tiddlyweb installation

[EduardWagner]

Hi, we are using tiddlywiki for internal documentation purpose for
about a year know and i will not miss it ever. Thank you so much for
this little working companion. As I noticed the possibilities of the
serverside tiddlyweb we were delighted and now we are going to let it
work. We installed the latest release 0.9.4 on a littele sparc machine
running sun solaris 10 and used both a python 2.4.4 and a 2.6.1
version.
Installation is running without any problems. We can create an
instance called 'tw'. importing the three plugins from_svn is working
fine also. Importing a whole tiddlywiki file into a new bag works also
fine and creating new recipes is not a problem. Just didn't find out
how to upload pictures, but chris dent can do it proved
'peermore.png'?
We start the server with a named mask 'server.domain.com' under port
8060 with group policies and access the recipe 'default' with firefox
3.0.5 (german) from wokstation clients (winxpsp3) in our internal
network.
The plugins load without any problems, but if we access the backstage
area 'sync' it shows the message 'error in macro <<sync>>' and we
can't find out why. The toolbar command 'syncing' doesnt' work also.
Sorry, but I am not very familiar with javascript, just a dau
(dümmster anzunehmender user)!
So we searched a bit and found Chris Dent's test installation at
'peermore.com:8080' and tried another way.
We used the 'webadaptor' from the bag 'TiddlyWeb' and the plugins for
'autosave' and 'source' and it works, you can edit a tiddler, create a
new one and sny to the web, even from a local file!!! But we don't
know if we can let it run like this due to stable prozessing .
Can anybody give us some hints what to try next to get the latest
release running.
Many thanks from Karlsruhe, Germany!

[chris...@gmail.com]

Hi, many thanks for giving TiddlyWeb a try and reporting on your
experiences. Before I get to the meat of your message, I should say
that TiddlyWeb is still a pre-version 1 application and as such has
some rough edges, some bugs and is not as easy to install or manage as
I would like it to someday be. Direct responses to your message below.

On Jan 8, 9:18 am, EduardWagner <ugligats...@googlemail.com> wrote:
> Hi, we are using tiddlywiki for internal documentation purpose for
> about a year know and i will not miss it ever. Thank you so much for
> this little working companion. As I noticed the possibilities of the
> serverside tiddlyweb we were delighted and now we are going to let it
> work. We installed the latest release 0.9.4 on a littele sparc machine
> running sun solaris 10 and used both a python 2.4.4 and a 2.6.1
> version.

Is Python 2.6.x working properly with TiddlyWeb? I've not tried it
with 2.6 yet and thought there might be some issues. If things are
running okay, that's great to know.

> Installation is running without any problems. We can create an
> instance called 'tw'. importing the three plugins from_svn is working
> fine also. Importing a whole tiddlywiki file into a new bag works also
> fine and creating new recipes is not a problem. Just didn't find out
> how to upload pictures, but chris dent can do it proved
> 'peermore.png'?

There are still some tricky issues with that. The interface has not
been solidified, and there is no client side (TiddlyWiki plugin)
support, but the basic gist is as follows:

* If you have a image file that you want to use
* You may PUT that file to a tiddler URL with a Content-Type header of
image/png or image/jpeg (or whatever type it is)
* The server code will recognize that you are putting a weird content-
type and base64 encode the content and store it to disk
* When you use that tiddler in a TiddlyWiki, it will either show up as
the image, or be a link back to the server.

There are multiple implementations of how to do binary content in
TiddlyWiki. The one currently in use with TiddlyWeb is unlikely to be
the one that remains, so at this time I wouldn't recommend using it,
unless it is just for exploration.

> So we searched a bit and found Chris Dent's test installation at
> 'peermore.com:8080' and tried another way.
> We used the 'webadaptor' from the bag 'TiddlyWeb' and the plugins for
> 'autosave' and 'source' and it works, you can edit a tiddler, create a
> new one and sny to the web, even from a local file!!! But we don't
> know if we can let it run like this due to stable prozessing .

I'm not sure that plugins in place on the peermore.com:8080 site are
the most recent.

What might be happening is that the plugins you installed into your
instance (with from_svn), depending on when you got them, are somewhat
broken (they are in active development at the moment).

What I suggest you do is run the from_svn command again to refresh
your plugins with the very latest and see if the problem goes away. If
it does not we'll need to do some closer investigation to see where
thing are breaking. If your server is on a public IP I'm happy to have
a look myself, or I can guide you through what to do. Feel free to
respond here or contact me directly.

Again, thank you very much for trying out TiddlyWeb. I'm glad it is
almost working for you.

[EduardWagner]

Hi, thanks for quick response :) See notes below

On 8 Jan., 14:01, "cd...@peermore.com" <chris.d...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi, many thanks for giving TiddlyWeb a try and reporting on your
> experiences. Before I get to the meat of your message, I should say
> that TiddlyWeb is still a pre-version 1 application and as such has
> some rough edges, some bugs and is not as easy to install or manage as
> I would like it to someday be. Direct responses to your message below.

sure, we try to use what we can;)

> Is Python 2.6.x working properly with TiddlyWeb? I've not tried it
> with 2.6 yet and thought there might be some issues. If things are
> running okay, that's great to know.

yes its running well, we get some warnings, but nothing remarkable,
for now we desided to go on with 2.4.4, its very stable

> There are still some tricky issues with that. The interface has not
> been solidified, and there is no client side (TiddlyWiki plugin)
> support, but the basic gist is as follows:
>
> * If you have a image file that you want to use
> * You may PUT that file to a tiddler URL with a Content-Type header of
> image/png or image/jpeg (or whatever type it is)
> * The server code will recognize that you are putting a weird content-
> type and base64 encode the content and store it to disk
> * When you use that tiddler in a TiddlyWiki, it will either show up as
> the image, or be a link back to the server.
>
> There are multiple implementations of how to do binary content in
> TiddlyWiki. The one currently in use with TiddlyWeb is unlikely to be
> the one that remains, so at this time I wouldn't recommend using it,
> unless it is just for exploration.

OK, we moved our pictures to an internal http-server and linked them
Hovermenu und splashscreen looks pretty again, thank god;)
think about, moving them to flickr, someday
but for now everybody has access over vpn and its easy

> I'm not sure that plugins in place on the peermore.com:8080 site are
> the most recent.
>
> What might be happening is that the plugins you installed into your
> instance (with from_svn), depending on when you got them, are somewhat
> broken (they are in active development at the moment).
>
> What I suggest you do is run the from_svn command again to refresh
> your plugins with the very latest and see if the problem goes away. If
> it does not we'll need to do some closer investigation to see where
> thing are breaking. If your server is on a public IP I'm happy to have
> a look myself, or I can guide you through what to do. Feel free to
> respond here or contact me directly.

ok, we imported the three plugins again, but the same behavior
backstage sync shows 'errors in macro <<sync>>'
updating and deleting tiddlers is working,
copy is woking (copyplugin) thats really good;)
renaming isn't working, but i think its a feature right now and not a
bug
creating a new tiddler is't working! I think the necessary fields for
syncing are missing
due to the error in macro sync.
for now we just try to go on with the plugins from peermore, because
the are working for our internal testing purpose
we can save/edit/rename and delete/copy and thats a lot :)))

the only thing we miss, we borrowed the wizard plugin from teamtasks
and modified it to create some default tiddlers
from forms and the plugin uses constructions like
store.saveTiddler(scopeData['scopename'],scopeData
['scopename'],homeTiddlerBody.join
('\n'),config.options.txtUserName,now,'Scope');
to create new tiddlers. I think the essential fields for tiddlyweb are
missing and we don't now the syntax
poor user you know;)
never the less, thank you very much for helping us.

[FND]

Sorry for the somewhat delayed response; the last week was very busy for
me, and some technical issues got in the way as well...

> backstage sync shows 'errors in macro <<sync>>'

If you click on that message, the resulting popup should give you more
information about the error - could you let us know what it says?
Also see this page:
http://www.tiddlywiki.org/wiki/Troubleshooting

> renaming isn't working

As you've guessed, it's a missing feature in the TiddlyWeb adaptor for
now. It's nothing massively complicated - I simply haven't gotten around
to it yet.

> creating a new tiddler is't working! I think the necessary fields for
> syncing are missing

That sounds likely.

However, a few weeks ago we made TiddlyWeb instances create a "common"
bag by default, and the TiddlyWebConfig plugin then sets the respective
variable (config.defaultCustomFields) accordingly.

So if that bag and all the latest plugins (TiddlyWebAdaptor,
TiddlyWebConfig, ServerSideSavingPlugin) are present, everything should
be working fine.
Maybe it's just that the "common" bag is missing because you'd created
your instance before we implemented this change?

> the only thing we miss, we borrowed the wizard plugin from teamtasks
> and modified it to create some default tiddlers from forms

> [...]

> I think the essential fields for tiddlyweb are missing and we don't
> now the syntax

You need to add some fields in the saveTiddler call:
store.saveTiddler(title, newTitle, newBody, modifier, modified,
tags, {
"server.type": "tiddlyweb",
"server.host": "<URI>",
"server.bag": "<bag>"
});

Please let us know how you get on!

-- F.

[ccahua]

On Jan 12, 9:48 am, FND <F...@gmx.net> wrote:

> As you've guessed, it's a missing feature in the TiddlyWeb adaptor for
> now. It's nothing massively complicated - I simply haven't gotten around
> to it yet.
>
> > creating a new tiddler is't working! I think the necessary fields for
> > syncing are missing
>
> That sounds likely.
>
> However, a few weeks ago we made TiddlyWeb instances create a "common"
> bag by default, and the TiddlyWebConfig plugin then sets the respective
> variable (config.defaultCustomFields) accordingly.
>
> So if that bag and all the latest plugins (TiddlyWebAdaptor,
> TiddlyWebConfig, ServerSideSavingPlugin) are present, everything should
> be working fine.
> Maybe it's just that the "common" bag is missing because you'd created
> your instance before we implemented this change?

I'd like to piggyback on this thread and post some observations to
share in the 'saving' issue pool.

My question is given that the default recipe is set to "server.bag":
"common", is there a way to save to a bag other than common, ie imwiki
to new bag?

I was happy to be able to save to the default recipe under 0.0.9.3 so
I haven't tested 095 when it came out. Also I wasn't able to save to a
bag other than common (python2.5)

Now upgrading to 095 I can't save anymore unless I use an old instance
made in 093 using ServerSideSavingPlugin v3.2

I failed this test that v095 saves to default recipe where
{{{config.defaultCustomFields = {
"server.bag": "common"};
}}}
and this test that v095 saves to different bag
*made new instance
*made new bag
*imported existing tiddlers into new bag
When the "server.bag": "common" is set to <new bag>, http://127.0.0.1:8080/recipes/<new
bag>/tiddlers.wiki has losted editing capability with the
chkHttpReadOnly is set to true and was only accessible from
AdvancedOptions as the backstage area disappeared.
Unchecking the chkHttpReadOnly to false to regain editing mode
persisted after a relaunch but subsequently modifying an existing
tiddler resulting in the usual 'You must save this tiddler.. " dialog

So conclusion, I was unable to save to a different bag other than
'common' in 093 and 095.

Under 095, I was able to change and save back in the ServerConfig
tiddler to "server.bag": "common" but unable to save again in general,
unlike 093.

Only successful save was to change the server.bag custom field to
'wiki' and back to 'common' but unable to save to SiteTitle nor
GettingStarted, nor new tiddler :-(

As evident in the server log and a $ls -R showing 1, 2 and 3 revisions
of ServerConfig:
{{{
127.0.0.1 - GUEST [12/Jan/2009:16:59:22 ] "PUT /bags/system/tiddlers/
ServerConfig?nocache=0.6353539275179345 HTTP/1.1" 2
04 - "http://127.0.0.1:8080/recipes/default/tiddlers.wiki" "Mozilla/
5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.9.0.5)
Gecko/2008120122 Firefox/3.0.5 Ubiquity/0.1.4"
}}}

I tried doing a $twanager update but that still didn't let me save
under 0.9.5

I tried making a new instance but that too didn't work.

I saved my old instance from 093 and double checked was able to save
again. whew!

ran a diff between ServerSideSavingPlugin 3.2 and 3.3 and the new
addition was this line: {{{readOnly = false; //# enable editing over
HTTP}}}

The thing I don't get is why I can save under the instance in 093 but
not the new instance made from 095. I guess ServerConfig is not the
only plugin that needs editing, but a $ grep -R "common" * in my
instance doesn't show any other tiddler with the specific
"server.bag": "common" parameter.

Eduard had saving success with 095, so I'll keep checking.

Anyway, it is still nice to save under v093 and i await the beta
launch :-)

Best,
tony

[FND]

> given that the default recipe is set to "server.bag": "common",
> is there a way to save to a bag other than common

Yes; you just have to set that field to whatever you need it to be.
For example, you might provide different buttons for tiddler creation
(e.g. "New Private Note", "New Article" etc.):
<<newTiddler fields:"'server.bag': 'myBag'">>

However, we've recently changed the understanding of workspace so you
don't have to worry about the TiddlyWeb-specific server.bag anymore.
So instead of that, you should use the following now:
"server.workspace": "bags/myBag"

Does that help?

-- F.

[EduardWagner]

Hi, See notes below

> Also see this page:
> http://www.tiddlywiki.org/wiki/Troubleshooting

we updated to release 0.9.6 and now everything is working YEAH!!!!!!
thanks for advise, i will follow the above guide for further issues

> As you've guessed, it's a missing feature in the TiddlyWeb adaptor for
> now. It's nothing massively complicated - I simply haven't gotten around
> to it yet.

OK awaiting next release, in the meantime we rename and delete ;)

>
> You need to add some fields in the saveTiddler call:
> store.saveTiddler(title, newTitle, newBody, modifier, modified,
> tags, {
> "server.type": "tiddlyweb",
> "server.host": "<URI>",
> "server.bag": "<bag>"
> });

OK, It tried something like that and the wizard is working
and even saving the new tiddler in the right bag !!!!!!!!!!!!

store.saveTiddler(title, newTitle, newBody, modifier, modified,
tags,
{
"server.type": "tiddlyweb",

"server.host": store.getTiddler("TiddlyWebConfig").fields
["server.host"],
"server.workspace": store.getTiddler("TiddlyWebConfig").fields
["server.workspace"]
});

again many thanks for the help, it's amazing
now we are starting to work intense with our imported tiddlywikis
i will post our experience with get to go tiddlyweb

happy Edi

[EduardWagner]

Hi tony,
i got the latest release 0.9.6 working now, if you want to i can post
the plugins,
because i used the latest and it's working.
There are some little mods you have to do and that was all for us.
bye edi

>
> I was happy to be able to save to the default recipe under 0.0.9.3 so
> I haven't tested 095 when it came out. Also I wasn't able to save to a
> bag other than common (python2.5)
>
> Now upgrading to 095 I can't save anymore unless I use an old instance
> made in 093 using ServerSideSavingPlugin v3.2
>
> I failed this test that v095 saves to default recipe where
> {{{config.defaultCustomFields = {
>     "server.bag": "common"};}}}
>
> and this test that v095 saves to different bag
> *made new instance
> *made new bag
> *imported existing tiddlers into new bag

> When the "server.bag": "common" is set to <new bag>,http://127.0.0.1:8080/recipes/<new