Re: 5 new messages in 4 topics - digest
shashwat pandey
Which type of social and economical imbalance are you
talking about, this imbalance does not have any
physical presence but a virtual presence, imposed by
politicians, there is no imbalance in Indian society
nether there had been any, the only imbalance is of
money, rich people enjoy supremacy over poor people no
matter which cast they belong to, moreover there is no
need to go to history, history is written by winners,
and only those point are presented which suits the
current set of people in power, any guess what type of
person Hitler would have been if he had won the second
world war? in my life span of 25 yrs, I am yet to see
any discrimination based on cast in society, yes I
have seen discrimination based on money, based on
education, based on muscle power and surprisingly
based on looks, but never in terms of cast, there are
no separate kitchen based on cast in any hostel in
India currently, but there are separate food for those
who can pay more and for those who can pay less, just
point one discrimination based on cast.....there are
none.
This concept of cast based suppression was coined only
in 1989, why not before? It is only because V.P Singh
found a very good opportunity in dividing India based
on cast and pumped the feeling of cast in Hindu
society, before India was divided on religion, now
India is divided on cast. It is pure politics nothing
more.
We as young generation must come forward and eliminate
this evil from India, let people practice their
religion government has nothing to do with religious
feeling of any person, and in religion there is no
discrimination on cast.
Here I would like to through some light on cast system
also but due to lack of time I will make it short.
Just have a look at any organization, there is one CEO
some directors, some managers then
engineers/executives, what is wrong in this, everyone
is doing what they can do best at any given time and
they are differentiated based on what they do best,
cast system is also a mirror image of current
organizational setup... more details I will mail you
later
Examples you have pointed in your mail (US Russia
etc), and superimposed it on Indian society, this
itself is not correct, their social structure is
different from ours moreover this clearly indicates
that you accept that people from upper cast are better
then others, I don’t agree with this, everyone who can
work hard, concentrate more and is calm can do
anything, cast simply does not come into picture, what
come into picture is in what environment you grow up,
your thought are molded depended on what you see when
you grow, and this is why I had stressed on regional
based reservation system so that growth reached every
corner of the country, every town should have a local
idol, it will indicate that what he/she has achieved,
is very much reachable.
P.S : my intentions are just to present my point of
view and hope this will be considered while we are
making policy of the group.
Regards
Shashwat Pandey
http://www.geocities.com/sha211_211
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Harsha
we won't need and speak of it provided we have over capacity, be it in
terms of no. of educational institutes or employment opportunitites.
This is clear supply and demand, and finally when it started pinching
the humble minority of OC (23-25% people), people go gaga on it. As
far as I can dig deep, every person should have a right to study what
he likes and finally abanduant opportunities should greet him when he
wanted to make a living. (why none is concerned with ladies
reservations, don't undermine, there is a day in offing when again we
scream) .
Just deprieving a person or a group is our incompetence, we should
take advantage of human talent and let every other person contribute
to the system, if you and me make it big, as is the case with NRIs or
business class, we remain a third world country. As a nation, if every
person gets second meal (30% of population don't get it) and has a
roof on top, our happiness index must be shining.
where is the problem and what is the solution?
Agreed it is a problem, doing away with reservations may bring bliss
to those who wanted, what happens to the huge majority of disgruntled
people. Our nation won't be progressing, we see more and more
problems, it's matter of time, they come and throw you out of your
house and occupy it (after all they are majority people, in a
democracy it's their say) .When it comes to solutions, a civil war is
immediate respite, because it gives us a chance to build from scratch,
unfortunately in a heterogeneous India, civil war doesn't ignite
nationalism but hatred. The only vaible solution is to bring more
opportunites, more educational institutes and everything more. Is it
possible? yes, unless you don't scream when government introduces
another 10 IITs, 100 NITS and 1000 universities. when we have this in
place, reservations in education becomes redundant. Also every other
person is ready to take up challenge and has his energies focussed.
The big question is employment for the society. (I don't think any
person aspires to be a labor, no body business). We should not be
respecting patents and float with intellectual properties(IP) similar
to China. (or like US going to war for their oil needs). no ethics
here if we want to take our head high. (mindless thousands of IT
engineers work in India bringing huge amounts of foriegn money, and
when bush comes mext month, we make a deal for 2 F-16s and few
boeings, gone every other dollar we brought into India through
hardwork). Over-reliance on service sector (IT services is a fraction)
is a cause of worry, we should be immediately focussing on reliable
manufacturing sector (more jobs to masses), consumption driven, export
oriented economy. certainly a lot to do with economics than with
mindless debates.
we want govt. to build infrastructure (at the same time, we want
subsidised railway fares, gas and petrol, health and education, 9%
interest of PF, hell we want everything free, mind that govt makes
revenue through direct or indirect taxes from it's citizens). tell me
where do you get 9% interest in the world on your PF savings, tell me
where do you get 25% subsidy on your cooking gas. govt. lives only to
the aspirations of it's people, it has no money to take new
initiatives.
if you and me make millions we may be happy in shortterm, but not our
nation. we need sound economic policies and strigent law of land. even
if it squeezes me we should bear it silently, otherwise our future
generation spits on us for our skewed selfishness. (there is no
nationalism at all when we speak, we are better off being self). I
fear most people here are some kind of variants of rights group
protecting their interests and not of a nation. I've serious doubts on
vision 2020, if few become rich, if few make it big, we will not be
going anywhere and will still be called a third world country, begging
world whenever a national disater strikes helplessly.
Harsha
If you and me make millions, we may be happy, but not the entire nation.
==============================================================================
> TOPIC: reservations
> http://groups.google.com/group/BM_discussion/browse_thread/thread/c782d6a1ddd8eaaa
> ==============================================================================
>
> == 1 of 1 ==
> Date: Wed, Jan 4 2006 11:15am
> From: "Sidharth Shyamsukha"
>
> Dear Harsha,
>
> I would like to explain how reservations are linked with politics.
> First a discimination is created, when people become more concerned
> about there caste, politicians will offer them reservations for votes,
> also would ecourage people to vote for people of their own caste.
> As the original purpose of caste system, division of labour is no more
> needed.
> The concept itself can be scraped.
>
==============================================================================
> TOPIC: Reservation
> http://groups.google.com/group/BM_discussion/browse_thread/thread/385ccd7f9c2b3c6
> ==============================================================================
>
> == 1 of 2 ==
> Date: Wed, Jan 4 2006 3:34am
> From: shashwat pandey
>
> Dear Harsh
>
> The Point you are stressing is same as what i was
> saying, people don't want reservation, those people
> who have confidence in themselves don't want to be
> discriminated on the basis of cast, what happens is
> even if a deserving candidate from OBC or SC qualifies
> say civil services credit in society is not given to
> his hard work but to his cast (OOOOKK he is from
> reserved category!! ). moreover putting non-competent
> people in demanding position makes them loose whatever
> confidence they have, i was in GTER for some work and
> i sow one research scholar struggling hard, they are
> developing engine (called Kavari) for LCA (Light
> combat Aircraft) since last 25 yrs but till now even
> design is not ready, problem is same here most of the
> people in R&D did not had the competence level
> required to complete the task hence it is pending,
> again since HOD belongs to a certain cast he preferred
> people from his community which resulted > dev null.
>
> This is why I suggest that if there is any need for
> reservation at all, it should be given on the basis of
> domicile(passing +2), in this manner, under-developed
> areas will also be having successful people, who in
> turn will help in overall development of India, no
> state in India will be left unrepresented in developed
> India map.
>
> Regards
>
>
> Regards
> Shashwat Pandey
> http://www.geocities.com/sha211_211
>
> == 2 of 2 ==
> Date: Wed, Jan 4 2006 1:41pm
> From: "BharatMaata"
>
> Hi Harsha!
> Reservations are important to clear out the social and economic
> imbalances in a society.
> India needs to move away from agroeconomy to industrial society.
> This cannot happen unless upper castes(management communities) are
> forced to invest in education and private enterpreneurship like
> factories.
> So, when Govt. squeezes out jobs and brings out the cheap labour from
> farming, upper castes move out of villages into towns and thus the
> economy starts rolling in a new direction!
>
> This has happened in USA during its civil war. It happened in Russia in
> 1917. England and France long before that during their revolutions.
>
> For centuries, upper castes enjoyed the fruits of caste system and now
> they cannot enjoy it due to reservations and hence all the whining.
>
> But either it is upper caste men or lower castemen, in today's India,
> we need hardwork and aggression.
>
> Jai Hind!!
> Madhu Rayala