizing the clause.
(3) From when there were only three posters.
H*ydn: Who wrote the original AGP FAQ, and I quote:
Q: Is there a FAQ for this newsgroup?
A: Yes, but you're not good enough to see it.
----
H*ydn
http://www.goth.org.au
http://www.fortunecity.com/roswell/daniken/67/index2.html
There is no joy in life. There is no salvation in death.
the Gruamach
st...@midnight.karoo.FISH.co.uk (Bloodstone) mumbled:
>The danger comes when, say Gru posts something advertising new Baby pics and
>then Jo Tosser comes along posting something about visiting his kEwl And wIckEd
>mAnsOn sItE mAn... Mr Tosser can then argue that he assumed that personal
>adverts were exempt because Gru got away with it... etc.
>This is the problem with specifying a charter, people can always twist words
>and circumstances so that most of the time (unless they've done something
>really dense) they can get away with it.
We already covered this part.
"It's not spam when it's from US"
I don't remember if it was in there or not, but under
this catch-all description of FAQ Violations we should
list a certain number of people as "official judges of
US" for sysadmins to contact if they feel a reported
poster is actually an abuser or not.
>I rather like the idea of...
>
> Question X.X You killed my account! You Bastards!
>
> You probably posted something truly dense, like a binary, advert or
> troll. Whatever you did you deserved it so stop whining.
But that's too vauge.
Rafe
> Eh feck... That'll serve me right for reading newsrgoups backwards... I just
> posted a message saying that words pretty much to this effect should form the
> "ARTICLE CONTENT" section of the charter.
And I'll serve you one more time before I finish the rewrite. Look at the
&*$**(%# RFC 666 thread and you'll see what I put together already so you can stop
replicating my work and strike out on your own. I -hate- being followed around
like that *giggle*
> The danger comes when, say Gru posts something advertising new Baby pics and
> then Jo Tosser comes along posting something about visiting his kEwl And wIckEd
> mAnsOn sItE mAn...
See Gru's followup and the AGP FAQ posts in the other thread for answers to
this burning issue and thousands more!
> I'm enjoying this now I don't actually have to do it :)
yes, now let -me- enjoy actually doing it, eh? *grin*
--
Marcus Panchenko
news:942790993....@midnight.karoo.co.uk...> :> First Question of the AGP FAQ:
There's an A.G.P FAQ now?
--
===>StealthGoth Pan<===A.G.S-F US East!
The Pan Pages - http://www.zenweb.com/pan
Net.Goth Directory - http://www.zenweb.com/pan/netgoth
Legends Online - http://www.zenweb.com/pan/legends
chijin <chijin5
>
>Bloodstone <st...@midnight.karoo.FISH.co.uk> wrote in message
>news:942790993....@midnight.karoo.co.uk...
>> Rafe <ra...@digitaldiscipline.com> wrote:
>> : oddlystrange wrote:
>>
>> :> First Question of the AGP FAQ:
>
>There's an A.G.P FAQ now?
Currently in development.
Don't kill me, I'm only watching.:)
Chijin<8P
**who croaks, "Pan's come! We're saved, by tarnation and thunder!!"**
**then drops dead in the dust with a Steve Martin arrow through his head**
Marcus Pan
Iew. Damn unconfigured newsreader.
Bloodstone
: Bloodstone wrote:
:> Eh feck... That'll serve me right for reading newsrgoups backwards...
: And I'll serve you one more time before I finish the rewrite. Look at the
: &*$**(%# RFC 666 thread and you'll see what I put together already so you can stop
: replicating my work and strike out on your own.
I would have read it... if I had it. The article I posted was quite different
to the first proposal of yours. Evidently I've missed a bit of discussion; the
bit where most of the points I raised have already been discussed.
I thought I was rasing new points; otherwise I wouldn't have posted.
Bloodstone
: On Tue, 16 Nov 1999 22:23:13 GMT,
: st...@midnight.karoo.FISH.co.uk (Bloodstone) mumbled:
: We already covered this part.
: "It's not spam when it's from US"
Eh... I only have enough space to keep a very short news spool on pixie so
while I was away doing other things the articles must have come and gone.
Blech.
: I don't remember if it was in there or not, but under
: this catch-all description of FAQ Violations we should
: list a certain number of people as "official judges of
: US" for sysadmins to contact if they feel a reported
: poster is actually an abuser or not.
I think in the league of bad ideas that registers pretty highly. The idea of
having an offical cabal is abhorrent to me. The necessity of having one person
ultimately in charge is bad enough, but in the extreme if s/he starts
behaving like a tosser we just install another charter proponent. An official
cabal will have much more obvious power than one charter proponent; someone
posting something a little bit out of the way can be flamed by several people
and have no comeback as they are "official administrators of the group".
I am *very* frightened that what hapenned on alt.gothic, where the supposed
AGSF went round clubbing to death anyone who posted anything but the same shit
that everyone was posting, might happen here. It *RUINED* alt.gothic for a
while and as I've said elsewhere it still hasn't fully recovered. Hence I think
any kind of organised power base, which was what caused the problem on
alt.gothic, should be avoided as much as possible.
I do think we need a charter proponent (and charter, obviously) though, but
only as someone to get the big holy stick out when required. Most of the time
we should be able to deal with the shit without the need for any kind of
"official action".
:>I rather like the idea of...
:>
:> Question X.X You killed my account! You Bastards!
:>
:> You probably posted something truly dense, like a binary, advert or
:> troll. Whatever you did you deserved it so stop whining.
: But that's too vauge.
Unfortunately you are correct. Would look nice in a FAQ though :)
Metamorph
> > : oddlystrange wrote:
> > :> First Question of the AGP FAQ:
> There's an A.G.P FAQ now?
Development in progress... Anything you would like to add?
I believe it came about due to the increase in traffic in our little
corner.. ;-}
Metamorph, working on another little idea...
[p&m]
the Gruamach
<p...@zenweb.com> mumbled:
>> Marcus Panchenko wrote:
>
>Iew. Damn unconfigured newsreader.
arf arf arf!
*Gru, sitting in his white Froot-O-Loom undies,
laughing so hard he falls off the chair*
The sad thing is, I don't even know WHY that seems so
damned funny.
Charles (aka: the Gruamach) http://home.stlnet.com/~gothcop
alt.gothic's own Garibaldi,Daddygoff and Jedi Footrubmaster
"He's a bit dodgy in the same way that a rat is a bit
covered in fur." -Door
daddygoth overboming
Bloodstone spoke loud and preached mightily...
>
> I think in the league of bad ideas that registers pretty highly. The idea
of
> having an offical cabal is abhorrent to me.
actually, in the latest revision of the faq, it appears that rafe has
written it so those people listed are contacts for sys-admin types who are
following up on reports of abuse, etc. that doesn't give them any power on
the ng for anything other than answering a few questions.
but, hey! i've never been part of a secret C@&L3 before! i kinda like that
idea! heheheheh
--
timly grć
Rafe
> I would have read it... if I had it. The article I posted was quite different
> to the first proposal of yours. Evidently I've missed a bit of discussion; the
> bit where most of the points I raised have already been discussed.
ah, that's okay, we'll forgive you. i'm a big softie to the regulars (except
benton, because he's come closest to touching my genitalia) *laugh*
> I thought I was rasing new points; otherwise I wouldn't have posted.
Please feel free to give me your thoughts on the proposed v0.3 faq (separate
thread). i'm using this one, the rfc666 one, and subsequent comments to fine-tune and
rebuild it before it goes into general use.
HiRez
> I am *very* frightened that what hapenned on alt.gothic, where the supposed
> AGSF went round clubbing to death anyone who posted anything but the same shit
> that everyone was posting, might happen here.
They did? Details, laddie...
the Gruamach
overboming" <ovrb...@mediaone.net> mumbled:
>
>Bloodstone spoke loud and preached mightily...
>>
>> I think in the league of bad ideas that registers pretty highly. The idea
>of
>> having an offical cabal is abhorrent to me.
>
>actually, in the latest revision of the faq, it appears that rafe has
>written it so those people listed are contacts for sys-admin types who are
>following up on reports of abuse, etc. that doesn't give them any power on
>the ng for anything other than answering a few questions.
>
>but, hey! i've never been part of a secret C@&L3 before! i kinda like that
>idea! heheheheh
Indeed.
Besides, this *IS* a secret C*b*l.... We're just THAT
pretenious, dammit.
Tom Fosdick
: Bloodstone spoke loud and preached mightily...
:>
:> I think in the league of bad ideas that registers pretty highly. The idea
: of
:> having an offical cabal is abhorrent to me.
: actually, in the latest revision of the faq,
Still hasn't showed on my newsfeed, but there again my ISP has just changed
news provider at, ooh, about ten minutes notice so it's probably dropped into
the great Internet void.
: it appears that rafe has
: written it so those people listed are contacts for sys-admin types who are
: following up on reports of abuse, etc. that doesn't give them any power on
: the ng for anything other than answering a few questions.
That's better, but I still think having named individuals is a bad idea.
I noticed when I was FAQ admin over on ag that in general conversation people
responded to me differently to before; I noted also that people were less keen
to argue with me even when the subject matter was way off relevent to the FAQ
(and I was on occasion wrong). If there are named individuals in the FAQ I
think there is a danger that people will react to these people will be seen as
leaders and hence will unduly influence, not through any official action, the
content and nature of the group.
A better idea would perhaps be to reference a list of people who can be called
upon for assistance, but not make that list actually part of the FAQ; hold it
somewhere else. Hopefully the extra layer of abstraction will further dissipate
any unintentional influence that these people may have.
: but, hey! i've never been part of a secret C@&L3 before! i kinda like that
: idea! heheheheh
There was no cabal! Honest guv!
Tom Fosdick
: Bloodstone wrote:
: They did? Details, laddie...
There was never really a problem with what one might call the core AGSF, but
the tag attracted an awful lot of gunslinging, trigger happy twats who thought
they were on some kind of crusade.
Ron for instance had a hard time explaining that a piece of horror fiction he
posted wasn't a troll. I remember posts from before AGSF that were as graphic
as that one if not more so receiving nothing but acclaim. After all, a huge
number of goths read and enjoy horror.
Anything vaguely controversial from an address that wasn't well known was
called a troll by the supposed AGSF.
They also failed to note that nowhere has it ever said in any charter or FAQ of
alt.gothic that the gothic subculture must be discussed in a positive light on
alt.gothic, hence anything even slightly critical was automaticly called a
troll, when in reality most of the time it would probably have done us (and the
poster) good to discuss any criticisms, whether or not the poster was trolling
would soon become apparent anyway.
Take also Chaos Control; a huge flamewar ensued when he arrived and had 8 bit
chars in his .Sig; he was immediately accused of trolling (despite the fact
that the content of his posts was nothing unusual) and hence the whole thing
went off like a claymore mine. If someone had had a quiet word in his ear and
said "look CC, 8 bit chars hose some people's newsreaders, can you not use
them" the whole situation could probably have been avoided.
Then there were the organised trolls; the people who turned up specificly
because of the hot-headed reputation of some of the supposed AGSF, they caused
huge flamewars because the twat element of AGSF came through true to form.
The points that have been discussed recently are very valid, if we are going to
have any official rules then they must have the capability of removing that
which is inappropriate from the group. We must however pay great consideration
to the any detrimental effects that such rules may have on the normal content
of the group. As with so many pioneers, alt.gothic was a good try and we needed
to make a stand, but with the benefit of hindsight it is clear that to some
extent, we got it wrong.
Greylock: Numb
did dance the two-step and proclaim:
>Ron for instance had a hard time explaining that a piece of horror fiction he
>posted wasn't a troll.
It was porn, not horror! :)
>They also failed to note that nowhere has it ever said in any charter or FAQ of
>alt.gothic that the gothic subculture must be discussed in a positive light on
>alt.gothic, hence anything even slightly critical was automaticly called a
>troll, when in reality most of the time it would probably have done us (and the
>poster) good to discuss any criticisms, whether or not the poster was trolling
>would soon become apparent anyway.
That's a difficult one. Very few people come onto a foreign newsgroup with
the aim of objectively debating a position.
>Take also Chaos Control; a huge flamewar ensued when he arrived and had 8 bit
>chars in his .Sig;
Ah. Salad daze. That flamewar went on for ever.
>Then there were the organised trolls; the people who turned up specificly
>because of the hot-headed reputation of some of the supposed AGSF,
That, I think, was the worst thing.
> As with so many pioneers, alt.gothic was a good try and we needed
>to make a stand, but with the benefit of hindsight it is clear that to some
>extent, we got it wrong.
As a matter of interest, does anyone know how net.subculutre.gothic is
going?
H*ydn: On alt.gothic one never has to cry havoc and unleash the hounds of
war because they're always loose.
Metamorph
> As a matter of interest, does anyone know how net.subculutre.gothic is
> going?
It's a lonely and empty space...
Metamorph
Siobhan
Numb) wrote:
>As a matter of interest, does anyone know how net.subculutre.gothic is
>going?
Haven't seen a single post in the two weeks I've been using newsguy.
Siobhan
....Normal is what cuts off your sixth finger and your tail...
{http://www.virulent.org} sio...@virulent.org
"Survival Tip: When In A House Without Heating Or Electricity
During The Middle Of Winter, Your Survival Is Directly Connected
To The Quantity Of Johnny Walker You Own."~Casper von Bittergoff
Alain
wrote:
>On 21 Nov 1999 10:39:59 GMT, t...@midnight.karoo.FISH.co.uk (Tom Fosdick)
>did dance the two-step and proclaim:
>
>>Ron for instance had a hard time explaining that a piece of horror fiction he
>>posted wasn't a troll.
>
>It was porn, not horror! :)
Same thing. It was porn written by Ron, if I understood well.
Alain.
HiRez
> As a matter of interest, does anyone know how net.subculutre.gothic is
> going?
About as quiet as the rest of usenet-ii.
Hey, maybe we should newgroup <mumble>.goth and collect the set..?
Nile Evil Bastard
:the Gruamach <gothcoph...@stlnet.com> wrote:
:: I don't remember if it was in there or not, but under
:: this catch-all description of FAQ Violations we should
:: list a certain number of people as "official judges of
:: US" for sysadmins to contact if they feel a reported
:: poster is actually an abuser or not.
:I think in the league of bad ideas that registers pretty highly. The idea of
:having an offical cabal is abhorrent to me. The necessity of having one person
:ultimately in charge is bad enough, but in the extreme if s/he starts
:behaving like a tosser we just install another charter proponent. An official
:cabal will have much more obvious power than one charter proponent; someone
:posting something a little bit out of the way can be flamed by several people
:and have no comeback as they are "official administrators of the group".
Also, such declarations in a FAQ carry negative weight with any abuse
administrator with any sort of a clue.
If they are the audience for such, they're not going to work.
:I am *very* frightened that what hapenned on alt.gothic, where the supposed
:AGSF went round clubbing to death anyone who posted anything but the same shit
:that everyone was posting, might happen here. It *RUINED* alt.gothic for a
:while and as I've said elsewhere it still hasn't fully recovered. Hence I think
:any kind of organised power base, which was what caused the problem on
:alt.gothic, should be avoided as much as possible.
This here a.g.p should suck in about six to twelve months.
At this point, we decamp and go elsewhere.
::> You probably posted something truly dense, like a binary, advert or
::> troll. Whatever you did you deserved it so stop whining.
:: But that's too vauge.
:Unfortunately you are correct. Would look nice in a FAQ though :)
I think it would do nicely.
Nile Evil Bastard
:As a matter of interest, does anyone know how net.subculutre.gothic is
:going?
It's a ghost town like the rest of net.* - there's an occasional post.
The planned access via Netizen appears not to be a happener.
(must post more to n.s.g)
HiRez
> :> AGSF went round clubbing to death anyone who posted anything but the same shit
> :> that everyone was posting, might happen here.
>
>
> There was never really a problem with what one might call the core AGSF, but
> the tag attracted an awful lot of gunslinging, trigger happy twats who thought
> they were on some kind of crusade.
Aha. Hm. I seem to recall <mumble> calling for the head of anyone that
disagreed with <non gender-specific pronoun> on certain issues.
That sort of thing will always happen. Regard current OSS 'community'
and the set of /.-types who are obviously in it for the personal
willy-wave, rather than producing useful code which will add to the sum
total of geek-related happiness.
As long as there are some people out there who have r00t on more
important boxes (conceptually speaking, of course), then they can be
thwacked with a rolled up copy of the NME and told to sit down and shut
up.
[It's a geek thing: One doesn't need to point out what The Right Thing
is to other geeks. I find it unfortunate that I seem to have to explain
this about once every six months, presumably to a set of people who just
aren't going to get it. Look - here's an example: The UK Usenet
Committee are a set of people who will never Get It for as long as they
live.]
daddygoth overboming
Tom Fosdick brought to mind...
>
> Ron for instance had a hard time explaining that a piece of horror fiction
he
graphic
> as that one if not more so receiving nothing but acclaim. After all, a
huge
> number of goths read and enjoy horror.
> Anything vaguely controversial from an address that wasn't well known was
> called a troll by the supposed AGSF.
alt.gothic.crass.porn?
yes, i remember that one as well...
Rat Bastard
<38416c93...@news.planet-int.net>...
> >It was porn, not horror! :)
>
> Same thing. It was porn written by Ron, if I understood well.
Horrific porn. :)
If it's the one I'm thinking of, it's the one involving murdering people
in the men's bathroom at a club... hmmm.. a snuff story, perhaps? ;)
Rat Bastard
--
_ /|_|\ ___ Rat Bastard: Neither a Rat, nor a Bastard? Discuss. ___
\X x/ ________________________________________
/\o/\ | "Being HERE is a lot like being lost.."-The Tick |
^^==^^===| http://www.obscure.org/~rbast ICQ#39637373 | ====
timmie
> Take also Chaos Control; a huge flamewar ensued when he arrived and had 8 bit
> chars in his .Sig; he was immediately accused of trolling (despite the fact
> that the content of his posts was nothing unusual) and hence the whole thing
> went off like a claymore mine. If someone had had a quiet word in his ear and
> said "look CC, 8 bit chars hose some people's newsreaders, can you not use
> them" the whole situation could probably have been avoided.
Actually... though i agree in most part about the rest of what's
happening... i have to disagree with that specific example...
although that poster later grew a brain... in the initial stages of
posting many quiet words were had... only to be rewarded by return abuse
via email...
much of the flaming in that thread wasn't so much about the origional
post (as it never really is..).. but more about an absolute refusal to
take into account the suggestions (some flames... some quiet words)...
and the continuing statement that they were some sort of special case
and should be exempt becuase they had some sort of mental disorder.
yup... i was one of the flamers... and i'm defending my actions... so
this entire post may be completely disregarded as one sided post
justification if you like...
timmie... now with new improved load off chest!
Bloodstone
: Tom Fosdick wrote:
:> There was never really a problem with what one might call the core AGSF, but
:> the tag attracted an awful lot of gunslinging, trigger happy twats who thought
:> they were on some kind of crusade.
: That sort of thing will always happen.
: As long as there are some people out there who have r00t on more
: important boxes (conceptually speaking, of course), then they can be
: thwacked with a rolled up copy of the NME and told to sit down and shut
: up.
When the dufuses and their supporters are the most vocal members of the group
and constitute a large enough slice of the total posters you have a political
problem with using any kind of power you have over and above the standard user
in order to try to influnce the group.
It may be ultimately a good thing for the US government to ban guns, and
they have far bigger guns than the general populous, but they're not about to
try banning guns.
In the context of this group, even in the context of UPG the power base of
group is central enough, large enough and well informed enough that such a
situation is unlikely to arise... possibly somewhat due to us having
(hopefully) learned from the alt.gothic experience[1]. If this group ever
does get to a size where fads and fashions such as the anti-troll
crusade get out of control then its time to uproot and find another
practically dormant alt group... or just newgroup one and start posting
to it immediately, which has been known to work in the past (regardless
of alt.config).
[1] For anyone who doesn't know, AGSF didn't have a particularly good
reputation on UPG.
HiRez
> [1] For anyone who doesn't know, AGSF didn't have a particularly good
> reputation on UPG.
Indeed not.
Were I an own-trumpet-blowing type, I'd go on at length about all
that... :)
--
J "Cabal? Naah, mate. Yer'avin a larf." H-R
--nightshade--
st...@midnight.karoo.FISH.co.uk (Bloodstone) wrote:
FWIW, the more rules the central power attempts to enforce, the more
unsure of its base it is, and the less i care to cater to it.
> [1] For anyone who doesn't know, AGSF didn't have a particularly good
> reputation on UPG.
gee. i wonder why. it didn't have a particularly good reputation within
its own boundaries. 'swhat happens when a bunch of self-important twits
set their moinds on being bullies.
--nightshade--
--
--nights...@geocities.canned.meat.com
"whoever said it was a small world was either a liar or a fool"
-concrete blonde
Greylock: Numb
(Bloodstone) did dance the two-step and proclaim:
>group is central enough, large enough and well informed enough that such a
>situation is unlikely to arise...
That, and the newsgroups have a culture which is passed between
net.generations. ag is a hostile newsgroup where there is (and has been
since before I started reading) a pile on mentality - it may be American
culture, the huge numbers, or it might just be entrenched behaviour which
everyone sees as acceptable.
And, of course, the English as a whole tend to be more polite - and there
are (as I think you alluded too) large groups of people who know each
other.
>possibly somewhat due to us having
>(hopefully) learned from the alt.gothic experience[1]. If this group ever
>does get to a size where fads and fashions such as the anti-troll
>crusade get out of control then its time to uproot and find another
>practically dormant alt group... or just newgroup one and start posting
>to it immediately, which has been known to work in the past (regardless
>of alt.config).
Seems a bit of an extreme solution.
>[1] For anyone who doesn't know, AGSF didn't have a particularly good
>reputation on UPG.
ag doesn't have a good rep on usenet anyway.
In this silence I am sinking
the Gruamach
(Greylock: Numb) mumbled:
>>(hopefully) learned from the alt.gothic experience[1]. If this group ever
>>does get to a size where fads and fashions such as the anti-troll
>>crusade get out of control then its time to uproot and find another
>>practically dormant alt group... or just newgroup one and start posting
>>to it immediately, which has been known to work in the past (regardless
>>of alt.config).
>
>Seems a bit of an extreme solution.
How do you think AGP came to what it is?
Some of us got bored/pissed off/tired of the bullshit
in AG, and took it over.
But then, not all of us *quit* ag/upg, but simply took
this over, too.
>>[1] For anyone who doesn't know, AGSF didn't have a particularly good
>>reputation on UPG.
>
>ag doesn't have a good rep on usenet anyway.
And we like it that way.
Charles/Gruamach. The St Louis SarkyGoth
http://home.stlnet.com/~gothcop
"Existance is a Mango.
Where's the Beef?" -spider
Marcus Pan
> arf arf arf!
>
> *Gru, sitting in his white Froot-O-Loom undies,
> laughing so hard he falls off the chair*
Gru O' the Looms?
> The sad thing is, I don't even know WHY that seems so
> damned funny.
I know the feeling. Flying bagels - they scare me. Yet at the same
time they crack most of you up... <sigh>
--
===>StealthGoth Pan<===A.G.S-F US East!
The Pan Pages - http://www.zenweb.com/pan
Net.Goth Directory - http://www.zenweb.com/pan/netgoth
Legends Online - http://www.zenweb.com/pan/legends
Marcus Pan
> Development in progress... Anything you would like to add?
>
> I believe it came about due to the increase in traffic in our little
> corner.. ;-}
Oi, who laid the highway through the back room o' the coffee house?
Gothpat
this to say:
> but more about an absolute refusal to
>take into account the suggestions (some flames... some quiet words)...
>and the continuing statement that they were some sort of special case
>and should be exempt becuase they had some sort of mental disorder.
>
me used mental disorder as an excuse as well.
Said person stopped posting for a year, but has started again, so I am
being very wary.
GothPat...who didn't warrant the attack
the Gruamach
<p...@zenweb.com> mumbled:
>Gru O' the Looms?
Exactly.
>> The sad thing is, I don't even know WHY that seems so
>> damned funny.
>
>I know the feeling. Flying bagels - they scare me. Yet at the same
>time they crack most of you up... <sigh>
It's the whole visual of a blueberry bagel flying past
your face, and beaning the icecream-truck guy, isn't
it?
the Gruamach
(Gothpat) mumbled:
>The first (and hopefully last) time I was flamed, the person attacking
>me used mental disorder as an excuse as well.
>
>Said person stopped posting for a year, but has started again, so I am
>being very wary.
Bah, you can't really brag til you have your own
pet-troll (even a pathetic one), like my and oddly's
little s*t*r.....
>GothPat...who didn't warrant the attack
I remember it, and no you didn't.
chijin <chijin5
spaketh...:
>On Wed, 01 Dec 1999 22:41:34 -0500, Marcus Pan
><p...@zenweb.com> mumbled:
>>I know the feeling. Flying bagels - they scare me. Yet at the same
>>time they crack most of you up... <sigh>
>It's the whole visual of a blueberry bagel flying past
>your face, and beaning the icecream-truck guy, isn't
>it?
Post-traumatic-dough-disorder. I've seen it a hundred times, poor devil.
Prolly dives for the floor when the toaster pops up.
Chijin<8P
**who adjusts the lyrics of that old BOC song(vet./psychicwars) to read, "...you
see me now a veteran, of a thousand bread-dough wars..."**