C5 auto vs manual.
14...@netrover.com
Anyone know the performance differences between a C5 auto and 6 speed
(ie 1/4 mile, 0-60, 0-100 etc.)? I would be interested in these numbers.
Any help appreciated.
Joe
Elamb20
automatic can. Also I never saw an automatic miss a shift. Ed
14TheGipper
Performance axle to the Auto. As the other post said the auto will win
80% of the time because the majority of the drivers of 6 speeds aren't
professionals.
In article <19991207220521...@ng-fm1.aol.com>,
--
Visit my 2000 Corvette Web site at the link below!
http://www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/fuel/245/
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
Clay Lovett
prefer manuals. What one person can do with a manual differs greatly from
the skills of another driver.
Buy what YOU want
14...@netrover.com
the numbers because they always test the 6 speeds. I am happy with my auto.
When someone wants to race me I just floor it and let the car do the rest. No
theatrics or missed shifts and I can even have a sip of my morning beverage.
Joe
Thud
accentuated by the thrusting of the engine...
Wait, did I say that out loud?
--
Thud
1993 40th anniv ruby 6spd
http://j.bruce.home.mindspring.com
Clay Lovett <clo...@mciworld.com> wrote in message
news:c_r34.98$BW3.31699@pm02news...
bbodin
Elamb20 wrote in message <19991207220521...@ng-fm1.aol.com>...
>Dont know the numbers but my feeling is that no one can shift as fast as an
>automatic can. Also I never saw an automatic miss a shift. Ed
>
>
>vette...@aol.com
according to Edmunds, the vette will hit 60 in a shade over 5 seconds. Opt
for the 6 speed manual and cut about half a second off that. (assuming a
driver who can shift properly, I'm sure).
3DfxCOOL
your Corvette TOO much.
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Thud <j.b...@mindspam.com> wrote in message
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mrvette
GENE
--
I'm just ego-testicle, that's all....
It doesn't matter what either of us does..win or lose,
'The cosmos knows'.....(Blue Shark)
You are jealous, because the voices talk only to me...
Jim Willis
LOL! I know you guys love your Corvettes, but you guys need to find a
woman for sexual gratification! ; - )
-- jdw
Tom Steele
And no clutch can waste as much energy as a stall converter. Shift time
isn't a serious factor and actually many of us can shift so quickly that the
difference is negligable. The auto is slipping as it shifts anyway.
The stick will be faster. Probably a quarter second or so...
-Tom Steele
Elamb20 <ela...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:19991207220521...@ng-fm1.aol.com...
Tom Steele
That's great for you. I mean that seriously, not sarcastically. But to all
who are posting with the attitude that their inability to drive a stick well
somehow means that those who CAN drive a stick well (and it's NOT real hard)
are wasting their time with the 6-speed, or won't beat them in an otherwise
equal race - sorry but you are living in fantasy-land.
I promise you, put me in a identical 6 speed Vette and you drive your auto
and I will beat you in a drag race EVERY time.
It's simple physics...
The stall converter uses fluid to transfer the energy of your engine to the
rear wheels. Much like taking a fan, turning it on and facing it towards a
fan that is turned off, the other fan will start to spin. But there is lost
energy via heat using that method. The very fact that you can sit stopped
at a light without moving should tell you that SOME of your energy is NOT
being used to drive the back tires. A manual transmission is more efficient
at getting the power to the rear wheels which in effect, means MORE REAR
WHEEL HP. It will be faster.
As for shift time and consistency, I have a 93 Cobra - they ONLY come with 5
speeds - and I have been to the drag strip many a night where the difference
in all my runs was less than a tenth of a second spread. I have run e.t.s
within hundredths of a second back to back. And I don't claim to be a pro
or anything.
The fact is, that after the 1-2 shift, you are rolling so fast anyway, that
taking a little time shifting doesn't really matter that much on your e.t.
anyway.
And a decent shifter should eliminate almost all missed shifts.
Even missing one shouldn't be a big deal. I missed 3-4 one time (God knows
how!) and still ran only two tenths off my usual e.t. In other words, with
the average .25 or more difference in an auto or stick, I STILL would have
beat an auto tranny car with the missed shift...
Again, if you aren't interested in the stick -that is fine. I'm not
slamming anyone for their driving abilities or lack thereof - but if you
believe that you are gonna beat a stick with an auto, you are going to be in
for a surprise.
-Tom Steele
<14...@netrover.com> wrote in message news:384E4EE9...@netrover.com...
> I bought an auto! I could care less what others think. I was just curious
of
> the numbers because they always test the 6 speeds. I am happy with my
auto.
> When someone wants to race me I just floor it and let the car do the rest.
No
> theatrics or missed shifts and I can even have a sip of my morning
beverage.
> Joe
>
> Clay Lovett wrote:
>
14...@netrover.com
able to beat a six speed but was curious of the difference in performance #'s. I
have a friend who has 2 ZR-1's and he would buy an auto next time. He's tired of
shifting. I have to say though for the average road conditions and average
driver skill the auto is probably best for most individuals. Why do we argue
amongst ourselves anyway? 6 speed or auto it doesn't matter....it is still a
vette and will blow the doors of of just about any factory production car
including the Italians. (that hurts cuz I'm Italian but it's true)You can't
float everyones boat that's why there is a choice. At least the auto is not like
some other cars where they lose 1 second 0-60 in auto trim.
Joe
Stephen Ritger
Steve
Y2K C5 91U Z51 Loaded
Tom Steele
I don't mean to be "fighting amongst ourselves." That is why I was very
careful to point out that I was not being sarcastic. But I did want to jump
in and stop the misinformation. An auto is fine if that is what you want or
need. But the six-speed will outrun it. That is all I wanted to get
across!
-Tom
<14...@netrover.com> wrote in message news:384F1C5C...@netrover.com...
Matthew Witherspoon
Have any of you folks ever attended or heard good things about the various
schools for driving that are supposed to teach the true and proper way to
handle a do-it-yourself transmission? Bondurant, et al.?
Matt W.
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C5Phil
I am not into "fighting amongst ourselves". And that is why I too try to
stop misinformation being spread.
1. Lets talk simple Debate before "simple physics". A manual sits stopped
at a light without moving. Always qualify your statements first. Does this
prove it is loosing energy also.
2. Simple physics, gear trains loose power due to friction, but end up
producing more torque at a given speed. The modern torque converter also
does this.
3. It is rear wheel torque that gets you off the line, don't forget you are
starting from a dead stop, at that moment the traction surface is producing
0, nada, no horsepower. I don't care how long or hard you crank on a bolt
that does not move. You may be producing hp but the wrench is not.
4. No I don't believe you could beat an auto "every time", that is a long
time. However I believe your beliefs are in good faith.
5. There are even articles of Vert Vetts with an auto and the G92 beating 6
speed coupes 0-60
And both had decent times. Coupe even has better weight transfer (slab
of glass).
7. Yes I attend the drags, and read the rags. And have owned manuals and
autos in Vettes and other automobiles.
6. Higher top speed, not we are talking HP. You win.
7. 1+6
regards,
C5Phil
Tom Steele
news:82qcog$rco$1...@nntp1.atl.mindspring.net...
>
> I am not into "fighting amongst ourselves". And that is why I too try to
> stop misinformation being spread.
>
> 1. Lets talk simple Debate before "simple physics". A manual sits
stopped
> at a light without moving. Always qualify your statements first. Does
this
> prove it is loosing energy also.
Ok, if you are being nitpicky... I was assuming a certain level of knowledge
there, but sure - I will clarify it. You can't sit still at a red light in
a manual transmission with the clutch engaged and the car in gear or it will
stall. You can sit still at a red light with the automatic in gear and it
will not stall. Thus, there is energy being wasted in the torque
converter - it is being turned into heat instead of forward motion. More
rwhp for the manual transmission.
> 2. Simple physics, gear trains loose power due to friction, but end up
> producing more torque at a given speed. The modern torque converter also
> does this.
But the automatic transmission is ALSO doing the gearset losses as well.
> 3. It is rear wheel torque that gets you off the line, don't forget you
are
> starting from a dead stop, at that moment the traction surface is
producing
> 0, nada, no horsepower. I don't care how long or hard you crank on a bolt
> that does not move. You may be producing hp but the wrench is not.
And with a manual transmission, you can "store energy" in the flywheel, and
dump the clutch within the limits of the back tires and their ability to
hold traction and leave hard. So the stored energy makes up for the
automatic's torque multiplication. And the auto tranny has a lower numeric
first gear than the manual, so it is not doing as much gear-related torque
multiplication as the manual is off the line with it's higher numerical
(first - and rear-end actually) gears.
> 4. No I don't believe you could beat an auto "every time", that is a long
> time. However I believe your beliefs are in good faith.
Again, being nitpicky, sure there could be an occasional rarity. I didn't
realize we were going to resort to picking apart technicalities on what was
supposed to simply be a post merely stating that, given otherwise equal
cars, the stick is going to be faster because of better transmission of
power to the rear wheels.
> 5. There are even articles of Vert Vetts with an auto and the G92 beating
6
> speed coupes 0-60
> And both had decent times. Coupe even has better weight transfer
(slab
> of glass).
Well, there is one thing I DIDN'T mention that I'm surprised you didn't jump
on, but options could make a difference. I imagine if you got a stripped
down Vette auto and a fully loaded six-speed, the weight difference might
cause them to run very close to the same e.t. But I don't really know
anything about the articles you are talking about, or whether to trust them.
Coming from the Mustang world, I found the Mustang rags ran articles all the
time that were very suspicious. I don't trust the rags as a rule.
> 7. Yes I attend the drags, and read the rags. And have owned manuals and
> autos in Vettes and other automobiles.
No comment. <grin>
> 6. Higher top speed, not we are talking HP. You win.
>
> 7. 1+6
>
> regards,
> C5Phil
Ultimately Phil, I'm sorry if I stepped on your toes or upset you in any
way. But I stand by my post. There were some wacky things being said and I
find that the general engine/car knowledge level of many Vette owners is
lower than the typical performance car owner because they don't HAVE to know
as much. Not ALL Vette owners, but many. The money has bought you a
top-notch, fast car out of the box and it isn't necessary to learn anything
more in order to go fast - unlike some of the other cars. The Mustang crowd
learns a lot because the cars are quick from the dealer - but still need
some hopping up to truly be fast. And it is easy and cheap to work on them
too.
That's not a slam. Just an observation. And I do NOT think that you should
have to know everything about your engine just to go fast. You can be a
great driver and have no interest in the workings of an internal combustion
engine or its peripheral parts.
I was just replying in a thread where someone had actually ASKED about the
differences - I wasn't just jumping in to cause trouble - but answering a
question.
Best Wishes
-Tom Steele
93 Cobra - no longer. Taking delivery of a Silver/black Coupe (YES it is a
6 speed <grin>) next week.
C5Phil
What do they say "Truth, Honor, Family, Friends in that order defend".
It is honorable to stand by your post, for I the same. So in defense of
what comes before honor the truth that I see, I reply:
For 1. I think you should have not used the stop light example since you can
put the auto neutral.
But, perhaps that the torque converter continues to "slip" as
you race and loose power.
For 2. The point here is that the torque converter is doing what a manual
driver does when he is slipping the clutch to get off the line with out
smoking the tires. And that you gain torque at launch
from the torque converter.
For 3. And how long does that stored energy last, how well do you apply it
to the ground. The torque converter will continue to multiply long after
your driver train and flywheel are in sync. Also, it is the total numeric
ratio at the rear wheels that counts, do the math, the perf gears in an auto
in low gear vs a 6speed in low gear are lower over all. 3.15 x 3.06 = 9.639
for the auto, 3.42 x 2.66 = 9.0972 for the manual, over 9% more for the
auto. 4.11, 4.56, 5.13s that is why these number stick in our heads.
For 4. One should always qualify their statements.
For 5. Go the library and check out Road and Track, Car and Driver,
Corvette Quarterly, etc. On would think with enough references you could
get some level of confidence in their tests. I dug
really deep into every article in every magazine I could and photo copied
them at the libraries.
Don't worry about my toes seems like I am always stepping on them or
putting the entire foot in
my mouth at once anyway. One of my other cars is a 94 Mustang GT 5speed,
just a BTW since now know you are an old Mustang guy.
Enjoy that new 6speed, I know you will.
regards,
C5Phil
PJH
Does the same apply to the Quarter mile??
Is there a point in time where one or the other will pass the other??
Does anyone race with an automatic??
Pat
Tom Steele wrote in message <82vbid$st4$1...@nntp6.atl.mindspring.net>...
>C5Phil <pmo...@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
>news:82qcog$rco$1...@nntp1.atl.mindspring.net...
>>.........................
>> 4. No I don't believe you could beat an auto "every time", that is a
long
>> time. However I believe your beliefs are in good faith.
>............................................
>> 5. There are even articles of Vert Vetts with an auto and the G92 beating
>6
>> speed coupes 0-60..............................................
>> And both had decent times. Coupe even has better weight transfer
>(slab
>> of glass).
>....................................................
>> regards,
>> C5Phil
>
>
Blake Felice
"PJH" <P_...@msn.com> wrote in message news:#cFbJ$aR$GA.183@cpmsnbbsa05...
> Assuming the auto can beat or equal a six speed in 0-60.
> Does the same apply to the Quarter mile??
> Is there a point in time where one or the other will pass the other??
> Does anyone race with an automatic??
> Pat
>
>
C5Phil
From reading, watching and personal experience. With good drivers in both
cars, 0-30 auto wins easy, 0-60 auto still pretty easy, 1/4 just about
equal. From then it's a manual world in acceleration.
Of course there are many caveats here, tires, temp, miles on car, etc...
Autocross is a different story, the manual at this point is superior so far.
regards,
C5Phil
Tom Steele
> For 3. And how long does that stored energy last, how well do you apply
it
> to the ground. The torque converter will continue to multiply long after
> your driver train and flywheel are in sync. Also, it is the total numeric
> ratio at the rear wheels that counts, do the math, the perf gears in an
auto
> in low gear vs a 6speed in low gear are lower over all. 3.15 x 3.06 =
9.639
> for the auto, 3.42 x 2.66 = 9.0972 for the manual, over 9% more for the
> auto. 4.11, 4.56, 5.13s that is why these number stick in our heads.
Phil,
That brings up an interesting point. First, I will say that I did not know
the Auto had a taller first gear than the six-speed. I come from
"Mustang-world" where our first gears are 3.35 for a standard T-5 or 2.95
for a T-5Z. So 2.66 is a suprise...
BUT, something you just reminded me of with a stick - and another
advantage... With more gears, you can keep the engine in a tighter
powerband and increase the area under the curve.
I still say equally equipped, the stick will beat the auto hands down!
-Tom
2000 Silver/black six-speed coupe with Z51...
Parked in the garage now!!! Got it today...
C5Phil
I have given you the numbers, the facts and the references. If you still
choose to believe that a 6speed will beat an auto in all cases, then there
is nothing more I can say. An ant and an elephant equally equipped will do
battle forever. I thought we were talking about two stock C5s one auto with
the G92 one 6speed, if not then all bets are off.
Enjoy your new wheels, I am sure you will learn many things.
regards,
C5Phil
Bryan Love
possibly shift with a manual. In a straight line, autos are your best
choice--look at drag cars, for goodness sake. Although, manuals have distinct
advantages in roadracing--optimal choice of gears, engine braking, etc.
But, in my honest opinion, this should ALL be irrelevant--in a street car, you
should choose what you ENJOY. If you like the clutch and the stick, go for the
manual. If your a "shiftless" type, go for the auto. The C5 is a great car at
a great price... enjoy it in any variety. =)
C5Phil
Amen. If turnips were horses, then beggars would ride.
regards,
C5Phil
Tom Steele
Bryan Love <bml...@eos.ncsu.edu> wrote in message
news:3877AD78...@eos.ncsu.edu...
> Good points. Also, remember that modern autos shift MUCH faster than you
could
> possibly shift with a manual. In a straight line, autos are your best
> choice--look at drag cars, for goodness sake. Although, manuals have
distinct
> advantages in roadracing--optimal choice of gears, engine braking, etc.
That is all nice, but shift speed is not nearly the most important factor in
a drag race - at least not on a street car. Maybe a fuelie or a funny car,
but when you are running 13 seconds in the quarter, only the 1-2 shift
matters. It is the only one happening at a speed slow enough to matter
whether you do it extremely fast, or just fast. I shift pretty fast. I
shift at WOT and don't lift up, and I don't hit the limiter when I do - that
ain't wasting much time.
FAR MORE importantly is the area under the curve on your hp during the race.
With a manual, you have more gears and can keep the engine in a more
specific rpm range for maximum hp, where the auto has to run a wider
powernband. That is the thing that really hurts an auto, along with losses
in the torque converter.
AND the stick, if driven properly, can take advantage of stored energy in
the flywheel. In other words, you can set the rpm around 1800 and dump the
clutch. That results in not too much wheelspin and a nice jump off the line
as you take advantage of the energy you stored in the flywheel.
> But, in my honest opinion, this should ALL be irrelevant--in a street car,
you
> should choose what you ENJOY. If you like the clutch and the stick, go
for the
> manual. If your a "shiftless" type, go for the auto. The C5 is a great
car at
> a great price... enjoy it in any variety. =)
I'm all for that. I'm just trying to argue the physics in the above, and
previous, posts. Drive what you like, but a properly setup stick will beat
an auto on a street car in a drag race.
-Tom Steele
2000 Silver/black 6-speed coupe with Z51, HUD etc.
C5Phil
You know, I am positive you are a very smart guy. But here is the problem
I have. GM and every rag states that the auto with the 3.15 has 4.7 -4.8
0-60 time. GM and every rag states that The 6 speed has 4.7 - 4.8 0-60
times. Even if their test were slower they go into why. Every test
published, shows that the 0-30 times for the auto are less than the 6speed.
So at 60 the auto is in front. GM states tha the 1/4 times are equal. Any
rag that has tested the same body with the 3.15s vs a 6speed, only 2 both
were converts, the auto was in front all the way. Lets just say that this
was chance (which I believe is true) and usually they are pretty equal 0-60
and 1/4 mile. I am not arguing that autos always beat 6speeds hands down.
But for some reason you always say that the 6speed will always win, no
matter what. How can this be? And as I have said before 2 of my cars are 5
speeds. And one other point to debate, the area under the curve is
determined by the overall ratio. A touque converter is not a simple fluid
coupling. It Multiplies torque, so when you figure the integral with that,
the auto is even geared lower overall than just the gear ratios of the
transmission and the carrier. You always here that the fastest cars in the
world are manuals. This is of course not true, just check out what Zora did
with 4 powerglide torque converters. Let alone an F car. I know you love
your 6speed, just as I love my dog. But I also know there might be a better
dog out there somewhere.
regards,
C5Phil
RobRJT
We took em out and the auto was a hair faster over 6 accel runs to about 80.
We switched cars and got the same results. Both the cars have under6k miles on
em.
Tom Steele
First, thanks for the compliment. I think the same about you. And I have
found that in many cases, smart people disagree. I will give you this, GM
has done it's best, with the first gear in the six-speed, to make your
arguments closer than ever to being true. With the 2.66 (if I recall
correctly) first gear, the 6 speed is in bad need of a higher numeric
rear-gear to get out of the hole better. If it had one, we wouldn't even be
having this debate because the difference would be so much more pronounced.
As far as the 0-60 speeds, I would say that the first gear on the six speed
is causing that. But you are going to use 2nd and 3rd in a quarter mile
drag race - heck, even on an eighth mile race, just barely. And then the
first gear ration advantage of the auto is gone, and it is dropping a whole
lot more revs on each shift.
Again, GM is on your side because the LS-1 has a fairly broad powerband, and
as a result, it doesn't lose as much time by dropping to the lower rpm with
the auto, but it does lose some area under the hp/torque curves at this
point.
As far as what GM states, I don't believe much of what manufacturers report.
They want to sell cars, and if saying the 6-speed has the same performance
as the auto, then they will publish it. They know they can't be held
accountable for a couple of tenths.
The torque converter is not a simple fluid connection, but it IS wasting
power via heat. Power that is not wasted on the six speed.
Finally, I am not married to my six speed. I am married to manual
transmissions. I have had them in my Mustangs in the past, and I chose it
in this car. It's not "what I have so that is why I like it."
I will give you this, in the Corvette, the differences in the six speed and
auto have been largely negated by gearing and a broad powerband. But the
reason I keep holding to the stick-shift as better is that if they are set
up properly (put a 3.73 or so in the six speed - a "performance axle option
for the MN6 if you will and this argument is over) then the stick will turn
in a better time. And on most cars, the larger drop in rpms during shifts
with the auto is going to hurt the area under the curve enough to slow the
car down as well. Especially if you start modifying for hp at the expense
of low end torque. A simple exhaust mod might be enough to make this
important.
We can agree to disagree though if you want. I still like you. :-)
-Tom Steele
2000 Silver/black 6-speed coupe with Z51, HUD etc.
C5Phil <pmo...@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
news:85eb20$uq6$1...@nntp4.atl.mindspring.net...
Kevin
go faster. Most of us can't make perfect shifts to see the
advantage.....that's where the auto comes in. I never could see buying a
sports car with an auto....until I bought my 96. Now I love the feel of an
auto in a sports car!
Thud
than an auto with perf axle because I'm not the best shifter. However, I
like the 6 speed because I'm single right now and I have to give my right
hand something to do...
--
Thud
1993 40th anniv ruby 6spd
http://j.bruce.home.mindspring.com
Kevin <Rakn...@charter.net> wrote in message
news:s7lqv3h...@corp.supernews.com...
RobRJT
Everytime the clutch is depressed the flywheel stops the energy flow...
Tom Steele
But that is not what I have been saying. And I strongly disagree about the
shift speed. I have explained that as well. Shift speed is not critical in
a drag race of a 12-13 second car, except for maybe the 1-2 shift. The rest
of the shifts are done at speeds where you are rolling fast enough that the
difference in an auto or stick isn't going to make a big difference in e.t.
And my shift speed is fast enough that you aren't going to get any benefit
from an auto. Auto's are not instantaneous and they shift by SLIPPING
bands. A good shift kit can help make the shift better, but some autos
(probably not the Vettes) are so sloppy that they probably shift slower than
a stick.
I'm glad you love your auto. And it looks like GM has loaded the deck so
that the auto and manual have very close performance numbers in stock trim.
But if they had put an appropriate rear gear in the 6-speed, it would be no
contest for all the reasons I have been posting.
--
-Tom Steele
2000 Silver/black 6-speed coupe with Z51, HUD etc.
Tom Steele
Care to clarify that? A clutch wastes power by converting energy?
Aside from the light slippage as it engages, it is a solid connection to the
rear wheels during a race.
Yes, we are aware that you have to disengage the power to shift, but it is
for a very short period of time and the auto is bleeding off energy via the
converter the whole race.
And a manual tranny is more efficient than an auto internally as well.
Here's the deal, we can argue all day long. But it is really simple. If
you put the same first gear in the 6 speed as the auto, then the manual is
gonna stomp the auto. GM has leveled the playing field a bit with gear
ratios, but in the real world - similarly geared cars, one with an auto and
one with a stick, the stick will win.
--
-Tom Steele
2000 Silver/black 6-speed coupe with Z51, HUD etc.
RobRJT <rob...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20000111113710...@ng-cg1.aol.com...
Kevin
as shifting goes...the auto is the way to go. Plus I don't like the idea of
GM charging more for the manual. Why should they charge more anyway? It
should be an even trade, like picking the color. And, Yellow and Mag Red
shouldn't be extra either!
C5Phil
Finally, an argument that totally negates any advantage an auto might have.
Damn, I am single too, now I want a 6speed. Hell, I want a 10 speed.
Hohoohoho...
regards,
C5Phil
C5Phil
And I like you as well. And this has almost turned into a religious
debate. But, errr, autos do shift using clutches and bands, they slip
virtually zero time, much less time than a manual clutch slips. It is the
torque converter that allows this to happen so rapidly, since it you might
say it slips. As far as modifying the cars, sure all bets are off. I,
perhaps foolishly, assumed a stock to stock question. Still, remember the
CERV II car with 4 wheel drive. 2, count em, 2 powerglide torque converters
in them. Yikes, couldn't hardly believe it myself (Zora you old rascal).
0-60 was 2.8 seconds, 200 MPH+ top speed. And again, so as not to seem just
an auto freak, my 94 Mustang GT is a 5speed, and my 92 Supra Turbo is a
5speed (yep, still got em). The little 3 liter Supra can smoke them both in
the 1/4. Why, of course it is not stock, 11 lbs boost (yes I am waiting to
see the head blow through the hood someday), dish pistons, port job, gears,
tires, etc... But this is apples and oranges to me. When the Supra was
stock the C5 would have beat it with one cylinder tied behing its bumper.
regards,
C5Phil
Tom Steele wrote in message <85fq4p$qml$1...@nntp4.atl.mindspring.net>...
>Sorry Kevin,
>
>But that is not what I have been saying. And I strongly disagree about the
>shift speed. I have explained that as well. Shift speed is not critical
in
>a drag race of a 12-13 second car, except for maybe the 1-2 shift. The
rest
>of the shifts are done at speeds where you are rolling fast enough that the
>difference in an auto or stick isn't going to make a big difference in e.t.
>
>And my shift speed is fast enough that you aren't going to get any benefit
>from an auto. Auto's are not instantaneous and they shift by SLIPPING
>bands. A good shift kit can help make the shift better, but some autos
>(probably not the Vettes) are so sloppy that they probably shift slower
than
>a stick.
>
>I'm glad you love your auto. And it looks like GM has loaded the deck so
>that the auto and manual have very close performance numbers in stock trim.
>But if they had put an appropriate rear gear in the 6-speed, it would be no
>contest for all the reasons I have been posting.
>
>--
>-Tom Steele
>2000 Silver/black 6-speed coupe with Z51, HUD etc.
>
>
RobRJT
I am NOT downing the manual, I've owned alot of cars with em. Usually low
torque Porsches or BMW(sompared to the Corvette). The auto in the vette is
great. And I care not to compete against or argue with other drivers of this
great car.
I got into it with a lotus espirit the other day. lugging along at 45 or so
when an opening in traffic occured. Letting the GM auto do its thing, and
hearing that american made chevy 350 roar past the lotus made my day...and I
figure either way you buy the car, it's a great car.