Round 2 info

[ZisWorks]

Been getting this a lot lately.

What is different:

DP boards integrated into TCON.  No cables which were 80% of the failures in round1.

Improvements to signal integrity, may allow higher speed operation.  Have to wait and see on this one for the real results.

Same chips, same feature set overall.

Boards are red, firmware is more mature.

Serial interface on the TCON is now functional, exposing some extra features (OC test, a simple crosshair, panel selection via microcontroller firmware).

Some bugs fixed (lines in half-speed modes, first few lines of OSD being broken, misc stuff like that)

Some image quality improvements (gamma correction)

40" and quantum dot 28" panels are now supported.

Kits are being made in Taiwan this time around, different vendor than the first round.  Should be good quality, they are a recommendation of a coworker (dayjob, well... before meta died anyway).

Status:

PCB order is 120 kits.  No preorders or anything, just seemed like a good number. 

PCB assembly is 5 kits, after they test good, I give the green light for the remaining kits to be assembled.  This will avoid potential rework on every board like last time.  It costs extra and adds some time, but it was a real hassle to fix things last time.  Less work for me, more consistent and faster results for you.

I should get those first 5 kits in about 2.5~3 weeks, and the remaining kits about a week after they test good.

Ordering

Not yet, not until the 120 are in-hand.  Last ~10 from round1 get their kits first, then orders open.  If you can read this line, they aren't orderable yet.

[mkaram]

Thanks for the update!

[wolfwings]

Thank you very much for the update. I'll be looking forward to picking up one of the newer kits for the second Seiki monitor here at the very least once they're available! :D

[jamja...@gmail.com]

Is the 40" panel the V400DK1-**. If so are they all supported same?

[Connor Sommerfeld]

Will be following along keenly. It's time to get my hands dirty!

[copelna]

Despite my already owning both previous x28/x39 models, EniGmA's impressions on the streaking for the Samsung panel are... very intriguing. Not a statement of commitment from me, as this seems like a pricey upgrade... but I'm curious...

I know there's a Round 1 line of about 10 orders and Round 2 testing/verification (not even talking about orders) hasn't even started. That said, I'd like to know how thorough the Samsung x28's are going to be supported once round 2 begins, seeing as how the shop page/official website hasn't been updated in a long time.

-Will we have to source our own panel like the Seiki 39s (are they Samsung exclusive)?

-In the case that they are exclusive and can only be pulled from a U28H750:

A. will there be a no panel kit option that comes configured to easily support mounting in the default samsung housing (new wiring/connections, easy access to button board, easy access for the power adapter, appropriate alterations to the mounting plate)?

B. can we pay for a modified x28 aluminum housing to go with the new kits (no bending, no cutting/dremmeling). I 100% understand that this is asking a lot for an already established case design/project. Honestly, if option A is easier/notably cheaper with better results, I'm all for that. Comes with it's own stand already as well.

-When orders are announced, will the pricing for all available configurations be updated in any way?

-Freesync is still unsupported, correct?

I am in absolutely no hurry, I'd wait for any amount of time for logistic changes, testing, and new parts.

[ZisWorks]

They are samsung exclusives. I will make a guide and no-panel kit available. Have to see what impact supporting both will have on the mechanicals. Not sure if I should mod existing ones and not bother with housings this time around. It adds around $150 to the price but it is a nicer display. Also risk of damage during modification.

Chips are the same, so no freesync this time around.

The site is really outdated, have to fix it all. :/

[herox...@gmail.com]

Is there going to be DP 1.4 this time around?

[ZisWorks]

no, it is the same chips as before, just on one board.

[Роман Хуснутдинов]

Hello. It's like a "progress update" post. Did you get first 5 kits for the second round?

[ZisWorks]

PCBs are with the assembler now, will probably finish in 1-2 days and ship out then.  Should have them in-hand in about a week.

[zigg...@gmail.com]

How long until the 39"kit

[ZisWorks]

Assembler found a few minor component errors, need to reorder those parts, but here is a pic of one of the pcbs without components.

[Роман Хуснутдинов]

So, what time it will cost to complete first round considering all circumstances?

[ZisWorks]

~+3 day delay from this.  Parts have already been ordered and will probably get there in 1-2 days.

Can't "consider all circumstances". Stuff happens, I try to be transparent about it.

[zigg...@gmail.com]

I noticed some of the redesign reduced the clutter and someone claimed it could fit inside the normal housing. Will this reduce cost as well?

[ZisWorks]

Yes, the combined design saves a bit (~20%), but the boards were made in Taiwan this time rather than China, and not at thr cheapest place, so cost has gone up overall. This should mean a higher quality product.

[twigg...@googlemail.com]

Can you give us the supported 40" model numbers? Is it the V400DK1-**?

[Роман Хуснутдинов]

Hello. Are there any news about boards? Just a progress update post. Thanks!

[ZisWorks]

This is what I got.

[ZisWorks]

Got a tracking number!

[Роман Хуснутдинов]

Also, I wanted to ask if you are interested in tweaking V400DK1-KE1 panel. I got v390dk1-ls1 panel, but as far as I 've tested it with RT66, it may have a few dead pixels. Can you tell more information about what it requires to arrange all the hardware and firmware to make it work in all your modes. I'm ready to to do all installations according your guide, if you're interested in it. Cause my V400DK1-KE1 is comparably better than v390dk1-ls1, I may like to swap it in the future for the better quality. So, if you'd be ready to tweak it via Skype, can you tell what we would have to do and prepare for this operation?

[ZisWorks]

I have 40" panel and have already tested it, so support is there already.  First five boards have arrived, visually looks good, except that they are green and not red :(.  Will be a busy weekend.

[Scott Yager]

Zis...

Are you saying there's another panel that's 40" that your board supports to? what tv/monitors is it in? I pulled the model from 2 posts up and I can't link it to any models.

[rob...@swiecki.net]

Hi,

How it will work inside x28, will it fit in place of the current TCON (I guess it's longer) with the current cover, and is the idea about the DP cables to go inside the chassis through the middle hole and to connect directly to TCON/DP?

[ZisWorks]

@Scott: V400DK1*

@Robert: Havent tried it, but it should fit.  There is a punchout in the housing that you can route the cables through.  Yes, connect cables, then close housing.  This will be the regular method for most other displays too.

[ZisWorks]

Just passed first video through the new tcon. Can probably give the goahead for remaining assembly over the long weekend.

[ZisWorks]

Some minor annoyances with the boards still, but I am happy to report that they are performing well.

No change to panel speeds, but now pixel clocks on the input side can be as high as 620MHz, previously limited to around 535MHz.  Notably, 4k72Hz with one input is ok.

I've also redone the tcon microcontroller firmware .  Now instead of having a pile of premade EDIDs, it generates one based on a set of modelines and panel selection which provides chromaticites and physical size.  Most importantly, the advertised serial number is made from the compile date and time, so now dual monitor configs should work without confusing the gpu driver.  This same panel selection is sent to the FPGA, so no more dip switch needed. 

Plan to give the (small) list of changes to the assembler tomorrow :)

[rob...@swiecki.net]

BTW, I'm testing the new firmware (V041), and it indeed allows higher pixel clocks. But, while 550MHz works (~62.5Hz), setting it to 575MHz crashes my computer. I use Linux, and the only thing I see is that both my monitors (x28 and an Asus one) stop being delivered the signal (go blank), what cannot be reverted (by using shortcuts, or by switching to console). Maybe it's something with Linux drivers, maybe with the card itself. I have GTX 1080Ti.

But, what is interesting, I can use 960x540 at 500Hz (ignore 480 in the description). Works well for me.

Modeline "960x540_480" 348.750 960 1008 1040 1250 540  543  548  558 +hsync -vsync

Also, the new firmware fixed (almost) the 1280x720 problem for me (screen being divided in 4 pieces with differing brightness/gamma), now I have only 2 pieces, i.e. 1/4 top of the screen is slightly darker, the rest of the screen is of identical gamma.

[Spencer Deven]

Glad to see round 2 is going (relatively) smoother! Any way to check where I am in line? Ordered the x39 kit on Sep 10th, 2017.

[goo...@seanpix.com]

If someone figures out which TV(s) to order or a good place to order the V400DK* panel from please post the info. (I'm in the US) I've got the 39, but would love to have a better panel as it's not the best.
And Yay, can't wait to get the kit!

[Scott Yager]

I just bought an LG 40UB8000. According to my search this is the right panel.

[mike kuuik]

V400DK1 i founded in monitor  AMH399U

V500DK2 in Samsung 50HU6900

[ZisWorks]

TCON screw holes look a little off on 0709 and 0710, but electrically they look correct.

[ZisWorks]

Got a ship date of  20DEC :)

[ad...@retrorgb.com]

Awesome!

[ZisWorks]

Got some pics, all packed up and ready to ship, probably get them next week.

[Spencer Deven]

Can we get an updated set of x39 install pics? Seems like it would be much simpler with the DisplayPorts on the TCON itself.

[ZisWorks]

Its a bit hard to see in this pic because of some extra development stuff, but here you can see dp straight into the tcon, one 12pin connection between tcon and bldriver, flex connection to bcklight on top side of bldriver board, and the same 6pin buttonboard as before.

Will post some better pics of various installs after the holidays.

[ZisWorks]

Delivery scheduled for the 27th :)

Shop will be updated and opened up on 1 Jan.  Also got some heatsinks for the FPGA and pcie 6pin to 5.5x2.5 dc jack cables for operation directly from the computer power supply.

I've also been improving the fpga firmware, some new features:

• Crosshair overlay is now supported.  It can be enabled by the atmega on the tcon.  Default is a green X. Input image is 64*64@4bpc RGBA and can be customized non-persistently with the uart interface.  See pics.  The red dot is part of my desktop background.
• There is now a splash screen for a few seconds where the framerate graph osd overlay is. See video.
• Image data is now pushed through a lookup table before being displayed.  This enables arbitrary digital gamma correction.  Improved profiles are included.  This improves tone accuracy.
• Panel control voltages were previously adjusted manually for each panel.  Now a huge python script eats through ~100k data points to tune the voltages and lookup tables.  In conjunction with the digital lookup control, this enhances absolute white and black levels slightly.  ~4% contrast improvement on 39".  28" is still running tuning script.
• Some core logic improvements were done to maintain timing with the addition of new logic in the video pipeline path.

Some other under-the-hood stuff that makes maintaining the fw easier.

[rand....@gmail.com]

Incredible work, helluva Christmas present update.

[ZisWorks]

Pics of new goodies.

[Omar K]

where do I sign up?!? TAKE MA MONEH

[ZisWorks]

Boards arrived. Now the real work begins.

[ZisWorks]

pic

[dever]

Awesome Zis!  Looking forward to getting a V2.

Any chances the new boards and firmware will alleviate the panel lottery greyscale banding I experienced on my X39?

[omar....@students.noblela.org]

so... how do i actually order? through the link in the website? and can i have a list of all supported panels?

[ZisWorks]

Shop is now live!

http://zisworks.com/shop.html

[Spencer Deven]

Any way to confirm where I am in line for a original run x39 order?

[ZisWorks]

@Miguel : If you have a Samsung U28H750, get the Samsung kit, if you have any other model, Samsung or otherwise, get the generic 28" kit.  The difference is the backlight cable.

@Spencer: Just sent an email about those :)

[miguel.i....@gmail.com]

Do the kits include the backlight driver already?

[ZisWorks]

All kits include backlight drivers. 

[Punk Rocker]

Thank you Zis! awaiting for build my x39 :)

[retr...@gmail.com]

I just picked up the Samsung 28" kit.  Is this the exact monitor I'd need?:  https://amzn.to/2SCFgPb

I'll start testing this first, then get the 39".

[ZisWorks]

Yes, that is the one.

[copelna]

How long will orders for this new round of kits be open?

[goo...@seanpix.com]

After us lurkers finally get ours from the first batch of orders! :p

[rob...@swiecki.net]

Does the samsung kit include any support for mounting it inside the original plastic chasis?

[ZisWorks]

No, it does not. Please see the "more info" descriptionon shop page for details of each kit.

[ZisWorks]

You can see pictures of my U28H750 mod here:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/tRwhwkm3hQCDNx7y7

Final kits have a few differences:
Heatsink is included, so dont use metal shield over tcon.
Backlight cable adapter is included, so no mapping and hotglue there.
A new 7pin connector is included for button board, have to move pins to new connector then just plug it in.

[jensmue...@gmail.com]

Nice work! I will definitely order a Samsung Kit when I'm back from my term abroad in August. I hope they won't sell out too fast.

[Omar K]

I have a Hisense Roku 50 inch TV. Would the kit work?

[ZisWorks]

Don't know what is inside it.  The probably-compatible 50" panel has never been tested, so to be on the safe side, no.

[Simon Kronstein]

I plan on ordering a kit anyway for my SE39UY04, but there's also a SE50UY04 available near me for a reasonable price. If I was to pick it up, how would I test it for compatibility? Is there anything I should order in addition to the X39 Rev2 Kit?

[ZisWorks]

No, SE50UY04 uses the V500DK1 which has a physically larger TCON with four output flexes. 

Compare zws tcon pictures to the V500DK1 here:https://www.shopjimmy.com/cmo-35-d085502-t-con-board.htm

V500DK2 uses the same tcon connection as V390DK1, so that one is probably compatible with zws tcon, but V500DK1 is no chance.

[matthewpaul...@gmail.com]

Just to confirm: the X39 Rev2 Kit for 39" Seiki SE39UY04 is not compatible with a Seiki SE39UY04-1, correct?

[ZisWorks]

SE39UY04-1 uses a cheaper backlight.  The TCON will work with the panel with all the same results, but the backlight driver will not.  You can use the existing backlight driver, but you lose the advanced backlight functionality (pwm-free, strobe, scan). 

BDM4065 and SE42UM are the same situation as SE39UY04-1.

[dreamstriker]

bought a samsung kit.
can you please confirm this monitor is ok? http://imgur.com/a/UT0e1le
U28H750uqc is uqc related?

[Miguel del Barrio]

Is the 6 pin PSU cable a substitute for an external 12v brick?

[ZisWorks]

@dreamstriker, I want to say yes, but dont know for sure.  The power consumption is different from the sticker on teh back of mine (19.0V, 3.1A claimed).  Yours is also lacking some FCC and other certification, maybe it is a slightly different unit for the korean market?

I don't know of any other 28" 4k panels, so it is probably moddable, but without disassembled pics, cant say for sure.

@miguel: Yes, with the 6pin, it can be powered by the computer.  Cheaper, simpler, and more efficient.  Also easier to ship around because customs doesn't care about a wire, but does care very much about things that plug into the wall.

[ZisWorks]

First batch of kits went out today.  Almost caught up with the round1 orders.  The first round2 orders should go out on Saturday :)

[Spencer Deven]

Got my kit! One question, with the big ol' heatsink you included with the new kit, I just dispose of the old panel cable shield and just mount the board directly, right? Also, do I still need to apply the thermal pads to the back of the TCON with that new heat sink?

[Spencer Deven]

Forgot to mention, its the x39 kit I'm working with, got all the old components out, with the exception of the 4 big bolts in the middle, they are stubborn.

[ZisWorks]

You have a round1 plate with round2 boards. In this configuration, the plate attaches to the top of the four M6 standoffs that you are having difficulty with.

For the round2 orders (not leftovers from r1) , you will get a round2 plate which is smaller and simpler to deal with, pictures are here. The roun2 plate also causes fewer problems with the se39uy04 plastic back cover.

Pics of r2 installation:

https://photos.app.goo.gl/kZJPafk69RUGtE2H7

[ZisWorks]

R1 kits used this plate as a heatsink. It didnt work very well. Dont bother with the original cover.

[Spencer Deven]

I need to saw that round 1 plate in half, but I still managed to get everything shoved up in there and back together. You weren't joking about most DisplayPort cables being finicky, went through 3 sets to get ones that worked at 4K 120hz.

[ZisWorks]

All x39 orders have shipped! Tracking numbers via email later today.

[ZisWorks]

The order backlog is now only two units! (one 40" kit and one to dreamstriker). Everything else has been shipped.

Also did some work with pushing the R2 improvemenrs into R1 kits, will be making that available soon. Main benefits:
1) Substantial image quality improvement
2) Easily changed EDID customization in new fw
3) Crosshair overlay support
4) If your kit currently has fpga fw below v036, there is also arbitrary resolution and automatic minimum clock support to look forward to.

It is a bit of work to do, should be about 1hr from start to finish.

[Maarten te Molder]

Awesome Zis, can't wait to get started :)