Fuel Injection Conversion
miniman
I have info on converting a mini to bosch K-jetronic fuel injection,
this system works a treat and is found on lots of VW, Audi, Saab,
Volvos etc. I can point you in the right direction if you are fed up
with carbs and the problems normally associated with them!
Also has anyone fitted a BMW supercharger to their mini yet? I
have............ sorry:-)
Anyone interested?????????
Karl
Thanks
Karl
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TC
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nite fire
dave
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Stephen Hetherington
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Raymond van Elst
--
Bye, Ray
miniman
Hope you find my little project amusing......
Engine spec:
1330 a+
piper 270/2 cam
9.5cr pistons
mgmetro head with mild porting
mgmetro dizzy with slight curve adjustment
LCB manifold and rc40 two box exhaust system
3.1 finaldrive
duplex timing gear
95 ron petrol
Max power 87.5bhp at 5736rpm
Max torque 87.3lb/ft at 4321rpm
Not very highly tuned but the torque curve is like a diesel engine's!
This engine wouldn't pull top gear below 40mph with an HIF carb and now
it can plug along quite contentedly at 15mph! it even starts first time
in the winter with no coughing or spluttering!
Top speed was 125mph before I put the supercharger on.........
Bosch K-Jetronic Overview:
There are many books on the subject and I have gleaned most of the
useful information from them so here are the basics,
The Fuel injection system is pressurized by a high pressure fuel pump
mounted by the tank, fuel then goes through an accumulator (pressure
vessel) which damps out pressure fluctuations and holds a pressure in
the system when the ignition is switched off. The fuel then gets pushed
to the front of the car into a metering unit, this unit is about
150wx300dx200h, the metering unit has a built in pressure regulator
which bleeds off excess fuel back to the tank, make sure this pipe is
8mm inner diameter minimum otherwise the restriction upsets the overall
system pressure (I found out the hard way!) this return has to be
drilled into the highest point of the tank (filler neck is good and
epoxy resin is petrol resistant!)
The metering unit consists of an air filter, feed and return fuel
outlets, 4 injector outlets, a cold start injector outlet, and two
outlets for the warmup regulator (Choke equivalent)
As air enters the metering unit, it is filtered and then goes through a
venturi with a disc in it that floats higher the more air is consumed,
this metering unit works on the mass air flow principle, unlike carbs
which meter fuel according to vacuum and a preset system of jets, when
set up correctly, the unit will always give the correct air fuel ratio
for normal running as it is measuring the weight of the air and not any
vacuum that is being created by the engine.
Idle mixture is adjusted by a small hex screw in the metering unit that
is accessible through a little cap on the top of it, this screw adjusts
the bottom end of the metering range and doesn't make a lot of
difference to the top end(Full throttle), the mid and top end of the
metering range are adjusted by the warmup regulator pressure, this is
where you can adjust your full throttle mixture in the knowledge that
it will be spot on at the midrange as well!
The warm up regulator works the opposite to how you would expect, it
has a bimetallic strip in it that when 12v is applied, it increases the
pressure on the metering arm therefore leaning the fuel mixture, so to
richen the mixture you need to shim it up to lower the pressure(simple
but time consuming, I put a valve on mine so I could adjust the mixture
from inside the car and view it on a lambda sensor display!)
The cold start injector is wired from the starter through a
thermotimeswitch which can be plumbed into the cooling system to sense
the overall temp, when the key is turned the timeswitch lets the cold
start injector run for a short period and then stops to ensure no
flooding if the engine doesn't start first time.
I have to admit that I have never needed the cold start injector in
sunny sussex so have just used it to block the hole in the manifold!
There is also an idle valve that bypasses the throttle butterfly when
the engine is cold, this is fed by the ignition feed that also feeds
the warmup regulator.
The injectors are activated by fuel pressure from the metering unit and
only spray above about 40psi, they are constantly running which is why
the system is sometimes referred to as CIS
Constant Injection System.
I Used the golf manifold but cut off the four runners and had two
runners tig welded on to the outer pair and used an old mini manifold
as a JIG to bolt it to when it was being welded.
I then got four tubes lathed up to accept the injectors and drilled the
manifold diagonally (two in each runner) so that when the injector
tubes were welded in they lined up with the back of the valves roughly,
the injectors just push-fit into the tubes, always get new O-rings for
them as the older ones tend to perish and the new ones are
nitrile(green). Make sure that the injectors don't snag your exhaust
manifold before you get them tigged in (I have used aluminium brazing
rods and they have been fine for 30,000miles
Trev
If you have any questions then do ask them, as this is a nice
conversion once set up correctly!!!
rickyomg
i would be very intersted i would like to convert my mg and austin
healey to efi see how mini and mgs are close it may work
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Chris Morriss
rickyomg <UseLink...@AutoForumz.com> writes
>"miniman" wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > I have info on converting a mini to bosch K-jetronic fuel
> > injection,
> > this system works a treat and is found on lots of VW, Audi,
> > Saab,
> > Volvos etc. I can point you in the right direction if you are
> > fed up
> > with carbs and the problems normally associated with them!
> >
> > Also has anyone fitted a BMW supercharger to their mini yet? I
> >
> > have............ sorry:-)
> >
> > Anyone interested?????????
>
>i would be very intersted i would like to convert my mg and austin
>healey to efi see how mini and mgs are close it may work
>
K-jet isn't EFI, but a mechanical constant-flow system. As such it
should work well on a siamese-head engine like the A-series.
True port-injection EFI is almost impossible to get working properly on
a two-port siamesed head. I (and many others) have tried it with
varying success. Rover managed to get a bodged system (with really
complex injection timing) to work, but it was never very wonderful.
If you want EFI to work well on the A-series, then I suggest you pay a
lot of money for a 7-port crossflow head from MiniSport in a couple of
months time when it is ready for sale. (It keeps a standard exhaust
manifold but has a nice 4-port inlet with a built-in 40DCOE-style inlet
manifold)
--
Chris Morriss
miniman
Very true Chris, the K-Jet is really a very good option for the
A-series, I have run mine for 25k and had no problems with it although
the standard mini gearbox doesn't really appreciate the superb torque
that can be attained with it! The only problems you may find with
fitting it are mounting the airflow meter (which is about the size of a
diesel battery) and making the manifold, I just used two injectors on
each port and that meant that virtually no fuelling adjustments were
required!
Bear this in mind, the only adjustments you need on this system are:
1 Control pressure, which affects the mixture at most throttle positions
and
2 Idle mixture, which only affects idle mixture and the affects
decrease towards the mid range
Seems a bit easier than an SU or weber to me but before I start that
debate again, I would say that what works with some engines may not
work too well with others!
let me know if you are after photos rickyomg I could probably take
some of each component against a rule so you have an idea what sort of
room you need in an engine bay for the conversion, mine fitted in a
mini van with the drivers (uk) side inner wing removed, no need for a
bonnet mod either!
Anthony
> In message <1_596415_fe740c0de7c...@autoforumz.com>,
> rickyomg <UseLink...@AutoForumz.com> writes
>
>> "miniman" wrote:
>> > Hi,
>> >
>> > I have info on converting a mini to bosch K-jetronic fuel
>> > injection,
>
> lot of money for a 7-port crossflow head from MiniSport in a couple of
> months time when it is ready for sale. (It keeps a standard exhaust
> manifold but has a nice 4-port inlet with a built-in 40DCOE-style inlet
> manifold)
Or you could get one from demon tweaks right now
-anthony
miniman
<anthony.godde...@tiscali.co.uk> said:
If money was no object!!!!!!!! my K-Jet conversion cost around £300 to
do, the weber alpha
and omex ecus cost more than that!
You could have a look at megasquirt as it is all DIY, that is if you
want to go down the efi route,
All I am saying is that you don't need a laptop to set it up
(K-Jetronic)and once you have played with two adjustments your fuelling
is spot-on throughout the rev range(which is pretty frustrating for a
rolling road operator when he can't get any more power out of your
engine because the mixture is perfect), try doing that with efi using a
map sensor, admitedly the systems that use mass airflow sensors are
pretty nice but if you want a nice DIY option then the mechanical
system is so much easier so troubleshoot! go on you know you want
to........... :-)
miniman
btw : Why does no one do a mini front end that is six inches longer? I
have just spent a week doing a frankenstein with two fibreglass ones,
now my supercharger can fit UNDER the bonnet!
Chris Morriss
<anthony.godde...@tiscali.co.uk> writes
>Chris Morriss wrote:
>> In message
>><1_596415_fe740c0de7c...@autoforumz.com>, rickyomg
>><UseLink...@AutoForumz.com> writes
>>
>>> "miniman" wrote:
>>> > Hi,
>>> >
>>> > I have info on converting a mini to bosch K-jetronic fuel
>>> > injection,
>> If you want EFI to work well on the A-series, then I suggest you pay
>>a lot of money for a 7-port crossflow head from MiniSport in a couple
>>manifold but has a nice 4-port inlet with a built-in 40DCOE-style
>>inlet manifold)
>
>Or you could get one from demon tweaks right now
>
>
>-anthony
Really? I din't know the 7-port head was out yet. Is that based on the
same original design from AKA racing in Denmark?
--
Chris Morriss
rickyomg
> In message <42a5e67a$1...@mk-nntp-2.news.uk.tiscali.com>,
> Anthony
> <anthony.godde...@tiscali.co.uk> writes
> >Chris Morriss wrote:
> >><1_596415_fe740c0de7c...@autoforumz.com>,
> rickyomg
> >><UseLink...@AutoForumz.com> writes
> >>
> >>> "miniman" wrote:
> >>> > Hi,
> >>> >
> >>> > I have info on converting a mini to bosch
> K-jetronic fuel
> >>> > injection,
> >> If you want EFI to work well on the A-series, then I
> suggest you pay
> >>a lot of money for a 7-port crossflow head from
> MiniSport in a couple
> >>months time when it is ready for sale. (It keeps a
> standard exhaust
> >>manifold but has a nice 4-port inlet with a built-in
> 40DCOE-style
> >>inlet manifold)
> >
> >Or you could get one from demon tweaks right now
> >
> >
> >-anthony
>
> Really? I din't know the 7-port head was out yet. Is that
> based on the
> same original design from AKA racing in Denmark?
> --
> Chris Morriss
do you think the k-jet would work on a mg 1275 engine these sus are
driving me crazy
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rickyomg
> On 2005-06-06 20:34:06 +0100, Chris Morriss
> <cr...@oroboros.demon.co.uk> said:
>
> > rickyomg <UseLink...@AutoForumz.com> writes
> >> "miniman" wrote:
> >> > Hi,
> >> >
> K-jetronic fuel
> >> > injection,
> >> > this system works a treat and is found on
> lots of VW, Audi,
> >> > Saab,
> >> > Volvos etc. I can point you in the right
> direction if you are
> >> > fed up
> >> > with carbs and the problems normally
> associated with them!
> >> >
> >> > Also has anyone fitted a BMW supercharger to
> their mini yet? I
> >> >
> >> > have............ sorry:-)
> >> >
> >> > Anyone interested?????????
> >>
> >> i would be very intersted i would like to convert my
> mg and austin
> >> healey to efi see how mini and mgs are close it may
> work
> >>
photos would be great this would give me a good start i think and i
would be greatfull to gite rid of them su,s
--
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miniman
> do you think the k-jet would work on a mg 1275 engine these sus are
> driving me crazy
Well it worked on mine and at that time it was 1330 a+ with a piper
270/2 cam and a 12g940 mg metro head, I don't think you have much
difference other than the manifolds possibly
The power output was 87bhp and it had a very flat torque curve which
made it possible for me to up the gearing to 3.1 and have a mini that
was drivable on the motorways, it would cruise at 85-90mph and return
49mpg if driven nicely although if you thrashed it or drove it 'off'
the cam it would only return 32mpg min! the so called 90bhp coopers
never could touch it as they just didn't have the torque.
Although when I say it worked I mean that it did until I snapped the
crank and now I am just putting the finishing touches to my engine with
a BMW mini supercharger and the K-Jet, I am pretty sure it will work
well as the first RS turbos had K-Jet and so did all the early saab
turbos, mmm I wonder what power that will produce, never mind how long
the standard gearbox will last with all that extra torque on tap!
200miles? who knows!
Anthony
> In message <42a5e67a$1...@mk-nntp-2.news.uk.tiscali.com>, Anthony
> <anthony.godde...@tiscali.co.uk> writes
>
>> Chris Morriss wrote:
>>
>>> In message
>>> <1_596415_fe740c0de7c...@autoforumz.com>, rickyomg
>>> <UseLink...@AutoForumz.com> writes
>>>
>>>> "miniman" wrote:
>>>> > Hi,
>>>> >
>>>> > I have info on converting a mini to bosch K-jetronic fuel
>>>> > injection,
>>>
>>> If you want EFI to work well on the A-series, then I suggest you pay
>>> a lot of money for a 7-port crossflow head from MiniSport in a couple
>>> months time when it is ready for sale. (It keeps a standard exhaust
>>> manifold but has a nice 4-port inlet with a built-in 40DCOE-style
>>> inlet manifold)
>>
>>
>> Or you could get one from demon tweaks right now
>>
>
> same original design from AKA racing in Denmark?
This is the link from there website, there is no picture there but the
one in the catalogue shows 4 ports on the same side of the head as the
thermostat housing.
-anthony
Chris Morriss
>Chris Morriss wrote:
>> In message <42a5e67a$1...@mk-nntp-2.news.uk.tiscali.com>, Anthony
>><anthony.godde...@tiscali.co.uk> writes
>>
>>> Chris Morriss wrote:
>>>
>>>> In message
>>>><1_596415_fe740c0de7c...@autoforumz.com>,
>>>>rickyomg <UseLink...@AutoForumz.com> writes
>>>>
>>>>> "miniman" wrote:
>>>>> > Hi,
>>>>> >
>>>>> > I have info on converting a mini to bosch K-jetronic fuel
>>>>> > injection,
>>>>
>>>> If you want EFI to work well on the A-series, then I suggest you
>>>>pay a lot of money for a 7-port crossflow head from MiniSport in a
>>>>manifold but has a nice 4-port inlet with a built-in 40DCOE-style
>>>
>>>
>>> Or you could get one from demon tweaks right now
>>>
>> Really? I din't know the 7-port head was out yet. Is that based on
>>the same original design from AKA racing in Denmark?
>
>http://www.demon-tweeks.co.uk/catalogue/product_detail.asp?PCODE=A/A9900
>384500&GRP=MP084&PGRP=M006&CLS=MSPORT&code=A_AALUHEAD&from=search
>
>This is the link from there website, there is no picture there but the
>one in the catalogue shows 4 ports on the same side of the head as the
>thermostat housing.
>
>-anthony
That link takes me to the aluminium versions of the standard A-series
head. Very nice, but if you want to EFI properly, you need the four
inlet ports that the 7-port head provides. (Unfortunately the 7-port
head is cast iron, so it's going to be heavy).
I still don't think that they've been released for sale yet. Surely
someone reading this knows the situation?
--
Chris Morriss
The Muffin Man
The Muffin Man
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